Spinoff Question..on Pushrod length

[TJS]

I have read over and over the pushrod thread. I even printed out the Lunati instructions and diagram that steelcomp posted. I am going to follow that procedure. Here is my question. I have BBC with Retro-fit roller Hyd. lifters. I have Smith Bros adjust to do this as well. I am wondering how to do this with hyd. rollers. Do I pump them up, or do I take them apart and "make" them solid with a machined insert slug of some sort to take place of the plunger set up. If I do pump them up then what is the best way to calculate the length into the formula.
Thanks.
T.J.
www.tjsperformance.com

[gn7]

some how you need to get the lifter solid, and the spring you are going to use in installed, you really shouldn't use a light spring method like some will tell you. I would start with your stock push rod and see where you fall at mid lift and start from there as to your starting point for the adjustable.

[TJS]

Yes I will be using my springs I will be running. Also the Smith Push rods I have are the length this cam/lifter package calls for, so the starting point I have.
T.J.

[gn7]

this just my 2 cents, and may catch hell from some, but I wouldn't get too hung up on this pushrod length think on a moderate lift hyd roller. The thread was started for a guy building a motor from the pan up, and then it is worth it. But think about what you are going to have to go thru to get those measurements, weigh that against the gains and personally I don't see it. Just my 2 cents of thought

[steelcomp]

TJS...I'll post this up for others to see (with some editing).
What I would do is use a solid roller lifter (making sure it's the same dimension as the hyd...most should be) and establish the correct PR length with that. Once you've gotten that length, decide on how much pre-load you're going to run in the lifter, and add that to the length of the PR. With a 7/16 rocker stud, it's .050" per turn, so if you go 1/2 turn, you would add .025 to the PR length. This works with hyd. flat tappets, as well.

[GofastRacer]

Well we may both catch hell then because I got to agree, in fact with that setup I'd just put the stock pushrods in and use the Manley tool for checking lenght, unless it's way off I'd just run it!..

[steelcomp]

Well we may both catch hell then because I got to agree, in fact with that setup I'd just put the stock pushrods in and use the Manley tool for checking lenght, unless it's way off I'd just run it!..Wow, I'm really disappointed in you guys. Are you getting old, or just lazy...if this guy took the time to learn about this, go as far as print up instructions, is asking a really good question, and wants to take the time to do it right, what the hell good is telling him not to? :confused:
BTW...that Manley checking tool is a POS, and you might as well not bother checking at all.

[TJS]

But I did build this engine from the Pan up. Go to my site and you will see it. I ran it once already with cast iron heads. Took it all apart and now I have Brodix BB2's and changed from a hyd. flat tappet to a Hyd roller cam.
Thanks.
T.J.
www.tjsperformance.com

[GofastRacer]

BTW...that Manley checking tool is a POS, and you might as well not bother checking at all.
Take the POS hose out and put a sleeve in it, and it works good on stocker rebuilds when stuff's been cut, I know I've checked it!..:D

[GofastRacer]

But I did build this engine from the Pan up. Go to my site and you will see it. I ran it once already with cast iron heads. Took it all apart and now I have Brodix BB2's and changed from a hyd. flat tappet to a Hyd roller cam.
Thanks.
T.J.
www.tjsperformance.com
Well in that case if you're looking to get the most out of it, then it is a good idea to do it!..

[gn7]

if you have the motor apart, by all means do it, I was under the impression you were doing this to a running motor. Steel is right the Manely checker and all the others like it are a total waste of time and money. The problem you have as I read it is that you have retro hyd. rollers which are taller and there are no solids that hieght, which means you are going to have to figure a way to "solid up" the ones you have.

[Fiat48]

For what it's worth dept:
I have the manley checker (plastic deal). I have the Lunati checker (fixed rocker deal and adjustable pushrods).
Most motors I do have been decked & squared, aftermarket heads and usually longer valves.
Sometimes the Manley hits it. Sometimes the Manley and the Lunati checker agree. But most times they don't. Most times if Manley and Lunati checker agree...then the 1/2 lift measured method also agrees.
I won't even try to explain that as I have no idea.
I have many pushrods from years of racing or picked up at swap meets. First thing I do is throw on the Manley checker and make a suitable pushrod to get started. I find the length needed with an adjustable pushrod. Then I simply find an old pushrod and cut it down so I have a "real" 3/8 pushrod for checking. The flimsy adjustable would fold up during a lift check.
Then I will adjust the valve lash and find 1/2 lift. Then follow procedure outlined in the instructions which I uploaded to Shaun's website. I do the check with the actual springs, rockers, etc that the motor will use.
I will also check how much travel across (scrubbing) the rocker does when opening and closing the valve (felt tip marker method) when I am done...just to know.
In the end I will have 2 homemade pushrods which I measure for length and have Smith Bros make them. They will make exact lengths I want while many others just want to hit me within .050. I didn't do all this to be within .050.
Now.....would I do this on a "stocker". I'd probably put the manley on there...then see what the Lunati checker says and if they agree I'd prolly say ok. Especially if this was all done with a stock length pushrod, stock valve lengths, etc.
I forgot something. Camshaft base circles really vary and another reason why pushrod length's vary from motor to motor.

[gn7]

I hear what your saying with the Manley and Lunati checkers, if I had both I might do exactly what you are doing. And I always use a Manley to set my adj. as a start point, and some times it's close and sometimes, well it just isn't. It has to do with the lift for the most part, I think. When the lift starts getting pretty high with Manley set up the rocker tends to over arc. But the craziest thing is I have two sets of Crower S.S. rockers with the roller, fulcrum, cup relationship that are differant, manuf. about 10 yrs apart, now which of these sets was the Manley checker designed for and why did Crower change them. Ultimately, after all is said and done I still check it at mid lift and order the EXACT rod also, except I get mine from Manton and they have always gotten them to me FAST.