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Steve 1
10-04-2004, 07:44 PM
This gentleman felt so strongly about this that he paid for a full page ad in the Sept 6th Edition of the Army Times.
By Dexter Lehtinen, an Army paratrooper and Ranger, severely wounded in 1971 while a reconnaissance platoon leader in Vietnam. He later graduated first in his class from Stanford Law School and later served as a Florida State Senator and the United States ' Attorney in Miami.
Here is his Full Page Advertisement:
John Kerry &Vietnam THE WOUNDS THAT NEVER HEAL In 1971, I awakened after three days of unconsciousness aboard a hospital ship off the coast of Vietnam. I could not see, my jaws were wired shut, and my left cheekbone was missing, a gaping hole in its place.
Later, while still in that condition at St Albans Naval Hospital, one of my earliest recollections was hearing of John Kerry's testimony before Congress. I remember lying there, in disbelief, as I learned how Kerry told the world that I served in an Army reminiscent of Genghis Khan's; that officers like me routinely let their men plunder villages and rape villagers at will; that "war crimes" committed in Vietnam by my fellow soldiers "were not isolated incidents but crimes committed on a day-to-day basis with the full awareness of officers at all levels of command."
Then Kerry went to Paris, meeting with the North Vietnamese enemy officials, all while our soldiers still fought in the field. The pain and disbelief I felt listening to his words went deeper than the pain I felt from the enemy fire which seriously wounded my face.
Eighteen months later I was discharged from the hospital, the wounds inflicted by the enemy fully healed. But more than 30 years later, the wounds inflicted by John Kerry continue to bring pain to scores of Vietnam veterans. Those wounds--the bearing of false witness against me and a generation of courageous young Americans who fought and died in Vietnam--are much more serious than any wound warranting a Purple Heart. Those wounds go to the heart and soul. Those wounds never go away.
Today, my son is a Marine Corps weapons officer, flying the F/A 18 Hornet. He belongs to the same Marine Corps Kerry ridiculed with his 1971 book cover showing protestors simulating the Iwo Jima Memorial, raising an upside-down American flag. He flies the same F/A 18 fighter jet that Kerry voted against in the U. S. Senate. And today, Kerry's picture hangs in an honored place in Saigon's war museum, as a hero to the Vietnamese Communists.
Yet, John Kerry shamelessly drapes himself in the imagery of Vietnam, military service and the support of veteran's devoid of any media scrutiny. Meanwhile, the criticism and disapproval of Kerry by scores of veterans continues to fall on deaf ears. Worse yet, any legitimate criticism of Kerry's post-war record is discredited as a "personal" attack or an attack against his service.
John Kerry is quick to surround himself with a handful of veterans and claims overwhelming support from the veteran community. He ignores, however, the wounds he inflicted on millions of veterans, and he refuses to sign a waiver to release his military personal records and medical records. This is the portrait of a man who has failed to come to terms with his treacherous past.
I, Dexter Lehtinen, paid for this ad personally, without any connection to other individuals or groups, because I want the public to know what John Kerry did to our Vietnam veterans.

Steve 1
10-04-2004, 07:46 PM
BTW what was the frauds discharge when he left the Navy? Got a choice here of 5 types.

Froggystyle
10-04-2004, 08:50 PM
BTW what was the frauds discharge when he left the Navy? Got a choice here of 5 types.
I dunno, but to give everyone some to choose from, I know of...
Honorable
Other than Honorable
Dishonorable
Administrative
I don't know the fifth. I earned the first, combined with a medical retirement due to parachute accident injuries.

OGShocker
10-05-2004, 06:56 AM
This gentleman felt so strongly about this that he paid for a full page ad in the Sept 6th Edition of the Army Times.
By Dexter Lehtinen, an Army paratrooper and Ranger, severely wounded in 1971 while a reconnaissance platoon leader in Vietnam. He later graduated first in his class from Stanford Law School and later served as a Florida State Senator and the United States ' Attorney in Miami.
Here is his Full Page Advertisement:
John Kerry &Vietnam THE WOUNDS THAT NEVER HEAL In 1971, I awakened after three days of unconsciousness aboard a hospital ship off the coast of Vietnam. I could not see, my jaws were wired shut, and my left cheekbone was missing, a gaping hole in its place.
Later, while still in that condition at St Albans Naval Hospital, one of my earliest recollections was hearing of John Kerry's testimony before Congress. I remember lying there, in disbelief, as I learned how Kerry told the world that I served in an Army reminiscent of Genghis Khan's; that officers like me routinely let their men plunder villages and rape villagers at will; that "war crimes" committed in Vietnam by my fellow soldiers "were not isolated incidents but crimes committed on a day-to-day basis with the full awareness of officers at all levels of command."
Then Kerry went to Paris, meeting with the North Vietnamese enemy officials, all while our soldiers still fought in the field. The pain and disbelief I felt listening to his words went deeper than the pain I felt from the enemy fire which seriously wounded my face.
Eighteen months later I was discharged from the hospital, the wounds inflicted by the enemy fully healed. But more than 30 years later, the wounds inflicted by John Kerry continue to bring pain to scores of Vietnam veterans. Those wounds--the bearing of false witness against me and a generation of courageous young Americans who fought and died in Vietnam--are much more serious than any wound warranting a Purple Heart. Those wounds go to the heart and soul. Those wounds never go away.
Today, my son is a Marine Corps weapons officer, flying the F/A 18 Hornet. He belongs to the same Marine Corps Kerry ridiculed with his 1971 book cover showing protestors simulating the Iwo Jima Memorial, raising an upside-down American flag. He flies the same F/A 18 fighter jet that Kerry voted against in the U. S. Senate. And today, Kerry's picture hangs in an honored place in Saigon's war museum, as a hero to the Vietnamese Communists.
Yet, John Kerry shamelessly drapes himself in the imagery of Vietnam, military service and the support of veteran's devoid of any media scrutiny. Meanwhile, the criticism and disapproval of Kerry by scores of veterans continues to fall on deaf ears. Worse yet, any legitimate criticism of Kerry's post-war record is discredited as a "personal" attack or an attack against his service.
John Kerry is quick to surround himself with a handful of veterans and claims overwhelming support from the veteran community. He ignores, however, the wounds he inflicted on millions of veterans, and he refuses to sign a waiver to release his military personal records and medical records. This is the portrait of a man who has failed to come to terms with his treacherous past.
I, Dexter Lehtinen, paid for this ad personally, without any connection to other individuals or groups, because I want the public to know what John Kerry did to our Vietnam veterans.
Thank you Steve!

Steve 1
10-05-2004, 10:14 AM
Sorry Froggy I should of listed them.
HONORABLE, GENERAL ,*UNDER O-T-H ,BAD CONDUCT .DISHONORABLE
* other than honerable

kahanamoko
10-06-2004, 03:26 PM
Kinda like Oliver North? Bad Conduct Discharge and forbidden to ever wear a military uniform again. Oh wait, Kerry's wasn't a bad conduct was it?

Back Forty
10-06-2004, 04:37 PM
Hey Kaknurmouth, you remind me of a reservist. The kind that shows up to a unit Saturday afternoon with his low quarters on; turns a coffee pot into piss, builds a birdfeeder and gets the fu*k out of Dodge Sunday morning. Nice response/attack.
You arent in the military. As a matter of fact you aren't even a lawyer. Judging by the hours you keep around here you're a gas pumper. It's obvious that you're waiting for your spot behind a broom at the local mill. Spend less time around here acting like an asshole and get back to checking the shitter for violators.
Check your rep. I signed it too asswipe.
If you are military I can see why you opted to build birdfeeders instead of staying active. Maybe you're retired... I see you're acting like a little f*cking girl about it. It's Bush's fault you joined up again isn't it..?
You're a typical lifer. Holding on to that ID card so you can get that cheap booze and smokes. I've seen you before. 1st and the 15th right?
Free dental and handouts for an old man right..? You make a fine GAS PUMPER.
Officer..? Sure I can believe that.

kahanamoko
10-07-2004, 02:29 AM
Hey there Back Door,
If you can break yourself away from taking it up the poop chute for a second let me point out a few of your errors. I was active duty 1983 through 1987. I've been in continuously since 1983. I came off active duty in 87 because of family problems here at home but decided to stay in because I liked the community, the camaraderie and the fact that there are so few shitheads like you there. It's unfortunate that you find it proper to berate the citizen soldiers of the Reserves and National Guard, especially since they're shouldering so much of the present burden of the current war. Used to pump gas when I was 16. Second job I had. Honest work. Don't suppose you'd know anything about that either. I work late hours because I enjoy my flexible schedule. When I'm not going to court in the morning I drift in the office between 9 and 10 and prefer to stay late to get my work done. I don't BLAME anybody for being in the military. I enjoy beinginthe military. Why don't you shut up, sign up, pick up a f**king rifle and show us what a man like you can do. Oh, that's right, don't forget it's a don't ask don't tell military so nobody has to know about "those" feelings you have about men. By the way, stay the f**k out of my unit. You couldn't hang.
I don't get free dental.
No free medical.
Sometimes I work for free during the month for the military to keep up on things.
I'm not an officer. Non-Commisioned Officer. It's not a great comparison, but so that you can understand, think of your girl scout leader. Kinda like that.
Oh, and you're a pussy.

Dave C
10-07-2004, 12:09 PM
hmmm... didn't you say that you became an officer in the military?
I'm not an expert in the military so someone help me understand this?
how did an NCO become a lawyer. I would think they would have to be an officer?
something doesn't add up in your story?

Jeanyus
10-07-2004, 12:18 PM
hmmm... didn't you say that you became an officer in the military?
I'm not an expert in the military so someone help me understand this?
how did an NCO become a lawyer. I would think they would have to be an officer?
something doesn't add up in your story?
I'm trying to figure out how someone with a degree, who has passed the BAR, is a Staff Sargent :confused: :confused:

Back Forty
10-07-2004, 12:50 PM
I'm trying to figure out how someone with a degree, who has passed the BAR, is a Staff Sargent
Because he's a...
http://scoop.diamondgalleries.com/news_images/2023_5348_2.jpg
The gas pumper has a poster of Melvin Purvis above his bed.
Here it is.
http://scoop.diamondgalleries.com/news_images/2023_5350_1.jpg
I could be wrong but it appears to be stained... :confused:
HEY GAS PUMPER... Please don't go the way of old Melvin. It would be a shame. :notam:

kahanamoko
10-07-2004, 04:24 PM
hmmm... didn't you say that you became an officer in the military?
I'm not an expert in the military so someone help me understand this?
how did an NCO become a lawyer. I would think they would have to be an officer?
something doesn't add up in your story?
My god! Do you ever, ever listen. Once again and for the last time. I went into the military in 1983. Active duty. Four years. Enlisted. I have never, ever been an officer. I am currently a Non-Commissioned Officer (NCO). I wasn't a lawyer when I got into the military (obviously). I have been an attorney for 8 years. I've had the opportunity to submit a packet for direct commission to JAG, obtained signatures from the appropriate officers in my chain of command, obtained the paperwork, filled it out, and then ultimately sat on it because I really don't want to deal with the political bullshit on what we call "the dark side". There are many officers that I truly respect. I enjoy what I do in the military at present and don't want to lose that. I enjoy being enlisted. I enjoy leading soldiers. I enjoy instructing soldiers. So apparently, what you "think" is not correct.

Steve 1
10-07-2004, 05:14 PM
Nutcase!! Here a Big Rat.

Dave C
10-07-2004, 05:24 PM
boy your story seems to keep changing alot...... ;) that means you lack credibility.
So now "your story" is that you got an undergraduate degree in what? When? then went to what law school?
Just curious.
You had such a great time bashing Froggy on his C.V :notam: ..... give us the same opportunity...... :D :notam:
My god! Do you ever, ever listen. Once again and for the last time. I went into the military in 1983. Active duty. Four years. Enlisted. I have never, ever been an officer. I am currently a Non-Commissioned Officer (NCO). I wasn't a lawyer when I got into the military (obviously). I have been an attorney for 8 years. I've had the opportunity to submit a packet for direct commission to JAG, obtained signatures from the appropriate officers in my chain of command, obtained the paperwork, filled it out, and then ultimately sat on it because I really don't want to deal with the political bullshit on what we call "the dark side". There are many officers that I truly respect. I enjoy what I do in the military at present and don't want to lose that. I enjoy being enlisted. I enjoy leading soldiers. I enjoy instructing soldiers. So apparently, what you "think" is not correct.

Jeanyus
10-07-2004, 05:29 PM
I've had the opportunity to submit a packet for direct commission to JAG, obtained signatures from the appropriate officers in my chain of command, obtained the paperwork, filled it out
I could be wrong about the Cat in the Hat Pajamas, Maybe you are a clerk in the army. Naaaaaaaaaa Your'e Cat in the hat.

Froggystyle
10-09-2004, 05:17 PM
I don't think he is in the military, in any sense or a lawyer either.
My guess, he is a civilian gate guard, and a part time 7-11 clerk.

Steve 1
10-09-2004, 06:08 PM
I agree Froggy Kook Types well except for running one paragraph into another (even a homemade lawyer would never ever do that) He has dainty little Lady Fingers most likely judging from the amount of twisted text pumped out ! That legal hype is from handling the correspondence on his Gay Sodomy site...

Back Forty
10-09-2004, 07:34 PM
I've held off for almost two days. I... I ... can't hold.... off... much... longer...
I... al..most.. for...got..... how to .... a..ttack... in the tr..aditional lib...eral way. I... must...
Ka..Kn...ASS........ you... pFff...
AH HAAAA!!!!!!
HEY KAKNF*CK!!!!
I SAW YOUR PICTURE IN THE PAPER ASSHOLE!!!!
HOW ABOUT AN ATTACK TODAY C*NTFACE!!!
AH HAA!!!! HOWDY YOU LIBERAL GAS PUMPER F*CK.
HOW'S IT FEEL TO HAVE A REAL MILITARY SCROUNGE CALLING YOU OUT SCUM BAG!!! I'LL BET YOU HAVE YOUR LOW QUARTERS POLISHED UP AND READY TO GO FOR YOUR DUTY NIGHT AT THE FILLING STATION!!!
OH SH*T, KAKNHAMMER IS CAUGHT AT THE STATION SLEEPING ON THE JOB... :jawdrop:
http://hilsingermotorsports.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=31722
LIGHTS OUT KAKNQUEEF.
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http://www.riverratlife.com/forums/board/ubb/graemlins/party.gif
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spectratoad
10-12-2004, 07:24 AM
Well I'm an NCO also and your story there Mr. K sounds a little fishy. I got your back there Back40. Seems to me that a commission as a JAG would different from a regular commission. That part of the officer corps seems to be rather its own entity and all the JAGs I know love the work. I am betting the you a Sally Struthers have the same degree.

Back Forty
10-13-2004, 04:40 PM
Looks like the GAS PUMPER is allowed to leave his room after his duty weekend running the lube rack down at the filling station... :idea:
Hey GAS PUMPER, Whats your favorite method of polishing brass? Maybe we should ask the brass eh...GAS PUMPER?
:sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:

kahanamoko
10-14-2004, 12:11 PM
I am betting the you a Sally Struthers have the same degree.
Whereas you apparently need to go back to elementary school and learn to spell.

kahanamoko
10-14-2004, 12:14 PM
Looks like the GAS PUMPER is allowed to leave his room after his duty weekend running the lube rack down at the filling station... :idea:
Hey GAS PUMPER, Whats your favorite method of polishing brass? Maybe we should ask the brass eh...GAS PUMPER?
:sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:
Your attempts at insults are pathetic. Actually ASS HUMPER, unlike your pathetic ass I was at Needles for four days running my boat, drinking beers, skiing, relaxing and having a great time with about 50 of my friends. Oh, sorry. Probably don't have any of those do you?

Steve 1
10-14-2004, 02:49 PM
Kook you said it ass humper LOL You have holes in both sides of your underwear.

kahanamoko
10-14-2004, 04:31 PM
Kook you said it ass humper LOL You have holes in both sides of your underwear.
Perhaps if you noticed the placement of the single comma and understood the English language you would know that I was calling him ASS HUMPER. You we can call RUMP RANGER.

THOR
10-14-2004, 04:37 PM
My god! Do you ever, ever listen. Once again and for the last time. I went into the military in 1983. Active duty. Four years. Enlisted. I have never, ever been an officer. I am currently a Non-Commissioned Officer (NCO). I wasn't a lawyer when I got into the military (obviously). I have been an attorney for 8 years. I've had the opportunity to submit a packet for direct commission to JAG, obtained signatures from the appropriate officers in my chain of command, obtained the paperwork, filled it out, and then ultimately sat on it because I really don't want to deal with the political bullshit on what we call "the dark side". There are many officers that I truly respect. I enjoy what I do in the military at present and don't want to lose that. I enjoy being enlisted. I enjoy leading soldiers. I enjoy instructing soldiers. So apparently, what you "think" is not correct.
You are totally full of $hit and everyone here knows it. You have a Law degree of some type and yet you are an NCO. Total BS. Crawl back under your rock.

kahanamoko
10-14-2004, 04:42 PM
I know people in the military with PhD's who are enlisted. Several with Masters Degrees. Alot of Nurses in the Reserves have gone on to receive advanced degrees. I know of at least one other attorney in the Army Reserves that is also an attorney. Many that have advanced degrees in Criminal Justice and work for police agencies.
Your "opinion" is wrong. If you were in the military then perhaps you'd know what you were talking about. And I don't care to hear the opinion of some Vietnam Vet regarding this issue unless he is still in the military because it is a completely different and much more "educated" military today than existed back then.

Steve 1
10-14-2004, 07:51 PM
Perhaps if you noticed the placement of the single comma and understood the English language you would know that I was calling him ASS HUMPER. You we can call RUMP RANGER.
No I read it as intended Kookette.

JustMVG
10-14-2004, 07:55 PM
Must have gotten his degree @ Univ. of Phoenix.

kahanamoko
10-17-2004, 12:00 AM
Must have gotten his degree @ Univ. of Phoenix.
Gee, I don't think they offer a Juris Doctor degree. Pitiful try though. Try again pussy.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 05:37 AM
Nothing to see here time to move on.

kahanamoko
10-17-2004, 08:56 AM
Then stop looking at yourself you pathetic loser.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 08:57 AM
Just a nobody let"s move on.

kahanamoko
10-17-2004, 08:58 AM
Right. Then do so. Apparently you're incapable.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 08:59 AM
Just a nobody let"s move on.

kahanamoko
10-17-2004, 09:00 AM
Still here. Thought you "moved on." Liar.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 09:01 AM
Just a nobody let"s move on.

kahanamoko
10-17-2004, 09:11 AM
loser

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 09:12 AM
Just a worthless nobody let"s move on.

LilHarley
10-17-2004, 10:03 AM
I find it hard to listen to anyone knocking Kerry's military service record or what he did afterwards unless they done time themselves. Serving in Nam for 2 tours with the 75th, I understand what he went through in with the fast boats, it wasn't easy. Any of you who want to talk crap about it without ever doing time in combat yourselves, only shows the brashness and ignorance of people who can talk cheap.
What he did upon returning I may not agree with, but he deserves to say and do what he believed in. He HAS the right, bought and paid for with what many of you, I hope, will never have to experience.
As far as Bush, I have absolutely no respect for in trying to manipulate the press in disrespecting Kerry's military service with nothing more then what Daddy paid for.
I am a registered Republican. Whether I vote that way this time or not, only time will tell. I voted for Bush last time, but to date, Bush and his cabinet, have been less then inspiring.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 10:19 AM
Kerry smeared a hero: my dad.
By CAROL CROWLEY
Published on: 09/20/04
Many of you believe dirty politics is the motivation of Vietnam veterans speaking out in opposition to John Kerry. Let me tell you the real motivation.
In the movie "We Were Soldiers," the story about the battle of the la Drang Valley in Vietnam in 1965, a young sergeant, Jack Gell, cried as he died, "Tell my wife I love her . . ." and my family relived the death of my dad. He told my mother in letters that he and those he served with believed they were doing the right thing, fighting to help a sovereign nation defend its freedom.
Before the movie was filmed, I heard my father's dying words from retired Lt. Gen. Hal Moore and journalist Joe Galloway, who were with him in the Valley of Death. I met Mel Gibson, who played Col. Moore in the movie, showing him family pictures and letters to help him learn the essence of these young men serving their country in a difficult time. Gibson said my father was a true hero.
I remember when the movie was released witnessing the healing of men and family members who clung to this story with a new pride after decades of being vilified. Finally, they talked about it. Finally, many were proud to be Vietnam veterans.
And then Kerry was nominated as a presidential candidate.
I don't blame Kerry for my father's death, and I don't much care if he shamelessly chased after medals. But I do care that when he returned from Vietnam he gave aid and comfort to the enemy while our soldiers were still dying. I care that he smeared my father and a generation of our armed forces with false charges of war crimes while posing himself as a hero. I care that Kerry's false charges encouraged our enemy who was pressuring our POWs in inhumane ways to confess to imaginary war crimes. I care that he went to Paris to meet with the Viet Cong in 1970 while still an officer in the Navy Reserve, returning to publicly advocate for their position and against America's position.
This isn't about politics. It's about honor and betrayal and protecting our country. And for me it is deeply personal, as it is for countless vets. Thirty-nine years later, my mother still cries on Nov 14. Thirty-nine years later, we miss my father every day. Thirty-nine years later, Kerry poses as a hero. As children of Vietnam veterans, many of us feel an unwelcome emotional strain as the arguments about what really happened in Vietnam are tugged back and forth, often by people who were not there. We deeply resent the suggestion that our fathers were war criminals as that theme inevitably seeps into the argument.
We are educated and grown. We have children of our own, some in the service. We know in our heart and soul the scars of war that will never go away. But we are not weak, and we will not be silent. I will stand with the Vietnam veterans who speak out, and the voice of my father will be heard through me.
As long as I have breath and Kerry seeks the office of president, I will speak out against him. Others like me are too many to count.
While we are dismissed as dirty politics, the truth is we would be doing the very same things if Kerry were a Republican. President Bush has never had anything to do with our opposition to Kerry, and if the president makes a personal appeal to us to stop, we cannot and will not do so, because there are some things that can never be forgiven, can never be forgotten. John Kerry is one of those things.
Carol Crowley lives in Charlotte, N.C.

LilHarley
10-17-2004, 10:25 AM
In my opinion, there are not too many living hereos, pretty much only dead ones. But I do respect his military service.
Don't forget, it was his blood over there too! The medals he won at the time, when he was charged to do what he needed to do, yes, he was and is a person who put his life on the line. He didn't believe we should be there, which many of us didn't believe at the time either. At least he didn't run away. In my opinion, I defintely would want Kerry on my backside in a firefight rather then Bush.
Once again, I may not agree with what he did afterwards, but that does not belittle his actions in combat nor my take offense to my tours. People that offend me are people like Hanoi Jane and Bush who speak out without ever having done anything themselves.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 10:44 AM
Harley Blame it on LBJ or RM that Bush did not go to Viet Nam as They called the shots The draftees were one thing but sending a Guard Air Wing is something noticed by the community and could cause political problems. Also the 102 proved to not be the right aircraft for that arena.
As for Tom, Jane Walter .John they are personally responsible for a lot of the brave names on the Wall.

LilHarley
10-17-2004, 10:58 AM
Harley Blame it on LBJ or RM that Bush did not go to Viet Nam as They called the shots The draftees were one thing but sending a Guard Air Wing is something noticed by the community and could cause political problems. Also the 102 proved to not be the right aircraft for that arena.
As for Tom, Jane Walter .John they are personally responsible for a lot of the brave names on the Wall.
Can't really blame LBJ or Tricky Dick for what daddy's money can buy. And trust me, that isn't the issue I have because, heck, old George wasn't the only one to buy or pull in favors to get in the NG. All lot of people did it. My only gripe is the talk afterwards, nothing else. Like I said, I voted for Bush last time, I may again or I may not, haven't made up my mind.
Good luck ..... wish I were at the lake!!! :rollside:

058
10-17-2004, 11:13 AM
In my opinion, there are not too many living hereos, pretty much only dead ones. But I do respect his military service.
Don't forget, it was his blood over there too! The medals he won at the time, when he was charged to do what he needed to do, yes, he was and is a person who put his life on the line. He didn't believe we should be there, which many of us didn't believe at the time either. At least he didn't run away. In my opinion, I defintely would want Kerry on my backside in a firefight rather then Bush.
Once again, I may not agree with what he did afterwards, but that does not belittle his actions in combat nor my take offense to my tours. People that offend me are people like Hanoi Jane and Bush who speak out without ever having done anything themselves.
So, according to you only Viet Nam vets are allowed to speak? Why not make it so that only Gulf War/Iraq war familys can vote in the Pres. election? Sorry.. but I don't respect his [Kerry's] "service" in Nam. He chose swiftboats as at the time was gravy duty and posed little or no risk. Soon after Ad. Zumwald re-evaluated the use of swiftboats and re-assigned them to river duty, Kerry did his best to get out of that duty when it was now dangerous. And for him to come home and urniate on the American flag, toss someone elses metals over the fence, [he didn't want to toss his owned "hard earned" metals because he knew he would have use for them later in his political ambitions] and for him to go to Paris to interfere with the peace negotations and do all the other things that are too numerous to list here, he should be tried for High Treason and hung like we do to traitors.

steelcomp
10-17-2004, 11:32 AM
So, according to you only Viet Nam vets are allowed to speak? Why not make it so that only Gulf War/Iraq war familys can vote in the Pres. election? Sorry.. but I don't respect his [Kerry's] "service" in Nam. He chose swiftboats as at the time was gravy duty and posed little or no risk. Soon after Ad. Zumwald re-evaluated the use of swiftboats and re-assigned them to river duty, Kerry did his best to get out of that duty when it was now dangerous. And for him to come home and urniate on the American flag, toss someone elses metals over the fence, [he didn't want to toss his owned "hard earned" metals because he knew he would have use for them later in his political ambitions] and for him to go to Paris to interfere with the peace negotations and do all the other things that are too numerous to list here, he should be tried for High Treason and hung like we do to traitors.
058's right...Kerry was being groomed for his political career long before he went into Nam. He went in, took the easiest job he could find, got his three purples for rice in the ass and a few scratches, and opted out as fast as he possibly could, only to IMMEDIATELY start his political climb, first by trashing the very guys who stood behind him. I would no more want that chicken shit imitation of a man in a fire fight with me than your sister. I'd shoot him. He'd be a liability, since the only thing he's proven to me is that there's one ass he's covering, and that's his own.
People that offend me are people like Hanoi Jane and Bush who speak out without ever having done anything themselves
You're either really naive, or a dirty son of a bitch (I'll let you choose) to include these two in the same sentence.
First...do you have ANY idea what it takes to become a Navy pilot? One of the first things it takes is political connections, if you go through the academy. So every pilot out there who graduated the academy had political pull. It's how you get the appointment.
That not withstanding, do you have any idea what it takes to fly a Navy fighter jet on and off the deck of a carrier? Hell, just fly it! Forget landing and taking off.
The man's got balls. He's the real deal. He did his part, and for what it's worth, none of this crap about him being AWOL has anything to it, or it would have stuck, a long time ago. You notice that no matter what the dems throw at Bush, it dosen't seem to stick.
He ran the state of Texas, and did a pretty damn good job. Kerry hasn't done a thing for Mass in twenty years.
The last thing is that Bush couldn't have gone to Nam if he wanted to. There's no way the CIA was going to let the son of a (then Governor or head of the cia or something,) politician go to war and be captured. Do you know of any other politician's son who was in Nam?
If you think Kerry is any more than the lying opportunistic two faced liberal politician than he is, then God help you.

LilHarley
10-17-2004, 12:09 PM
1- Fast boats got a little more then rice up their ass, road on more then one myself.
2- As a matter of fact, 2 House Reps sons served with me in the Rangers.
3- I don't believe I'm naive or a SOB, your opinion meets little to me as my opinion of you probably means little to yourself.
4- Last, I have never read anywhere that Bush went to the any of the Academies, for which I have a lot of respect. I was under the impression he went to an IVY league school as did Kerry . Also, I am not aware of anyone going to Colorado, the Point or Annapolis to be in the Air National Guard ....

Jeanyus
10-17-2004, 12:20 PM
Kerry has done something for the state of Massachusetts, it's called the Big Dig . Do a search for the Big Dig, and you will find a public transit system (mostly subway system for cars), that went way over budjet, was run by corrupt contractors. The whole project is surronded by corruption, scandel, pork, people getting thier palms greased. The project has gone way over scedule, people in Mass have had to deal with torn up roads, and traffic problems during the whole 10 year mess, the ones I have talked to are very unhappy. The orignal cost estimate was 2.2 billion, current estimate is 14.6 billion, orignal completion date,1995, revised completion date,2005. So kerry ins't totaly worthless.

CrazyHippy
10-17-2004, 12:23 PM
So lets ASSUME (HUGE assumption, that i personally dont agree w/) that Kerry was a Hero, and Bush had strings pulled so he wouldn't have to go. That was over 30 years ago now.
What have they done for me lately? :confused:
Kerry has a 20 year record, of getting absolutley NOTHING done. I would assume that if you are running for a political office, you would provide recent and relevant references to your work. Why is Kerry running on something from 35 years ago, and not his political record? :confused:
Bush on the other hand, gets things done. Agree w/ his policies or not, something is getting done. He is making decissions on the fly, based on the information at hand, and acting.
I personally do not agree w/ everything the president has done. BUt he WILL be getting my vote, as i feel he will take the necessary steps to make me safer. And isn't that his job?
BJH

Sleek-Jet
10-17-2004, 12:42 PM
058's right...Kerry was being groomed for his political career long before he went into Nam. He went in, took the easiest job he could find, got his three purples for rice in the ass and a few scratches, and opted out as fast as he possibly could, only to IMMEDIATELY start his political climb, first by trashing the very guys who stood behind him. I would no more want that chicken shit imitation of a man in a fire fight with me than your sister. I'd shoot him. He'd be a liability, since the only thing he's proven to me is that there's one ass he's covering, and that's his own.
People that offend me are people like Hanoi Jane and Bush who speak out without ever having done anything themselves
You're either really naive, or a dirty son of a bitch (I'll let you choose) to include these two in the same sentence.
First...do you have ANY idea what it takes to become a Navy pilot? One of the first things it takes is political connections, if you go through the academy. So every pilot out there who graduated the academy had political pull. It's how you get the appointment.
That not withstanding, do you have any idea what it takes to fly a Navy fighter jet on and off the deck of a carrier? Hell, just fly it! Forget landing and taking off.
The man's got balls. He's the real deal. He did his part, and for what it's worth, none of this crap about him being AWOL has anything to it, or it would have stuck, a long time ago. You notice that no matter what the dems throw at Bush, it dosen't seem to stick.
He ran the state of Texas, and did a pretty damn good job. Kerry hasn't done a thing for Mass in twenty years.
The last thing is that Bush couldn't have gone to Nam if he wanted to. There's no way the CIA was going to let the son of a (then Governor or head of the cia or something,) politician go to war and be captured. Do you know of any other politician's son who was in Nam?
If you think Kerry is any more than the lying opportunistic two faced liberal politician than he is, then God help you.
Just to keep things straight here comp, Bush was in the Air National Guard (Air Force), not the Navy. He flew F102's, an interceptor/bomber escort. I think his first carrier landing was aboard the S-3 last year.
No flame intended, just trying to keep the facts straight.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 12:45 PM
Bush is fighting this mess left by “The” Zipper Bill Clinton, But all is ok since he was a yellow KGB loving Pinko Liberal Coward with a "Nose Problem".

Schiada76
10-17-2004, 12:50 PM
. There's no way the CIA was going to let the son of a (then Governor or head of the cia or something,) politician go to war and be captured. Do you know of any other politician's son who was in Nam?
If you think Kerry is any more than the lying opportunistic two faced liberal politician than he is, then God help you.[/QUOTE]
Err ummmmmm Gore.
But he had babysitters.
Just kepin it real.

Schiada76
10-17-2004, 12:52 PM
[QUOTE=LilHarley]Can't really blame LBJ or Tricky Dick for what daddy's money can buy. And trust me, that isn't the issue I have because, heck, old George wasn't the only one to buy or pull in favors to get in the NG. All lot of people did it.
I must be missing something. Does this mean everyone in the Guard during Nam was a politicians or rich man's son? All of them? What about the guardsmen that served in Nam?

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 01:02 PM
To whom it may concern: Kerrys Babe
I was a civilian economic development advisor in Viet Nam, and was captured by the North Vietnamese communists in South Viet Nam in 1968, and held for over 5 years. I spent 27 months in solitary confinement, one year in a cage in Cambodia, and one year in a "black box" in Hanoi.
My North Vietnamese captors deliberately poisoned and murdered a female missionary, a nurse in a leprosarium in Ban me Thuot, South Vietnam, whom I buried in the jungle near the Cambodian border.
At one time, I was weighing approximately 90 lbs. (My normal weight is 170 lbs.). We were Jane Fonda¹s "war criminals." When Jane Fonda was in Hanoi, I was asked by the camp communist political officer if I would be willing to meet with Jane Fonda. I said yes, for I would like to tell her about the real treatment we POWs were receiving, which was far different from the treatment purported by the North Vietnamese, and parroted by Jane Fonda, as "humane and lenient."
Because of this, I spent three days on a rocky floor on my knees with outstretched arms with a piece of steel rebar placed on my hands, and beaten with a bamboo cane every time my arms dipped. Jane Fonda had the audacity to say that the POWs were lying about our torture and treatment.
Now ABC is allowing Barbara Walters to honor Jane Fonda in her Feature "100 Years of Great Women." Shame, shame on Jane Fonda! Shame, shame on Barbara Walters! Shame, shame on 20-20. Shame, shame on ABC. And, shame, shame on the Disney Company.
I had the opportunity to meet with Jane Fonda for a couple of hours after I was released [in 1973]. I asked her if she would be willing to debate me on TV. She did not answer me, her husband, Tom Hayden, answered for her. She was mind controlled by her husband.
This does not exemplify someone who should be honored as "100 Years of Great Women." After I was released, I was asked what I thought of Jane Fonda and the antiwar movement. I said that I held Joan Baez¹s husband in very high regard, for he thought the war was wrong, burned his draft card and went to prison in protest.
If the other antiwar protesters took this same route, it would have brought our judicial system to a halt and ended the war much earlier, and there wouldn¹t be as many on that somber black granite wall called the Vietnam Memorial. This is democracy. This is the American way.
Jane Fonda, on the other hand, chose to be a traitor, and went to Hanoi, wore their uniform, propagandized for the communists, and urged American soldiers to desert. As we were being tortured, and some of the POWs murdered, she called us liars.
After her heroes‹the North Vietnamese communists‹took over South Vietnam, they systematically murdered 80,000 South Vietnamese political prisoners. May their souls rest on her head forever. Shame! Shame!
Respectfully, Michael D. Benge
- - - Michael D. Benge spent 11 years in Viet Nam--1963-75, five years as a Prisoner of War--1968-73. For efforts in rescuing several Americans before capture, he received the State Department's highest award for heroism and a second one for valor.

Steve 1
10-17-2004, 01:14 PM
Here a Link on Michael Benge.
http://members.aol.com/bear317d/olsen.htm

steelcomp
10-17-2004, 10:55 PM
To whom it may concern: Kerrys Babe
I was a civilian economic development advisor in Viet Nam, and was captured by the North Vietnamese communists in South Viet Nam in 1968, and held for over 5 years. I spent 27 months in solitary confinement, one year in a cage in Cambodia, and one year in a "black box" in Hanoi.
My North Vietnamese captors deliberately poisoned and murdered a female missionary, a nurse in a leprosarium in Ban me Thuot, South Vietnam, whom I buried in the jungle near the Cambodian border.
At one time, I was weighing approximately 90 lbs. (My normal weight is 170 lbs.). We were Jane Fonda¹s "war criminals." When Jane Fonda was in Hanoi, I was asked by the camp communist political officer if I would be willing to meet with Jane Fonda. I said yes, for I would like to tell her about the real treatment we POWs were receiving, which was far different from the treatment purported by the North Vietnamese, and parroted by Jane Fonda, as "humane and lenient."
Because of this, I spent three days on a rocky floor on my knees with outstretched arms with a piece of steel rebar placed on my hands, and beaten with a bamboo cane every time my arms dipped. Jane Fonda had the audacity to say that the POWs were lying about our torture and treatment.
Now ABC is allowing Barbara Walters to honor Jane Fonda in her Feature "100 Years of Great Women." Shame, shame on Jane Fonda! Shame, shame on Barbara Walters! Shame, shame on 20-20. Shame, shame on ABC. And, shame, shame on the Disney Company.
I had the opportunity to meet with Jane Fonda for a couple of hours after I was released [in 1973]. I asked her if she would be willing to debate me on TV. She did not answer me, her husband, Tom Hayden, answered for her. She was mind controlled by her husband.
This does not exemplify someone who should be honored as "100 Years of Great Women." After I was released, I was asked what I thought of Jane Fonda and the antiwar movement. I said that I held Joan Baez¹s husband in very high regard, for he thought the war was wrong, burned his draft card and went to prison in protest.
If the other antiwar protesters took this same route, it would have brought our judicial system to a halt and ended the war much earlier, and there wouldn¹t be as many on that somber black granite wall called the Vietnam Memorial. This is democracy. This is the American way.
Jane Fonda, on the other hand, chose to be a traitor, and went to Hanoi, wore their uniform, propagandized for the communists, and urged American soldiers to desert. As we were being tortured, and some of the POWs murdered, she called us liars.
After her heroes‹the North Vietnamese communists‹took over South Vietnam, they systematically murdered 80,000 South Vietnamese political prisoners. May their souls rest on her head forever. Shame! Shame!
Respectfully, Michael D. Benge
- - - Michael D. Benge spent 11 years in Viet Nam--1963-75, five years as a Prisoner of War--1968-73. For efforts in rescuing several Americans before capture, he received the State Department's highest award for heroism and a second one for valor.
That story turned my stomach. I bet he won't throw his medals over a fence.
Kerry ought to be shot in front of a firing squad.

steelcomp
10-17-2004, 11:10 PM
Just to keep things straight here comp, Bush was in the Air National Guard (Air Force), not the Navy. He flew F102's, an interceptor/bomber escort. I think his first carrier landing was aboard the S-3 last year.
No flame intended, just trying to keep the facts straight.
Thanks, SJ. No flame taken.
Thought he was a navy pilot...heard he landed on carriers. I stand corrected. Dosent matter...like I said, just flying any one of those jets is'nt anything most of us can do. His co-flyers say he was a good pilot. Good guy to fly with and be around
Air Nat'l Guard...OK,...I never said Bush went to any of the Academies. Just pointing out that many did, and that took political pull, and grooming. But I guess if you run for President, even that kind of service is open for criticizm. I just can't stomach anyone even comparing Bush and Kerry, as much a POS as that man is. And anyone swallowing any of what he says, after as many different stories as he's come up with, well, I have something here you can swallow as well, and you won't even know the difference! Putting Bush in the same sentence as Hanoi Jane makes me want to spit!

steelcomp
10-17-2004, 11:15 PM
. There's no way the CIA was going to let the son of a (then Governor or head of the cia or something,) politician go to war and be captured. Do you know of any other politician's son who was in Nam?
If you think Kerry is any more than the lying opportunistic two faced liberal politician than he is, then God help you.
Err ummmmmm Gore.
But he had babysitters.
Just kepin it real.[/QUOTE]
Didn't knnow Gore's dad was a politician. I didn't say there weren't any politicians' sons in Nam...I asked if there were. I was under the impression that Bush put in for active duty and was rejected due to his status as Bush senior's son. I had heard htat on a report some time back. It's all really semantics.

Schiada76
10-18-2004, 07:13 AM
Err ummmmmm Gore.
But he had babysitters.
Just kepin it real.
Didn't knnow Gore's dad was a politician. I didn't say there weren't any politicians' sons in Nam...I asked if there were. I was under the impression that Bush put in for active duty and was rejected due to his status as Bush senior's son. I had heard htat on a report some time back. It's all really semantics.[/QUOTE]
Gore's daddy was a senator,bought and paid for by Armand Hammer (Occidental Petroleum)

Steve 1
10-18-2004, 03:03 PM
Err ummmmmm Gore.
But he had babysitters.
Just kepin it real.
Where algore went over there he could have wore a tuxedo.