Adjusting the plates on a V-bottom cruiser.

[dmontzsta]

Is it pretty similar to a flatty?
My Dad's Eliminator needs some serious adjusting. You can put the plates all the way up and it is still STUCK down in the water. You can only get the bottom to come loose if you have some chop, then it slams right back down.
With a flatty I have always used 1/8" gap when in the full up position. Do you do the same with a V-bottom?

[bigkatboat]

You might want to move the prop forward (get the nose up) and then try to adjust the plates. If the boat is stuck in the water, it doesn't need any plate. Rebalance the boat, and then go to your 1/8" up, and try the boat.

[GofastRacer]

Also if you haven't done it already you may want to put a straight edge on the bottom and make sure you don't have a hook in it!..

[haulina29]

And eliminate the super bronze full cup three blade . Try a stellings 2 blade you will like it.

[dmontzsta]

And eliminate the super bronze full cup three blade . Try a stellings 2 blade you will like it.
I was telling my Dad a two blade would give him some better top end, which he is looking for. But I have heard these Eliminators dont do too well, with a two blade. He would just be happy to get this thing in the 60s.

[haulina29]

The stellings is real forgiving very little tail lift i beleive its a menkins prop now . Most bronze three blades have a ton of tail lift . As gofastracer stated try and get it under the boat as far as possible with out moving the strut . I am not familiar with that hull either but I would still give it a try ! H29

[÷קmᮆښ×÷]

hey Don do you need the Jet guys to show you how to move the prop forward like they did in getting your propshaft out of the old boat??? :devil: :D :D

[dmontzsta]

hey Don do you need the Jet guys to show you how to move the prop forward like they did in getting your propshaft out of the old boat??? :devil: :D :D
hey now, I know how to get a prop shaft out. Just didnt know that old ass coupling split with the bolts like it did, and those bolts really did SPLIT! :rollside: I was also a puss and didnt want to break the coupling, cause I wanted to reuse it, but I ended up putting the one from the B boat in there.
It would be nice for you jet guys to help me adjust the cav plates though. I dont want to mess with the prop yet, cause the plates really arent getting much movement at all, it is like the lever is useless. I think it is adjusted so far down, that any up isnt even doing a thing.

[÷קmᮆښ×÷]

hey now, I know how to get a prop shaft out. Just didnt know that old ass coupling split with the bolts like it did, and those bolts really did SPLIT! :rollside: I was also a puss and didnt want to break the coupling, cause I wanted to reuse it, but I ended up putting the one from the B boat in there.
It would be nice for you jet guys to help me adjust the cav plates though. I dont want to mess with the prop yet, cause the plates really arent getting much movement at all, it is like the lever is useless. I think it is adjusted so far down, that any up isnt even doing a thing.
call me and bring it by ill set it up for ya and check to see were the prop is sitting now if it needs to be moved..

[river redy]

call me and bring it by ill set it up for ya and check to see were the prop is sitting now if it needs to be moved..
Do you do runner bottoms, i definetly need someone that knows what there doing and i can come over this weekend, Ill bring beer

[shadetreedon]

call me and bring it by ill set it up for ya and check to see were the prop is sitting now if it needs to be moved..
Hey that sounds like a deal.Send me a pm when you think you have some free time.I WILL BUY THE BEER. :idea:

[dmontzsta]

Hey that sounds like a deal.Send me a pm when you think you have some free time.I WILL BUY THE BEER. :idea:
Better make sure its that unleaded coors.
:hammerhea :)

[Michael Minegar]

Don, I had the same boat as your Dad's. It was even yellow. It had a c-500 box and was a 9 degree shaft angle. It had a bone stock 454 with an aluminum intake and a 750 holley. This boat was wicked the way it handled. Let me explain. It had an electric plate the you never knew where it was at. No guage or anything to tell you if it was up or down. It would come up out of the water fine and make a couple of half hearted hops and then suck in like glue. If you were lucky enough to hit some nice chop it might decide to break free for awhile. The other thing it did that I hated was if you decided to turn right it might suck in and drive you straight to shore. Very uncomfortable feeling. I met Phil Bergeron in Burley Idaho and talked to him one day for about an hour about props and rudders and Horsepower. I wanted to put a blower on it to at least make the boat fun. He told me unless I changed the whole basic setup ie strut placement, rudder combo, motor location, that the boat would be lethal with any good horsepower. I wasnt willing to go to all that work and my brother had a friend that lived in LA that had always wanted the boat so I sold it to him and he skis with it all the time and loves it.

[dmontzsta]

Don, I had the same boat as your Dad's. It was even yellow. It had a c-500 box and was a 9 degree shaft angle. It had a bone stock 454 with an aluminum intake and a 750 holley. This boat was wicked the way it handled. Let me explain. It had an electric plate the you never knew where it was at. No guage or anything to tell you if it was up or down. It would come up out of the water fine and make a couple of half hearted hops and then suck in like glue. If you were lucky enough to hit some nice chop it might decide to break free for awhile. The other thing it did that I hated was if you decided to turn right it might suck in and drive you straight to shore. Very uncomfortable feeling. I met Phil Bergeron in Burley Idaho and talked to him one day for about an hour about props and rudders and Horsepower. I wanted to put a blower on it to at least make the boat fun. He told me unless I changed the whole basic setup ie strut placement, rudder combo, motor location, that the boat would be lethal with any good horsepower. I wasnt willing to go to all that work and my brother had a friend that lived in LA that had always wanted the boat so I sold it to him and he skis with it all the time and loves it.
Hey Michael,
Thats sweet, thanks for sharing the story. Sounds like these boats like to stick to the water. They do make great ski boats and I am sure your friend is enjoying every minute of it. You are right about the electronic plates, you have no idea where you are (up or down) atleast with an overide you can look down and see where you are.
My dad likes to leave it alone, but I just think it should be a hair bit faster than 55mph. For what it is, it is great, and I know he doesnt want to change the setup. If we could get it to 65mph that should be pretty good for a regular old cruiser. :)
Maybe I should just leave it alone and let him cruise...afterall he is getting old! :D lol now he is going to give me some shit for that one. :rollside:

[Michael Minegar]

I gotta admit what happened to me. We were at our local lake and I think I had about 4 people in the boat. I was full throttle going about 50-55 and a damn personal water craft (lake lice bastard) went right by me on the outside. That was the night I knew that a blower was in my future. I was steamed, pissed, embarrased and humiliated all at the same time. If the blower was not an option, then the next time a lake lice was going to go by it,somebody else was going to own it.

[dmontzsta]

I gotta admit what happened to me. We were at our local lake and I think I had about 4 people in the boat. I was full throttle going about 50-55 and a damn personal water craft (lake lice bastard) went right by me on the outside. That was the night I knew that a blower was in my future. I was steamed, pissed, embarrased and humiliated all at the same time. If the blower was not an option, then the next time a lake lice was going to go by it,somebody else was going to own it.
lol. That is what I want to save my dad from. :)

[bocco]

dmontzsta,
I have the same boat as your dad and it does similat things. I have also been trying to break 60mph without success. Funny the previous owner was sure it ran better than 70. Must be the weight of the GPS. It also does run better in chop. On glassy water it suck down and lean to the left. Seems like it should lean right since the prop is left handed. My plates were out of adjustment when I got my boat. They were about 1/8" down when raised all the way up.
Also I was playing with a new steel prop last summer and as the builder added cup the problem got a little worse. My impression of this hull now is that it doesn't like cup on the props and it's better to add gear than pitch. But since we both have the C500 changing gears is a little inconvenient and expensive.
Gary

[÷קmᮆښ×÷]

Hey that sounds like a deal.Send me a pm when you think you have some free time.I WILL BUY THE BEER. :idea:
when ever you have time have Don call me we will set it up.. and as Don stated unleaded coors :D

[dmontzsta]

dmontzsta,
I have the same boat as your dad and it does similat things. I have also been trying to break 60mph without success. Funny the previous owner was sure it ran better than 70. Must be the weight of the GPS. It also does run better in chop. On glassy water it suck down and lean to the left. Seems like it should lean right since the prop is left handed. My plates were out of adjustment when I got my boat. They were about 1/8" down when raised all the way up.
Also I was playing with a new steel prop last summer and as the builder added cup the problem got a little worse. My impression of this hull now is that it doesn't like cup on the props and it's better to add gear than pitch. But since we both have the C500 changing gears is a little inconvenient and expensive.
Gary
You know the butt gps sometimes feels faster. :)
I know scape goat has one as well and he is running in the 80s, but he did say it is a bit loose. My main gripe about the boat is just what you said, it is too "stuck" in the glass. I picked up a solid 4-5mph with VERY mild chop, but on the glass it does not trap air under it.
I know you cannot make a cruiser like this a rocket, but I dont see why you shouldnt be able to do 65mph TOPPED OUT without issues.
I guess I will try the 1/8" flatty method and see how it acts, since nobody has really messed with this hull, it is going to take some R&R. Certainly not like the mighty Biesmeyer, where the setup is known and dialed in already. :D I still cant believe I have one in the garage, I love it more and more everyday.

[Sleek-Jet]

I know you cannot make a cruiser like this a rocket, but I dont see why you shouldnt be able to do 65mph TOPPED OUT without issues.
I guess I will try the 1/8" flatty method and see how it acts, since nobody has really messed with this hull, it is going to take some R&R. Certainly not like the mighty Biesmeyer, where the setup is known and dialed in already. :D I still cant believe I have one in the garage, I love it more and more everyday.
Put a Chevy in it... :D
For what it's worth, my boat definitely "feels" better running in some chop. I had it in some good 8 - 12" chop this summer running around to a more protected boat ramp (trying to beat the afternoon Monsoons onto the trailer). The boat really felt like it was in it's element, it was up out of the water, carried the bow much better than when it's running in glass, and the water was breaking farther back on the hull. The ride wasn't even that bad. Even my brother mentioned how fast I got around the island to the other boat ramp (probably about 2 miles from where we were camped). Wether it was really fast, or just felt it, I don't know.
I can't say enough good things about these hulls, I'm in love.

[Riverkid]

The right prop will make all the difference in the world. I was lucky to have Wilkes run out to Elsinore with 5 different props one afternoon. We threw my old Spectra 20 in and started testing. All four props did different things, and then he told me to go grab a steel 3 blade Menkins he had behind the seat. WOW. Did that prop ever work. Nice argument back at the ramp Jim- "Take it off". Me - "No way Jose', how much". Jim - "I'll get you another one just like it". Me - "I like this one just fine"....
Ended up buying it, he just wanted me to sweat for a while I think. Hands down best thing ever done to that boat. Good luck with it.

[ScapeGoat]

This boat can be a rocket with some mods,
First tall gears small prop. reason being the boat is too sharp a vee for the larger prop for instance my 12x15.larger props tend to lift the tail too much
Second move the prop and v drive forward this will lift the nose and drag the tail better.
Third look onder the boat the major modification is to add a third inner strakes, to help prevent the rolling to one side and in my instance throwing the passinger out of the boat at unsafe speeds
Lets all post pics of the bottumof the boats and and running gear specs to compare and find out what works and what does not.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/506/2846591047593828375_boat6-med_1_.jpg
468 banks twin turbo estimated HP 550
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/2846PB040042.JPG
9* strut
12x15 precision prop
v-drive is a 10* champion with 12%
I ran a two blade but had electrical issues so I ddid not get any results.
here is one of Bocco 1 boat. Don't know his specs
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/2846bocco1.bmp

[whale]

Hi, I have a 76 Rayson Craft 21 Foot Day Cruiser.......the btm. of the hull looks like this boat.......I am having the same problem. I dont want to be rude ....and this is not my thread but is there a fix to this problem ..............wayne

[ScapeGoat]

yes but each boat is different

[dmontzsta]

What prop has worked the best for you? I know the stock one from Eliminator was a 12x15 3 blade. My Dads cruiser is running a 12x16 3 blade, it really has ALOT of bite downlow and gets up and gets to top speed (55mph) impressingly quick. But it will not do 1mph over 55 and spins the 12x16 3 blade to 4700rpm. He is looking for a little more top end. We are going to swap some DOVE heads, cam and manifold out this summer, then cut down the prop or get another one, he is looking for a 65mph cruiser that still has that down low bite.

[ScapeGoat]

You could always try my 12x15 3 blade
I also have a 12x15 2 balde
both are precision props
I am going to try a 11X15 3 blade
post pics if you gott em

[dmontzsta]

You could always try my 12x15 3 blade
I also have a 12x15 2 balde
both are precision props
I am going to try a 11X15 3 blade
post pics if you gott em
Maybe we should go out the Lake together, for some experimenting. :) You can try the 12x16 if you would like, since you have alot more motor. That way you can check out the boat too. Mouzer had his cruiser out, but I did not get any pics or take any measurements.

[bocco]

Moving the prop forward was mentioned as a solution to get some air under this hull. I currently less than 1/2 inch between prop and strut so that's not an easy option. I wonder if shifting weight to tha back of the boat would help. My battery is mounted on the stringer up close to the V-drive. I was thinking about moving it to the very back and adding one more. Would that be enough to make a difference? I also wonder about the original setup in these boats and should the motor have been a few inches back?

[dmontzsta]

I got to really drive the piss out of this boat yesterday. If you run the plates all the way up through some mean chop, it gets a little scary. If you run the plates down a little, it rides alot better and will still get some lift under it. If you run it with the plates all the way up in glass, it is no different than having the plates all the way down in glass, the boat just sticks to the bottom.
I dont like running it in chop, cause I like to keep the stress cracks to a minimum, since my Dads cruiser is in very nice shape.

[79 Howard]

Why don't you start with the basics, put your t-handle in the 3rd or fourth knotch from the top and check your plate with a straight edge at every turnbuckle. Should be nice and flush if not make it that way then see how it sets and make your desired adjustments

[dmontzsta]

Why don't you start with the basics, put your t-handle in the 3rd or fourth knotch from the top and check your plate with a straight edge at every turnbuckle. Should be nice and flush if not make it that way then see how it sets and make your desired adjustments
There is no t-handle, it is electronic. With the plate all the way up, there is 1/8th of an inch gap. These boats, as with most, have not been tested by the masses.

[79 Howard]

Ok put the plate all the way up and tap it downn 3 touches ,check your straight edge from the bottom of the boat to the leading edge of your cav plate. You need a starting point to determine if it is turnbuckle adjustment or other things but start with the easy then go to the hard if you need to

[ScapeGoat]

Let me correct moving the prop forward. I was told to move the v drive and prop shaft strut forward and set it lower to around 7* this should drag the tail and carry the nose nicely. I will have finishline look at my boat hopefuly in May. He made or race one before and made it work well would like to see what he tells me once he see's the boat.
P.S.
Mine is on standby now since it is stored in my house out at havasu.

[VD CRUISER]

Let me tell you, getting the strut angle and location where it should be makes a big difference. To start with, my 21' Howard had a 10 deg shaft angle and the end of the barrel was 17" from the transom. This was ok until I put the blower motor in it. It started to do some spooky things as I got above 85 mph,(some even thought it was spooky at 75 mph) . I finally made the commitment to change it and went to a 7.5 deg strut with the barrel 23.5" from the transom. This and using props of 11 1/2" to 11 3/4" dia. made a huge difference. It carries the bow nicely and will "set" like a flatbottom. I don't know that these dimensions will work on your boat, but I'm sure some of the knowledgeable people out there could come very close to the right dimensions. Oh, my engine is pretty close to the transom and my battery is mounted behind the motor.

[whale]

What is the barrel ? Do you mean the end of the strut ? Wayne

[ScapeGoat]

the barrel is the part of the strut that the shaft goes through

[63stevens]

I have a 22' Lavey craft cruiser. Power is a basically stock 454 with a Casale c-500 running 1.04 gears. The prop is a 13 x14 bronze three blade. Turning 5300 rpm the boat will go 53mph (gps). To put that boat into the 60's would require a bunch more hp and more gear in the v-drive. It didn't have a tendency to stick to the water at speed. With the electric/hydraulic trim tabs you could get the nose up but it still didn't want to go faster than 53. I wasn't ready to spend alot of money on it to get it to go faster so I gave it to my oldes son and bought a 21' contiental with 509" chevy running 15's in the box and 11 1/2 15 steel three blade. Turning 5600 the boat gps' at 68 mph. It is stuck to the water but with some fine tuning I'm sure it will break the 70 mark. The prop is about 1'' from the barrel of the strut so I'm going to move the prop forward about 1/2 inch. I'm also going to change the gears in the box to 18's. My experience over the years has taught me that speed requires $ and that no matter how much money you throw at the boat what you have is what you have. Some boats just don't like like to go fast and some do.

[VD CRUISER]

I have made a lot of changes to my boat over the years, like removing the cav plates and grinding in the plate recess to remove the hook built into the recess, also blueprinted the bottom on the last 5 or so feet,(it does have a little rocker in it now). Nothing made such a difference as changing the strut, but all of it together works reallly well . I run my prop about 1/4" from the strut, I also use a lot of overdrive,(48 %), that helps to carry the bow. It works the best with a 2 blade prop, (currently a 11 3/4 X 16 Menkins).

[Wildchild80]

Cleaning up the bottom of those boats would help a ton
1) The water pickup should be on the cav. plates
2) The strut is extremly important it should be at least 21" from the back of the boat (depending on power maybe more). The base of the strut should be flush with the boat bottom. 7 to 7.5 degrees.
3) The plate movement on a "V" bottom boat that is set up correctly is only about 3/8" as compared to flatbottoms that have 1 -1/2" but the electric deal really sucks from the standpoint that you can never know where the plate is until the boat starts doing somthing goofy. Even with an indicator they just don't move like a manual one with an overide.
4) And the last 4' of the boat needs to be flat or have a little rocker in it.
doing this stuff will make a HUGE difference in the way your boat handles

[uclahater]

Cleaning up the bottom of those boats would help a ton
1) The water pickup should be on the cav. plates
Dave why is this important, and what differences have you found by doing this.
Thanks
Jim

[weekendwarrior]

Just to clarify, we are talking about an Eliminator cruiser,right? These boats I believe have a round keel. This is great in a jet but not ideal in a v-drive. I definately agree that the strut should be atleast 20" from the transom. But I respectfully disagree with running a shallow degree strut. I think that a 9 degree would work great. In my opinion you should run a deep strut, so you can run the biggest diameter prop you can find. The deep strut will help you with lift of the hull and the large prop will help with your all around cruising.(When I say big prop I mean like a 13" prop. or 12.5. Any smaller than that and the hull may not be getting the blade surface it needs to push it forward efficiently.)

[Wildchild80]

Dave why is this important, and what differences have you found by doing this.
Thanks
Jim
The "Strainer scoop" like is shown in those pics is a big bump on the boat it will pick up the boat at high speed and cause changes in handling. Also it cause drag and slows the boat down at any given RPM

[lucky]

hey now, I know how to get a prop shaft out. Just didnt know that old ass coupling split with the bolts like it did, and those bolts really did SPLIT! :rollside: I was also a puss and didnt want to break the coupling, cause I wanted to reuse it, but I ended up putting the one from the B boat in there.
It would be nice for you jet guys to help me adjust the cav plates though. I dont want to mess with the prop yet, cause the plates really arent getting much movement at all, it is like the lever is useless. I think it is adjusted so far down, that any up isnt even doing a thing.
like that's past tense??? i don't think so !!!! ARE!!!!:)