Is my boat acting right at speed ?

[1968Droptop]

I recently installed a ride plate from SquirtinThunder, and a droop snoot. In it's current state the boat does 75 at 5200 (basically stock 460). At that speed it kind of rocked left, right, left, right, etc. quickly. This rocking was VERY slight and no steering inputs were needed to keep it perfectly straight. The water was some what flat at the time, with maybe a slight head wind. My diverter was almost all the way up as well. Is this what my hull should do, or is this something to be concerned about ?
It didn't do this before, but I don't think I was seeing 75 before adding the rideplate and droop. I'm still pretty green to what my hull should feel like at speed and don't want anything terrible to happen.
Here's a pix of the back if that helps.....http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/521/3320Ride_plate.JPG

[GunninGopher]

Is that engine stock or are you doing 75. I'd be shocked if it were both. And the diverter was full up?

[1968Droptop]

Is that engine stock or are you doing 75. I'd be shocked if it were both. And the diverter was full up?
Basically stock: 750 vacuum secondary with the quick opening spring, dual plane intake, MSD, recurved dist., and open Bassett's. I don't know what cam is in it, but it has the typical jet boat rumpa rumpa rumpa idle at 700-800 rpm's.
A friend was pacing me on my right with a hand held GPS. I know it's not a perfect way, and I know the hand helds are not 100 accurate, but it must be somewhat close ???
The diverter was one notch away from being all the way up.

[roostwear]

What has happened is by adding the ride plate and droop, you have decreased the leverage the diverter can apply to lift the bow. The good news is it sounds like you are well aired out. The rocking back and forth is just "walking" and another symptom of lifting the hull out of the water at speed. If it bothers you, you could probably bring it down by dropping the ride plate and/or wedging the droop. The bad news is you have now entered the "tinkering" zone and will forever be dicking with your setup trying to beat the last speed. Repeat after me... I having a boating problem.....

[1968Droptop]

What has happened is by adding the ride plate and droop, you have decreased the leverage the diverter can apply to lift the bow. The good news is it sounds like you are well aired out. The rocking back and forth is just "walking" and another symptom of lifting the hull out of the water at speed. If it bothers you, you could probably bring it down by dropping the ride plate and/or wedging the droop. The bad news is you have now entered the "tinkering" zone and will forever be dicking with your setup trying to beat the last speed. Repeat after me... I having a boating problem.....
I having a boating problem, I having a boating problem, I having a boating problem...LOL. The rocking got my attention at first, but it wasn't scary, it just hadn't done that before. If the hull is well aired out, then I'm ass-u-ming that means more speed ? I'm not in any grave danger of it doing something I don't want it to do ? Does that GPS number sound way off to you ?
Hows the arm ? Did you get my message ? I sure hope all is well on your end.

[Captain Assin' Off]

Are YOU acting right at speed? Do you have a goofy assed grin? Is the wind making your nose run, and eyes water, forming a vee shaped mixture of tears and snot, that eventually fills both ears? Do you have that oh so familiar tightening of the sphincter, maybe actually forcing your ass to take a big chomp out of your seat? Do you have a fearful look in your eyes after the run, are your legs charlied up, and do your arms ache? Are you out of gas? Are your friends in a state of awe and disbelief after the run, was it video taped for posterities sake? If you answer yes to most of those, you are acting properly...as for the boat, well...um...I don't know.... :crossx:

[malcolm]

What Matt said!!! :rollside: :boxed: :)
:D

[roostwear]

I having a boating problem, I having a boating problem, I having a boating problem...LOL. The rocking got my attention at first, but it wasn't scary, it just hadn't done that before. If the hull is well aired out, then I'm ass-u-ming that means more speed ? I'm not in any grave danger of it doing something I don't want it to do ? Does that GPS number sound way off to you ?
Hows the arm ? Did you get my message ? I sure hope all is well on your end.
The arm's still attached, but the the doc wants to wait another week before replacing the cast and pulling stitches. Got the message... sorry, I haven't been able to do squat for weeks. You found another alternative for the dyno runs? If not, I'm at a point where I can get the headers back there.
Speedwise, my gut says you're not quite at 75, but what do I know, I only run 71! If you get the time, give me a call anytime during the day.... I have plenty of time on my hands until June 12th.

[Cas]

you're also in the zone where I hope you're wearing a real good life jacket

[IMPATIENT 1]

What has happened is by adding the ride plate and droop, you have decreased the leverage the diverter can apply to lift the bow. The good news is it sounds like you are well aired out. The rocking back and forth is just "walking" and another symptom of lifting the hull out of the water at speed. If it bothers you, you could probably bring it down by dropping the ride plate and/or wedging the droop. The bad news is you have now entered the "tinkering" zone and will forever be dicking with your setup trying to beat the last speed. Repeat after me... I having a boating problem.....
MY NAMES THOMAS AND I HAVE A BOATING PROBLEM TOO.

[HBjet]

Your boat shouldn't be rocking back and fourth. If it is, then my first thought is its not made or set up to run for the speed you were going. If the diverter was up, lifting the boat means less boat in the water. With that, there isn't enough boat in the water to keep it straight, and level at higher speeds. Like its falling off center. That is not safe and I don't recommend running like that.
What does the bottom of your hull look like? Do you have a photo? My hulls inside strakes end about 4 feet from the transom, limiting the amount of lift for that area of the hull. Because if that, I have enough hull in the water to stay level and straight at speeds over 90mph with various diverter positions and water conditions. Now, a hull like a gullwing, has the inside strakes come all the way to the rear of the boat. By doing that, the boat will right higher out of the water, but then will have the tendency to want to fall off center and rock if it was a v bottom hull. The gullwing, because of its design, can have those center strakes all the way back, and still stay stable because the outsides of the hull entrap air, stabilizing the boat. Make sense?
So, if you have a photo of your hull, the bottom rear portion, it would be good to take a look. Also check with a long straight edge to see if there is hook, rocker, or anything unusual with the bottom rear of the boat.
HBjet

[roostwear]

A Sanger with moderate power and a lowered thrust line is going to walk on you. Even my Advantage likes to walk when it's aired out.More horsepower would help (typical boater response, eh?) calm it down getting it off the tail a little. Oh the problems those of us with too little hp have. You wanna go fast (loose), or calm it down. Decision, decisions.

[HBjet]

- Her ass is all over the place. - Her rear end is loose.
"Loose" is fast, and "on the edge" is out of control.
:rollside:
HBjet

[Wet Dream]

Why is it that everyone that posts pics about the ride plate always takes the pics from the top? The boat doesn't give a crap what the top looks like. Its all about the setup and angle on the bottom of the boat...where the water interacts with the boat.

[1968Droptop]

roostwear:
REALLY glad to hear your doing better Mike. June 12th ? Man that's a LOT of spare time. A guy can spend a lot of money sitting around bored with a computer in from of him, can you say E-Bay, Jegs, Summit...LOL I'll pass the info on to Tony about the headers, THANKS ! As for my boat, thanks for the info. more horsepower , the answer to every question !!!!! Low 70's ? I'm still pretty happy with that...for now :cool: It sounds like you are of the opinion my Sanger is doing what it should.
HBjet:
Thanks for taking the time to respond. My hull is indeed a Gull Wing design (can kind of see it in the pix). I have takin a straight edge to the hull (for/aft) and it seems to be pretty darn flat. Not sure what you mean by rocker ??? It's a 30 yo boat, and the bottom has some scratches from beaching, but no big dents or bulges. By reading your post, your opinion is my boat is doing what it should do at speed, right ?
Captain Assin' Off & Malcolm:
Maybe, yes, yes, yes, yes, not quite, a little, a little, no, no, no, no, yes, and finally no. :p
CAS:
I was afraid someone would say that.
Wet Dream:
Sorry the pix I posted weren't any help. I did what I thought might help others to answer my question. Like I said, I'm still pretty new to the boating world and just trying to learn.

[jrork]

In it's current state the boat does 75 at 5200.
Is this what my hull should do, or is this something to be concerned about ?
Nutz, This is a problem I will never have......Maybe I should post something on low speed handling issues......

[TRG]

I really do not have this kind of issue in my Rogers,even as long as ive had it, but i will tell you that it gets pretty squirlyin moderate chop around 50mph, it chine walks pretty good but in the smooth water there is no problems as far as chine walking anywhere in the throttle! although if you were to look at the bottom on either side of your intake fins, you will see a difference in the hook from either side! just my opinion though.
Randy, one helluvan explanation about the gullwing design,...you might wanna stand up and take a bow for that one!
Todd

[flat broke]

As far as chine walking being "something your boat is supposed to do?" That is more a matter of something your boat is prone to do. Just because it has the tendency and essentially it may be "normal" behavior for your particular hull, does not mean it is a good thing. Think of it like a kid with turrets (or however the hell you spell it). For him, screaming obscenities in public is normal, and you wouldn't really chastise him for doing it. But compared to other children without the afliction, most would say it is bad behavior.
Personally I feel uneasy in a boat that chine walks. Doesn't matter how much I trust the driver or how consistent the water is, it's a unsettling feeling. If you are having to make any sort of steering correction to control the problem, you are no longer driving the boat, but trying to overcome the handling problem which deters from your ability to react to other issues like changing water conditions, traffic etc. To each their own, but just because something is "normal" doesn't mean its good.
Chris

[1968Droptop]

Thanks for all the replies. I'll keep a close eye on how the boat feels/reacts in changing water conditions and at different speeds and relay that info after more than just a couple of runs.

[Tahiti350]

DropTop,
I've been into chine walk once, out on American Lake, and it was a little unnerving. Retrimmed the drive and smoothed right out. I know I have some issues with the hull (rough patches, and some mild hook). I'll be looking at trim tabs soon, but not quite like Geoff's.....
And Yes, I do wear a good life jacket, just in case, but you probably already noticed that I always put it on before I throttled up. Good jackets aren't exactly cheap, but medical bill are worse.

[jtmarten]

Are YOU acting right at speed? Do you have a goofy assed grin? Is the wind making your nose run, and eyes water, forming a vee shaped mixture of tears and snot, that eventually fills both ears? Do you have that oh so familiar tightening of the sphincter, maybe actually forcing your ass to take a big chomp out of your seat? Do you have a fearful look in your eyes after the run, are your legs charlied up, and do your arms ache? Are you out of gas? Are your friends in a state of awe and disbelief after the run, was it video taped for posterities sake? If you answer yes to most of those, you are acting properly...as for the boat, well...um...I don't know.... :crossx:
Maybe one of these will help keep you firmly planted in the seat
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/1692PRSr1.jpg

[Squirtin Thunder]

These boats with the double concave bottom are extremely stable. Chine walking is NOT a common problem. These boats will run 75 plus in shit water. I not sure what is going on with your boat, Chris, give me a call, let's see where you are at.
Jim

[Tahiti350]

Oh, BTW, I'm Gary, and I have a boating problem......
Memorial day weekend, today is almost cloudless, and I'm boatless, this sucks.

[1978 Rogers]

Nutz, This is a problem I will never have......Maybe I should post something on low speed handling issues......
Well, you have the right pump and engine for that. :crossx:
Chris, what has Skagen said? What about adjusting the rideplate angle.

[1968Droptop]

Well, you have the right pump and engine for that. :crossx:
Chris, what has Skagen said? What about adjusting the rideplate angle.
He didn' think it was anything to worry about. I've got more info today from ST, looks like MORE parts.....................

[1978 Rogers]

Ah yes, more parts. That can fix about anything. :)

[Sanger Jet]

I have the Super Jet and It's Scary as hell :cool:

[1968Droptop]

I have the Super Jet and It's Scary as hell :cool:
Now how does that do, Scary = Fast, or Fast = Scary :skull:

[bp]

my sw used to do that at anything over 95... but i made it stop... :)

[cyclone]

Some v-bottoms work well with droop snoots and some do not. some v-bottoms can stand to be aired out and still ride stable and on the keel while others do not.
for example- my first Rogers, an 18-foot cyclone with a deep-entry v bottom reacted horribly to a Place Diverter droop. It lifted the hull out of the water so much that it felt like the boat was riding on an ice skate blade and constantly fell off the keel and chine walked. It was a hull design that like to ride in the water and not so much on top of it.
but my second Rogers v-bottom, a 19-foot Bonneville TR, worked beautifully with a droop snoot and lots of up-angle on the ride plate. In fact i ran as much as 5-degrees up on the plate along with an AMT long droop and the boat didn't chine walk until it got up around 115 mph in windy conditions. In all other conditions it drove like it was on rails.
You mentioned that you had your diverter pointed almost all the way up and this likely contributed to the ill handling situation. Try lowering your ride plate to maybe 2-degrees up in relationship to the shoe and point the diverter around 1-2 degrees up from that. that should give you plenty of lift while still keeping the keel planted in water. Experiment from there and you'll find a happy medium between being aired out and having a secure ride. You might also want to experiment with a short droop or even a snoot. Try to borrow parts from your friends to try out before spending a lot of cash on stuff.

[1978 Rogers]

but my second Rogers v-bottom, a 19-foot Bonneville TR, worked beautifully with a droop snoot and lots of up-angle on the ride plate. In fact i ran as much as 5-degrees up on the plate along with an AMT long droop and the boat didn't chine walk until it got up around 115 mph in windy conditions. In all other conditions it drove like it was on rails.
Porter, see what my boat is capable of? Now if I didn't have to put 2 kids in daycare a certain orange and yellow boat might be able to pass Captain Chaos. lol :cry:

[1968Droptop]

Thanks for the indepth reply cyclone. I currently have a 7.5* short droop snoot. I was told to try a 2* wedge, pointing down, to change my thrust anlge a little bit. I'm hoping to level off the boat a little, while still getting air under it. I'm also going to play with the ride plate a bit. But I'll only change one thing at a time. On a side side not, it was a bit breezy that day, and you mentioned your boat only did it in the wind. HUH ?
This may be an ignorant question, but I see a lot of the replies have refered to 'V" hulls. I have a Gull Wing design, are those still considered a "V" hull ?
1978 Rogers: I don't doubt it for a minute. That boat looks as though it could do those speeds. All you need is another credit card :cool:

[bp]

gullwings are semi-v's. wedging down will lower thrust centerline. lowering thrust centerline can give you more keel lift.
running the pd all the way up is a lot of nozzle angle no matter where you put the thrust centerline. it's trying to drive the bow up by driving the transom into the water. try it a click down, then another click down. the plate could be in the 2-4 degree range, as cyclone indicated, but the nozzle angle (adjusted with pd) will have more of an impact. for your speed range, the nozzle -should- work best in the 5-7 degree -up- range.
gullwings shouldn't rock, and shouldn't be run with the nose jacked way up in the air. they -can- be blown over if you try hard enough.