who's running a 383.

[Powerplayin]

I am building a new sbc 383 for this summer, it is going in a 1989 18' Powerplay.
I would like to see your guy's combo's and any idea's you have... here is mine so far..
94' 4 bolt block
eagle 4130 forged 3.75" stroker crank
eagle H beam, 3-D ESP rods...
SRP forged pistons. 9.8:1(has a dish of 16cc)
Hastings Moly rings
vortec cast iron heads, screw in 7/16 studs and guideplates.
Crane full roller valvetrain
Crane roller cam.. 222/230 dur. .509/.528 lift 112 LSA.. gonna use 1.6 rockers so lift will be .543/.563 lift
matching springs, retainers and locks.
Edelbrock RPM air gap intake
750 holley, vac sec and elc.choke
IMCO thumper power exhaust
I am hopeing for around 380 hp..
any advice?
Travis

[canuck1]

I've had no luck with the eagle stuff, spend a little more and buy a quality crank and rods. The victor intake would be a better choice for a boat and mech secondary carb. I have run a similar combo in my race car and sprint boat with good results, approx 425 hp

[Powerplayin]

Can you tell me what went wrong with your eagle stuff?
Thanks
Travis

[canuck1]

According to the builder the metal is not of the best quality(chinese). 7 races to a set of rods and 2 cranks. The parts wouldn't pass mag test/cracks. This is in a class that only sees 6000 rpm

[canuck1]

We went to crower sportsman rods $400.00 approx and have run them 35 races with no problems. these motors are checked every 3 races. for a few more $ buy the american parts

[Infomaniac]

Travis:
Eagle had some problems in their early days. This has been 5 years ago. They have since made marked improvements in their QC program. Every rod and crank is x-rayed. Just about every brand of H beam steel rod that is not carillo is made in china. At 380 HP I would not worry about any brand of rod.
Why Vortec heads? These are extremely thin. They crack very easily. unless they are very cheap I would use something else.
It appears you are building your engine for high RPM's, if not I would reconsider some of those parts to build touque.
If you are going to buy new rods and pistons, try and get 6" rods. The added torque will be well worth it.
Do you have any flow numbers for the heads? Someone has them if they have stock ports. Do not increase the lift unless you know the heads flow good at that lift.
Oh Yea, I have eagle rods in my blown alcohol injected 1,000 HP engine.
Sometimes I come across as being very negative, but when asked I do give advice since I have been there and done that many times.
Good luck.

[canuck1]

Infomaniac
Last year we blew up 3 motors with the eagle parts. The problem was the quality of the metal being used I,m not a metal expert but the tests came back with these results. We used the rest of the new parts we had left and had them checked before they failed, they were showing stress cracks.
If the motor is going to be run at the limit extensively I wouldn't use them. My .02

[Powerplayin]

Its only gonna see 5200 rpm max..
The vortec heads were a good price from a buddie. I haven't heard about anybody cracking the heads.
A buddie runs a eagle stuff in his drag cars, so I am not worrying to much.. I did go with the 6" rods and a SRP piston to match. I am still debating about 1.6 or 1.5 rockers, Bruce at WPM thought it was a perfect combo with the 1.5's and I wouldn't gain much by using the 1.6's if the heads were not ported, but the only thing he insisted on was a single plane manifold.
Infomanic... what would you change to build more torque?
Thanks guy's

[Infomaniac]

Powerplayin: Actually the intake is the first thing I would change. Single plane intakes kill bottom end, They are meant to make HP. The Edelbrock Performer is designed to increase torque. Anything with RPM in the designation is not what you need. Also I would pick a cam with a bit less duration to get the RPM range down a bit more. If the RPM range of the cam is 1,500 more than you are going to turn it, it is a waste. You could be using the extra low end and broader torque band with a shorter duration cam.
ALL ENGINES make more torque than HP up to 5,252 RPM. At this point they are equal. HP just begins to exceed torque at this RPM. Take my word for it I ran engine Dyno's for many years. If you plan to use the engine at that RPM then you must have the combination of parts to match.
Good Luck
[This message has been edited by Infomaniac (edited March 03, 2002).]

[Powerplayin]

Thanks for the info... http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif http://free.***boat.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

[LIBERATOR]

I also run a 385 SBC. Was told by my engine builder to stay away from the Vortec heads. I am using the World Products Torquer 2 cast iron. Was also advised to use a dual plane intake. I am using the Edlebrock Performer RPM. I am curious as to the response by Bruce about the single plane because I trust his judgment. He built my carburator.

[Mike Lindberg]

I know your vortec heads will work fine at 5200 rpm,my friend runs them on his 20 ft. open bow v-hull.He's got a crower cam with .470 and .490 lift,otherwise stock except for holley 750 and aftermarket exhaust manifolds with transom exhaust. he runs high 60's at 5000rpm with a 23"laser.Does you boat have an alpha drive?I also run a 20'v-hull.Its a '92 350 mag.merc.Bravo one.I went the blower route first with a B&M 144,MSD ignition,750 Edelbrock marine,transom exhaust and holley fuel pump.With 4-5 lbs. boost it went from 58 mph to 70 mph. I just finished adding Dart 72 cc chamber heads to lower compression and a Crower cam with .553 lift with 1.6 roller rockers.I'm using a Merc. high five 25 pitch prop,which works the best out of all the props I've tried,might be the small diameter which allows more trim.The motor is going back in this week,I'll let you know how it runs! Regarding your boat,have you thought about a blower? Pacific Power Boats in Portland,OR.has a brand new B&M 250 for $1800 last time I checked.

[Powerplayin]

yup, running a alpha drive with a 1.5 ratio. The boat is 18' and about 3000 lbs. I have enough money in this motor right now... maybe next year I might think about going the blower route.. I will try this motor and see how the boat likes it. I have a spare drive ready when this one grenades LOL!
Travis

[Mike Lindberg]

Sounds like you're on the right track,I think 5200 rpm with a 23 pitch prop should get you to 70 mph. By the way,I forgot to mention you would have to change your heads to match a blower intake and lower the compression.Good thing you've got an extra Alpha,don't let it come out of the water without letting off! I got my motor in today,just have to check the outdrive alignment.I'm anxious to try out the head and cam change and dial in some timing.

[Powerplayin]

yes, I would have to change the heads to run a blower, maybe next winter, funds are getting low LOL!
Good luck with your motor Mike. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/wink.gif
Travis

[BOFH]

Just my opnion, you may want to go back and re-think your overall system.
If you are going to stay under 5500, you do not "need" forged crank and pistons. Especially, at that low compression... Cast pistons expand more like the block, and you can run a much closer cylinder tolerance, which is free power. This could save money for the same low end power…
Molly rings are tough to seat. At high RPM/compression they have advantages, but at low RPM they just cost more. :-)
At low RPM, you have they wrong induction. You need a 180 torque based system, not a high RPM open plenum. Also, I don’t like the Holly off idle stumble. Personally, I would go for Carter AFB (Edlebrock) as they adjust for low RPM better, yet still open up.
You need to go through and see where you need power, and make the engine breathe well at that point. Too big a head, or carb will actually cost some power, a lot of hole shot, and waste gas and cash.
You do want to get some rev limiter. MSD has a nice ignition with rev limit possibilities.

[Mike Lindberg]

I aree with the performer intake,and especially the Edelbrock vs. Holley.My Edelbrock 750 has excellent driveability not to mention the linkage and bracket matched up like the weber.I took all the choke assembly off since I'm running a small blower. I bought a new holley on my old boat and never could get rid of the flat spot off idle. Worked great wide open though.

[Infomaniac]

Guys: The off idle stumble with a holley is easily fixed by installing a larger squirter. (The accelerator pump discharge nozzle)You can also drill your existing one if you have a drill set that small.
It is a common problem with boat use. A boat engine is loaded pretty hard during take off. The accelerator pump has to supplement the engine with fuel momentarily as the main system starts to take over from the idle system

[BOFH]

Holly carbs get the off idle stumble because the secondaries slam open. This kills air velocity, so all the fuel drops out of suspension on the plenum floor. Over drilling the accel jets dumps more fuel to overcome the problem. However, this drop out of fuel is very temperature sensitive, and a drill is not. :-)
Carter AFBs (Edelbrock) have a vacuum plate over the secondary to block them off at low RPM wide open dumps. This keeps velocity up, and fuel in suspension. As the revs come up, the secondaries come open. :-)
Both solutions work, but I find the second one more "elegant." What can I say… I like cool toys. :-) Both are good, however. Best to go with what you know.

[Infomaniac]

BOFH We are talking about wide open throttle off idle stumble? That's not what I read.
If so it is hard enough to get a vacuum secondary Holley to open the secondaries at all much less flop open. Ususlly have to put a lighter spring to fix that.
A mechanical secondary carb should be a double pumper on a boat and should not have this problem.
[This message has been edited by Infomaniac (edited March 07, 2002).]

[Havasu Hangin']

My 750 Holley (vacuum secondaries) works great on my 383. I ditched the choke, and C&J Engineering massaged it a little...
They did a 800 conversion, drilled the plates, installed a cross tube (instead of the "j" tubes) installed different secondary spring (purple .063), re-jetted (75/86), new nozzle (.033), and power valve (6.5).
No off-idle stumble like my old 750DP.
http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/happy/happy25.gif
PS- Travis- 380HP? No worries...