I did everything right , but it must be wrong!!!

[Snowboat]

I finished up my engine and ran it on the trailer. Reset the valves and drilled a couple of 1/16' holes in the primary plates to settle the idle down. Blipped the throttle on the trailer. http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/214leave_004-thumb.jpg
Drove to the lake and tooled around until warm. When I get the R's up the block pressure rises. I don't want more than 10 psi. Tried to get to 40 psi as I was reaching 6,500 rpm. Loaded it up and hauled home to the computer advisory board. I hate driving and looking over my shoulder. It doesn't look like I broke my seals and can't find any evidence of water in the oil. Here's a pic of the plumbing (dirty Boat).
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/214leave_007-med.jpg
The thermostat plumbing should be the same as in Rex's catalog, even though the tee's are placed differently. The ones closest to the manifold go to an unrestricted dump and to a ball valve for the headers. Here's a pic of the crossover and block pressure guage. http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/214leave_015-med.jpg
The crossover has a tee with a guage plumbed in. The intercooler is a separate circuit, as is the v drive. There is a pressure relief valve to avoid spikes to the cooler and also one to protect the Dan Olson oil cooler, that is before the Magnaflow pump. What the hell have I done wrong? I'd like to have 10 psi at 7,000 rpm. Thanks.

[Snowboat]

Summer's short in Wyoming. Should I just run one side of the Magnaflow through the engine, in a loop. and let the other one run to dump?

[DUCKY]

It almost sounds like the bypass in the t-stat housing might be stuck, check it out....
It it's ok, then you might put some other kind of pressure relief (dump, with gate valve) elsewhere.
40psi is too much, but I wouldn't be afraid of 15-20 at WOT. Automotive radiator caps open at 14-18psi.
[ May 27, 2003, 09:43 PM: Message edited by: DUCKY ]

[Rexone]

Ok here's my guess. It appears you have all -8 lines. correct me if I'm wrong on that. The Mag is capable of pumping quite a bit of water. You've essentially got (2) -8's going in and a little over (1) going out based on your (1) unrestriced line and (1) ball valved down to the headers (not flowing much on that one). My guess is you're restricting the flow out. I'd suggest a -10 or -12 even on the dump line.
What you've said that I don't understand is that you have a pressure relief valve. Why is it not dumping the excess pressure off? What pressure is it set at? Where exactly is the bypass valve plumbed in? Where does the line off of it go? With a properly set up pressure bypass valve the dump line size I talked about above kind of becomes a mute point. If that bypass valve were set at about 15 lbs you'd never see much over that if it was working properly and had a big enough line off it.
Tell me more and we'll try to get it figured out. And like Ducky said the thermo bypass could be stuck although I don't ever remember seeing that problem. Also even if that were the case your bypass valve should be limiting the high pressure from building.
Also what was the temp doing while this high pressure was happening?
[ May 27, 2003, 11:47 PM: Message edited by: Rexone ]

[Snowboat]

Thanks for the replies. Ducky, I'll check the bypass, but I don't think that will be the problem.
Rexone:
1. They are all number eight except for water pickup to the cooler, which is ten, and twelve to the intercooler.
2. If I increase the size of my dump line, I will still have #8 at the thermostat port and the dump fitting.
3. The temp was cool, wasn't reading on the guage yet, probably around 100. Will verify that I have the correct sender today. It does peg the guage when you ground the wore.
4. OK, bypass stuff. The brass adjustable bypass valves are plumbed the same way for the engine and for the intercooler, 1/2" pipe fittings. Water comes from the pickup, to a Tee where the valve is located, right on the through hull. Intercooler on is set at 25 psi. Water under 25 goes to intercooler and any above 25, goes to a dump. The engine is the same way, set at 8-10 psi. When I hooked the garden hose to the engine pick up, turned the water on a 1/4 turn, some water would come out of the bypass dump and then when the engine wrapped up all the water would go to the engine. I installed the bypass valves primarily to protect the coolers from spikes when the boat leaves the water and comes back down.
5. I wonder if the pump should just feed the engine systems with one outlet and have the other one go straight overboard?
[ May 28, 2003, 06:45 AM: Message edited by: Snowboat ]

[DetroitJim]

This deal works great, 7-10 psi and any temp I want. Most of the water gets dumped before the motor. The Magnaflow impeller moves way too much water, it was originally meant for a recirculating system. Also, you need bigger outlet hoses all the way to the transom. When I tried -8 it overheated. -12 is best, I run -10 now and it is hotter. My header water comes from the back of the intake with a gate valve.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/181DSCN0297-med.JPG
[ May 28, 2003, 08:51 AM: Message edited by: DetroitJim ]

[Snowboat]

DetroitJim: I see that the right side of the pump outlet is wide open. The left side is about half open, but can't tell where the hoses go. What is feeding the other opening on the front of the block? Your setup almost looks like system could be fed by one side of the pump. I'm thinking that since I have four lines exiting the pump, I could run all of them of of the right side. The left side could go to dump with a ball valve. Then I would essentially have one output, on the pump, feeding the engine. That should cut the pump output by more than half. Jim, got any other pics?

[Rexone]

Snowboat:
Thanks for the replies. Ducky, I'll check the bypass, but I don't think that will be the problem.
Rexone:
1. They are all number eight except for water pickup to the cooler, which is ten, and twelve to the intercooler.
2. If I increase the size of my dump line, I will still have #8 at the thermostat port and the dump fitting.
3. The temp was cool, wasn't reading on the guage yet, probably around 100. Will verify that I have the correct sender today. It does peg the guage when you ground the wore.
4. OK, bypass stuff. The brass adjustable bypass valves are plumbed the same way for the engine and for the intercooler, 1/2" pipe fittings. Water comes from the pickup, to a Tee where the valve is located, right on the through hull. Intercooler on is set at 25 psi. Water under 25 goes to intercooler and any above 25, goes to a dump. The engine is the same way, set at 8-10 psi. When I hooked the garden hose to the engine pick up, turned the water on a 1/4 turn, some water would come out of the bypass dump and then when the engine wrapped up all the water would go to the engine. I installed the bypass valves primarily to protect the coolers from spikes when the boat leaves the water and comes back down.
5. I wonder if the pump should just feed the engine systems with one outlet and have the other one go straight overboard? Snowboat,
Regarding your #2. Any hose is only as large as the smallest point in it in terms of flow. You must also change the fittings if you enlarge the dump line to have any effect. (On that same note, add a couple sharp 90's and you dramatically reduce the flow capability in any line. Just for general ref.)
Regarding the bypass on the engine. This must come off the engine to work properly (after the water pump). If you've got it prior to the pump (intake side) that's why it's not working. In this case its the Magnaflow pump making the pressure and that pressure must be relieved by your bypass valve and / or adequate dump line size. Just thought I'd mention it since it's not real clear where you have that bypass valve located.
[ May 28, 2003, 05:57 PM: Message edited by: Rexone ]

[INEEDAV]

Kenny
Make sure you have this going right by the time I come up there. I am going to try to make a trip up in a month or so. After my contract runs out at Cripple Creek I am going to Thailand for a couple weeks, then likely to Columbia, barring my taking a position here permanently. So my chances to take a ride are quite likely going to be limited later on. God only knows when I will have time to finish mine.

[DetroitJim]

Snowboat, you are correct, I am dumping half of the water overboard before it even goes to the engine. The hoses from the valve on the left go to the front water inlets on the block. Even with that, I am throttling back the output on the single outlet to the motor. The problem here is that the Magnaflow pump puts out way too much volume and pressure. If you set your deal up similar to mine, then you can set the water flow to what is needed for cooling with no thermostat, and control block pressure separately. Notice that my bypass dumps ahead of the outlet control valve.
Since you are already set up with a thermostat, you might be able to get it to work if you upsize the outlet hoses and restrict the inflow. The problem with a thermostat is that the block pressure will change when it opens and closes. This can cause the header water to be either too much or not enough. In my opinion, a thermostat is not needed. Just get the flow down to where it needs to be and no more, and get the pressure down to where the headers fog at 1500 rpm.
DJ
[ May 29, 2003, 07:31 AM: Message edited by: DetroitJim ]

[Snowboat]

Thanks, Rexone and Detroitjim. I think I have it. It sure isn't very sanitary (its done well but its cluttered), but it works. I might have been able to do it differently, but did not want to make too many new braided lines. Here's a shot of Spaghetti Stainless. At this point, I'm thinking that a thermostat may have been a waste of money for my application. http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/524/214home_041-med.jpg
The #8 line coming out of the pump, on the left, goes to dump with a valve you can reach. Where the #8 cap is, there is another valved line going to dump, that you can't reach. The first tee's lines go to the block. The lines from the next tee go to the T'stat. The straight fitting's line, clamped to the head goes to the valve for the headers. The other one, that is hard to see, goes to dump with no valve. I have been able to keep the block pressure at 10 psi or less and not overheat. I was also able to blow steam, but at this altitude that's only 200'. Sure seems like a pain in the ass to have to get the valves set right. Fortunately, no one is allowed to drive the boat without me. Any thoughts on the use of a thermostat? Fiat, continuing to jet down using the "burned off cad method". I put a little more work into cavitation spring tension. I thought I had them tight before (no up pedal). When I looked down at a fair speed, I could see the plates moving the rod. Tightened those babies up and got the leg quivers after thirty minutes of farting around. Thanks to the many, whose advice I have used.

[Rexone]

Glad you figured it out. The thermo set up will just make it easier to keep the engine warm enough. Once you get all the valves set you really shouldn't have to be moving them much.
Also you can safely run more block pressure than 10 pounds. Most auto radiator caps are 12 to 18 lbs. We normally recommend 15-20 for safety. Most engines will take a little more than that without problems though. My preference is around 15 to 18. Just FYI. Glad to be of help and Good luck. :)

[Snowboat]

After two years of exceesive water in the oil, with no failures, I was shooting for a low block psi number. Is the thermostat plumbed correctly? Also, I have heard about people drilling holes in the poppet. Any thoughts?

[Rexone]

I see no reason for drilling holes in the poppet valve and have never heard of anyone doing it. Sometimes we drill extra holes in the thermo itself but not often. My preference has always been to use bypass valves (more than one if necessary) to blow off excessive pressure. I'm sure your system will work, just a little more labor intensive to make sure all the valves are correct. As far as what I see from the pic your plumbing should work. :)