TOO Much Horsepower??

[mcdirt]

I just got nailed by Johnny Law in Idaho and the citation reads "overpowering"! I have a 78' Tahiti jetboat with a Big Block Ford 514. My boat passes safety inspections (I've had several), I pass decible levels (tested me 4 times tonight and I passed all of them); my boat is safe! The citing officer says my manufacture's placard must state the maximum appropriate horsepower for the hull. As mine doesn't (the cop say's I must have cut it out), (and I haven't), then I'm only allowed 600hp as that is the occupancy weight limitation stamped on the placard. Is this for real? Any help would be appreaciated.
Thanks
Dan

[wsuwrhr]

The motor makes 250 horsepower, looks like a 460 to me. He got a dyno sheet to prove otherwise?
Look in any 70's pickup truck pal.
Brian

[wsuwrhr]

My Anthony doesn't have a placard, at least not when I bought it.
My Hondo does though, I don't know what the rated weight or horsepower is.
Brian

[coolchange]

Bwaaahahahaha, the cops in Idaho carry dyno's?
You're allowed 600 hp??!!
There is a Coast Guard rule/formula for hp based on the area of the transom. Don't know if it applies to the law in Idaho. Fight it and make him prove that the 429 truck motor in your boat has more than the 1970 rated 280 hp.

[coolchange]

WSUWRHR, great minds.....

[SK48]

May I ask where in Idaho did this happen ?

[mcdirt]

McCall

[Boatcop]

The Coast Guard formula and Federal Standards for safe powering apply only to Outboard powered boats, less than 20 feet in length.
The certification lable is also only required on outboards less than 20'. Some boat manufacturers will put them on inboards (and outboards) over 20'feet, but only as a liabilty precaution, not because the law (any law) requires it.
The Idaho Officer wasn't paying attention in his Boating Law class.
Here's the Federal Law:
TITLE 33--NAVIGATION AND NAVIGABLE WATERS
CHAPTER I--COAST GUARD, DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY (CONTINUED)
PART 183_BOATS AND ASSOCIATED EQUIPMENT--Table of Contents
Subpart D_Safe Powering
Sec. 183.51 Applicability.
This subpart applies to monohull boats less than 20 feet in length,
except sailboats, canoes, kayaks, and inflatable boats, that are
designed or intended to use one or more outboard motors for propulsion.
And Idaho Law:
TITLE 67
STATE GOVERNMENT AND STATE AFFAIRS
CHAPTER 70
IDAHO SAFE BOATING ACT
67-7007. CERTIFICATION LABEL -- CONTENTS. The certification label shall
contain the following information in letters no less than one-eighth (1/8)
inch in height and the information letters shall contrast with the basic color
of the label and identify:
(1) The name and address (city and state) of the manufacturer. If the
vessel is manufactured outside the United States, the importer shall be
considered the statutory manufacturer, and his name and U.S. address shall
appear on the label; or, if the vessel is to be sold at retail by a private
label merchandiser, then his name and address may appear on the label.
(2) A statement that:
(a) "This Boat (or Vessel) Complies With U.S. Coast Guard Safety
Standards in Effect on (month and year of certification)" or;
(b) "This Boat (or Vessel) Complies With U.S. Coast Guard Safety
Standards in Effect on the Date of Certification" and;
(c) If the vessel displays a stability warning label as required by
federal law the certification label shall also show the words, "This Boat
Complies With U.S. Coast Guard Safety Standards, Except Load Capacity, in Effect on the Date of Certification" (or the actual date of such certification).
(3) The display of the certification and the capacity information
required by this chapter may be combined on one (1) label provided the two (2)information displays are separated by a prominent line or border and the
capacity information is the most prominent by virtue of larger type face,
bolder type face or contrasting color background.
(4) The information relating to capacity required by this chapter shall
be determined by any of the methods and formulas used, recommended or
recognized by the U.S. Coast Guard or any agencies successor thereto.
and:
TITLE 67
STATE GOVERNMENT AND STATE AFFAIRS
CHAPTER 70
IDAHO SAFE BOATING ACT
67-7006. CAPACITY PLATE -- CONTENTS. A capacity plate shall bear the
following information permanently marked thereon:
(1) For all vessels designed for or represented by the manufacturer as
being suitable for use with outboard motor:
(a) The total weight of person, motor, gear, and other articles placed
aboard which the vessel is safely capable of carrying under normal
conditions.
(b) The recommended number of persons commensurate with the weight
capacity of the vessel and the presumed weight in pounds of each person.
In no instance shall such presumed weight per person be less than one
hundred fifty (150) pounds.
(c) Clear notice that the information appearing on the capacity plate is
applicable under normal conditions and that the weight of the outboard
motor and associated equipment is considered to be part of total weight
capacity.
(d) The maximum horsepower of the motor the vessel is designed or
intended to accommodate.
(2) For all other vessels to which this chapter applies:
(a) The total weight of persons, gear and other articles placed aboard
which the vessel is safely capable of carrying under normal conditions.
(b) The recommended number of persons commensurate with the weight
capacity of the vessel and the presumed weight in pounds of each such
person. In no instance shall such presumed weight per person be less than
one hundred fifty (150) pounds.
(c) Clear notice that the information appearing on the capacity plate is
applicable under normal conditions.
and
TITLE 67
STATE GOVERNMENT AND STATE AFFAIRS
CHAPTER 70
IDAHO SAFE BOATING ACT
67-7005. CAPACITY PLATE AND CERTIFICATION. All vessels, except seaplanes, constructed after November 1, 1972, and manufactured in or used on the waters of this state and under twenty (20) feet in length, except sailboats, canoes,kayaks and inflatable boats, shall have a certification and capacity plate permanently affixed to the vessel at a location so as to be clearly visible and legible from the position designed or normally intended to be occupied by the operator of the vessel when it is underway in the water.
Note the parts I highlighted in BOLD!
Armed with this information, go to that Officer's Supervisor, and demand that the citation be dismissed by the Officer, and that he or she be retrained in their job.
If they refuse, contest the citation in court and make a fools out of that particular Officer and their Department.

[mcdirt]

Thank You BoatCop!!! I really appreciate your help in this matter.

[tahitijet]

how would he have any clue it wasn't a 460? and know you had 600HP?
BTW I also have a 78 tahiti but with a 700hp 540 chevy

[wsuwrhr]

how would he have any clue it wasn't a 460? and know you had 600HP?
BTW I also have a 78 tahiti but with a 700hp 540 chevy
Yep.
Brian

[wsuwrhr]

Fight it and make him prove that the 429 truck motor in your boat has more than the 1970 rated 280 hp.
If I knew anything about Fords, I would have used the smaller displacement number. I didn't know what other motor resembles the 460.
Brian
My Valiant came with a 273 V8, however a 360 looks identical....

[wsuwrhr]

WSUWRHR, great minds.....
Yes sir

[wsuwrhr]

The Coast Guard formula and Federal Standards for safe powering apply only to Outboard powered boats, less than 20 feet in length.
The certification lable is also only required on outboards less than 20'. Some boat manufacturers will put them on inboards (and outboards) over 20'feet, but only as a liabilty precaution, not because the law (any law) requires it.
The Idaho Officer wasn't paying attention in his Boating Law class.
Maybe he thought it was an outboard?
You guys know how those Fords run.... ;) :sleeping:
Brian

[Ultrafied]

Dang ..... you are good Alan!!!!! :)

[98 Vector 21]

Sounds like you need to find a differant lake....

[Jrocket]

Hats off to ya Boatcop!

[TwinMach26DCB]

The answer from Boatcop is precisely why I read these boards.... Nice answer -- I certainly wouldn't argue with him..
Fight it --- for all of us...

[Bluefin]

Dan,
First and foremost let me say that I think your boat is one of the nicest I have seen in Idaho. We met a month or so ago on the lake, I had the blown blue Howard. I was watching you from Jesicas on the deck while having dinner on a friday night. You had my attention through out dinner as well as most of the other people dining. As I overheard comments from the other people outside, it was clear that I was the only person enjoying your boat (Especially when you hit the Nitrous). I guess my point is, no matter how legal you are, in McCall the tourists & locals don't want to have boats like ours on the lake. There are too many people with influence on the city officials that see us as a nuisance and complain. The squeeky wheel gets the grease. So as long as you are doing speed runs right in town and pissing off the town folk, you (and when I'm on the water) are going to get tickets.
Again, don't get me wrong but you are going to have to "Cool Your Jets" a little or everytime WE hit the water Johny Law is going to be bugging us.
I will be moving to McCall on Oct. 1 for work, bringing the Howard, 2 dirt bikes and 4 sleds, we will have to get together. For now, come down to Boise and we can go to Lucky Peak and tear it up. The law is very easy to work with down here. Let me know how things are going. Thx Mike
mikeconner@cobsbend.com