Lokkin' for a blower

[Dominator Scott]

I would really like to get my hands on a roots style blower and intake for my dads Sanger and would prefer to find one used. Seems everything I find is for Chevy though. Any idea's as to where I could track one down?
The motor is all stock so I'm not lookin' to make monster power but more for that WOW factor. Please point me in the right direction. :rollside:
Also can anyone tell me if a mid to late 70's Ford 460 has cast or forged internals? Pistons,crank,ect?

[Dominator Scott]

Nobody has any suggestions or comments? :cry: Whats up with that? :cool:

[Greaser]

Try racingjunk.com Usually find some good deals over there.

[Dominator Scott]

Try racingjunk.com Usually find some good deals over there.
Tried. No blowers for a Ford application that I saw. :cry:

[Heatseeker]

The jetboat mores:more power, more speed, more bling.
You got it bad...and quick too! I think we should all start a 12-Step program for the jetboat mores! :)
No Ford leads here, sorry. Has pops seen his "new" ride yet?

[Dominator Scott]

The jetboat mores:more power, more speed, more bling.
You got it bad...and quick too! I think we should all start a 12-Step program for the jetboat mores! :)
No Ford leads here, sorry. Has pops seen his "new" ride yet?
Dad is coming down on Saturday but thinks he's coming to help me install some light fixtures in the house. Boy is he in for a surprise. :rollside:

[Goad]

I think youre goin overboard puttin a blower on your dads boat.....unless hes a balls to the wall kinda guy, I would do it.
Plus they dont make blowers for boats that have tie down cleats :rollside:

[Dominator Scott]

I think youre goin overboard puttin a blower on your dads boat.....unless hes a balls to the wall kinda guy, I would do it.
Plus they dont make blowers for boats that have tie down cleats :rollside:
I am known for going overboard on every toy I touch. I installed the tie downs because I wasn't comfortable towing it for 200 miles back to my folks next spring without having the transom of the boat secured to the trailer. Specially with our chitty Michigan roads.
My father would love a blower but would never do it himself because he just doesn't have the patience or ambition to tackle something like that.

[Slow Burn]

Try Littlefield Blowers in 714-992-9292 ask for Lee K.

[Sanger Jet]

They are 4000 bucks!!!

[Duane HTP]

D Scott. I have a customer that we are taking off a REAL NICE POLISHED 671 Weiand for and putting on a 1471. He will have it for sale soon. PM me and I'll get you hooked up if you want.

[IMPATIENT 1]

Dad is coming down on Saturday but thinks he's coming to help me install some light fixtures in the house. Boy is he in for a surprise. :rollside:
dude , please take pics when he first see's it for us!! i think i speak for all of us, when i say "we want pics of his expressions", video be good too,lol.
i bet he'll love it without the blower just as much. you'd have to go back into the mill and put stronger parts in it too, then there's compression to worry about on top of that.

[Duane HTP]

Yeah, for that deal, I'll bet he'd rather have it without the blower. Like he said, TAKE PICTURES!

[sanger rat]

Don't forget the pump upgrades when you put a blower on it. SS impeller, Inducer, Jet-a-way. Shoe and ride plate. You're in to deep to stop now. :)

[Ken F]

>Also can anyone tell me if a mid to late 70's Ford 460 has cast or forged internals? Pistons,crank,ect?<
Scott,
It would help a lot to know the engine # (above the starter) and head #'s.
I can tell you that the stock crank is good for quite a bit of HP bumps. On a Ford your weakest point with a stock engine is the heads...expecially the years you are talking about. Upgrading the rods to some CobraJet rods, or truck rods would be advisable. If you decide to go through with it, I've got an almost new set of I-beam rods I'd sell reasonably.
I've got mine at 655 hp/625 tq and have reached the point where I have cap-walk with the stock 2-bolt mains. (BOA2T) I'd try and keep it under the 550 hp deal with 2 bolt mains.
Post up some engine & head #'s
Hope this helps,
Ken F

[IMPATIENT 1]

i ran a 200hp shot, 11 to 1(@750-780 total hp) on a cast bbf crank for 1 whole season. tore it apart for new bearings and balanced eagle crank/flexplate/balancer, wasn't hurt at all, didn't even wear thru the polishing marks yet. those bbf oe cranks are tuff!! it wouldn't scare me at all to run 7-8lbs of boost with 8 to 1 compression on 1, other than the occasional cavatation jolt.

[sanger rat]

Ken wouldn't a main stud girdle take care of the cap walk?

[atxwrangler]

i am putting together a blown ford for my boat,i have learned a lot so far.you can call me if you want ,361-782-1241. i don't know it all,but,i have learned a lot about the basics,and still learning!

[LakesOnly]

The motor is all stock so I'm not lookin' to make monster power but more for that WOW factor. Please point me in the right direction. :rollside:
Also can anyone tell me if a mid to late 70's Ford 460 has cast or forged internals? Pistons,crank,ect?With very rare exception, all Ford 460's came with cast crank, forged rods and cast dished pistons. In your particular case, c/r is likely around 7.9:1, a compression ratio which might work well with a blower.
The pistons & rods, however, might not...especially the cast pistons. In an engine with high engine hours and resultingly loose bore clearances, the pistons can rock, and then the skirts of the cast pistons have been known to break. This is more a matter of not having proper bore clearances than it is piston integrity, but that's not to say that the cast pistons are plenty strong for a blower application. :squiggle: The rods can handle more abuse than most people give them credit, but given the pistons, the lack of history on the motor and the fact that you want to simply bolt a blower to it, well, personally I'd shy away from the idea.
Talk to guys running blower motors and everyone that runs something other than a Ford will be quick to point out that the oem Ford 460 crank's have a tiny 1.375" snout diameter. It is also a very long snout. The snout length's leverage + 1.375" snout diameter = SNAP! with a load from the blower belt. At least that's what they'll tell you. While this is indeed more possible than other brand combos, the minimal amount of boost you intend to run on a tired old 460 would load the crank so little that I feel you have nothing to worrry about in this particular case.
Speaking of the oem cast cranks: Yes, they are exceedingly strong...much stonger than they have the right to be, and stronger than most of the cast cranks out there from the same era. This comes from the quality material from which they were cast and also the immense journal overlap between the rods and main bearings. Here is a cross sectional engineering drawing of a 460 crankshaft that clarifies what I'm talking about:
http://home.earthlink.net/~highflowdynamics/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/385oem.jpg
As you can see, the 2.500" rod journals and 3.000" mains have a LOT of overlap due to the 3.85" stroke (which is just a 1.925" throw). This is what makes offset stroking the 460 crank so darned easy...and logical, since it already has such a huge piston bore to begin with. ;)
My personal opinion is that if you want to add a blower, then build the motor for the blower. These engine's were originally placed into passenger cars that ran down the freeway at about 2200 rpm. KenF is right that the restricted exhaust flow in the oem iron heads will hurt power. Rods and pistons will hurt reliability, too. Build the shortblock and port the iron heads and you will get your money's worth out of the blower. If you don't, then you will simply be sporting a blower on your engine while well planned tunnel ram motors will give you a run for your money.
Long ago before 460 forged cranks and aluminum heads were available, my partner built an alcohol funny car that used a 1968 production cast iron 460 crank (no snout support), cast iron 460 passenger car heads and a completely unmodified block, slapped a blower on top and managed 7.50's at LA raceway (3000 ft altitude) and 7.20's at Sacramento Raceway.
http://home.earthlink.net/~kaneofthenation/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/714carweb.jpg
Power was so great with only 1 tooth smaller on the blower cog (just 7% overdriven) that everytime he went to 2 teeth down instead of 1, the Halibrand input shaft on the TH400 would twist like a pretzel.
So build it right and these engines can take a hell of a lot of abuse. Build it wrong, and all the money spent is gone forever in the blink of an eye.
LO

[atxwrangler]

thanx for the insight paul! :cool:

[Ken F]

Ken wouldn't a main stud girdle take care of the cap walk?
It might, but the block is already .030 over. By the time I do all the machine work to the block necessary for 4-bolt mains ect, I'm not too far away from a new A-460 block from FRP. That's the way I'm going to go. That way I'm not restricted at all with anything/size I want to do down the road.
Ken

[Dominator Scott]

>Also can anyone tell me if a mid to late 70's Ford 460 has cast or forged internals? Pistons,crank,ect?<
Scott,
It would help a lot to know the engine # (above the starter) and head #'s.
I can tell you that the stock crank is good for quite a bit of HP bumps. On a Ford your weakest point with a stock engine is the heads...expecially the years you are talking about. Upgrading the rods to some CobraJet rods, or truck rods would be advisable. If you decide to go through with it, I've got an almost new set of I-beam rods I'd sell reasonably.
I've got mine at 655 hp/625 tq and have reached the point where I have cap-walk with the stock 2-bolt mains. (BOA2T) I'd try and keep it under the 550 hp deal with 2 bolt mains.
Post up some engine & head #'s
Hope this helps,
Ken F
I will get the numbers off the heads and block today and you guys can translate it for me. :rollside:

[Heatseeker]

...The pistons & rods, however, might not...especially the cast pistons. In an engine with high engine hours and resultingly loose bore clearances, the pistons can rock, and then the skirts of the cast pistons have been known to break. This is more a matter of not having proper bore clearances than it is piston integrity, but that's not to say that the cast pistons are plenty strong for a blower application. :squiggle: The rods can handle more abuse than most people give them credit, but given the pistons, the lack of history on the motor and the fact that you want to simply bolt a blower to it, well, personally I'd shy away from the idea...
LO
Paul is right on with this. I bolted a blower on top of an 18 year old cast piston 454(against advice from many folks on this board). Sure it held up a season and a half of babying it(mostly very short blasts), but the first time I really layed into it(full 1/4 mile or better WFO run), it went pop. Not only did the tow to the ramp take three humiliating hours, but the wife constantly bitched for a week after and I didn't have a boat for a month of prime boating season while I finished up the blower motor I was building. The teardown of the old motor was not pretty!
I guess the moral of the story is, yes you can put a blower on top of an old motor, but it's only a matter of when, not if, it's going to blow up.
Also, the performance gain wasn't all that dramatic(it was alot quicker out of the hole but not much faster on the big end), but the loss of fuel economy certainly was!
Just some more food for thought...

[Dominator Scott]

Paul is right on with this. I bolted a blower on top of an 18 year old cast piston 454(against advice from many folks on this board). Sure it held up a season and a half of babying it(mostly very short blasts), but the first time I really layed into it(full 1/4 mile or better WFO run), it went pop. Not only did the tow to the ramp take three humiliating hours, but the wife constantly bitched for a week after and I didn't have a boat for a month of prime boating season while I finished up the blower motor I was building. The teardown of the old motor was not pretty!
I guess the moral of the story is, yes you can put a blower on top of an old motor, but it's only a matter of when, not if, it's going to blow up.
Also, the performance gain wasn't all that dramatic(it was alot quicker out of the hole but not much faster on the big end), but the loss of fuel economy certainly was!
Just some more food for thought...
All very good points. I could tear down the motor this winter and go through it so it can handle a blower without a problem. The deciding factor will be what I can pick up a blower for so I will just play it by ear at this point.

[Sanger Jet]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&sspagename=ADME%3AB%3AWNARL%3AMT%3A12&viewitem=&item=110047744881#ebayphotohosting
I've been eyeballing this for my 532 stroker for awhile now

[Dominator Scott]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&sspagename=ADME%3AB%3AWNARL%3AMT%3A12&viewitem=&item=110047744881#ebayphotohosting
I've been eyeballing this for my 532 stroker for awhile now
Man that guy has some nice stuff. :rollside:

[roostwear]

I've been looking at that for some time too. I wonder if the wife would swap the trip to Tahiti for that setup on the Advantage? :idea:

[b's sanger]

I would really like to get my hands on a roots style blower and intake for my dads Sanger and would prefer to find one used. Seems everything I find is for Chevy though. Any idea's as to where I could track one down?
The motor is all stock so I'm not lookin' to make monster power but more for that WOW factor. Please point me in the right direction. :rollside:
Also can anyone tell me if a mid to late 70's Ford 460 has cast or forged internals? Pistons,crank,ect?
You're likely not going to have room for the blower belt unless you modify that rear bulkhead and floor.

[Sanger Jet]

You're likely not going to have room for the blower belt unless you modify that rear bulkhead and floor.
The only other choice is another Hull :cry:

[Dominator Scott]

You're likely not going to have room for the blower belt unless you modify that rear bulkhead and floor.
I was lookin' at the boat last night and wondering the same thing. :rollside:

[sanger mike]

D.s. the blower set up will fit in the sanger. thats not an issue. but as you know it becomes alot of work and money to make it work for the whole package. I think it would be cool to put a big stroker ford in that thing. say 557 or so, then dad could just troll around the lake and tell all the cool young jet boaters um it's just a mild 460 (ya wanna race) hehe. :220v: :yuk:

[Dominator Scott]

D.s. the blower set up will fit in the sanger. thats not an issue. but as you know it becomes alot of work and money to make it work for the whole package. I think it would be cool to put a big stroker ford in that thing. say 557 or so, then dad could just troll around the lake and tell all the cool young jet boaters um it's just a mild 460 (ya wanna race) hehe. :220v: :yuk:
He is on a private lake and has the only jet boat out there. Unless you count those new SeaDoo style jet boats. Other than that it is pontoons,a few ski boats and jet ski's.
It is a retirement community so he's not to popular with his neighbors with this boat. :rollside:

[Placecraft Dragstar]

He is on a private lake and has the only jet boat out there. Unless you count those new SeaDoo style jet boats. Other than that it is pontoons,a few ski boats and jet ski's.
It is a retirement community so he's not to popular with his neighbors with this boat. :rollside:
Those jet ski's and SeaDoo boats are not jet boats, They are lake lice :rollside:

[Dominator Scott]

Those jet ski's and SeaDoo boats are not jet boats, They are lake lice :rollside:
Dad calls them "water flea's". :rolleyes:

[IMPATIENT 1]

Dad calls them "water flea's". :rolleyes:
i call em "roost targets" :crossx:

[b's sanger]

D.s. the blower set up will fit in the sanger. thats not an issue. but as you know it becomes alot of work and money to make it work for the whole package. I think it would be cool to put a big stroker ford in that thing. say 557 or so, then dad could just troll around the lake and tell all the cool young jet boaters um it's just a mild 460 (ya wanna race) hehe. :220v: :yuk:
At least in my set-up, there is not enough room for the belt with the stock location of the Ford. I'm leaning toward a stroker for a back-up, already have a 4-bolt SCJ block waiting for attention.