PDA

View Full Version : Custody issue/questions



AZJD
03-14-2007, 07:46 PM
I know this is a touchy and sometimes lousy topic, however I have seen and given some good advice to fellow HB'ers in reguards to this type of topic.....
I have a 6 yr old daughter, and when her mother and I split I was broke as a joke and could not afford to put up the dough for a long fight. My ex has tons of family money. With that being said, I gave up custody and have been seeing my daughter once or twice a week for a couple of hours in the afternoons for the past 3 1/2 years.
I have played the nice card with the ex so that I don't put my daughter thru what I went thru as a child. I have recently been asking for more time with her and her answer was flat out NO! She said, and I quote "hire an attorney, but remember I have 10 of them and you will never get custody." WTF :eek:
So general info question to any dads out there that have gone through this! What can I expect........? Wat are my options? What kind of time frame does something like this need to be resolved? I don't do drugs! I drink socially! I don't have criminal record or DUIs or anything like that! Just want to spend more time in my daughters life......
Any input would be great! Thanks.......

Jyruiz
03-14-2007, 07:50 PM
Sorry to hear bro, but I don't think you need to get an attorney to ask for more time. If your record is as clean as you say, I don't see why a judge would not allow you more time. Either way, I wish you good luck and hope to get to spend more time with your little one.

Kilrtoy
03-14-2007, 07:52 PM
Been there done that and you are at her mercy , I hate to say that but that is the case...

riverbound
03-14-2007, 07:55 PM
ANYthing that can be used against you WILL. even stuff as small as things, comments, posted on line. If you can prove you are a positive Role model, and a good father figure you are still in for a fight, but with the ammount of money she has to throw around you will have to throw in quite a bit too. I guess the question is, how much is more time with your daughter worth to you?
Im in no way doubting your love for your daughter, but I have seen buddies go through this in the past and it was very expensive for them :(

YeLLowBoaT
03-14-2007, 07:57 PM
Try to keep it out of court if you can. If ever thing is on the up and up I don't see why she would not let you spend more time with her. I hate to see it go to court. I'm in the process of getting custdity of my cousin.( atleast temporaly)
and I quote "hire an attorney, but remember I have 10 of them and you will never get custody."
statments like that will cost her latter on. Its time to start a record of every thing that is said and when.

riverbound
03-14-2007, 07:57 PM
Sorry to hear bro, but I don't think you need to get an attorney to ask for more time. If your record is as clean as you say, I don't see why a judge would not allow you more time. Either way, I wish you good luck and hope to get to spend more time with your little one.
True, but if she (her family) has lawyers on the payroll. they will look high and low for "dirt" and the smallest things will be blown out of proportion and out of context.

AZJD
03-14-2007, 08:09 PM
Her family is very wealthy and has a ton of lawyers on the payroll! I am trying and have been for 3 years to keep this out of court. She is re-married now and ever since the wedding my time has been cut shorter. Stepdad has full access to her at school and on weekends, however I can't even pick her up from school!

Jordy
03-14-2007, 08:17 PM
however I can't even pick her up from school!
Apparently your Ricky Bobby style driving has done nothing to impress her... :jawdrop: :eek:
That sucks that she's playing this game now J. Was really hoping that you both had grown up in the last 8 years, sucks that it seems to be somewhat one sided.
All you can do is keep doing what you are doing. Spend as much time as you can with Kaylee as often as you can. You know the grandpa card will get you nowhere, but what about the grandma card? She's one of the sweetest, most genuine people I've ever met in my life. You know it's just the evil blood pulling the strings right now. :(

DK18
03-14-2007, 08:20 PM
Hate to be in your shoes! Im thankfull my ex will at least let the kids decide what they want to do and when they want to come over. If your ex isnt letting her come over even when she asks.. Thats F#cked up! Lifes supposed to be about the kids!

Deano
03-14-2007, 08:20 PM
Why would your time be cut shorter? If your divorce papers say otherwise, then you can just go down to the court and get that taken care of quick.
My only advise is to get on everyones good side. It will work out to more time and of course better for your child. It is extremely difficult for a father to get custody.
I was dating a girl that had children with a well known celeb. She wasn't/isn't the best mother and he was trying to get custody. This guy spent loads of money and didn't get anything but a headache.
Of course you would give everything you have for your children, but I think the best is to get in good with the mother and go from there. Works great for me. I get my kids whenever I or they want.
Maybe get an attorney and atleast fight for more time if she doesn't budge.

AZJD
03-14-2007, 08:21 PM
Apparently your Ricky Bobby style driving has done nothing to impress her... :jawdrop: :eek:
That sucks that she's playing this game now J. Was really hoping that you both had grown up in the last 8 years, sucks that it seems to be somewhat one sided.
All you can do is keep doing what you are doing. Spend as much time as you can with Kaylee as often as you can. You know the grandpa card will get you nowhere, but what about the grandma card? She's one of the sweetest, most genuine people I've ever met in my life. You know it's just the evil blood pulling the strings right now. :(
Bottom line is that her mom has and always will give her what she wants. I have thought about that approach, however it has never paid off in the past! Blood is thicker than her genuiness!

squirt'nmyload
03-14-2007, 08:23 PM
see if the ex wants to go waterskiing at pleasant:jawdrop: :D

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:23 PM
I think your best shot is to continue to play the cool card for now. Be at everything you can for school or sports. Make yourself available to be with her at every chance possible. If there is a soccer game, be there 30 minutes early and leave after they do.
Just show your support for now and swallow those feelings for the good of your girl.
Instead of paying a lawyer, take that money and do things for your daughter like sending her balloons and a bear at school on special days. When her mom or stepdad picks her up, make it certain that they know you are there whether physically or not with her bringing those balloons home. Simple things to let your daugter know that you care and love her will make the difference in her life; not fighting for custody and going broke fighting on that. Take her to fun places in town like Chuckee Cheese or Amazing Jakes.
As time goes on, she will want to spend more time with you. When she is with you, make sure that you have a ton of fun with her and she enjoys her time with her dad. That is the beauty of being the guy on the outside, you'll become the fun one that she wants to spend more time with.

AZJD
03-14-2007, 08:24 PM
Why would your time be cut shorter? If your divorce papers say otherwise, then you can just go down to the court and get that taken care of quick.
My only advise is to get on everyones good side. It will work out to more time and of course better for your child. It is extremely difficult for a father to get custody.
I was dating a girl that had children with a well known celeb. She wasn't/isn't the best mother and he was trying to get custody. This guy spent loads of money and didn't get anything but a headache.
Of course you would give everything you have for your children, but I think the best is to get in good with the mother and go from there. Works great for me. I get my kids whenever I or they want.
Maybe get an attorney and atleast fight for more time if she doesn't budge.
I have zero custody, and no court appointed visitation due to the fact that I moved out of state for a year after the divorce for work. I don't necesarily need custody, but would like court appointed visitation. Don't care about child support costs but I am concerened with the amount I would have to spend fighting her attorneys!
Bottom line is that I have made up my mind to persue this and I just have to take the next step and consult an attorney!

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:25 PM
Another idea, buy her class pizza, cookies, and soda one day. The kids will love you and thank her for the things you did.

DK18
03-14-2007, 08:28 PM
I think your best shot is to continue to play the cool card for now. Be at everything you can for school or sports. Make yourself available to be with her at every chance possible. If there is a soccer game, be there 30 minutes early and leave after they do.
Just show your support for now and swallow those feelings for the good of your girl.
Instead of paying a lawyer, take that money and do things for your daughter like sending her balloons and a bear at school on special days. When her mom or stepdad picks her up, make it certain that they know you are there whether physically or not with her bringing those balloons home. Simple things to let your daugter know that you care and love her will make the difference in her life; not fighting for custody and going broke fighting on that. Take her to fun places in town like Chuckee Cheese or Amazing Jakes.
As time goes on, she will want to spend more time with you. When she is with you, make sure that you have a ton of fun with her and she enjoys her time with her dad. That is the beauty of being the guy on the outside, you'll become the fun one that she wants to spend more time with.
Exactly!!!!! It works for me. lately Ive been getting my kids every weekend.
but only cause they talk their mom into it.

AZJD
03-14-2007, 08:31 PM
I think your best shot is to continue to play the cool card for now. Be at everything you can for school or sports. Make yourself available to be with her at every chance possible. If there is a soccer game, be there 30 minutes early and leave after they do.
Just show your support for now and swallow those feelings for the good of your girl.
Instead of paying a lawyer, take that money and do things for your daughter like sending her balloons and a bear at school on special days. When her mom or stepdad picks her up, make it certain that they know you are there whether physically or not with her bringing those balloons home. Simple things to let your daugter know that you care and love her will make the difference in her life; not fighting for custody and going broke fighting on that. Take her to fun places in town like Chuckee Cheese or Amazing Jakes.
As time goes on, she will want to spend more time with you. When she is with you, make sure that you have a ton of fun with her and she enjoys her time with her dad. That is the beauty of being the guy on the outside, you'll become the fun one that she wants to spend more time with.
Heres the big problem Mike. She has managed to pull the plug on me taking her anywhere by jockying her schedule so much I can't keep up. She knows what days I cannot get to the house as soon as she's out of school and she decides what days I can come see her so that I don't have the ability to even ask to take her anywhere. She always convieniently has something going on to keep me from being able to plan anything. This girl is good at this type of thing........I think Jordy can confirm the ability of my ex to completely control any situation.
I am not told about any of her school functions. I have to look them up on line or call the school for info. Once upon a time when her parents were still trying to get us back together, her mother would call me to tell me when and where the functions were so I could be there for them..............not so much anymore since she re-married.

Jordy
03-14-2007, 08:31 PM
Bottom line is that her mom has and always will give her what she wants.
I do know her mom remember??? Oh, and her mom still gets what she wants as well... it's a never ending cycle. :(

Jordy
03-14-2007, 08:33 PM
I think Jordy can confirm the ability of my ex to completely control any situation.
That's an incredible understatement. It's genetic and I do believe the genetics lead right back to this guy -----> :devil: :jawdrop:

Deano
03-14-2007, 08:34 PM
I would at least consult an attorney then. I would think they would give you visitation. Shit happens...the judge won't let your daughter suffer for it. Good luck!

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:35 PM
I have zero custody, and no court appointed visitation due to the fact that I moved out of state for a year after the divorce for work. I don't necesarily need custody, but would like court appointed visitation. Don't care about child support costs but I am concerened with the amount I would have to spend fighting her attorneys!
Bottom line is that I have made up my mind to persue this and I just have to take the next step and consult an attorney!
I would simply write her a nice letter letting her know how much your daughter means to you and that you want to remain a strong part of her life. Then in the letter kiss your ex's ass a little. tell her how greatful you are for the work she has done for your little girl and how proud you are of your little girl now. Tell your ex she is great mother and you couldn;t imagine your little girl with anyone else as a mother.
Then explain that you dont want to try and step in on the bond they have, simply you would like to remain a father figure to your little girl and be in her life becuase you love her so much.
Having that in writing and not acting like a dick will come in handy. Just write nice letters to her. However, what you are really doing is building up months of effective communication that if it does go to court and you show the judge what contact you have made with your ex and how you compliment her, showing that you just want to be there too, things may work more in your favor.

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:37 PM
Heres the big problem Mike. She has managed to pull the plug on me taking her anywhere by jockying her schedule so much I can't keep up. She knows what days I cannot get to the house as soon as she's out of school and she decides what days I can come see her so that I don't have the ability to even ask to take her anywhere. She always convieniently has something going on to keep me from being able to plan anything. This girl is good at this type of thing........I think Jordy can confirm the ability of my ex to completely control any situation.
I am not told about any of her school functions. I have to look them up on line or call the school for info. Once upon a time when her parents were still trying to get us back together, her mother would call me to tell me when and where the functions were so I could be there for them..............not so much anymore since she re-married.
Fock it. Give the boat to an attorney and get some custody. :(
It will work, just fock with her head for a while. She will come around, you just have to be stonger mentally to play the game.

FOURQ
03-14-2007, 08:39 PM
i went through this crap about 2 years ago and if your as clean as you say I dont see a problem with it. the best advice I got from my lawyer was just be cool let her step on her own toes. meaning let her try to make you look like a bad guy and the Judge will see right through it if your clean..they do this shit all day long and know when someone is playing games or not. well I got 50/50 everything and I didnt have a pot to piss in but I was clean.I say go for it

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:39 PM
Heres the big problem Mike. She has managed to pull the plug on me taking her anywhere by jockying her schedule so much I can't keep up. She knows what days I cannot get to the house as soon as she's out of school and she decides what days I can come see her so that I don't have the ability to even ask to take her anywhere. She always convieniently has something going on to keep me from being able to plan anything. This girl is good at this type of thing........I think Jordy can confirm the ability of my ex to completely control any situation.
I am not told about any of her school functions. I have to look them up on line or call the school for info. Once upon a time when her parents were still trying to get us back together, her mother would call me to tell me when and where the functions were so I could be there for them..............not so much anymore since she re-married.
This means you have to bring the fun to her. Maybe her favorite game. Instead of sitting there and hugging her, show her how to have fun right in front of her mom.
Here is what will start to happen. Be there any second she allows. The new husband will start ot get bothered, but be super cool to this guy. This guy is the one who is going to be in her ear telling her to let you take her for an hour. Then as time goes on, it will change.
As I said, whoever can play it cool mentally and be very level headed about this the most, will start to prevail.

AZJD
03-14-2007, 08:40 PM
I would simply write her a nice letter letting her know how much your daughter means to you and that you want to remain a strong part of her life. Then in the letter kiss your ex's ass a little. tell her how greatful you are for the work she has done for your little girl and how proud you are of your little girl now. Tell your ex she is great mother and you couldn;t imagine your little girl with anyone else as a mother.
Then explain that you dont want to try and step in on the bond they have, simply you would like to remain a father figure to your little girl and be in her life becuase you love her so much.
Having that in writing and not acting like a dick will come in handy. Just write nice letters to her. However, what you are really doing is building up months of effective communication that if it does go to court and you show the judge what contact you have made with your ex and how you compliment her, showing that you just want to be there too, things may work more in your favor.
Good advice. I have tried it for 3 years in person. Maybe need some paper copies now. I am logging everyday weather or not I see her or not. Whenever her mom changes times or days on me and when she drops her at grandparents everything.....

AZJD
03-14-2007, 08:41 PM
Thanks everyone. Will keep ya informed and up to date!

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:41 PM
i went through this crap about 2 years ago and if your as clean as you say I dont see a problem with it. the best advice I got from my lawyer was just be cool let her step on her own toes. meaning let her try to make you look like a bad guy and the Judge will see right through it if your clean..they do this shit all day long and know when someone is playing games or not. well I got 50/50 everything and I didnt have a pot to piss in but I was clean.I say go for it
Exactly... That is why I say do the letters because that will show the level of contact you are attmepting for and how nice you are trying to be about it. If she is a psycho bitch, it will come out and a judge will see that. Make sure that in every letter, you show intentions to part of her life and dont want your little girl to be without her mom. You just want to be her dad as well.

Jordy
03-14-2007, 08:41 PM
This means you have to bring the fun to her. Maybe her favorite game. Instead of sitting there and hugging her, show her how to have fun right in front of her mom.
There you go. Sell the boat and buy a horse!!! I've even got a saddle I'll loan you. :D :D :D
p.s. I just want to watch this one unfold. I remember the horses she used to hand me to ride. :jawdrop:

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:42 PM
Good advice. I have tried it for 3 years in person. Maybe need some paper copies now. I am logging everyday weather or not I see her or not. Whenever her mom changes times or days on me and when she drops her at grandparents everything.....
Great start. Just keep that discreet!!!!!

Magic34
03-14-2007, 08:45 PM
There you go. Sell the boat and buy a horse!!! I've even got a saddle I'll loan you. :D :D :D
p.s. I just want to watch this one unfold. I remember the horses she used to hand me to ride. :jawdrop:
Jordy... Ding ding ding....
You got a great idea.
Hire a fockin petting zoo to come to her house becuase he mom wont let her go anywhere with you. Do this at one of your scheduled visits.
We had a petting zoo come over at my girls 1st bday party. It was about $300 for 60-90 minutes and they brought a pony for the kids to ride.
How much would the new husband shit himself if a fockin llama, pony, chickens and goats are eating his trees in the front yard and shittin all over the place.
That would work great. 2 birds with one stone on this one and being serious it is a great idea. Your daughter has a memorable experience and you get to shit all over the ex's lawn at the same time!!!!

Jesster
03-14-2007, 08:46 PM
I have a patient that is a family attorney for Riverside county family court system. I see her tomorrow night and will ask her what kind of chance you have. Have you missed (not been able to attend) any of the time that you do have with her? Are you now stable financially? Are the visits now monitored? Not really any of my business but she will probably ask. PM me if you like.

Jordy
03-14-2007, 08:48 PM
Jordy... Ding ding ding....
You got a great idea.
Hire a fockin petting zoo to come to her house becuase he mom wont let her go anywhere with you. Do this at one of your scheduled visits.
We had a petting zoo come over at my girls 1st bday party. It was about $300 for 60-90 minutes and they brought a pony for the kids to ride.
How much would the new husband shit himself if a fockin llama, pony, chickens and goats are eating his trees in the front yard and shittin all over the place.
That would work great. 2 birds with one stone on this one and being serious it is a great idea. Your daughter has a memorable experience and you get to shit all over the ex's lawn at the same time!!!!
The problem is, she's already got that at the house. He'd need some girrafe's, koala bears, elephants, and aardvarks to top the menagerie up there. ;)
Kaylee has a couple horses and is riding hunter/jumpers already. I just want to see Justin on something with no handlebars, throttle, or brakes. :)

Cas
03-14-2007, 08:57 PM
from a Dad who fought, fought and fought some more to get custody and finally did......get EVERYTHING in writing. Send her a certified letter and ask for a written response. In the letter, point out the things you mentioned here ie:
my time has been cut shorter. Stepdad has full access to her at school and on weekends, however I can't even pick her up from school!
I am not told about any of her school functions
She has managed to pull the plug on me taking her anywhere by jockying her schedule so much I can't keep up. She knows what days I cannot get to the house as soon as she's out of school and she decides what days I can come see her so that I don't have the ability to even ask to take her anywhere. She always convieniently has something going on to keep me from being able to plan anything.
The courts are only interested in "what's in the best interest of the child". You only need to prove that you're a good father that only wants more time with your daughter. If you want to keep her over night, you need to prove you have the means and the room for her to be comfortable and have her own space. Set specific times for pick-up and drop off and don't be late.....keep a log!
I could write a friggin book on this stuff....took me 2 years and darn near everything I had to get my kids. What it boiled down to was I was able to show patterns, good and bad, of my ex. There were a few times I waited for over an hour in front of her house to return the kids while she was out having a good time.
The 3 most important things-
1. write everything down - keep a log - good and bad - keep detailed records
2. make all contact regarding your daughter in writing with a written response - make copies with dates
3. what is in the best interest of the child

ROZ
03-14-2007, 09:02 PM
i went through this crap about 2 years ago and if your as clean as you say I dont see a problem with it. the best advice I got from my lawyer was just be cool let her step on her own toes. meaning let her try to make you look like a bad guy and the Judge will see right through it if your clean..they do this shit all day long and know when someone is playing games or not. well I got 50/50 everything and I didnt have a pot to piss in but I was clean.I say go for it
Well said... My case is ending up such as yours.
One thing to remember is that you're asking for more visitation and the genuine attempt to become closer to your child is welcomed by the court. You can try it pro per with the help of az's family court services...

Magic34
03-14-2007, 09:06 PM
The problem is, she's already got that at the house. He'd need some girrafe's, koala bears, elephants, and aardvarks to top the menagerie up there. ;)
Kaylee has a couple horses and is riding hunter/jumpers already. I just want to see Justin on something with no handlebars, throttle, or brakes. :)
Well, how the hell do we transport a giraffe or elephant?
This seems like a good challenge.

JB in so cal
03-14-2007, 09:07 PM
Well said... My case is ending up such as yours.
One thing to remember is that you're asking for more visitation and the genuine attempt to become closer to your child is welcomed by the court. You can try it pro per with the help of az's family court services...
Good luck, Chris. Hope it turns out well for you.

Jordy
03-14-2007, 09:12 PM
Well, how the hell do we transport a giraffe or elephant?
This seems like a good challenge.
The elephant shouldn't be too hard. It's trying to get the dumbass giraffe to duck his long neck under the overpasses and traffic lights that complicate things. I do have a few friends with 6 horse goosenecks. If we get his head in, the neck and body will follow with the right application of cattle prod. ;) :D

Magic34
03-14-2007, 09:14 PM
The elephant shouldn't be too hard. It's trying to get the dumbass giraffe to duck his long neck under the overpasses and traffic lights that complicate things. I do have a few friends with 6 horse goosenecks. If we get his head in, the neck and body will follow with the right application of cattle prod. ;) :D
I am free this Sunday. :idea:
But after helping with this, you jokers need to help me with raising and adding 10' to my garage. :D

Magic34
03-14-2007, 09:16 PM
J, on a serious note, just get your ducks in a row before going too far. Start written, effective, mature and understand communication with her so when that day comes, which it will, you are able to make a good claim for some more custody.
Oh and once you start this, watch every move becuase she can hire a private investigator to follow you and tape you. Just make sure every decision you make is a good one. That includes how you change lanes on the freeway. Just picture is a someone always watching waiting for you to fock up.

Jordy
03-14-2007, 09:19 PM
I am free this Sunday. :idea:
But after helping with this, you jokers need to help me with raising and adding 10' to my garage. :D
You going to keep the giraffe in the garage??? :jawdrop: :D
See, here is a simple illustration. As you can see, the lion, zebra, and hippo are all about the same height. The giraffe has a neck that is just out of control, which makes things much more difficult. :(
http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=26483&stc=1&d=1173935927

Magic34
03-14-2007, 09:20 PM
You going to keep the giraffe in the garage??? :jawdrop: :D
See, here is a simple illustration. As you can see, the lion, zebra, and hippo are all about the same height. The giraffe has a neck that is just out of control, which makes things much more difficult. :(
http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=26483&stc=1&d=1173935927
LMAO
And that is a great movie. Seen it about 200 times.
Look, mints!!!!!

Magic34
03-14-2007, 09:22 PM
I have a pommy that we could shave to look like a lion. It may work for a 6 y/o as passing off for a lion. :idea:

Jordy
03-14-2007, 09:24 PM
And that is a great movie. Seen it about 200 times.
So you know what a pain in the ass giraffes can be!!! :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop:
I'd suggest these guys, but they'd end up taking over the whole place and we'd all be on lifeboats!!! :jawdrop:
http://www.theplaza.ca/moview/Pics/Films/2005/Madagascar/pic1.jpg

Magic34
03-14-2007, 09:35 PM
So you know what a pain in the ass giraffes can be!!! :jawdrop: :jawdrop: :jawdrop:
I'd suggest these guys, but they'd end up taking over the whole place and we'd all be on lifeboats!!! :jawdrop:
http://www.theplaza.ca/moview/Pics/Films/2005/Madagascar/pic1.jpg
We've been had boys!!!!
But the penguins are psychotic!!!
They could probably really help though. Dig her a deep hole to Antarctica.

Jordy
03-14-2007, 09:49 PM
We've been had boys!!!!
But the penguins are psychotic!!!
They could probably really help though. Dig her a deep hole to Antarctica.
In all seriousness though, I've known Justin going on 8 years now and his ex just as long. She definately has to have the upper hand in whatever she's going into and will pull no punches getting there. Hopefully one of these days she will realize the only one being punished is Kaylee, who just happens to be an innocent bystander in the whole thing, not a pawn in the game. :(

Jordan_23_85205
03-14-2007, 10:11 PM
Hey AZJD,
I live in AZ and went through this about 10years ago. I wasn't married to the woman but I knew I wanted rights. After fighting for joint custody, I went back fought for full custody and won. Now today, I have sole custody and my wife adopted her when she was 4.
Now I was in a differen poistion then you are, but I got a lawyer that specializes in helping fathers. His name is John Popilek and he was located in Scottsdale. Let me know if you would like me to find his contact information.
Anyways, good luck....I've been there and it sucks.

32sunrkt
03-14-2007, 10:38 PM
( Hope this helps )
Arizona Child Custody Laws
Guidelines for Child Custody Under Arizona Laws. (25-403)
Arizona laws require the court to determine child custody in accordance with the best interests of the child. The court shall consider all relevant factors, including the following guidelines:
1. The wishes of the child's parent or parents as to custody.
2. The wishes of the child as to custody.
3. The interaction and interrelationship of the child with the child's parent or parents, the child's siblings and any other person who may significantly affect the child's best interest.
4. The child's adjustment to home, school and community.
5. The mental and physical health of all individuals involved.
6. Which parent is more likely to allow the child frequent and meaningful continuing contact with the other parent.
7. If one parent, both parents or neither parent has provided primary care of the child.
8. The nature and extent of coercion or duress used by a parent in obtaining a child custody agreement.
9. Whether a parent has complied with the educational program regarding children and divorce that is required by Arizona laws.
* Preferences of the Court.
In awarding child custody, the court may order sole custody or joint custody. The child custody laws in Arizona do not create a presumption in favor of sole custody over joint custody, or vice versa. The court, in determining custody of a child, shall not prefer one parent as custodian because of that parent's sex.
* Joint Custody.
The court may award joint custody of a child if both parents agree and submit a written parenting plan and the court finds that joint custody is in the best interests of the child. The court may order joint legal custody without ordering joint physical custody.
The court may issue an order for joint custody over the objection of one of the parents if the court makes specific written findings of why joint custody is in the best interest of the child. In addition to the factors listed above in determining custody, the court will consider the following factors in determining whether joint custody is in the child's best interests:
- 1. The custody agreement or lack of a custody agreement by the parents regarding joint custody.
- 2. A parent's lack of agreement is unreasonable or is influenced by an issue not related to the best interests of the child.
-3. The past, present and future abilities of the parents to cooperate in decision-making about the child to the extent required by the order of joint custody.
-4. Whether the joint custody agreement is logistically possible.
* Joint custody shall not be awarded if the court makes a finding of the existence of significant domestic violence or if the court finds by a preponderance of the evidence that there has been a significant history of domestic violence.
Parenting Plan.
The parents must submit a parenting plan setting out each parent's rights and responsibilities for the following:
-1. The personal care of the child and for decisions in areas such as education, health care and religious training;
-2. A physical custody schedule for the child, including holidays and school vacations;
-3. A procedure by which proposed changes, disputes and alleged breaches may be mediated or resolved, which may include the use of conciliation services or private counseling;
-4. A procedure for periodic review of the terms of the parenting plan by the parents; and
-5. A statement that the parties understand that joint custody does not necessarily mean equal parenting time.
*** Access to Records.
Unless otherwise provided by court order or law, on reasonable request both parents are entitled to have equal access to documents and other information concerning the child's education and physical, mental, moral and emotional health including medical, school, police, court and other records. A parent who attempts to restrict the release of documents or information by the custodian without a prior court order is subject to appropriate legal sanctions.
Domestic Violence.
The court shall consider evidence of domestic violence as being contrary to the best interests of the child. If the court determines that a parent who is seeking custody of the child has committed an act of domestic violence against the other parent, there is a refutable presumption that a child custody award to the parent who committed the act of domestic violence is contrary to the best interests of the child. This presumption does not apply if both parents have committed an act of domestic violence. The court may place restrictions upon a parent who it finds has engaged in acts of domestic violence, if it finds that doing so is in the best interest of the child.

lewiville
03-14-2007, 10:42 PM
Another idea, buy her class pizza, cookies, and soda one day. The kids will love you and thank her for the things you did.
On that note, coach her soccer team, take her to church, find daddy and daughter weekend things, etc. Just get in there and be a dad. Your daughter will know that you love her. The ex is not going to know what hit her when your daughter turns 12 she can make the decision where she wants to live and if you keep up the good get together things, you'll be the million dollar dad. By that time you ex will get devorced again and then be looking to get back together. You know what to do next.

boater012
03-14-2007, 10:56 PM
Hey Justin You are a great guy and will not have an issue getting more time with her without a high dollar attorney. I just went through this in december with my 2 and a half year old son. My ex tried to pull the he does drugs, he is a bad guy crap and the judge saw right through it as others have suggested. I represented myself and I got exactly what I was asking for, to the letter.
The judge actually thanked me for wanting to a bigger part of my sons life!
I went in very prepared, I did a ton of research online at the california court website. I know you are in AZ but I wouldn't sweat it too hard. Just be honest and let the judge know exactly what you were thinking when you agreed to turn over custody back when you did it! They are alot more pro-dad then they used to be, in cali anyways.
I hope this helps sir, btw if you dont have time to do much research I still have about 200 pages of precident in a folder and I would be more than happy to make you copies and fedex it to you man. Goodluck

Ziggy
03-14-2007, 11:46 PM
I'm willing to bet she is not a complete angel so find a little dirt on her and spring at the right time.............patience.

DaddyMack
03-14-2007, 11:49 PM
Thanks everyone. Will keep ya informed and up to date!
That sucks.. sorry to hear about your sitation.. But no matter the expense of her attorneys, the courts do have to typically abide by the law and it can be turned around.
You probably have an organization that is called "equal rights for dads" or something similar. call the family courts they can help you.. They are pretty powerful lobby, no matter the cost or her attys. I would start there.. sometime that organization alone can work.... otherwise the
alternative is hire youself a good atty and go for it.. you have nothing to lose.

AZJD
03-15-2007, 05:07 AM
Thanks again all!:D

photo chick
03-15-2007, 05:57 AM
Justin...this really stinks! As someone else said, it will only hurt your daughter in the end. I wish more mom's would realize that!!!!
I don't have any useful advice but my aunt is in the DA's office of Tempe, PM me if you want the name of a good attorney....
Good luck!

rrrr
03-15-2007, 06:27 AM
from a Dad who fought, fought and fought some more to get custody and finally did......get EVERYTHING in writing. Send her a certified letter and ask for a written response. In the letter, point out the things you mentioned here ie:
The courts are only interested in "what's in the best interest of the child". You only need to prove that you're a good father that only wants more time with your daughter. If you want to keep her over night, you need to prove you have the means and the room for her to be comfortable and have her own space. Set specific times for pick-up and drop off and don't be late.....keep a log!
I could write a friggin book on this stuff....took me 2 years and darn near everything I had to get my kids. What it boiled down to was I was able to show patterns, good and bad, of my ex. There were a few times I waited for over an hour in front of her house to return the kids while she was out having a good time.
The 3 most important things-
1. write everything down - keep a log - good and bad - keep detailed records
2. make all contact regarding your daughter in writing with a written response - make copies with dates
3. what is in the best interest of the child
This is the accurate info. The court is mandated by law to do what's best for your daughter. The judge should take a pretty dim view of the fact that your ex is refusing you YOUR PARENTAL RIGHTS.
When I got divorced I was traveling more than half the time, couldn't argue custody. But I wrote everything down, took notes, because my ex truly was a shitty mom. Told me I'd never get custody because she "wasn't a protitute and didn't do drugs".
But three years after the divorce I hired a kick ass attorney and spent many late nights writing a narrative of the time since we split.
I knew everything about my son's school work and her refusal to attend parent teacher conferences. His teacher testified in a deposition that I had met with her many times and called her, in spite of the fact my son lived in Houston with his mom and I lived in Dallas.
I knew everything about his medical history. I had him tested for ADD, and when that came up in the trial her lawyer, all smug, asked me what I knew about Ritalin. He was torpeded pretty quickly when I rattled off the chemical name, the physiological effect of the drug, statistics on ADD, etc.
Took him to the orthodondist, he needed braces and she said he didn't. WTF, she's a dental professional? Made her attorney look stupid again.
She kept him out past midnight on weeknights playing softball, drank after the game, and drove with him in the car. She smoked in the car and house and testified that she didn't see it as a problem (that was a freebie in front of the court; I told you she was a shitty mom).
I testified that in spite of the fact I paid around $1,000 a month in child support, I bought clothing and shoes for the kid and paid for his haircuts. I kept reciepts for that and medical expenses, and she refused to reimburse me 50% as required by our divorce decree.
I could go on.....bottom line is I walked out of court with custody and she paid me child support for 13 years until my son was 19.
You have to know EVERYTHING about your child and be ready to talk about it.
This is simple stuff......you are looking for what is called a Motion to Modify Parental Custody.
GET A GOOD ATTORNEY. Paying an extra hundred bucks an hour for a superstar WILL make a difference.
Good luck. You have to be a tough, thorough hard ass to pull this off. But you can do it.

BadKachina
03-15-2007, 06:57 AM
If I remember right, to set up custody and child support for my child we had to go see an arbitrator downtown. I think you are allowed to request arbitration every two years or so. You don't need a lawer for that, it's a free service for both of you. Once you sign up she has to attend. I did this a few years back and got my visitation and child support worked out. The child support was a little more than I wanted but they gave me the tax write off instead. They also nailed out what holidays we both got etc.. It's a good service and best of all it's free. If this works out for I'll send you my legal fees.
Good luck, Paul.
http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/sscDocs/word/drad10h.doc

soupersonic
03-15-2007, 07:49 AM
If I remember right, to set up custody and child support for my child we had to go see an arbitrator downtown. I think you are allowed to request arbitration every two years or so. You don't need a lawer for that, it's a free service for both of you. Once you sign up she has to attend. I did this a few years back and got my visitation and child support worked out. The child support was a little more than I wanted but they gave me the tax write off instead. They also nailed out what holidays we both got etc.. It's a good service and best of all it's free. If this works out for I'll send you my legal fees.
Good luck, Paul.
http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/sscDocs/word/drad10h.doc
Great advice .Also, there is no reason you cant get visitation every other weekend and every other holiday. One more gem i learned the hard way,keep a video camera handy and dont be afraid to record things like the exchanges and phone conversations.

Jordy
03-15-2007, 07:50 AM
One more gem i learned the hard way,keep a video camera handy and dont be afraid to record things like the exchanges and phone conversations.
You don't want to let Justin loose with a video camera, c'mon now!!!! All kinds of non-court appropriate footage would end up on those tapes. :jawdrop:

DaddyMack
03-15-2007, 08:12 AM
The courts are only interested in "what's in the best interest of the child". .......The 3 most important things-
1. write everything down - keep a log - good and bad - keep detailed records
2. make all contact regarding your daughter in writing with a written response - make copies with dates
3. what is in the best interest of the child
The logs and records are really important.
This is really good advice in addition to what I advised above.... BUT #3
should be number one...that has to be your foremost.
someone else on here stated that the court looks at
"A parent's lack of agreement is unreasonable or is influenced by an issue not related to the best interests of the child." From what you have stated, her actions alone are not in the best interests of the child. That has to be number 1 and emphasized, no matter what you do.
I don't practice family law (more dangerous than representing criminals:jawdrop: ) but I did assist a mother who had no money (pro bono) against her husband who was a cop about two years ago. The family courts, unfortuantely, operate under their own guidelines. i.e. rules of evidence, etc. seem not to apply. I was dealing with allegations of drug use, etc. We complied with all of their requests (and passed) but were getting no where. So I decided to make allegations that the cop was using drugs as well and asked for testing and start making him jump through the hoops he was making her do. We settled right in court and he backed off entirely. I don't think he was using, but the point being, the courts kind of let anything go under the guise of the best interests of the children. So be prepared for that as well, both offensively and defensively.
again.. seek out "Equal Rights for Divorced Fathers". Most of what they do is free, AND they do this all the time. They have a terrific success rate in equalizing the playing field, no matter the strength of the other sides attorney and are usually well respected in the courts. Further, they can usually get both sides talking just due to their strength. Start with them and then they can give you all kinds of recommendations for attorneys, etc. if it becomes necessary to get one.

Biglue
03-15-2007, 08:37 AM
Don't have any advice for you JD, but it looks like there's people in the know with good advice. Just wishing you good luck with your little girl bro.

seanv
03-15-2007, 08:50 AM
jd i went thru all of this here a few years ago with my kayleigh. call me at work 623.815.2262 i can tell you how the az family courts work lawyers or not;)

lewiville
03-15-2007, 09:28 AM
This is the accurate info. The court is mandated by law to do what's best for your daughter. The judge should take a pretty dim view of the fact that your ex is refusing you YOUR PARENTAL RIGHTS.
When I got divorced I was traveling more than half the time, couldn't argue custody. But I wrote everything down, took notes, because my ex truly was a shitty mom. Told me I'd never get custody because she "wasn't a protitute and didn't do drugs".
But three years after the divorce I hired a kick ass attorney and spent many late nights writing a narrative of the time since we split.
I knew everything about my son's school work and her refusal to attend parent teacher conferences. His teacher testified in a deposition that I had met with her many times and called her, in spite of the fact my son lived in Houston with his mom and I lived in Dallas.
I knew everything about his medical history. I had him tested for ADD, and when that came up in the trial her lawyer, all smug, asked me what I knew about Ritalin. He was torpeded pretty quickly when I rattled off the chemical name, the physiological effect of the drug, statistics on ADD, etc.
Took him to the orthodondist, he needed braces and she said he didn't. WTF, she's a dental professional? Made her attorney look stupid again.
She kept him out past midnight on weeknights playing softball, drank after the game, and drove with him in the car. She smoked in the car and house and testified that she didn't see it as a problem (that was a freebie in front of the court; I told you she was a shitty mom).
I testified that in spite of the fact I paid around $1,000 a month in child support, I bought clothing and shoes for the kid and paid for his haircuts. I kept reciepts for that and medical expenses, and she refused to reimburse me 50% as required by our divorce decree.
I could go on.....bottom line is I walked out of court with custody and she paid me child support for 13 years until my son was 19.
You have to know EVERYTHING about your child and be ready to talk about it.
This is simple stuff......you are looking for what is called a Motion to Modify Parental Custody.
GET A GOOD ATTORNEY. Paying an extra hundred bucks an hour for a superstar WILL make a difference.
Good luck. You have to be a tough, thorough hard ass to pull this off. But you can do it.
kind of sucks because I did all of that stuff and by the time we left the court a year later I was so out of breath and $$$. It was like training to be a pro athlete. Always maximizing your time in doing something for your kids. I had the kick ass attorney to. Let the kids be your motivation. I came out with half custody and my relationship with the ex is good. I set an example that I was trying to set in the marriage and that was "don't FOOCK" with me because I will work harder than you and stay up later than you to win what I believe is far. She told me that she would never hold the kids against me and yet would never let them spend the night during the week.