High flow bowl!

[svt2224]

Here are some pics of the bowl failure that I experienced at the SDBA race in OKC. This is the second bowl I have broken in two races, the last was at MF last season. Has anyone else ran into this problem?
Jhttp://thumb9.webshots.com/t/59/559/7/91/56/2391791560069608869cMbnTT_th.jpg (http://community.webshots.com/photo/2391791560069608869cMbnTT)

[Jet Hydro]

Looks like a unloading and loading problem. did you do that at the big end? I think it might take a bigger Band-Aid :220v:

[blown428fe]

Wow, same spot on both bowls?
http://image59.webshots.com/559/7/91/56/2391791560069608869cMbnTT_ph.jpg

[svt2224]

Both times that this has happend it has been right off the line just before the boat falls onto plane, I have spoke to a couple of the jet gurus that are around and I am going to add a MSD launch controler (thanks Gary) to try to cut down on cavitation. Both bowls dominator and berk have broke in the same place.

[UBFJ #454]

Picture posted here is of an older Berkeley?

[svt2224]

It's a few years old, I bought it as a new old stock item.

[UBFJ #454]

Hard to tell from a picture ... you'll have to check ... From picture it mlooks like a Core Shift in the casting (mic both sides of the break ... looks like maybe approaching 0.100 difference side to side ... w/nodular Al cast material in the inner portion of the cast ... again hard to be sure with only pictures) if anything close to what I think I see ... Bad Casting with Bad Pour of cast material (nodules imply non constant pour ... segeration og materials ... manufacture's Flaw). Also it appears the bowl vein shown in you picture is 'cracked' at its base .....
Who did the front of the bowl blades Prep? If too much cut straight (w/o side direction, only up into bowl ... too much pressure can build up at top of bowl and with a Poor Casting ... Pop Can Go The Bowl) ... You've said 'free flow bowl' ... I'm understanding that to mean someone has tried to make the bowl flow free'er by taking out the restrictions of the bends af the blades of the bowl at their onset ... that can be bone, but path of water entry into the bowl off the impeller is critical, especially with a poorly, mis-cast bowl.

[DEL51]

That pic is small. is it double bolted? Do hi end builders sonic check bowls?

[Cs19]

Youve got a problem there.. I seriously doubt the bowl prep work or core shift caused TWO different bowls to fail in the same area.
Heavy cavitation would be my guess.What does the boat feel like when you stand on the gas?
Tell us about your set up and pump work youve had done in the past.

[Cs19]

Need better pics too, i only see one pic and its worthless.

[sanger rat]

That pic is small. is it double bolted? Do hi end builders sonic check bowls?
Click on the picture for a bigger shot.

[svt2224]

I don't think it is a core shift problem do to the fact that the casting measurement is very close across the break, the same goes for the dominator bowl that failed, both of which had cracked the vanes about 2" back along the hub. My hi-flow statement was refering to the large volume of water that escaped from the bowl and hit the bottom of the bridge over the starting line. The blades were not heavly modified the leading edges were cleaned up and the bowl has been indexed for a 9.25 impeller. I run a full open loader, inducer,2deg up shoe 1/16 below keel, ride plate is set at 2.5deg up, berkley r nozzel 3deg up with a 3 1/16 insert. The boat leaves pretty good, the motor flashes to about 7800rpm and drops to around 6700rpm when loaded. http://community.webshots.com/photo/552430231/2936253010069608869rcdSIO
http://http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/59/559/2/53/1/2936253010069608869rcdSIO_th.jpg (http://community.webshots.com/photo/2936253010069608869rcdSIO)

[steelcomp]

Is it possible that there's still air in the bowl when you're hitting it? With those RPM specs and impeller, you're obviously making big power...I'm guessing that there's some water hammering going on there.
That sucks...twice.

[MikeF]

Do you have a picture of the loader you are using? Is it the same loader used when damage to both bowls?

[Cs19]

I don't think it is a core shift problem do to the fact that the casting measurement is very close across the break
the bowl has been indexed for a 9.25 impeller.
I run a full open loader, inducer,2deg up shoe 1/16 below keel, ride plate is set at 2.5deg up, berkley r nozzel 3deg up with a 3 1/16 insert. The boat leaves pretty good, the motor flashes to about 7800rpm and drops to around 6700rpm when loaded.
I dont think its core shift either,berkeley or dominator bowls dont just break, its something in your combination that is hammering on the bowl.
Your set up doesnt sound way off or anything, I was expecting you to say you had 15" of blocker cause that could be something that would cause starvation or cavitation at the hit of the throttle.Your probably just cavitating REALLY hard off the line and hammering on your pump..7800 RPM off the line definatly is not helping your situation,a launch controller should help alot.
Explain "the bowl has been indexed" to me, i think i know what you mean just want to clarify.
Thanks.

[Jim Brock]

with the inducer and a 9.25 empeller i think you are loading to much water and choking it down to much 3 1/16, putting to much in and not letting enough out. something has to give, try opening it up to 3.125

[MikeF]

with the inducer and a 9.25 empeller i think you are loading to much water and choking it down to much 3 1/16, putting to much in and not letting enough out. something has to give, try opening it up to 3.125
BUT......did both bowls fail in the same spot?! :boxed:

[Jet Hydro]

Yes there is some Core Shift but, I still say loading and unloading and reloading.
I have found out that "any jet with any kind of power will take 3.125 or "larger" insert
You might also need a longer or deeper loader like I run on my hydro?
I use to blow out my wedges all the time till I made my new loader.
You should have hooked up with me at OK City I could have had you back on the water as my motor was blown first thing Saturday morning. I had everything you needed!
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497broken.jpg

[bp]

going to 7800, then back to 6700 indicates to me that you're voiding the suction piece between the rope and the beam. the effect isn't cavitation induced, but created by loss of, or partial loss of suction to a pump. when that happens, pressure inside the suction drops so low, some of the water changes to gas, which exacerbates the condition. then, at a point where speed increases, you finally overcome the low pressure with a full charge of water supply (rpm drop), and a resulting spike in bowl pressure. kind of like running, at full speed, over a hole in the water, with bowl pressure going to zero, then fully recovering. the bowl pressure spikes you can get when you do that are pretty impressive. it's not that pressure is way too high, it's the immediate spike in pressure that can cause a problem. and as jim mentioned, with a 3.0625 insert, that spike is gonna be way way higher than it would be with a 3.125, or 3.156.
if you've been doing this repetitively, there is probably a bit of metal fatigue involved, and it finally said "i'm done here". the cracking you mentioned may have already been there, as a result of the repetitive hammering. a launch controller can be programmed to prevent this. if you just put a rev limit chip at 7000, the potential for this could be reduced. you should also have some data collection on that thing, so you can see exactly what is happening. but you should probably have the best bowl you can get to handle this kind of abuse - a new amt.
haven't seen anything like it since roger sayles brand new bowl, but that bowl had paper thin walls, and the piece that blew out was very thin.
just my 2cents...

[svt2224]

Last season I ran a 3.125 insert, this is what I was using when the dominator bowl broke. At that time I was running a Agressor AA, inducer with no luck getting the thing to hook up consistantly. I switched to the 9.25 over the winter which helped with the launch and brought back the consistency that I had lost, I droped the insert down to 3 1/16 with the intentions of lifting the boat a little more.
BP I think your theory is right on the money, the LC should (I hope) lower the pressure spike at take off. I guess we will see at Ft. Worth.

[bp]

sv, reducing the insert diameter -should- reduce the voiding. the nozzle insert affects velocity and volume; smaller=higher velocity, less volume, so more volume is available in the suction piece. however, less volume at no speed reduces acceleration because the velocity difference isn't as significant at no speed as hi speed.
sound like you may need to address hardware/bottom, to get better loading off the rope. going to a .156 will increase initial acceleration IF you can keep the thing loaded. but, going to the .156 will require more water.
with data collection, you can see how much differenc these seemingly small nozzle changes make to intake conditions between the rope and beam.
btw, i hope i didn't imply that you have NO cavitation. it just needs to be recognized that the cavitation you are experiencing is secondary to what is causing it.

[Squirtcha?]

You should have hooked up with me at OK City I could have had
you back on the water as my motor was blown first thing Saturday
morning. I had everything you needed!
Probably best that he didn't come to see you. He's already got two
blown out bowls so the problem is still there. You might have ended
up with one in similar condition.

[svt2224]

I had some local friend's offer to lend me a bowl. I did not use it for the exact reason that Squirtcha mentioned, I have two broken bowls and did not need a third. I am fairly confident that the launch controller will help by providing some forward motion to load the pump before it hits full power.
BP what type of data aquisition do you use and were are your pressure taps located?

[Cs19]

the bowl has been indexed for a 9.25 impeller.
What do you mean indexed? Was the bowl repositioned on the suction or did you mean the bowl was opened up for the 9.250 impeller.
CS

[Cs19]

the motor flashes to about 7800rpm and drops to around 6700rpm when loaded.
6700 on a 9.250 impeller, What kind of ET and MPH are you seeing? and what hull ?
CS

[Jet Hydro]

I would think it would be better to fix the boat to launch flat footed then to have to use a launch controller. There are a ton of parts out there that might help you get out of the hole. :)

[bp]

i can stand on the gas with no limiter without any problem, but i choose to use the launch controller, and have since jim lee invented the first one when we were running risky business. the launch controller is useful for lots of things.

[steelcomp]

6700 on a 9.250 impeller, What kind of ET and MPH are you seeing? and what hull ?
CSquote svt2224I run a black and gold Condor Lightening #507, with a mild blown alky bbc.

[svt2224]

As steelcomp stated I am running a 18' Condor lightning, it is a heavy lake lay-up (740# with intake only). The best ET I have seen since switching it to alcohol was a 8.40 @ 117 at waco in the spring. These hulls are pretty quick but not very fast, the best 1/8 mile it has ran was a 4.62. The motor is a 496 with ported Dart 360's, stage 4 8-71 Littlefield, Enderle birdcatcher and 110 pump. I'll try to post an old and new pic of the boat, I doubt it works.http://www.dragboats.com/gallery/picture_detail.php?PictureID=2194&RecID=8

[svt2224]

old

[Cs19]

As steelcomp stated I am running a 18' Condor lightning, it is a heavy lake lay-up (740# with intake only). The best ET I have seen since switching it to alcohol was a 8.40 @ 117 at waco in the spring. These hulls are pretty quick but not very fast, the best 1/8 mile it has ran was a 4.62. The motor is a 496 with ported Dart 360's, stage 4 8-71 Littlefield, Enderle birdcatcher and 110 pump. I'll try to post an old and new pic of the boat, I doubt it works.http://www.dragboats.com/gallery/picture_detail.php?PictureID=2194&RecID=8
Sorry i missed the part where you already mentioned what hull you had.
Those are respectable times, I imagine it will get even better once you get a handle on these issues.
Good luck with it, let us know how the launch controller works out.
Chris.

[Cs19]

I would think it would be better to fix the boat to launch flat footed then to have to use a launch controller. There are a ton of parts out there that might help you get out of the hole. :)
Everyone does things different.
Im curious as to what you would do to get this thing off the line without cavitating the crap out of the jetdrive.
high RPM burnouts (7800) off the line dont get you anywhere, the pump goes into cavitation and the bowl pressure goes into a huge dip which means no thrust which means you sit there while your competition is GONE.

[Aluminum Squirt]

SVT2224, I'm no drag racer so take this with a grain of salt. Have you looked at the Eagle/Outlaw (aluminum boats out of Canada) billet bowls? Not sure if it is at all suited for the 1/4 mile but I do know they take extreme abuse, not only from rocks on the outside, but also in large pressure variances from the continous loading/unloading that a white water river generates. I'm sure you are hitting it with quite a bit more HP that we deal with but its worth looking into. Your also probably loading it pretty hard. The fast guys in U, A, and B class develop some pretty good intake pressures but we can't hang a loader in there (it'll get ripped off) so our intake pressures are probably lower but that is a guess. I'm just a stock class recreational racer but if you are interrested, take a peak over on the Eagle/Outlaw forum, there are plenty of fast guys over there that could probably answer your questions. Not sure of the price, but I know they are expensive. I figured with a boat running those numbers, you already know racing isn't cheap. The bowls, by the way, are a total work of art machining wise. I have a picture of-Aluminum Squirt

[bp]

those billet bowls are pretty nice, but at a fairly heavy price tag. racing doesn't have to be -that- expensive...
3 or 4 years ago, bill rathke won our 8.50 class with a blown alky motor in an old mach1 jet. he had some type of rev limiting on it for launching, and i don't recall him ever having any pump problems. that thing would run 8.50 to 8.52 all the time.

[steelcomp]

Squirt, those bowls are pure sex, and for what you guys do, probably well worth the $$, but after reading this thread, I think the problem here isn't a weak bowl, it's a water supply/starvation problem. A stronger bowl is only going to bandaid an already existing problem that needs to be quantified and solved. DA is going to be the key here, otherwise I think it's all guessing.SVT2224, I'm no drag racer so take this with a grain of salt. Have you looked at the Eagle/Outlaw (aluminum boats out of Canada) billet bowls? Not sure if it is at all suited for the 1/4 mile but I do know they take extreme abuse, not only from rocks on the outside, but also in large pressure variances from the continous loading/unloading that a white water river generates. I'm sure you are hitting it with quite a bit more HP that we deal with but its worth looking into. Your also probably loading it pretty hard. The fast guys in U, A, and B class develop some pretty good intake pressures but we can't hang a loader in there (it'll get ripped off) so our intake pressures are probably lower but that is a guess. I'm just a stock class recreational racer but if you are interrested, take a peak over on the Eagle/Outlaw forum, there are plenty of fast guys over there that could probably answer your questions. Not sure of the price, but I know they are expensive. I figured with a boat running those numbers, you already know racing isn't cheap. The bowls, by the way, are a total work of art machining wise. I have a picture of-Aluminum Squirt

[motormonkey]

Is it possably popping because your bowl has no bleeder in it. Launching with air bubble at that rpm cant be good.

[Aluminum Squirt]

Agreed Steelcomp, the bowl is addressing a symptom not the problem which is always a band aid. I'd still like to see if one of those bowls will perform on a flatwater boat. Man they look sweet and no doubt they are strong-Aluminum Squirt

[bp]

Is it possably popping because your bowl has no bleeder in it. Launching with air bubble at that rpm cant be good.
no.

[steelcomp]

no.Are you saying no because of time on the rope at idle before launch?

[motormonkey]

I noticed boats with droops take time to purge bowl. Sitting on line doesnt purge bowl, then firing, looking at lights and then hammering from slow roll with blown motor. The pressure spike from air compressing could be blowing bowl. It seems like cheap insurance to me.

[Aluminum Squirt]

This probably sounds pretty crazy but: wouldn't air in the bowl actually provide a little bit of cushion for the shock of that much water due to air's inherant 'compressability'. I'm probably not thinking right but water does not compress and with that much HP, I'm sure those kind of RPM's/HP are a pretty large stress on a bowl. While I'm sure having air in there either from being trapped or from cavitation is not the right answer as far as ET's and set-up go, I would think that an air pocket would actually provide some cushion for most of the parts and keep the pressure spikes a little less sharp. Only problem with my theory is that when there is air in there, the impellar has nothing to grab so the RPM's shoot way up and when the intake pressure finally goes positive, it probably makes one hell of a pressure spike. I still agree with SC and think that we are looking at too many symptoms and not enough solutions that will provide a little bit softer launch and less RPM's. I'm mostly talking out my ass but I'm very interrested in this discussion. It's way better tha the typical Chevy vs Ford or how do I plumb my new exhaust discussion-Aluminum Squirt

[motormonkey]

I was thinking when the air compresses, the pressure of the water in suction housing slamming into the water in the droop. With all the air in top of pump it seems that when it does load the water under pressure , slamming into the water thats not flowing yet as the air bubble is holding just long enuff to cause hammering, like kinking a hose and letting it go in a bucket. I also think way to much rpm on launch untill it loaded. Just thinking out loud. I wonder what it looks like from the line when it blows...and how far out it when it happens...

[steelcomp]

If the air pocket (whether caused by lack of filling of the bowl or cavitation) was to remain stationary, then yes, I believe it might act as somewhat of a cushion. But... since it's not stationary, and the air is suddenly displaced when conditions are met, the impact of the water against the bowl as it displaces the air is most likely what's causing the damage. Since water can't compress, it's mass X it's velocity = a whole lot of energy. It may as well be a solid at that point. I'm beginning to believe it's a bottom/keel/entry shape issue. Again, DA is going to be very useful here, but for now, the launch control is going to help a lot. Like bp said, the launch control is useful in many other ways, so even if the problem is solved mechanically (or hydrodynamically), the LC won't be wasted.
I think.
edited because I can't write, I can't spell, and what I had written made no sense at all. :rolleyes:

[Jet Hydro]

Everyone does things different.
Im curious as to what you would do to get this thing off the line without cavitating the crap out of the jetdrive.
high RPM burnouts (7800) off the line dont get you anywhere, the pump goes into cavitation and the bowl pressure goes into a huge dip which means no thrust which means you sit there while your competition is GONE.I ran 5.097 @ 98.253mph @ the 660 and I flat foot it from the line with no launch controller. He had a 4.62. so theres not a lot of difference, I did it with out cavitating the crap out of the jetdrive. I would spend some time seting up the boat to launch with out taking a bounce or with out standing the nose up. I made myself a loader to fixed my off the line cavitating and worked on the set-up to make it jump forward and not up on the hole shot.
These day`s you have to think "out of the box!" I spend many hours testing parts till I find the right combos and I look at things form the other side of the wall. Works for me and so far, for all the boats I have set-up. Times have changed but, people still think like we are back in time! :220v:

[steelcomp]

JH...I've been impressed with your efforts and progress, and you deserve a lot of credit for what you've accomplished, but I don't see that anything you've had to overcome has anything to compare with a typical hull. You're not running near the power, and from what I can see, the dynamics of your boat is probably nothing like anything else. Let's face it...you've had no choice but to think "outside the box", since there is no box where your deal is concerned. What may work on your boat is (probably) not going to be effective here, or on any other "typical" hull, so to compare your setup with anyone else's except another jet hydro isn't really an accurate or useful comparison. On that note, just because I'm curious, what would you do specifically to solve the problem here? I ran 5.097 @ 98.253mph @ the 660 and I flat foot it from the line with no launch controller. He had a 4.62. so theres not a lot of differance, I did it with out cavitating the crap out of the jetdrive. I would spend some time seting up the boat to launch with out taking a bounce or with out standing the nose up. I made myself a loader to fixed my off the line cavitating and worked on the set-up to make it jump forward and not up on the hole shot.
These day`s you have to think "out of the box!" I spend many hours testing parts till I find the right combos and I look at things form the other side of the wall. Works for me and so far, for all the boats I have set-up. Times have changed but, people still think like we are back in time! :220v:

[bp]

This probably sounds pretty crazy but: wouldn't air in the bowl actually provide a little bit of cushion for the shock of that much water due to air's inherant 'compressability'.
if there is an air pocket in the top of the pump, the pump will be air bound and it won't create pressure in the bowl. the pump has to be full of water to function. with no pressure, the boat won't move.
air in the pump is a bad thing.

[Jet Hydro]

JH...I've been impressed with your efforts and progress, and you deserve a lot of credit for what you've accomplished, but I don't see that anything you've had to overcome has anything to compare with a typical hull. You're not running near the power, and from what I can see, the dynamics of your boat is probably nothing like anything else. Let's face it...you've had no choice but to think "outside the box", since there is no box where your deal is concerned. What may work on your boat is (probably) not going to be effective here, or on any other "typical" hull, so to compare your setup with anyone else's except another jet hydro isn't really an accurate or useful comparison. On that note, just because I'm curious, what would you do specifically to solve the problem here?
steelcomp I`m not sure you really understand but I work on more then just my Hydro. I even set-up and tune a V-Drive Hydro amoung other boats. Yes what I`m doing with the Hydro is damn sure out of the box as even Duane gave up 2 years a go. I look at each problem in a different light then the others do because they learned it the old way. Everything I`v done on my Hydro I was told NOT to do but you and I know it has worked and is working. Now as far as the power goes I was on a 9.90 run last weekend, I was told but I have NOT done the math yet but, I was told I was on a 9.60 run when I lost the motor. It takes a little power to move a 2500lb boat. He say`s his boat is a lake lay up "HEAVY" My hull is 900.lbs. I use the same tunning ways to set-up the blue boat with the SBC and it`s a V-Bottom not a Hydro. He`s running 74.7mph with a small block in a big deep ski boat with a delta bottom. Once again, I had to go out side of the box as all the other builders told me we were not going to make it happen but guess what "WE DID". I`m looking for a tunnel hull to play with as I have a few things I want to try on one that I use on the Hydro. My pod is very close to the center pod as a tunnel hulls. I keep my nose low and the tail up on the intake. I see no reason why this cant be done on a tunnel hull. All the tunnels I see racing or running strong are nose up and draging the ass. I think I can see some speed changes if the nose can be lowered and the tail riding on the intake. Less chance of blow overs if the nose is lower, right? Like I said I look at things from a different light and so far my out of the box thinking had worked fo me and the others I have helped. You will soon see the SJ Project as it`s gonna start today. Last ran it GPSed 72. We`ll see what my "out of the box" thinking can do with the same motor set-up and a pump/bottom change. It has nothing to do with the Hydro, it has to do with the way I look at things and go "out side the box" and try new things.
I`d bet if I had his boat I could make it "flat foot" off the line with a little set-up and some R&D.
steelcomp I cant really say what I`d change with out looking the boat over and seeing it make a few passes. I`d think maybe the shoe/ loader game and maybe a little nozzel changing. It`s not as easy as just going off what works for someone else. You have to do some home work.

[Cs19]

All the tunnels I see racing or running strong are nose up and draging the ass. I think I can see some speed changes if the nose can be lowered and the tail riding on the intake. Less chance of blow overs if the nose is lower, right? Like I said I look at things from a different light and so far my out of the box thinking had worked fo me.
Geez that was quite a post you laid down Jet Hydro.
BTW, your idea of setting up a tunnel is not thinking outside the box, thats actually very common for a fast tunnell.
You should try applying your "ideas" or "outside the box thinking" to a 120 mph tunnel boat, i think youll find there are a ton of problems to overcome with a boat running in those speeds opposed to one running the speed your running, its a tottally different ballgame.

[steelcomp]

All the tunnels I see racing or running strong are nose up and draging the ass. I think I can see some speed changes if the nose can be lowered and the tail riding on the intake. LOL...dude...
awww, never mind. What CS said. :rolleyes:

[Jet Hydro]

What's the difference??? He`s getting to the 660 at 4.62? I get there on a "blown" or "broken" motor at 5.097 = 0.477 difference :idea: ..,. Never mind I know nothing and that SJ is calling me to come cut a big ass hole in it :supp: ...later

[Cs19]

What's the difference??? He`s getting to the 660 at 4.62? I get there on a "blown" or "broken" motor at 5.097 = 0.477 difference :idea: ..,. Never mind I know nothing and that SJ is calling me to come cut a big ass hole in it :supp: ...later
We are not comparing you to anyone else..
But if you want to.. The .477 is a HUGE difference, you were both most likely tapped out at 660 ft. so he basically kicked your ass to 600 ft by half a second..Actually your 5.09 1/2 track time doesnt really add up that well, his 4.62 with an 8.40 does.What did you say you ran in the 1/4 with a 5.09 half track?

[Jet Hydro]

:rolleyes: Yea ok :idea: maybe next time I`ll do it on 8 :220v: :argue: :)

[Cs19]

No, what did you run on that 5.09 pass? Thats a respectable time.

[Jet Hydro]

I didnt run, it broke and rolled the lights @ a 10.14 at 81.699mph doing 98.253mph at the 660. and no it`s not toped at the 660 either

[Cs19]

I didnt run, it broke and rolled the lights @ a 10.14 at 81.699mph doing 98.253mph at the 660. and no it`s not toped at the 660 either
Never said they were.. Something is off there but Ill let it go, this thread is too far off subject.

[Jet Hydro]

you were both most likely tapped out at 660 ft. :idea: looks like Some one did???? :idea:

[svt2224]

My Hull does not have a drop keel, and the center pod is wider than most tunnels. I have taken some pictures of the bottom, however I am still stuck in the dark ages and using a 35mm camera so it will be a bit before I get them up. I also failed to mention that I run ~40psi intake pressure mid-track and the boat leaves flat with very little bow rise leaving flat footed. I have some video as soon as I figure out how to post it I will get it up.
Thanks
Jason

[poncho-pwr]

No offense JetHydro, but you are trying to tell a guy who's boat runs 8.40s that he doesn't have his boat set up right and you could certainly make it leave flat-footed without any problems, yet your best run is a 10.14?????? What in the hell do you know about setting up a mid to low eight second jet boat? Yes, you made a lake boat run 74.4mph with a small block, and yes you are making your heavy hydro(non-tunnel) run well I guess, but you are not in this guys league yet compadre so ease up a bit.

[Cs19]

What in the hell do you know about setting up a mid to low eight second jet boat? .
exactly, its a different deal... when you get down into those numbers you start developing some odd problems with the boat but you dont even know whats happening, why its happening or what direction to go.even with a data logger it can be hard to see whats happening...Its different and a real challenge.

[Cs19]

:idea: looks like Some one did???? :idea:
no actually i misunderstood what you were TRYING to say as you misspelled topped, i thought you were implying something about the 1/8 mile clocks being off.
The jetboats in TE around here generally run 4.9-5.0 to the 1/8, so you might as well pull those ME? stickers off and put TE stickers on.

[steelcomp]

If svt has the cavitation problems that seem to be evident, then he's probably losing two to three thenths before the 660 just due to that. Maybe more. Making it up pretty good on the big end, though. Get that thing hooked, and it's going to be a lot quicker.

[Jet Hydro]

no actually i misunderstood what you were TRYING to say as you misspelled topped, i thought you were implying something about the 1/8 mile clocks being off.
The jetboats in TE around here generally run 4.9-5.0 to the 1/8, so you might as well pull those ME? stickers off and put TE stickers on.
Sorry I missed the extra P In topped :rolleyes: Oh yea and a boat that had a best time of 8.40 somewhere in it`s life is not going to be an 8.0 boat so it looks like he may also be in the TE Class that my boat may be in?? Like I said you think what you want it`s no big deal to me as I have my boat hooking up HARD and going straight, even blowing the motor it went straight.Like I said it`s no big deal to me. :)

[Jet Hydro]

No offense JetHydro, but you are trying to tell a guy who's boat runs 8.40s that he doesn't have his boat set up right and you could certainly make it leave flat-footed without any problems, yet your best run is a 10.14?????? What in the hell do you know about setting up a mid to low eight second jet boat? Yes, you made a lake boat run 74.4mph with a small block, and yes you are making your heavy hydro(non-tunnel) run well I guess, but you are not in this guys league yet compadre so ease up a bit.
If you call knocking holes in a bowl set up right then remind me to never let you work on my tub.
What in the hell do you know about setting up a mid to low eight second jet boat? More then you think and more then I`ll let out on here. :)
Good Day :D

[svt2224]

If you call knocking holes in a bowl set up right then remind me to never let you work on my tub.
Sorry I missed the extra P In topped Oh yea and a boat that had a best time of 8.40 somewhere in it`s life is not going to be an 8.0 boat so it looks like he may also be in the TE Class that my boat may be in?? Like I said you think what you want it`s no big deal to me as I have my boat hooking up HARD and going straight, even blowing the motor it went straight.Like I said it`s no big deal to me.
Jet Hydro, knocking my set up skills is not something that I appreciate, whether or not it is directed towards me or as a defensive measure towards others posting to this tread. I have won a WC in ME and I don't believe that is something comes with poor set ups. My move to TE has brought about challenges that I had not ran across when running the slower class and as CS19 stated the few tenths needed to switch classes do not come easy. By the way the best of 8.40 was made on a shake down run with a mild, what I thought was a 9.00 tune. My motor is happy running 9's and I am able to run a full season plus some lake trips without any major problems which keeps my operating cost down and my wife happy. I had an Idea of how to keep this from occuring when I posted this thread, however I wanted to hear from my fellow racers concerning this particular problem and its possible solutions.

[Jet Hydro]

knocking my set up skills is not something that I appreciate
Forget I said anything ok, you seem to take things out of context. I was wrong to say anything about your set-up and you are set up just fine if you like knocking holes in your bowls. I`m done with it, it`s not my bowl blowing apart anyway. Sorry you took it the way you did and hope you figure out why your set-up is knocking those holes out. I`ll keep my mouth shut now. :220v:
See ya on the holding rope! :crossx:

[Cs19]

svt, your times are impressive dont let anyone try and and tell you otherwise. Sorry your thread got off topic.

[poncho-pwr]

I have heard from a lot of people around here that those 18 foot youngblood/condors are VERY difficult to set up and make behave once they are running over about 105mph, so I would say svt2224 is doing a pretty damn good job!!

[svt2224]

svt, your times are impressive dont let anyone try and and tell you otherwise. Sorry your thread got off topic.
No problem, I appreciate all of the input on the subject.
I have heard from a lot of people around here that those 18 foot youngblood/condors are VERY difficult to set up and make behave once they are running over about 105mph, so I would say svt2224 is doing a pretty damn good job!!
Thanks Poncho, making this thing run as good as it does was definately not easy, it took many hardware changes and good ole trial and error to get rid of the big end hop these hulls are famous for and I am confident that the "bowl ventilating" problem can be solved as well.
Thanks
J