View Full Version : do these prices look right to you guys?
502procharger
10-31-2002, 11:40 AM
Prices Quoted from my engine builder for my new 540 bbc
crane roller cam $300
roller lifters $525.00
manely severe duty intake valves $200.00
inconnel exhaust valves $360.00
race gasket set $160.00
speed pro file fit rings $150.00
.80 wall 1piece pushrod $144.00
please let me know what you guys think of these prices. also let me know if you know where to get this stuff cheep. eek!
DUCKY
10-31-2002, 01:10 PM
Cam and everything else is about right. Lifters are too high though. About $280 from a disount place, so I'd say 300-325 retail.
DogHouse
10-31-2002, 02:36 PM
280 would be about right for the standard issue rollers. Any of the light weight or severe duty sets will be more, although 525 still sounds a little high.
-brian
revndave
10-31-2002, 03:48 PM
PRICES LOOK OK.I WOULD USE FARIA SS VALVES.THEIR SS VALVE IS BETTER THAN MOST INCONEL VALVES.
I just had a set of heads built, $380 for the FARIA SS all around. KC
Fiat48
10-31-2002, 06:03 PM
Roller lifters may be the severe duty ones by Comp..they are about that price. All other prices in line. Don't piss your engine builder off by buying parts elsewhere when he is giving you a fair deal as it looks like he is. When your engine is on the operating table, it's life is in his hands.
DogHouse
10-31-2002, 06:42 PM
Good point Fiat48, but I was a little peeved when my builder charged me 900 bucks (plus tax plus shipping) for a Scat crank I could have mail ordered for 300 bucks less not including the tax savings... Especially since he was already charging top $$$ for labor and machine work. That's a tough question. The builders kind of have you over a barrel when your motor is in pieces on their bench. From now on I'll be doing more of the work myself assuming I have the time.
-brian
If you start pinching pennies by buying the parts yourself all you will do is piss the builder off and void whatever warranty he would give you because he does not have to warrant "your" parts. Is he not allowed a fair profit for his work and expertise? It is not in your good interest to piss off the builder at this point. Next engine you build have the machine work done by the machine shop and build it yourself and when you run over your crankshaft you have no one to blame but yourself. :D
502procharger
10-31-2002, 07:15 PM
058
relax there buddie. i just wanted to see if these were fair prices or not. i am not pennie pinching, nor have i ever when it comes to any of my boats or motors. This is a new builder i am working with and a few of the prices seemed a little strange to me. i have had, and have myself built many other motors and i have never paid $525.00 for a set of crain roller lifters. i was just looking for some input from the rest of you gear heads. thank you everyone for the input.
565edge
10-31-2002, 07:21 PM
502procharger:
058
relax there buddie. i just wanted to see if these were fair prices or not. i am not pennie pinching, nor have i ever when it comes to any of my boats or motors. This is a new builder i am working with and a few of the prices seemed a little strange to me. i have had, and have myself built many other motors and i have never paid $525.00 for a set of crain roller lifters. i was just looking for some input from the rest of you gear heads. thank you everyone for the input.Buy from shafiroff racing engines,they back there shit,great prices,free shipping,no tax,there prices are pretty low,but they only sell the best,talk to pete,they have a web site www.shafiroff.com (http://www.shafiroff.com)
DogHouse
10-31-2002, 07:35 PM
...warranty...Warranty, from a custom engine builder, ha ha that's a good one!!! I have an oil leak problem at the moment, still waiting for the builder to step up to the plate and offer to fix the #$^*()! thing but nothing yet.
Is he not allowed a fair profit for his work and expertise?Fair profit for the work and expertise should be built into the machine labor and assembly charges, not a 50% markup on the price of the parts!
...when you run over your crankshaft...I found that I've had much better luck ever since I stopped using them for wheel chauks!
-brian wink
Fiat48
10-31-2002, 09:18 PM
When I built engines I treated people as I would like to be treated. I wanted to be paid for my labor and machine work which I would not discount or compromise. But marking up parts? Hell, parts are too high in the first place. I would rather the customer use the best parts from summit or wheverever they could be bought for the best price. Phone calls (where applicable), freight and time spent ordering or searching for parts was charged. If the customer wanted to use junk parts or inferior parts, I would not build it. All I asked the customer was that if the engine did turn out to have a problem, not to jump to any conclusions of bad workmanship or parts, just come see me and we would take it apart together and see what the problem was. And to keep an open mind that these are passenger car engines designed to run at RPM's that we are now close to idling at. But it didn't work. So I only build for a few proven customers and my own engines.
$900 for a $300 crankshaft is commonplace in this buisness. So is waiting for you parts to be machined for months while the "quickie" jobs with more profit get done first.
502procharger : Check the lifters he is selecting for you and they may be the more expensive ones. I bought a set of Comps that have larger rollers, more needles, and a slot for oiling. They were about $525.00. I put these in when a set of the regular comps failed from so much idling in a daycruiser. I talked to Comp and they said they got a lot of failures on street stuff so they came up with this lifter. Probably Crane has it too. Your builder should be more than happy to enlighten you.
So the engine builder is suppose to eat all the expense of aquiring the parts for a customer's engine? Since when? You cannot go into any retail establishment and expect to buy parts for what he buys them for. Get a clue! There is freight charges and overhead to cover. I build engines for other people too and I will not give my time and expense away so parts are a source of profit since I have time and expense involve in getting those parts to my door. Fiat48, You said something about asking the customer not to jump to any conclusion when his engine has a "problem"...yeah, right, when his vacation or 3 day weekend has been ruined by a engine "problem" Do you think he is going to be reasonable when he comes thru your door on Monday morning after his ruined weekend?....Shit, I'd pay good money to watch that one. I, like you, select who I build engines for but most shops do not have that option.
Hotcrusader76
11-01-2002, 04:34 AM
058:
So the engine builder is suppose to eat all the expense of aquiring the parts for a customer's engine? Since when? You cannot go into any retail establishment and expect to buy parts for what he buys them for. Get a clue! There is freight charges and overhead to cover. I build engines for other people too and I will not give my time and expense away so parts are a source of profit since I have time and expense involve in getting those parts to my door. Fiat48, You said something about asking the customer not to jump to any conclusion when his engine has a "problem"...yeah, right, when his vacation or 3 day weekend has been ruined by a engine "problem" Do you think he is going to be reasonable when he comes thru your door on Monday morning after his ruined weekend?....Shit, I'd pay good money to watch that one. I, like you, select who I build engines for but most shops do not have that option.Well put. Diddo on that!
DogHouse
11-01-2002, 08:23 PM
058:
So the engine builder is suppose to eat all the expense of aquiring the parts for a customer's engine? Since when? You cannot go into any retail establishment and expect to buy parts for what he buys them for. Get a clue!Nobody said anything about "eating" the expense or buying the parts for what the builder pays for them... Trust me, I have a "clue" as you put it. I just don't want to pay a 50% markup on every part that goes in my motor.
There is freight charges and overhead to cover.Understood, freight is expected no matter what the source is.
I build engines for other people too and I will not give my time and expense away so parts are a source of profit since I have time and expense involve in getting those parts to my door.Nobody asked you too. In my case I was able to specify exactly what parts I wanted in the motor, no time or "expense" required on the part of the builder. Hell, I even told the builder about a new model of crank that he didn't know was available yet. Don't f_ck me with a 50% markup and we'll get along just fine!!!
Fiat48, You said something about asking the customer not to jump to any conclusion when his engine has a "problem"...yeah, right, when his vacation or 3 day weekend has been ruined by a engine "problem" Do you think he is going to be reasonable when he comes thru your door on Monday morning after his ruined weekend?....Shit, I'd pay good money to watch that one. I, like you, select who I build engines for but most shops do not have that option."Reasonable"??? My experience has been that few if any builders are willing to step up to the plate and fix ANYTHING on their dime unless the (supposedly uneducated) buyer can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the "expert" builder was responsible for the failure. Usually, it's just buyer get out your checkbook and everyone will be just fine...
-brian
Fiat48
11-01-2002, 08:41 PM
DogHouse: Sadly, I have to agree that few builders will step up to the plate. Makes you wonder how some stay in buisness. You would think they would want a happy customer sending other customers. I thought the machine shops in this town would go broke years ago with the work they do. But they are still there. And somehow always busy. PT Barnum said it best.
DogHouse
11-01-2002, 09:09 PM
Yup, a sucker (me!!!) born every day!
:D
Infomaniac
11-01-2002, 09:39 PM
I paid that much for my roller lifters from Clay Smith. They are the new pressure fed bearing type. I think they are actually Crower lifters.
I did buy cheap Herbert lifters and throw them away each year. These will last.
Crane are 319.00 and 362.00 From Herbert. Horiz bar and vert bar
DUCKY
11-05-2002, 12:59 PM
Originally posted by 058:
So the engine builder is suppose to eat all the expense of aquiring the parts for a customer's engine? Since when? You cannot go into any retail establishment and expect to buy parts for what he buys them for. Get a clue! I never said that you should be able to buy for the same price as the shop. For example, most manufacturers give their retail outlets 40% off list prices. Summit and Jegs probably get 50% due to volume. If the engine builder bought those lifters for $240 direct from the manufacturer and you can buy them for $280 from summit or the like, then $325-$350 is fair for the builder to charge. Fair profit is to be expected, but anal raping is not!
502procharger
11-05-2002, 03:12 PM
With all the controversy I started I think I am just going to scrap the suppercharged 540 bbc and get a 1963 mercury 9.9 outboard.
Listen I have a chain of retail stores in upstate NY, so I know about markup and overhead. I agree that you should be able to make your profit, hell that is what we are all in business for. I do however disagree with being shafted by a shop just because they have my motor torn down and think they can charge me whatever they want. I have no problem paying what is the fair market price. That way everyone is happy. Just so everyone knows, the 525 for lifters was because he thought he was going to have to put a retro fit set in, and later found out he did not need to. Thank you everyone for the input and help.
I never said anything about being raped, the question was asked if these prices were out of line or fair. I added my .02 and prob. worth less about providing your own parts for the engine builder to use. Since the builder does not know the origion of those parts how is he suppose to guarantee his work. Its like going into a steak house and bringing your own steak and then bitching because its tough. Just for the record I charge anywhere between 15 to 30% mark up on parts depending on how much time and trouble I have aquiring those parts. As for warranty a honest builder will stand behind his work, sorry you got screwed Doghouse.
Liberator TJ1984
11-06-2002, 07:26 AM
I believe you have to build a trust between you and the Mechanic...trust to a certian point what he says but don't try to make it obvious you think he's trying to get away with something...just curious why this or that...
I was lucky I have a good relationship with my builder..he wanted me to go roller setup..I told him NO ..tried to skimp on costs and went Hyd...
cam lost 13 of 16 lobes ( missed heat treating ..was told by Crane ) took motor back to him..after a WARM chat I was looking forward to using his advice..he rebuilt motor labor for Free
I just had to buy parts...I was very lucky he worked with me !!!
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