boat comes out of water with an attitude.

[jimthetoolman]

Help: When i am going about 10 miles an hour and punch it the boat whats to pitch to the right. Could it be a cav plate that needs to be adjusted or to low of gears in the v drive? anyone with a clue? its not real bad but noticable when jumping on gas.
oh its a 69 hondo 502 10 3/4 x 15 prop with 15 gears.

[Marty Gras]

I have a clue, and a question. Does your prop 'slip' at all, or does it just 'bite' and make the boat jump?

[Marty Gras]

I have a clue, and a question. Does your prop 'slip' at all, or does it just 'bite' and make the boat jump? PS, how much down plate do you have while doing this "punch it" thing?

[jimthetoolman]

Well a little of both. When I jump on put it to the floor its revs about 5800 and stays that way. Not good for the engine. but fun!!! so what do I need to do change gears or prop or both?

[jimthetoolman]

Also not getting alot of top end, around 72 gps and 6000 rpms.

[Dkahnjob]

The pitching to the right might be in the plate adjustment. I would put a straight edge on the bottom of the boat for about the last 3 feet and see where the plate is when it is up. Remember if you want the left bow to go down that means right side plate down. I would do it progressively, starting with 1/8 of a turn on the inboard center turn buckle and go to a 1/4 turn on the next turn buckle, and progressively on out to the outboard turn buckle.
As far as speed and prop go if you want to try to get some more speed try an 11 1/2 X 15 steel 2 blade and see how that works. Your prop is pretty small in diameter. You might even try an 11 1/2 X 14. See if you can borrow a few different props before buying one. Where are you located?
David Kahn

[jimthetoolman]

I am in Elk Grove CA. Thanks for the info. I will do some adjusting.

[HighVoltage 329]

I'm thinking you should go up in gear. It will come out smoother and you should pick up mph on the big end.

[jimthetoolman]

What size gears are you thinking?

[HighVoltage 329]

I'm no expert but I've driven flats with 15s with similar problems. 18s helped. Maby you can find some to try.

[Carnivalride]

Help: When i am going about 10 miles an hour and punch it the boat whats to pitch to the right. Could it be a cav plate that needs to be adjusted or to low of gears in the v drive? anyone with a clue? its not real bad but noticable when jumping on gas.
oh its a 69 hondo 502 10 3/4 x 15 prop with 15 gears.
Also not getting alot of top end, around 72 gps and 6000 rpms.
Something doesn't add up here to me, if your only getting 72mph turning 6000rpm with 15's and a 15pitch prop your prop slip is 26.6%. With that kind of slip I just don't see how it can "jump right" from a roll unless your set-up is off. I don't believe uping the gears will help. Something else is wrong.
PS: I've run as low as 9's with a 11.5 x 15 & just switched from 12's with a 11 x 16 and I didn't have an issue. My prop slip is between 16 & 17%, 78 Hondo runner bottom.
JMO,
Loren

[Flat Hall'N]

I raced a 1973 hondo with 22 gears and a 15 prop. It pulled 6000 rpms at about 80 mph. The rudder was set-up about 1" left of center to the prop. I was told to make it easier to get the prop shaft out without having to pull the rudder. When I would stab the gas pedal it wanted to go to the right and I had to hold it straight. Maybe check out the rudder placement. Thats what made my boat go to the right.

[jimthetoolman]

Thats is how mine is setup !!! A LITTLE TO THE RIGHT...That may be it. Still have the other problem with it have in to little prop or to low of gears. Tryiing a new prop tomorrow.

[CircleJerk]

Thats is how mine is setup !!! A LITTLE TO THE RIGHT...That may be it. Still have the other problem with it have in to little prop or to low of gears. Tryiing a new prop tomorrow.
Welcome to the world of 'The Proper Care and Feeding of YOUR Particular V-drive Setup'!
If memory serves, Don Garlits had a list posted on the door of his pull behind dragster trailer for the reasons and possible cures of tire shake. I think the list numbered 40+ something.......

[Flat Hall'N]

Thats is how mine is setup !!! A LITTLE TO THE RIGHT...That may be it. Still have the other problem with it have in to little prop or to low of gears. Tryiing a new prop tomorrow.
I don't know how much horsepower your are running but the bigger gears should quiet that down a little. Good luck!!

[Rexone]

Thats is how mine is setup !!! A LITTLE TO THE RIGHT...That may be it. Still have the other problem with it have in to little prop or to low of gears. Tryiing a new prop tomorrow.
Make one change at a time. The prop is a good place to start. I think yours is too small (diameter). Too small a gear is not your problem based on the 6000 max rpm. With the correct prop it may turn out your gear is too high, depending on HP which is presently unknown.

[jimthetoolman]

My guess its putting out around 600-625 hp ..

[InKahntrol]

Make one change at a time. The prop is a good place to start. I think yours is too small (diameter). Too small a gear is not your problem based on the 6000 max rpm. With the correct prop it may turn out your gear is too high, depending on HP which is presently unknown.
My last boat had a 600hp BBC with 15% gears in the drive, and I just kept changing props until I found the correct setup. Ended up with an 11.5x15 steel two blade. Your prop is pretty small and it's easier to swap props than it is to swap gears.
Also, almost every flatty I've ever seen has an offset rudder. Also, every big-power V-drive I've ever driven pulls on the wheel under hard acceleration. That's the nature of the beast to some degree.
My pops is right, you should be able to dial a lot of your problem out with proper plate setup. My 940hp Campbell daycruiser tucked the bow down and to the starboard under hard acceleration when we first finished it, and Patterson told us how to fix it. Listen to the circle guys, they know what they're talking about. :rollside: :)
Dan Kahn

[LilFlattie]

I have a 69 Hondo also. It pulls to the right also, just a little. I have 18's in the box and a 11x14 prop. I see 6700 rpm and 84 mph. FWIW I live in Placerville.

[jimthetoolman]

When I stab it she will hit 6 grand and stay at 6000-6500 till I let off . I will try and post a video of it and you can let me know what you think I should do so I don't waste any time and money. Will post this afternoon.

[Carnivalride]

When I stab it she will hit 6 grand and stay at 6000-6500 till I let off . I will try and post a video of it and you can let me know what you think I should do so I don't waste any time and money. Will post this afternoon.
All you said in your first post was that it was a 502. What kind? Stock GM with hydraulic roller cam or?? If it's the stock GM one it may not have enough valve spring to really spin anymore. I personally wouldn't take it above 6000rpm if it's the stock deal.

[jimthetoolman]

http://www.***boat.com/image_center/showphoto.php?photo=112145
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/showphoto.php?photo=79275&password=&sort=7&thecat=500&size=big&password=&sort=7&thecat=500

[stoker2001]

Jim,you might try 707 864 0332. Joe Shelfo,for a prop,he is in Napa.good luck

[Bobbo541]

Hey Jim did you ever open the v-drive to see what gears are in it. The boat sure does look alot different from when i sold it to you . Good job.
Bob

[jimthetoolman]

Thanks bob.. Been having a lot of fun with it. Way different than driving a Jet.. This takes a little skill to drive.. Makes it interesting thats for sure.

[DUCKY]

I would start with the plate adjustment. and then start trying other props. The plates may improve the pull, but I would venture to guess that that you are trying to blow the prop off the boat (cavitating) and when it tries to hook up you are going for a ride. I would go for a little more diameter, like a 11.25 or 11.5 x 15. I wouldn't mess with gears until the boat handles properly. Call me if you want to talk about a baseline plate setup...I don't want to type that much. :)

[jimthetoolman]

Just got off the river with a 11 1/2 x 17. Didn't pull as hard but got more speed. Don't know how much more. put it didn't impress me. WIll be trying another one tomorrow hopefully. What was funny is that I pulled a little less rpm then the 10 3/4 x 15 prop. WTF?

[Carnivalride]

Just got off the river with a 11 1/2 x 17. Didn't pull as hard but got more speed. Don't know how much more. put it didn't impress me. WIll be trying another one tomorrow hopefully. What was funny is that I pulled a little less rpm then the 10 3/4 x 15 prop. WTF?
Like I asked in an earlier post what type of 502, stock? What cam? If it only pulled a little less rpm with that prop change maybe your engine doesn't make power any higher with the current configuration.

[daddy b]

Sounds very fun, I am about to mount my bbc in my 68 Hondo, I'm very interested in your setup. Motor position, v drive position, prop position. I believe I have all the stock settings however I'm running @700 hp. I was thinking of moving the motor forward a little. I have a 11 1/4 x 15 that has been recommended for the boat. daddy b

[bigheavyd2]

Facts About Props
Rake
Higher Lift
More Rake, More Transom Lift
More Bottom End
Pitch
Higher the Pitch, More Slip at Bottom End
Hook at Top End
Lower Pitch, More RPM
Diameter
Bigger Diameter, More Lift
More Torque, Less RPM

[Marty Gras]

I'm reading your "Facts About Props" and shaking my head, "NO", to many of your points. Some of what you say can be true for hydros, but not flats, and vise >< versa. No arguement, just a different opinion from experience.

[jimthetoolman]

Carnivale: No Its not stock. 509 cu with J&E pistons with ported rectangular closed chamber heads comp cams cam shaft and valvetrain, rectanglar port tunnel ram with dual 750 dbl pumpers etc without going into detail. It runs good. 6000 rpm is the most I have pushed it.

[jimthetoolman]

Ducky : Checked the plate adjustment and your right it was off. Made some changes.. and boat is really running well. Thanks everyone for your help. Jim.

[jimthetoolman]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6903570178914463741&hl=en

[Bobbo541]

Hey Jim cool video looks like you might need a little more adjustment on the plates. When i was racing my 72 hondo i could get out the down pedel and it wouldnt bouce like yours.

[Marty Gras]

You went up in diameter and up on the pitch, so the "17" prop will load the motor a lot more at all speeds and too much down low. Your older Hondo is a little heavy'r than Lorens "ski boat" but I wouldn't go any larger than 11" diameter. Your original prop could use some work or just switch to a 10 7/8" X 16 then go quicker and faster. Loren, your single carb 'deal' went 100MPH at what RPMs?

[Kurtis500]

jimthetoolman, I have a 73 true flat Hondo also that I raced for a couple years before the hydros. I used a couple props and gears from 12's to 29's. What helped to partially cure (one of) my problems, same as your having, was to move the motor forward and get a lot of down peddle at the launch. My personal experience was that the boat is built heavy and for skiing. The strut in my boat and probably yours was 12 degree, not at least 10 degree or less like I believe most racing flats are. When I started upping the horsepower the launches would become more unstable like your is starting to look. All the gear changes, different props, propshaft adjustments, re-built bottom and plate adjustments couldn't solve the problem that adding horsepower made. I know some have made it work, but I didn't feel like cutting up my flat, buying more parts and keep adjusting things around just to get a tiny bit in mph and et. Hopefully you will not need too much more work to settle it down. Good luck.
I still got my flat and its back to skiing and cruising around.

[Flat Hall'N]

jimthetoolman, I have a 73 true flat Hondo also that I raced for a couple years before the hydros. I used a couple props and gears from 12's to 29's. What helped to partially cure (one of) my problems, same as your having, was to move the motor forward and get a lot of down peddle at the launch. My personal experience was that the boat is built heavy and for skiing. The strut in my boat and probably yours was 12 degree, not at least 10 degree or less like I believe most racing flats are. When I started upping the horsepower the launches would become more unstable like your is starting to look. All the gear changes, different props, propshaft adjustments, re-built bottom and plate adjustments couldn't solve the problem that adding horsepower made. I know some have made it work, but I didn't feel like cutting up my flat, buying more parts and keep adjusting things around just to get a tiny bit in mph and et. Hopefully you will not need too much more work to settle it down. Good luck.
I still got my flat and its back to skiing and cruising around.
Kurtis500
Just curious as to how your boat handled with the 29 gears & what kind of horse power & top end you were running. My dad & I want to get the 1973 hondo that we raced a couple of years ago back in the water again maybe with some added HP. Never ran the boat with more that a 22 gear.

[Carnivalride]

You went up in diameter and up on the pitch, so the "17" prop will load the motor a lot more at all speeds and too much down low. Your older Hondo is a little heavy'r than Lorens "ski boat" but I wouldn't go any larger than 11" diameter. Your original prop could use some work or just switch to a 10 7/8" X 16 then go quicker and faster. Loren, your single carb 'deal' went 100MPH at what RPMs?
George,
It runs 101mph on GPS at 7200rpm with 12's and either the 11 x 16 or 10-7/8 x 16 props. Haven't been out since the first of August due to OT and family issues so I still haven't run it with the 18's yet.
Loren

[Kurtis500]

Kurtis500
Just curious as to how your boat handled with the 29 gears & what kind of horse power & top end you were running. My dad & I want to get the 1973 hondo that we raced a couple of years ago back in the water again maybe with some added HP. Never ran the boat with more that a 22 gear.
It made only a little difference with the 29's since I think they were just too big. My et and mph with 12's compared to 29's was almost the same. The two gear sizes seemed a bit under its sweet spot with the 12's and just over with the 29's. The problem I had was the doinking and oscillating as it picked up mph. By moving EVERYTHING around multiple times and changing each thing one at a time, I finally came to the conclusion that the high angle strut is the culprit. No prop, gear, plate adjustment, rebuilt bottom or change of weight distribution could beat it.
So I took the motor out of the flat and put it in a lightweight Kurtis500 hydro and shaved 2 seconds and gained 25mph on its very first pass :rollside:
BTW, my other boat is an example of a hard hooking prop and low gears. A combo that works well for the et target, but I'm going to change before the World Finals before it breaks the deck off.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/7sat_drag_boat_014-1.jpg

[Flat Hall'N]

It made only a little difference with the 29's since I think they were just too big. My et and mph with 12's compared to 29's was almost the same. The two gear sizes seemed a bit under its sweet spot with the 12's and just over with the 29's. The problem I had was the doinking and oscillating as it picked up mph. By moving EVERYTHING around multiple times and changing each thing one at a time, I finally came to the conclusion that the high angle strut is the culprit. No prop, gear, plate adjustment, rebuilt bottom or change of weight distribution could beat it.
So I took the motor out of the flat and put it in a lightweight Kurtis500 hydro and shaved 2 seconds and gained 25mph on its very first pass :rollside:
BTW, my other boat is an example of a hard hooking prop and low gears. A combo that works well for the et target, but I'm going to change before the World Finals before it breaks the deck off.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/7sat_drag_boat_014-1.jpg
That makes sense. Nice boat!

[Marty Gras]

"K500" after that pass, did someone from the safety crew come over and "slap you around"? I would have! That's a 'little' too much launch for any sane person. You can only do that "wild s#!t on the river. PS if your ET and speed were "almost the same" with 12's or 29's you had other major problems (17% difference!) !

[jimthetoolman]

Do any of you guys have a prop for sale that would be suitable for my application?...
also I have a 396 60 over built by S&S Automotive in San Leandro never fired tunnel ram to pan $4450. Bought it from Bobo541 here on the boards.

[Kurtis500]

"K500" after that pass, did someone from the safety crew come over and "slap you around"? I would have! That's a 'little' too much launch for any sane person. You can only do that "wild s#!t on the river. PS if your ET and speed were "almost the same" with 12's or 29's you had other major problems (17% difference!) !
Marty Gras, you should make an effort to try and not come across as an a$$. You wouldn't slap me around either.
The 12's and 29's were not the only gears I used, one was too big the other too small. The motor frewheeled with the 12's dropping the et and mph while the 29's overloaded it and dropped the et and mph. The two numbers would come out near identical in 1/4 mile runs. 18's and 22's were an improvement.

[jimthetoolman]

I do know one thing that was a crowd pleaser. That kind of thing is what people like to see. Dangerous but cool.

[Kurtis500]

I do know one thing that was a crowd pleaser. That kind of thing is what people like to see. Dangerous but cool.
Thats not me, my friend drives that one, I drive the kurtis. The launches got much worse when we upped the horsepower in the motor by switching from carbs to an injector and alcohol. The boat would launch high for years, but now the launch is a little too much, so its time to tame it down. :cool: Its a hydro with 12% gears in it and has run 9.7's.

[flatrookie]

I had watched the video myself and someone had posted that it bounced to much to adjust the plate for an over all ride what is the perfect ride ? should there be no bounce at all what angle is to high for the deck to ride ? very new to all of this little seat time my boat needs a little dialing in

[jimthetoolman]

Bobbo541 needs to answer that one. He is the hondo expert. Hopefully he will see this and answer your question.

[Bobbo541]

When i raced my hondo it would bounce a couple of times then set and i could get off the down pedel and it would not move.I am no expert on this. I just know what mine did and I see what Jim's is doing on the video and his looks to me like it's not to stable and needs more adjusting.

[flatrookie]

so at what speed would it set ? and do you just keep adjusting the the t-handle lock position with the plate further down ? to get it to (set) ? and would it be absolute glass that you are running on ?

[DUCKY]

I just watched your video. Very cool, but I do think it needs more plate adjustment and some prop and/or strut work. Every boat is different, but the boat should take a set and stop bouncing, and it just doesn't seem like it is. You may even try a couple of nickels in the shaft coupler. It also seems that the motor is revving and it never sounds like the prop is hooking up. As far as the plate adjustments go, I always start with a baseline, then make small changes the make the boat go straight if necessary. You should be able to roll on the gas and ease off the plate and the boat should take it's set and stay there until you let off, or you run out of motor. If it won't do that then prop, shaft angle, and strut depth changes are in order. You should be able to just rest your toes on the down pedal on flat water if you are on the gas.
I have a fire extinguiser ready, flame away!

[Marty Gras]

Each "hop" that a 100/115 MPH flat does on the track, equals 1/10 of a second in ET. So two "hops" are 2/10th and so on. V-drive placement, prop, gear VS motor, hull balance, and many other factors create the boat that "takes a set" and prohibits the others from doing so. YOU may think I'm an azz, but the boats I've worked on don't bounce and easily take a set real quick. As far as the red shovel nose hydro in your photo, it's "flashy" but unsafe. Also as far as some of the other "experts" around here, it's hard to believe that some people would give advise on subjects they really have never even personally delt with. I'll now sit back and deal with YOUR INPUT, on my attitude and your lack of experience on this subject.

[jimthetoolman]

Martygras: I appreiciate all your help.... but why are you so harsh on these guys? they are just trying to help me just as your are. Can't we all get along?

[v-drive]

this board is made up of alot of nice people.I know this because I have met a few. Every time I can't figure something out I come here for help and usually get a lot of good input. The most help comes from the people who are working on their boats just like us who have experianced the same problems. It usually doesn't come from the people that know everything if you get my drift...later..v-drive

[Dave Sammons]

Sent you a PM

[jimthetoolman]

Thanks dave.

[flatrookie]

what does nickles do in the shaft coupler do change the launch ? my boat bounces a lot to bad proably more than the tool mans its cool at about 45 steady throttle but then when you nail the gas it starts bouncing bad can someone help please ?

[Bt273]

what does nickles do in the shaft coupler do change the launch ? my boat bounces a lot to bad proably more than the tool mans its cool at about 45 steady throttle but then when you nail the gas it starts bouncing bad can someone help please ?
I will probably get nailed for this but here you go,the nickels move the prop back,thus changing where your propeller is(location),Is the boat you are asking about in your avatar? if it is the first noticable thing is your engine way back,this meaning it is right over your strut,a lot of weight your propellor has to pickup and the balance is off(to much in the rear causing your boat to be nose high).The only way to fix it is move the engine forward,most race boats you see,the engines are forward for balance,and yes prop shaft angle is important as well,less degree more forward motion than up at a hard angle,you will see v-drives that look rolled forward to change the angle of the prop shaft(less) like a 7 degree strut or 7.5 degree, I know I am being technical here but it sounds like you want all you can get out of your boat.trial and error is what all the guys have done to learn,everybody has their opinion on what to do,you will learn in a hurry what your boat likes trying some of these methods iI garuntee it!

[flatrookie]

I will probably get nailed for this but here you go,the nickels move the prop back,thus changing where your propeller is(location),Is the boat you are asking about in your avatar? if it is the first noticable thing is your engine way back,this meaning it is right over your strut,a lot of weight your propellor has to pickup and the balance is off(to much in the rear causing your boat to be nose high).The only way to fix it is move the engine forward,most race boats you see,the engines are forward for balance,and yes prop shaft angle is important as well,less degree more forward motion than up at a hard angle,you will see v-drives that look rolled forward to change the angle of the prop shaft(less) like a 7 degree strut or 7.5 degree, I know I am being technical here but it sounds like you want all you can get out of your boat.trial and error is what all the guys have done to learn,everybody has their opinion on what to do,you will learn in a hurry what your boat likes trying some of these methods iI garuntee it!
cool thank you for the reply and info yes thst is the boat just bought it a month ago and learning a lot from all of you on here so har far will I know to move the motor forward ? and how much does it cost to replace the shaft or shorten ?

[Kurtis500]

Each "hop" that a 100/115 MPH flat does on the track, equals 1/10 of a second in ET. So two "hops" are 2/10th and so on. V-drive placement, prop, gear VS motor, hull balance, and many other factors create the boat that "takes a set" and prohibits the others from doing so. YOU may think I'm an azz, but the boats I've worked on don't bounce and easily take a set real quick. As far as the red shovel nose hydro in your photo, it's "flashy" but unsafe. Also as far as some of the other "experts" around here, it's hard to believe that some people would give advise on subjects they really have never even personally delt with. I'll now sit back and deal with YOUR INPUT, on my attitude and your lack of experience on this subject.
Marty Gras, you should re-read my post and cross-reference it to his original question. I also have a ealry - true flat Hondo that experienced the identical attitudes as Jimthetoolman. I went a long period of time taking one step after another to attempt to solve the boats handling. I tried to assist Jimthetoolman with what experiences I have had. I have done so without arrogance and condensation towards anybody, including you. However, you have now, and elsewhere before on this board, acted with both arrogance and an inflated ego about "knowledge" and "experience" treating others as if theirs is useless and you posses the only true method(s). Anybody who works, not plays, in an arena that has true life-taking risks knows that people with your arrogance and close-minded approach to others experiences are TOTALLY DANGEROUS and a risk to others. Its a shame your just too damn smart to think you could actually learn something. Your advice, coupled with your attitude, aren't worth wiping my butt with. I don't care how many 'heroics' you have performed in a boat, your business, or the amount of wrenches you've turned on, the swollen ego over "knowledge" in a hobby sport is a little pathetic to see. Its one thing to feel that way quietly, another to be an outright jack--- about it to others whos past experiences you have no clue about. Many of those experiences are relayed from long time boat racers with similar situations who had a desire to help others, not critisize. But theres no need to disappoint Marty Gras, stay in your ivory tower of hobby-sport-knowledge and look down yonder upon the peabrains working their tails off to have more fun in their boats while you pretend to be smart.
Find something in life besides 'boat knowledge' to hang your self-worth on..
Darren

[jimthetoolman]

BOOM ! ouch!

[jimthetoolman]

Dave Sammons: Thanks again for your help yesterday. You gave me a lot of good info to try. Will be getting to work on them and hopefully the weather will be good this weekend. Will let you know how it works. Again thanks. jim

[blowngas]

har far will I know to move the motor forward ? and how much does it cost to replace the shaft or shorten ?
I don't know for sure, but it seems to me that the 1970's methods of positioning the v-drives and motors wasn't what the boats liked------it seemed like most were set up to "fly" by the driver------ My hondo is of mid seventys vintage, and when I first got it, it was scary as hell to drive!!!----the motor was set way too far to the rear, and with the plates set straight, you still were on the down pedal all the time to keep the attitude safe on the top end------it took a new prop and moving the motor forward about three times before it got "right"------the boat will now take a quick set, no prop "blast" out the back of the boat, and is running on the middle "plate" with the outside ones out of the water (runner bottom)------find a competent drive shaft company locally and take him your shaft and make sure he can shorten it correctly-----cost should not be extreme-----if so, then find another shop-----you should be able to have the shaft shortened (u-joint) several times to equal the cost of a new one------if you have a one piece Mark Williams style, then that's a different story-------they are really nice but costly and you should have your motor placed where it needs to be before laying out the funds for a shaft like that-----take it one step at a time, and go back and reread the above posts, and try to decide which step you need to take first------

[flatrookie]

I don't know for sure, but it seems to me that the 1970's methods of positioning the v-drives and motors wasn't what the boats liked------it seemed like most were set up to "fly" by the driver------ My hondo is of mid seventys vintage, and when I first got it, it was scary as hell to drive!!!----the motor was set way too far to the rear, and with the plates set straight, you still were on the down pedal all the time to keep the attitude safe on the top end------it took a new prop and moving the motor forward about three times before it got "right"------the boat will now take a quick set, no prop "blast" out the back of the boat, and is running on the middle "plate" with the outside ones out of the water (runner bottom)------find a competent drive shaft company locally and take him your shaft and make sure he can shorten it correctly-----cost should not be extreme-----if so, then find another shop-----you should be able to have the shaft shortened (u-joint) several times to equal the cost of a new one------if you have a one piece Mark Williams style, then that's a different story-------they are really nice but costly and you should have your motor placed where it needs to be before laying out the funds for a shaft like that-----take it one step at a time, and go back and reread the above posts, and try to decide which step you need to take first------
thank you for your reply as a guess what woud be a start in inches to move the motor forward ? I know that is last resort

[ssmike]

Jim:
What size/diameter prop are you interested in? I still have a few drag props that i might sell.
Sammons will steer you right.

[jimthetoolman]

SSMIKE:Thanks for the reply...
What size do you have? How about a 11x16? or please pm me with the sizes. I really think my 10 3/4 x 15 is a little small with 15 gears. I am in the process of doing what Dave told me to do. Hopefully I will take it for a spin on Sat.. Thanks

[jimthetoolman]

SSMIKE: Any luck on the props?

[Marty Gras]

"K500" I must say that I was not directing my comment about "Experts" toward you. I don't know you and could care less. I did direct a comment toward the red boat in the photo and "it's still dangerous", (just like ME?) My "Expert" comment was directed toward a person here that I do know and he's no expert. I do hope you feel better about yourself, after your attack on me. I also feel that since you "did your boat all yourself", you too must now be an "Expert", RIGHT? Did any of my advise or direction to look for answers, end up being wrong? These questions and remedies are basic to flatbottom set ups and it is best that "jim" is working with a proven professional. Getting THE CORRECT BASICS will make dialing the boat in, much "quick'r and easy'r". I'm so dangerous that none of my customers ever got wet while racing, and we did do a few race boats.

[Kurtis500]

"K500" I must say that I was not directing my comment about "Experts" toward you. I don't know you and could care less. I did direct a comment toward the red boat in the photo and "it's still dangerous", (just like ME?) My "Expert" comment was directed toward a person here that I do know and he's no expert. I do hope you feel better about yourself, after your attack on me. I also feel that since you "did your boat all yourself", you too must now be an "Expert", RIGHT? Did any of my advise or direction to look for answers, end up being wrong? These questions and remedies are basic to flatbottom set ups and it is best that "jim" is working with a proven professional. Getting THE CORRECT BASICS will make dialing the boat in, much "quick'r and easy'r". I'm so dangerous that none of my customers ever got wet while racing, and we did do a few race boats.
Your right Marty Gras, I did my boat(S) all by myself. That is how a HOBBY sport goes my friend, you should let that sink in. Everybody at the tracks and the lake are hobby sport people having fun. Some pay others to do the work, some do it themselves. Launching rockets and putting 50,000 pound payloads into orbit requires experts, not boats.
Now, since you throw around the term 'EXPERT' and 'proven professional', I suppose you can show us, in detail, EXACTLY when you go from a babbling ametauer to an expert. Include all the certifications, education, degrees, hours, hands-on experience and 'passes' needed to define it for us. Reading your posts, one would believe you set this standard. Worse yet, you put others down and have no clue who they are or what experience they have.
Again, I have the nearly identical boat to Jimthetoolman and have performed almost all the changes possible to correct a single problem that mirrors his. These experiences are worth relating since they were made under the mph/et clocks and have verifiable data to back them up. Now, I would like you to explain how this deserves the label of 'lack of experience on this subject'. And please include all my other experiences since you seem to know about them.
I'll now sit back and deal with YOUR INPUT, on my attitude and your lack of experience on this subject.
I do hope you feel better about yourself, after your attack on me.
By reading many of your posts here and in other topics, you deserve whatever treatment you recieve. Your arrogance is an easy target, as well as the ambiguous terms like 'expert' and so-on. And still, I wouldn't approach you for advice or recommend others to after viewing your posts.

[Marty Gras]

Please read my PM to you. PS, THANKS but I don't really need any of you're recommendations, I have more work than I can handle.

[Kurtis500]

Please read my PM to you. PS, THANKS but I don't really need any of you're recommendations, I have more work than I can handle.
You have one waiting, and try to act civil once in a while.
BTW, I didn't recommend anybody to you.

[jimthetoolman]

Dave Sammons when we talked you told me how far forward to move my engine. I think you said 27 to 28? IT was really easy I just pushed it forward on the rails and I didn't have to cut my driveline. Is there anything else I am missing? Dave or Kurtus500 Martygras HELP I hope this is right before I put new holes in my rails. As always thanks for the help. Jim

[jimthetoolman]

Hey Ducky what do you think? Does that sound like the right number? 27 to 28.