Open Cockpit Helmet Restraint System

[Terminal Velocity]

This is a plug i've been working on for open cockpit Helmet Restraint. Yes it looks like another device but it has been revised and many angles of the original have been changed to accomodate wearing our life vests instead of using seatbelts. There are a couple more changes to some angles we are currently working on for driver comfort but you can see how it fits with your jacket and helmet on.
What you don't see are the tethers from the headrest to the rear side area of the helmet, as well there will be tethers from the front shoulder legs up the front to the chin of the helmet and one more that will go from the shoulder legs around your back to help tie it to you.
THIS IS NOT GOING TO BE MARKETED!!! I am not trying to make money with this, this is something i have decided to try and build for friends and their friends who drive open cockpit boats to try and keep the helmet on. I will be using one with my Super Stock which i believe APBA with their new mandate will allow me to use without using the padded donut collar.
We are open to suggestions and ideas from you guys so let me know what you think.
Thanks
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[Terminal Velocity]

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Well there it is, bigger pic's are available in the image center. I won't be online much this weekend due to Nascar in town but i'll try and check back as i can to answer questions.
Thanks

[126driver]

For starters, I recommend trying to find a better-looking model. :D :D :rollside:

[wsuwrhr]

For starters, I recommend trying to find a better-looking model. :D :D :rollside:
Breasts would be nice. :jawdrop: :jawdrop:
Brian

[Morg]

James,
Other than the suggestions listed by the peanut gallery. I was wondering what your thoughts were to the back acting like a scoop if you go in backwards?
Also I have been going back & forth on what type of restraint I am going to use. I am getting stuck on being able to move my head for side & back vision for running at the lake. For this i was thinking a doughnut type neck brace, but I just don't think they offer enough support.
Until this thread I was thinking my only other option was the dragrace style. But I am concerned about being able to twist & look before going into a turn @ the lake.
With the restraints on yours, is it set up for being able to rotate your head?
Thanks
Morg

[Terminal Velocity]

126...My model...you only wish you had that much. Now go find your taco on your helmet.
wsuwrhr...breasts? That's what i married my wife for, CABO YABO'S!!!!
Morg...I have thought about the back acting like a scoop but i "THINK" and talking with my hydrolic engineers at my work with the tethers it shouldn't be a problem, going in that way should release the water around your neck and shoulders. What this is more intended to accomplish is to provide support to your neck in keeping the helmet with you and not "bucketing" the helmet and ripping it off. The main problem is that the chin strap holds the helmet to you until the hydraulic pressure overrides the strap strength, unfortunatly by the time the strap lets go the helmet has bent your neck to far (that is my theory and reasoning). As for being able to look around to see what is going on before entering a turn this is a MAJOR thing that i am working on being that i plan on using this in the SSRA. There is a "bar" that you can bet through simpson that i am going to purchase and look at that would mount say on both sides of your mouth area, it looks like a elongated "U" say 3 inches plus or minus wide, if you were to clip to that from the shoulder legs it would allow the clip to "slide" from side to side as you turned your head. What i've found driving my boat with the "donut" is that i still can only turn so far, after that i actually turn my shoulders to see any farther being that this Helmet Restraint System becomes "part" of you as you turn your shoulders the tethers turn too. This is obviously is a work in progress and there may be alterations but my intention is to make it the best i possibly can for visibility and i will be the guinea (sp?) pig. I've witnessed TOO MANY of my friends being killed because of the helmet coming off and looking at everything i really feel this is a great way to go, the original initial design has done wonders for neck safety, i'm just trying to adapt that to our form of racing and fun.
Sorry for the long post if anyone wants you can call me to discuss things at
702-266-7322(cell).
James

[Terminal Velocity]

I should mention a couple of things, one of the reasons i am doing this is that the original design of the restraint device with the current style of life jackets "to me" pushes your helmet and head way forward. So i've tried to compensate by changing the angles of the head rest and shoulder legs to work with everyone's existing jackets. Lifeline and/or Security might be able to redesign their jackets in the neck collar area to accomodate this style of restraint but i have not been in contact with them at this time.
Also i did make a call to the original "design" manufacturer and attempted to talk with them about the possibility of making one for open type applications without belts and was told (in so many words) that it wouldn't be in their interest to come up with a new design to work for us...so i decided to try and do it.
The restraint device will be made of Kevlar and Carbon Fiber using vaccum bagging and Hysol (loctite brand) epoxy resins to give as much strength and protection as we think can be. As of now i have no idea what the actual material costs will be because i am still working on the plug to build the actual mold from. As soon as i build the first one (mine) i will know what it will take.
James

[wsuwrhr]

That's what i married my wife for, CABO YABO'S!!!!
James
pray she deosn't read that.....haha
Either way, with that excuse, why are YOU modeling your part?
Brian
(I'm confused)

[Sked]

What a bunch of crap. It's a shame that boat (and auto) racing has been taken over by the safety freaks. :(

[WaterBox]

YO. Jimmy :D ["It probably wouldn't be in there interest to come up with a new Design for the open boat's"] Because of the LIABILITY factor they would be looking at! Be carefull Budd! :crossx:

[uclahater]

What a bunch of crap. It's a shame that boat (and auto) racing has been taken over by the safety freaks. :(
Are you off your rocker. James is putting some time and effort into keeping us alive. The racers are dieing because of broken necks.
If your negativity isnt meant toward James than OK, but if it is your an ASShole :mad:
James if your coming to Neddles I would like to try it if its ready. Great job :D

[Terminal Velocity]

Thanks Hater for the support.
Some people may not like it and that's fine with me. If this will keep helmets on and prevent broken necks and people dieing then maybe the so called "safety freaks" will back off of capsules for the masses who wish not to be in one.
Waterbox...yea the liability thing is kind of a ?. Which is one more reason i don't plan on trying to market this. For the most part it will be available to certain friends and their associates only, and people who i feel realize that racing and extreme speed on the water is inherently dangerous and ANYTHING can happen regardless of what you are wearing.
Hater i should have one or two done by then and for sure i'll bring it down for you to check out.
Take care,
James

[Terminal Velocity]

pray she deosn't read that.....haha
Either way, with that excuse, why are YOU modeling your part?
Brian
(I'm confused)
thankfully she doesn't come on here. and as for her modeling there is no way her YABO'S would fit in the jacket and be able to zip it up. 36D compared to my training bra chest. :2purples:

[kipperps28]

James,
I applaud your effort. I hope it works for you. I have driven for Al Lapointe for 10 years, and I recommend drivers that are interested in safety and helmet restraints to call Security (425-557-6508). His son Scott is running the Issaquah, WA store and will help you. These guys really care about racers. Just my 2 cents.

[wsuwrhr]

thankfully she doesn't come on here. and as for her modeling there is no way her YABO'S would fit in the jacket and be able to zip it up. 36D compared to my training bra chest. :2purples:
Yea now you are getting the picture. :) :)
Brian

[Stab-n-Steer]

James,
Keep up the good work Buddy! We are going through this right now with the Crackerbox's. The helmet restraints are mandated now and we are all getting fitted for them. I hate both versions I have tried (Lifeline and SRP).
I was just commenting to my competitors that someone should design one similar to the Hahn's Device they use in car racing. Looks like you are one step ahead! I never want to drive a capsule boat but I don't want to die either. Anything that will make open capsule boats more safe, I'm all for...
S&S

[MKEELINE]

These "safety freaks" are taking all the fun out of racing :rolleyes: . All these new fangled safety innovations sound like such a pain in the ass. I mean come on, lifejackets, helmets, firesuits, fire suppression systems, seatbelts, roll cages, HANS device, scattershields, etc.....what a bunch of crap. Who could possibly need all that stuff. I'm sure most drag racers would be alot more comfortable in their jeans then a firesuit and boat racers should be allowed to wear Speedos and flip-flops, I think that's what they wear in jersey.

[rossdbos]

These "safety freaks" are taking all the fun out of racing . All these new fangled safety innovations sound like such a pain in the ass. I mean come on, lifejackets, helmets, firesuits, fire suppression systems, seatbelts, roll cages, HANS device, scattershields, etc.....what a bunch of crap. Who could possibly need all that stuff. I'm sure most drag racers would be alot more comfortable in their jeans then a firesuit and boat racers should be allowed to wear Speedos and flip-flops, I think that's what they wear in jersey.
Mkeeline:
Are you serious????? Is this some kind of joke????!!! I hope I've been "punk'd" reading your response! If this is your idea of sarcasm it sadly missed it's mark.
These "safety freaks" that you so eloquently spoke of only want to save the lives of their fellow racers. I doubt you are a racer, have been a racer or know any racers. To even mention jeans, t-shirt, and flip flops is ludicris! The reason I made sure that the helmet restraint got instituted as an APBA safety bylaw was that I was sickened by the amount of head and neck injury a driver sustained in wrecks, mainly single boat accidents where his helmet came off. Go speak to a few drivers that spent time recovering from concussions, had their ears sewn back on, etc. because the helmet came off.
As I previously stated I am not for mandating capsules but want to make sure the driver has the utmost protection if he is completely exposed (as in a non-capsule boat).
Why don't you go speak to some past injured drivers or perhaps the widows & children of drivers who died of head injuries sustained. Then go on the web and make clear, concise statements not the rantings of a lunatic :messedup: .
Ross

[superdave013]

Hey Ross,
I think he was kinda teasing that JSSK88 guy

[rossdbos]

I had a feeling so, but this is way too touchy of a subject as anytime any type of safety mandate is put forth the naysayers, mainly those who don't even race, pipe in on how the "safety freaks" are at it again. I support anyone who is innovating for safety and am sick and tired of seeing racers getting hurt in our flat/v bottom ranks.
At the same time this particular safety mandate is one that I personally sponsored and seemed to be accepted without the normal rhetoric that gets spewed that is why I jumped, maybe prematurely, the gun when I read the posting. Too many "monday morning quarterbacks" that never have had to fill out incident reports or work with the families left behind of those that gave their all and perished doing what they loved.
I apologize for going off on MKEELINE but I do take this very serious.
Ross

[Terminal Velocity]

Well i'm glad to see that the majority of the people are enthused about the prospect of this device. if anyone comes into vegas or are going to be passing through get a hold of me bring your jacket and helmet and your more than welcome to try it on. The more i see people supporting this the more it makes me want to get it done. As i said i'm not doing this to make money, i'm doing this because i can't stand to see my friends get killed anymore. Am i saying this will stop that...NO! Nobody can predict what will happen at any given time, and there are way to many variables when dealing with high speeds on water, but for driver comfort and i believe safety, this is a direction to start in.
One major factor in this is still to have as much visibility as possible. In Burley last year i inadvertently cut off Kipper28 because i didn't see him and to this day i still kick myself in the ass for it. I've raced against kip a couple of times in burley and maybe washington once or twice and he has ALWAYS been a great competitor. BUT the other thing i noticed is that even without something restraining the helmet i missed the fact that kip was there, and for that reason before my boat hits the water again i will radios to help assist me in knowing where my competition is. I only hope that all race teams will seriously look at radios as a tool for their drivers and their competitors to be additionally aware on the water.
When the mold is finished and i'm comfortable with it i will put this out to anyone, anyone who wants to borrow the mold when it is not being used and use it to build their own it's theirs, i don't care if you build one from my mold and then make your own mold! If that's not an admittance of not trying to make money i don't know what is. All i care about is trying to help all of us in this sport.
As for anyone who is worried about "safety freaks" ruining our sport, i pray for your safety and hope that you or your family never have to go through the pain of losing someone to a sport you love so dearly. i understand trying to keep things light and good hearted but this subject to me is nothing to make light of so Good luck to you.
Sorry for the long post 1st beer is on me next time we meet.
James

[MKEELINE]

First of all i would like to say "I'm sorry" to those that I offened with my post. Apparently my sarcasm DID miss it's mark. I was so stunned by JSSK88's post that I jumped the gun and posted something I shouldn't have. Or should have stated differently.
My point was to show that as time goes by, and racers are injured or killed, new safety innovations are developed to make these sports less dangerous, hopefully. This is one of the most important things a sport can do for its self. IMO.
I applaude anyone that trys to make their sport safer.
Again, I really wasn't tring to offend anyone and my sarcasm wasn't appropriate for this situation. I know that safety is a VERY serious issue.
Mike

[Terminal Velocity]

No problem with me Mike. Thanks for coming back on and straightening out what you meant, i kinda figured you were messing around with others.
Take care
James

[rossdbos]

Me neither! Again, sorry if I went off on you when I should have probably been really responding to jssk88's remarks.
Ross

[MKEELINE]

No worries.

[Moneypitt]

James, are you comming to Bluewater, could you bring what you have to this point and let others see what you are working on?? My desires to capsulate the 89 boat are falling on deaf ears and I mentioned this deal you are working on to Mike. We won't be racing this season due to things that are out of my control, but are planning to return next November fresh and ready to get after it. If you could bring your deal to Bluewater you may stir up some interest with the others that are not into the capsule idea............Ray

[Terminal Velocity]

Ray, when is Bluewater? i'll make a day trip if necessary the only weekend i have planned is the 8th through the 10th and even then i may be able to squeeze a saturday out. It's the NHRA nationals here in vegas and pops is coming down but hmmmmmm i might be able to talk him into a day trip as well. Let me know the dates and i'll work something out bud.
James
EDIT 3-16: Ray looks like the dates are April 22-24th i'll plan a day trip for Saturday.
See ya.

[WaterBox]

OK! Enough of that crap. Did I hear somone say something about PICTURES?? :D :eek: :rollside: :p :D

[CircleJerk]

What a bunch of crap. It's a shame that boat (and auto) racing has been taken over by the safety freaks. :(
geesz Sked, want to explain a little? Is this an Eastern drive by shooting or your yearly buzz the troops kamakazi blitz post? Come on now cough up two posts for me buddy! (sarcasm works if recognizable)
It is not news that us nostie guys are not waiting for the best neck-helmet gear possible,....we require some devise next year of the owners choice. It seems there are some legal ramifications involved within NBRA to enforce them now but only a fool will disregard their potential benefits. Will you guys keep me posted? Ross, Jim, etc. I want the best for our guys and myself, since capsules arent in any of our futures.....

[Terminal Velocity]

OK! Enough of that crap. Did I hear somone say something about PICTURES?? :D :eek: :rollside: :p :D
which pics? Yabo's in a jacket or chicklets in a speedo? :jawdrop:

[wsuwrhr]

which pics? Yabo's in a jacket or chicklets in a speedo? :jawdrop:
Being the smart guy you seem to be, do you REALLY need an answer to your question?
Brian

[Terminal Velocity]

No, but i've known waterbox since i was about 12 years old and i figured he'd laugh. O and by the way wsuwrhr i actually showed the wife this thread and specifically my comments to you and i got a :rolleyes: so if i can i'll try and sneak a pic for ya.

[wsuwrhr]

O and by the way wsuwrhr i actually showed the wife this thread and specifically my comments to you and i got a :rolleyes: so if i can i'll try and sneak a pic for ya.
I figured as much, you may have more business than you want to do, maybe it wouldn't be a good idea anyway.
Haha.
Brian

[WaterBox]

No, but i've known waterbox since i was about 12 years old and i figured he'd laugh. O and by the way wsuwrhr i actually showed the wife this thread and specifically my comments to you and i got a :rolleyes: so if i can i'll try and sneak a pic for ya.
Atta-Boy Jimmy :D I've already seen the Chicklets [ Not a pretty sight :yuk:] I am sure the Yabo's would be much easier on the eyes. :supp:

[Sked]

geesz Sked, want to explain a little? .....
I wasn't planning to but since you asked, I'll explain a little further.
Since the helmet restraint rule was already approved it's water over the dam, hence the brevity of my original posted statement. Anyway, I'll make my position a bit clearer.
I have no problem with whatever anyone wants to do to make themselves feel safer, more secure, or more comfortable. Hell, race in a straight jacket if it makes you feel good, I don't care. I do however wish to be afforded the same courtesy by those (the safety freaks) who feel they must impose their religion on me in the name of saving us all. For a number of reasons including safety, I'd never wear a full face helmet in a race boat, but you don't see me imposing my religion on everybody else by proposing rules to ban them. On the topic of helmets, of the head/neck/helmet loss injuries, how many of those drivers were wearing a full face helmet? Surely those who introduced and pushed for this helmet restraint rule should have that info. Maybe rossdbos will answer that question for me.
And rossdbos, you're not for mandating capsules but you're for mandating YOUR solution for safety. That seems pretty hypocritical to me.
I see this latest safety mandate as a ploy by some of the crackerbox guys to help keep them off the hook in regard to capsules/roll cages/restraints for their class. Oh right, I know, it can't be done in a cracker. I give you guys a lot of credit for getting that excuse to fly. As for this helmet restraint rule holding off the use of capsules in racing flatbottoms, forget it, that's not going to happen now. The cats out of the bag. The point that sells the capsule to even someone like me who hates the whole idea of them is not the safety aspect, it's about the edge it gives you in competition.
I know the safety freaks believe they have the best intentions and feel they're doing the right thing by removing the two of the things that best defined motorsports, speed and danger. In my opinion, those two things are integral to motorsports. I believe that giving information and recommendations to drivers should be the limit of the safety freaks' influence. The final decisions should be left to the individuals who are directly affected, the drivers.
So, to the safety freaks: Save yourselves, wear whatever you want for yourselves. If I wanted or needed your help in saving my ass or neck I would have asked for it. I'm well past the age of eighteen and capable of making my own decisions regarding safety and racing. I have no problem with holding only myself accountable for the decisions I make. I resent you imposing your ideas of what's best for me as a driver and I further resent loosing the freedom to race as I feel comfortable, which I believe allows ME to be a better and safer driver. This is by no means my last words on the subject, but it will have to do for now. Like I said, the deal is done, there's no sense in me wasting my time fighting a battle that's already been lost. Another win for the safety freaks.

[FlatRacer]

TELL 'EM, SKED!
I'm glad it's you standing on my old soapbox. A man of science and physics, and not one of those whining emotional "save us from ourselves" liberals.
Give 'em hell. I'm too tired to do it anymore.
Eric

[V-DRIVE VIDEO]

The point that sells the capsule to even someone like me who hates the whole idea of them is not the safety aspect, it's about the edge it gives you in competition.
:idea: Are you implying the boats are faster maybe more topside slippery makin them faster? It makes sense on a big course at least. :idea:

[Morg]

Maybe James is just offering something that for those who are interested could be benificial.
I'm just waiting for the new model to show up.

[FlatRacer]

The reason I made sure that the helmet restraint got instituted as an APBA safety bylaw was that I was sickened by the amount of head and neck injury a driver sustained in wrecks, mainly single boat accidents where his helmet came off.
Ross: Please explain to me the nature of the helmet restraints. Are we simply mandating the Lifeline "bra" style restraints like the drag racers wear, or is it something else?
I have to tell you that when I raced, I did not buckle the chin strap of my helmet. I used Velcro on the chin strap to hold it on my head. The Velcro had just enough holding power to keep the helmet on my head in the wind, but it would let go if the helmet bucketed in the water. Better a torn ear or a concussion than a broken neck. The day I got run over, the helmet did its job on the initial impact and then came off just like I intended it to. That was the second thing I'm grateful for, the first being that I was not strapped into a capsule, since the boat sank upside down in the mud and wasn't found for quite some time.
Getting back to helmet restraints, in lieu of a Lifeline "bra", I had straps sewn onto the shoulders of my life jacket which were then clipped to D-rings on the sides of my helmet. Would that qualify as legal under the new mandate?
Eric

[FlatRacer]

:idea: Are you implying the boats are faster maybe more topside slippery makin them faster? It makes sense on a big course at least. :idea:
I think the "edge" Sked is referring to is the added aggressiveness that comes from the feeling of security that the capsule gives some people. In situations where you'd back off and give a competitor room in an open boat (an archaic concept once known as sportsmanship), some would be more apt to take chances in a capsuled boat. The old "healthy respect" for the physical har that could come to you is gone, replaced by a (false?) sense of invulnerability.
Just imagine how Nascars racers would drive if they were absolutely convinced they couldn't be hurt.
Eric

[EXTREMEBOATS]

Inoventions relating to safety should be commended and not frowned upon. Making better, safer options available whether mandated or of free will is what promotes the sport. It is always your personal choice to use these options to promote your safety, but if you choose not to use them that is your personal responsibility to accept the consequences of those choices. Anyone that is willing to sacrifice their time, money,and effort to help improve the safety of the man in the machine should be applauded! From a personal point of view... without people like James this sport will die, we need everybody"s imput and ideas to identify ways to make positive changes. :D Mike and Kristina Cline

[CircleJerk]

Hi Flat, long time no hear....Well, I guess I asked for it so just call me CircleSafetyJeRkFreakie....Thanks Sked, for not sugar coating anything! One point that I would like to make is the fact that some would not even wear a helmet if they could get away with it and spending horsepower money on new safety developements....forget it! So, any organization, I guess, must weight the pros and cons and squirt the grease into the squeakiest wheel and mandate items that some racers wont buy even if they think it could possibly safe their life. Our group is trying to learn from those of you with the most experience and best reactionary rule package. I am so glad our group had a rule committee and a great team of inspectors for the coming year. I also would like to know like Flatracer what type of helmet comes off. I had an open face when I went in head first with a neck donut and only lost my glasses. I went in at the end of the straighaway just before the turn so maybe 70-80mph? Others without the donut all had neck pain. Surely a helmet restraint could possibly help us Nostalgia guys either in limiting neck injuries or helmet loss but then you have the potential visibility problem as mentioned. I will buy the strap Lifeline version, however, this looks interesting as long as it doesnt take to much HP dough! :)

[CircleJerk]

Atta-Boy Jimmy :D I've already seen the Chicklets [/QUOTE]
Ya, but I havent seen a picture of your Lavey yet!!! Does a Hemi actually fit? I put FI on the Blondes barge! :)

[Terminal Velocity]

Getting back to helmet restraints, in lieu of a Lifeline "bra", I had straps sewn onto the shoulders of my life jacket which were then clipped to D-rings on the sides of my helmet. Would that qualify as legal under the new mandate?
Eric
Eric it is my understanding that the straps sewn into the jacket and clipped to the helmet is fine. I am not positive but i believe that is how Security is going about it.
James

[Terminal Velocity]

Sked very good points you make on your behalf and I thank you for coming back to share your thoughts.
I for one started this project about 2 weeks after i returned from Gus Schade's funeral, it was going to be for me and a few friends that i had had contact with following Gus' accident and this was probably before APBA or probably anyone had taken the first step to "force" this rule on us. When i found out that APBA had taken this step i decided that if somebody wanted another "CHOICE" of how to restrain their helmet then here is another option.
Now sked, there is NO set thing APBA has mandated on how to "restrain" your helmet. Put plastic clips to the d-rings so they will break, sew only three or four threads on the straps so they will pull apart, hell tie a piece of bailing wire from your big head to your little head i could care less all you have to have is something showing intent to keep the helmet on which kind of still gives you the choice on how to do it and i'm sure your intelligent enough to figure something out that you feel comfortable with as i have done, my way is just a lot more work.
Take care
James

[rossdbos]

O.K. JSSK88 & Flat Racer, I'll bite:
First, I can respect your opinion(s) as yours and we can agree to disagree, however the big picture includes the good of ALL not just the whims of the few. As a racer first (for over 25 years) then a promoter I understood very well the "powers that be" foisting their mentality on the masses. However, now as a promoter and having been witness to some pretty horriffic wrecks and fatalities and more importantly speaking with the various racing groups on the West Coast, nearly everyone asked had the same response- there is a problem with helmets coming off during incidents. So, you say "safety freaks" and "liberals", while I apologize for not consulting flatbottom racers on the East coast. In speaking to the majority (and I mean majority of Flat Bottom and V Bottom racers in APBA if you look at the numbers statistically) realizing that the Pro-Stocks, Grand Nationals, CrackerBoxes, Nostalgia Flats, & Nost. Endurance all agreed that there was a problem and agreed with the solution it was natural to sponsor the idea to the IRC. Also, insurance and APBA IRC was on the hunt again to open up the mandatory capsule issue which you may or may not know I was instrumental in getting changed from "mandatory" to "highly reccomended".
Next, the "full face" vs. "open face" debate. JSSK88, while I don't want to mandate capsules because to the majority of flatbottom/V racers are just now starting to embrace the idea, the vast majority has yet to be "on board' with Capsules. So once the capsules start the're natural "evolution" in flat/v racing and more drivers are akin to the idea of capsules then and only then will there ever be capsule mandate discussion. APBA & Insurance both allow the drivers to make their own choice with respect to Open or Full face helmets. I can give plenty of reasons for use of both, but the "bucketing" effect that you spoke of has legitamcy in wearing a "full face". I like Terminal Velocity's innovation and support anyone who is looking to improve the safety aspect of the sport. The bravado of having an exposed driver while attractive to some has hurt the sport tremendously. Too many needless lives lost, so a simple safety mandate like helmet restraints are aimed to keep the drivers head/neck from separating thus reducing the amount of head/neck trauma and maybe even save a life. If the cost of $75.00 up to $500.00 is not worth your life then I wouldn't want you on my race course. I like the idea of open face helmets but I know too many drivers that are worried about shattering their good looks in an accident and I can't say I blame them. There is not enough research that can effectively prove either one is better in flatbottom/V racing so again the solution pointed to keeping the helmet ON! Oh, by the way in answer to your question, it's about even- driver's wearing open face to full face, still the driver's sustained MASSIVE HEAD TRAUMA!
So you see my solution was enacted after careful observation, discussion and conclusion not the ravings of a "liberal" "safety freak" foisting my religous beliefs on the non-believers, can I get a "amen" brother!
Now, the roll cage vs. complete encapsulation, I'm sure the Jersey's all embraced the roll cage after one drove over the top of another- no way. It was a very contentious issue that still provokes debate but alas is water under the bridge. With respect to the crackerboxes, other than the roll cage please tell the crackers, most of whose hulls date back to the mid 60's and 70's how to retrofit a capsule in??????? I personally don't like the idea of a roll cage in the case of rollover as without sufficient flotation looks like you'll sink like a stone and possibly trap the unconscious driver/rider, however if it works for the JSS's so be it.
Now, Flat Racer, the nature of helmet restraints are wide open- "D"rings, bra, under the jacket, over the jacket as long as your helmet is tethered so your neck can't hyperextend in any direction thus ending your life it's open. No mandate of HAN'S or a particular mfg. so Lifeline, Deist, Simpson, Security, Tiger, and rest or make your own and rivet to your helmet and sew it to your life jacket, hell put as few stitches in as you want, be spiteful and when your neck snaps you'll have showed us who's right!
Last, Flat racer and JSSK88, are you guys kidding when it comes to NASCAR. Go ask Charlie Strang how much safety and continued MANDATES come down from above without any debate from any drivers. If NASCAR could make sure that no one would die they would do it in a heart beat. Racing fatalities hurt all motorsports. If NASCAR deems it so it shall be and if you don't like it there's 44 other teams waiting for you to leave.
Gimme a break, "an archaic concept once known as sportsmanship" by giving room to a boat! Look at your overlap rule and realize what racing is, that's what it's about. If you go into a turn and your about to be overtaken I assume you'll just back down and give him the lane, not likely!? Capsule boats on the West Coast will be given no "advantage" -inside lane b.s. etc., capsule drivers will have radio's, rear view mirrors, and gold old fashioned peripheral vision. The driver's will have the "edge" and continue to push it.
You both have to remember these guys race consistently against 10+ boats every weekend not just 3-5. It's a brave new world out there and some would like to go back to the days of leather football helmets (if any helmet at all) and smoking ciggarettes while racing. Yeah, when the speeds were a fraction of what they are today. So I guess we'll chalk it up to the liberal buffoons preaching to heathens, hoping to save racing, One Racer at a time!
Hallelujuah!!!!!!
Signed
Preacher Ross
AMEN!

[Terminal Velocity]

Nice post Ross, informative, concise non-bashing. I'll give you an amen...for now. :hammerhea

[Terminal Velocity]

Nice post Ross, informative, concise non-bashing. I'll give you an amen...for now. :hammerhea :cool:

[rossdbos]

Thank you, Brother!

[FlatRacer]

Inoventions relating to safety should be commended and not frowned upon. Making better, safer options available whether mandated or of free will is what promotes the sport. It is always your personal choice to use these options to promote your safety, but if you choose not to use them that is your personal responsibility to accept the consequences of those choices.
Extreme: I certainly do not frown upon safety innovations when they make sense in the physical world, as opposed to those that are instituted for political reasons to appease the insurance companies. I work in civil service so I have plenty of experience with people who are more interested in appearing to be doing something about a problem than actually coming up with a real solution to it.
Capsules are exactly such a band-aid. I remain wholly unconvinced of their effectiveness because I see them creating as many problems as they solve.
I don't know what the current state of affairs is regarding the capsule mandate. Last time I looked into returning to racing I was facing a three year phase in to 100% compliance. So, when you speak of it as being a matter of "personal choice", sadly, you're (at least last time I checked) mistaken. Believe me, I WISH you were right. I'll always have a Pro-Choice stance on capsules.
As to helmets and restraints, at the very first race I ran with my new full face helmet I was glad I made the switch. In the warmup I was following a boat when a fish got kicked out of the water by the prop wash. When it hit me in the chin area it felt like an 80mph fastball. Had I not been wearing a full face, I'm sure I would've sufferred a broken jaw.
I had been Velcro-ing my chin strap since the late '80s and after my crash in '92 I had straps sewn to the shoulder areas of my vest and attached them to the helmet with D-rings. The logic there is that the straps would keep the helmet on my head, but not strapped to it. In the event of the helmet catching the water and bucketing, the pull would be transferred through the jacket to my leg straps instead of my chin and neck, thus saving me from becoming a quadraplegic.
I don't write these posts lightly. I'm not some toothless yahoo with a death wish. I've thought long and hard about my personal safety and how best to protect it. I feel passionately about this subject because I love this sport, and if I could afford to, I'd be out there every weekend driving my balls off and grinning from ear to ear.
Eric

[FlatRacer]

or make your own and rivet to your helmet and sew it to your life jacket, hell put as few stitches in as you want, be spiteful and when your neck snaps you'll have showed us who's right!
Now, that was uncalled for. Please refer to my last post.
Eric

[rossdbos]

Eric:
Agreed, and I apologize for my sarcasm, but after reading JSSK88 and your posts accusing me and others of being "religous safety freaks, etc." I was rubbed the wrong way especially because neither of you have been standing where I have, spoken to the widows, lost the friends I have, question myself for even putting on the race, for past 7 years after hanging up my driving shoes for the time being. I am damn tired of hearing the phrase " well at least he died doing what he loved" that may bring solace to you but not me. I know a majority of the fatalities didn't have to be! Again, re-read my post- Insurance was only a partial consideration- THE MAJORITY of the RACERS AGREED THERE IS A PROBLEM!!!!!! If the driver's agree there is a problem and we have a solution then why not implement it. Let me ask both you and JSSK88, with as many accidents with as many helmets popping off and as many fatalities and head trauma I ask you both WHAT'S YOUR SOLUTION? Have either of you gone out and spoke not just to your group but to all racers within the category (Flat or V) in your area? Call safety manufactuers, discussed the issue with people a hell of a lot more knowledgeable than myself. It wasn't just me saying there is a fundamental problem, everyone racing Flat or V on the West Coast ACKNOWLEDGED the problem. But again, I'm the "safety freak"!
Since you haven't been around lately, in 2004 myself and others from R12 successfully got the IRC to change the capsule mandate from "mandatory" to "highly recommended" so in answer to your question CAPSULES ARE NOT MANDATORY IN FLAT OR V BOTTOM RACING.
I don't take you or JSSK88 as "toothless yahoo's" but apparently you both feel the need to take the verbal assault with your comments- "freak" "liberal", etc. I just responded to it. I don't wish anyone any injury, crash, etc. I have been a party to far too many and wish I could eradicate it but as I have memorized the first line of the APBA membership form- "RACING IS AN INHERENTLY DANGEROUS SPORT"!!!! I only want to see the danger element downsized to keep my friends around a little longer and make my sport the best racing sport there is!!
The Rev. Ross
Glory be!

[FlatRacer]

Ross:
Thank you. I didn't mean to rub you the wrong way, but the fact is I've been fighting the capsule mandate since it all started nearly fifteen years ago. I had given up any hope of the IRC seeing the light when the three year phase in was announced a couple years ago. I had resigned myself to the idea that the only place I ever run my boat again (legally) would be at an ACBS Antique Raceboat Regatta.
If I seemed sarcastic at times it was because I was bitter. I've been bitter ever since I ordered my new Bezer in '92 wondering all the while how long I'd be allowed to use it. The situation was that the entire sport of inboard flatbottom racing was a perpetual state of impending doom. The outlook was constantly bleak. Any thoughts I had of investing money into a top shelf racing engine were shadowed by the ever present cloud of the impending capsule mandate. In fact when I did have a pile of money drop in my lap, I chose not to spend it on something that might be worthless in three years. I spent it instead on one of my other interests. I still believe Flatbottom Ski Boat racing would not have survived the capsule mandate. I even named my boat "Already Gone", partially as a tongue in cheek commentary on the suspicion that I may have been building a dinosaur. Kinda like the last guy to build a front engine roadster for Indy.
I am shocked and amazed to see the IRC has reversed itself in this matter. Whatever roll you had in bringing this about, I thank you. Thank you, thank you, thank you! My beloved sport just may have been rescued from the scrap heap of motorsports history. I'll be looking into rejoining APBA, getting my medical and my equipment up to date (flotation, huh? well,...okay), and getting back into the game. I've been talking with a potential sponsor, and I'm optimistic that the time may be right for me to return.
I agree with the concept of helmet restraints, particularly the idea of attaching the helmet to something other than my chin (wild horses couldn't make me do that), but I still feel that a capsule is not for me.
Looks like I've got some calls to make and some wrenching to do.
Eric Tolnes, Owner, Driver
SS/PS/CanAm 86 "Already Gone"

[V-DRIVE VIDEO]

In the warmup I was following a boat when a fish got kicked out of the water by the prop wash. When it hit me in the chin area it felt like an 80mph fastball.
Eric
Now that would make for some great video! :messedup:

[CircleJerk]

Move over Sked, anothers coming......Hey Mike, all your friends went boat racing again, want a boat now? Ross, thanks for your input, if you recall, we had a talk a while back about race promotion. Too bad it leaves us out from behind the wheel! 2005 should be a banner year! Flat, I like your strap idea, it may be the way I go.

[Miss BK]

I admire anyone who works this hard to prevent another funeral. Bravo to you!
More and more of my friends are wearing them (Champ/SST120) and we haven't had a funeral for many YEARS. That is as awesome as it gets, and now we can go back to focussing on pure RACING instead of whether somebody is going to die, a family left fatherless, and how many fans won't be coming back. And how many drivers will switch to something less deadly.
When our best friend died in a capsule of a broken neck 15 years ago (Ditto Earnhardt) we went into overdrive to figure out how to prevent another one.
Lifeline had a helmet restraint system that was good and we began to sell them to anyone we could convince to buy one. I worried about the HANS after watching a driver have his chest crushed by the "arms" during a pretty violent stuff. He suffered a broken sternum and was unconscious for several hours. (He then quit racing for good) HANS says they have improved the design since that accident.
In the system shown above, I'm sorry, but I'm afraid those arms that come across your chest are going to cause even more serious damage to your chest and lungs if you ever land hard against something. When you are in a 5 pt restraint, they are stationary - locked in place. But without any anchor, I really think they may crush into your torso. Even with the lifejacket on tight, they'll still move under severe G's.
If you are slammed against the steering wheel just imagine what will happen to you underneath the padding of that jacket. OUCH!
And then the entire collar will act as a fulcrum, and the back side will smack the back of the helmet and throw your head forward. Not good.
That's something to think about.
There's already another system out there, that holds no solid surface against your body --- and is anchored by your hip. It's called the D-CEL restraint system and you can buy one for only around $300. It's third generation helmet restraint made by the people at Safety Solutions and is really a work of art. You canwear it under your life jacket, and can be used either in an open cockpit or in a safety cell.
Check it out!
http://www.hutchensdevice.com/ (Click "products")
http://www.hutchensdevice.com/dcelharness/images/decelside.jpg

[Miss BK]

A friend of mine in Europe just got one of these and will be trying it out in Formula One this season. He already likes it 100x's better than the HANS, since it doesn't anchor to any part of the boat and the parts held against the body are all soft.
http://www.hutchensdevice.com/dcelharness/images/2003-Knoxville-016.jpg

[Terminal Velocity]

Excellent another choice for the people to decide on. My only concern would be having something to the chin in case you went in belly first and backwards that way the water catching the chin can't roll the helmet backwards.

[Miss BK]

I talked to the guy at Safety Solutions about the D-Cel, and I asked about the missing chin strap. He told me the D-CEL's 4 rear connections are engineered to quickly alternate the load from all directions of impact, and this early action will ultimately reduce neck tension by 70%.
Also, many people assume the term "bucketing" means the helmet filling with water as it enters the water. That isn't quite true. Actually, the term is from the gravitational force that is similar to swinging a bucket of water in an arc over your head -- If done fast enough, the water does not spill out and instead pulls away in the opposite direction. It wants to pull away from you. The faster you swing the bucket, the heavier it becomes and the greater the force.
The danger of being ejected from a fast moving boat is the same: a body being catapulted at high speed acts like an arm swinging a bucket of water. Because of the G-forces, the head/helmet begins to weigh more and more and is pulling away from the shoulders.
The neck bones are trying to hold together against the force -- and all it takes is for this heavy "bucketing" helmet to touch the surface of the water to push the neck beyond its limit. The brain stem suffers the brunt of this limit.
So any device that can keep the neck bones from stretching too far will be a benefit from the dangers of bucketing. Neck collars and donuts have little use in preventing "bucketing".
There's quite a bit of info and test data about the D-CEL on the website.
http://www.hutchensdevice.com/news/Head_Neck_Restraint.html
Here is some of that data, copy and pasted:
Because the point of highest neck tension happens early in the event, as the head is being redirected by the neck, it is important that the head and neck restraint be adjusted to start taking load away from the head and neck as soon as possible in the event. As with any restraint system, a head and neck restraint works better when it is allowed to start restraining the head early in the event. With strap harnesses, this is no different.
Strap harnesses have been shown in sled testing to reduce neck tension in frontal and angular frontal impacts. Since they do not rely on the seat belts to provide the restraint, like current carbon devices, they will not become dislodged or loosen during an impact. In fact, the harness devices have never failed during a sled test.
Other devices, the HANS and SRS-1, have come loose from the seat belts during a single impact in a laboratory environment. In the real world, the set-up in your race car may be nothing like the ideal conditions in the sled lab, which can increase the chances of the restraints to fail in use. Reports of injuries during various impact situations while using current carbon devices date back to the early 90's