Got My New Engine!

[Bailey]

Well, it's finally at home! Still a few small things to do, but it will be ready within the next couple months! My wife wants to kill me:mad: , but I've been waiting over 2 years for this! :)
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2457.jpg
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2456.jpg
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2455.jpg
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2454.jpg

[Sweet Cruz]

How many cubs?:) :)

[MudPumper]

Looks nice. How about some specs??

[Oldsquirt]

Damn, that sure looks nice....almost too nice to put in the boat:D
Now it's time to make a trip over to Watson Engineering for some dyno runs, right? :)

[Heatseeker]

Real nice Bailey! I second the motion for a dyno trip!
Didn't you have Morgan build that?

[atxwrangler]

nice ferd!cu. in.?????

[Bailey]

Its 521 ci, No dyno runs, Ill just tune it in the boat.

[Bailey]

yes Morgan's Machine and marine built it.

[MudPumper]

Its 521 ci, No dyno runs, Ill just tune it in the boat.
Just my opinion but you are crazy to build that motor and NOT dyno it. You will miss out on hidden HP guaranteed. My .02:)

[BUSBY]

Just my opinion but you are crazy to build that motor and NOT dyno it. You will miss out on hidden HP guaranteed. My .02:)
I agree 100% ... it's not that much $$$ to do it right now ... and definately worth every penny ... if you've waited this long, do it right.
My .02 even though we don't know each other.
Very nice engine though!
Good Luck,
Brian

[76miller]

That is one bad a#$ FORD, is that a Wilson intake ? What heads? Very very nice.76miller

[revndave]

I agree 100% ... it's not that much $$$ to do it right now ... and definately worth every penny ... if you've waited this long, do it right.
My .02 even though we don't know each other.
Very nice engine though!
Good Luck,
Brian
I agree with the dyno also.Cheap insurance.

[lilrick]

Hay, isn't the distributor in the wrong end? :D nice lookin' piece.

[Sanger Jet]

Intake and Valve covers should polish up nice!!

[CARLSON-JET]

Motor looks sweet... I also dig the stand..

[BrendellaJet]

Very nice. Ditto on the dyno. Its a blast to do and you can set your tune up safely and get feedback form the changes made. Takes a heck of a lot longer if you do it on the water. When you are done you throw it in the boat and you know its gonna run right.

[460 jus getn it]

Fukin A, nice looking motor

[smokinflatties]

Hay, isn't the distributor in the wrong end? :D nice lookin' piece.
that is what i was thinking but looks good:idea:

[dmontzsta]

Nice Ford!

[blown428fe]

Looking mint.

[Hallett19]

Motor looks awesome!! Good job sticking with the Ford power, we need more loyal Ford guys around here!!
The place diverter is running great on my boat!
Hope all goes well with the motor!

[Bigern]

SwweeeeeeeTTTTT:eek:

[FILUCKY]

I'll guess on the heads. Well they have standard port location and Ford exhuast pattern, so i'll say Performers or SCJ's with the end's milled to get rid of the engravings? Would be nice to get some specs on this beast, looks really nice!:)

[jetboat]

its nice to see a ford getting it getting its do!sharp.wifes ill always gripe,learn to live with them,it over 30 years and still dont understand them.

[camoman]

Very nice:D

[87HARDIN]

Weren't they selling any Chevys?:D J/K Nice looking motor, have fun.

[Bailey]

The heads are edelbrocks with some work of course, Hogan's sheet metal intake, 10.7:1 compression, roller cam. Haven't had a chance to get all my paper work in order with all the specs.

[GM Killer]

Nice looking motor!!! As far as the dyno thing goes, Ive done both. You can find extra power on the dyno, but once installed the whole game changes. So is it worth it? I think it is if you want some numbers to go by, but if you are happy with the RPM and the MPH then who needs it. I ran over 115 in my CP without a dyno on the third pass it made.
Remember this too. Plenty of guys claim they are making "X" amount of power on the dyno, but what are they making in the boat, out of ideal conditions. Also, if the motor makes power at lets say 6800rpm, but it only turns 6200 in the boat, then max power is not being made is it! Then what? start cutting impellors? start changing this and/ or that. Where does the tuning truly take place?

[e514jet]

Nice BBF......gotta love it........:D :D

[Duane HTP]

I can't imagine spending that much money on a motor and not taking it to the dyno. It will be the cheapest HP and piece of mind that you could ever get. The HP numbers from the dyno are just a by product of the dyno tuning. But knowing where it's going to detonate, where in the timing curve it makes its most power, which cylinders are lean and how to correct them, little things like knowing the oil is going to creep up the pan at 5200 rpm, those kind of things are what make dyno runs so invaluable and make motors last longer. JUST DO IT! You will never be sorry. Once you know exactly where you are on the motor, the rest comes easy. Dyno it, put it in and forget it.
Happy Boating.

[Duane HTP]

I can't imagine spending that much money on a motor and not taking it to the dyno. It will be the cheapest HP and piece of mind that you could ever get. The HP numbers from the dyno are just a by product of the dyno tuning. But knowing where it's going to detonate, where in the timing curve it makes its most power, which cylinders are lean and how to correct them, little things like knowing the oil is going to creep up the pan at 5200 rpm, those kind of things are what make dyno runs so invaluable and makes motors last longer. JUST DO IT! You will never be sorry. Once you know exactly where you are on the motor, the rest comes easy. Dyno it, put it in and forget it.
Happy Boating.

[bp]

bailey, what gm killer implied is correct - your "peak" hp may be at 6600-7000 range, and you may find it only turns 6k in the boat. but with all the instrumentation available on the dyno, you would be able to tune the boat there so that it would operate the best through the entire range. you'd also know what the hp "curve" looks like, and know the hp that is being absorbed by the pump at whatever the rpm is, and then make INFORMED decisions.. i.e., is there 100 hp left, or only 40-50? as duane mentioned, the tuning information is invaluable, IF you have a really knowledgeable dyno operator.

[FILUCKY]

Lets say ya build a motor that makes peak power at 7000rpm, and in your boat it will only be able to turn 6000rpm, what the hell differance does it make to dyno tune your motor? Best thing to do is find a motor that makes the power your looking for at the rpm you will be turning and build that motor. For example my old motor made 910hp@7200, this was dyno tuned to make max hp, put it in my boat with a "B" impeller and it fell on its face @6000, this was with the cam set @2*advanced, well after retunning it in the boat with a few cam *changes it was pulling the same "B" impeller to 6700rpm with no other changes. So in other words i could have wipped my butt with that dyno money and been just as well off. But i could not of bragged about my little 514 making 910hp with a single carb.:rolleyes: In the end who really knows what hp i was running to the impeller, but it was running a hell of alot better then after it came of the dyno.:)

[bp]

that's great you could pick up 700rpm with only moving the cam 2 degrees.
how many dyno pulls were made on your engine, and did you move the cam timing on different pulls?

[steelcomp]

Lets say ya build a motor that makes peak power at 7000rpm, and in your boat it will only be able to turn 6000rpm, what the hell differance does it make to dyno tune your motor? Best thing to do is find a motor that makes the power your looking for at the rpm you will be turning and build that motor. For example my old motor made 910hp@7200, this was dyno tuned to make max hp, put it in my boat with a "B" impeller and it fell on its face @6000, this was with the cam set @2*advanced, well after retunning it in the boat with a few cam *changes it was pulling the same "B" impeller to 6700rpm with no other changes. So in other words i could have wipped my butt with that dyno money and been just as well off. But i could not of bragged about my little 514 making 910hp with a single carb.:rolleyes: In the end who really knows what hp i was running to the impeller, but it was running a hell of alot better then after it came of the dyno.:)The difference would have been that you would have known in advance that your motor didn't make much power below 7000. No offense, but you obviously wasted your time and $$ on the dyno, because you certainly didn't get it tuned for max power. Maybe max peak power, but that's pretty irrelevant in a jet. Dyno's and operatores are like everything else...there are good, and bad. BTW...the fact that the motor turns X tpm on the dyno, and Y rpm in the boat is a little backwards. The idea is to know what the power curve is for the engine, which you'll never know without a dyno, and then pick whatever combination you're going to need to run at that best rpm. Building an engine that makes peak HP @ 7200 is typically useless in a jet, if it falls on it's face at 6500. Most jets in the 700-900 hp range aren't going to run much over 6500, and to run up in the 7000 range, you're going to lose a lot of pump effeciency, so that needs to be weighed into the equation. If you make peak power @ 7200, but still make within 2-3% at 6500, then you're OK...even better if you can run @ 6000. Motor will last longer, but don't expect to run a jet much above 7000 without serious mods.

[BrendellaJet]

that's great you could pick up 700rpm with only moving the cam 2 degrees.
how many dyno pulls were made on your engine, and did you move the cam timing on different pulls?
Seriously, you paid for the dyno time and didn't try the degree change? If you had you would have known that it could make more power and you wouldn't have had to guess to get there. If you dont make full use of the dyno then you shouldn't be posting against its merits.
Point is, there are enough of these pumps out there to know what it takes to turn X RPM with each type of pump and the different. Take that info to the dyno and KNOW if you are going to be disappointed when you run it in the boat, better yet KNOW that you need to make changes to the set up to reach your goals and do them on the dyno to KNOW if they are going to have the desired impact.
I spent a chunk of change on my 548. I had a particular goal in mind-800 useable horsepower at as few RPM as possible to make it live. Peaked at 825 at 6800. goal achieved.
BUT GUESS WHAT, IT MAKES 800 AT 6100 RPM , SO I DONT HAVE TO WRING IT OUT TO 6800 FOR 25 HP WHICH WILL HAVE NO NOTICEABLE IMPACT ON PERFORMANCE, AND I SURE AS HELL DONT HAVE TO RE-INDEX MY CAM AND WONDER WHAT IMPACT IT WILL HAVE.

[FILUCKY]

Steel, i agree with ya. My point is everyone is telling this guy he needs to dyno his motor to get all his hp, but if the motor is not built to the correct specs for his aplication it is a waist of time and money. My motor was built for a drag car and put in a jetboat and no amount of dyno time will change that.:) And yes BP, a simple change in cam* is all it takes sometimes to completely change the way a motor runs under load. I knew my old 514 would need alot of changes to be a great jetboat motor so thats why its gone and my new mill is a 611, my heads flowed way to much cfm for a 514 to really run right in a jetboat at my limited rpm range. I think the best tunning for a motor is a chassie dyno, and lets face it, thats all a jetboat is. As far as me changing my cam timming and gaining 700rpm, that was done all in one day. My shop is about one mile from the boat ramp, took it out and ran a few passes wasn't happy so back to shop where i re-degreed the cam in the boat. I think i changed it about four times before i was happy with it. Every time i changed it (2* increments) it changed my top rpm by a few hundred rpm. Its been since last year so it might have been a total of 4* from where it was dynoed but i think it was two. I also changed the valve lash a few times as well. But no major changes like cam, carb ect.

[bp]

yes BP, a simple change in cam* is all it takes sometimes to completely change the way a motor runs under load.
As far as me changing my cam timming and gaining 700rpm, that was done all in one day.
i didn't say it was not possible to change the way the motor runs with a cam degree change, and it's really too bad your dyno time was such a waste. just out of curiousity, how much hp does it take to achieve a 700 rpm increase (6000-6700) with a "b" impeller?
i have a good friend that, several years ago, had a well known builder put together a 630+ engine. after the builder said it was done, my friend went to the dyno to watch, and 2 pulls later (1300+) hp, they were done. the bottom end ate itself up, 0 oil pres, after 18 hours in the boat.
when my engine was first built, we made 18 pulls in one day trying a -whole- lot of different things. after 80 passes, we made some changes and went back to the dyno and only made 16 pulls, testing several more things. many years, and several hundred passes later, the info from the dyno is still relevant. if you choose not to use it, your choice. but with good operators, the info from the engine dyno is invaluable. you may recommend to bailee anything you like, but i would recommend dynoing. it's his money, and his choice.

[FILUCKY]

Well i dug through my toolbox and found my cam change specs. I tryied four different cam posisions. first was at 2*adv. (best on dyno@7200) it turned 6400, then i went with 0* and thats when it ran the worst 6000, then i went to 4*adv. it turned 6700, so i added 2* more advance (6* total) and it slowed it down to 6500. and so back to 4*advananced. And Brendellajet, when i need advise on how to wright a check to pay someone to build me a motor, i'll ask ya. And as far as bump'n heads with Steelcomp, i rather enjoy it, i almost always leave, having learned something new.:D

[Duane HTP]

Filucky, It sounds like maybe you are missing the point here. You go to the dyno to make the motor make the power where it is needed, not just to post HP numbers. Sounds like you went to a dyno that only knew about drag car motors. There is a lot of difference between the two. You should have played with the cam on the dyno. That's what you go for. To just put a motor on the dyno and say it made 800 hp means really nothing. How much could it have made. And could that power have been moved to the rpm range that the pump required. The answer is yes. Next time go to a dyno place that is familar with jet boat engines. You will be surprised at the results. Match the motor to the pump, is the name of the game.
blown428fe, put your engine on the dyno. But the lesson learned here is, "Take it to a dyno shop that is familar with jet boat engines." otherwise you might just waste your money too.

[FILUCKY]

Bp, when the motor was built it was going into a car, or it would have been setup differnt. My new motor is going to be an exact copy of a motor that has already been built and dynoed extensively (1089hp@6800) with a single carb, the same motor was also dynoed with a sheetmetal intake with two dominators, it made a little over 1150hp but was at 500rpm higher which would be a waste for my aplication since 6800 is my target rpm. I guess what i don't understand is why people don't build proven combos, expecialy people on limmited bugets? Even with copping a motor that on a dyno is exactily what i want i'm pretty sure when it actualy goes in the boat i will have to do some tunning in the boat for the best performance.

[BrendellaJet]

Oh, so you are knocking me because i paid to have my motor built? You are so cool. :)
You are the one who paid to go to the dyno and didnt get his money's worth.

[Bow Tie Omega]

Well i dug through my toolbox and found my cam change specs. I tryied four different cam posisions. first was at 2*adv. (best on dyno@7200) it turned 6400, then i went with 0* and thats when it ran the worst 6000, then i went to 4*adv. it turned 6700, so i added 2* more advance (6* total) and it slowed it down to 6500. and so back to 4*advananced. And Brendellajet, when i need advise on how to wright a check to pay someone to build me a motor, i'll ask ya. And as far as bump'n heads with Steelcomp, i rather enjoy it, i almost always leave, having learned something new.:D
Well filucky, you can slam Brendella Jet for writing a check for having one of the most reputable marine engine builders in the industry do his motor right the first time, but it was you who had to put two engines in your boat to get it to perform how you wanted. So who is more stupid, spending money the first time for a motor done right, or spending thousands more on building two engines before you got it right. So when I have a need to waste thousands of dollars on a combo that will not work, I will give you a call. And oh yeah, that money that I save from not using a dyno, I can re-apply it towards building my second motor, because the first one did not meet my expectations.

[Bow Tie Omega]

Oh Bailey, by the way, nice motor, that intake is absolutely bitchen. IMO, you are leaving some HP on the table with out taking that motor to the dyno. For a mild set up, I would not waste the money, but with more aggressive set ups such as yours, it would not hurt and would only help. Anyways, anyone who tells you that you do not need to with more agressive setups, they are giving you bad info. Trust me, while I have recieved some great info on these boards in the past, I have recieved some bad info as well, and the bad info is what ended up costing me thousands of dollars.
Regardless, nice motor, good luck with everything!:)

[MudPumper]

Did I mention......That intake and those valve covers give me a giant BONER.:D :D

[Ralph Brunt]

good looking motor, i would like to know why you went with the edelbrock heads? and what cc's are they
ralph

[steelcomp]

Steel, i agree with ya. My point is everyone is telling this guy he needs to dyno his motor to get all his hp, but if the motor is not built to the correct specs for his aplication it is a waist of time and money. My motor was built for a drag car and put in a jetboat and no amount of dyno time will change thatTrue, nothing will cahnge that, but the dyno will tell you ahead of time that your combination is wrong. I don't think everyone here is telling Baily to dyno for max power...at least I'm not. The idea of dynoing an engine is to gather useful information that you can't get anywhere else. It's nice that you live so close to a lake, but not everyone has that luxury. I did 14 pulls on my engine in my session. I had too much invested in my engine to just throw it in the boat and run it, and that would have been very inconvenient. It looks like Baily has a few $$ invested as well, and that needs to be protected. To me, the more you have invested, and the higher the level of performance the engine, the more valuable a dyno session is. Even the most successful grass roots racers recognise the value of dyno time. Your experience is your experience, but to recommernd to someone else that dyno time is wasted, isn't good advice. Not everyone builds "known" combinations. Some of us do our own thinking (not to imply that you don't) and try our own combinations. I was very confident that my engine was going to make good power, especially for it's size, but I had to try a lot of things that were a little "outside the box" for the scope of the project, and I wanted to test the combination in a controlled environment, and I'm glad I did. Dual fours on a sheetmetal intak isn't off the shelf stuff, and I don't care how many times the combination has been built, every engine is different. Baily's engine will require some experience and knowledge to tune and optimize.
Baily, if you can afford the $$ for a dyno session, I would highly recommend it, for your own benefit. It's cheap insurance to pretect your investment. I'm guessing you have some respectable $$ invested in that engine, and it would be a shame not to be able to fully take advantage of what you have, instead of just guessing, or find out too late (in the middle of the lake) that sometrhing was overlooked, or a mistake was made. That's for amatures. Besides, just the experience of a day on the dyno is worth the $$. LIke they say...you think an education is expensive, it's nothing compared to ignorance.
Just my .02...not trying to butt heads with anyone.

[steelcomp]

Remember this too. Plenty of guys claim they are making "X" amount of power on the dyno, but what are they making in the boat, out of ideal conditions. Also, if the motor makes power at lets say 6800rpm, but it only turns 6200 in the boat, then max power is not being made is it! Then what? start cutting impellors? start changing this and/ or that. Where does the tuning truly take place?The dyno will give you a baseline for all further comparisons. If your engine is making X amount of power at the dyno, there is information about under what conditions it was making that power. IE DA, humidity, temp, etc. My engine was tested at a DA of 2700', at about 84 degrees. I know then, that on any day, I can fairly accureately estimate what the power is given the conditions, and what tune up cahnges I might need to make. If the engine was turning 6800 on the dyno, but only turns 6200 in the boat, that may not matter, if the power drop isn't substansial. The point is, that with a dyno session, you'll know what the power is at 6200, and weather or not you need to make chages to get the engine to operate at a higher RPM where there's considerably more power, or leave it there, where it's not going to make a big difference anyway. It's all about useful information, and again, without it, you can chase your tail untill the cows come home, or come out of the gate knowing exactly where you stand.

[FILUCKY]

So why was my money wasted on a dyno session? Like i've stated several times in this thread alone my 514 was built and tunned for a drag CAR, not a jetboat. But when i decided to build a drag BOAT, i used the motor i already had sitting on a engine stand in my shop, from there i retunned the motor for top performance in a jetboat with the parts the motor already had. Was it optimal? no. but with a hard days work the motor was dialed in without taking it to a dyno. The 514 ran great after being retunned but i wanted more, so it was sold and the money was put towards a bigger motor. Once agian, no money wasted.:)

[GM Killer]

Im glad my few words got a good discussion going:D Some good points were made on both sides of the table. I enjoyed it. Thanks guys.

[steelcomp]

Im glad my few words got a good discussion going:D Some good points were made on both sides of the table. I enjoyed it. Thanks guys.:confused: :confused: :confused:

[steelcomp]

So why was my money wasted on a dyno session? Like i've stated several times in this thread alone my 514 was built and tunned for a drag CAR, not a jetboat. But when i decided to build a drag BOAT, i used the motor i already had sitting on a engine stand in my shop, from there i retunned the motor for top performance in a jetboat with the parts the motor already had. Was it optimal? no. but with a hard days work the motor was dialed in without taking it to a dyno. The 514 ran great after being retunned but i wanted more, so it was sold and the money was put towards a bigger motor. Once agian, no money wasted.:)As I said before, if it works for you, that's fine, but recommending that someone not go to the dyno with a new engine is, well, about as smart as putting a drag car engine in a jet boat. If you tuned a motor in your boat, and you know it wasn't "optimal", then I'd say it wasn't dialed, either. Bottom line is, you just don't know, and are guessing at best. If that's good enough for you, more power to ya. We'll just have to agree to disagree, but It's all good.

[Bow Tie Omega]

So why was my money wasted on a dyno session? Like i've stated several times in this thread alone my 514 was built and tunned for a drag CAR, not a jetboat. But when i decided to build a drag BOAT, i used the motor i already had sitting on a engine stand in my shop, from there i retunned the motor for top performance in a jetboat with the parts the motor already had. Was it optimal? no. but with a hard days work the motor was dialed in without taking it to a dyno. The 514 ran great after being retunned but i wanted more, so it was sold and the money was put towards a bigger motor. Once agian, no money wasted.:)
A drag car motor "TUNED" to be a jet boat motor. No other parts necessary????? What did you do, put different spark plugs in it and OT headers on it (That was sarcasm by the way). Maybe that is how they do it in your part of Texas, but not here. The points made here are if you are going to spend big bucks on a high horse power, you might as well spend another grand on tuning her right, it could be the difference of 20 -80 hp, and to someone who obviously cares enough to spend big dollars on big horse power should want to get the most for their buck, at least that is what common sense dictates. But then again you built your 2000 hp motor for free as well (sarcasm again) I guess common sense is not a necessity in your parts:D . Maybe you should take the stories of your build over to bench racers and try to sell those folks:D
One thing I am certian of.....If I give you and DNE(BrendellaJets builder) all of the same parts to build a motor to run in a jet boat, DNE's will win every single time and the motor would last longer as well.

[FILUCKY]

Het Steelcomp, if he wants to take his motor to be dynoed thats his call and i don't think anything you or i say will really affect that.:D You feel happy with your dyno tune, i'm happy with tunning mine to the boat. I think that its probibly a pretty even split between those who like it dynoed and those who like to tune it in the boat. But just for arguement sakes, why do alot of car race teams dyno tune there motors and then chassie dyno them and often find 25-75hp or so at the rear tires, after the motor was tunned on a motor dyno? Do ya think that maybe dyno rooms and real world don't always work out the same? are you so happy with the dyno tune on your motor that you just bolt it in your boat and leave it alone? You don't try to further tune it. Just curious, ever think you might be leaveing some hp on the table?:)

[Bow Tie Omega]

Thats what I thought.....No response:D

[bp]

nobody responded to my question either.
what horsepower increase is required to go from 6000 to 6700, same boat same b impeller?

[GM Killer]

The word "guessing" has been used for when a dyno isnt used. How much guessing is there really? If you know what your heads flow, cam size, cubic inch, compression, etc, then you should have a pretty good idea of what you are shooting for to begin with. As I said previously, it all changes once its in the boat. Sure there is hidden power that can be found on a dyno, but unless you are used to working with one, arent ready to make changes, and do not have your engine builder/tuner with you and a gain of parts (ie. different headers, carbs and associated parts, ignition parts, possibly different cams) what good is it? You can change the timing while in the boat. If there is a leak, then fix it. Check the plugs to see the rich/ lean of the carbs. Can your fuel system efficiency be checked on the dyno? No! Engine temp going to be the same in the boat as on the dyno, probably not. Water through the headers ran on the dyno? The list goes on.
Ive both used a dyno and not. For me it has always worked out in the end. Im neither for or against, no matter what you do there is always work after it is installed.
Good luck and enjoy

[Blown 472]

The word "guessing" has been used for when a dyno isnt used. How much guessing is there really? If you know what your heads flow, cam size, cubic inch, compression, etc, then you should have a pretty good idea of what you are shooting for to begin with. As I said previously, it all changes once its in the boat. Sure there is hidden power that can be found on a dyno, but unless you are used to working with one, arent ready to make changes, and do not have your engine builder/tuner with you and a gain of parts (ie. different headers, carbs and associated parts, ignition parts, possibly different cams) what good is it? You can change the timing while in the boat. If there is a leak, then fix it. Check the plugs to see the rich/ lean of the carbs. Can your fuel system efficiency be checked on the dyno? No! Engine temp going to be the same in the boat as on the dyno, probably not. Water through the headers ran on the dyno? The list goes on.
Ive both used a dyno and not. For me it has always worked out in the end. Im neither for or against, no matter what you do there is always work after it is installed.
Good luck and enjoy
You forgot about draining a few quarts of oil out to make more hp on the dyno.

[GM Killer]

One thing I am certian of.....If I give you and DNE(BrendellaJets builder) all of the same parts to build a motor to run in a jet boat, DNE's will win every single time and the motor would last longer as well.
Pretty bold statement!!! The first and only time my CP hit the water my boat ran in the 9.1xs and it was and still is undynoed. CS19 with his DNE motor, pro built boat ran a best of 9.50's or .60's that weekend. I know more money was spent on his set up then mine. Jim Guthrie, nor anyone associated with building the boat was at the track to do any tuning, where Chris had more then one working on his. We did NO tuning on my boat or motor that weekend with the exception of adding a few degrees of timing. Even better, mine is a FORD!!!

[BrendellaJet]

Pretty bold statement!!! The first and only time my CP hit the water my boat ran in the 9.1xs and it was and still is undynoed. CS19 with his DNE motor, pro built boat ran a best of 9.50's or .60's that weekend. I know more money was spent on his set up then mine. Jim Guthrie, nor anyone associated with building the boat was at the track to do any tuning, where Chris had more then one working on his. We did NO tuning on my boat or motor that weekend with the exception of adding a few degrees of timing. Even better, mine is a FORD!!!
Uhhhhhh, did you read what he said? SAME PARTS! Not different make.

[bp]

Pretty bold statement!!! The first and only time my CP hit the water my boat ran in the 9.1xs and it was and still is undynoed. CS19 with his DNE motor, pro built boat ran a best of 9.50's or .60's that weekend. I know more money was spent on his set up then mine. Jim Guthrie, nor anyone associated with building the boat was at the track to do any tuning, where Chris had more then one working on his. We did NO tuning on my boat or motor that weekend with the exception of adding a few degrees of timing. Even better, mine is a FORD!!!
you're way way off. for one thing, that wasn't a true dne built engine; it was a bunch of parts cs collected that dne helped him assemble. second, YOUR engine is/was way way larger than that thing was; ford or chevy, go play with yourself, doesn't matter; you're talking apples and oranges trying to compare your deal with where that daytona was on it's first or second trip to the track. now, he has a dne designed engine (that's still smaller than yours), so maybe you'd like to try him again? or maybe you'd like to try out the dragon, which is also smaller than yours. and, since the dragon is running 8.40s-.50s, heavier layup gullwing than yours, smaller engine, just maybe jim left some on the table???
AND, the way your deal was flying the nose that weekend, it's a wonder it didn't just take off. of course, it wasn't YOU that was at risk...

[GM Killer]

Uhhhhhh, did you read what he said? SAME PARTS! Not different make.
Not the way you guys put down Fords!!! Comparing dyno vs. not.
Its still a bold statement.

[GM Killer]

you're way way off. for one thing, that wasn't a true dne built engine; it was a bunch of parts cs collected that dne helped him assemble. second, YOUR engine is/was way way larger than that thing was; ford or chevy, go play with yourself, doesn't matter; you're talking apples and oranges trying to compare your deal with where that daytona was on it's first or second trip to the track. now, he has a dne designed engine (that's still smaller than yours), so maybe you'd like to try him again? or maybe you'd like to try out the dragon, which is also smaller than yours. and, since the dragon is running 8.40s-.50s, heavier layup gullwing than yours, smaller engine, just maybe jim left some on the table???
AND, the way your deal was flying the nose that weekend, it's a wonder it didn't just take off. of course, it wasn't YOU that was at risk...
His boat was FAR from the first time at the track, and it was my one and only time. If the motor was/ is "spare parts" the were pretty nice from looking at it. Crank trigger, evacuation pump, im sure the heads were "off the shelf", custom intake. My boat was only run one more time after that which was at the river, and it was never ran again. Now the motor is sold and the hull is for sale. So a race is out. But with a few twists here and there, to both the pump set up and a little tuning of the motor, and it would have been in the mid 8s as well.
Where do you get "flying the nose"? Were you there? I have the video if you really want to see it. It was on a conservative set up with plenty of room for growth. Just because it ran better then MOST of you thought it would run, especially the first and only time out, a few people got butt hurt.

[BrendellaJet]

Not the way you guys put down Fords!!! Comparing dyno vs. not.
Its still a bold statement.
Whatever! Im not gonna turn this into a DNE bashing thread, you want to go for it.
And I dont put down Fords. Maybe I poke a little fun but thats it. I dig em. Since I cant run 2 motors in my boat, I have to pick one.

[GM Killer]

Whatever! Im not gonna turn this into a DNE bashing thread, you want to go for it.
And I dont put down Fords. Maybe I poke a little fun but thats it. I dig em. Since I cant run 2 motors in my boat, I have to pick one.
Not going for anything....its all good. Nothing but a good, slightly heated, discussion going on here. Im enjoying it. I RARELY come to this forum, and when I do I might as well have some fun.
I still have a lil 19' Hallett that runs good for what it has. Maybe Ill see ya at the river some time, BS over a beer or 2 or 3 or...
take care

[bp]

gm, of course i was there - i watched him do the 2 second redlights on all those passes, and i don't care what a video looked like, the thing was flying the nose. since he's driven open boats 2 seconds quicker than yours, probably didn't seem like much to him, but that nose was too high. if you really wanted a comparison, you should have compared it to the 019, and even that engine was smaller than yours.
as far as cs, you have no idea where those parts came from, and no one said they were "spare" parts; they were pieces he collected over time. you can think what you want to, but your build was way beyond the first engine in that boat. and, that was the first year he was out, and it takes a significant period of time to get a daytona right. if he hadn't gone to the dyno and matched things up correctly, he'd have been running that boat in the 10s.
and i never "bash" fords - my last ford was an '01 silver lightning that i had for almost 5 years, until it just could not do what i needed from a truck.

[GM Killer]

gm, of course i was there - i watched him do the 2 second redlights on all those passes, and i don't care what a video looked like, the thing was flying the nose. since he's driven open boats 2 seconds quicker than yours, probably didn't seem like much to him, but that nose was too high. if you really wanted a comparison, you should have compared it to the 019, and even that engine was smaller than yours.
as far as cs, you have no idea where those parts came from, and no one said they were "spare" parts; they were pieces he collected over time. you can think what you want to, but your build was way beyond the first engine in that boat. and, that was the first year he was out, and it takes a significant period of time to get a daytona right. if he hadn't gone to the dyno and matched things up correctly, he'd have been running that boat in the 10s.
and i never "bash" fords - my last ford was an '01 silver lightning that i had for almost 5 years, until it just could not do what i needed from a truck.
You dont care what the video shows? Makes a lot of sense. So your memory is better then hard proof!!!! Between Scotten and Guthrie watching the video seeing room for improvement, you are claiming you know more about a CP's ride and set up then them? You are good. And to compare my boat, a boat on its first voyage, to others with proven track time....now that is apples to oranges if I ever heard. What do you know about my motor? To say mine is built way beyond someone elses is only your opinion. I dont know you and you know only what you have seen of my motor. My motor is nowhere near set on kill. It was built for the river and limited racing. No dyno time to select parts or tuning. As far as a Daytona being timely in prep, that was his choice not mine. If I spent time and tuned mine it would be in the mid 8's. So what is your point?

[FILUCKY]

Thats what I thought.....No response:D
Why don't you tell us all about the badass race motors you've built (and dynoed of course) so we can understand your level of expertice on this subject.:)
Bp, the response to your question is a lot of hp! But more then that its a matter of having the cam timmed correctily to match your hp/trq curve to the size impeller your running, too much advance and your running out of useable rpm, not enough advance and you can't get over the "hump" to get into the top of your power curve. This might be a little over your head, i would recomend PM'n Steelcomp.:D
And as far as bashing DNE:confused: When did that happen? The only reason they were mentioned at all was theres a few of their fluffers that feel they need to through their name out there on every thread they post on.:rolleyes:
I get the impression that DNE builds some good motors, its just some of their customers that suck!:D

[bp]

You dont care what the video shows? Makes a lot of sense. So your memory is better then hard proof!!!! Between Scotten and Guthrie watching the video seeing room for improvement, you are claiming you know more about a CP's ride and set up then them? You are good. And to compare my boat, a boat on its first voyage, to others with proven track time....now that is apples to oranges if I ever heard. What do you know about my motor? To say mine is built way beyond someone elses is only your opinion. I dont know you and you know only what you have seen of my motor. My motor is nowhere near set on kill. It was built for the river and limited racing. No dyno time to select parts or tuning. As far as a Daytona being timely in prep, that was his choice not mine. If I spent time and tuned mine it would be in the mid 8's. So what is your point?
i'd agree with both of 'em, there was room for improvement, and the first improvement would be bringing the nose down.
secondly, you are the person comparing your boat to cs, not me. my point was that if you are going to compare it's performance to something as an advertisement to not go to a dyno, compare it to something a little more closely matched to your boat at the time, and cs's wasn't. are you now trying to imply that cs's, the dragon, or the 019 were "on kill"? all three got a helluva lot of sustained river thrashin' for boats "on kill".
third, yeah, i know about your motor. you might as well chill about it, 'cuz it's not gonna do any good to say anything else.
and filucky, i didn't ask about "getting over humps", or any result of changing cam timing. the question should be easy to understand:
if a b impeller jet boat turns 6000 at wot, how much additional hp is need to achieve 6700? 100, 200, 300, 400, ?????? how much?

[cyclone]

Lets say ya build a motor that makes peak power at 7000rpm, and in your boat it will only be able to turn 6000rpm, what the hell differance does it make to dyno tune your motor? Best thing to do is find a motor that makes the power your looking for at the rpm you will be turning and build that motor. For example my old motor made 910hp@7200, this was dyno tuned to make max hp, put it in my boat with a "B" impeller and it fell on its face @6000, this was with the cam set @2*advanced, well after retunning it in the boat with a few cam *changes it was pulling the same "B" impeller to 6700rpm with no other changes. So in other words i could have wipped my butt with that dyno money and been just as well off. But i could not of bragged about my little 514 making 910hp with a single carb.:rolleyes: In the end who really knows what hp i was running to the impeller, but it was running a hell of alot better then after it came of the dyno.:)
You picked up 700 rpm in your jet boat just by advancing the cam timing
? something must not have been right. i've done this test on the dyno several times and the gains when the cam timing is off just a couple degrees are not usually measured in 100's of horsepower..most i've seen is 30-50hp by advancing the cam when the motor needed it to be. either your tach is screwy or you've got some other things going on.

[Bow Tie Omega]

Why don't you tell us all about the badass race motors you've built (and dynoed of course) so we can understand your level of expertice on this subject.:)
Bp, the response to your question is a lot of hp! But more then that its a matter of having the cam timmed correctily to match your hp/trq curve to the size impeller your running, too much advance and your running out of useable rpm, not enough advance and you can't get over the "hump" to get into the top of your power curve. This might be a little over your head, i would recomend PM'n Steelcomp.:D
And as far as bashing DNE:confused: When did that happen? The only reason they were mentioned at all was theres a few of their fluffers that feel they need to through their name out there on every thread they post on.:rolleyes:
I get the impression that DNE builds some good motors, its just some of their customers that suck!:D
No matter what I state, it will not matter, because you were able to take a drag car motor and by "tuning it", you were able to make it a jet boat motor. Your way out of my league man, and everyone elses here, including the experts (once again, sarcasm). If you are able to make drag car motors into jet boat motors just by a little tuning, I bet you can make ugly girls pretty and turn single prop cesna's into space shuttles . No way man, you are way out of my league. But keep spewing your BS, a lot of us are finding it quite entertaining:D
All kidding aside, I know enough to know that you sound like you are full of BS and are making it up as you go. You are making our points for us. Most big auto race teams are in fact puting their engines on conventional dynos and chassis dynos, they are finding horsepower and potential problems on both, otherwise, they would not waste their time with either. You are trying to claim that you are doing what they can without a dyno????? Get over yourself. If you want to be a "cowboy" and think you can know more about your own motor and it's performance than a computer, it is all you bud. It is your motor, you can do what you want. But to spew your ignorance onto the innocent as "expert opinion" is irresponsible and negligent on your part. While your motor may run at a decent level, I guarantee you that any expert engine builder worth his salt would find a fair amount of horsepower and torque that you left on the table by using a dyno along with diagnosing potential problems early, that is called common sense. Opinions like yours end up hurting people in the pocket book, some times more than they can afford. If people like you do not have anything constructive and responsible to provide as far as info you should stfu and learn something before someone knowing less than you state you know comes to you and asks you why you would give him such bad info, you opinion just cost him $20,000. So before you start slamming people who use dyno's or have their motors built by experts who know what they are doing and use dyno's, you should think about the potential results of your advice and who might be listening .That is the point that I am making.

[Blown 472]

No matter what I state, it will not matter, because you were able to take a drag car motor and by "tuning it", you were able to make it a jet boat motor. Your way out of my league man, and everyone elses here, including the experts (once again, sarcasm). If you are able to make drag car motors into jet boat motors just by a little tuning, I bet you can make ugly girls pretty and turn single prop cesna's into space shuttles . No way man, you are way out of my league. But keep spewing your BS, a lot of us are finding it quite entertaining:D
All kidding aside, I know enough to know that you sound like you are full of BS and are making it up as you go. You are making our points for us. Most big auto race teams are in fact puting their engines on conventional dynos and chassis dynos, they are finding horsepower and potential problems on both, otherwise, they would not waste their time with either. You are trying to claim that you are doing what they can without a dyno????? Get over yourself. If you want to be a "cowboy" and think you can know more about your own motor and it's performance than a computer, it is all you bud. It is your motor, you can do what you want. But to spew your ignorance onto the innocent as "expert opinion" is irresponsible and negligent on your part. While your motor may run at a decent level, I guarantee you that any expert engine builder worth his salt would find a fair amount of horsepower and torque that you left on the table by using a dyno along with diagnosing potential problems early, that is called common sense. Opinions like yours end up hurting people in the pocket book, some times more than they can afford. If people like you do not have anything constructive and responsible to provide as far as info you should stfu and learn something before someone knowing less than you state you know comes to you and asks you why you would give him such bad info, you opinion just cost him $20,000. So before you start slamming people who use dyno's or have their motors built by experts who know what they are doing and use dyno's, you should think about the potential results of your advice and who might be listening .That is the point that I am making.
But what if the dyno is hot? or really really easy??

[Bow Tie Omega]

But what if the dyno is hot? or really really easy??
LMAO!!!:D

[cyclone]

But what if the dyno is hot? or really really easy??
Then drain a few quarts of oil out and call it good. oh and test the cam timing adjustments in the boat afterwards. :)

[Blown 472]

Then drain a few quarts of oil out and call it good. oh and test the cam timing adjustments in the boat afterwards. :)
What about the muffler brgs?

[78Eliminator]

400hp, but the dyno says 1400 "corrected".......
By the way, that is a nice tunnel ram manifold. That must have cost a fortune!

[GM Killer]

i'd agree with both of 'em, there was room for improvement, and the first improvement would be bringing the nose down.
secondly, you are the person comparing your boat to cs, not me. my point was that if you are going to compare it's performance to something as an advertisement to not go to a dyno, compare it to something a little more closely matched to your boat at the time, and cs's wasn't. are you now trying to imply that cs's, the dragon, or the 019 were "on kill"? all three got a helluva lot of sustained river thrashin' for boats "on kill".
third, yeah, i know about your motor. you might as well chill about it, 'cuz it's not gonna do any good to say anything else.
The only nose that needs to come down is the one on your face!!! Never have I come by someone as arrogent as yourself about something you know nothing about. While reviewing the boat runs with Guthrie, he NEVER mentioned the nose running high, what he did mention was "there is too much boat in the water", amongst other things.
You want me to "chill"? You "know about my motor"? What do you know about my motor? Were you there seeing it built? Who did the assembly? The machine work? All you know is what i advertised on my ad and what was posted during the build of it. Unless you are personal friends with Guthrie, which is doesnt sound like you are, then he wouldnt tell you about it. The boat has never been to a shop and only to Jims house twice for measurements. It was at Mcclures for the intake and it was stripped at that time. I didnt see you when Bennett was doing the bottom.
I forgot, your ultimate memory of the races 3-4 years ago, when you saw the "nose so high", you must have gathered huge amounts of information at that time.
Your statements about my ride and probably anyone else's ride is your opinion, even though in your mind you think they are fact. Unless you know for sure, quit coming off like you know it all. We have never met and probably never will. I do not pretend to know anything about you or your boat, nor do I care. So why you insist on being such an expert about me and my boat is beyond me.

[pw_Tony]

The only nose that needs to come down is the one on your face!!! Never have I come by someone as arrogent as yourself about something you know nothing about. While reviewing the boat runs with Guthrie, he NEVER mentioned the nose running high, what he did mention was "there is too much boat in the water", amongst other things.
You want me to "chill"? You "know about my motor"? What do you know about my motor? Were you there seeing it built? Who did the assembly? The machine work? All you know is what i advertised on my ad and what was posted during the build of it. Unless you are personal friends with Guthrie, which is doesnt sound like you are, then he wouldnt tell you about it. The boat has never been to a shop and only to Jims house twice for measurements. It was at Mcclures for the intake and it was stripped at that time. I didnt see you when Bennett was doing the bottom.
I forgot, your ultimate memory of the races 3-4 years ago, when you saw the "nose so high", you must have gathered huge amounts of information at that time.
Your statements about my ride and probably anyone else's ride is your opinion, even though in your mind you think they are fact. Unless you know for sure, quit coming off like you know it all. We have never met and probably never will. I do not pretend to know anything about you or your boat, nor do I care. So why you insist on being such an expert about me and my boat is beyond me.
LMFAO!!!:devil: :devil:

[bp]

The only nose that needs to come down is the one on your face!!! Never have I come by someone as arrogent as yourself about something you know nothing about. While reviewing the boat runs with Guthrie, he NEVER mentioned the nose running high, what he did mention was "there is too much boat in the water", amongst other things.
You want me to "chill"? You "know about my motor"? What do you know about my motor? Were you there seeing it built? Who did the assembly? The machine work? All you know is what i advertised on my ad and what was posted during the build of it. Unless you are personal friends with Guthrie, which is doesnt sound like you are, then he wouldnt tell you about it. The boat has never been to a shop and only to Jims house twice for measurements. It was at Mcclures for the intake and it was stripped at that time. I didnt see you when Bennett was doing the bottom.
I forgot, your ultimate memory of the races 3-4 years ago, when you saw the "nose so high", you must have gathered huge amounts of information at that time.
Your statements about my ride and probably anyone else's ride is your opinion, even though in your mind you think they are fact. Unless you know for sure, quit coming off like you know it all. We have never met and probably never will. I do not pretend to know anything about you or your boat, nor do I care. So why you insist on being such an expert about me and my boat is beyond me.
we did meet, but there's no video of it. you can think what you want. you're obviously not having fun anymore, since you're completely off point and want to attack, which i could care less about.

[GM Killer]

we did meet, but there's no video of it. you can think what you want. you're obviously not having fun anymore, since you're completely off point and want to attack, which i could care less about.
We met? Im sorry if I dont remember. Video? Obviously you think and say what you want, just as shown above.
I always have fun. Just not around here. I still have my Hallett and it scoots fine.
Take Care

[460 jus getn it]

Here you guys might need this.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/157023popcorn.jpg

[bradbigsley]

LMFAO!!!:devil: :devil:
go back to your dirtbikes you jerkoff:mad:

[Squirtcha?]

Well, it's finally at home! Still a few small things to do, but it will be ready within the next couple months! My wife wants to kill me:mad: , but I've been waiting over 2 years for this! :)
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2457.jpg
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2456.jpg
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2455.jpg
http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w53/bailey107/IMG_2454.jpg
Woah this sucker got off track eh?
That's a fine looking piece of machinery there brother.
I don't know if any body's mentioned it or not...........
but you might wanna think about putting that thing on a dyno?? (supposed to be humorous)

[pw_Tony]

go back to your dirtbikes you jerkoff:mad:
I'm gonna have to punch someone's nose down:D
I'm gonna probably make a stupid comment but maybe that motor doesn't need a dyno as bad as everyone is making it out to be:confused:
It looks pretty burly with that intake and valve covers but it's a 10.7:1 521 with Some Eldy heads on it. Maybe he is good enough just to tune it in the boat. I don't know the exact specs but maybe it's more mild than it looks. I dunno. But if it is as sick as it perceives to be then I got another vote for the dyno:)

[American Turbine Man]

nobody responded to my question either.
what horsepower increase is required to go from 6000 to 6700, same boat same b impeller?
268 HP
That's probably a little high, it hard to calculate how much more air will get into the jet with the additional speed.
ATM
American Turbine, Dominator, & Legend

[Ralph Brunt]

if it's a race boat and you are looking for every last hp then dyno it. but by the looks of those carbs i'm gunna say its not a race boat soooooo just enjoy your beautifull engine. not saying those are bad carbs either:D

[MikeF]

Looks good........for a ford.;) :cool:

[BUSBY]

The only nose that needs to come down is the one on your face!!! Never have I come by someone as arrogent as yourself about something you know nothing about. While reviewing the boat runs with Guthrie, he NEVER mentioned the nose running high, what he did mention was "there is too much boat in the water", amongst other things.
You want me to "chill"? You "know about my motor"? What do you know about my motor? Were you there seeing it built? Who did the assembly? The machine work? All you know is what i advertised on my ad and what was posted during the build of it. Unless you are personal friends with Guthrie, which is doesnt sound like you are, then he wouldnt tell you about it. The boat has never been to a shop and only to Jims house twice for measurements. It was at Mcclures for the intake and it was stripped at that time. I didnt see you when Bennett was doing the bottom.
I forgot, your ultimate memory of the races 3-4 years ago, when you saw the "nose so high", you must have gathered huge amounts of information at that time.
Your statements about my ride and probably anyone else's ride is your opinion, even though in your mind you think they are fact. Unless you know for sure, quit coming off like you know it all. We have never met and probably never will. I do not pretend to know anything about you or your boat, nor do I care. So why you insist on being such an expert about me and my boat is beyond me.
Ouch ... and I thought Bob was out against me alone
I don't worry about what Bob says too much now, as soon as he called me non-licensed rookie and himself a 10 second "world champion"... I figured out that he was seeing drag boat racing from a different "world"
He says he knows me as well ... but in reality only he doesn't ... only knows me from the last 6 years of NJBA alone ... seems to think I didn't exist before that in the drag boating world ...
so again I say, don't take it personal ...

[bp]

268 HP
That's probably a little high, it hard to calculate how much more air will get into the jet with the additional speed.
ATM
American Turbine, Dominator, & Legend
thanks atm. i'm thinking that's low, but i'm only basing that on the result of a 150 n2 shot (rpm diff). my guess would be more along the lines of 350-400?

[poncho-pwr]

One other thing to think about as far as the dyno goes is this....Besides running it on the dyno to properly tune it, you can also look at it as a proof testing event, or "shakedown" run. Wouldn't you rather find out that there was a manufacturing flaw in a part or an assembly error that could cause catastauphic engine failure in the dyno room rather than in a jetboat at 80/90/100+mph where jetboats don't have the best reputation for treating their drivers nicely during those events??? Just another thought, take it for what it's worth.

[steelcomp]

Het Steelcomp, if he wants to take his motor to be dynoed thats his call and i don't think anything you or i say will really affect that.:D You feel happy with your dyno tune, i'm happy with tunning mine to the boat. I think that its probibly a pretty even split between those who like it dynoed and those who like to tune it in the boat. But just for arguement sakes, why do alot of car race teams dyno tune there motors and then chassie dyno them and often find 25-75hp or so at the rear tires, after the motor was tunned on a motor dyno? Do ya think that maybe dyno rooms and real world don't always work out the same? are you so happy with the dyno tune on your motor that you just bolt it in your boat and leave it alone? You don't try to further tune it. Just curious, ever think you might be leaveing some hp on the table?:)I like this...the more questions you ask, the less you seem to know.
How many jet boats do you know trhat have rear tires, or a chassis? :notam: I don't see how that relates to dynoing a jet boat engine, and in fact, chassis tuning and dyno tuning (for HP) are two completely seperate things.
Yes, I'm very happy with the dyno tune on my engine. What you seem to be leaving out is the fact that a jet pump is basically a dyno, or water brake. Other than the weather (or DA) what you get on the dyno with a jet boat engine, is what you're going to get in your boat. If I'm racing at a DA of 2784', and it's near 84 deg., then I know just exactly what power I'm making. Those were the conditiond in the dyno room. Keeping an eye on the weather, I can adjust from there, and always have a good idea of what the power is, and how to tune. That's just part of racing, and pretty much how it's done. There's no driveline, there's no gears, there's no parasitic anything on a jet. You're not going to tune for optimum on the dyno, and then "chassis tune" a jet boat. My tune is what it is, and I built everything else around that power. Smart as you're trying to sound, I figured you knew that.
Stop arguing about something you know so little about.

[steelcomp]

The word "guessing" has been used for when a dyno isnt used. How much guessing is there really? If you know what your heads flow, cam size, cubic inch, compression, etc, then you should have a pretty good idea of what you are shooting for to begin with. As I said previously, it all changes once its in the boat. Sure there is hidden power that can be found on a dyno, but unless you are used to working with one, arent ready to make changes, and do not have your engine builder/tuner with you and a gain of parts (ie. different headers, carbs and associated parts, ignition parts, possibly different cams) what good is it? You can change the timing while in the boat. If there is a leak, then fix it. Check the plugs to see the rich/ lean of the carbs. Can your fuel system efficiency be checked on the dyno? No! Engine temp going to be the same in the boat as on the dyno, probably not. Water through the headers ran on the dyno? The list goes on.
Ive both used a dyno and not. For me it has always worked out in the end. Im neither for or against, no matter what you do there is always work after it is installed.
Good luck and enjoyYou and FILUCKY must be drinkin the same Koolaid, 'cause neither of you know what the hell you're talking about.
Sure there is hidden power that can be found on a dyno, but unless you are used to working with one, arent ready to make changes, and do not have your engine builder/tuner with you and a gain of parts (ie. different headers, carbs and associated parts, ignition parts, possibly different cams) what good is it? I don't know too many dyno operators that are just going to let some guy come in and use the dyno. Typically, that's what you pay for. LIke everything else, there are good, and bad operators, so doing a little homework is always a good idea when someone decides to dyno an engine. It would be pointless to NOT have your engine builder there...that's the whole purpose. What do you expect, just hang out and burn some gas? Drink some beers, eat a pizza, and call it good? LOL...C'mon, get real. If you want to argue, argue about something you understand. If that's your idea of a dyno session, you could just use a break-in stand.
Can your fuel system efficiency be checked on the dyno? No! Engine temp going to be the same in the boat as on the dyno, probably not. Water through the headers ran on the dyno?Fuel effeciency? You mean fuel system effeciency, as in a/f ratio, or ex temp? Maybe Lamda? Ever heard of an 02 sensor? How about BSFC? (Brake specific fuel consumption) I guess the answer to your question, is go ahead...check your plugs. I'd bet a weeks pay you really don't even know how. Engine temp can be anything you want it to be on the dyno...that's part of the simulation. Hell, there are dynos that can simulate G forces...I think they figured out engine temp. Water through the headers? How hard is that?
You've never even been in a ryno room, have you.

[Bailey]

Wow, didn't mean to start any arguenments. Yes Dan didn't think I was going in this direction when I started. The motor was built for a jet boat and was built to make hp to 6000rpm. Used the edelbrock heads because thats what the builder wanted to use. I know theres other heads outthere but Ive seen good results from the edelbrocks. Not racing the boat just for fun.

[camoman]

Not racing the boat just for fun.
That says it all:D

[pw_Tony]

Where did the valve covers from. Those are very nice

[wickedfab]

ebay= 700 hp 150mph jet
craigslist=650 hp 130mph flat bottom jet
***boat=impeller aa cut 650hp 110 mph @6000rpm
to dyno or not=priceless
:D
nice lookin motor
the distributors on the wrong side though:)

[BrendellaJet]

Not racing the boat just for fun.
That says it all:D
Racing is fun!

[Squirtcha?]

Wow, didn't mean to start any arguements.
I can't believe you came in here stirring the proverbial pot like that.:eek:

[Bailey]

Valve covers came from Ford Perfomance Solutions in LA.