the Jewish lady

[bigq]

http://www2.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/107Soilder.JPG
Bad day to be an Israeli soilder. They are about to evict this settlement where she lives. :frown: :frown:

[Blown 472]

boo fricking hoo, the land she stole and built an illegal home on?? cry me a river.
You forgot to mention the 140,000.00 to 400,000.00 that these thieves were compensated, how you ask???? your tax dollars.

[bigq]

You mean the land they took after Egypt, Syria and Jordan announce intentions to destroy Israel that led to the six day war? What would you do iif you were put in that position?
What about the 1.8 billion a year tax dollars going to the Palestinians, or not because the leaders steal it all. That must be ok because they arn't Jews.
the picture was only about two individuals, I wasn't trying to state a right or wrong. The compensation wouldn't change the fact that I was being forced out of my home for political reasons. This lady made a life there and money isn't going to change that, but ok boo-hoo, those damn Jews. :rolleyes:

[Jeanyus]

boo fricking hoo, the land she stole and built an illegal home on?? cry me a river.
You forgot to mention the 140,000.00 to 400,000.00 that these thieves were compensated, how you ask???? your tax dollars.
If you go back a little farther in your history book, you will see that this so called "Stolen Land" belonged to the Jews at one time.
I say to the victor goes the spoils of war. I 1967 Isreal was surrounded by 465,000 soldiers, From Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, and Egypt. The Arabs had 2,800 tanks, and 800 aircraft. A naval blockade was set up, nothing was getting through to Isreal. "The dessert sands will be soaked with Isreali blood" the Arabs said.
Six days later the Arabs were begging for mercy, thier warplanes were gone, (Egypt lost 300 planes in 1 day, they were taking a break to pray, while Isreal destroyed their planes on the ground) The tanks were destroyed, by some brilliant Isreali tank commanders. And the Arab army was in full retreat.
Of course guys like blown are going to say that Isreal won, because they had American weapons.
Sorry the Arabs had the latest in Russian military equipment.
So why are we making Isreal give back the land that they took from people, who had vowed to destroy them.
That would be like making Blown give his house to a Native American family.
Hey blown sorry to ruin your world with facts.

[wsuwrhr]

boo fricking hoo, the land she stole and built an illegal home on?? cry me a river.
You forgot to mention the 140,000.00 to 400,000.00 that these thieves were compensated, how you ask???? your tax dollars.
Blown,
Im not on either side, but it looks like a young woman to me. I doubt she had anything to do with it.
I think it just sucks to be on either side.
Brian

[058]

Gaza is just the first step to drive the Jews into the sea. They will not be appeased with just a small strip of land because this whole thing isn't about land, its about getting rid of all the Jews by whatever means possible including murdering them in their streets. The Arabs can not beat them with war as they have been handed their collective asses many many times over the years so they resort to other means such as child suicide bombers, killing innocent women and children, blowing up busses and trains...real f uckin' heros :mad:

[SmokinLowriderSS]

boo fricking hoo, the land she stole and built an illegal home on?? cry me a river.
You forgot to mention the 140,000.00 to 400,000.00 that these thieves were compensated, how you ask???? your tax dollars.
Man, I was going to have to pull out another history lesson for Blown, but bigq beat me to it. :cool: You REALLY must quit reading the newly revised, "politically corrected" history books Blown, they LIE. History CANNOT be "revised" to suit opinion, it is a collection of facts.
1966, after 20 years of Arab threatening to push the Israelis into the sea, AND Soviet union backing of them, the israelis pounced on the "poor helpless Arabs", and beat them soundly, ALONE, without US help, in the same time it took the lord to create heaven & earth (if you believe it as such). :cool:
Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Done, put a fork in 'em.
The Arabs LOST IN ARMED COMBAT :
The Gaza Strip
The Golan Heights
The Sianai Penensula
The West Bank of the Jordan River.
They lost the East bank too but we made them return that at the time.
The Israelis proceeded to do the same thing the Soviets did after the 2nd world war in Europe (W Ger, Yugoslavia, Poland), they turned these areas into buffers for protection.
True to form tho, Blown not only hates the US and ignores the reality of things his politics disagree with, he hates all the successfull people worldwide too. One cannot argue the FACT that the Israelis have been a successfull people in their endeavors, survival and growth. :cool:
Ya ever wonder, since the Israelis have made the desert flower through hard work, what the Arabs could have done if it were not for 60 years of nothing but hatred to work on??? Talk about wasted effort. :yuk:
Anyway, yes, is a rough situation. I'd hate to be one of the troopers having to do it, but again, LIKE SO MANY TIMES BEFORE, Israel makes a 1-sided overture to peace, to make friends with their enemies. The only questionmark is exactly WHAT will the Arabs do in response? Will they meet them half-way, or, will 058 be proven correct? Unfortunately, I tend to follow 058's opinion. :frown:

[SmokinLowriderSS]

The real fools in the whole mess are the "palestinians", who really should be called "Trans-Jordanians" because there has never been a Country of "Palestine". There WAS an area (where Israel and Jordan sits) that was Trans-Jordan, created in 1921 by the League of nations but was officially ruled over by England. It became a full-fledged self-runing Kingdom in 1946
1948, Israel was formed, the jews who ALREADY LIVED THERE were happy, the arabs WHO ALREADY LIVED THERE got pissed. The Arabs refused citizenship and LEFT, on their own. The Egyptians didn't want them, neither did the Syrians OR the Jordanians, or the Iraqis, or the Lebanese. The Trans-Jordanian Arabs rejected a country they could have belonged too (which has been a successful country) and were in turn spat upon and rejected by their bretheren as undesirables.
Somehow, folks like Blown blame the Israelis...........................

[Steve 1]

Israel Is The Victim And The Arabs Are The Indefensible Aggressors In the Middle East
By David Horowitz
FrontPageMagazine.com | January 9, 2002
1. The Jewish Problem and Its "Solution"
ZIONISM is a national liberation movement, identical in most ways to other liberation movements that leftists and progressives the world over -- and in virtually every case but this one -- fervently support. This exceptionalism is also visible at the reverse end of the political spectrum: In every other instance, right-wingers like Patrick Buchanan oppose national liberation movements that are under the spell of Marxist delusions and committed to violent means. But they make an exception for the one that Palestinians have aimed at the Jews. The unique opposition to a Jewish homeland at both ends of the political spectrum identifies the problem that Zionism was created to solve.
The "Jewish problem" is just another name for the fact that Jews are the most universally hated and persecuted ethnic group in history. The Zionist founders believed that hatred of Jews was a direct consequence of their stateless condition. As long as Jews were aliens in every society they found themselves in, they would always be seen as interlopers, their loyalties would be suspect and persecution would follow. This was what happened to Captain Alfred Dreyfus, whom French anti-Semites falsely accused of spying and who was put on trial for treason by the French government in the 19th Century. Theodore Herzl was an assimilated, westernized Jew, who witnessed the Dreyfus frame-up in Paris and went on to lead the Zionist movement.
Herzl and other Zionist founders believed that if Jews had a nation of their own, the very fact would "normalize" their condition in the community of nations. Jews had been without a state since the beginning of the diaspora, when the Romans expelled them from Judea on the west bank of the Jordan River, some 2,000 years before. Once the Jews obtained a homeland – Judea itself seemed a logical site — and were again like other peoples, the Zionists believed anti-Semitism would wither on its poisonous vine and the Jewish problem would disappear.
Here is what happened instead.

[Steve 1]

2. The Beginnings
In the 1920s, among their final acts as victors in World War I, the British and French created the states that now define the Middle East out of the ashes of the empire of their defeated Turkish adversary. In a region that the Ottoman Turks had controlled for hundreds of years, Britain and France drew the boundaries of the new states, Syria Lebanon and Iraq. Previously, the British had promised the Jewish Zionists that they could establish a "national home" in a portion of what remained of the area, which was known as the Palestine Mandate. But in 1921 the British separated 80 percent of the Mandate, east of the Jordan, and created the Arab kingdom of "Transjordan." It was created for the Arabian monarch King Abdullah, who had been defeated in tribal warfare in the Arabian Peninsula and lacked a seat of power. Abudllah’s tribe was Hashemite, while the vast majority of Abdullah’s subjects were Palestinian Arabs.
What was left of the original Palestine Mandate – between the west bank of the Jordan and the Mediterranean Sea – had been settled by Arabs and Jews. Jews, in fact, had lived in the area continuously for 3,700 years, even after the Romans destroyed their state in Judea in AD 70. Arabs became the dominant local population for the first time in the 7th Century AD as a result of the Muslim invasions. The Arabs were largely nomads who had no distinctive language or culture to separate them from other Arabs. In all the time since, they had made no attempt to create an independent Palestinian state west or east of the Jordan and none was ever established.
In 1948, at the request of the Jews who were living in Palestine, the United Nations voted to partition the remaining quarter of the original Mandate to make a Jewish homeland possible. Under the partition plan, the Arabs were given the Jews’ ancient home in Judea and Samaria – now known as the West Bank. The Jews were allotted three slivers of disconnected land along the Mediterranean and the Sinai desert. They were also given access to their holy city of Jerusalem, but as an island cut off from the slivers, surrounded by Arab land and under international control. Sixty percent of the land allotted to the Jews was the Negev desert. Out of these unpromising parts, the Jews created a new state, Israel, in 1948. At this time, the idea of a Palestinian nation, or a movement to create one did not even exist.
At the moment of Israel’s birth, Palestinian Arabs lived on roughly 90 percent of the original Palestine Mandate – in Transjordan and in the UN partition area, but also in the new state of Israel itself. There were 800,000 Arabs living in Israel alongside 1.2 million Jews. At the same time, Jews were legally barred from settling in the 35,000 square miles of Palestinian Transjordan, which eventually was renamed simply "Jordan."
The Arab population in the slivers called Israel had actually more than tripled since the Zionists first began settling the region in significant numbers in the 1880s.The reason for this increase was that the Jewish settlers had brought industrial and agricultural development with them, which attracted Arab immigrants to what had previously been a sparsely settled and economically destitute area.
If the Palestinian Arabs had been willing to accept this arrangement in which they received 90 percent of the land in the Palestine Mandate, and under which they benefited from the industry, enterprise and political democracy the Jews brought to the region, there would have been no Middle East conflict. But this was not to be.
Instead, the Arab League – representing five neighboring Arab states – declared war on Israel on the day of its creation, and five Arab armies invaded the slivers with the aim of destroying the infant Jewish state.During the fighting, according to the UN mediator on the scene, an estimated 472,000 Arabs fled their homes to escape the dangers. They planned on returning after an Arab victory and the destruction of the Jewish state.
But the Jews -- many of them recent Holocaust survivors -- refused to be defeated. Instead, the five Arab armies that had invaded their slivers were repelled. Yet there was no peace. Even though their armies were beaten, the Arab states were determined to carry on their campaign of destruction, and to remain formally at war with the Israeli state. After the defeat of the Arab armies, the Palestinians who lived in the Arab area of the UN partition did not attempt to create a state of their own. Instead, in 1950, Jordan annexed the entire West Bank.

[Steve 1]

3. Refugees: Jewish and Arab
As a result of the annexation and the continuing state of war, the Arab refugees who had fled the Israeli slivers did not return. There was a refugee flow into Israel, but it was a flow of Jews who had been expelled from the Arab countries. All over the Middle East, Jews were forced to leave lands they had lived on for centuries. Although Israel was a tiny geographical area and a fledgling state, its government welcomed and resettled 600,000 Jewish refugees from the Arab countries.
At the same time, the Jews resumed their work of creating a new nation in what was now a single sliver of land. Israel, had annexed a small amount of territory to make their state defensible, including a land bridge that included Jerusalem.
In the years that followed, the Israelis made their desert bloom. They built the only industrialized economy in the entire Middle East. They built the only liberal democracy in the Middle East. They treated the Arabs who remained in Israel well. To this day the very large Arab minority, which lives inside the state of Israel, has more rights and privileges than any other Arab population in the entire Middle East.
This is especially true of the Arabs living under Yasser Arafat’s corrupt dictatorship, the Palestine Authority, which today administers the West Bank and the Gaza strip, and whose Arab subjects have no human rights. In 1997, in a fit of pique against the Oslo Accords, Palestinian spokesman Edward Said himself blurted this out, calling Arafat "our Papa Doc" – after the sadistic dictator of Haiti – and complaining that there was "a total absence of law or the rule of law in the Palestinian autonomy areas."
The present Middle East conflict is said to be about the "occupied territories" – the West Bank of the Jordan and the Gaza strip – and about Israel’s refusal to "give them up." But during the first twenty years of the Arab-Israeli conflict, Israel did not control the West Bank. In 1950, when Jordan annexed the West Bank, there was no Arab outrage. Nor did the Middle East conflict with the Jews subside.
The reason there was no Arab outrage over the annexation of the West Bank was because Jordan is a state whose ethnic majority is Palestinian Arabs. On the other hand, the Palestinians of Jordan are disenfranchised by the ruling Hashemite minority. Despite this fact, in the years following the annexation the Palestinians displayed no interest in achieving "self-determination" in Hashemite Jordan. It is only the presence of Jews, apparently, that incites this claim. The idea that the current conflict is about "occupied territories" is only one of the many large Arab deceits -- now widely accepted -- that have distorted the history of the Middle East wars.

[Steve 1]

4. The Arab Wars Against Israel
In 1967, Egypt, Syria and Jordan attacked Israel for a second time and were again defeated. It was in repelling these aggressors that Israel came to control the West Bank and the Gaza strip, as well as the oil-rich Sinai desert. Israel had every right to annex these territories captured from the aggressors – a time honored ritual among nations, and in fact the precise way that Syria, Lebanon, Iraq and Jordan had come into existence themselves. But Israel did not do so. On the other hand, neither did it withdraw its armies or relinquish its control.
The reason was that the Arab aggressors once again refused to make peace. Instead, they declared themselves still at war with Israel, a threat no Israeli government could afford to ignore. By this time, Israel was a country of 2 or 3 million surrounded by declared enemies whose combined populations numbered over 100 million. Geographically Israel was so small that at one point it was less than ten miles across. No responsible Israeli government could relinquish a territorial buffer while its hostile neighbors were still formally at war. This is the reality that frames the Middle East conflict.
In 1973, six years after the second Arab war against the Jews, the Arab armies again attacked Israel. The attack was led by Syria and Egypt, abetted by Iraq, Libya, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and five other countries who gave military support to the aggressors, including an Iraqi division of 18,000 men. Israel again defeated the Arab forces. Afterwards, Egypt – and Egypt alone -- agreed to make a formal peace.
The peace was signed by Egyptian president, Anwar Sadat, who was subsequently assassinated by Islamic radicals, paying for his statesmanship with his life. Sadat is one of three Arab leaders assassinated by other Arabs for making peace with the Jews.
Under the Camp David accords that Sadat signed, Israel returned the entire Sinai with all its oil riches. This act demonstrated once and for all that the solution to the Middle East conflict was ready at hand. It only required the willingness of the Arabs to agree.
The Middle East conflict is not about Israel’s occupation of the territories; it is about the refusal of the Arabs to make peace with Israel, which is an inevitable by-product of their desire to destroy it.

[Steve 1]

5. Self-Determination Is Not The Agenda
The Palestinians and their supporters also claim that the Middle East conflict is about the Palestinians’ yearning for a state and the refusal of Israel to accept their aspiration. This claim is also false. The Palestine Liberation Organization was created in 1964, sixteen years after the establishment of Israel and the first anti-Israel war. The PLO was created at a time the West Bank was not under Israeli control but was part of Jordan. The PLO, however, was not created so that the Palestinians could achieve self-determination in Jordan, which at the time comprised 90 percent of the original Palestine Mandate. The PLO’s express purpose, in the words of its own leaders, was to "push the Jews into the sea."
The official charter of the new Palestine Liberation Organization referred to the "Zionist invasion," declared that Israel’s Jews were "not an independent nationality," described Zionism as "racist" and "fascist," called for "the liquidation of the Zionist presence," and specified, "armed struggle is the only way to liberate Palestine." In short, "liberation" required the destruction of the Jewish state. The PLO was not even created by Palestinians but by the Arab League -- the corrupt dictators who ruled the Middle East and who had attempted to destroy Israel by military force in 1948, in 1967 and again in 1973.
For thirty years, the PLO charter remained unchanged in its call for Israel’s destruction. Then in the mid-1990s, under enormous international pressure following the 1993 Oslo accords, PLO leader Yasser Arafat removed the clause while assuring his followers that its removal was a necessary compromise that did not alter the movement’s goals. He did this explicitly and also by citing a historical precedent in which the Prophet Muhammad insincerely agreed to a peace with his enemies in order to gain time to mass the forces with which he intended to destroy them.

[Steve 1]

The Struggle to Destroy Israel
The Middle East struggle is not about right against right. It is about a fifty-year effort by the Arabs to destroy the Jewish state, and the refusal of the Arab states in general and the Palestinian Arabs in particular to accept Israel’s existence. If the Arabs were willing to do this, there would be no occupied territories and there would be a Palestinian state.
Even during the "Oslo" peace process -- when the Palestine Liberation Organization pretended to recognize the existence of Israel and the Jews therefore allowed the creation of a "Palestine Authority" -- it was clear that the PLO’s goal was Israel’s destruction, and not just because its leader invoked the Prophet Muhammad’s own deception. The Palestinians’ determination to destroy Israel is abundantly clear in their newly created demand of a "right of return" to Israel for "5 million" Arabs. The figure of 5 million refugees who must be returned to Israel is more than ten times the number of Arabs who actually left the Jewish slivers of the British Mandate in 1948.
In addition to its absurdity, this new demand has several aspects that reveal the Palestinians’ genocidal agenda for the Jews. The first is that the "right of return" is itself a calculated mockery of the primary reason for Israel’s existence -- the fact that no country would provide a refuge for Jews fleeing Hitler’s extermination program during World War II. It is only because the world turned its back on the Jews when their survival was at stake that the state of Israel grants a "right of return." to every Jew who asks for it.
But there is no genocidal threat to Arabs, no lack of international support militarily and economically, and no Palestinian "diaspora" (although the Palestinians have cynically appropriated the very term to describe their self-inflicted quandary). The fact that many Arabs, including the Palestinian spiritual leader -- the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem -- supported Hitler’s "Final Solution" only serves to compound the insult. It is even further compounded by the fact that more than 90 percent of the Palestinians now in the West Bank and Gaza have never lived a day of their lives in territorial Israel. The claim of a "right of return" is thus little more than a brazen expression of contempt for the Jews, and for their historic suffering.
More importantly it is an expression of contempt for the very idea of a Jewish state. The incorporation of five million Arabs into Israel would render the Jews a permanent minority in their own country, and would thus spell the end of Israel. The Arabs fully understand this, and that is why they have made it a fundamental demand. It is just one more instance of the general bad faith the Arab side has manifested through every chapter of these tragic events.
Possibly the most glaring expression of the Arabs’ bad faith is their deplorable treatment of the Palestinian refugees and refusal for half a century to relocate them, or to alleviate their condition, even during the years they were under Jordanian rule. While Israel was making the desert bloom and relocating 600,000 Jewish refugees from Arab states, and building a thriving industrial democracy in its allotted sliver, the Arabs were busy making sure that their refugees remained in squalid refugee camps in the West Bank and Gaza, where they were powerless, right-less, and economically destitute.
Today, fifty years after the first Arab war against Israel, there are 59 such refugee camps and 3.7 million "refugees" registered with the UN. Despite economic aid from the UN and Israel itself, despite the oil wealth of the Arab kingdoms, the Arab leaders have refused to undertake the efforts that would liberate the refugees from their miserable camps, or to make the economic investment that would alleviate their condition. There are now 22 Arab states providing homes for the same ethnic population, speaking a common Arabic language. But the only one that will allow Palestinian Arabs to become citizens is Jordan. And the only state the Palestinians covet is Israel.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Why so many people choose to ignore the history, forget the reality of HOW the palistenians got to where they are, and (most importantly) WHICH SIDE CONTINUES TO PUSH THE CONFLICT when peace and prosperity have been available for 57 years. No, it is easier to blame the winner for winning (even when beating looong odds) than to blame the looser for repeated stupidity.
Thanks for the thorough treaste Steve1, quite accurate, and quite revealing to the un-educated.

[Blown 472]

The real fools in the whole mess are the "palestinians", who really should be called "Trans-Jordanians" because there has never been a Country of "Palestine". There WAS an area (where Israel and Jordan sits) that was Trans-Jordan, created in 1921 by the League of nations but was officially ruled over by England. It became a full-fledged self-runing Kingdom in 1946
1948, Israel was formed, the jews who ALREADY LIVED THERE were happy, the arabs WHO ALREADY LIVED THERE got pissed. The Arabs refused citizenship and LEFT, on their own. The Egyptians didn't want them, neither did the Syrians OR the Jordanians, or the Iraqis, or the Lebanese. The Trans-Jordanian Arabs rejected a country they could have belonged too (which has been a successful country) and were in turn spat upon and rejected by their bretheren as undesirables.
Somehow, folks like Blown blame the Israelis...........................
Since we are talking history here perhaps you should google the Balfour agreement then you can talk all you want. And as far as terroists go, while you read that you will see what the israels did to the english to drive them out, oh and don't forget the uss liberty.

[Steve 1]

FYI the USS Liberty was 100 nautical miles OFF Position (Communications screw-up maybe some of your relatives Bent 472)...To make your rant halfway plausible answer why Israel would attack their only ally in the World???
http://www.nsa.gov/liberty/liber00010.pdf Here knock yourself out!!
http://www.arlingtoncemetery.org/historical_information/jews.html

[bigq]

Since we are talking history here perhaps you should google the Balfour agreement then you can talk all you want. And as far as terroists go, while you read that you will see what the israels did to the english to drive them out, oh and don't forget the uss liberty.
The time of the Balfour agreement the area was in British Mandate divided into different eniities. They were never states or countries. One of the areas was called Palestine, but it was never a country. You are right though it was called "Palestine". Both the Jews and Arabs lived there at the same time until the UN did partition off land for the Jews and the Arabs, but it was never called Palestine.
Just as it is to this day the Arabs never accepted the division and went to war with Israel and lost even more land. personally I think Israel is showing quite a bit of faith that the fighting will stop, but just like in the past I doubt it. :frown:

[Blown 472]

FYI the USS Liberty was 100 nautical miles OFF Position (Communications screw-up maybe some of your relatives Bent 472)...To make your rant halfway plausible answer why Israel would attack their only ally in the World???
http://www.nsa.gov/liberty/liber00010.pdf Here knock yourself out!!
http://www.arlingtoncemetery.org/historical_information/jews.html
100 miles off position so you attack them?? strange.

[Blown 472]

Blown....being "solution" oriented as usual. :notam:
I think he may throw up a Ferdinand Marcus reference at any time.
My solution?? cut off all money to them period.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

100 miles off position so you attack them?? strange.
Hmmmm I seem to recall a particular US Armored Personell Carrier that was 4 miles out of position one night back in 1991. Ya know who attached THEM? A US Apache helicopter punched it with a Hellfire. Miracle there were only 4 WOUNDED, somehow nobody in it was killed.
So, by your logic, the US Apache crew had purposely decided a MARKED, US M-113 APC was suddenly their enemy? No, it was NOT WHERE IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE. It was in an area of enemy controll, not US controll. As long as there has been war, there have been errors, mistakes. There WILL BE mistakes as long as there is war. There are fewer of them all the time fortunately.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

My solution?? cut off all money to them period.
Yes............... Of course ................. Stop assisting the SECCOND MOST IMPORTANT SOURCE OF REGIONAL CHANGE AND STABILITY in the entire middle east area.
They USED to be the strongest source (only source) untill the changes hapening now in Iraq makes them less of a threat to middle-east extremism than a humanitarian, democratic, educated Iraq ruled by popularly elected leaders.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Per WRMEA (Washington Report On Middle East Affairs):
Israel's GNP is higher than the combined GNP of Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, the West Bank and Gaza. With a per capita income of about $14,000, Israel ranks as the sixteenth wealthiest country in the world; Israelis enjoy a higher per capita income than oil-rich Saudi Arabia and are only slightly less well-off than most Western European countries.
To think of what the Palistineans keep walking away from............... :hammerhea :hammerhea

[Blown 472]

Yes............... Of course ................. Stop assisting the SECCOND MOST IMPORTANT SOURCE OF REGIONAL CHANGE AND STABILITY in the entire middle east area.
They USED to be the strongest source (only source) untill the changes hapening now in Iraq makes them less of a threat to middle-east extremism than a humanitarian, democratic, educated Iraq ruled by popularly elected leaders.
Stability?? are you high? what do they do to bring stability to the area?? kick people off their land? bulldoze their houses? threaten to attack other countries, wow they sure have you fooled.

[Blown 472]

Per WRMEA (Washington Report On Middle East Affairs):
Israel's GNP is higher than the combined GNP of Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, the West Bank and Gaza. With a per capita income of about $14,000, Israel ranks as the sixteenth wealthiest country in the world; Israelis enjoy a higher per capita income than oil-rich Saudi Arabia and are only slightly less well-off than most Western European countries.
To think of what the Palistineans keep walking away from............... :hammerhea :hammerhea
And we send them millions of dollars every year why??? :confused: :confused:
Some quotes for you:
It's not a matter of maintaining the status quo. We have to create a dynamic state, oriented towards expansion.
--Ben Gurion
Ben Gurion | 08.22.05 - 3:55 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A partial Jewish State is not the end, but only the beginning. I am certain that we can not be prevented from settling in the other parts of the country and the region.
--David Ben Gurion, in a letter to his son, 1937
Ben Gurion | 08.22.05 - 3:56 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
... After we become a strong force as the result of the creation of the state, we shall abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine.
--David Ben-Gurion
Ben Gurion | 08.22.05 - 3:57 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't mind if after the job is done you put me in front of a Nuremberg Trial and then jail me for life. Hang me if you want, as a war criminal. What you don't understand is that the dirty work of Zionism is not finished yet, far from it.
--Amos Oz interview with Ariel Sharon, originally published in the Israeli daily Davar on 17 December 1982
Ariel Sharon | 08.22.05 - 3:58 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment... Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly."
--Theodore Herzl, founder of the World Zionist Organization, speaking of the Arabs of Palestine,Complete Diaries, June 12, 1895 entry.
Theodor Herzl | 08.22.05 - 3:59 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism, colonialization or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands."
--Yoram Bar Porath, Yediot Aahronot, of 14 July 1972.
Yoram Bar Porath | 08.22.05 - 4:00 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Everybody has to move, run and grab as many hilltops as they can to enlarge the settlements because everything we take now will stay ours... Everything we don't grab will go to them."
--Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of militants from the extreme right-wing Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, November 15, 1998.
Ariel Sharon | 08.22.05 - 4:00 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahlal arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population."
--Moshe Dayan, address to the Technion, Haifa, reported in Haaretz, April 4, 1969.
Moshe Dayan | 08.22.05 - 4:01 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population."
--Israel Koenig, "The Koenig Memorandum"
Israel Koenig | 08.22.05 - 4:02 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We should prepare to go over to the offensive. Our aim is to smash Lebanon, Trans-Jordan, and Syria. The weak point is Lebanon, for the Moslem regime is artificial and easy for us to undermine. We shall establish a Christian state there, and then we will smash the Arab Legion, eliminate Trans-Jordan; Syria will fall to us. We then bomb and move on and take Port Said, Alexandria and Sinai."
--David Ben-Gurion, May 1948, to the General Staff.
Ben Gurion | 08.22.05 - 4:03 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti - Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault ? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?"
--David Ben-Gurion - Quoted by Nahum Goldmann in Le Paradoxe Juif (The Jewish Paradox), pp121.
Ben Gurion | 08.22.05 - 4:04 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The thesis that the danger of genocide was hanging over us in June 1967 and that Israel was fighting for its physical existence is only bluff, which was born and developed after the war."
--Israeli General Matityahu Peled, Ha'aretz, 19 March 1972.
Matityahu Peled | 08.22.05 - 4:04 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
...The most spectacular event in the contemporary history of Palestine - more spectacular in a sense than the creation of the Jewish state - is the wholesale evacuation of its Arab population which has swept with it also thousands of Arabs from areas threatened and/or occupied by us outside our boundaries.”
--Moshe Shertok-latter Israeli Foreign Min-in a letter to Goldmann, 15 June 1948
Moshe Shertok | 08.22.05 - 4:06 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves…politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves… The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country.”
--Speech by David Ben-Gurion, 1938, quoted in Zionism and the Palestinians by Simha Flapan, 1979
Ben Gurion | 08.22.05 - 4:07 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jutice, you must realise how foolish you look. You're going about complaining of "nationalistic propaganda," and yet you cannot disprove the fact that only 7% of the land was legally bought, or that in time of conquest Israel took over everything but the West Bank and Gaza (that's 78%). And now, if I may add, the Israeli government takes Palestinian land (yes, takes, not buys or anything else) in order to construct (illegal) settlements.
Try to focus on these areas, and try not to look like a fool.
p.s. you should look at this UN map from that period.
Oscar | Homepage | 08.22.05 - 4:08 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Between ourselves it must be clear that there is no room for both people in this country…there is no other way than to transfer the Arabs to the neighboring countries, to transfer all of them; not one village, not one tribe should be left."
--Yosef Weitz of the Jewish National Fund, diary entry, 1940
Yosef Weitz | 08.22.05 - 4:08 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We and they [the Palestinians] want the same thing: we both want Palestine. And that is the fundamental conflict."
--David Ben-Gurion, 1936
Ben Gurion | 08.22.05 - 4:09 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
**when I say "took over," I mean took over land left by the Palestinian owners.
Oscar | Homepage | 08.22.05 - 4:10 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"If this state of affairs continue, then the Zionists will gain mastery over our country, village by vllage, town by town; tomorrow the whole of jerusalem will be sold..".
--Arif Al-Arif in Filastin, 25 Jan 1913
Arif Al-Arif | 08.22.05 - 4:11 pm | #
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is my favorite one.............
"We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population

[SmokinLowriderSS]

I'll be dam'd. Somebody taught blown how to do research before a post.
All the quotes in the world do nothing to alter the FACT THAT the Arabs started the shooting conflict, have pressed the shooting conflict, continued a terror-bombing conflict (they must have realized they can't win a shooting conflict), and REFUSE TO AGREE TO a PEACEFULL END to the pointless and useless waste of life and destruction of their own future.
PS. I have no interest in looking up all the PLO/hamas/King Hussein/Egypyian/Jordanian quotes about erasing Israel and pushing it into the sea. A hundred to one Blown.
Incedentally, all the way untill the 80's, the time-honored practice of ANNEXING CONQUORED TERRITORY was followed by every middle-eastern & african country. To the victor WENT THE SPOILS.

[Blown 472]

I'll be dam'd. Somebody taught blown how to do research before a post.
All the quotes in the world do nothing to alter the FACT THAT the Arabs started the shooting conflict, have pressed the shooting conflict, continued a terror-bombing conflict (they must have realized they can't win a shooting conflict), and REFUSE TO AGREE TO a PEACEFULL END to the pointless and useless waste of life and destruction of their own future.
PS. I have no interest in looking up all the PLO/hamas/King Hussein/Egypyian/Jordanian quotes about erasing Israel and pushing it into the sea. A hundred to one Blown.
Incedentally, all the way untill the 80's, the time-honored practice of ANNEXING CONQUORED TERRITORY was followed by every middle-eastern & african country. To the victor WENT THE SPOILS.
This is sorta like pissing up a rope with you. A country founded in terrorism and you think others started it?? ok well carry on with your rose colored life. :D :D

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Stability?? are you high? what do they do to bring stability to the area?? kick people off their land? bulldoze their houses? threaten to attack other countries, wow they sure have you fooled.
Care to explain to me Blown just WHO (what countries) the Israelis have attacked? Who have they threatened? Who have they bulldozed out and kicked out? A half-million arabs LEFT just durring the 6-day war. Know what, I'd bulldoze THAT area too, and resettle. Nobody was home, the occupants LEFT. The ones that left NEVER RETURNED. So... they must just leave shacks stand for 60 years JUST IN CASE the previous occupants decide to return?
Israel has the ONLY DEMOCRATIC GOVERNMENT IN THE AREA. Israelis have civil rights nobody in the area has from any other government. Israel is an EXAMPLE of what CAN BE. Tell me how many other middle-eastern nations have had leaders replaced by brutalitarians by assasination? How many other nations in the area are run by brutal dictators? How many other nations in the area can boast of the NON-OIL income of the israelis? They have a sucessful INDUSTRIAL economy. They make and sell stuff. The Arabs are set for like another 60 years or so and then are broke-a$$ed again when the oil puddle dries out (and it WILL).
As usual, you have no useful solution to making peace in the mid-east. You just complain about the US supporting Israel and think we should just abandon them to their enemies so their enemies might just succeed in wiping them off of the face of the earth.
Back to the ROOTS OF THIS THREAD ..............................
It is a damn shame that the Israeli Govt is FORCING ISRAELIS OUT OF THEIR HOMES. It is a hard job for the Mil and police to do, I know how distasteful it would be if I had to do it here. It also sucks that the Israel Govt is TRYING AGAIN to attain a peaceful relation with their emenies who hate them for simply BEING, for EXISTING AND IT WILL BE AN EFFORT FOR NAUGHT. The Arabs will continue their war, will continue to loose, and people like you Blown, will continue to place the blame upon Israel.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

This is sorta like pissing up a rope with you. A country founded in terrorism and you think others started it?? ok well carry on with your rose colored life. :D :D
I'ver gotten used to pissing up rope blown, refuting one falacy after another here and elsewhere. Care to explain just how it is you figure ISRAEL is the TERRORIST?
OK. so Israel swore it would wipe out all the Arab nations an hour after it was created in 1948??? Gimme a break Blown. Even YOU can't deny the reality of who started this war in the mid-east, who has continued it, and who has lost it at every turn.
No, wait a minuite, yes, you can deny it. Aren't blinders a wonderful thing? They prevent you from seeing that isn't directly in front of you. And if it is in front, you close your eyes.

[HighRoller]

Blown, I have a 100% guaranteed plan that will bring stability to the area. Let the Palestines and Israelis have it out once and for all. If the Palestines want to pick a fight by bombing women and children, let them reap the rewards of their actions. It would take no longer than a month for the Israeli military to wipe out all the Arafat lovers and bring peace to the region. I say we and all the other countries let the two factions decide this thing on their own instead of interfering. What do you say blowin4yroldboys?

[Blown 472]

I'ver gotten used to pissing up rope blown, refuting one falacy after another here and elsewhere. Care to explain just how it is you figure ISRAEL is the TERRORIST?
OK. so Israel swore it would wipe out all the Arab nations an hour after it was created in 1948??? Gimme a break Blown. Even YOU can't deny the reality of who started this war in the mid-east, who has continued it, and who has lost it at every turn.
No, wait a minuite, yes, you can deny it. Aren't blinders a wonderful thing? They prevent you from seeing that isn't directly in front of you. And if it is in front, you close your eyes.
Lemme see, the israelies blew up a hotel that the english were in, now what would you call that sort of action???
Need more proof, now look for the key word, "terrorism"
http://www.rcgfrfi.easynet.co.uk/marxism/articles/f134-ime.htm

[Blown 472]

Blown, I have a 100% guaranteed plan that will bring stability to the area. Let the Palestines and Israelis have it out once and for all. If the Palestines want to pick a fight by bombing women and children, let them reap the rewards of their actions. It would take no longer than a month for the Israeli military to wipe out all the Arafat lovers and bring peace to the region. I say we and all the other countries let the two factions decide this thing on their own instead of interfering. What do you say blowin4yroldboys?
I pity you simply for the fact you can't debate a point without name calling, now run along and admire your self in the mirror some more.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

As soon as the last line of the first paragraph of Blown's posted hot link ends with:
"It is a racist, colonialsettler state founded by Britain and the USA to safeguard their oil and other economic and military interests in the region. "
I know well that the REST of the article Blown posted is the same. Just another wack-job hack-job. Sure, Israel was set up in 1948 to protect Americas Oil Interests ... 20 years BEFORE oil was ever FOUND there. Oh, yea, some "big oil" company knew it was there, so WE had the UN start up a new country, just to start a 50+ year regional war, to "protect our oil interests".
BS flag run up the pole again amidst a barage of star shells left over from 4July.

[Blown 472]

As soon as the last line of the first paragraph of Blown's posted hot link ends with:
"It is a racist, colonialsettler state founded by Britain and the USA to safeguard their oil and other economic and military interests in the region. "
I know well that the REST of the article Blown posted is the same. Just another wack-job hack-job. Sure, Israel was set up in 1948 to protect Americas Oil Interests ... 20 years BEFORE oil was ever FOUND there. Oh, yea, some "big oil" company knew it was there, so WE had the UN start up a new country, just to start a 50+ year regional war, to "protect our oil interests".
BS flag run up the pole again amidst a barage of star shells left over from 4July.
And britian was in iraq in the 20's why?? you should really read up on your history. :crossx:

[Steve 1]

And britian was in iraq in the 20's why?? you should really read up on your history. :crossx:
Yeah I know they were pumping Oil LOL Look the world’s dumbest laziest man (Your beloved Palestinian) really did not care about that pile of sand and rocks until the hardworking Jews began to grow Oranges the size of basket-balls.
Two cultures one bred towards intelligence for the last 1000 years (one fifth of the Nobel laureates) and the other married their cousins...

[SmokinLowriderSS]

I suppose even the lazy, deceitful, ignorant bastards who can't even unite long enough to win a SMALL war due to their own petty infighting need a champion to carry their cause to the rest of the evil (especially Israel), manipulative, western world, and they have their champion alright, ..... Blown.

[Blown 472]

I suppose even the lazy, deceitful, ignorant bastards who can't even unite long enough to win a SMALL war due to their own petty infighting need a champion to carry their cause to the rest of the evil (especially Israel), manipulative, western world, and they have their champion alright, ..... Blown.
So, you love them why?

[bigq]

Nonetheless, I posted the picture for the humanity of it all. I thought the picture was brilliant and to be honest really moved me, which rarely happens. The sorrow from the lady and the solider just overwhelmed me so I thought I would share. He can’t even look her in the eyes for a second because he knows he would be overcome and break down and the others in the background staring at the ground for the same reason.
Like I said before it wasn’t about the Jews and Arabs, It was about two humans not politics, governments or religion. It’s not easy to separate it for obvious reasons.
:( :(

[bellababe]

I'ver gotten used to pissing up rope blown, refuting one falacy after another here and elsewhere. Care to explain just how it is you figure ISRAEL is the TERRORIST?
OK. so Israel swore it would wipe out all the Arab nations an hour after it was created in 1948??? Gimme a break Blown. Even YOU can't deny the reality of who started this war in the mid-east, who has continued it, and who has lost it at every turn.
No, wait a minuite, yes, you can deny it. Aren't blinders a wonderful thing? They prevent you from seeing that isn't directly in front of you. And if it is in front, you close your eyes.
Reading your insane ranting on these boards really makes me thankful that I live in a BLUE state and don't have to listen to any crazy angry person like you.

[Steve 1]

Reading your insane ranting on these boards really makes me thankful that I live in a BLUE state and don't have to listen to any crazy angry person like you.
So truth is crazy and angry?? But being a communist traitor terrorist lackey enabler is all well and fine!

[bellababe]

So truth is crazy and angry?? But being a communist traitor terrorist lackey enabler is all well and fine!
You are all sooo sad. I really feel sorry for all of you. Don't think I can waste any more time on this ridiculous board. See ya....................

[HM]

You are all sooo sad. I really feel sorry for all of you. Don't think I can waste any more time on this ridiculous board. See ya....................
buh bye. Quiter. :D

[SmokinLowriderSS]

You are all sooo sad. I really feel sorry for all of you. Don't think I can waste any more time on this ridiculous board. See ya....................
I hear the "Democratic Underground" board is friendlier, except for the death threat e-mail they sent a Crawford Texas woman who disagrees with Sheehan's protest. Have a nice day. :cool:

[Blown 472]

You are all sooo sad. I really feel sorry for all of you. Don't think I can waste any more time on this ridiculous board. See ya....................
**** them, speak your mind and who gives a **** what these sheepeople think.

[HM]

baahhhhhh baahhhhh baahhhhhh :D

[ROZ]

Palestinians are the arab world's trailer park trash... Every country in the region has basically evicted(nicely put)them into the area that they now reside and claim. French and Brittan did the same with displaced Jews after the war..
We were all jews once, or don't you remember that Mr. Antisemite472....

[Blown 472]

Palestinians are the arab world's trailer park trash... Every country in the region has basically evicted(nicely put)them into the area that they now reside and claim. French and Brittan did the same with displaced Jews after the war..
We were all jews once, or don't you remember that Mr. Antisemite472....
I was waiting for that to come out, so I question the motives of a people and I am antisemite? that is a lame and played out. What about when the jews killled thousands of their own, what does that make them????

[SmokinLowriderSS]

It's not the fact of you questioning their motives Blown, It's the fact that you accuse the Israelis of being the agressors and of being AT FAULT for the fighting the Arabs continue to press (and loose), despite a long, well documented history to the contrary.
I do agree that the "anti-semite" thing is of dubious value, (and a very "tired" claim made by far too many people (just like "racist" is overused also)) thus the reason I have not said anything of the sort.

[Blown 472]

It's not the fact of you questioning their motives Blown, It's the fact that you accuse the Israelis of being the agressors and of being AT FAULT for the fighting the Arabs continue to press (and loose), despite a long, well documented history to the contrary.
I do agree that the "anti-semite" thing is of dubious value, (and a very "tired" claim made by far too many people (just like "racist" is overused also)) thus the reason I have not said anything of the sort.
You read any of the stuff I posted?? I am not accusing them it is FACT they are agressors and at fault plain and simple.

[ROZ]

I was waiting for that to come out, so I question the motives of a people and I am antisemite? that is a lame and played out.
Why wait for it to come out, why not be proud of it?
Saying that it's played out only skirts around what you may or may not believe . It's not played out if it's true...
As far as I'm concerned, you haven't enough information about this region of the world to comment... Then again, does most on the boards? The dialog here isn't even a discussion.
What about when the jews killled thousands of their own, what does that make them????
Not even an argument because it doesn't hold water...
Americans have killed thousands of Americans, Arabs have killed thousands of arabs, and Scotts have killed thousands of Scotts, I guess that makes those who live the survivors...

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Anyone notice the latest "attacks" made by the "agressive" israelis? Sniping attacks from the West Bank. FROM Arabs shooting at Israeli soldiers, Again, Still, and more tomorow.