Cam brg question...

[steelcomp]

How many times can you re use cam bearings? I know what some of you will say...as cheap as they are why re use?? Granted, but the ones in the motor have little time, just want to knock them out to clean the block. They've already been in and out, and back in once. I'm wondering about losing the press fit with another go-round.
Thanks. :D

[Fiat48]

Never reuse a cam bearing. The crush is gone.
Keep an old set of cam bearings for mock up. When everything all fitted..drive em out..clean the block and install new.

[steelcomp]

Gotcha. Kinda thought so. (Don't tell that to the ones in my motor now!!) :rolleyes:

[Fiat48]

We have reused them at the races to make a couple laps and finish the race. But they "just don't feel right" when you put them in a second time. $20 a set..not worth it.

[steelcomp]

We have reused them at the races to make a couple laps and finish the race. But they "just don't feel right" when you put them in a second time. $20 a set..not worth it.
Wow. Under what circumstances would you remove and reinstall cam brgs at a race?? :confused:
BTW...I agree with you 100%. Thanks.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Here's a question for ya on this. What sort of wear have you guys seen on cam bearings. I didn't bother to get my old ones from my machine shop on my 454 so I have no idea what wear they had, I just replaced them after 300+ hours. My lower end bearings were worn out (GM A400's)
I do agree, just replace them, cheap insurance.

[steelcomp]

Never seen cam brg wear as a problem. They get a little shiney on the bottom, but never seen them "wear out". I've seen oem stuff with 100K+ and the cam brgs were still lookin good. I know too tight a chain can wear them out, and I always try to orient the oil holes accordingly. I know on some you don't have a choice, but if possible, it helps.
I'm sure there are others who have seen wear issues with race motors. Maybe super high spring pressures, continued high rpm, etc. can cause problems like with any other bearing. Improperly assembled gear drives, another possibility, I imagine. I did have to hand scrape a BB Chev's cam brgs once to get the cam to go in and turn. That motor is still running in my buddy's Mandella, going on 5 yrs. Big Comp solid, motor turns 6700-6800, about 670hp.

[Fiat48]

Wow. Under what circumstances would you remove and reinstall cam brgs at a race?? :confused:
BTW...I agree with you 100%. Thanks.
Like when I was at a pretty good paying race and we broke the camshaft (broke right off at the distributor gear)...freak deal... during qualifying. Took the motor apart and drove the cam bearings out to get any junk hiding in there and then put it back together to run the race. All night type deal. What we used to call "fun".

[Fiat48]

Never seen cam brg wear as a problem. They get a little shiney on the bottom, but never seen them "wear out". I've seen oem stuff with 100K+ and the cam brgs were still lookin good. I know too tight a chain can wear them out, and I always try to orient the oil holes accordingly. I know on some you don't have a choice, but if possible, it helps.
I'm sure there are others who have seen wear issues with race motors. Maybe super high spring pressures, continued high rpm, etc. can cause problems like with any other bearing. Improperly assembled gear drives, another possibility, I imagine. I did have to hand scrape a BB Chev's cam brgs once to get the cam to go in and turn. That motor is still running in my buddy's Mandella, going on 5 yrs. Big Comp solid, motor turns 6700-6800, about 670hp.
Exact reason why you mock up with an old set of cam bearings. There are some BBC blocks that you have to "clearance" the cam bearings...because the cam holes are either not straight or on the small side. Only seen it a couple times over many years.

[steelcomp]

Exact reason why you mock up with an old set of cam bearings. There are some BBC blocks that you have to "clearance" the cam bearings...because the cam holes are either not straight or on the small side. Only seen it a couple times over many years.
Yeah, the one I had to do was really tight. Had to drive it in harder than I liked, but it went. I new it would be a tight fit, and it was. Cam wouldn't even go in. Last brg, back of block. I learned what it was to hand scrape a bearing, like they did in the old days!! :D

[steelcomp]

Like when I was at a pretty good paying race and we broke the camshaft (broke right off at the distributor gear)...freak deal... during qualifying. Took the motor apart and drove the cam bearings out to get any junk hiding in there and then put it back together to run the race. All night type deal. What we used to call "fun".
Yeah...fun!! :notam: Been there, done that, although I can say we never broke a cam. At least not one I didn't throw on the ground. :rolleyes:

[blowngas]

Who thinks which cam bearings are the best???----Durabond race??----Clevites???-----I usually use durabonds on chevy builds but had to go with clevite set on Rodeck block as all cam bearings are same size in it----had to get in touch with rep to find out part #----not sure if I can get same set in Durabond--------anyhow, just curious

[Fiat48]

To me..cam bearings that fit the hole. Durabond..clevite...whoever. Just not a big item in my opinion. But I see they make "race" cam bearings. Oh well.
Yeah..Dart is playing that cam bearing game also. 2 different numbers int he set. You have to buy like 3 sets of cam bearings to get a set out of it. Or buy the "race special" bearings from Dart for $$$. Don't know of any number for an actual set for a Rodeck.

[Floored]

Wore the cam bearings in a 427 top oiler ford. The cam had grooved journals and with big cam and spring it wore into the bearing enough we had to beat the cam out of the engine at each bearing it passed through. Ah yes the fun we used to have.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Sealed Power's are in my 454 (Clevite 77's in my bottom end).

[DeputyDawg]

Damn steel, I can front ya a set of cam bearings man! Just messin' with ya.

[steelcomp]

Damn steel, I can front ya a set of cam bearings man! Just messin' with ya.
Man, I'm scrapin the bottom, here! Everywhere I turn around, it's another $250 here, $500 there. But I'm gettin close. Ordered push rods today, spent the weekend mocking up everything. It all looks good now. I'll get the heads assembled this week, get the block honed and cleaned, and hopefully be able to put the short block together this weekend, and maybe get the heads on.
I think I got a set of cam bearings somewhere. :D :D

[DeputyDawg]

I will be coming to the west coast with a couple of days to kill this week and I would be more than happy to spin some wrenches and lend a hand if needed. I follow instructions real well..LOL. What push rods are you running? I am a Manton fan myself.

[steelcomp]

I will be coming to the west coast with a couple of days to kill this week and I would be more than happy to spin some wrenches and lend a hand if needed. I follow instructions real well..LOL. What push rods are you running? I am a Manton fan myself.
Mantons are good push rods, and I used them when I built a few FE motors, but for my BBC deal I went with the Manley Pro series one-piece. I built hundreds of press tip push rods when I was at Dart, and I know how much they can vary, so I try and stay clear of them. Nothing worse than having a push rod come apart!
If you're in the area, glad to have you come by. PM when you know more.

[blowngas]

mantons sure are pricy!!!----I really like the manley pros

[wsuwrhr]

All night type deal. What we used to call "fun".
Yea no shit,
I wouldn't think of an all nighter trying to get something going.
Brian

[Fiat48]

Yea no shit,
I wouldn't think of an all nighter trying to get something going.
Brian
How bout splitting a cylinder In Phoenix Az, taking the motor apart in a Safeway parking lot and carrying the block across the street to Johnny Lopers machine shop (old fuel racer) who then tells you how nuts you are to try to pull something like this off......he sleeves the block at 2:00 a.m. and then HE buys pizza and comes across the street and instructs the wives how to wipe all the parts down with toilet paper to have them ready for you to install!
LOL! :D

[dave186]

i had to have the cam bearings clearanced in my BBF, i dont know why and the machinest couldnt tell me why either.

[SUI-CY-COLE DIMARCO]

smith bros,,or jesel for push rods..never had a failure from running.

[Snowboat]

Rather than hand scrape a tight cam bearing, I learned another way. Take an old cam and put some one inch chisel marks in it, marks going lengthwise, insert and turn. Works like a bit reamer.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

How bout splitting a cylinder In Phoenix Az, taking the motor apart in a Safeway parking lot and carrying the block across the street to Johnny Lopers machine shop (old fuel racer) who then tells you how nuts you are to try to pull something like this off......he sleeves the block at 2:00 a.m. and then HE buys pizza and comes across the street and instructs the wives how to wipe all the parts down with toilet paper to have them ready for you to install!
LOL! :D
Now THAT sounds like fun! :D :D :D :D :D

[steelcomp]

Now THAT sounds like fun! :D :D :D :D :D
I remember in my street racing days, we'd go out "trolling" early in the evening, and loose a few. Then we'd go to my shop, and change cam, intake, carb, and gears, and go back out and stomp some shiot! :umm: Take about an hour or so. That was fun. too. :D

[GofastRacer]

How many times can you re use cam bearings? I know what some of you will say...as cheap as they are why re use?? Granted, but the ones in the motor have little time, just want to knock them out to clean the block. They've already been in and out, and back in once. I'm wondering about losing the press fit with another go-round.
Thanks. :D
Well I'm not one for reusing them but I have done it(time factor), I go by the way they feel going back in. I been using Dura-Bond for ages and it seems to me they are the best, the ones I've put back went back in just about as tight as they came out of the box and never had a problem!..

[GofastRacer]

I remember in my street racing days, we'd go out "trolling" early in the evening, and loose a few. Then we'd go to my shop, and change cam, intake, carb, and gears, and go back out and stomp some shiot! :umm: Take about an hour or so. That was fun. too. :D
I can relate to that, LOL... :D :D

[blowngas]

Did anyone of you ever run any of the needle roller cam bearings----Crower used to advertise them as the big deal in fuel motors back when!!!!-----I haven't heard of them in a long while-----have the tool to install them, but never used them

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Likely turned out to be just a waste of complexity with no material gains.
Long ago, Chevrolet built one of a kind, a (small block I believe) with complete ball bearing movements to see just how much was lost on iol-film bearing friction. Built 2 identical engines with that one difference, crank, rods, cam, the whole lower end roller ball bearinged.
The result ...... NO DIFFERENCE. No reduced friction from the oil bath film babbit bearings. (well, there was a difference, the roller-bearing motor was a bunch heavier and harder to produce/expensive)

[SmokinLowriderSS]

I'll be darned. They are still arround. Looks like a longgevity at hard running item. Here's a recent magazine article.
http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/69618/
Requires a lot of block machining and a specially made cam but for insanely-high valve spring pressures, looks like the only train in town.

[steelcomp]

I'm pretty sure it's the only way one of the Ford Motorsport Big Blocks comes....with roller cam bearings.

[blowngas]

was supprised to see that the installation tool was still a "drive'em in" deal----the set I got was a long screw that "pulled" the bearing in smoothly----oh well, whatever works!!!-------sounds like they are still being used for "all out" motors