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YeLLowBoaT
03-20-2007, 09:20 PM
Crew safty comes 1st, public safty comes 2nd...
I can't beleave he just said that on the news. :eek:

Kilrtoy
03-20-2007, 09:24 PM
Crew safty comes 1st, public safty comes 2nd...
I can't beleave he just said that on the news. :eek:
So what is the problem, I dont see anything wrong with that

squirt'nmyload
03-20-2007, 09:24 PM
well, who's gonna save the public if the crew can't??:D

Windy
03-20-2007, 09:26 PM
well, who's gonna save the public if the crew can't??:D
Exactly...geez

Tom Brown
03-20-2007, 09:28 PM
That's SOP for any emergency crews. It's not a disregard for the public, it's the best way forward in an emergency.

YeLLowBoaT
03-20-2007, 09:35 PM
Still to make that EXACT statement goes agains every thing that a fire dept/ LEO stands for.
It was a very bad choice of words. If he had said something like the safty of our crews is of the utmost importance( which is what the story is about) that would have been onthing. To say the public comes second implys that they are more worried about themselfs then those they are PAID to protect.

Biglue
03-20-2007, 09:42 PM
So if the rescuer is in deep shit, he's got a lesser chance of surviving draggin the rescuee with him. Makes perfect sense to me. At the end of the day they have families they want to go home to as well.

Kilrtoy
03-20-2007, 09:44 PM
Still to make that EXACT statement goes agains every thing that a fire dept/ LEO stands for.
It was a very bad choice of words. If he had said something like the safty of our crews is of the utmost importance( which is what the story is about) that would have been onthing. To say the public comes second implys that they are more worried about themselfs then those they are PAID to protect.
NO IT DOES NOT, that is exactly what is taught across the country.
If you cant take care of yourself and you are now endanger how are you helping the cause....
THINK ABOUT IT...

YeLLowBoaT
03-20-2007, 09:52 PM
NO IT DOES NOT, that is exactly what is taught across the country.
If you cant take care of yourself and you are now endanger how are you helping the cause....
THINK ABOUT IT...
I understand what your saying and I agree with it for the most part.( 1st resonpce is paid to but themselfs in harms way to protect the public... alot of them seem to forget that) I still think to make a statement like: " The safty of our crews comes 1st, the safty of the public comes 2nd and the safty of our equipment comes 3rd" Is a very bad choice of words. There is a dozen other things he could have said that would have made this a none issue.

phebus
03-20-2007, 09:54 PM
I think it's great to see a Fire Chief be a Fire Chief instead of a politician. Don't know what Chief that was, but good for him.

Rexone
03-20-2007, 10:19 PM
I fail to see the problem. You can't save anyone if you're dead. Same thing is taught in first aid / CPR. Don't add to the victim list by getting in over your head.
Sounds like you're looking for a PC answer from a non PC straight forward fire chief. :)

Kilrtoy
03-20-2007, 10:21 PM
.( 1st resonpce is paid to but themselfs in harms way to protect the public... alot of them seem to forget that) .
No! The police and fire personnel are not paid to get hurt and killed. They are paid to provide a service. In times of service they are to do it safely and correctly, That is why they have medals of valor, medals of heroism, Medals of life saving.
They are for going above and beyond the call of duty and service, placing themselves in harms way.
It is an honor to be nominated for such a medal and even more so to receive one.
But no one wakes up and tries to earn one,

mbrown2
03-20-2007, 10:27 PM
Don't add to the victim list by getting in over your head.
Perfect layman's translation.....
Yellowboat, don't take this wrong or offensive...but is it possible you may be reading into this too much cause you did not like the way it was stated? You mentioned you agree with it, but did not like the way it was stated. I thought it was pretty clear, concise and direct.
How would you state it any different and make sure it was clear,concise and direct to the general public and not mislead them?....

bigq
03-20-2007, 10:28 PM
Kinda the same thing (only smaller scale) I was just told last week in the first aid CPR class to make sure you are safe and not going to get killed trying to save someone. Just makes the situation worse and more people will die or get hurt.
Maybe you watch to many movies:D

YeLLowBoaT
03-20-2007, 10:34 PM
I fail to see the problem. You can't save anyone if you're dead. Same thing is taught in first aid / CPR. Don't add to the victim list by getting in over your head.
its not the idea behind the statement.( which I agree with) Its the way it was said...It implys that they put the safty of thier members above the safty of the public. Which is counter to the purpose of any 1st responce. They are paid to put the public safty 1st.

Rexone
03-20-2007, 10:36 PM
its not the idea behind the statement.( which I agree with) Its the way it was said...It implys that they put the safty of thier members above the safty of the public. Which is counter to the purpose of any 1st responce. They are paid to put the public safty 1st.
I disagree. But that's ok. After all this is ***boat. :D

Tom Brown
03-20-2007, 10:45 PM
The police and fire personnel are not paid to get hurt and killed. They are paid to provide a service.
:)
The next time I get pulled over for speeding, I'm going to tell the officer, "I pay you to lay your life down so you owe me your life." I'm sure it will go over well. :D :D :D
You can't pay for someone's life. How much money do police make, anyway? It's not like cops are driving fancy cars, running DCBs, and living with gorgeous wives. Gads.

YeLLowBoaT
03-20-2007, 10:54 PM
How would you state it any different and make sure it was clear,concise and direct to the general public and not mislead them?....
The safty of our crews is a top priority of... blah blah blah...
( since this was about a crew safty short comings)
We are working to imporve our procedures, to insure the safy of our crews.
There are many, more....
Statements like this:
" The safty of our crews comes 1st, the safty of the public comes 2nd, the safty of our equipment comes 3rd"( which is what was said)
pretty much says it all. This is not a statement, this is a list of prioritys.
.
If he would have simply removed the list component of the statment it would have changed the meaning.
one word really can make a diffrance.
I mean lets just say you want to buy a gadget. you have 2 choices, Acme and widget. They exactly the same, the only diffance between the two is one word in thier pitchs too you..
Acme told you: Customer survice, is a top priority of the acme corperation
widget told you: Customer survice, is the top priority of the widget corperation.
Which company would you buy the product from?
They appear the same, but have 2 drasticly diffrent meanings.
One says its one priority of the company the other says it is the top priority of the company.

YeLLowBoaT
03-20-2007, 11:01 PM
No! The police and fire personnel are not paid to get hurt and killed. They are paid to provide a service. In times of service they are to do it safely and correctly
Which at times during that service you need to put your life/limb in danger to save anohters life. Correct?
so 1+ 1 = 2... you are paid to put your life/limb in danger.

HM
03-20-2007, 11:24 PM
what the fuk is safty?

Kilrtoy
03-20-2007, 11:25 PM
Which at times during that service you need to put your life/limb in danger to save anohters life. Correct?
so 1+ 1 = 2... you are paid to put your life/limb in danger.
No not correct, I am not paid one penny to put my limb or life in danger to save anothers.
I am paid to provide a service, I am not paid to get injured, mamed or killed while do so. I am one of the dumb ones thou. I will leave it at that

HM
03-20-2007, 11:26 PM
No not correct, I am not paid one penny to put my limb or life in danger to save anothers.
I am paid to provide a service, I am not paid to get injured, mamed or killed while do so. I am one of the dumb ones thou. I will leave it at that
STFU flatfoot.:devil:

YeLLowBoaT
03-20-2007, 11:33 PM
No not correct, I am not paid one penny to put my limb or life in danger to save anothers.
I am paid to provide a service, I am not paid to get injured, mamed or killed while do so. I am one of the dumb ones thou. I will leave it at that
I think you may want to reread the mission statement for your agency...I know the CHPs mission statement says otherwise.

C-2
03-20-2007, 11:40 PM
I hear what Yellowboat is saying.
If I am getting my arse kicked by a pack of midgets (speaking of), I expect the closest LEO to jump in and help me, without worrying about getting his own arse kicked.
Fawk, even my homies will do that and I don't even pay them.:)

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 01:12 AM
I think you may want to reread the mission statement for your agency...I know the CHPs mission statement says otherwise.
OK HERE IT IS.
So again you are wrong,
And we all know I am NOT A FAN OF THE CHP IN, ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM
Prevent Loss of Life, Injuries, and Property Damage - To minimize the loss of life, personal injury, and property damage resulting from traffic collisions
through enforcement, education, and engineering. To enforce the provisions of the California Vehicle Code and other laws to prevent crime.
That is called the three "E's" next question

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 01:35 AM
OK HERE IT IS.
So again you are wrong,
And we all know I am NOT A FAN OF THE CHP IN, ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM
Prevent Loss of Life, Injuries, and Property Damage - To minimize the loss of life, personal injury, and property damage resulting from traffic collisions
through enforcement, education, and engineering. To enforce the provisions of the California Vehicle Code and other laws to prevent crime.
That is called the three "E's" next question
Try again....
The mission of the California Highway Patrol is to provide the highest level of safety, service, and security to the people of California. This is accomplished through five departmental goals:
Prevent Loss of Life, Injuries, and Property Damage - To minimize the loss of life, personal injury, and property damage resulting from traffic collisions through enforcement, education, and engineering. To enforce the provisions of the California Vehicle Code and other laws to prevent crime.
Maximize Service to the Public and Assistance to Allied Agencies - To maximize service to the public in need of aid or information, and to assist other public agencies when appropriate.
Manage Traffic and Emergency Incidents - To promote the safe and efficient movement of people and goods throughout California, and to minimize exposure of the public to unsafe conditions resulting from emergency incidents and highway impediments.
Protect Public and State Assets - To protect the public, their property, state employees, and the state's infrastructure. To collaborate with local, state, and federal public safety agencies to protect California.
Improve Departmental Efficiency - To continuously look for ways to increase the efficiency and/or effectiveness of departmental operations.
link (http://www.chp.ca.gov/html/what_we_do.html)
Did you forget that they insure the safety of several public officals from the governer down to the file clerk working at FTB that got a death threat. Its not the local PD/sheriffs that show up its the CHP. I've personally been working at a FTB( seasonal) when I The CHP had to respond to a man with a gun in the parking lot looking for a auditor. Now if looking for a man with a gun in and around a office building is not putting your life/limb at risk to protect some one I don't know what is.

Wet Dream
03-21-2007, 04:55 AM
Yellow, you can try to make it sound bad, but its the truth in what he said. Sorry it comes off as so blatant, but...tough shit. Thats the way it is. No, their job is not to risk their lives. It is an inherent risk involved, but no crew will go in to save a building over their own lives. Sorry.

Dribble
03-21-2007, 05:51 AM
I want the guy who's trying to save my butt to be safe while he's doing it. If he's injured or killed, I'm screwed.

rrrr
03-21-2007, 05:56 AM
The safty of our crews is a top priority of... blah blah blah...
( since this was about a crew safty short comings)
We are working to imporve our procedures, to insure the safy of our crews.
There are many, more....
Statements like this:
" The safty of our crews comes 1st, the safty of the public comes 2nd, the safty of our equipment comes 3rd"( which is what was said)
pretty much says it all. This is not a statement, this is a list of prioritys.
.
If he would have simply removed the list component of the statment it would have changed the meaning.
one word really can make a diffrance.
I mean lets just say you want to buy a gadget. you have 2 choices, Acme and widget. They exactly the same, the only diffance between the two is one word in thier pitchs too you..
Acme told you: Customer survice, is a top priority of the acme corperation
widget told you: Customer survice, is the top priority of the widget corperation.
Which company would you buy the product from?
They appear the same, but have 2 drasticly diffrent meanings.
One says its one priority of the company the other says it is the top priority of the company.
C'mon, Jeezuz. You're splitting hairs when you start with the "He shoulda said it this way" crap. The FD guys are no different than a marine platoon. They fight in strength, act according to their training, and aren't effective unless they protect each other.
You're fishing for a POLITICALLY CORRECT way to say something when the guy already said the right thing.

Seadog
03-21-2007, 06:06 AM
The first rule of any emergency responder is : DO NOT ALLOW YOURSELF TO BECOME THE NEXT VICTIM. Lifeguards are taught that if you cannot control the victim, so not let them drown you too. On TV, they just punch out the victim, but if you have tried to swing a punch in the water against a person freaking out, you know how impossible it is. In industrial training, the hardest lesson to get through is; When someone in a confined space and is not responding, do not go in to do a rescue.

lucky
03-21-2007, 06:13 AM
this works for firemen, but as a cop this statment sucks :D

riverbound
03-21-2007, 06:17 AM
Crew safty comes 1st, public safty comes 2nd...
I can't beleave he just said that on the news. :eek:
I dont see anything wrong with that statement.

CARLSON-JET
03-21-2007, 06:32 AM
It does not say who nor what they are protecting on the side of the car.
On the topic, I agree one can not protect/save another while dead or severily injured.
It is very hard to control the actions of others. Prime example ... Reginal Deny (sp) took a severe beating as the cops drove away as fast as they could from the L.A. riots. Sure they are tough when 12 of them have a tazer stuck in some drunk chicks ass. Level the playing field and you get to see what their mission statement really is. Run Forest Run.... ;)

Mr. C
03-21-2007, 06:36 AM
Can't really use that as a fair example, they were ordered out of there, many did not want to leave, many were really upset they had to leave.
It does not say who nor what they are protecting on the side of the car.
On the topic, I agree one can not protect/save another while dead or severily injured.
It is very hard to control the actions of others. Prime example ... Reginal Deny (sp) took a severe beating as the cops drove away as fast as they could from the L.A. riots. Sure they are tough when 12 of them have a tazer stuck in some drunk chicks ass. Level the playing field and you get to see what their mission statement really is. Run Forest Run.... ;)

phebus
03-21-2007, 06:52 AM
YeLLowBoat, you seem intelligent, and appear to be a nice guy, but once again you seem to put public safety under the microscope, and take the opportunity to criticize.
It makes me wonder what has occurred in your past that makes you so bitter?

Throttle
03-21-2007, 06:53 AM
YB
What more needs to be said...
How can I help the public if I am laying there dead or dismembered?
you are always the first one to jump on something here with us, what is it you said you do for a living (i forgot)? ( oh yeah, your job is to watch mine).

Throttle
03-21-2007, 06:59 AM
YeLLowBoat, you seem intelligent, and appear to be a nice guy, but once again you seem to put public safety under the microscope, and take the opportunity to criticize.
It makes me wonder what has occurred in your past that makes you so bitter?
I swear, I have felt this way... but again he has proved to find something for us to get the popcorn out for...
I wrote it before, his little sister took his fire truck away from him...

Throttle
03-21-2007, 07:04 AM
Come down off your cross, use the wood from it to build a bridge and get over it! :D :D :D
:D :D :D :D :D
Nice!!!

Throttle
03-21-2007, 07:12 AM
http://www.ocfa.org/_uploads/images/mission.jpg

Throttle
03-21-2007, 07:22 AM
How the OCFA Responds to Your Emergency
Message from the Fire Chief
The Orange County Fire Authority is committed to helping the more than 1.3 million residents we serve when they are faced with an emergency. We understand the confusion and difficulties people face following a fire or medical emergency and we want you to know that we are here to help. Our goal is not only to put out fires and provide medical assistance to our residents, but to help them get back on their feet after their emergency.
Fires
The OCFA responds to all types of fire emergencies, including house fires, car fires, vegetation fires, commercial, and industrial fires. The Authority sends a predesignated number of pumpers (fire engines), ladder trucks, paramedics, and chief officers to each type of call. The number of firefighters and amount of equipment sent is based on our knowledge of how to safely and effectively deal with each type of fire, including extinguishing the fire, rescuing endangered occupants, protecting other property, and doing all of this in a way that is safe for our personnel and the public. Because the behavior of fires can be unpredictable we always ensure that we have enough firefighters ready for unexpected problems. When the officer in charge is sure that the fire or situation is under control, the fire companies will be released to be available for other emergencies. The safety of our firefighters is paramount.
Medical Emergencies
The standard OCFA response to a medical emergency is a paramedic engine or a paramedic van, accompanied by an engine. Your safety and well being is the reason we assign an extra unit to these calls. Medical emergencies often require more than two or three firefighters and we want to make sure we have all the equipment and personnel necessary to take care of your situation.

Flyinbowtie
03-21-2007, 07:44 AM
YeLLowBoat, you seem intelligent, and appear to be a nice guy, but once again you seem to put public safety under the microscope, and take the opportunity to criticize.
It makes me wonder what has occurred in your past that makes you so bitter?
Couldn't agree more.
There is a set, unchangable perspective in play here that isn't going to change. Every one of the topics started is in essence the same, expressing the same sentiment.

Biglue
03-21-2007, 08:24 AM
YB
What more needs to be said...
How can I help the public if I am laying there dead or dismembered?
you are always the first one to jump on something here with us, what is it you said you do for a living (i forgot)? ( oh yeah, your job is to watch mine).
If I remember correctly, he has a contracting business of some sort. Painting I believe. But then a couple days ago he said he would be starting a new job on nights......hmmmmmmmm. :jawdrop:
I could be mixing up a couple different peeps.
In either case, I think the majority of the people are happy and feel safe with LEO's and Firemen doing their jobs. Good job boys and girls. There's always gonna be that small percentage of people that will scrutinize the norm. Just my .02

HatenWinter
03-21-2007, 08:31 AM
Oh Yellowboat, not again......................................... :rolleyes:

phebus
03-21-2007, 08:52 AM
I'm not one to criticize others, as everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I would love to sit down with some beers and talk with YeLLowBoat. I'm sure some of his reasoning is very sound, but I would like to represent public safety in the discussion, and hear his side, and get a better understanding of where he is coming from. So, next time you are in Havasu YeLLowBoat, I'll buy, and I guarantee we'll leave as friends.

Throttle
03-21-2007, 08:54 AM
If I remember correctly, he has a contracting business of some sort. Painting I believe. But then a couple days ago he said he would be starting a new job on nights......hmmmmmmmm. :jawdrop:
I could be mixing up a couple different peeps.
In either case, I think the majority of the people are happy and feel safe with LEO's and Firemen doing their jobs. Good job boys and girls. There's always gonna be that small percentage of people that will scrutinize the norm. Just my .02
yeah, I thought he was like "bob the builder" or something, I wanted him to see how OSHA oversee's his safety at work... my .02:D

Baja Big Dog
03-21-2007, 09:03 AM
Crap, I just woke up, I fell off the bottom step of the short bus, and I dont for the life of me understand this thread.

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 09:07 AM
So, next time you are in Havasu YeLLowBoat, I'll buy, and I guarantee we'll leave as friends.
RICK, I already told you you cannot buy friends.

little rowe boat
03-21-2007, 10:17 AM
Why am I not surprised that YB. found this.
As a firefighter if I become part of the problem, then I have not made the situation better, I have made it worse. So, by putting the safety of myself and crew first, then we are in a better position to help everyone else.

little rowe boat
03-21-2007, 10:18 AM
I'm not one to criticize others, as everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I would love to sit down with some beers and talk with YeLLowBoat. I'm sure some of his reasoning is very sound, but I would like to represent public safety in the discussion, and hear his side, and get a better understanding of where he is coming from. So, next time you are in Havasu YeLLowBoat, I'll buy, and I guarantee we'll leave as friends.
He might view this as hazing.:D

Throttle
03-21-2007, 10:41 AM
He might view this as hazing.:D
he didnt say anything about pissing in his beer...

RiverDave
03-21-2007, 11:24 AM
I want the guy who's trying to save my butt to be safe while he's doing it. If he's injured or killed, I'm screwed.
Well I suppose on your definition of safe.. My definition of safe is sitting across the street watching the house burn down. LOL A firemen's definition might be a litle different. ;)
RD

SHOTKALLIN
03-21-2007, 12:40 PM
this is rediculous. some people just want to hear things sugar coated I guess. Yellow boat you are second in line. get over it.:D

3:30dirty
03-21-2007, 05:13 PM
As a firefighter for 12 years, and in a leadership role, my main objective is the saftey of my crew. We all go home in the morning. Always been that way and always will. Any fire chief will tell you the same thing....

Boatcop
03-21-2007, 05:34 PM
I just finished up an in-depth training program in what's known as the "Incident Command System". It's the benchmark in handling any emergency incident. From a single vehicle accident to a Katrina-like or WTC event.
The number one priority that any Incident Commander must have is SAFETY OF THE REPONDERS! We can't do anyone any good if we're taken out of the action.
In the old days the Coast Guard used to have a saying. "You have to go out, but you don't have to come back." That's been long abandoned. Now, safety of personnel is always number one.

Wet Dream
03-21-2007, 05:41 PM
And YB has nothing to respond with? Just hoping this one goes away, huh?

talkinghead
03-21-2007, 08:08 PM
I have always felt that I am more likely to be 'helped' by a good samaritan than the police or fire dept.
On the other hand, even as a law abiding citizen I figure I am far more likley to be hurt or killed by the police vs. a random stranger in my daily travels.
And by the way this is all a two-way street - if I saw a LEO or fire dept. personnel in trouble, and that by helping that person(s) I would endanger myself - I WOULD NOT HELP THEM IF IT ENDANGERED MY LIFE. I would make a call to 911 if possible.
I also believe many who work in gov't have nothing more than disdain and contempt for the general public anyway.

vmjtc3
03-21-2007, 08:13 PM
No! The police and fire personnel are not paid to get hurt and killed. They are paid to provide a service. In times of service they are to do it safely and correctly, That is why they have medals of valor, medals of heroism, Medals of life saving.
They are for going above and beyond the call of duty and service, placing themselves in harms way.
It is an honor to be nominated for such a medal and even more so to receive one.
But no one wakes up and tries to earn one,
Bingo

squirt'nmyload
03-21-2007, 08:16 PM
I have always felt that I am more likely to be 'helped' by a good samaritan than the police or fire dept.
On the other hand, even as a law abiding citizen I figure I am far more likley to be hurt or killed by the police vs. a random stranger in my daily travels.
i don't know where you live but i'd say i have to disagree with this......waaaaaay more drunk drivers and other idiots on the roads than cops.

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 08:21 PM
Actaully when I called the fire dept in question here... it was funny the operator said the person that made the comment( who I wanted to talk too) said he was in and was answering his phone... yet when she tried to patch me thru All I got was a recording... :confused: after then 3rd call I finally got thru...( saying I was calling the news station that he made the comments on help I think :D ) he gave me some BS about how not to making the prob worse( which I agreed with him) and how the safety of his crew was number #1... same bs about firemen not being paid to put thier life/limbs in danger...
When I started asking him Qs about that... things like: So you don't drive at a high rate of speed or do not go in burning structures? he changed his toon.
after a few mins of this guy being a complete jerk. He hung up on me. So I called the Mayors office... which was very intrested in what I had to say... so was news station that the comments were made on as well as the local paper...
oh yeah I'm going to be paying a little vist tomarrow with him at his office tomarrow with a camcorder. Hopefully he will see me... if not thats fine, I'll do the same thing every day til he does.
Now I know some of you guys may think I'm a jack ass, and thats fine. I'm doing what every person on here should be. Fighting for what he thinks HIS tax dallors should be spent on.

Screemy1
03-21-2007, 08:22 PM
Crew safty comes 1st, public safty comes 2nd...
I can't beleave he just said that on the news. :eek:
Okay... i am commenting before reading any other threads... just because this should be common sense.... but you must have missed it.... Crew safety first.... well, yes... because if the crew is not safe... they will do one thing and then be out because of accidents or death.... if you are soving others... you have to save yourself first because if you put somebody over yourself... you will not be there for the next person who needs saved.... Just look at it as the instructions are givin on every commercial flight you go on. "In case of cabin loss of pressure, oxygen masks will drop down from the compartment above. Put mask on your self before assisting others." In other words.... you need to take care of yourself so you will be around to take care of others..... COMMON SENSE!!!!!

talkinghead
03-21-2007, 08:24 PM
Police and Fire Dept. members are also capable of driving drunk.
Also, driving is not the only way to get hurt or killed.

squirt'nmyload
03-21-2007, 08:45 PM
Police and Fire Dept. members are also capable of driving drunk.
Also, driving is not the only way to get hurt or killed.
true.........i only used driving as an example cause you said "in my daily travels" :)

squirt'nmyload
03-21-2007, 08:48 PM
When I started asking him Qs about that... things like: So you don't drive at a high rate of speed or do not go in burning structures? he changed his toon.
i never knew there were any toons that could do that....i just want one to bbq and put a keg on....oh, shit...you mean tune:D

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 08:53 PM
true.........i only used driving as an example cause you said "in my daily travels" :)
Don't bring up driving... I was hit 7 times in the last year, 5 of those times I was on the "clock", All of them were not my fualt( rearended at red lights or backed into... I got on a 1st name bases with the guy and the wrecking yards getting rear bumbers...)
I use to think the drivers in sacramento were nuts... that was until I worked on a job in medesto... I kid you not, I did not drive one mile where I did not see a major moving violation.

squirt'nmyload
03-21-2007, 08:57 PM
Don't bring up driving... I was hit 7 times in the last year, 5 of those times I was on the "clock", All of them were not my fualt( rearended at red lights or backed into... I got on a 1st name bases with the guy and the wrecking yards getting rear bumbers...)
I use to think the drivers in sacramento were nuts... that was until I worked on a job in medesto... I kid you not, I did not drive one mile where I did not see a major moving violation.
but were any of them cops:D :D

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 09:02 PM
but were any of them cops:D :D
one was a retired sheriff if that counts for anything. total his brand spanking new, paper plate and all honda van. :D I still have his card.

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 09:08 PM
Now I know some of you guys may think I'm a jack ass, and thats fine. I'm doing what every person on here should be. Fighting for what he thinks HIS tax dallors should be spent on.
I see it now, someone is goingto get arrested very son and come back on here and claim a violation of his rights. This is gonna get good

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 09:20 PM
I see it now, someone is goingto get arrested very son and come back on here and claim a violation of his rights. This is gonna get good
That would actaully make my year... :rolleyes:
Not only would I go on TV, but I could sue for $$$$$. I would never have to work again :D
( if you can't tell thats sarcasm)

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 09:24 PM
That would actaully make my year... :rolleyes:
Not only would I go on TV, but I could sue for $$$$$. I would never have to work again :D
( if you can't tell thats sarcasm)
How ever sad that statement is, It is very true........

C-2
03-21-2007, 09:30 PM
Some things are better left unsaid, which is why I can somewhat see where YB is coming from (I think).
Public perception of LE, firefighters and other public officials has been waning over the years, and is only getting worse. Telling the public what they don’t want to hear is never gonna help the cause.
Just yesterday I was in on a conference call between several city attorneys, a city manager and an HR manager, weighing options to present to a city council. The result - settle it. Don’t take it to trial even though the agency/parties were not necessarily at fault.
Most cities don’t like to go trial – ya never know who has an axe to grind, or who you can count on to make a rational decision. Wasn’t always like this, and you gotta ask yourself, why?

Throttle
03-21-2007, 09:50 PM
How ever sad that statement is, It is very true........
hey Kilrtoy, you must have really got under his skin cuz he responds to your comments...:idea:

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 09:51 PM
One of the major probs in CA is over 50% of the state works for the state/local goverment is some form or another. ( and its only going to get worse as long as the state keeps getting more and more into debt) Not only are they working for the goverment they are getting rich of the troff.( I know this is going to piss off some ppl, if you have any doubts about this google the stats for the average income of a person in CA vs the average gov empolyee in CA) I beleave the main cuase for this is thier unions( look at what unions are doing to GM and ford)
Just look at the election Arnold put on, he tired to make a change and was voted down by the ppl of CA. The gov employees unions in CA spent over a quarter Billion( thats with a B) in ads to fight the changes the propostions arnold put on that ballet.
if you think I am full of BS and other stuff... look at how many Goverment employees we have on this site alone with 50k+++++ boats. Also if you do happen to work for a goverment agency, add up what you make in wages and bennies, then find a postion close to what you do and see what thier pay+ beenies is like.
Not saying that every one here that works for the goverment is make $$$$$.
What I am saying is that Most of them are getting paid more then they would in the private sector.
I won't even get into job security or what some production out put is.

Throttle
03-21-2007, 09:55 PM
Don't bring up driving... I was hit 7 times in the last year, 5 of those times I was on the "clock", All of them were not my fualt( rearended at red lights or backed into... I got on a 1st name bases with the guy and the wrecking yards getting rear bumbers...)
I use to think the drivers in sacramento were nuts... that was until I worked on a job in medesto... I kid you not, I did not drive one mile where I did not see a major moving violation.
7 times? I see a pattern... you sure none of these were you at fault?
this would be a great driving record if you were 75, how old r u? lol!

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 09:57 PM
7 times? I see a pattern... you sure none of these were you at fault?
this would be a great driving record if you were 75, how old r u? lol!
mid 20s...
All but one, I was rear ended stoped at red lights. Kind of hard to be your fualt when your sitting behind several other cars stoped at a red light.

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 09:58 PM
One of the major probs in CA is over 50% of the state works for the state/local goverment is some form or another. ( and its only going to get worse as long as the state keeps getting more and more into debt) Not only are they working for the goverment they are getting rich of the troff.( I know this is going to piss off some ppl, if you have any doubts about this google the stats for the average income of a person in CA vs the average gov empolyee in CA) I beleave the main cuase for this is thier unions( look at what unions are doing to GM and ford)
Just look at the election Arnold put on, he tired to make a change and was voted down by the ppl of CA. The gov employees unions in CA spent over a quarter Billion( thats with a B) in ads to fight the changes the propostions arnold put on that ballet.
if you think I am full of BS and other stuff... look at how many Goverment employees we have on this site alone with 50k+++++ boats. Also if you do happen to work for a goverment agency, add up what you make in wages and bennies, then find a postion close to what you do and see what thier pay+ beenies is like.
Not saying that every one here that works for the goverment is make $$$$$.
What I am saying is that Most of them are getting paid more then they would in the private sector.
I won't even get into job security or what some production out put is.
Ok out of all my friends I make the least of any of them, Even their wives make more than I do.
So those facts are not correct, and no none of my friends own their own company, that I am referring to...
50 K boat
an entry level 21 foot boat cost more than 50K nowadays...

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 10:16 PM
Ok out of all my friends I make the least of any of them, Even their wives make more than I do.
So those facts are not correct, and no none of my friends own their own company, that I am referring to...
50 K boat
an entry level 21 foot boat cost more than 50K nowadays...
you need to check the states thier tiger....
There are pleny of entrey level boats for under 20k some even under 10k... We are not talking higher end... we are talking just getting yourself on the water for family fun.
now when it comes to income... your again wrong.
a CHP officers makes just under 57k to start. (link (http://www.chp.ca.gov/recruiting/html/officer.html)) the average income in CA last year PER HOUSE HOLD was 49k and change. ( its on the FTB site... I just don't want to look thru hundreds of pages of PDFs to find it) So the starting pay for a CHP officer is almost 15% of what the average HOUSE HOLD income is for the state of CA.
you just have friends that make more money then you do.

Tom Brown
03-21-2007, 10:42 PM
What I am saying is that Most of them are getting paid more then they would in the private sector.
I'll tell you what, I'll pay you more than you currently make in the private sector if you'll let me shoot you. After all, I will have paid for your life so it will be fair plus it's probably the only way to end this thread.

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 10:50 PM
you need to check the states thier tiger....
There are pleny of entrey level boats for under 20k some even under 10k... We are not talking higher end... we are talking just getting yourself on the water for family fun.
now when it comes to income... your again wrong.
a CHP officers makes just under 57k to start. (link (http://www.chp.ca.gov/recruiting/html/officer.html)) the average income in CA last year PER HOUSE HOLD was 49k and change. ( its on the FTB site... I just don't want to look thru hundreds of pages of PDFs to find it) So the starting pay for a CHP officer is almost 15% of what the average HOUSE HOLD income is for the state of CA.
you just have friends that make more money then you do.
That includes benifits
they start at this
The base salary for a CHP cadet is $3,868 (includes seven hours mandatory overtime) while attending the Academy. In addition, cadets receive free room and board. Effective the first month following their Academy reporting date, cadets receive full health and dental benefits for themselves and their dependents.
far from your 57K

Ultrafied
03-21-2007, 10:53 PM
I don't know about anyone else, but I sure don't pay my taxes so that someone can DIE for me. Why would a person even contemplate that. Try to save me. OK. Try to protect me, OK. But expectations seem a little unreal here.

Tom Brown
03-21-2007, 10:55 PM
It's interesting to see that you're capable of following this thread, Kilr. You've even got some quality points and reasoned responses in here.
I haven't been around much lately so I probably missed a thread about a life changing experience for you. Last I knew, you weren't able to read past the third word in a thread that didn't contain pics of boobies.
Kilr - 'fock intellectual conversation... I like broads'-toy

YeLLowBoaT
03-21-2007, 11:17 PM
That includes benifits
they start at this
The base salary for a CHP cadet is $3,868 (includes seven hours mandatory overtime) while attending the Academy. In addition, cadets receive free room and board. Effective the first month following their Academy reporting date, cadets receive full health and dental benefits for themselves and their dependents.
far from your 57K
I said officer not cadet.( so does the link "Officers start at $56,880 per year.") even as a cadet thats still 46k and changer per year... thats not too bad with full bennies. Its also still not that far off from the average HOUSE HOLD income. So compared to average family in CA they are doing pretty good..

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 11:28 PM
I said officer not cadet.( so does the link "Officers start at $56,880 per year.") even as a cadet thats still 46k and changer per year... thats not too bad with full bennies. Its also still not that far off from the average HOUSE HOLD income. So compared to average family in CA they are doing pretty good..
Yes I am in the know here, They do not get a 10,000 dollar raise upon graduation after 7 months. BUT over the next 6 to 7 years on the pay scale they move up only 10K to 67K TOP STEP.....Come on you are smarter than that. It is trickery in the hiring process, That is someone with a B.A. degree and some other perks, TRUST ME.

Kilrtoy
03-21-2007, 11:30 PM
So each person in this family of 46K makes 11 dollars and hour,
Come on, In and Out starts at 10 bucks an hour.. Once again facts that have been posted YES, but embellished to a certain veiw

YeLLowBoaT
03-22-2007, 12:34 AM
we are still talking per house hold not per person... the average income per return is some where around 37k in CA... still a CHP cadet makes almost 10k more then that.... so tell me again how they are not paid alot compared to the average person?
67k is 30K more then the average person makes in CA. Its almos 75% more...
7 months of training is not alot of training from green to operating statis.
I know several trades that have 2 year apprenticeships and some that have 5-7 years apprenticeships before your at "operating statis".
even the person that does your wifes hair has to have more time in "training" to be able to legally cut hair in the state of CA( 2000 hours of traing thats 50 weeks at 40 hours a week)
hell to get your contracting licence you have to have a min of 4 year of work exp or a BS degree in a building scince.
Shall I keep going?

8Dayz
03-22-2007, 09:40 AM
-LEO's are not paid to be bullet sponges and FF's are not paid to be kindling for the fire. THAT WOULD BE A WAST OF YOUR TAX DOLLARS!:sqeyes:
-What would you like to see your tax $ spent on? You made mention of wasting it on the organizations that protect our local communities.:confused:
-Public safety take calculated risks with there proper training and protective gear.
-You YB have a big problem with what other people have. You should concentrate on yourself and not with keeping up with the JONES' A boat is your example! Have you ever heard of living beyond your means, 2 incomes, 2nd mortgages,loooonnnnnggggg term loans,inheritance or just that some people may have a really successfully private business also. In todays day anything is possible, why do you care, who cares? worry about yourself dude.
-Life is about decisions brother. If you want a good job and to have nice things you must believe in delayed gratification, go to school and make good financial decisions, live for tomorrow. A little good luck helps also.:)
-you are always looking for a fight on here!
-Why do I care what you think:o I'm out
Oh yea Karma is a pain. Maybe you should look in the mirror dude, all those accidents, that sucks it must be someone Else's fault that crap happened to you:jawdrop:

h2oski2fast
03-22-2007, 09:58 AM
NO IT DOES NOT, that is exactly what is taught across the country.
If you cant take care of yourself and you are now endanger how are you helping the cause....
THINK ABOUT IT...
Then why ever show up to work, it might put you in danger.

YeLLowBoaT
03-22-2007, 10:18 AM
-LEO's are not paid to be bullet sponges and FF's are not paid to be kindling for the fire. THAT WOULD BE A WAST OF YOUR TAX DOLLARS!:sqeyes:
-What would you like to see your tax $ spent on? You made mention of wasting it on the organizations that protect our local communities.:confused:
-Public safety take calculated risks with there proper training and protective gear.
-You YB have a big problem with what other people have. You should concentrate on yourself and not with keeping up with the JONES' A boat is your example! Have you ever heard of living beyond your means, 2 incomes, 2nd mortgages,loooonnnnnggggg term loans,inheritance or just that some people may have a really successfully private business also. In todays day anything is possible, why do you care, who cares? worry about yourself dude.
-Life is about decisions brother. If you want a good job and to have nice things you must believe in delayed gratification, go to school and make good financial decisions, live for tomorrow. A little good luck helps also.:)
-you are always looking for a fight on here!
-Why do I care what you think:o I'm out
Oh yea Karma is a pain. Maybe you should look in the mirror dude, all those accidents, that sucks it must be someone Else's fault that crap happened to you:jawdrop:
Thats just funny... I would love to know how you can peer into my life over the internet :rolleyes:
Not only did you get EVERY thing wrong about me, you completely missed my point.

CARLSON-JET
03-22-2007, 10:26 AM
The photo chop of the Energizer bunny operating that shovel?? Keeps digging and.... :idea:

Kachina26
03-22-2007, 10:36 AM
I had a really nice response all thought out, but I think I'll run it past my cat. He's more likely to get it.

acatitude
03-22-2007, 10:37 AM
I'm not one to criticize others, as everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I would love to sit down with some beers and talk with YeLLowBoat. I'm sure some of his reasoning is very sound, but I would like to represent public safety in the discussion, and hear his side, and get a better understanding of where he is coming from. So, next time you are in Havasu YeLLowBoat, I'll buy, and I guarantee we'll leave as friends.
Hey I hate everyone and everything all the leos and firefighters and kindy garden cops, they do nothing. all dcb owners, all daytona owners, i even hate myself some days......... Will you buy me beer the whole time im in havi also???????????? :D :D :D

UnionJack
03-22-2007, 01:41 PM
So what is the problem, I dont see anything wrong with that
I agree

Kilrtoy
03-22-2007, 02:14 PM
Then why ever show up to work, it might put you in danger.
Great point, Im going to speak to my boss as I write this about doing my job, like a whole hell of a alot of people, Im gonna telecommute.
That way I know I stay safe

Kilrtoy
03-22-2007, 02:15 PM
Hey I hate everyone and everything all the leos and firefighters and kindy garden cops, they do nothing. all dcb owners, all daytona owners, i even hate myself some days......... Will you buy me beer the whole time im in havi also???????????? :D :D :D
Thank you for including me in that statement

slink
03-22-2007, 03:30 PM
mid 20s...
All but one, I was rear ended stoped at red lights. Kind of hard to be your fualt when your sitting behind several other cars stoped at a red light.
Mid 20's.....perfect time for you to apply for one of the over paid, under worked, do nothing careers you speak of in LE or Fire. That is if you are not to scared or don't think you could pass the background. Go to PORAC.com. Plenty of openings throughout the state. Come show us all how we are supposed to do our jobs.....Be the leader you preach to be:)

mikefd024
03-22-2007, 03:37 PM
Of course firefighter saftey is important, but that does not mean you are not going to what ever you can do to help a civilian in a bad situation. That is what our job is. Do you think that it is 100% safe to go on daily calls such as burning buildings to perform a rescue or extinguish the fire, go into a uncontrolled brush fire, be lowered on hoist from a helicopter, car accidents on the freeway, drunk people spitting on you, fighting combative patients, or go on calls such as shootings, stabbings, assaults. The answer to all those questions is no, it is not safe, but that is what we are paid for. But remember there are few of us and alot of civilians, there is reason for that not everyone wants to do our job. It is not always safe, and yes I do have a family, and think about them often when I am work. I know that my fellow firefighters out there think the way I do, and would act as I would, to do whatever they can to help a civilian.

acatitude
03-22-2007, 03:43 PM
Thank you for including me in that statement
now what makes you think your so popular???:D you buying the beer:)
And I don't see any mention of you homo:D :D

Screemy1
03-22-2007, 05:37 PM
we are still talking per house hold not per person... the average income per return is some where around 37k in CA... still a CHP cadet makes almost 10k more then that.... so tell me again how they are not paid alot compared to the average person?
67k is 30K more then the average person makes in CA. Its almos 75% more...
7 months of training is not alot of training from green to operating statis.
I know several trades that have 2 year apprenticeships and some that have 5-7 years apprenticeships before your at "operating statis".
even the person that does your wifes hair has to have more time in "training" to be able to legally cut hair in the state of CA( 2000 hours of traing thats 50 weeks at 40 hours a week)
hell to get your contracting licence you have to have a min of 4 year of work exp or a BS degree in a building scince.
Shall I keep going?
sounds like you need to find a better job... or you should be a become a cop, fireman..... since you obviously want the money.... getting into one of these jobs is hard..... My friend has been LAPD for less then 2 years with a Bachlors degree.... makes very little for the crap he goes through.... and his wife who is an RN makes more then him working three days a week in an operating room.... he sometimes bangs his head how much she makes when he has almost been stabbed and in physical confrontations with crazy's.... It is a JOB.... not something asking you to be a HERO..... If someone was to hand you a million dollars for you to run into a burning building that was full of explosives that could go off any second, what would you do????? Money and benefits does not mean you have to go die........

acatitude
03-22-2007, 06:02 PM
we are still talking per house hold not per person... the average income per return is some where around 37k in CA... still a CHP cadet makes almost 10k more then that.... so tell me again how they are not paid alot compared to the average person?
67k is 30K more then the average person makes in CA. Its almos 75% more...
7 months of training is not alot of training from green to operating statis.
I know several trades that have 2 year apprenticeships and some that have 5-7 years apprenticeships before your at "operating statis".
even the person that does your wifes hair has to have more time in "training" to be able to legally cut hair in the state of CA( 2000 hours of traing thats 50 weeks at 40 hours a week)
hell to get your contracting licence you have to have a min of 4 year of work exp or a BS degree in a building scince.
its science, not scince. had to know how to spell to be a cop, I was a painter before i passed english.:D :D YB we just went thru this shit about a month ago with you. Give it a rest. you are so far off base. refresh your memory with the salaries I posted before... and please don't drive in front of me... I'm thinking your one of those who slam on the brakes for the insurance money, especially after a couple of your earlier remarks... go have a beer dude

Xlration Marine
03-22-2007, 06:58 PM
Take it easy dude. Last year some one caught one of our fine boy's banging a sheep or two. Must have been some kind of fire. They bring the shhep i to sheer them, must be about a thousand or more in south Chandler right now.

YeLLowBoaT
03-22-2007, 07:35 PM
its science, not scince. had to know how to spell to be a cop, I was a painter before i passed english.:D :D YB we just went thru this shit about a month ago with you. Give it a rest. you are so far off base. refresh your memory with the salaries I posted before... and please don't drive in front of me... I'm thinking your one of those who slam on the brakes for the insurance money, especially after a couple of your earlier remarks... go have a beer dude
Actaully, I was trained as a engineer, Degree from CSUS in applied mathematics.( minor was mechanical engineering.) Once I actaully started working in that field, I hated dealing with the people I was working with...( egos that would make ***boat egos look small) So I left and went to something I actaully enjoyed doing.( I love being able to stand back at the end of the day and say I built that)I've always loved working with my hands. I'm not doing what I am doing to get rich, I'm doing what I am currently doing do to the cards I have been delt( anytime you want to come by and see what I deal with on a daily bases be my guest. There are things that are going on in my life that I will not spread over the net.)
If you knew anything about me what so ever, it is that I can't stand ANY ONE thats not doing thier job. You may not see the statments he made as not doing his job, but I do. Unlike most people I take action on things I feel are wrong.

Tom Brown
03-22-2007, 07:38 PM
If you knew anything about me what so ever, it is that I can't stand ANY ONE thats not doing thier job.
I'm posting from work right now. :cool:

Throttle
03-22-2007, 08:01 PM
lets hear it Yellowboat...
did I just read something you wrote previously?... I think it said something like - you don't know me, dont judge me... you are doing exactly that with us...
You have NO idea, nor do I feel like its any of your business to know how my personal finances are delt with...
go back to another post by 8dayz for your clue... cuz you need to get one...
btw, how was your meeting today? this should be good.

acatitude
03-22-2007, 08:06 PM
Actaully, I was trained as a engineer, Degree from CSUS in applied mathematics.( minor was mechanical engineering.) Once I actaully started working in that field, I hated dealing with the people I was working with...( egos that would make ***boat egos look small) So I left and went to something I actaully enjoyed doing.( I love being able to stand back at the end of the day and say I built that)I've always loved working with my hands. I'm not doing what I am doing to get rich, I'm doing what I am currently doing do to the cards I have been delt( anytime you want to come by and see what I deal with on a daily bases be my guest. There are things that are going on in my life that I will not spread over the net.)
If you knew anything about me what so ever, it is that I can't stand ANY ONE thats not doing thier job. You may not see the statments he made as not doing his job, but I do. Unlike most people I take action on things I feel are wrong.
if your not doing it for the money then quit all your bitching about people with higher paying jobs, and regardless of the pay do you really think that a firefighter is getting paid whatever they make to walk into a building thats totally encased in fire and 3 seconds from collapsing or that a leo should just walk out in front of a killer???????????????
I think you need some anger management or self assurance classes my friend. give it a rest and stand back and enjoy what you built and let others do their job as they are trained..I think you have been overwelmingly punked on this issue....... good luck

YeLLowBoaT
03-22-2007, 08:24 PM
I made a statement that for the most part goverment employees are paid more then they would be if they were in the private sector.( granted some jobs don't transfer to the private sector) Lets face it, every one thinks they are underpaid... I know people don't like to hear that they are over paid...I'm not saying all are, but ALOT are.

Ultrafied
03-22-2007, 08:31 PM
I made a statement that for the most part goverment employees are paid more then they would be if they were in the private sector.( granted some jobs don't transfer to the private sector) .
Really ..... like civil engineers (no), surveyors (no), network engineers (no), software engineers (no), executive administrators (no), project managers (equal skill, equal responsibility ... no), politicians (yes, oops). What "for the most part" are we talking about?

Throttle
03-22-2007, 08:44 PM
yellowboat,
I am thinking about going out for a beer, tommorrow is pay day and I want to spend what you call "your tax dollars"... is it ok if I go out and do that?
btw, "your tax dollars" is not a part of my salary... So forget I asked for your permission, I am goin out for a pitcher of beer!
now back to the purpose of your thread... the chief (not salary's)... how did your meeting go?

YeLLowBoaT
03-22-2007, 08:46 PM
Really ..... like civil engineers (no), surveyors (no), network engineers (no), software engineers (no), executive administrators (no), project managers (equal skill, equal responsibility ... no), politicians (yes, oops). What "for the most part" are we talking about?
depends on what agency your talking about and what thier production is like.
For example... In my county the guys that drive the trash truck make an average of ~68k a year( around 35 a hour)with full bennies ( $1 copays for dr vists, dental vision.) Now BFG and WM drivers doing the same job, in the same county( 2 un incoparted areas recently became citys do to the fact that they were paying way more in porperty tax then they got back in survices. So they became citys and bid it out.) Make about $20 a hour or 40k a year. Thats a HUGE diffrence.
Just from the todays paper... a Psychaiatristis working for the Deptment of corrections make an average fo 252k a year... yet the deptment of mental health makes 140k. Kiaser is 123k. 2 state agencys one making almost twice what the private sector and one that makes almost 20k more. Now the Dept of mental health does not really bother me, on the other hand the dept of corrections is way over paid... yes they need to be paid more then some one that does not work in a prison, but almost double is just a joke.
oh yeah... one more thing, They are getting a raise on 4/1/07
If you want to read the artical go to sacbee.com... you have to log in( its free)

phebus
03-22-2007, 09:00 PM
O.K. if I get drunk tonight, and crash my car in a fiery ball, I'm going to be pissed if at least three of you hose dragers don't go to heaven with me. Pussys. :) , rush in there without thinking, it's what you're paid to do.
Oh, and the two nuns I ran into are just going to have to die too, because there is no one left to save them.
Sorry:)

talkinghead
03-22-2007, 09:51 PM
Yellowboat: In general I agree with you on your views with regard to government employees (in particular within California).
On the other hand, can you imagine what California would be like if this form of welfare (the public employment system) were not available?
Ofcourse a certain number of employee's are required to administer the state's business, but would it be a stretch to say that California is not only bloated with people but public employees as well?
I can't think of many government positions that actually produce anything of marketable value...as such many gov't positions to an extent are a burden on the free markets and society as a whole.
Also, the sad reality (IMO) is that many in the 'commercial' workforce largely support a pension system for government workers that they can only dream of...
Note: The above comments do not apply to those serving in the military, as far as I am concerned they deserve everything they can get and more...

Code4
03-22-2007, 09:56 PM
depends on what agency your talking about and what thier production is like.
For example... In my county the guys that drive the trash truck make an average of ~68k a year( around 35 a hour)with full bennies ( $1 copays for dr vists, dental vision.) Now BFG and WM drivers doing the same job, in the same county( 2 un incoparted areas recently became citys do to the fact that they were paying way more in porperty tax then they got back in survices. So they became citys and bid it out.) Make about $20 a hour or 40k a year. Thats a HUGE diffrence.
Just from the todays paper... a Psychaiatristis working for the Deptment of corrections make an average fo 252k a year... yet the deptment of mental health makes 140k. Kiaser is 123k. 2 state agencys one making almost twice what the private sector and one that makes almost 20k more. Now the Dept of mental health does not really bother me, on the other hand the dept of corrections is way over paid... yes they need to be paid more then some one that does not work in a prison, but almost double is just a joke.
oh yeah... one more thing, They are getting a raise on 4/1/07
If you want to read the artical go to sacbee.com... you have to log in( its free)
Apples and oranges buddy. First of all, it appears your math is a little off. 68,000 a year is 32 an hour and some change. Wages are negotiated and are based on the areas economy and expenses. You will find major differences in wages depending on the area of the state. For example, the Bay area's cost of living is quite a bit higher than Los Angeles, and you will find wages are higher there to compensate for the cost of housing and other things. You quoted what the average household income is in California. I hope you realize that the average is obtained by including ALL jobs in this state, in which agriculture plays a huge roll with manual labor. This state has ALOT of low paying jobs. The problem is not with overpaid government employees, its that the average is derived in an area with numerous low low paying jobs.
In this area, most private sector jobs are paid 20% or more higher than the same government jobs.
If you are gonna bitch about government employees, why dont you focus on something that matters, like our troops in Iraq not getting paid crap for putting their lives on the line every day for all of us, and having to work side by side with private employees of companies like Halliburton and Blackhawk getting paid over $100,000 tax free to do the same thing. Where are those private companies getting their cash? The good ole US government.
As for the original subject, I want both Fire and PD to be there for me in my time of need, but I do not EXPECT any of them to injure, maim or kill themselves doing it. Any that put their lives on the line saving another is GOING BEYOND THE CALL OF DUTY.

talkinghead
03-22-2007, 10:14 PM
I don't think it is totally relevant to compare salaries of gov't workers and those in the private sector performing similiar jobs.
The private sector is more or less subject to market forces while the government sector is basically insulated from these same forces.

bajarunner
03-22-2007, 10:28 PM
Crew safty comes 1st, public safty comes 2nd...
I can't beleave he just said that on the news. :eek:
You have got to be kidding me! Are you serious? This is how you feel about that statement. Dude there will be no one to help you if there dead. Think about that. Where is your common sense, what a self centered irritating thing to say about our public service people.. :mad: :mad: :mad:
Sorry this frustrated me so much I had to say something, and I normally don't have anything to say.

YeLLowBoaT
03-22-2007, 10:37 PM
I don't think it is totally relevant to compare salaries of gov't workers and those in the private sector performing similiar jobs.
The private sector is more or less subject to market forces while the government sector is basically insulated from these same forces.
I disagree, The money to fund the public sector comes from the private sector. So if times get bad and lots of people lose thier job or take big pay cuts to keep thier job. The public sector needs to fallow that change.( or they will run out of money)
I mean lets face it both CA and the federal goverment would have both gone banrupt years ago if they were a company.
Beleave me its just a matter of time before no one will lend us any more money and we will be skrewed.
Some of the salarys, beenies and pension plans that are provided to some goverment empolyees are going to be the undoing of this state. I would dare to say that the whats going on currently with the employment by the state of CA is more of a danger to state then the illegal alien porb we have. Several people have put measures on the ballet( arnold was most recent) to try to change the downward spirl this state is going into, and it was voted down. I'm just glad I paid cash for a lot out of state, Hopefully with in the next few years I can build a house on it and get out of this state.

YeLLowBoaT
03-22-2007, 10:46 PM
now back to the purpose of your thread... the chief (not salary's)... how did your meeting go?
he was not in...( what a shock, ), but I have a appointment with him monday 9 AM. Which is fine, I'm more then happy to wait.

Throttle
03-23-2007, 06:52 AM
he was not in...( what a shock, ), but I have a appointment with him monday 9 AM. Which is fine, I'm more then happy to wait.
Just FYI, I do not know what department you are trying to meet with (let me know)... The Fire Chiefs position is very busy and political (you will like that part). Very difficult to get an appointment with usually... kinda like your dentist (if you have one... no bennies?)

talkinghead
03-23-2007, 08:52 AM
Yellowboat: Your right that the public sector will follow a private sector downturn, but not totally (which is why I said they are 'basically' insulated from economic downturns...).
The goverment can always print more money, the private sector can't.

BRSTQUEST
03-23-2007, 09:25 AM
Lets cut to the chase, Yellowboat is a pompus blowhard who has issues with public sector employees. If you read the vast majority of his posts they have something to say about government waste and the quaility of its employees. As one of those public employees you speak of, I would love to see you do something constructive with your time and stop worrying about this trivial stuff on a boating web site. I know you pay the salary of the public employee and its public knowledge on what goes on but damn, get a life......or better yet put down the paintbrush and take on one of the careers you bash so often. And the governement isn't run like a private company for a reason. And the reason is profit, as much as I cannot stand the inefficient nature of our governemnt it is the best in the world. Yellowboat take a deep breath, have a beer, get a BJ and calm the phuk down....Life is to short and I would hate to hear about some hose dragger who had to give you CPR and bring back into this miserable life

little rowe boat
03-23-2007, 10:43 AM
I would hate to hear about some hose dragger who had to give you CPR and bring back into this miserable life
Don't worry he would get a special airway.:eek:

little rowe boat
03-23-2007, 10:45 AM
Please accept my apology.
I don't want to get sued for hazing.

Seadog
03-23-2007, 12:23 PM
I just finished up an in-depth training program in what's known as the "Incident Command System". It's the benchmark in handling any emergency incident. From a single vehicle accident to a Katrina-like or WTC event.
The number one priority that any Incident Commander must have is SAFETY OF THE REPONDERS! We can't do anyone any good if we're taken out of the action.
In the old days the Coast Guard used to have a saying. "You have to go out, but you don't have to come back." That's been long abandoned. Now, safety of personnel is always number one.
Sounds like you are doing the FEMA training. I have completed IS 100/200/235/241/700/800 and we are doing a G358 session in a few weeks.

Kachina26
03-26-2007, 08:25 PM
he changed his toon.
as in cartoon? Or did you mean tune? Perhaps you were looking for the word, tone? Fock man, where did you get that degree? Did they have no English requirements?

squirt'nmyload
03-26-2007, 08:33 PM
i never knew there were any toons that could do that....i just want one to bbq and put a keg on....oh, shit...you mean tune:D
as in cartoon? Or did you mean tune? Perhaps you were looking for the word, tone? Fock man, where did you get that degree? Did they have no English requirements?
i thought he was talking about a boat :D