stereo help?????

[lostlake]

I would like to tap the brains of the stereo gods..... I was at a stereo shop in Corona Today and the guys there swear by kicker. Are they any good.. He was telling me if he set me up with a kenwood head unit, 2 6x9's ,( 2 or 4 4x10's ) Note: The reason for the 4x10s is because I have no more room for 6x9's ) a 12" sub, a D class amp for the sub, and a 4 ch amp for the other speakers It would be a kick ass system... Now how bout it????

[DickDanger]

Lost,
I have had great luck with Kicker products over the years, so I suppose that what they are telling you is legit. I frequent the "Audio Shoppe" in Riverside, as they have MANY years experience doing boat installs, they are great to deal with, very professional, and have good suggestions for making a great system fit into small places.
I suggest giving them a call, and talk to the shop manager, Rod. -Dick Danger out.

[racingrascal]

Dosen't sound bad. Is the 12" sub woofer come in a sealed pre-fabricated box or are they going to build an encloser for it? Are the 6x9/4x10's marine speaker (water proof)? Another company you may want to look at is Boston or MBquart, they are both great companies also. What kind of amps? Kicker? Rule of thumb is one dollar for every watt. of power out of the amp.
Andy

[Havasu Hangin']

Originally posted by lostlake:
...I was at a stereo shop in Corona Today and the guys there swear by kicker. Are they any good..
Most Stereo shops will try to sell you what they are comfortable with (what they've installed in the past), and/or what they make the highest margin on.
IMO, Kicker are good, but there is usually better out there for less/equal money.
Originally posted by lostlake:
He was telling me if he set me up with a kenwood head unit, 2 6x9's ,( 2 or 4 4x10's ) Note: The reason for the 4x10s is because I have no more room for 6x9's ) a 12" sub, a D class amp for the sub, and a 4 ch amp for the other speakers It would be a kick ass system...
4x10s? Hmmmm. Not familiar with the 4x10s.
You're on the right track. However, I agree with racingrascal on the components- Infinity Perfects, MB Quarts, Boston, or Babbs would be higher quality. A 4 channel would be good, but a quality 2 channel will also handle 4 speakers, no worries.
Right on with the Class D for the sub(s). However, I would prefer two 10's or 2 12's, as a boat has no acoustics, and SPL gets lost. Kicker subs are good, probably the best part of their line.
IMO, Kicker amps get a 6 out of 10. There are probably better out there for less money, unless they are giving you a screaming deal. If you like, I can point you to a couple internet retailers to compare the shop's quoted prices to what the market is.
Remember, as I stated earlier, these guys are trying to sell you based on their agenda. Don't be afraid to mix & match components, and/or compare prices.
Good luck!. http://www.goldenplasma.f2s.com/forum/smilies/cool08.gif

[Havasu_Dreamin]

What about Rockford Fosgate? I'm thinking of adding a 2 6x9's, a 10 or 12 inch woofer and one or two 400 watt amps. I have been told the two amps would be best to have one amp run all of the 6x9's, a total of 6, and then one amp to run the woofer. I don't know the specifics of the speakers or the amp.

[racingrascal]

Havasu Dreamin,
It depends on the components as to which amp to run, you said two 400 watt amps. You may need a 200 watt amp for the sub and a 400 for the 6x9's. Also another thing I hear nobody mention are bass tubes if you have the location they can work out great and come powered. Tell me more boys.
Andy

[77Spectra]

Do you have room in your forward bulkhead for speakers? I am running A Kenwood stereo into an equalizer with a biamp fader. The front side runs a 250 watt amp into two 6x9's. They are sealed in the rear so the subs will not blow them out. The rear side runs two 12's with a 400w amp. The equalizer is almost a must in a boat.

[lostlake]

Thanks to all http://www.goldenplasma.f2s.com/forum/smilies/happy01.gif
Racing: they do have a sealed box but they said if it won't work they will build me one. No on the marine speakers. Havasu Hang- You are absoulty right the stereo shop loves Kicker or Cerwin vega, THe 4x10s are because it's a 21 deck and in the rear behind the front seats the 6x9s will work, but no room up front there's only 5 in wide on the bottom protion of the deck by your feet. He also has Hi tronics amp ( never heard of) I'll take any info and good shops around my area if some are know... Corona Area.
http://www.goldenplasma.f2s.com/forum/smilies/happy03.gif
[This message has been edited by lostlake (edited July 28, 2001).]

[Havasu Hangin']

Originally posted by Havasu_Dreamin:
What about Rockford Fosgate? I'm thinking of adding a 2 6x9's...I don't know the specifics of the speakers or the amp.
I'm not a big fan of Fosgate- only because I think your dollar can go farther with other brands. Fosgate used to be king of the hill, so they have the brand recognition- you pay for the brand. Don't get me wrong, they sound great, but buyer beware. IMO:
Don't get caught up in the "200 watts vs 400 watts" testosterone slinging. It doesn't mean as much as the ohm load- that determines the output of the amp. Quality amps can handle very low ohm loads for long periods, while the cheap stuff will only handle low ohm loads for a few seconds. Most brands have "quality" and "value" lines, so the brand isn't as important as the specs. Also, keep in mind that there is little regulation on how much you can lie about your product in the stereo industry.
One 2 channel amp can run 6- 6x9s, but that's a 1.3 ohm load- make sure the amp is 1 ohm stereo stable. If those speakers are rated at 100 watts each (for example), look for an amp that offers 300 watts x 2 RMS @ 1 ohm.
Use a Class D subwoofer amp for your sub. Make sure it is rated for the sub- if you have a 4 ohm SVC sub rated at 300 watts RMS, then look for a mono block amp rated at 300 watts RMS x 1 (minimum) @ 4 ohms.
If it were me (and believe me, you don't want to be me), I would run an eq with a sub out to your sub amp, and two amps (front & rear) for your components. You want to keep your subs on a separate amp whenever possible, as subs suck juice- if an amp clips, everything on that circuit suffers. I have 5 amps in my boat- I like the JBL stuff.
There's my 4 cents.
http://www.goldenplasma.f2s.com/forum/smilies/cool08.gif
Uh oh...I just realized I'm in the squirt section, and I don't have a jet. You guys aren't going to kick me out, are you? http://www.goldenplasma.f2s.com/forum/smilies/scared04.gif

[Havasu Hangin']

Originally posted by lostlake:
THe 4x10s are because it's a 21 deck ...but no room up front there's only 5 in wide on the bottom protion of the deck by your feet.
Are you talking about 4x6's? http://www.goldenplasma.f2s.com/forum/smilies/confused09.gif
Originally posted by lostlake:
He also has Hi tronics amp...never heard of
Hifonics? The make some very good amps. And some so-so ones.
Originally posted by lostlake:
I'll take any info and good shops around my area if some are know... Corona Area.
Do it yourself! Oops..sorry...I'm in the "jet section" again. My bad. http://www.goldenplasma.f2s.com/forum/smilies/sad23.gif

[johnnie jetboat]

Forget the stereo and buy some Bassett twisties http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

[johnnie jetboat]

Forget the stereo and buy some Bassett twisties http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

[jroos]

I have Alpine detachable face, 2 Pioneer 100W amps with built in cross-overs, 1 amp runs 2 4-way 6x9`s with cross-over turned off, other runs 1 10" Bazooka tube, cross-over set to lows. It rocks. The deck itself and divider wall makes for a perfect bass reflector. I want to get some Explode stuff. Will only be happy when fish are floatin` around my boat.

[froggystyle]

Couldn't stay away.... Phoenix Gold just released a new line called the "Tantrum" series. I pulled the very expensive PG Zeropoint titanium amps out of my Durango for my boat project, as they were just too loud for a closed vehicle. I never even used half of their potential. I bought a Tantrum 600.4 amp and am running it 2ohms to the front and rear channels, and 2 ohms to the sub. It hits...hard. I will buy the 2500 (2x250, bridged to 1x500 at 4 ohms) for the 2 JL subs eventually, but I am focused on the regatta right now. Bottom line is, the amp was $450, and the sub amp will be $350. Both were out the door prices. I am very pleased with the quality, look and of course, being Phoenix Gold, I know they will stand up. Also, they have a great crossover installed. I'm not even using the 10 channel Sony I have anymore.
As far as your speaker selection, the oval speakers were designed to be installed as a sub, were a larger, round one would not fit. If you are running a dedicated sub, like your kicker, than go with components. Get some 6" mids, some 4" high/mids, and some 1" tweeters well placed for clarity. Or, run a bunch of good co-axial mids/tweets. I like the new Kappa's for this as well, as they have a separate external crossover for both speakers, though they are co-axial. In a boat, fading is not as important as volume, so I might go with a huge 4 channel for your mids, and bridge it to 2 channels at 2 ohm. And then run a class D for the sub. I would think very strongly about the PG though. I don't think you will hit this hard for $800. I love the Infinity components, and just put the Kappa's in my Durango and am very pleased. I have always run Bostons before, but got a great deal on the Infinitys this time.
[This message has been edited by froggystyle (edited July 29, 2001).]

[Racing Ray]

I have 2 15" Diamond subs each powered by a 500 watt amp. A 300 watt drives 4 Boston 6X9s and 4 4" components with 4 2" component tweeters and 2 voice horns. Sound alright to me. The Bostons are very clean sounding. I can't seem to kill fish I guess they hear me coming.

[lostlake]

Wow!!!! Froggy, Havasu, Racingray.. YOu all sure seem to know alot about stereo equimpent. Thanks, I'm going to print out all your response's and go to a few diffrent shops just to plug there brains and see how they would do it compared to what they sell. It seems like as long i stay with $$$ products I'll probally sound as good as the next guy.. Thanks again. Lost

[rivercrazy]

Great reply's and the Q's in here. I second most of the advisory points in here.
Don't skimp on quality. You'll pay extra in the long run. Do it right the first time.
I would recommend going with a three amp set up. Go with either two 2 channel amps (on for the front and one for the rear channels) or two 4 channel amps bridged. This assumes all are 1 ohm stable. (I would go conservative on this if you run in really hot climates. Amps will run hotter in bridged mode). Then get a seperate class D sub amp.
On the speakers, I would stay away from the 4X10's if 6.5" will fit. If 6.5" fits, go with seperates (6.5 and seperate tweeter). 4X10's are a compromise and the 6.5" will give you cleaner and tighter mid bass response. Your subs will bang your low frequency response and mid bass is often overlooked in a boat.
Make sure that the subs you choose are installed in a engineered enclosure, either one designed for that size from an audio retailer or specifically designed for the speaker you are buying from the stereo installer.
Brand wise, I recommend the JBL/Infinity products. Get 2 10" or 12" Infiniti Kappa Perfects and go with either a JBL P600.1 or JBL P1200.1 power servies sub amp. Get two JBL P180.2 or P80.4 power series amps for the other speakers and you'd be good to go. I have 4 Infinity Marine Kappa 6X9's and am very happy with them. I would recommend staying with marine speakers on the 6.5" and 6X9's. They will get wet, trust me.
Get high quality cables. If you go big run 2 gauge power cable to a distribution block and 4 gauge wire for ground and power to each amp. Phoenix Gold makes great stuff for this along with 10-12 gauge speaker wire (Maybe even 8 for the subs).
Don't overlook a capacitor also. Your batteries will not be able to keep up with the demand and the caps fill in the gaps. Run a 1 farad cap for each 1000 watts rms. They also keep the amps fully supplied with juice that will make them run cooler. Amps starving for power will result in excess heat that can kill them.
Go back about 3-4 months in Hot Boat Hot Spots and refer to subs in an Eliminator Daytona. You will find more great info there. Hangin Havasu really knows his stuff and provided a lot of technical detail there.

[lostlake]

Thanks Froggy, Your knowledge is priceless, I have no idea where i can put 6.5's, i just don't have the room but i will have to look at all options once i get the boat, but your info will do me justice, i will look into the jbl as i have heard good things, and i am now digging out my hot boat issue's so i can do my research, hopefully when i'm done you will be able to hear me from Lostlake.. C-ya

[froggystyle]

If you need to only fit 4" mids, do it, just find a place for some 8" subs in there for mid-bass. Most of what you need to hear on the top end, should be sightline from your ears, meaning, nothing in the way, and pointed at your head. Once you ruin that dynamic, it is really tough to get good "imaging" in your ride.
BTW, I shifted gears today. I decided to do my own install so I could be on the water for the regatta. I decided to go with Phoenix Gold "X-Force" 15" subs, with two 8" mid bass, and four sets of 6.5 and 1" mids/tweets. Still running the PG Zeropoint amps, but now with two caps and more neon than a 21' boat should have!

[rivercrazy]

All-right Froggy. Sounds like your boat will be party central. Congrats on the new boat and the upcoming stereo install. Sounds like its going to really kick tail and kill fish!
Again, congrats!
By the way does a monkey need a drivers licence to pilot a boat? Is a monkey a chick magnet? Maybe everyone coming to Ops6 should bring one