Who has driven a Shifter Kart?

[Burley1]

So what is the deal with shifter karts, who makes the best, is there one better for tall guys, what should someone get 80cc, 125cc, 250cc
Thought it would be fun and there is a track not to far away from home. :)

[76ANTHONY]

hey i thought about that the other day, i guess theres a track in hemet, looks like fun :D

[Billy Heinlein]

I was state champion back in 93 the first year shifter karts could compete, they are blast to dive, and why I was driving Kali Karts from Europe were the best chassis, not sure any longer. But if you plan to play, the real expense with shifters is tires, due to total clutch lock up and a solid rear axel they don't last long. Al so get a lot of rear gear to experiment with, going from a 24 to a 26 can make a huge deference depending on your driving style. Good luck and given hell on the track, wish my back would let still race, I really miss it. The older I get the better I was: idea:

[Mrs.Racer277]

Talk To Racer277. I Tripped Over One In His Garage. Almost Spilled My Friggen Beer, Too...
HEHEHEHE
I know where there is one for sale. Good deal too!
I will have Racer277 PM you.

[Burley1]

HEHEHEHE
I know where there is one for sale. Good deal too!
I will have Racer277 PM you.
Please have him PM me with the details
Thanks :)

[Reaper1]

Talk to Tom Slick. He worked for a place that was the largest importer of Tony Karts, I think. :boxed:

[SnakeWrench]

just tested a new WRP chassis for a friend at Adams. Raced with Kieth and Alex out there for years and finished 4th twice at the worlds. Never made the podium though. Age will slow you down a bit and these guys with the new Tags are going damned near as fast.

[Mrs.Racer277]

Please have him PM me with the details
Thanks :)
PM sent! :D
Welcome

[boatnam2]

not shifter carts but this is by my house and getting ready to open up looks fun.polepostionraceway.com

[WILD LAVEY]

the best four karts out there right now are birel, tony kart, crg, and top kart. thats my opinion anyway. you might want to look at the tag (touch and go)class. they have a water cooled 125 cc with an onboard starter hench touch and go. these karts about as fast as the shifters. you might want to post this on lakc.org also. good luck.

[LUVNLIFE]

PM Jacpunx. He can give you quite a bit of info ;)

[WaTchTheGelCoat]

I am the regional sales manager for the CRG importer for the U.S. If you have any questions regarding CRG, send me a PM.

[Burley1]

bump

[tahitijet]

I raced for many many years about the time i quite enery, crg, top kart were the competitive karts, then PTK came out and did decent. There are 2 or 3 people on the boards that import/deal these karts.
Best thing to do is go to a race see what the fast guys in all clases are running then find a dealer who will offer track side assistance till you get the hang of dialing in these karts. There not turn key they do require alot of setup to be competitive and that changes day to day and track to track and sometimes a few times in the same race day.
If Marc Zartian is still in the game he was great with assistance, last i heard he was in carlsbad.

[Burley1]

I raced for many many years about the time i quite enery, crg, top kart were the competitive karts, then PTK came out and did decent. There are 2 or 3 people on the boards that import/deal these karts.
Best thing to do is go to a race see what the fast guys in all clases are running then find a dealer who will offer track side assistance till you get the hang of dialing in these karts. There not turn key they do require alot of setup to be competitive and that changes day to day and track to track and sometimes a few times in the same race day.
If Marc Zartian is still in the game he was great with assistance, last i heard he was in carlsbad.
Thanks for the input I won't be doing it for any other reason than for fun. that is what I say now.
Is it to much to have a 250cc engine in them or a 450 4 stroke or hell how about a cr500 engine even though the 500 may be a bit hard on tires. :D

[jstwkd]

All I really know is they are fun as hell.....we have 6. 4 crg and 2 tony......lots of fun..we dont race so it doent really seem to matter......but 25 bucks for the day.
I have a older crg with an oval frame.and a longer nose peice.....I dont think they make it anymore..

[Burley1]

All I really know is they are fun as hell.....we have 6. 4 crg and 2 tony......lots of fun..we dont race so it doent really seem to matter......but 25 bucks for the day.
I have a older crg with an oval frame.and a longer nose peice.....I dont think they make it anymore..
That is what I was thinking, go out to Grange for the day and tear it up.
I forgot how much I enjoyed seeing pic's of your lovely wife, I was always seeing her on The Inside Line

[Racer277]

Thanks for the input I won't be doing it for any other reason than for fun. that is what I say now.
Is it to much to have a 250cc engine in them or a 450 4 stroke or hell how about a cr500 engine even though the 500 may be a bit hard on tires. :D
I'll get you the email, just gotta get to that computer.
I thought the same thing, as I've had a few CR500's. Wanted to put the motor in. It wouldn't be worth it, unless you were on a BIG track, i.e. Willow Springs big track, Laguna Seca big track, Fontana on the oval, etc.
The 125 can spin the tires and drift all 4 in ANY gear. It's fun for a few, but you will quickly find that the challenge is in keeping up your speed and making fast laps.
I thought I was a pretty good driver (10 years street bike, competitive MX, dezert, Smoto racer, etc), then I got in a kart. Everything you do matters. If you are 1' off the right line going into or out of a corner, it shows as .2 on the laptimes. Anyone can watch the Neckcar guys and think 'I could do that'. BS. You can't, not without a lot of practice.
Get on a shifter kart, have a 15yo kid show you the way around a track fast, and you will know what skill at driving is.
These are a kick, you will come out sweating and grinning everytime..

[Racer277]

That is what I was thinking, go out to Grange for the day and tear it up.
I forgot how much I enjoyed seeing pic's of your lovely wife, I was always seeing her on The Inside Line
Grange is a really fun track. The elevation changes and the infield really give you an appreciation for F1. Several of the corners are blind because of the elevation changes.
Adams is really cool, Willow Springs is very smooth, Grange is fun, Apex is a little small, but fun, lots of places down there...

[jstwkd]

ya..you will be feeling great...turning fast laps(at least for you)...then your behind this kid and you know he is fast but your right there with him.....woohoo.Then you realize he is on an 80cc....Dohh!
I hate that.....
The 125 is plenty fast for the track we ride.....I spend half the time trying to learn and get a faster lap and the other half just mashing the pedal to the floor and sliding thru every corner.....you just cant take a corner like that on the street or the dirt....Its a blast for the money!
Whats up Burley1 not on IL anymore????
There is a pic of her in a thread on the sandbar.....something about modeling for HB......

[Burley1]

ya..you will be feeling great...turning fast laps(at least for you)...then your behind this kid and you know he is fast but your right there with him.....woohoo.Then you realize he is on an 80cc....Dohh!
I hate that.....
The 125 is plenty fast for the track we ride.....I spend half the time trying to learn and get a faster lap and the other half just mashing the pedal to the floor and sliding thru every corner.....you just cant take a corner like that on the street or the dirt....Its a blast for the money!
Whats up Burley1 not on IL anymore????
There is a pic of her in a thread on the sandbar.....something about modeling for HB......
I would be pissed if a kid beat me like that, and that is me too, my nickname in high school was "Stab N Steer"
I saw IL was down and then just stopped, I will get the new password from Bre and drop back in. And I saw her picture and she is smokin hot as ever. :D

[Burley1]

I'll get you the email, just gotta get to that computer.
I thought the same thing, as I've had a few CR500's. Wanted to put the motor in. It wouldn't be worth it, unless you were on a BIG track, i.e. Willow Springs big track, Laguna Seca big track, Fontana on the oval, etc.
The 125 can spin the tires and drift all 4 in ANY gear. It's fun for a few, but you will quickly find that the challenge is in keeping up your speed and making fast laps.
I thought I was a pretty good driver (10 years street bike, competitive MX, dezert, Smoto racer, etc), then I got in a kart. Everything you do matters. If you are 1' off the right line going into or out of a corner, it shows as .2 on the laptimes. Anyone can watch the Neckcar guys and think 'I could do that'. BS. You can't, not without a lot of practice.
Get on a shifter kart, have a 15yo kid show you the way around a track fast, and you will know what skill at driving is.
These are a kick, you will come out sweating and grinning everytime..
I never have driven one so I have no concept of how fast they are.

[jstwkd]

On a straight away they feel like a 2 stoke.......power band and all...but when you hit the top of the power band. then all of a sudden there is a corner that you look at and say no way I am going to make this.Just turn the wheel you will be amazed....They are even controlable in a four wheel slide....I love it!

[Racer277]

I never have driven one so I have no concept of how fast they are.
This depends on the track.
If you took it to the salt flats, prolly about 110? Maybe others would know better.
For Grange and Willow Springs I think our top is about 75-80. Apex is less for sure and I think Adams is too. As with any racing, the top speed isn't the rush, it's getting there that is.
I've talked to Champ car drivers that still use these to train on. Statements like:
"nothing else is close to the cornering G's of a champ car of F1" were common.
Really the cornering g's (3+) are as fun as the acceleration. IMHO.

[Burley1]

On a straight away they feel like a 2 stoke.......power band and all...but when you hit the top of the power band. then all of a sudden there is a corner that you look at and say no way I am going to make this.Just turn the wheel you will be amazed....They are even controlable in a four wheel slide....I love it!
Sounds fun

[Burley1]

This depends on the track.
If you took it to the salt flats, prolly about 110? Maybe others would know better.
For Grange and Willow Springs I think our top is about 75-80. Apex is less for sure and I think Adams is too. As with any racing, the top speed isn't the rush, it's getting there that is.
I've talked to Champ car drivers that still use these to train on. Statements like:
"nothing else is close to the cornering G's of a champ car of F1" were common.
Really the cornering g's (3+) are as fun as the acceleration. IMHO.
Sound like it would be very addicting

[Burley1]

Bump

[Racer277]

You've got mail.

[Burley1]

Racer how much do tires cost?

[Racer277]

~150+ per set I believe, but check with WatchTheGelCoat, he may know better.
I ran alot of take offs from friends. When you race, new tires are necessary every race and you likely have to buy the tires specific to the organization (spec tires). I could put 3-4 days of practice on a set.

[LGCDEVIL]

Got an '02 Tony for sale (very low hours). PM me if you are interested. Can also hook you up with some info if needed. Know quite a few shoes, shops, etc..

[Burley1]

~150+ per set I believe, but check with WatchTheGelCoat, he may know better.
I ran alot of take offs from friends. When you race, new tires are necessary every race and you likely have to buy the tires specific to the organization (spec tires). I could put 3-4 days of practice on a set.
150 seems cheap enough

[Burley1]

Racer,
how much use is left in the kart engine before it would need a rebuild "Best Guess" andthen how much would it cost to do the rebuild?

[Burley1]

the best four karts out there right now are birel, tony kart, crg, and top kart. thats my opinion anyway. you might want to look at the tag (touch and go)class. they have a water cooled 125 cc with an onboard starter hench touch and go. these karts about as fast as the shifters. you might want to post this on lakc.org also. good luck.
This TAG class you talked about sounds fun but I think the shifting is half the fun "Right"

[Racer277]

Racer,
how much use is left in the kart engine before it would need a rebuild "Best Guess" andthen how much would it cost to do the rebuild?
It's a Honda CR125 engine, so ~$120 for the top end kit.
I went 3 years or so before the rebuild, depends on how much you drive it.
Should be done every 10-15 hours I believe. That's a lot of driving.
It's difficult to put in more than 2 hrs of driving a day.

[Burley1]

It's a Honda CR125 engine, so ~$120 for the top end kit.
I went 3 years or so before the rebuild, depends on how much you drive it.
Should be done every 10-15 hours I believe. That's a lot of driving.
It's difficult to put in more than 2 hrs of driving a day.
Really 2 hours is alot, why? because it beats the hell out of you.

[Mrs.Racer277]

Really 2 hours is alot, why? because it beats the hell out of you.
Pretty Much! ;) ;)

[Burley1]

Pretty Much! ;) ;)
I hope it isn't to much for a old man
:D

[jstwkd]

After 2 hrs you will feel like you ran all day....Beats the Sh!t out of ya!...............But damn is it fun!

[Burley1]

After 2 hrs you will feel like you ran all day....Beats the Sh!t out of ya!...............But damn is it fun!
Sounds like it would be a hoot. :D

[Racer277]

Really 2 hours is alot, why? because it beats the hell out of you.
I found at best I was able to focus 100% on my driving for 3 seperate 20 minute stints. After that, I was not thinking far enough ahead of the kart. The physical part is one thing, it does beat you up. But how long can you stay in the zone was the question. After that, I was not driving as competitively, and not improving my times.
I race dezert races (D37), that take 2 hours sometimes more, but staying at 100% on the kart is different and more difficult. It requires a level of precision that is difficult to maintain. I could still drive at 90%, but not have the edge that is so much fun.
I really learned respect for F1 drivers that drive for 1 full hour at 100% with maybe one mistake (often none) the whole time. Amazing.
Maybe others have different views on this?

[Burley1]

I found at best I was able to focus 100% on my driving for 3 seperate 20 minute stints. After that, I was not thinking far enough ahead of the kart. The physical part is one thing, it does beat you up. But how long can you stay in the zone was the question. After that, I was not driving as competitively, and not improving my times.
I race dezert races (D37), that take 2 hours sometimes more, but staying at 100% on the kart is different and more difficult. It requires a level of precision that is difficult to maintain. I could still drive at 90%, but not have the edge that is so much fun.
I really learned respect for F1 drivers that drive for 1 full hour at 100% with maybe one mistake (often none) the whole time. Amazing.
Maybe others have different views on this?
Wow that is a good point.

[Burley1]

I found at best I was able to focus 100% on my driving for 3 seperate 20 minute stints. After that, I was not thinking far enough ahead of the kart. The physical part is one thing, it does beat you up. But how long can you stay in the zone was the question. After that, I was not driving as competitively, and not improving my times.
I race dezert races (D37), that take 2 hours sometimes more, but staying at 100% on the kart is different and more difficult. It requires a level of precision that is difficult to maintain. I could still drive at 90%, but not have the edge that is so much fun.
I really learned respect for F1 drivers that drive for 1 full hour at 100% with maybe one mistake (often none) the whole time. Amazing.
Maybe others have different views on this?
Racer have you ever been on a big track like willow? what is involved if you want to race somewhere like that.
Also what besides a helmet is required as far as safety gear.
Thanks

[Racer277]

Racer have you ever been on a big track like willow? what is involved if you want to race somewhere like that.
Also what besides a helmet is required as far as safety gear.
Thanks
For practice most tracks want long pants and a jacket (I see alot of guys with jeans/leather jackets). A kart specific driving suit is a good idea. You are on a race track, so oil, rubber, chain lube are all common. As you drive the kart fast you will see pieces of tire flying all around you. A motorcycle helmet and a kart suit are cheapest as they don't have to be fire resistant. If you get a car helmet and a car suit, it will be more money, but can be used for other racing. Gloves are a must, and driving shoes a good idea. All depends on you. Talk to WatchtheGelCoat, he has offered deals. Also Kimball Williams Racing. I think there are others on here that sell also.
I've been on Willow Springs on a bike, it would be boring on a kart. There is a 250 superkart series that races Horse Theif, Streets of Willow, Laguna Seca etc. But these are VERY SERIOUS guys with big bucks. Ex Indy racers etc, a different league from a 125 shifter.
Willow Springs Kart track is $25 bucks per day. Most weekdays you will have the track to yourself, not bad to rent a racetrack for 25. Weekends with a race will be much more crowded for practice, but very educational. This sport is taken as seriously as any other. You will see diesel pushers towing warriors with 5 karts for one driver pull up. You can learn alot following these guys and girls.
Adams, Apex and Grange are about the same price and you will spend $15 in gas on a big day.

[Burley1]

For practice most tracks want long pants and a jacket (I see alot of guys with jeans/leather jackets). A kart specific driving suit is a good idea. You are on a race track, so oil, rubber, chain lube are all common. As you drive the kart fast you will see pieces of tire flying all around you. A motorcycle helmet and a kart suit are cheapest as they don't have to be fire resistant. If you get a car helmet and a car suit, it will be more money, but can be used for other racing. Gloves are a must, and driving shoes a good idea. All depends on you. Talk to WatchtheGelCoat, he has offered deals. Also Kimball Williams Racing. I think there are others on here that sell also.
I've been on Willow Springs on a bike, it would be boring on a kart. There is a 250 supkart series that races Horse Theif, Streets of Willow, Laguna Seca etc. But these are VERY SERIOUS guys with big bucks. Ex Indy racers etc, a different league from a 125 shifter.
Willow Springs Kart track is $25 bucks per day. Most weekdays you will have the track to yourself, not bad to rent a racetrack for 25. Weekends with a race will be much more crowded for practice, but very educational. This sport is taken as seriously as any other. You will see diesel pushers towing warriors with 5 karts for one driver pull up. You can learn alot following these guys and girls.
Adams, Apex and Grange are about the same price and you will spend $15 in gas on a big day.
Why is it boring on the big track, too slow? how much faster are the 250 karts

[Mrs.Racer277]

Why is it boring on the big track, too slow? how much faster are the 250 karts
The 125 Shifters top speed is maybe 110? I'm not sure. That would be boring on a big track. 150 is boring on the straight at Willow.
These are made for very tight turns, that's where the lateral G's come from. You'd never see that on a big track with a 125 kart.
I'm not sure, but I don't think there are more than 30 Superkart racers in the US. These are not CR250 motors, but TZ or RS250 roadracing motors. In several guys cases they have factory Yamaha and Honda roadrace motors installed.
My guess is a superkart costs $20k and up, $50K to be competitive...Superkart speeds top out above 165mph.
I haven't really looked at superkarts, as they have so few races and racers, but I'm sure there is plenty of info online.
R277

[Mrs.Racer277]

When we raced SCCA solo (autocross) races, they had all different classes including shifter karts.
There were very hot RX7's and Procharged Z06's out there, etc.
The 125 shifters turned faster laps than any of the cars...

[Burley1]

The 125 Shifters top speed is maybe 110? I'm not sure. That would be boring on a big track. 150 is boring on the straight at Willow.
These are made for very tight turns, that's where the lateral G's come from. You'd never see that on a big track with a 125 kart.
I'm not sure, but I don't think there are more than 30 Superkart racers in the US. These are not CR250 motors, but TZ or RS250 roadracing motors. In several guys cases they have factory Yamaha and Honda roadrace motors installed.
My guess is a superkart costs $20k and up, $50K to be competitive...Superkart speeds top out above 165mph.
I haven't really looked at superkarts, as they have so few races and racers, but I'm sure there is plenty of info online.
R277
Oh my god those 250 superkarts are nuts, I bet those are a handfull!!!

[Burley1]

When we raced SCCA solo (autocross) races, they had all different classes including shifter karts.
There were very hot RX7's and Procharged Z06's out there, etc.
The 125 shifters turned faster laps than any of the cars...
Talk about a ego killer for those cager guys getting there azz handed to them by a go-kart

[Burley1]

I was looking at a site that had video of a guy a Laguna Seca "WOW" that looked like a rush :220v:

[Burley1]

I hope Mark chimes in, I want your feedback come on JP.

[al cole'holic]

...think about going 0-100 then 100-0 in like 4 seconds :supp: :D

[cdog]

Back in 1992 I was tri-C and Socal Champ in the pistion port light class at Adams track in riverside. I raced a couple of IKF races and ran in the top 5 untill mech. problems. I raced against guys from europe with serious rigs and their budget for 1 month was my dad's race budget all year. My kart was 12 year old Emmick with a Komet 100cc. Shifters were just gaining popularity back then. I had a couple of experiances driving them. Very fast. I would not suggest a new commer to the sport to jump in on one. They are honestly way too fast for a newbe. Learn how to drive first. Your ego will be hurt for quite a while. I was 15 in 1992 and would spank the hell out of guy's my age now that would get all pissed off that a kid out drove them. I'd get a used and well set up kart to get you started. Keep in mind that it's cheaper to run a Formula Ford than a Shifter Kart.

[bonesfab]

A buddy of mine had a 10th mile oval in his front yard that we used to go to every sunday. took the old 100 cc carts and put built briggs or honda 4 stokes on them. most fun i've had. 5 gallons of gas lasts all month. not to mention you get 8-10 carts out there and its a rush..

[riverroyal]

125 is about all you need for tracks here in socal,lots of fun,just make sure your tire budget is high. :eat:

[cdog]

You should also check out Jim Hall Racing school up in ventura. I went when I was 13. Excellent experiance.

[afi823]

go to DROMO ONE in anaheim, they have a sick track there. 20 bucks for 20 mins of full on racing.

[Burley1]

go to DROMO ONE in anaheim, they have a sick track there. 20 bucks for 20 mins of full on racing.
I was looking and those things only have 9 hp engines I mean paleese. I am sure they are fun but I am quite sure I would get a little bored.

[JustMVG]

I found at best I was able to focus 100% on my driving for 3 seperate 20 minute stints. After that, I was not thinking far enough ahead of the kart. The physical part is one thing, it does beat you up. But how long can you stay in the zone was the question. After that, I was not driving as competitively, and not improving my times.
I race dezert races (D37), that take 2 hours sometimes more, but staying at 100% on the kart is different and more difficult. It requires a level of precision that is difficult to maintain. I could still drive at 90%, but not have the edge that is so much fun.
I really learned respect for F1 drivers that drive for 1 full hour at 100% with maybe one mistake (often none) the whole time. Amazing.
Maybe others have different views on this?
I have amazing respect for the F1 guys too, having to decide what to buy with my ultra-million dollar contract, then walk out to drive the most advanced cars in the world, i am kidding of course but there is an all F1 driver Kart race for charity every year and Schumey, Montoya and the rest show up and have a blast.

[Mrs.Racer277]

I was looking and those things only have 9 hp engines I mean paleese. I am sure they are fun but I am quite sure I would get a little bored.
And they yell at you there. :rolleyes: :p :D