Oil Filter # for 460? Short filter? Weight oil?

[stashtrey]

I'm at work and can't remember the part # for the shorter oil filter for my boat.
Also.... what oil do you guys run in a stock 460 Ford? I thought I read some people saying 10w 50????
I'm gonna change my oil after work.

[stashtrey]

Ah. Nevermind. I did a little search and found all my answers.
Thanks!

[bergen]

i dont know much, but i thought it was allways ph8a for 460's

[RiverRacer]

Fram PH-16. 20-40 Valvoline Racing Oil if it's close to dead stock. 20-50 or straight 50 wt if it has increased clearance. RR

[Moneypitt]

PH 43 is the short version of the PH 8A. I'm not sure if the PH 16 has the check flaps for horizonal mounting............MP

[Konabud]

You can also use a Wix 51068.

[Ken F]

Don't use a Fram. The filter elements have been known to colapse shutting off your oil flow. Do a google search on it.
Use the wix, or the better alternative is to get an oil filter adaptor from Ford Motor sports which turns your filter fore and aft. then you can run a big filter.
Contact Lem Evans @ 270-684-6268. He can ship you one at a good price.
Ken F

[Moneypitt]

Don't use a Fram. The filter elements have been known to colapse shutting off your oil flow. Do a google search on it.
Ken F
You know, there have been countless threads about not using Fram filters, and how others, like wix are better etc etc etc. I just want to say that in over 40 years of performance motorsports I have never had a filter, any filter, fail and cause any engine damage. I use Fram if I find them on sale, or just about any other brand on the street grocery getter. We have used Fram on the PS boat for about 6 tough racing seasons over the last 15 years without any filter related problems. IMO, most failures blamed on an oil filter, any brand, are wishful thinking, and those problems would've occured due to mechanical problems with a perfectly good filter..........MP

[Ken F]

As I stated in my post- google it
http://people.msoe.edu/~yoderw/oilfilterstudy/oilfilterstudy.html
Fram Extra Guard PH8A
This filter cartridge has a small outside diameter with a rather low filter element surface area (193 sqin), and features cardboard end caps that are glued in place. The rubber anti-drainback valve seals the rough metal backplate to the cardboard end cap and easily leaks, causing dirty oil to drain back into the pan. If you have a noisy valve train at startup, this filter is likely the cause. The bypass valves are plastic and are sometimes not molded correctly, which allows them to leak. The backplate has smaller and fewer oil inlet holes, which may restrict flow.
The telltale signs for a Fram Extra Guard are: It has 8 small holes for the oil inlet and a thin, cheap looking backplate, and is currently stamped with a "2Y". There are 5 very small crimps holding the gasket in place. If you look into the center hole all the way to the top of the filter, you will see a kind of "button" in the end cap of the cartridge (which looks like it's made of metal from there). This is the plastic bypass valve.

[RiverRacer]

I've never had a problem with a Fram Filter. Or a Wix, or Autolite or any other for that matter. 'Normal' FE Ford pressure for me is 120+ pounds at startup and 80+ at idle. 460's start and idle with less than that(70 on start and 30 at idle), so I use the PH-16 Filter (where space is an issue) and have never had a problem. At least not since 1967 or so. RR

[058]

Perhaps you are lucky. I had problems with Fram filters....from losing oil pressure on one engine to NOT filtering debris from oil in another engine [flatten cam lobes] in fact so much shit got past the filter the engine siezed up. Not even a breaker bar would turn the engine. A filter is suppose to trap the crap the engine produces even in the event of a failure....in this case the Fram failed miserably. Never again will a Fram will grace any of my engines.

[GunninGopher]

Perhaps you are lucky. I had problems with Fram filters....from losing oil pressure on one engine to NOT filtering debris from oil in another engine [flatten cam lobes] in fact so much shit got past the filter the engine siezed up. Not even a breaker bar would turn the engine. A filter is suppose to trap the crap the engine produces even in the event of a failure....in this case the Fram failed miserably. Never again will a Fram will grace any of my engines.
I had a problem with my last jet. It had a 460 with a hi-volume oil pump. I used to run a short filter all the time to make it easier to swap, and I changed it a couple of time a year, so I fugured if I kept pressure the reduced filter surface area wouldn't be a problem. One time I started losing pressure at mid and high rpm. I pulled the motor and the pressure relief valve in the pump was stuck to the retaining pin. That short filter was a Fram. I put in a standard size Fram, and a new pump. And it did it again. I switched to a new filter and then it didn't happen on the next trip. I sold the boat after that so I don't know what happened afterwards.
I'll never use a little filter again, but I did just put a Fram on my new one.

[Moneypitt]

Perhaps you are lucky. I had problems with Fram filters....from losing oil pressure on one engine to NOT filtering debris from oil in another engine [flatten cam lobes] in fact so much shit got past the filter the engine siezed up. Not even a breaker bar would turn the engine. A filter is suppose to trap the crap the engine produces even in the event of a failure....in this case the Fram failed miserably. Never again will a Fram will grace any of my engines.
What was locked up? The bearings? the pistons in the holes? Or the oil pump that sees oil before the filter.....??????Just curious..........MP

[058]

What was locked up? The bearings? the pistons in the holes? Or the oil pump that sees oil before the filter.....??????Just curious..........MPWhen I tore the engine down I loosened the #1 main cap and the engine spun free. There was so much shit in the bearing it reduced the clearance to less than zero. Crank was unhurt but other bearings had debris in them as well but not near as bad as the #1 main. The best conclusion I could come up with is the filter did not trap anything and there was less that 15 minutes of break-in time only so its not like the filter went into bypass from being on too long.

[Moneypitt]

When I tore the engine down I loosened the #1 main cap and the engine spun free. There was so much shit in the bearing it reduced the clearance to less than zero. Crank was unhurt but other bearings had debris in them as well but not near as bad as the #1 main. The best conclusion I could come up with is the filter did not trap anything and there was less that 15 minutes of break-in time only so its not like the filter went into bypass from being on too long.
Is this a Ford? BBC feed oil from the back, so the front main would be the last one to see debris. It kinda sounds like there was debris in the oil system down stream from the filter. It is almost impossible that a filter, any filter, would allow chunks big enough to polute the entire engine. Were there chunks in the filter? I have seen alot of bearing failures that looked as though the debris came from somewhere else, but in fact was caused by un chamfered oil holes chewing up the bearing material, kinda rolling it up and snowballing into large pieces, that in turn caused more and more material to be displaced into siezure mode. If a filter were inferior, it would be on the small stuff, measured in microns. Hell, a T shirt will catch the big stuff,(flakes), of bearing material. I think you said it also flattened a cam lobe in 15 minutes, could've been due to a tight lifter from debris in the oil galley leading to the lifters. Which lobe went flat?............MP

[058]

Fords oil from the front of the engine so #1 main is the first to get oil. The cam went flat because I tried to get away with too much spring pressure. Lifters were rotating and there was no assembly problems and clearances were checked. Nothing was overlooked or left to chance. The filter was opened and there was debris in the filter. The engine was complety hot washed and galley brushes used in the block and the crank. Oil holes in the crank were chamfered. My only screw up was trying to get away with too much spring pressure killing a few lobes during break-in. IMO the bypass in the filter was never closed allowing oil to bypass the filtering element or the bypass opened with the pressure from the cold oil. Since I switched to Baldwin filters I haven had any problems.

[Moneypitt]

Fords oil from the front of the engine so #1 main is the first to get oil. The cam went flat because I tried to get away with too much spring pressure. Lifters were rotating and there was no assembly problems and clearances were checked. Nothing was overlooked or left to chance. The filter was opened and there was debris in the filter. The engine was complety hot washed and galley brushes used in the block and the crank. Oil holes in the crank were chamfered. My only screw up was trying to get away with too much spring pressure killing a few lobes during break-in. IMO the bypass in the filter was never closed allowing oil to bypass the filtering element or the bypass opened with the pressure from the cold oil. Since I switched to Baldwin filters I haven had any problems.
But you also switched spring pressure........So switching filter brands wasn't comparing apples to apples.............MP

[sgdiv7]

If I read this right, It sounds like the bypass did its job, filter cloged up and the bypass opened. I don't like bypass valves for that reason. you will see oil psi drop befor the media blows apart, if your watching the oil guage that is.

[058]

But you also switched spring pressure........So switching filter brands wasn't comparing apples to apples.............MP
Point being the filter was bypassing intentional or not. It allowed debris into the engine. The spring pressure and cam going south was the cause of the debris [my fault, I know] but shouldn't have gotten past the filter if it had been doing its job. On large diesel engines the filter filters oil at all times cold or hot. The bypass only opens when the filter becomes almost completly stopped up. I have a hard time believing the 3 lobes that went south was enough material to stop up a filter causing it to bypass. If thats the case then the Fram does not have enough surface area to be a good filter, reason enough to switch brands. According to "Bob the oil guy" he claims the Fram only has 190 sq/in of filtering surface area, the least of any commerically available filter, the most filtering surface was the Motor-Craft with 390 sq/in of filtering surface. When I split the filter there was some debris in the element but appeared to be not enough to stop up the filter. There appeared to be more debris in the bottom of the filter than the element itself. Sorry guys, You won't convince me that the filter was not at least in part at fault. If I hadn't been pushing my luck with valve springs I doubt this whole thing would have happened but it did.