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79miller
09-06-2004, 07:39 AM
Does anyone have any details about a boat crash at the Topock Bridge? A boat hit one of the bridge pilings late last night. If anyone heard or saw anything please let me know.
G

LUVNLIFE
09-06-2004, 08:20 AM
Someone should know something and post it soon. Another reason I don't like boating at night, someone else not paying attention.

Tom Garcia
09-06-2004, 09:39 AM
I dont know about that one, check out pictures from Sat-9-4-04, This was pulled into Site 6, Speed boat and pantoon. I guess quiet a few people hurt.

copperrat20
09-06-2004, 10:08 AM
I just saw something on the news about this. They said 8 people killed? :(

79miller
09-06-2004, 10:23 AM
There were 8 people on the boat and 4 are still missing. Very good friends of mine. Very trajic day. Just trying to find more details.....

79miller
09-06-2004, 11:19 AM
That's them. Terrible day for everyone and their families.

Kachina26
09-06-2004, 11:21 AM
I hate hearing this kind of stuff. Be carefull out there people! Sorry to hear about your friends :frown:

cc322
09-06-2004, 11:36 AM
Very tragic for sure. I just dont get it :mad: , it seems that this has been a very deadly year on or around the colorado river, if these type of deadly accidents keep happening thier will be some major changes comming our way. Very sad to hear.

MRS FLYIN VEE
09-06-2004, 11:42 AM
There were 8 people on the boat and 4 are still missing. Very good friends of mine. Very trajic day. Just trying to find more details.....
I am so sorry to hear this happen to someone you know.. very tragic.. our hearts and prayers to you and the family.. :(

79miller
09-06-2004, 11:46 AM
Thanks everyone, we are still getting bits and pieces of the story...

Kilrtoy
09-06-2004, 11:47 AM
Sorry to hear this. Wish the best to them, that can be had out of this tragic event..

Charley
09-06-2004, 11:48 AM
does anyone have any details??? where were the occupants from?

79miller
09-06-2004, 12:08 PM
They were from Anaheim, Huntington Beach and Riverside.

FRENCHIE
09-06-2004, 12:20 PM
always some horror story!!! :frown:

ahhell
09-06-2004, 01:13 PM
Im sorry to hear of the loss.....
lives have been changed forever

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 01:17 PM
why does this shit happen?sit on the beach and get trashed and pass out on the beach :devil: :frown:
If you can't fly your boat straight, leave it on the beach with all the other Queens :eek: :D

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 01:21 PM
Its always sad to hear of stuff like this, we are a boating family..lets stick together and live to tell the stories please! :idea: .......( . )( . )........I know im a Canatard and all, but you are all friends. Except Ob Eddie :D

TCHB
09-06-2004, 01:30 PM
I know the Parker bridge has lights on it but not sure about the Needles bridges.

Kachina26
09-06-2004, 01:41 PM
I know the Parker bridge has lights on it but not sure about the Needles bridges.
I didn't know that Parker had a bridge. However, the Bridges in Topoc have lights. I imagine all bridges have lights.

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 01:42 PM
I don't know about this stuff yet, but why are you running your boat at night for :eek: I know I wouldn't just for the safe factor, unless you have lights...that most don't!
Don't get me wrong, I feel for these people....BUT, QUIT BEING STUPID ON THE WATER!
How many more before die before it makes sense :frown: ........( . )( . )......

Kachina26
09-06-2004, 01:44 PM
I don't know about this stuff yet, but why are you running your boat at night for :eek: I know I wouldn't just for the safe factor, unless you have lights...that most don't!
Don't get me wrong, I feel for these people....BUT, QUIT BEING STUPID ON THE WATER!
How many more before die before it makes sense :frown: ........( . )( . )......
I love night rides, under a big moon.

24ROD
09-06-2004, 01:49 PM
:frown:
Very sad to hear. Our thoughts and prayers go out to the familys. :frown:

Boatcop
09-06-2004, 01:59 PM
All the bridges crossing the river are lighted. Green lights for the areas you can safely go under. Red for the areas you shouldn't.
Lights don't mean a thing for those who don't know what they stand for.

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 02:17 PM
All the bridges crossing the river are lighted. Green lights for the areas you can safely go under. Red for the areas you shouldn't.
Lights don't mean a thing for those who don't know what they stand for.
I have my license Alan, but boating at night is screwed up stuff.....Why would you do it in the first place ....Using the force don't work, so its off the seat of your pants driving....****ed up shit, you guys have to deal with!..............( . )( . )......... :frown:

mike37
09-06-2004, 02:38 PM
this sucks I hate to hear thing like this
condolences to the family

JetBoatRich
09-06-2004, 04:42 PM
Very sad news, without all the details on how they hit and why they were out there. Better off waiting on judgment of the people on-board.

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 04:52 PM
Very sad news, without all the details on how they hit and why they were out there. Better off waiting on judgment of the people on-board.
I only give my opinion JBR, nothing more! :frown: .........( . )( . ).......... :(

THOR
09-06-2004, 05:00 PM
I only give my opinion JBR, nothing more! :frown: .........( . )( . ).......... :(
I dont think the decedant's family would care for your comments much. I think a little respect is in order.

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 05:07 PM
I dont think the decedant's family would care for your comments much. I think a little respect is in order.
I resepect all on the water, sorry if it's coming off wrong. Im really sorry , Canatard Ya know :frown: .........( . )( . )......... :chi:

JetBoatRich
09-06-2004, 05:10 PM
I only give my opinion JBR, nothing more! :frown: .........( . )( . ).......... :(
Kim, not directed at you, just more speaking for myself and how I feel about the dangers of driving at night on water :sqeyes: I like to hear more about the incident

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 05:12 PM
My heart is with these people, sorry if it came out all wrong. I will shut my mouth now...Sorry! :frown:

CARRERA
09-06-2004, 05:12 PM
I'm sure more news is yet to come.............

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 05:14 PM
Kim, not directed at you, just more speaking for myself and how I feel about the dangers of driving at night on water :sqeyes: I like to hear more about the incident
Im with you also, truth though...not hear say!.........I feel bad now for what I said before :cry:

Kachina26
09-06-2004, 06:18 PM
Good point, who knows if they were safely on a beach for the night and someone got stung by a scorpion, prompting a fast ride to the nearest ramp. Whatever the case, there's a world of hurt going on.

CARRERA
09-06-2004, 06:21 PM
Very good point, who knows what the reasons were...........

79miller
09-06-2004, 07:32 PM
They are on their way back home, but there are still 2 bodies missing.
This is a very sad day for a large group of people that have been going to the river together for a very long time. We've had some of the best times in our lives out there just sitting on the beach, cruising the river or boat floating at night with 3 boats tied up and a stereo blasting, the last of which I'm sure was the plan for last night. I could go on typing for hours, but I don't think there is much else to say that would make the situation any better nor do I feel qualified to pass on any information not having been there.
I'm sure there will be all sorts of comments being made as more details and news reports come out, but for now there are alot of sad and hurt people that will remember this day for the rest of their life.
Our friends will be missed...

KACHINA KEN
09-06-2004, 07:39 PM
Hi All,
I just got in from Havasu, I passed the scene this afternoon, there were 6 LE boats and a salvage company boat assisting in directing traffic. The strange thing is there were no visable signs of anything striking the bridge on either the North or South sides of the pylons. We had to go in the store in the Topoc marina and the lady in the store said that the driver of the boat climbed up the rocky embankment and found a trucker parked up and started banging on his door hysterically, the trucker and his wife were scared because the guy seemed like a maniac but once they put things together they radioed for help then went into the Topoc trailer park to solicite assistance from residents. 3 guys in 1 boat went out to help but it was all in vain, from what I am told it was 9 people with 4 dead and the rest except the driver in the hospital. Alan should be able to give us an update soon I'm sure. Another thing is with the water around Topoc being so cold it may be awhile before the river gives up her dead, I would be surprised if they were recovered any sooner then 10 days. Tragic day for the river.

Mrs. casean
09-06-2004, 07:51 PM
Hi All,
I just got in from Havasu, I passed the scene this afternoon, there were 6 LE boats and a salvage company boat assisting in directing traffic. The strange thing is there were no visable signs of anything striking the bridge on either the North or South sides of the pylons. We had to go in the store in the Topoc marina and the lady in the store said that the driver of the boat climbed up the rocky embankment and found a trucker parked up and started banging on his door hysterically, the trucker and his wife were scared because the guy seemed like a maniac but once they put things together they radioed for help then went into the Topoc trailer park to solicite assistance from residents. 3 guys in 1 boat went out to help but it was all in vain, from what I am told it was 9 people with 4 dead and the rest except the driver in the hospital. Alan should be able to give us an update soon I'm sure. Another thing is with the water around Topoc being so cold it may be awhile before the river gives up her dead, I would be surprised if they were recovered any sooner then 10 days. Tragic day for the river.
Very scare and very sad... a shame good times have to end in certain ways.

Keithb87
09-06-2004, 08:34 PM
:( :( :( :( :( :(

spute
09-06-2004, 08:41 PM
so sorry to hear about incidents like this. it is a horrible way to end a great experience.

rrrr
09-06-2004, 08:44 PM
Just my $.02, but the bridge pylons are marked and lit with standard red and green navigation markings and lights. I know this because I was there a few weeks ago.
Your life may depend on your knowledge of such things.
I mourn for the dead and injured. But boating is less forgiving than many activities. Knowing the rules is the minimum required for safety.

beyondhelpin
09-06-2004, 08:48 PM
My regards to the family and friends.

C-2
09-06-2004, 08:49 PM
Sucks to keep reading stories like this.
Very sad, sorry for the losses. :( :( :(

Kim Hanson
09-06-2004, 08:55 PM
:frown: Very sad day in deed..............( . )( . ).......

IN2-IN2MX
09-06-2004, 09:04 PM
We are so sorry to hear this. Our thoughts are with the family & friends :frown: .

OGShocker
09-06-2004, 09:28 PM
Sucks to keep reading stories like this.
Very sad, sorry for the losses. :( :( :(
Seems like every weekend. :( :( :(
God's speed to the family and friends of those lost. :chi:

Waldo
09-06-2004, 09:30 PM
Our prayers are with all involved. Sorry to hear about this tragic accident.

al cole'holic
09-06-2004, 09:32 PM
...10 o'clock news is reporting the driver is facing manslaughter and BUI charges.. :frown:

Kilrtoy
09-06-2004, 09:40 PM
...10 o'clock news is reporting the driver is facing manslaughter and BUI charges.. :frown:
Not good, what channel

KACHINA KEN
09-06-2004, 10:04 PM
...10 o'clock news is reporting the driver is facing manslaughter and BUI charges.. :frown:
If it's AZ it will be DUI, BUI is gone from what I understand......

svlperry
09-06-2004, 10:35 PM
I dont know about that one, check out pictures from Sat-9-4-04, This was pulled into Site 6, Speed boat and pantoon. I guess quiet a few people hurt.
where r those pics at

dmontzsta
09-06-2004, 10:43 PM
Very scary and sad news. I do not boat at night, but not to say it couldnt happen in the day. I am sure it could happen to any of us. God bless the families and friends.

TahitiBoss21
09-06-2004, 11:37 PM
I spent the weekend at Park Moabi, and today i was bringing my boat to the ramp when a Sheriff's Advantage boat passed me. On the back was a yellow body bag strapped to the engine cover with a victim in it.
They brought the victim to the launch ramp area and took the person inside of their trailer.
Very humbling experience indeed.

MASTERKENDOG
09-07-2004, 01:07 AM
Tragic. It sucked to see what I saw today. 2 body bags and the boat. I just got in, and knew everyone would probably want to see some of the wrecked boat pictures. I forgot how to upload the pictures, but click on the links. I have more pictures and info from the Sheriffs. I will post some time in the next day or two, gotta get to bed it's 2am!!
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/671P9060251.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/671P9060247.JPG
masterkendog

Uplink
09-07-2004, 01:18 AM
Looks like a Renegade 21. Very sad to see a day of boating on a holiday turn so tragic. :frown: We went under that bridge earlier this summer.
Be carefull at night at Lake Mohave too, guys. Every time, I see (more like HEAR first then SEE, after using the spotlight) at least 1 person with no running lights, or lights not working, or the SeaDoo's returning to Katherine's, naturally w/no lights, long after the sun has gone down.
Hopefully we can learn from whatever happened, my condolences to the families, :frown:
Mark

Essex502
09-07-2004, 05:27 AM
This pretty much sums it up:
Boat strikes bridge; 2 dead, 2 missing
By Gary Weiand
Monday, September 6, 2004 11:03 PM MDT
Drinking and boating took a heavy toll on Colorado River boaters over the Labor Day weekend, according to reports from the San Bernardino County, Calif., Sheriff's Office.
Sgt. Phil Odom said that early Monday morning a boat carrying seven passengers crashed into a pylon supporting the Interstate 40 Bridge near Topock, leaving two confirmed dead, two missing and presumed dead, and three injured. Alcohol is suspected as a cause of the crash, he said.
Odom said the driver, Scott Eckhof, 34, Anaheim Hills, Calif., has been charged with causing injury or death under the influence of alcohol, and manslaughter under the influence of alcohol.
The bodies of Jennifer Knight, 23, Corona, Calif., and Ryan McMahan, 26, Mohave Valley, have been recovered, he said. Missing and presumed dead are Rorey McMahan, 28, home presently unknown, and Dale Baldwin, age and place of residence presently unknown.
Sgt. Mike Fassari said the time of the crash was uncertain, but the Sheriff's department was notified about 4 a.m. Monday. The dive team arrived at 6:30 and began searching for the boat, which had sunk, and the two missing passengers. Divers discovered the wrecked boat around 1:30 p.m. but the search for the passengers was continuing, he said Monday evening.
Alcohol may have been a factor in another boating accident earlier in the Labor Day holiday, Odom said.
The two-vessel collision occurred off Site Six near the California shoreline on Lake Havasu Saturday evening. Odom said that driver Michael Scot Macintosh, 43, San Bernardino, was southbound in his 1995 Mariah runabout when he collided head-on with a triple pontoon boat carrying 11 people. Macintosh's boat had three passengers aboard.
The pontoon boat saw the crash coming and slowed down, but the Mariah's driver did not see the threat until the last moment, Odom said.
Contrary to earlier reports, no one was sent to University Medical Center in Las Vegas. Three were ejected from the Mariah and transported to Havasu Regional Medical Center - Macintosh, who suffered a punctured lung and broken ribs, James Trusswell, 29, Wrightwood, Calif., who suffered a broken leg, and his sister Amanda Trusswell, 24, Colton, Calif., who suffered a severe head laceration as well as scrapes and bruises.
The third passenger was unhurt, he said.
Odum said that two passengers on the pontoon also went to the HRMC - Andrew Lazarz, 23, Inglewood, Ohio, with a broken ankle, and Nicole Hill, 17, Redlands, Calif., who complained of back pain and was treated and released, he said.
Odom said that a blood sample was taken from Macintosh, and it would be about a month before its results are known.
"The investigation is incomplete at this time," he said. "A case may be issued."
Reprinted without permission from the Lake Havasu News Herald

Huckleberry
09-07-2004, 06:04 AM
God I hate reading these types of posts! When are we gonna learn to stop getting shitfaced and driving boats? My condolences go out to the families of the deceased and missing. :frown: My support goes out to the Investigators and District Attorneys who will hopefully bend the driver over and ream him! :angry2:

714monkey
09-07-2004, 06:47 AM
These guys were friends of mine as well, and they will be missed.

JET-O-VATOR
09-07-2004, 07:05 AM
anyone know if they were coming up or going down?? that bridge id kinda hard to see at night coming up river but if you know the river you know its there right after the pipeline..... very sad...... my condolences....

LASERRAY
09-07-2004, 07:08 AM
Terrible news! Condolences to the families. :frown:

Essex502
09-07-2004, 07:17 AM
God I hate reading these types of posts! When are we gonna learn to stop getting shitfaced and driving boats? My condolences go out to the families of the deceased and missing. :frown: My support goes out to the Investigators and District Attorneys who will hopefully bend the driver over and ream him! :angry2:
I agree 100%! There are no good times to drink and drive your boat - especially so at night. These alcohol induced deaths are terrible. I also hope that the driver gets the full weight of the law fall on top of him.

Sherpa
09-07-2004, 07:21 AM
the driver must already feel just horrible.... how would any of you guys feel
(if you could imagine such a tradegy occurring) if you were responsible for
the deaths of 4 of your freinds..............
it was a very stupid thing to do though......... late at night.... drunk...
driving fast........
damn shame.
--Sherpa

Havasu_Dreamin
09-07-2004, 07:29 AM
Take this FWIW, according to KFWB this morning, estimated speed of the boat that hit the bridge was 35-40 MPH. Also, according to KFWB, driver is being charged with vehicular homicide.

chub
09-07-2004, 07:42 AM
May the grace of God be with those that lost there lives in this tragic accident. Remember it's an accident, I"ve been there. A lot of lives changed this weekend and people need support not opinions.

J540
09-07-2004, 08:00 AM
anyone know if they were coming up or going down?? that bridge id kinda hard to see at night coming up river but if you know the river you know its there right after the pipeline..... very sad...... my condolences....
They were going down river, They left Topock around 1:00 am, looks like heading up river, then turned going down river. buy the looks of the boat, it was more than 35MPH. It was a Renagade Boat 20/22? open bow.Very nice Boat. I will see about getting the pic's of the boat up. It was Metropolitan Marine Towing and Salvage, That recovered the boat.
PEOPLE PLEASE, I SEE THIS ALL THE TIME, GUYS GOING WAY TO FAST UP/DOWN THE RIVER AT NIGHT WITH RAIDO ON FULL TILT NO SPOTLIGHT,PEOPLE DANCING IN THE BOW OF THE BOAT, DRIVER CAN'T SEE. :supp: THINK A LITTLE :idea:

superdave013
09-07-2004, 08:07 AM
It was a Renagade Boat 22/24? open bow.Very nice Boat.
From the pics that have been posted it's a Renegade 21' open bow. And yes, they are nice boats.

MsDrmr
09-07-2004, 08:08 AM
may there families be guarded against negitivity and accusations. when we enjoy something, sometimes we all make ill decisions, I bet a night ride is exquisite, something must have happend (hopefully they were not drunk). I am sorry for your loss, and those of the family members that are remaining.

Scream
09-07-2004, 08:53 AM
Terribly tragic news. How many of these threads have we read this summer alone? Boating at night is exquisite as mrsdrmr said, but the need for safety first is what should be the first thought of all of us on the water. I've only gone over wakeless speed a couple of times at night, Full Moon, and I knew where I was and where I was heading. Boating during the day is hazardous as well.
Hopefully the reiteration of horrific stories like these will make some of us wake up and take notice. There's really no need for injury or loss of life in this hobby/sport/activity...
I cannot even imagine what the familes are going through right now. Such a waste...
Scream

DryHeatOnly
09-07-2004, 09:12 AM
This is such a senseless tragedy. My sympathies go out to the families involved.
I cruised upriver under the Topock bridge the night before between 7:30-7:40pm (well after sunset). With a double set of pylons, you HAVE TO either know that part of the river like the back of your hand or better yet just cruise through at or near no-wake speed.
DHO :frown:

Ivan Dan
09-07-2004, 09:28 AM
May the grace of God be with those that lost there lives in this tragic accident. Remember it's an accident, I"ve been there. A lot of lives changed this weekend and people need support not opinions.
I agree with you! I know the driver Scott and several passengers on the boat, they have been going to the river for many many years and knew that area VERY well. Scott is a very responsible and stand up guy that might have made a tragic mistake. But PLEASE everyone don't start saying he was wasted until it is confirmed and they are still saying it is suspected at this time. He had several of his best friends on that boat and one of them is one still missing so you know he is suffering too. Also my prayers go out to the families and friends of the other passengers that were lost or are still missing. When I heard about the crash I expected the pictures of the boat to be a lot worse to be honest.
GODSPEED to everyone involved including families and friends! Please guys don't judge this could happen to you or me just as easy.

RiverOtter
09-07-2004, 09:55 AM
Just curious... I boat on a navigable waterway. The channel is market with bouys Red, Green and Black, (all with reflective tape) and blinking channel markers. All of the bridges have red and green lights on them. Is this not common on the western lakes since they are land locked??

Fufu Queen
09-07-2004, 10:03 AM
On our way home yesterday from down by Parker, Hustler and I both saw the rescue boats, we had know Idea what had happened till this morning while listing to the radio news. It always hurts a lot to hear of fellow boaters lost, they are all in our thoughts and prayers.
I just wanted to say God Speed to the families and also for anyone that was involved. Hustler and I have lost a lot of great people in the past couple of years but to dog anyone out would be out of the question, we all make mistakes and do things we should have put more thought too. Accidents are just that accidents, we might be in a car we might be in a sand rail or even on a bike but what we need right now is a ton of love and understanding for the people that were lost.
Hustler and I do love to boat at night but we always have our lights on and the spotlight is attached to my arm, it is my responsibility to be his second set of eyes. We also never drive fast, always at a wakeless speed, the other thing is we never boat at night where we don’t know the river or waterway, if we don’t we have someone with us that does. And remembering that the River always changes.
This is a tragedy that is felt all over this boating community all I can say is that with anything we do even if it’s walking across the street things happen. I think what we need to remember is that lives were lost.
Also, anytime we do anything fun there is risk.
Again to the families and drivers of the boats, you all are in our thoughts and prayers.
GOD SPEED

ROZ
09-07-2004, 10:13 AM
Sad to read. Too bad about your friends.

Boatcop
09-07-2004, 10:24 AM
Just curious... I boat on a navigable waterway. The channel is market with bouys Red, Green and Black, (all with reflective tape) and blinking channel markers. All of the bridges have red and green lights on them. Is this not common on the western lakes since they are land locked??
The bridges are marked and lighted for the channel, but no navigation bouys on the Colorado River.

Windy
09-07-2004, 10:31 AM
God Speed to those involved in this tragic accident. :(

PlyaPlya22
09-07-2004, 10:34 AM
The bridges are marked and lighted for the channel, but no navigation bouys on the Colorado River.
How hard is it to get the Nava bouys in certain places on the river?

Fufu Queen
09-07-2004, 10:39 AM
Good ? I like that Idea...

Prop Rod
09-07-2004, 10:56 AM
This story sucks! I feel so bad for the families that lost love ones. I had to drive at night once and it scared the sh!t out of me. My thoughts and prayers are with you.

Essex502
09-07-2004, 10:59 AM
Accidents do happen. Push on a lever and the lever breaks = accident. Unforeseen.
Negligence on the other hand CAN be AVOIDED. Drink and get into a boat then drive it down the lake or river and run into something = NEGLIGENCE. Could have been foreseen by the driver or passengers who allowed the driver to partake in the partying and still drive the boat.
What we don't know is whether or not the driver was under the influence of alcohol or other substances.
What we do know is 2 are dead and 2 are presumed dead and the driver has been arrested and booked with $100,000 bail.
When will people take responsibility and call it what it is ... bad judgement that lead to 4 deaths at the least...criminal manslaughter if the driver was intoxicated.

Fufu Queen
09-07-2004, 11:31 AM
We are all-human and make mistakes. People will pay not only with the loss of loved ones but also with the guilt that they will live with each and everyday till they met their maker. We have to remember that we are not the Jude and jury but the ones that feel the loss of fellow boaters. And the mistakes that we make by being human.
I truly feel as if everyone should take a refresher course in boating like learning what the red and green lights mean and what’s the white light on the back is for also how to read when lights are posted on pillars etc. It does not hurt to be more aware. We need to remember every time we get into a boat, car or jump on a bike that we are in a killing machine and we must respect that. Life is to short to forget we can all be taken out in a blink of an eye.

coolchange
09-07-2004, 11:57 AM
Condolences to the family and friends.
I hope alcohol wasn't involved,bad enough to deal with as it is.
It only takes a moment and you have to really be there all the time especially at night. One night comin down river with my bro just on a plane and I felt he should be settin up his turn by now so I flipped the spot on for a second. He made a hard left and looked at me in disbelief. Said if I hadn't done that he would have ran right into the side of the mountain. Scared the shit out of him. And we had been goin to Parker for 20 years at that time. He said he was just taken it all in and lost track for just a second.

Huckleberry
09-07-2004, 12:14 PM
Accidents do happen. Push on a lever and the lever breaks = accident. Unforeseen.
Negligence on the other hand CAN be AVOIDED. Drink and get into a boat then drive it down the lake or river and run into something = NEGLIGENCE. Could have been foreseen by the driver or passengers who allowed the driver to partake in the partying and still drive the boat.
What we don't know is whether or not the driver was under the influence of alcohol or other substances.
What we do know is 2 are dead and 2 are presumed dead and the driver has been arrested and booked with $100,000 bail.
When will people take responsibility and call it what it is ... bad judgement that lead to 4 deaths at the least...criminal manslaughter if the driver was intoxicated.
VERY WELL PUT! Especially the part about it not being an accident if in fact the driver was DUI.

RADDONKEY
09-07-2004, 12:41 PM
Our prayers to the family and friends. We went by twice yesterday, and were there when they found one of the bodies. A tragic accident. Its up to the court to decide guilt not us. Thanks go out to the officers who spent thier holiday looking for victims. True professionals doing a tuff job. :frown:

MagicMtnDan
09-07-2004, 12:46 PM
It's a terrible tragedy for sure. Especially when these "accidents" cause the death of innocent people.
So how long before someone posts that the consumption of alcohol shouldn't be blamed rather, the accident was caused by a loss of visibility due to "low light conditions." :220v: :mad: :argue: :skull:

andy01
09-07-2004, 12:55 PM
Accidents do happen. Push on a lever and the lever breaks = accident. Unforeseen.
Negligence on the other hand CAN be AVOIDED. Drink and get into a boat then drive it down the lake or river and run into something = NEGLIGENCE. Could have been foreseen by the driver or passengers who allowed the driver to partake in the partying and still drive the boat.
What we don't know is whether or not the driver was under the influence of alcohol or other substances.
What we do know is 2 are dead and 2 are presumed dead and the driver has been arrested and booked with $100,000 bail.
When will people take responsibility and call it what it is ... bad judgement that lead to 4 deaths at the least...criminal manslaughter if the driver was intoxicated.
Couldn't have said it better myself!
To bad for the familys!!!
Andy

Charley
09-07-2004, 12:55 PM
My sincere condolences to the families of all involved. I also have to agree, please keep the assumptions out of this mess, It's already a tragic situation let's not add unsubstantiated scenarios into this.
I am not trying to hijack the thread here but kinda felt this was related enough to post: Although I am upriver of the bridge, I on 6-8 occasions have done the Topock Run at night myself.... My boat has a minimum planing speed and quite honestly, It's un nerving driving at 30-35mph at night, especially as narrow as it gets up there! I actually use my spotlight differently than most....The spotlight's beam tends to have alot of glare associated with it and actually hinders my long range vision...so by not using it constantly , I tend to see the river MUCH better! without the light on(DARK) I use the sillouette of the sky against 2 outter banks to choose my long range line and then every 5 seconds I flash each bank like a strobe to insure my long range line isn't a bad short range line. I also flash all boats 2-3 times as I approach and pass them ... ya my wife laughs cause Im strobing the river banks the whole way home, but it seems to work for me. I'm not saying this is the way people should do things, but different things work for different people and if my technique clicks for 1 of you it was worth posting!
once again my condolences to the families :frown: :frown:

SBullet
09-07-2004, 01:04 PM
My condolences to the families & friends who received this horrible news yesterday! :frown: :frown:

BadBahner
09-07-2004, 01:08 PM
Is there an after sunset speed limit on that section of the river? Just asking so I know for the future.
Thanks,

Ziggy
09-07-2004, 01:16 PM
anyone know if they were coming up or going down?? that bridge id kinda hard to see at night coming up river but if you know the river you know its there right after the pipeline..... very sad...... my condolences....
And the fact that there is a train bridge that runs accross right there too makes it double dangerous. The I40 and train bridge pylons are not equally distanced, or not in alignment with each other.
Tragic event, my heart goes out to the families.

Sherpa
09-07-2004, 01:26 PM
there might be quite a few circumstances we don't have information regarding at this point.
do jets still make a hard turn if the motor seizes-?
I do know that jets don't turn for shit if go fast peddle isn't mashed.. **
what if somebody fell onto the driver, or knocked the drive into "neutral"
and since no drive=no steer............. lots of possibilities... the known
fact is 4 people died...... while out having fun..........
--Sherpa
waiting for the jury to decide.

Mike67rs
09-07-2004, 01:44 PM
Here is a pic of the approach from the south. What you can't see until you come around are the railroad bridge supports in the water. I can see how it would be dangerous at night. Mike
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/1554April04_029.jpg

BOBALOO
09-07-2004, 02:03 PM
Alot of people have said they use a spotlight and I used to also. The last time we were at Parker one of Parkers finest stopped Scuba Steve for using a spotlight and he almost got a ticket b/c of it.
Is there a restriction on using lights at night cuz I still have mine in my lap to illuminate the shoreline or that odd object outline with no lights at night. All it takes is a second during the day or night to have a collision.
Last Memorial at Parker I had 11 people on my boat (yes I was the DD) and as we were floating in front of the entrance to the Keyes at night. I turned my attention away from looking up and down the river for 10 seconds as to make sure nobody was behind the boat so I could start up. No sooner did I start the boat do I see another boat coming RIGHT at us, a SUPER quick reverse and lots of throttle saved all of you from reading about this night in the paper. Be careful.

J540
09-07-2004, 03:44 PM
This is a pic, going up river, looks like a lot of room, its not that bad, but going down river like they were, its a lot different,you lose site of the second pylon that holds the I40.They left ToPoc and went up river about 3or4 houses up from Needles bridge and had quite the party going on one nice sound system. and they did have lights, cuz the girl was dancing in the openbow and they were flashing two or three flash lights at her as they were floting down river.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/1554April04_029.jpg[/QUOTE]

FunOnTheWater
09-07-2004, 04:13 PM
I feel so bad for the families who now have to bury their loved ones. The driver mad a very bad choice and those who were with him,may not of had a choice. All the speculation of what happened is building on the story.
People, be careful lets be around to enjoy many more holidays together.
Rest In Peace to the victims

BoatPI
09-07-2004, 04:49 PM
I hope in a way that this does not turn out to be a claim I work on. Fatal's are terrible. Tragedy, almost always unavoidable.
I have spoken for pages on the dangers of boating on Havasu or the river at night.

Spotondl
09-07-2004, 05:54 PM
Condolences to the families involved in both accidents.
We were in the channel when the site 6 accident occurred. Sherrif's boat ran through there at maximum/ultimate wake speed... Holy moly, hold onto the boats...
Heard about the Topock incident through the grapevine...
We were camped out at Cattail and there was a father and son in the site directly across from us. They took off Friday afternoon for the sandbar despite the winds and they did not return that night.
As we were getting ready to launch on Saturday we see the guy and his son sitting at the ramp, boat on the trailer having just arrived back from Friday's outting so we started talking to him. Well, I guess they made it only to the channel due to the conditions... The dad was sucking down rum and cokes all day and waited until after dark to make the run back to cattail... His kid told me that he asked his dad NOT to drive because he was obviously too hammered. Anyway, somewhere along the way the guy runs his boat up onto the shore. The entire lower unit of his merc was sheared off and the entire starboard side was sideswiped with dirt and mud. All of the bimini and cleat hardware was tore off and there was a 3 inch hole in the side where it looks like something inboard slammed the inside of the hull and broke through. The kid was scared shitless and all banged up and had a long laceration on his palm that needed some attention. Of course, drunken dad didn't have a scratch on his body and was joking around as if it wasn't a big deal. He was sore about the $250 SeaTow pull back to the ramp... :yuk: :cry: :cry:
The dad was telling us about some marital issues he was having at home and that was why he was spending some "alone time" with his kid... Guess when the kid relays this story to mom and she sees the boat damage and the $$$ damage dad will REALLY have some marital issues to deal with....
VERY VERY close to having 3 tragic accidents this weekend...

J540
09-07-2004, 06:28 PM
Condolences to the families involved in both accidents.
We were in the channel when the site 6 accident occurred. Sherrif's boat ran through there at maximum/ultimate wake speed... Holy moly, hold onto the boats...
Heard about the Topock incident through the grapevine...
We were camped out at Cattail and there was a father and son in the site directly across from us. They took off Friday afternoon for the sandbar despite the winds and they did not return that night.
As we were getting ready to launch on Saturday we see the guy and his son sitting at the ramp, boat on the trailer having just arrived back from Friday's outting so we started talking to him. Well, I guess they made it only to the channel due to the conditions... The dad was sucking down rum and cokes all day and waited until after dark to make the run back to cattail... His kid told me that he asked his dad NOT to drive because he was obviously too hammered. Anyway, somewhere along the way the guy runs his boat up onto the shore. The entire lower unit of his merc was sheared off and the entire starboard side was sideswiped with dirt and mud. All of the bimini and cleat hardware was tore off and there was a 3 inch hole in the side where it looks like something inboard slammed the inside of the hull and broke through. The kid was scared shitless and all banged up and had a long laceration on his palm that needed some attention. Of course, drunken dad didn't have a scratch on his body and was joking around as if it wasn't a big deal. He was sore about the $250 SeaTow pull back to the ramp... :yuk: :cry: :cry:
The dad was telling us about some marital issues he was having at home and that was why he was spending some "alone time" with his kid... Guess when the kid relays this story to mom and she sees the boat damage and the $$$ damage dad will REALLY have some marital issues to deal with....
VERY VERY close to having 3 tragic accidents this weekend...
You should have Kick the Dad in the ASS and gave the kid a ride. if it would have turned out worst and a body bag was needed for dad, iam sure the mom would have Thanked you for mabe saving her sons Life. F*** what the Dad has to think. I would have got PD over to have a talk with him, He mite have hit you or I and they would need a bag for us, if he was Drunk and I didn't need a bag...........He would.

Ziggy
09-07-2004, 06:40 PM
The dad was telling us about some marital issues he was having at home and that was why he was spending some "alone time" with his kid... Guess when the kid relays this story to mom and she sees the boat damage and the $$$ damage dad will REALLY have some marital issues to deal with....
VERY VERY close to having 3 tragic accidents this weekend...
That is the dumbest excuse I've heard...and its not the first time either. Go drown you sorrows at home not when you're supposed to be having one/one time with your boy...You think the father learned a lesson??? Probably doubtful.....but I bet the son sure learned a whole lot about dear ol' dad.. :messedup:

Extreme Liquid
09-07-2004, 06:45 PM
Our thoughts go out to the families for the loss of their loved ones. Agree with a few of you out there. A 5 mile an hour zone needs to be made in that tight area. It was so sobering to see the boat be pulled out of the water yesterday. We took a close look at it once it arrived at Park Moabi. It is a good reminder of what can happen.

H20Advantage
09-07-2004, 07:07 PM
Condolences to the families involved in both accidents.
We were in the channel when the site 6 accident occurred. Sherrif's boat ran through there at maximum/ultimate wake speed... Holy moly, hold onto the boats...
Heard about the Topock incident through the grapevine...
We were camped out at Cattail and there was a father and son in the site directly across from us. They took off Friday afternoon for the sandbar despite the winds and they did not return that night.
As we were getting ready to launch on Saturday we see the guy and his son sitting at the ramp, boat on the trailer having just arrived back from Friday's outting so we started talking to him. Well, I guess they made it only to the channel due to the conditions... The dad was sucking down rum and cokes all day and waited until after dark to make the run back to cattail... His kid told me that he asked his dad NOT to drive because he was obviously too hammered. Anyway, somewhere along the way the guy runs his boat up onto the shore. The entire lower unit of his merc was sheared off and the entire starboard side was sideswiped with dirt and mud. All of the bimini and cleat hardware was tore off and there was a 3 inch hole in the side where it looks like something inboard slammed the inside of the hull and broke through. The kid was scared shitless and all banged up and had a long laceration on his palm that needed some attention. Of course, drunken dad didn't have a scratch on his body and was joking around as if it wasn't a big deal. He was sore about the $250 SeaTow pull back to the ramp... :yuk: :cry: :cry:
The dad was telling us about some marital issues he was having at home and that was why he was spending some "alone time" with his kid... Guess when the kid relays this story to mom and she sees the boat damage and the $$$ damage dad will REALLY have some marital issues to deal with....
VERY VERY close to having 3 tragic accidents this weekend...
This is called child endangerment (a felony) and could send this idiot away for a little while. Kill yourself but not your children or any other innocent victims.
My regards go out to the family of the victims. How many times do we (meaning society) have to say don't drink and drive. It's too easy for something tragic like this to happen. Drinking impairs your judgement, sense of timing and visual perception especially at night. There is nothing wrong with drinking as long as you use good judgement and moderation. This has been said many times over and over again and still people whom many of us regard as responsible and good people continue to make this terrible mistake.
Not only are the families affected by the loss but so are the emergency personnel who have to deal with the aftermath. I have personally seen too many bodies in various states of dismemberment due to alcohol and someone getting behind the wheel of either a motor vehicle or boat. Loss of life only takes a second.....let's all take that second and make the right decisions with regards to alcohol. Don't give those who don't like our favorite past time more ammo to place stricter regulations on our passion for boating and good times with great friends.

JetBoatRich
09-07-2004, 07:32 PM
This is called child endangerment (a felony) and could send this idiot away for a little while. Kill yourself but not your children or any other innocent victims.
My regards go out to the family of the victims. How many times do we (meaning society) have to say don't drink and drive. It's too easy for something tragic like this to happen. Drinking impairs your judgement, sense of timing and visual perception especially at night. There is nothing wrong with drinking as long as you use good judgement and moderation. This has been said many times over and over again and still people whom many of us regard as responsible and good people continue to make this terrible mistake.
Not only are the families affected by the loss but so are the emergency personnel who have to deal with the aftermath. I have personally seen too many bodies in various states of dismemberment due to alcohol and someone getting behind the wheel of either a motor vehicle or boat. Loss of life only takes a second.....let's all take that second and make the right decisions with regards to alcohol. Don't give those who don't like our favorite past time more ammo to place stricter regulations on our passion for boating and good times with great friends.
Nice post Josh.
Drowning your problems :( is no way to make them go away, I hope somebody said that to him. Just glad to hear the the kid is alright, yet maybe mentally scared now

Larah
09-07-2004, 08:55 PM
I just wanted to say that I am pretty close to all that were involved. It is VERY sad about what has happened. It is so sad and I wish I could tell you guys more details, however the familys really want everything to be kept as quiet as possible since they have reporters following them daily. If you are a reporter....please leave them alone!
Some misconceptions about this incident are VERY apparent, but I am sure that when the familys decide to talk that they will clear this up.
I wish you guys all the best...and please please always be careful

racecar.hotshoe
09-07-2004, 09:08 PM
All are condolences to you and the family,friends.I dont know of any reporters on here but I guess you never know.God speed to all partys who has lost loved ones.

Tom Garcia
09-07-2004, 09:34 PM
Team,
SO SORRY FOR ALL INVOLVED. Here some info.
http://www.havasunews.com/articles/2004/09/07/news/news01.txt

Essex502
09-08-2004, 05:36 AM
I just wanted to say that I am pretty close to all that were involved. It is VERY sad about what has happened. It is so sad and I wish I could tell you guys more details, however the familys really want everything to be kept as quiet as possible since they have reporters following them daily. If you are a reporter....please leave them alone!
Some misconceptions about this incident are VERY apparent, but I am sure that when the familys decide to talk that they will clear this up.
I wish you guys all the best...and please please always be careful
I do feel bad for the family members who lost there loved ones but what "misconceptions" are there? Boat sank, 4 dead, driver arrested for multiple felonies...what is the misconception?

love 'em don't hate 'em
09-08-2004, 05:47 AM
I dont think the decedant's family would care for your comments much. I think a little respect is in order.
Thank you THOR for your request that people have a little respect when they post their comments and opinions. A lot of the victim’s family and friends are grieving & coming to this forum to find out information on the crash and for support. This is such a tragic accident which has affected a lot of people, more then just the eight who were involved.
Four of passengers are close family friends of mine, including the driver, two survivors and one of the missing. They are local So Cal boys.
In addition, they are all very sweet, kind, fun guys who work hard & love to go to the river to relax and have a good time. Don’t we all? We have to remember that this was an accident and one that will forever leave a tragic scare on all involved.
It is everyone’s responsibility to be safe on the water.
Friends, please be respectful when you post. We need all the love and support from the boating community right now.
“…Well I was born in the sign of water and it's there that I feel my best…”
–Little River Band

79miller
09-08-2004, 06:23 AM
[COLOR=Purple][FONT=Arial Black][FONT=Verdana]
Thank you THOR for your request that people have a little respect when they post their comments and opinions. A lot of the victim’s family and friends are grieving & coming to this forum to find out information on the crash and for support. This is such a tragic accident which has affected a lot of people, more then just the eight who were involved.
Four of passengers are close family friends of mine, including the driver, two survivors and one of the missing. They are local So Cal boys.
In addition, they are all very sweet, kind, fun guys who work hard & love to go to the river to relax and have a good time. Don’t we all? We have to remember that this was an accident and one that will forever leave a tragic scare on all involved.
It is everyone’s responsibility to be safe on the water.
Friends, please be respectful when you post. We need all the love and support from the boating community right now.
Absolutely, this is why I started this thread to help everyone in our group of friends and family get current information and help get through this trajedy. Everyone is very torn up over what has happened.
I do not want this thread to turn into a preaching/lecture thread on the pros and cons of boating at night or any of the other circumstances involved with the crash. There is tons of other places on the internet and this forum to do that.
Thanks everyone for thier comments and condolences, I know all of us greatly appreciate your kindness, support and thoughts.

79miller
09-08-2004, 06:32 AM
This is one of the latest articles from the OCRegister.
>>>>>>
Boat crash kills 2
Two missing, including Huntington man, in Colorado River accident. An Anaheim Hills man is arrested.
By GREG HARDESTY, GWENDOLYN DRISCOLL and JOHN McDONALD
The Orange County Register
Needles Under the moonless sky, they never saw it coming.
"I looked up and there it was, and we just hit it," said Jeff Leinen, 34, of Orange, recalling when his friend's jet boat slammed into a concrete railroad bridge support at more than 35 mph, spilling eight adults into the Colorado River.
A Corona woman and an Arizona man were killed in the accident early Labor Day, the latest boating tragedy to occur in the area. Last year, an accident near Parker, Ariz., claimed the lives of three Orange County residents.
Killed Monday were Jennifer Knight, 25, and Ryan McMahan, 27, of Mohave.
Two adults are still missing, including Leinen's best friend, Dale Baldwin, 35, of Huntington Beach.
Leinen and Baldwin were among five friends whose fates intertwined with three strangers in a bar on the last holiday weekend of summer.
They took an early morning "boat float" after last call at the Topock Gorge, a waterfront bar in Topock, Ariz.
Scott Eickhoff, 31, of Anaheim Hills invited his four friends and three Arizona residents they had just met at night to join him on his 1998 23-foot Renegade runabout.
Eickhoff, who works at an RV repair business in Anaheim, was uninjured in the 3:30 a.m. accident. He was arrested on suspicion of vessel manslaughter and felony operating a boat under the influence. He is free on $100,000 bail.
"It's sad," said Greg Fisher, manager of the Topock Gorge. "It seems like every year something like this happens. For anyone to even be out on the water (at that time), that's a little scary."
McMahan's brother, Rorey McMahan, 29, of Texas, was missing late Tuesday, along with Baldwin.
"He's my only son," Patricia Baldwin, 58, of Anaheim said of the former ski instructor, surfer and dirt-bike rider, who often visited the river. "We were very good friends."
From her bed at the Colorado River Medical Center, Brenna McMahan, 24, of Mohave, who was injured, was too distraught to talk about her dead husband and his missing brother.
Her mother held her hand as she sobbed, "I'm fine. I'm doing good."
Leinen, Eickhoff and Baldwin spent the day Sunday boating along the Colorado River with two other good friends, Knight and Simon Pirotta, 35, of Riverside.
Sunday evening, the friends ate sandwiches, drank, shot pool and listened to music at the Topock Gorge.
The McMahans accidentally sat at their table but were invited to stay. When the bar closed around 2 a.m., they joined the five on the boat.
Eickhoff went north on the Colorado River from the Topock marina, then turned.
The river curves near the Topock Bridge, along Interstate 40, which intersects the California-Arizona border.
Three bridges stand close together at the spot where the river resembles a vast, greenish-yellow marsh.
"We were just kind of going - it didn't seem like a big deal," Leinen recalled. "I wasn't scared, thinking that we needed to slow down."
And that's when it happened.
"I kind of came up out of the water, calling for the other people, and I never heard a word," Leinen said. "I thought I was the only survivor."
It took Leinen about 20 minutes to swim to shore.
Pirotta floated to the California shore a half-mile downstream and alerted utility-plant workers to the accident.
Ryan McMahan's body was found early Tuesday in about 12 feet of water south of the collision scene.
Knight's body was found floating about a mile south of the scene early Tuesday.
Authorities used a helicopter and several boats to search for Baldwin and Rorey McMahan.
"They could be right by the pillar, 100 yards down the river (or) one-quarter of a mile away," said Det. Rob Alexander of the San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department.
Eickhoff was uninjured.
"He is not in a good state right now," said Chris Jones, 35, of San Jacinto, who has known Baldwin since preschool and also is friends with Eickhoff.
Eickhoff has no record of accidents or alcohol-related offenses, according to the Department of Motor Vehicles.
Patricia Baldwin declined to discuss the accident.
"We are all worried about him," Jones said.
Dale Baldwin attended Esperanza High School in Anaheim and Fullerton Junior College, his mother said.
He worked three days a week as a computer programmer at Jellco Container Inc., an Anaheim manufacturer of corrugated boxes and seller of packaging products. In addition, he ran his own company, Deuce Kustom Clothing.
Until recently, Jennifer Knight also worked at Jellco, said Jason Wilkerson, 35, Jellco's operations manager.
"We took three hours today" to deal with the tragedy, Wilkerson said. "We shut off the phones and just talked."
Leinen said the accident has made him think about the single lifestyle he and his buddies have long enjoyed.
"It's kind of a cliché, but I never thought this would happen to us," he said.
"If I was married with kids and stuff, I probably wouldn't have been out on the river at 2 a.m., fighting for my life."
Driscoll reported from Needles, Hardesty and McDonald from Orange County.

Larah
09-08-2004, 06:40 AM
I couldn't agree more. There is a newspaper article in the OC Register today in the local section if you all want to read. I am sure since many of you all know the ones involved, you probably know me and my family as well.
As far as the misconceptions, I said this is trying to be kept private, so I will not go into that.
I hope everyone learns from this tragic experience and is more careful and safe.

love 'em don't hate 'em
09-08-2004, 06:57 AM
... My support goes out to the Investigators and District Attorneys who will hopefully bend the driver over and ream him! :angry2:
Hey Huck..the driver is a friend of mine and he is an experienced boater. It is alleged that there was drinking involved...remember, innocent until proven guilty. This was a terrible accident which has left my brother with out a roommate.
I agree that we all need to be responsible and not drink and boat. This was a terrible accident.

montyawards
09-08-2004, 07:02 AM
This one's going to hurt for a long time. But it is comforting to know how many friends there are who will support and think only kind thoughts for those involved. As I will too.
-Your Friend
Monty

Wally_Gator
09-08-2004, 07:14 AM
Opinions and thoughts...
Opinion, this must be the hardest thing family and friends must ever have to go through. I would never wish this upon anyone. Let alone to have the monday morning quarterbacks questioning every move and motive. Everyone please remove the microscope from these people and let them have their privacy. A family should be able to morn in their own way. My family's thoughts and prayers go out to those who have lost.
Stick to the facts. Experienced boaters ran into a bridge at night, 4 lives have been lost. Everything else is either suspicion or conjecture.
If there is any light from this tradgedy, I for one strive to become a safer boater after hearing about such incidents.. I couldn't imagine loosing any of my 3 little ones..

Mrs.Racer277
09-08-2004, 07:21 AM
I am so sorry to hear about everyones loses. You are all in my prayers.
I grew up with the Eickhoff family. They lived in my neighborhood. A friend of the family's should have been on that boat but was tired and went to bed instead. Just found out my sister was also thinking about going this weekend but stayed home instead.
Again my condolences to all the families and friends involved.

love 'em don't hate 'em
09-08-2004, 07:27 AM
Opinions and thoughts...
Stick to the facts. Experienced boaters ran into a bridge at night, 4 lives have been lost. Everything else is either suspicion or conjecture...
I agree Wally...this accident could have happened under a number of circumstances. I do hope that there is a silver lining and that the boaters reading this thread will be a little bit more careful the next time they take to the water.
Peace be with you all.

Huckleberry
09-08-2004, 08:25 AM
Hey Huck..the driver is a friend of mine and he is an experienced boater. It is alleged that there was drinking involved...remember, innocent until proven guilty. This was a terrible accident which has left my brother with out a roommate.
I agree that we all need to be responsible and not drink and boat. This was a terrible accident.
L.E.D.H.E.,
I'm sure he is an experienced boater. Are you saying that experienced boaters don't drink and drive? I'll take that bet any day! Are you saying experienced boaters don't do stupid things? Again, I'll take that bet any day. (BTW, eight adults on a 21-foot boat...Probably not the brightest thing to do, drunk or sober! Let alone in total darkness at 35 MPH. Just these two factors alone can be major factors in this or any collision.)
You keep harping on this being an "accident." I beg to differ. An "accident" is when you are operating your boat in a safe manner and hit a submerged object, a steering cable breaks, another boater cuts in front of you without warning...causing a collision. It appears this is a case of an experienced boater who made some poor decisions, each one compounding the other and ultimately resulting in a very tragic incident, not accident. We are all responsible for everything we do. We must all think of the most far reaching possibilities and consequences of our actions before we do them, and weigh the risks. If your friend did not do this, shame on him. If he did, he gambled and lost, as did those aboard his boat, their families & friends. For them and to you I give my most sincere condolences.
Yes, it was "alleged" he was drinking and driving. In 22 years as a L.E.O., I've never seen anyone booked for DUI that didn't have the objective symptoms of intoxication. Without probable cause, they could not have booked your friend for felony DUI. That means he was likely given some type of field sobriety tests which indicated he was impaired, he showed physical symptoms of intoxication (Bloodshot & watery eyes, odor of alcohol on his breath, horizontal gaze nystagmus in his eyes...), probably statements made by witnesses indicating he had been drinking prior to the collision, and a chemical test to determine his blood alcohol content. I cannot even fathom San Bernardino Sheriff's Office booking a person to felony DUI if they had no reason at all to believe the person was impaired. Was your friend legally impaired...Only time will tell. If in fact it comes out that he had no alcohol or drugs in his system, I will be the first one to stand up and publically admit I was wrong and apologize. I promise you this. If he was in fact impaired, I will not say squat.
On the positive side of this whole unfortunate trajedy...I truly respect your friend for doing the honorable thing and remaining at the scene of the collision. It shows that even if he did screw up, he's an upstanding man and is willing to accept responsibility for his actions. Not to mention that he was there for his friends when they needed help. Unfortunately it has become all too popular to flee the scene of a major collision to dodge one's responsibility. That is as chickenshit as it gets in my book!
It may seem that I am focusing directly on your friend. I am not. I am focusing on the friggin morons who still think it is alright to go out to a bar, get shitfaced, and then get into a boat and take the lives of their family, friends, and innocent people into their hands. I am sick of seeing it, and I am sick of hearing about it! Those that do it need to be bent over and reamed by the legal system, and then for many, many years to come by their new-found lover named "Bubba"!!!

Wally_Gator
09-08-2004, 08:34 AM
L.E.D.H.E.,
I'm sure he is an experienced boater. Are you saying that experienced boaters don't drink and drive? I'll take that bet any day! Are you saying experienced boaters don't do stupid things? Again, I'll take that bet any day. (BTW, eight adults on a 21-foot boat...Probably not the brightest thing to do, drunk or sober! Let alone in total darkness at 35 MPH. Just these two factors alone can be major factors in this or any collision.)
You keep harping on this being an "accident." I beg to differ. An "accident" is when you are operating your boat in a safe manner and hit a submerged object, a steering cable breaks, another boater cuts in front of you without warning...causing a collision. It appears this is a case of an experienced boater who made some poor decisions, each one compounding the other and ultimately resulting in a very tragic incident, not accident. We are all responsible for everything we do. We must all think of the most far reaching possibilities and consequences of our actions before we do them, and weigh the risks. If your friend did not do this, shame on him. If he did, he gambled and lost, as did those aboard his boat, their families & friends. For them and to you I give my most sincere condolences.
Yes, it was "alleged" he was drinking and driving. In 22 years as a L.E.O., I've never seen anyone booked for DUI that didn't have the objective symptoms of intoxication. Without probable cause, they could not have booked your friend for felony DUI. That means he was likely given some type of field sobriety tests which indicated he was impaired, he showed physical symptoms of intoxication (Bloodshot & watery eyes, odor of alcohol on his breath, horizontal gaze nystagmus in his eyes...), probably statements made by witnesses indicating he had been drinking prior to the collision, and a chemical test to determine his blood alcohol content. I cannot even fathom San Bernardino Sheriff's Office booking a person to felony DUI if they had no reason at all to believe the person was impaired. Was your friend legally impaired...Only time will tell. If in fact it comes out that he had no alcohol or drugs in his system, I will be the first one to stand up and publically admit I was wrong and apologize. I promise you this. If he was in fact impaired, I will not say squat.
On the positive side of this whole unfortunate trajedy...I truly respect your friend for doing the honorable thing and remaining at the scene of the collision. It shows that even if he did screw up, he's an upstanding man and is willing to accept responsibility for his actions. Not to mention that he was there for his friends when they needed help. Unfortunately it has become all too popular to flee the scene of a major collision to dodge one's responsibility. That is as chickenshit as it gets in my book!
It may seem that I am focusing directly on your friend. I am not. I am focusing on the friggin morons who still think it is alright to go out to a bar, get shitfaced, and then get into a boat and take the lives of their family, friends, and innocent people into their hands. I am sick of seeing it, and I am sick of hearing about it! Those that do it need to be bent over and reamed by the legal system, and then for many, many years to come by their new-found lover named "Bubba"!!!
I can see that our L.E.O.'s believe in our legal systems principal of Innocent until proven guilty.
I might suggest that while you have very valid points, post a new topic and rant there. Ease up on the grieving folks. The bodies aren't even cold.

love 'em don't hate 'em
09-08-2004, 09:02 AM
L.E.D.H.E.,
... Those that do it need to be bent over and reamed by the legal system, and then for many, many years to come by their new-found lover named "Bubba"!!!
Huck...we are all trying to deal with this as well as we can. And yes, the driver is an upstanding citizen who just lost his best friend in the crash. He, his family and friends will have a life time of pain and agony dealing with this. As I mentioned, this has personally affected my family as one of the missing is my brother’s roommate and several of his other friends were on the boat as well. Your timing and this forum is off. At this time, we just don’t need you to upset us more with your insensitive remarks. You may not be directing them our friend, but that is the way it is coming across.
I do agree and understand your anger with people who drink and boat or drink and drive for that matter. It would be grand if these types of “incidents” (like that term better then accidents?) never happened.
However, I think it is inconsiderate of you to keep making comments such as, "Those that do it need to be bent over and reamed by the legal system, and then for many, many years to come by their new-found lover named "Bubba". These are crude, rude and disgusting. Thankfully, no one seems to be as ignorant as you are. Would you go to my friends funeral services and say these remarks? I hope not. Remember that there are many friends and family member who are coming to this site to help them mourn and go through the grieving process. Many know the victims and survivors, and many know the driver as well.
Huck, you are entitled to you opinion, but your remarks are hurtful to those of us who are trying to deal with this. I am asking you to please have the common decency to keep your "bubba" comments to yourself.

love 'em don't hate 'em
09-08-2004, 09:06 AM
I can see that our L.E.O.'s believe in our legal systems principal of Innocent until proven guilty.
I might suggest that while you have very valid points, post a new topic and rant there. Ease up on the grieving folks. The bodies aren't even cold.
Thank you Wally. :smile:

SHOCKWAVETOM
09-08-2004, 10:02 AM
I am so sorry to hear about everyones loses. You are all in my prayers.
I grew up with the Eickhoff family. They lived in my neighborhood. A friend of the family's should have been on that boat but was tired and went to bed instead. Just found out my sister was also thinking about going this weekend but stayed home instead.
Again my condolences to all the families and friends involved.
Mrs. Racer277.....Two of the kids in my neighborhood (18 yrs old) and one of their sisters and husband was supposed to be on the boat also. There wasn't enough room for them after Topoc so they got on another one. This is straight from the mouth of the mother of one of them that did not get on the boat. Lucky for them and you never know what turn life is going to give you.
While they were coming back home on the 40 they ran accross the car wreck that killed a couple of people. One of the kids went to the hospital and stayed with one of the guys overnight and he sadly died. Rough weekend for him and I hope he has learned a lesson over how precious life is :(

Mrs.Racer277
09-08-2004, 10:08 AM
Mrs. Racer277.....Two of the kids in my neighborhood (18 yrs old) and one of their sisters and husband was supposed to be on the boat also. There wasn't enough room for them after Topoc so they got on another one. This is straight from the mouth of the mother of one of them that did not get on the boat. Lucky for them and you never know what turn life is going to give you.
While they were coming back home on the 40 they ran accross the car wreck that killed a couple of people. One of the kids went to the hospital and stayed with one of the guys overnight and he sadly died. Rough weekend for him and I hope he has learned a lesson over how precious life is :(
Small world. Story sounds similar to what I heard today from my mom and sister. I'm so thankful my sister decided to stay in town to run her business and our other friend was to tired and went to bed.
My heart goes out to all those involved.
Glad to hear you guys made it home safe.

SHOCKWAVETOM
09-08-2004, 10:13 AM
Small world. Story sounds similar to what I heard today from my mom and sister. I'm so thankful my sister decided to stay in town to run her business and our other friend was to tired and went to bed.
My heart goes out to all those involved.
Glad to hear you guys made it home safe.
Yes it is a small world. It seems we may have some friends that cross paths.
We had left GA at Lake Mohave before the guy drowned out there. When we got back to the slip the LEO/Ambulance were standing by at the docks. I am glad we did not have to witness that tragedy :(

FRENCHIE
09-08-2004, 10:15 AM
yea tom i agree!! ;)

SHOCKWAVETOM
09-08-2004, 10:26 AM
yea tom i agree!! ;)
The one kid that did not get on the boat has been out on my boat at Lake Mohave and stayed at the house. He is a friend of my son's and he goes in the military in two weeks. I am sure this will affect him quite a bit but I just hope he realizes going forward how very close he came to having his own life ended. Very, very close.

Larah
09-08-2004, 10:33 AM
I agree!!!! :D

SHOCKWAVETOM
09-08-2004, 10:36 AM
Larah...are you a friend of Brent or his sister? Brent is one of the neighborhood kids here in my community.....

Essex502
09-08-2004, 10:56 AM
I have to agree with Huckleberry...the folks that are new on this board who chose the "introduce themselves" by posting on this thread seem to want sympathy from us...I for one will give sympathy where due but I have NO SYMPATHY for the driver of the boat if he was indeed intoxicated or alcohol impaired when the accident occurred. No excuse for it at all. No accident. Criminal negligence and homicide. This was not an accident.
When you post anything on a Forum like this you invite commentary - good or bad - and you better be ready for it. Yes, sometimes it hurts when confronted with other peoples opinions and at a time of grief it hurts doubly so.
I remember quite well a few years ago when the HTM crash happened and people were wringing their hands and saying "whoa is me" but the truth sometimes hurts and when something as stupid as this happens and lives are lost it is important that others learn from the mistakes and quit the drinking and driving that is so prevalent on our lakes and rivers. It remains to be seen whether the driver was impaired or not but I'd have to believe there wouldn't be a $100K bail on someone who didn't drink a drop of liquor.
As for starting another thread...why? Is this one is for sympathy only?

Wally_Gator
09-08-2004, 11:08 AM
As for starting another thread...why? Is this one is for sympathy only?
Maybe because some people are decent human beings.
Was this thread only about someone's guilt or innocense? No..
Get a clue.. Maybe if your family was struck by such tradgedy though not of your fault, kids or friends went for a ride with someone else, you might be singing another tune...
In the end people will be held accountable. That is for sure. Your thoughts have already been heard. But for those in mourning, go somewhere else and pour salt in someone else's wounds. Your venom does nothing for the families that are affected by this.

79miller
09-08-2004, 12:12 PM
Absolutely, this is why I started this thread to help everyone in our group of friends and family get current information and help get through this trajedy. Everyone is very torn up over what has happened.
I do not want this thread to turn into a preaching/lecture thread on the pros and cons of boating at night or any of the other circumstances involved with the crash. There is tons of other places on the internet and this forum to do that.
Thanks everyone for thier comments and condolences, I know all of us greatly appreciate your kindness, support and thoughts.
I'll quote myself and also say that many of the people viewing and posting on this thread know just about everyone involved from the driver to the passengers. At the same time, some of the people viewing and posting don't know each other but know those involved in the crash, as seen in some of the above posts, and are coming here to get more information.
I don't think anyone is looking for sympathy, but more for information about their injured and lost friends.
Maybe some people are more passive on their comments then others, but this is a public forum and everyone is free to say whatever they want.

H20Advantage
09-08-2004, 12:50 PM
Riding on 79Millers post I will put my two cents in without meaning to disrespect anyone.
We all grieve when there is a loss of this type. The members of this forum are a family of sorts in that we all share in the love of boating and the lakes.
Grief is expressed in many different forms and some will show it as sorrow and others anger. Many times when people read a thread like this these emotions come out and sometimes the way they respond may seem offensive to others. These boards are often used in this manner to express our feelings and thoughts so that many may deal with this terrible loss.
Lets all remember those that are lost and grieve for those that are left behind.

79miller
09-08-2004, 01:00 PM
Riding on 79Millers post I will put my two cents in without meaning to disrespect anyone.
We all grieve when there is a loss of this type. The members of this forum are a family of sorts in that we all share in the love of boating and the lakes.
Grief is expressed in many different forms and some will show it as sorrow and others anger. Many times when people read a thread like this these emotions come out and sometimes the way they respond may seem offensive to others. These boards are often used in this manner to express our feelings and thoughts so that many may deal with this terrible loss.
Lets all remember those that are lost and grieve for those that are left behind.
Well said, thanks.

moneysucker
09-08-2004, 01:11 PM
My condolences to all the families involved. I have hit things on night runs years ago and thankfully no-one was hurt. I learned a valuble lesson at night you need to slow down. I even had a spot light and hit the one rock on our section of the river. My first trip driving a boat. I learned a lesson that night and unfortunately sometimes it takes something happening to you or someone close to see. The purpoes of this thread was to gather information and express sympathy. We don't need to jump anyone over alleged mistakes or investigate the accident from our desks. People on these boards have lost someone close and/or had their lives altered permanantly and it could have been any one of us. Have some compassion and unless you are on the jury leave the prosecuting out of here. These things can happen to anyone and unfortunately they do. Again my thoughts and prayers to the victims and their families and wish them all a speedy recovery.

Performance 19
09-08-2004, 02:05 PM
Condolences to all of those affected by this terrible tragedy. Thoughts and prayers are with you.
On another note, just got done viewing some threads where people were actually bragging about how many beers they pounded at the sandbar, etc., and then had a hard time navigating back to thier destination. Maybe those of us who deplore drinking and driving/boating should be posting there!
Again, heartfelt condolences to all of those feeling such great loss and pain over this.
Jill + Jim

AzDon
09-08-2004, 04:01 PM
It's a terrible tragedy for sure. Especially when these "accidents" cause the death of innocent people.
So how long before someone posts that the consumption of alcohol shouldn't be blamed rather, the accident was caused by a loss of visibility due to "low light conditions." :220v: :mad: :argue: :skull:
Well, nobody yhas to now because you just said it! This is the kind of accident that only seems to happen at night..... But darkness will only be a footnote statistic....All LE cares about is "alcohol" statistics.....I just wonder if there would be ANY charges filed if the cooler was filled with Pepsi?

Kilrtoy
09-08-2004, 04:21 PM
Well, nobody yhas to now because you just said it! This is the kind of accident that only seems to happen at night..... But darkness will only be a footnote statistic....All LE cares about is "alcohol" statistics.....I just wonder if there would be ANY charges filed if the cooler was filled with Pepsi?
Are you kidding
YES THERE WOULD BE, 35MPH at night, if in fact that was the speed, negligent boating or what ever AZ calls it....
ALL LE CARES ABOUT IS YOUR SAFETY, even though you may be to drunk to realize this.

MudPumper
09-08-2004, 04:39 PM
If you are boating above wakeless speed at night you should also be wearing a life preserver. It doesn't take much to get tossed from a boat and chances are you will die from drowning not the collision.

Larah
09-08-2004, 05:45 PM
Actually I was rasied with Simon, Scot, and Jeff. I also knew Dale (except we called him Daryl)

79miller
09-08-2004, 06:07 PM
larah, check your private messages.

DragKits
09-08-2004, 06:27 PM
I dont know anyone that was in the accident but it hurts to see these young people lose there lives like this. Im from Orange County like the people in the accident and went to the same schools as them. I think its really nice that this thread was put up here for family and friends to look at to help get both information on the accident and support to help get through rough times.
I have a really good friend at my work that is best buds with the people in the accident and I have seen him the last 2 days at work struggling to get through the day thinking of his friends and there families. It saddens me to see people hurt.
My prayers go out to all of there friends and family.
Try to stay strong during these bad times and stay around loved ones.
You will all be missed.

BoatFloating
09-08-2004, 06:43 PM
Are you kidding
YES THERE WOULD BE, 35MPH at night, if in fact that was the speed, negligent boating or what ever AZ calls it....
ALL LE CARES ABOUT IS YOUR SAFETY, even though you may be to drunk to realize this.
Kilroy, I don't want to give AZDon any ammo because he's a wack but the 35mph isn't the issue. The speed limit is what is safe for conditions. Like Charley said there is alot of Cats that won't be on plane at 25mph and you have to run about 35mph+. I know this boat wasn't a cat just given n example.

SCLB41
09-08-2004, 08:34 PM
Are you kidding
YES THERE WOULD BE, 35MPH at night, if in fact that was the speed, negligent boating or what ever AZ calls it....
ALL LE CARES ABOUT IS YOUR SAFETY, even though you may be to drunk to realize this.
Thanks, Kilrtoy. You took th ewords right out of my mouth.

Danhercules
09-08-2004, 08:50 PM
Kilroy, I don't want to give AZDon any ammo because he's a wack but the 35mph isn't the issue. The speed limit is what is safe for conditions. Like Charley said there is alot of Cats that won't be on plane at 25mph and you have to run about 35mph+. I know this boat wasn't a cat just given n example.
Then that type of boat should not be driving at night.

FunOnTheWater
09-08-2004, 08:55 PM
again, such a bad incident :sqeyes: boat type, time, etc. does it matter?
I have to agree with poor choices made and they should not have been out there. But, that can not be changed and lives are changed, to many lost.

Tyson Ross
09-08-2004, 10:58 PM
First of all I feel for all involved, including the driver. The one thing that never seems to get mentioned is the liability passengers have in these type of incidents, assumption of risk. EVERYONE needs to be smart and make good decisions. Not just the drivers.
AZ says speed limit at night is 25mph. Can't speak for CA.
I wish the best for all involved through this difficult time.
(No speed limit at night) MY BAD

Seadog
09-09-2004, 05:55 AM
There are a few things that I have to get out about what I am reading here. Very few people have not done stupid things at that age. One problem is that kids are getting sh*t faced at a younger age and more frequently. We as responsible boaters need to make it uncool to do this. If a buddy is plastered, we need to keep him out of the cockpit. Is your life so pathetic that you cannot party without a beer bong, jello shots or several bottles of tequila? Watching drunks is fun.....to a point.
Boating at night is not for amateurs. Speed kills at night because you cannot see obstacles. I love night boating, but even with a full moon, 25 mph can be risky. Over that is just foolhardy.
I also hear a lot about using spotlights. Around here, that is a good way to get shot at. That and using docking lights for going around on the water. Using them will foul up your night vision and destroy it for others that have it pointed at them. With the multiple million candle power many put out, they can totally blind someone. They should rarely be used but rarely and never towards other boats.
I feel sorry for those who have lost family and friends in this incident, but most cases like this, it is everyone but the drinking driver that gets killed or maimed. Every time someone drinks and gets behind the wheel, the odds go up tremendously, that they will have an accident. We have argued the situation on this board countless times, but it keeps happening with regular frequency. Only you can change it. Don't need an excuse to get pie-eyed. Don't let your friends need to get soused and never let them boat or drive with alchol in their system. Change the world, one friend or loved one at a time

Hallett19
09-09-2004, 06:54 AM
I thouroughly enjoy night boating, but with me, I only do it where I know the water very very well, Havasu and Martinez. I use a high candle power light to spot the shore and I give it a quick wave in front of me every few seconds to make sure there are not boat w/o lights or bouys. I will never go night boating near a bridge unless I knew where it was and I would go by it at idle. This was a mistake on the drivers part, and weather he knew the water or not (I'm assuming he didnt) he should not have been driving fast, drunk and uneducated of terrain all when its dark. I really hope he doesnt ruin for us so authorities will take us off the water after a certain time. One can only pray. And I feel terrible for the family of the people who died for such a stupid mistake. :mad:

imbndvs
09-09-2004, 07:49 AM
First, my heart goes out to the families who have lost a family member in this accident.
Second, I can't believe people feel sorry for the driver! I have read here how people feel sorry for him because he will have to live with this for the rest of his life and he must feel terrible. I think the key words there are FEEL & LIVE.
At least he is still LIVING and FEELING which is more than he can say for his friends HE killed by drinking and driving!!!

LeeJay
09-09-2004, 08:10 AM
For all of us that have know Dale, we should say at least he was doing what he loved with the people he loved, and hope that his passing was very quick and he didnt suffer any.
Dale, we love you and you will be missed.
I am sure that all of Scotty's friends want him to know that we still love him too even though this is a very tragic accident.
We love and care about all of you!!

SCOPE
09-09-2004, 08:51 AM
.............and he is very lucky that it was not worse.
HUH? :confused: :confused: :confused:
"......leaving two confirmed dead, two missing and presumed dead, and three injured."
Very tragic. Condolences to the families of the victims killed. :frown: :frown:

little rowe boat
09-09-2004, 09:17 AM
he is very lucky that it was not worse.
:confused:

Keithb87
09-09-2004, 09:36 AM
Everytime I read the posts on this thread I start to Tear up...
It is so sad to hear about the loss of 4 fellow boaters, and to think of the HELL that the Driver is going through now, and the future legal HELL he will soon be going through.
This is why we ( My family that is) only drink, if we even do, in the evening.. and the Boat is parked.. NO ONE GOES OUT AFTER THE ALCOHOL IS INTRODUCED..... Even if one of us is sober, because of the stupid things that most drunks pull... "HOLD MY BEAR AND WATCH THIS" kind of stuff We just don't go.. Most of the time, we do not even take beer, or other stuff... But that is our choice..
The thing to remember is everyone on that boat had a CHOICE to go or not... and what about the lialibality of the bar that they were drinking at?
Shouldn't the bartender at least said " HOLD ON THERE SIR, I Think you should wait a little while.. "
I was not there, so I can not JUDGE those that were affected by the Decisions of all involved...
As it has been said many times before, The peeps on this board are like a big family.. and any loss of Family members hurts ...
Just my .02
God speed all involved..
Keith (Hurts to hear of such tragety) B87

CJ
09-09-2004, 09:44 AM
When I first got my boat, I drove from Havasu to Laughlin after nightfall with 8 people on my boat. I knew soon after as I discussed it with friends that it was a very STUPID move even though I was completely sober. I did wreck one prop. Luckily no one was hurt.
I tried to stop a friend from going upriver to Moabi the very same night, hours before the incident. Luckily he got lost in the coves before the sandbar and called me to drive him back to his truck. I am very happy to still have my friends in one piece.
My heart goes out to all involved. I am an Orange County guy and seems everyone knew someone. I hate hearing these things. One consolation is the lesson that will be learned by (unfortunately only) a few.

V-DRIVES RULE
09-09-2004, 09:54 AM
HORRIBLE HORRIBLE news my condolances to the FAMILYS. THIS IS TO ALL OF YOU PEOPLE OUT THERE WHO DRIVE BOATS::: iF YOU DRINK A DROP AND DRIVE YOUR BOAT YOU ARE A F#@CKING IDIOT!!! you are responsible for everybodys safty on your boat and anybody who climbs in a boat knowing the drivers been drinking is a FOOL!!!! i think the cops should go down to the sand bar and check every boat owner for drinking!! anybody who drives a boat and has been drinking this should EFFECT YOU!!! look at your friends and family and remember what the driver of that boats going thru!!! He has to face those familys. VERY SAD FOR ALL INVOLVED!! THE NEXT TIME I SEE A BOATER ON THE RIVER DRINKING AND DRIVING IM GOING TO CALL THE COPS MYSELF AND SAVE FUTURE FAMILYS FROM SUFFERING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !

OC-PARTYCAT
09-09-2004, 10:31 AM
boo frikin hoo, What happens when a drunk driver in a car kills a family, or your family? I dont think anyone including the law shows any sympathy..
It is a sad and terrible "negligent" thing that happened and I feel for, and pray for the "victims". This guy is still breathing the air he took away.
What if one of your children was dead because of his negligence? I dont think you would feel sorry for him, I dont.
I dont think anyone of his friends or family should be looking for any support from this board, unless they are ready to hear some negative along with it.
If I hurt anyone while driving drunk, and I feel that due to me being drunk caused it, I would expect no sympathy from anyone. Yes, I would live with it for the rest of my life, but that is not enough. I would want to be punished and so should he. He made the call and failed.
All the comments listed above are my opinion..only if he is found to be drunk while driving.

Ivan Dan
09-09-2004, 10:32 AM
First, my heart goes out to the families who have lost a family member in this accident.
Second, I can't believe people feel sorry for the driver! I have read here how people feel sorry for him because he will have to live with this for the rest of his life and he must feel terrible. I think the key words there are FEEL & LIVE.
At least he is still LIVING and FEELING which is more than he can say for his friends HE killed by drinking and driving!!!
You know....I'm getting sick and tired of hearing a*holes like you run their mouth. Can you honestly say you've NEVER EVER drank and drove? I seriously doubt there is ONE person in this entire forum that can say that. This could have happened to ANY one of us on that one time you or I drank and drove. Unfortunately it happened to Scott and yes it was a bad idea but that is no reason to nail him to the cross and burn it. You don't think the guy feel's bad enough? We don't need your crappy statements around here. Take them somewhere else.

JetBoatRich
09-09-2004, 10:41 AM
I am sure that all of Scotty's friends want him to know that we still love him too even though this is a very tragic accident, and he is very lucky that it was not worse.
!!
I must have missed something :confused: what do mean it could have been worse? To you this is not enough?

nodigg
09-09-2004, 10:43 AM
Condolences to the families, friends AND to the Captain who made the WRONG choices that night and has forever altered his remaining years.
Yes to the Captain too, but! you make the choice, you pay the price none the less!
The question this presents to my mind is, how many alchohol related death/injury accidents ocurred over the same weekend within the state of California/Arizona? Though always tragic, do water involved OUI accidents get more media attention than highway accidents?? Or were there none that weekend? I doubt it!

Boatcop
09-09-2004, 10:44 AM
AZ says speed limit at night is 25mph.
There is no night time or any other time speed limit on the water, except in places specifically marked as "No Wake" Zones.
It is and always has been, "Reasonable and prudent for the existing conditions, taking into account all hazards that may be present."
Let the investigators do their jobs. They know what they're doing, and the actions they take will be appropriate, based on the outcome of that investigation.

OC-PARTYCAT
09-09-2004, 10:48 AM
You know....I'm getting sick and tired of hearing a*holes like you run their mouth. Can you honestly say you've NEVER EVER drank and drove? I seriously doubt there is ONE person in this entire forum that can say that. This could have happened to ANY one of us on that one time you or I drank and drove. Unfortunately it happened to Scott and yes it was a bad idea but that is no reason to nail him to the cross and burn it. You don't think the guy feel's bad enough? We don't need your crappy statements around here. Take them somewhere else.
Heaven forbid anyone have an opinion other than yours. I drive my boat all time while drinking, just like almost everyone I see at Havasu. But if I cause an accident because of it....please nail me to the cross and burn it, thank you

Ivan Dan
09-09-2004, 11:01 AM
Heaven forbid anyone have an opinion other than yours. I drive my boat all time while drinking, just like almost everyone I see at Havasu. But if I cause an accident because of it....please nail me to the cross and burn it, thank you
So much easier when its NOT you! There isn't any need to kick a guy when he's already down. He knows he is going to have to pay for his mistake both emotionally and legally.

OC-PARTYCAT
09-09-2004, 11:02 AM
agreed

Havasu_Dreamin
09-09-2004, 11:20 AM
You know....I'm getting sick and tired of hearing a*holes like you run their mouth. Can you honestly say you've NEVER EVER drank and drove? I seriously doubt there is ONE person in this entire forum that can say that.
Right here, never, ever done it. Too much to lose.
Also, it's a free country, anyone can say whateverTF they want. And I'm with E502, a thread like this is asking for both negative and positive comments.

Keith E. Sayre
09-09-2004, 11:56 AM
It scares me to do it. It's usually a mad dash to the Springs for dinner and
staying too long. We end up coming back in the dark. I carry 2 spotlights
all the time and still hate it. The trip back usually takes about 2 hours and
it's sheer terror for me the entire time. My kids and Nancy are all scanning
for any available light along with me. The boat is going so slow that it falls
off plane every few minutes and that's ok with me.
Ironically, I'm not new at this, I've been to the end of the lake and back
a gazillion times and every time it gets dark on the way back--it's a completely different experience in my eyes. Nothing seems the same as it
did a couple hours earlier in the daylight. Go slow, cover up the lights inside
your boat like gauge bezels etc and I'm thinking about buying a plottable
GPS for these instances. Record the trip down and retrace it on the way
back if it's dark. Even after that--I still think I'll crawl back.
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats

haulina29
09-09-2004, 12:07 PM
In this case I feel all the people in the boat are responsable for there own actions nobody made them get in the boat after a evening of partying, and if they did get in on there own they got nobody to blame but there self .If they would have hit another boat then that would be a different story , just as in the HTM crash nobody to blame but there self . The investigation should be simple x amount of people leave the party area in a boat at hit a bridge what else is there to investigate? No need to pass blame it happened its over .

jas0502
09-09-2004, 01:01 PM
You know....I'm getting sick and tired of hearing a*holes like you run their mouth. Can you honestly say you've NEVER EVER drank and drove? I seriously doubt there is ONE person in this entire forum that can say that.
Well I can say that.
First of all .......................my condolences to the friends and families involved, I mean no disrepect.
My husband does not drink. I do. From the time we have been together(over 10 years) he has made it clear to me that under NO circumstances should I ever drive a car, boat, atv after have ONE drink.
When he was young he was a tow truck driver, and has been to many accident scenes that involved alcohol and death.
I will never get behind the wheel after drinking, and I know since he does not drink, he never will. This can be inconvienient, but thats how we do it!!!!!!!NEVER DRINK AND DRIVE!!!!

slink
09-09-2004, 01:21 PM
The investigation should be simple x amount of people leave the party area in a boat at hit a bridge what else is there to investigate?
I wish it was just that simple.........Don't forget about the families of the victims that are probably already in contact with civil attorneys ($$$), or will be soon, to find "The truth" and ultimatley lay blame ($$$), so your answer is no, it's not that simple. The investigators are going to get blasted with a million and one questions from the families about the case and are going to have to have an answer for all of them.

oldbuck40
09-09-2004, 01:28 PM
Talk is cheap,but it will never change what has been done, I lost my future son in law 4 yrs. ago to the same thing,,he was 22,,, So sorry to hear the loss of your friends and fellow boaters over here in TEXAS. I for one know the hurt you are going thru... time heals alot of that hurt but it also makes us stronger and wiser!

imbndvs
09-09-2004, 01:32 PM
IVAN DAN,
No I don't think he FEELS bad enough!!! Like I said, at least HE still feels!!!
The bottom line is that because of HIS actions FOUR people lost their lives!!!
As far as I am concerned he can NEVER feel bad enough.
If you don't like what I write or how I feel then don't read it.

keithj714
09-09-2004, 02:34 PM
So many people are talking about this, it was the first thing I heard about when I got back.
My condolences to the people involved and my thoughts are with the driver, he certainly didn't intend to put his friends in harms way, but alcohol does impair judgement. This kind of thing could happen to anyone who drinks and gets behind the wheel.
My own personal rule is if I wouldn't do it in my car, I don't do it in my boat. So far, I haven't been able to get any girls to jump off the hood of my car topless, though.
It also helps out whenever I lean toward bending that rule that my co-pilot doesn't drink, knows how to drive a boat and can be a real b*tch when she has too. That's probably saved me some trouble a couple of times.

ratso
09-09-2004, 02:54 PM
How about "no wake" after dark...and even if it takes all night to get to where you are going...at least you might get there alive. Every Wednesday after work we get a group together and go cruising around in the boats. There is a restaurant on the water and we all pull up around dark to go in and eat. Last night after we left, one of the boats in the group was having trouble with his lights...and it was pitch dark. We ALWAYS idle back when visibility is limited...in a group, yet it seems almost every time we see some goofball running balls to the wall, and I'm thinking what if my buddy was out there by himself without lights and some jerk ran him over because he couldn't be seen. 35 and even 25 is too fast at night...

Danhercules
09-09-2004, 03:01 PM
The thing to remember is everyone on that boat had a CHOICE to go or not... and what about the lialibality of the bar that they were drinking at?
Shouldn't the bartender at least said " HOLD ON THERE SIR, I Think you should wait a little while.. "
I hope I am takin this the wrong way, but WTF!!!
The bar!! I am sick of the "Its not my fault" crap.
Next you gonna say it the boat builder fault for not putting a breathalizer on the boat?
The driver made bad choices. That dose not make him evil. He did not try to hurt his friends, but he did. I have made a bad choice time to time, that dose not make me a bad guy. A buisness owner might make a bad choice and go out of buisness, do you think he ment to do it? Hell no, just poor choices.
I know someone that will not drink a drop if he is gonna drive, it took his brothers death for him to start thinking that way.
I am not trying to

Keithb87
09-09-2004, 03:16 PM
I hope I am takin this the wrong way, but WTF!!!
The bar!! I am sick of the "Its not my fault" crap.
Next you gonna say it the boat builder fault for not putting a breathalizer on the boat?
May family has had a few "bartenders" in it from time to time. I was only speaking from their experience. A good Bartender should know how much the patron has had to drink and either cut them off, or at least keep them from driving.
I'm in not saying it's the bar or bartenders fault at all. Just that the bartender might of been able to hold off the exit for a little while. Possibly only delaying the inevetiable but who knows. And if more bars were to take this action, possibly there would be less Acohol related incidents/accidents.
I guess I should not of used the word "liability" but instead "Duty".
I did state in my post that everyone that got in that boat did so by their own "CHOICE".

haulina29
09-09-2004, 03:29 PM
Slink i no what you are saying i was trying to be to the point , not todays world if that makes sense ,thats whats wrong with our system we spend to much time trying to pass blame and in this case its a no brainer No one to blame except the people involved all of them .

Jrocket
09-09-2004, 03:49 PM
Why was a guy that had been drinking,driving the boat and going that fast at night?

keithj714
09-09-2004, 04:16 PM
I'll probably get beat up on this, but if I remember correctly, if you are involved in a fatality accident with ANY measurable amount of alcohol in your system you can be charged with vehicular manslaughter and "DUI". Many people assume that "DUI" begins at .08 but that is not necessarily so. Also, at least in California in a fatality accident, blood is drawn and tested no matter if you seem perfectly sober. The charges by themselves are not necessarily a real indictment of the driver's physical state.
I'd say there are alot of contributing factors to this accident, darkness, tiredness (probably at 3:30 am after a long day on the river and a night out afterwards), no life jackets, distractions on the boat, poorly marked obstacles in the water. And yes consumption of alcohol too, but the guy might have felt (and been) sober and in control in that respect but had a beer in the last hour before they took off to come home, and would still be in the same tough spot legally. Even at .08, I don't think most people are terribly impaired, it's set low to discourage people from getting close to real impairment.
I throw this in because even if you were "Mr. Responsible" and had a couple of beers over 3 hours or so and had a very low BAC, and then a jetskier turned in front of you and you ran over him in clear daylight, you could find yourself in the same situation. And if the cops found any evidence of drinking on your boat or among your friends on the boat, I think the charges would probably still be filed. They might be dropped later pending the outcome of the investigation, but I think when alcohol is involved in any way in a fatality, they get you in the system as fast as possible. The only way to possibly steer clear of this kind of thing is to not drink at all, and not allow drinking on your boat either and I really don't think there are many of us here that adhere to that strict standard.

Debbolas
09-09-2004, 04:25 PM
I am just so sorry for your loss and Please take the words of my fellow hot boaters with a grain of salt.

rrrr
09-09-2004, 06:30 PM
I'd say there are alot of contributing factors to this accident, darkness, tiredness (probably at 3:30 am after a long day on the river and a night out afterwards), no life jackets, distractions on the boat, poorly marked obstacles in the water.
I have been around the Topock marina and the I-40 bridge exactly one time. If you want to criticize me for being unfamiliar with the area, fine.
I was impressed by the size of the railroad and highway bridges, and as I passed by on my way south towards Havasu I noticed that the bridge abutments were clearly marked with standard navigation markings and lights.
If you don't know what the green and red lights mean, then you should stay home. If you want to run 35 MPH at night then a river isn't the place to do it. At the end of the day, it's all about responsibility. I have read all the posts about how the driver was an experienced boater. That implies he had been on the river before, and knew that the bridges were there. Choosing to run through the crossing at speed was understandable if the driver knew how to interpret the navigation lights.
He was either incompetent, drunk, or both. As the operator of the boat, he also had a duty to make the passengers don PFDs. If I drive after dark, all my passengers are wearing them.
Throw barbs if you wish, but hitting a support of the biggest bridge on the Southern Colorado river shows total idiocy. Yeah, the driver feels pain from his jail cell. But it doesn't compare to the realization by the victims families that they lost their loved ones due to total negligence.
Don't like these strong words? It's all factual. One of my best friends in high school killed a couple in their 60's while running from the cops. Pain and grief is real. Choices are made. Outcomes must be dealt with.
Period.

rrrr
09-09-2004, 06:57 PM
In this case I feel all the people in the boat are responsable for there own actions nobody made them get in the boat after a evening of partying, and if they did get in on there own they got nobody to blame but there self .
So they should have expected the driver would crash into the largest structure on the river between Davis dam and Lake Havasu? The boat driver represented his competence by offering the victims a ride. They had a reasonable expectation that he was competent to operate the boat.
It's ugly and it's tragic, but the guy behind the wheel is 100% responsible for the outcome.
Personal relationships aside, that is a fact.

AMIETONYA
09-09-2004, 07:24 PM
Our Hearts Go Out To Those Who Have Lost Family Members And Friends Due To This Tragic Event. I Could Never Imagine In A Million Years That Something Could Happen To Such Experienced "river" Goers. We Just Dont Understand. It Breaks Our Hearts That Lives Were Lost And I Hope That Everyone Can Find The Goodness In Their Hearts To Forgive Those Who Think Certain People Are To Blame. Scott Will Never Be The Same And I Hope He Can Get Through This. As For Dale He Was A Great Guy And I Can Only Hope His Last Memories Were Hanging Out With His Best Friends And Doing What He Loved The Most, Hanging Out At The River. He Will Be Missed.

PHOTOGLOU
09-09-2004, 08:36 PM
There is no night time or any other time speed limit on the water, except in places specifically marked as "No Wake" Zones.
It is and always has been, "Reasonable and prudent for the existing conditions, taking into account all hazards that may be present."
Let the investigators do their jobs. They know what they're doing, and the actions they take will be appropriate, based on the outcome of that investigation.
Whats the law on handheld spotlights at night???

LeadDog
09-10-2004, 05:06 AM
For all of us that have know Dale, we should say at least he was doing what he loved with the people he loved, and hope that his passing was very quick and he didnt suffer any.
Dale, we love you and you will be missed.
I am sure that all of Scotty's friends want him to know that we still love him too even though this is a very tragic accident.
We love and care about all of you!!
well said!
I'm not getting involved in the politics, but this is a great loss of our friends no matter how it went down!

Boatcop
09-10-2004, 05:33 AM
Whats the law on handheld spotlights at night???
Hand held spotlights are permitted, to illuminate the shoreline or hazards on the water.
You must never shine the light at another boat.
The same goes for installed "bow lights" or docking lights installed on pontoon and other larger vessels. These are for docking only and should bever be used for navigation. The white docking lights wash out the red/green navigation lights, making them invisible to other boaters, in addition to impairing the night vision of oncoming boats.
Night time navigation requires night vision, which is ruined by exposure to wiite light. Even the back-glare from a spot light can impair the night vision of the operator of the boat using the spot. A minimum of 20 minutes is required for the effects of white light to subside and night vision is restored.
If it's so dark to require a spotlight to see where you're going, you must slow down to minimum safe speed and proceed with extreme caution.

Mrs.Racer277
09-10-2004, 07:05 AM
Again I want to say how sorry I am to hear about the loss of family and friends.
It is good to see that they have so many friends out there that are willing to stand by and support those in need.

Rexone
09-10-2004, 08:06 AM
First my sincere condolences to all those involved, their families, and friends. I hate hearing about accidents like this and it seems all too frequent lately.
Secondly, and some of you are not gonna like this part... I've been biting my tongue on this thread for a couple days now reading all the speculation, accusations, etc, etc. I think it's highly disrespectful to carry on like this knowing that the families and friends of those hurt and killed are frequenting this thread and shows poor judgement and no compassion whatsoever for those involved. Regardless of who is responsible and why (which hasn't been established) the bantering and arguing about it here amazes me and frankly makes me sick. Not that half of you give a shit what I think but I really don't care because it offends me reading this thread and I don't even know these folks personally.
But as I know from prior cases where accidents have caused death to members or their families what I think matters not because I've seen this scenario before. But I would not feel right letting this go on without expressing my opinion on it. I just hope all involved in this terrible trajedy take this thread with a grain of salt and don't dwell on the negative and the bashing of your loved one. Again I am so sorry for your loss and that you have to endure this type of material on top of it.

Mrs.Racer277
09-10-2004, 08:18 AM
First my sincere condolences to all those involved, their families, and friends. I hate hearing about accidents like this and it seems all too frequent lately.
Secondly, and some of you are not gonna like this part... I've been biting my tongue on this thread for a couple days now reading all the speculation, accusations, etc, etc. I think it's highly disrespectful to carry on like this knowing that the families and friends of those hurt and killed are frequenting this thread and shows poor judgement and no compassion whatsoever for those involved. Regardless of who is responsible and why (which hasn't been established) the bantering and arguing about it here amazes me and frankly makes me sick. Not that half of you give a shit what I think but I really don't care because it offends me reading this thread and I don't even know these folks personally.
But as I know from prior cases where accidents have caused death to members or their families what I think matters not because I've seen this scenario before. But I would not feel right letting this go on without expressing my opinion on it. I just hope all involved in this terrible trajedy take this thread with a grain of salt and don't dwell on the negative and the bashing of your loved one. Again I am so sorry for your loss and that you have to endure this type of material on top of it.
Very well put. My thoughts exactly. This was posted so family and friends could go here for information on lost loved ones. Not so others could give their negative opinions. These people are grieving. Give them peace and show them respect. They are not responsible for what happened.

RiverToysJas
09-10-2004, 08:22 AM
First my sincere condolences to all those involved, their families, and friends. I hate hearing about accidents like this and it seems all too frequent lately.
Secondly, and some of you are not gonna like this part... I've been biting my tongue on this thread for a couple days now reading all the speculation, accusations, etc, etc. I think it's highly disrespectful to carry on like this knowing that the families and friends of those hurt and killed are frequenting this thread and shows poor judgement and no compassion whatsoever for those involved. Regardless of who is responsible and why (which hasn't been established) the bantering and arguing about it here amazes me and frankly makes me sick. Not that half of you give a shit what I think but I really don't care because it offends me reading this thread and I don't even know these folks personally.
But as I know from prior cases where accidents have caused death to members or their families what I think matters not because I've seen this scenario before. But I would not feel right letting this go on without expressing my opinion on it. I just hope all involved in this terrible trajedy take this thread with a grain of salt and don't dwell on the negative and the bashing of your loved one. Again I am so sorry for your loss and that you have to endure this type of material on top of it.
Thank you for posting that, I couldn't agree more!!!
RTJas :D

moneysucker
09-10-2004, 08:23 AM
Well said Mike. If this happened to my family or friends I would be bent at a lot of the comments made and those who make them should put themselves in the position of the victims and their families, Stating the truth or not, there are quite a few coments that should be edited or deleted by their authors and show a little class. Hiding behind a computer and a screen name doesn't make it right to say what you wouldn't say to people face to face. Have your opinions but express them in the proper place.

Southern California Private Investigators, Inc.
09-10-2004, 09:01 AM
Dear members,
My name is Farzin Noohi. I am a Private Investigator working for attorney Robert Van Hoy on behalf of Scott Eickhoff. If you have any information regarding the accident or the location of the accident on 9/6/04, please contact me at my email address: Farzin@socal-pi.com.
Thank you.

79miller
09-10-2004, 09:15 AM
Rexone,
Thanks for helping emphasize why this thread was created and thanks for everyone else for their support and nice comments.
I've been in contact with many of our friends that were directly or indirectly involved and most have been viewing this thread for information and/or support. At least most understand that some people don't respect the situation and they just disregard the posts.
There is still way too much speculation going around to really know exactly what happened, except for the fact we have lost some friends. The police investigators aren't telling much. I'm sure once more details are known we will openly discuss them here.
To comment on the night boating issue:
I have been through that part of the river hundreds of times during the day and in the middle of the night and don't have any problem doing it as long as the conditions allow. I have had some of the best times on the river floating at night.
I also think in the correct conditions there are minimal safety issues aside from some other jackass running into you. Anything can happen out on the river and I think the fewer people that are out on the water the safer it is, whether the sun is up or down. I can't remember ever feeling like I put myself or my passengers in a unsafe situation, but I can remember the many times some idiot in a boat or on a PWC has almost hit me, cut me off or almost put me into the rocks.
Be safe out there,
79miller

hot_diggity_dog
09-10-2004, 09:29 AM
:idea: 79Miller if you need a boating forum for all to grieve :frown: :frown: without the drama you can go to
riverratlife.com (http://www.riverratlife.com)
HDD :frown:

79miller
09-10-2004, 09:33 AM
It ok, just saying my peace...
I've been over there, good stuff.

Mowens
09-10-2004, 10:50 AM
I am new to this forum, but I have been going to the river and lake for many years. I heard about the accident through a friend and thought it was just horrible.
Come to find out this hits home.I met Jennifer Knight a few time through a good friend that was dating her.Things didn't work out between them ,but they remained good close friends for many years.
First of all,my condolences to Jennifer's father,family, friends and Cesar. Hang in there BRO!!!

keithj714
09-10-2004, 11:35 AM
I have been around the Topock marina and the I-40 bridge exactly one time. If you want to criticize me for being unfamiliar with the area, fine.
I was impressed by the size of the railroad and highway bridges, and as I passed by on my way south towards Havasu I noticed that the bridge abutments were clearly marked with standard navigation markings and lights.
If you don't know what the green and red lights mean, then you should stay home. If you want to run 35 MPH at night then a river isn't the place to do it. At the end of the day, it's all about responsibility. I have read all the posts about how the driver was an experienced boater. That implies he had been on the river before, and knew that the bridges were there. Choosing to run through the crossing at speed was understandable if the driver knew how to interpret the navigation lights.
He was either incompetent, drunk, or both. As the operator of the boat, he also had a duty to make the passengers don PFDs. If I drive after dark, all my passengers are wearing them.
Throw barbs if you wish, but hitting a support of the biggest bridge on the Southern Colorado river shows total idiocy. Yeah, the driver feels pain from his jail cell. But it doesn't compare to the realization by the victims families that they lost their loved ones due to total negligence.
Don't like these strong words? It's all factual. One of my best friends in high school killed a couple in their 60's while running from the cops. Pain and grief is real. Choices are made. Outcomes must be dealt with.
Period.
Yeah, sure, mistakes were made. No denying that. I just don't think the armchair quarterbacks should be dragging the guy through the mud over the alcohol issue just because of the way things worked out legally so far.

gordon taylor
09-10-2004, 11:52 AM
new to all this but had to join just to right on behalf of guy driving the boat everyone makes mistakes and they all where drinking together right so they all knew what could happen it was an accident everyone i know has drank to much and driven just remember that before u say thing sorry to all involved

Larah
09-10-2004, 01:05 PM
We just got a call that they found another body today. It wasn't Dales body. Sorry to all who knew him.

SHOCKWAVETOM
09-10-2004, 01:18 PM
We just got a call that they found another body today. It wasn't Dales body. Sorry to all who knew him.
:(

That Guy
09-10-2004, 01:27 PM
Very sad...again our thoughts and prayers go out to all involved. :(

79miller
09-10-2004, 01:29 PM
Correct, according to the Sheriffs dept. Rorey McMahan's body was found this morning. Dale's body has yet to be found.
Very sorry to hear......

Mrs.Racer277
09-10-2004, 01:34 PM
Thank you for the update.

weebitevil
09-10-2004, 03:28 PM
boo frikin hoo, What happens when a drunk driver in a car kills a family, or your family? I dont think anyone including the law shows any sympathy..
It is a sad and terrible "negligent" thing that happened and I feel for, and pray for the "victims". This guy is still breathing the air he took away.
What if one of your children was dead because of his negligence? I dont think you would feel sorry for him, I dont.
I dont think anyone of his friends or family should be looking for any support from this board, unless they are ready to hear some negative along with it.
If I hurt anyone while driving drunk, and I feel that due to me being drunk caused it, I would expect no sympathy from anyone. Yes, I would live with it for the rest of my life, but that is not enough. I would want to be punished and so should he. He made the call and failed.
All the comments listed above are my opinion..only if he is found to be drunk while driving.
I knew one of the people on that boat that died. He was a sweet and normal guy. It was an unfortunate accident. So why dont you watch your mouth.
You are ignorant. Get a clue. Running your mouth off, when first off you were not even there, nor do you know the circumstances.You only know what you have read or heard from others. Keep your RUDE opinions to yourself! :hammerhea

shorty
09-10-2004, 04:40 PM
Correct, according to the Sheriffs dept. Rorey McMahan's body was found this morning. Dale's body has yet to be found.
Very sorry to hear......
Do you have any more details about the recovery of Rorey, or where they found him in relation to the accident site.

Steelers920
09-10-2004, 04:48 PM
We all know that this is a very tragic accident but few of us know all of the facts. I am glad that we live in a country that we are free to go out on the river and to express our feeling in public. Here is a fact that many on this site do not know. Scott is one of the most caring and giving person that I know. Scott has gone out of his way many times to help just about everyone on that boat, myself and complete strangers. There is no way in hell that he would ever do anything to harm anyone. I also know that Scott is very good at driving a multitude of vehicles. I would get into any vehicle/boat with Scott right now and there would be no reason to fear a thing.
To those out there who want to kick a man while he is down,that is your right. I'm glad you are the safe people that never do anything wrong. You have never ran that yellow light that was actually red. You never drive your truck over 55 mph while pulling your boat to the river. You never talk on your cell phone while drinking coffee, and telling your kids to be quiet while you are driving. You have never gone out to dinner and had a glass of wine with your ravioli. You have never blasted your favorite Bon Jovi tape so that I could hear it two lanes over. And I know that none of you have ever driven while you are tired or falling asleep. All of these things are distractions that can be very dangerous and even deadly. These things all impair your abillity to operate a vehicle. I wonder if having 8 people in your boat, a few riding in the bow, with the music going and at night is distracting at all?
A thing about everyone on that boat. They all knew the dangers of boating at night and are all just as responsible. I know that may sound a bit harsh, but it is true. I know 4 of the people who were on that boat and I love them all very much. Dale who is still missing is one of my best friends and my room mate.

Bank Boy
09-10-2004, 05:25 PM
My prayers are with the families of the victims and the survivors. I can only imagine how hard it would be to lose people that you love and care for in an accident that you are involved in.
It is way to easy to judge someones decision after the fact.

Deuce Clothing Inc
09-10-2004, 05:38 PM
IN MOMENTS LIKE THESE, WHAT CAN ONE SAY? I FEEL SADNESS FOR THE LOSS OF ONE OF MY DEAREST FRIENDS AND BUSINESS PARTNER. I THINK WE SHOULD ALL BE REMINDED TO NOT TAKE LIFE FOR GRANTED AND CHERISH EVERY MINUTE WITH THE ONES WE LOVE, AS IT COULD BE THE LAST. THERE ARE ALOT OF FEELINGS, OPINIONS AND JUDGEMENTS RELATED TO THIS TRAGIC EVENT. HOWEVER, THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT THE WORLD HAS LOST A BEAUTIFUL SOUL AND ANOTHER SOUL WILL BE SUFFERING ON THIS EARTH. AND NOW WHAT? FORGIVE, REMEMBER AND LIVE LIFE TO THE FULLEST AS HE WOULD WANT EACH ONE OF US TO DO.
EVERY PERSON THAT IS DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY INVOLVED IN THIS ACCIDENT IS IN MY THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS.
P.S. TO ALL OF DALE'S CLOSE FRIENDS, I HAVE OPENED UP THE DEUCE CLOTHING WEB SITE FOR PHOTO POSTINGS, SO WE ALL MAY EXCHANGE PICTURES AND FOND MEMORIES.
www.deuceclothing.com (mark@deuceclothing.com)

CARRERA
09-10-2004, 05:56 PM
We all know that this is a very tragic accident but few of us know all of the facts. I am glad that we live in a country that we are free to go out on the river and to express our feeling in public. Here is a fact that many on this site do not know. Scott is one of the most caring and giving person that I know. Scott has gone out of his way many times to help just about everyone on that boat, myself and complete strangers. There is no way in hell that he would ever do anything to harm anyone. I also know that Scott is very good at driving a multitude of vehicles. I would get into any vehicle/boat with Scott right now and there would be no reason to fear a thing.
To those out there who want to kick a man while he is down,that is your right. I'm glad you are the safe people that never do anything wrong. You have never ran that yellow light that was actually red. You never drive your truck over 55 mph while pulling your boat to the river. You never talk on your cell phone while drinking coffee, and telling your kids to be quiet while you are driving. You have never gone out to dinner and had a glass of wine with your ravioli. You have never blasted your favorite Bon Jovi tape so that I could hear it two lanes over. And I know that none of you have ever driven while you are tired or falling asleep. All of these things are distractions that can be very dangerous and even deadly. These things all impair your abillity to operate a vehicle. I wonder if having 8 people in your boat, a few riding in the bow, with the music going and at night is distracting at all?
A thing about everyone on that boat. They all knew the dangers of boating at night and are all just as responsible. I know that may sound a bit harsh, but it is true. I know 4 of the people who were on that boat and I love them all very much. Dale who is still missing is one of my best friends and my room mate.
Everything you have just stated above is so true. I think you are what anyone would call a true friend indeed, which it seems to have been missing aboard that boat that night. Because, "friends, do not let friend, drive drunk," if that was the case.
This is not meant to kick anyone around and or down. My prayers go out to each and everyones family and close friends as youself. Please people, lets all live and learn from this.

THOR
09-10-2004, 05:58 PM
I'll say this for the second time in this thread. Show some respect to the decedant and the family thereof.
I have observed the behavior of many folks on here spouting opinions and they have been substandard at best while operating a vessel. You know what they say about living in glass houses.

79miller
09-10-2004, 05:59 PM
Do you have any more details about the recovery of Rorey, or where they found him in relation to the accident site.
That is the only detail I have forwarded to me from someone in contact with the sheriffs.

JetBoatRich
09-10-2004, 06:21 PM
Little Story, I was thinking of lifting my truck and know of one for sale and have talked to the guy the last couple days. I commute up north for work, he was headed up that way today as I was heading down. We met in the middle so I could check out teh lift kit, tires etc. He then asked if I heard about the accident. I mentioned the HB thread, which he has read. He went on to say, he knows Scott quite well and is great guy and always a stand up person. He mentioned Scott knows what he did and his life is changed for ever, everything he has will be gone most likely. But he will be a responsible for his actions.
These things can hit close to home and have several times the last couple years around here. The whole situation is terrible.

shorty
09-10-2004, 06:26 PM
TOPOCK, Ariz. The body of a Redlands, California, man killed in a boating accident early Labor Day was recovered today from the Colorado River.
Sergeant Tim Smith with the San Bernardino County, California, Sheriff's Department says a boater spotted the body floating in the river.
The body of 29-year-old Rorey McMahan was found about a quarter mile downstream from where the boat he was riding in smashed into a cement support for the Topock (TOH'-pahk) Bridge.
One man remains missing and is presumed dead; the bodies of two other victims were recovered earlier.
Three other people were hurt.
The driver of the boat was uninjured. He was arrested for investigation of vessel manslaughter and operating a boat under the influence of alcohol and is free on 100-thousand-dollars' bail.

Ziggy
09-10-2004, 06:38 PM
You know what they say about living in glass houses.
Couldn't have been stated more clear Thor..You got class dude. :cool:
btw-my mrs says to say hi to your mrs.

moneysucker
09-10-2004, 07:03 PM
We all know that this is a very tragic accident but few of us know all of the facts. I am glad that we live in a country that we are free to go out on the river and to express our feeling in public. Here is a fact that many on this site do not know. Scott is one of the most caring and giving person that I know. Scott has gone out of his way many times to help just about everyone on that boat, myself and complete strangers. There is no way in hell that he would ever do anything to harm anyone. I also know that Scott is very good at driving a multitude of vehicles. I would get into any vehicle/boat with Scott right now and there would be no reason to fear a thing.
To those out there who want to kick a man while he is down,that is your right. I'm glad you are the safe people that never do anything wrong. You have never ran that yellow light that was actually red. You never drive your truck over 55 mph while pulling your boat to the river. You never talk on your cell phone while drinking coffee, and telling your kids to be quiet while you are driving. You have never gone out to dinner and had a glass of wine with your ravioli. You have never blasted your favorite Bon Jovi tape so that I could hear it two lanes over. And I know that none of you have ever driven while you are tired or falling asleep. All of these things are distractions that can be very dangerous and even deadly. These things all impair your abillity to operate a vehicle. I wonder if having 8 people in your boat, a few riding in the bow, with the music going and at night is distracting at all?
A thing about everyone on that boat. They all knew the dangers of boating at night and are all just as responsible. I know that may sound a bit harsh, but it is true. I know 4 of the people who were on that boat and I love them all very much. Dale who is still missing is one of my best friends and my room mate.
Well said and I have to say that at least 90% of people on here are guilty of at least one of these offenses. You hit the nail on the head. My thoughts and prayers are with all of you.

rrrr
09-10-2004, 07:09 PM
A thing about everyone on that boat. They all knew the dangers of boating at night and are all just as responsible. I know that may sound a bit harsh, but it is true.
I don't buy that for a minute. The other people in the boat assumed that the operator had the knowledge and skill to keep from hitting the biggest freekin' bridge on the Colorado River.
Going downstream he would have seen the Topock Marina lights on the left, cars crossing the I-40 bridge, and the channel navigation lights in front of him. No more difficult than approaching a red light at an intersection.
For you to state the passengers are to blame is stupid. When I drive my boat with passengers, I know that their safety is my responsibility.
Yeah, this is tragic. But to try and shift blame from the guy driving the boat is more of that "It ain't my fault" crap.

Mrs.Racer277
09-10-2004, 07:16 PM
TOPOCK, Ariz. The body of a Redlands, California, man killed in a boating accident early Labor Day was recovered today from the Colorado River.
Sergeant Tim Smith with the San Bernardino County, California, Sheriff's Department says a boater spotted the body floating in the river.
The body of 29-year-old Rorey McMahan was found about a quarter mile downstream from where the boat he was riding in smashed into a cement support for the Topock (TOH'-pahk) Bridge.
One man remains missing and is presumed dead; the bodies of two other victims were recovered earlier.
Three other people were hurt.
The driver of the boat was uninjured. He was arrested for investigation of vessel manslaughter and operating a boat under the influence of alcohol and is free on 100-thousand-dollars' bail.
Thank you for the up date.

THOR
09-10-2004, 07:24 PM
Couldn't have been stated more clear Thor..You got class dude. :cool:
btw-my mrs says to say hi to your mrs.
Thanks dude.
Right back at your mrs.

sandblasted
09-10-2004, 07:25 PM
Like REXONE I've bit my tongue on this thread...there are several issues I want to address....not in any order either...
1. I am really sorry for the loss of life in this accident...I'm sure the driver of the boat will be beating himself up for years and he should be..If I put myself in his shoes I would be suicidal if I was responsible for the deaths of my friends. It seemed like he was taking responsibility for the accident and maybe he still is but the post from the PI rubs me the wrong way....So now what, do they plan to sue the county for the bridge lights? Sounds like the HTM accident all over again!
2. I've been on the river twice at night and there definetly is a pucker factor, especially when another boat is approaching you.....My buddy was driving both times but he was glad to have another set of sober eyes looking out as well...
3. Does it suck that some people on this forum have been somewhat cavalier or non-chalant about this subject? Well, this is a "PUBLIC" forum...You gotta take the bad with the good...it's been that way since day one on these boards!
4. The bottom line to me is that a terrible accident occurred, we can all speculate about what caused it but none of us really know what happened that night...except that 4 people are dead...I truly feel sorry for all the families involved, and yes, I feel sorry for the driver..I know he feels worse than any of us could imagine.

phebus
09-10-2004, 07:28 PM
I wish this thread would be pulled. This is a time for grieving, not finger pointing or placing blame. Please show some respect.

Boatcop
09-10-2004, 07:35 PM
So now what, do they plan to sue the county for the bridge lights? Sounds like the HTM accident all over again!
Just for the record, the lighting of bridges crossing navigable waterways is the responsibility of the US Coast Guard. Arizona Department of Transportation (ADOT) or CALTRANS may be responsible for keeping them lit, depending on how the bridge was contracted, but the configuration and ultimate responsibility lies with the Federal Government.
I've inspected some of these bridges for proper lighting, after reconstruction or modification. Namely the Parker crossing, and the Agnes Wilson bridge down by Lost Lake.
I'm sure that proper lighting was one of the FIRST things they checked.

sandblasted
09-10-2004, 07:47 PM
Just for the record, the lighting of bridges crossing navigable waterways is the responsibility of the US Coast Guard. Arizona Department of Transportation (ADOT) or CALTRANS may be responsible for keeping them lit, depending on how the bridge was contracted, but the configuration and ultimate responsibility lies with the Federal Government.
I've inspected some of these bridges for proper lighting, after reconstruction or modification. Namely the Parker crossing, and the Agnes Wilson bridge down by Lost Lake.
I'm sure that proper lighting was one of the FIRST things they checked.
My point is not who is responsible for the lighting...It's why is a PI already involved? Who do they plan to sue?

Boatcop
09-10-2004, 08:12 PM
My point is not who is responsible for the lighting...It's why is a PI already involved? Who do they plan to sue?
Since the PI is working for the driver's lawyer, I would think they're looking for a good defense against the criminal charges and to deflect the civil lawsuit that's sure to follow. Trying to find someone else for "Contributary Negligence". Quite possibly retained by his insurance company.
Not necessarily to find someone for the DRIVER to sue. Although you never know with lawyers involved.
There are 5 sides to this story. 1) The victims', 2) their lawyers. 3) The suspect's, 4) HIS lawyers, and 5) the truth. Hopefully we'll know the last one when San Bernardino County completes their investigation. I know the guys conducting it, and they're top notch in what they do.
I've tried to throw a few facts out here without appearing to pass judgment, since I only know as much as everyone else here does. Just trying to educate a few peeps on what general, readily available facts there are. The only reason I say "suspect", above, is because that's what you call someone accused of a crime.
Keep in mind that he is only "accused" at this point, and don't hold your breath waiting for a final verdict. The Red Rock crash goes up for sentencing next friday. 2 days short of 1 year since the incident. And this one was settled quicker than most.
It may be a while before what actually happened is released.

Mrs.Racer277
09-10-2004, 08:19 PM
My point is not who is responsible for the lighting...It's why is a PI already involved? Who do they plan to sue?
I may be way off on this one but, maybe they don't plan to sue anybody.
To me it sounded like he was just trying to get information for Scott's attorney. Don't they do that all the time for car accidents? Try to find witnesses. I have even seen ads in the news paper for witnesses. :confused: :confused:
What is really a shame is that this thread was started as a form of information gathering for friends/loved ones of these people. There have been at least 10 new people signed up just to see and post info about these people. Their first impression of ***boaters is that we are a bunch of heartless people who will say anything we think in front of grieving friends/loved ones. You all know that bad news travels 10x faster than good. So what will the general public think of us as a group after reading through this thread? I am surprised at the rudeness of some members, as everyone I've met in person has been so considerate.
To all friends/loved ones of the victims: Our hearts are broken over this tragedy, our prayers and thoughts are with you.

sandblasted
09-10-2004, 10:01 PM
Since the PI is working for the driver's lawyer, I would think they're looking for a good defense against the criminal charges and to deflect the civil lawsuit that's sure to follow. Trying to find someone else for "Contributary Negligence". Quite possibly retained by his insurance company.
Not necessarily to find someone for the DRIVER to sue. Although you never know with lawyers involved.
There are 5 sides to this story. 1) The victims', 2) their lawyers. 3) The suspect's, 4) HIS lawyers, and 5) the truth. Hopefully we'll know the last one when San Bernardino County completes their investigation. I know the guys conducting it, and they're top notch in what they do.
I've tried to throw a few facts out here without appearing to pass judgment, since I only know as much as everyone else here does. Just trying to educate a few peeps on what general, readily available facts there are. The only reason I say "suspect", above, is because that's what you call someone accused of a crime.
Keep in mind that he is only "accused" at this point, and don't hold your breath waiting for a final verdict. The Red Rock crash goes up for sentencing next friday. 2 days short of 1 year since the incident. And this one was settled quicker than most.
It may be a while before what actually happened is released.
As always, you are one of the few voices of reason on this board, but then again you have seen some of these tragedies up close.

pzlkween
09-10-2004, 10:54 PM
I live in Las Vegas where we always get reports of accidents in Havasu, etc. Coming from Orange County I always hope it's not someone I know. When I read Scott's name in the paper, I still crossed my fingers that there were more Eickhoff's out there. Unfortunately after reading through this thread I realize I actually knew 3 people on that boat. While I'm not close, I have fond memories of each them & know that Scott is a good person. It's unfortunate what happened, but I agree with Steeler920. They all knew what they were doing - any one of them could have been driving the boat at that time. While I don't believe in boating at night, it was a choice made by all on the boat - not just the driver.

unleashed
09-10-2004, 11:23 PM
This has got to be one depressing topic. I FEEL so bad for all involved from Family, Friends and Yes even for the driver. Sounds like they were having a great time and enjoying what we all do... having fun on the river. ACCIDENTS do happen and this is definitly an ACCIDENT. If you want to point fingers wait till after a hearing than say your peace. GEEEEZZZZ Im ashamed at some of you for your rush to judgement. For now can we all just say a prayer for the deceased and family left behind and could you possibly put yourself in the drivers shoes for one second and think how he feels(And dont give me that Bullcrap that at least hes alive, Hes in a living hell right now). Let the law handle the situation and lets hope for the best for the survivors, the deceased families, and everyone else involved.
One thing I want to point out is the driver stuck around and did not flee unlike past accidents. The law will handle everything accordingly. Godspeed to the deceased! :frown:
Deano
Unleashedclothing (http://www.unleashedclothing.com)

OGShocker
09-10-2004, 11:37 PM
Hopefully we'll know the last one when San Bernardino County completes their investigation. I know the guys conducting it, and they're top notch in what they do.
It may be a while before what actually happened is released.
Alan,
Do you remember Mike Grey?

steelcomp
09-10-2004, 11:56 PM
I've read this whole post and I really feel bad for the victims and their families. They were victims. Victims of carelessness, impaired judgement, and irresponsibility. I disagree that the driver didn't intend to hurt anyone. He didn't do anytihgn that he was supposed to do to protect those who he was responsible for or prevent what happened. And I disagree with the fact that the people got on that boat on their own free will and knew what they were doing. They got on that boat expecting that whoever was driving was going to get them to wherever they were going safely and in good health. The most important lesson I have learned from reading all this is that I will be sure to know and understand the condition the driver of the boat I'm riding in and will never, never take for granted the responsibility I take on as the driver of a boat. It's so terribly terribly sad. The families of those who were lost will forever suffer such pain, such loss, and unnecessary sadness, and the driver has forever so needlessly ruined the rest of his own life. Please, please, everyone, don't let this happen to you. Please don't let this happen to someone you know. Please.
God Bless.

Rexone
09-11-2004, 04:34 AM
I wish this thread would be pulled. This is a time for grieving, not finger pointing or placing blame. Please show some respect.
It's all about respect vs the importance of some to excercise free speech and speculate, no matter how inappropriate or rude it may be at the time or place.
I think it's pretty self explanitory reading through this thread who values which more.

Wally_Gator
09-11-2004, 12:00 PM
Although things are not as black and white as I am about to point out.
Things are all shades of grey. Here I look at those more to either side..
For those with common decency, what hapened to the driver can be worse than any punishment thrown down by the law. From the heresay it sounds like Scott is suffering more than what may or could happen by law.
I see those that are cold hearted, throw stones and kick one while they are down, may not know this decency that would torment ones soul. These are the ones saying throw the book at him.
I think Alan (Boatcop) had a very good point. 5 sides. Somewhere in there is the truth. I would suggest everyone wait on passing judgement until suspicion is laid to rest and the truth comes out, whatever the truth is. When the truth comes out even then I will not pass judgement until I have a chance to walk a mile in that persons shoes. Regardless, the end result will be remembered and knowledge will be gained.
I say truth only in relation to heresay.
It is obvious that all of this will go over some heads and these people will have no clue.
I hate to be redundant, but lay off of the blame and be respectful of the dead and families wishes.
Just my .02 cents...

racecar.hotshoe
09-11-2004, 12:03 PM
Well said brother well said.

Racer277
09-11-2004, 12:43 PM
Very well said. Thank you

79miller
09-11-2004, 02:15 PM
Beautifully written Wally. Thanks again for supporting everyone involved!

mike37
09-11-2004, 02:54 PM
Wally_Gator very good .02 thanks

Kachina26
09-12-2004, 12:55 PM
Thanx for being there GMFL.

Southern California Private Investigators, Inc.
09-12-2004, 02:11 PM
Dear Members,
In reply to some of the emails I have received, I would like to clarify that I am a criminal defense investigator interested in securing information regarding the incident on September 6, 2004. In addition, some people have voiced their concerns about contacting me via email. Below are my phone numbers, please do not hesitate to contact me at my office.
Farzin Noohi
Southern California Private Investigators, Inc.
Office: 714-740-2525
Pager: 714-237-5471

Steelers920
09-13-2004, 04:59 PM
GMFL, I want to thank you and your friends for helping my friends in this terrible time. There needs to be more people in the world like you. I do know that the people you went to help, would have done the same thing. Going to help a complete stranger in the middle of the night. I can not thank you enough.

OOfatso
09-25-2004, 11:44 AM
All,
I hate to bring up such a sad subject but did they ever find that last missing person? What is the latest outcome on this accident?

Mrs.Racer277
09-25-2004, 11:46 AM
All,
I hate to bring up such a sad subject but did they ever find that last missing person? What is the latest outcome on this accident?
No. Last I heard Dale is still missing. :confused:

OOfatso
09-25-2004, 12:03 PM
Wow,
That has gotta suck! From what I understand, the girl that got killed was from the trailer (Moble-Home) park where I go. I just cant imagine what all of the families are going through! I just found out the the lady that got killed a week later was the flooring guy's niece. He pretty much gave me a run down on what happend and it just blew me away.
The only thing that I asked the big guy upstairs, is if there was anything to happen like that to my family, please make it me and dont let my kids see.....cause I dont know what I would do if some thing happened to them!
:frown: :frown: :frown: :frown:
OOfatso

Charley
09-25-2004, 12:05 PM
The only thing that I asked the big guy upstairs, is if there was anything to happen like that to my family, please make it me and dont let my kids see.....cause I dont know what I would do if some thing happened to them!
:frown: :frown: :frown: :frown:
OOfatso
AMEN BROTHER

OOfatso
09-25-2004, 02:31 PM
Thanks for the additional info.......

Mrs. casean
09-25-2004, 02:36 PM
All,
I hate to bring up such a sad subject but did they ever find that last missing person? What is the latest outcome on this accident?
I thought I heard they did??? Maybe I'm wrong??

dicudmore
09-25-2004, 02:37 PM
I thought I heard they did??? Maybe I'm wrong??
I believe I heard that they found the last one :(

Mrs. casean
09-25-2004, 02:41 PM
I thought I heard he was 1/2 mile down river?? We were out there last weekend in that radius location... we were hopin we didn't come accross it... not that we wouldn't want to help, but we had children in the boat :(... not a site for children.

Mrs.Racer277
09-25-2004, 03:42 PM
I will ask my sister tonight if I remember. She was friends with Dale. I looked on there web site and it still says he is missing but I don't know how current that is.

WUTWZAT
09-25-2004, 06:56 PM
Wow,
That has gotta suck! From what I understand, the girl that got killed was from the trailer (Moble-Home) park where I go. I just cant imagine what all of the families are going through! I just found out the the lady that got killed a week later was the flooring guy's niece. He pretty much gave me a run down on what happend and it just blew me away.
The only thing that I asked the big guy upstairs, is if there was anything to happen like that to my family, please make it me and dont let my kids see.....cause I dont know what I would do if some thing happened to them!
:frown: :frown: :frown: :frown:
OOfatso
The girl who died was Jennifer Knight, she was from here in Southern California. She was laid to rest this last Monday. The other women involved in the crash lost her husband and brother-in-law, and all were from the Arizona area. Just want to help keep things straight.
Jason

Mrs.Racer277
09-25-2004, 07:06 PM
The girl who died was Jennifer Knight, she was from here in Southern California. She was laid to rest this last Monday. The other women involved in the crash lost her husband and brother-in-law, and all were from the Arizona area. Just want to help keep things straight.
Jason
I think they were talking about 2 different accidents.
The one on labor day and the other when the one boat hit the back of their friends boat.

Mrs.Racer277
10-21-2004, 07:48 PM
All,
I hate to bring up such a sad subject but did they ever find that last missing person? What is the latest outcome on this accident?
Just wanted to give you an update. Dale's body has not been found.
His family and friends were able to have a memorial service for him last Saturday.
Godspeed Dale.

hot_diggity_dog
11-17-2004, 05:06 AM
Just wanted to give you an update. Dale's body has not been found.
His family and friends were able to have a memorial service for him last Saturday.
Godspeed Dale.
Here is the latest news!!!!! :frown:
Body in lake is the final Topock victim
Story by: Gary Weiand
More than two months of mystery ended Tuesday afternoon with the recovery of a body from Lake Havasu.
Sgt. Tim Smith of the San Bernardino, Calif., Sheriff's Department confirmed that a highly decomposed body found floating 15 miles south of Topock Gorge, near Catfish Cove, belonged to Dale Baldwin, 34, of Huntington, Calif. The SBCSD had listed him as missing person since a Labor Day weekend boating accident.
Baldwin went missing Sunday, Sept. 5, following an early morning crash north of Topock Gorge, when the boat in which he was a passenger struck the cement support of a train bridge over the Colorado River at Interstate 40. Three bodies were pulled from the water, and though Baldwin's was not one of them, he has been presumed dead ever since.
Smith said the body was brought ashore near the mouth of Lake Havasu, after an unidentified phone call alerted the Mohave County Sheriff's Department to a body floating in the current. They in turn called the SBCSD, which recovered the body, he said.
HDD

Parker Dreamin
11-17-2004, 07:12 AM
Thanks for the update.

bunny 166
11-17-2004, 07:20 AM
may he rest in peace... :clover:

Mrs.Racer277
11-17-2004, 07:22 AM
Thank you very much for the update.

Second "PLACE"
11-17-2004, 08:05 AM
Finally some closure to this part of the ordeal. Thoughts and prayers to ALL people involved.