Holley or Edelbroch

[tittyman]

Have a BBC with 12:1 comp., radical cam, dual 660'S, tunnel, Vertex Mag. Just rebuilt these 660'S...still haven't got them completely dialed in...
Ran the boat yesterday, not on it hard at all..went through 8-10 gallons of fuel while just adjusting the carbs..running round a little bit..that's a crap load of fuel for the amount of time I ran the boat..plus it's 110 race fuel..my boat only has 2 10 gallon tanks
The question is..1. If I change these 660'S to get better fuel hours should I go with Holley or Edelbroch? I would be willing to sacrifice a little power for much better fuel economy...what size should they be?
Question 2..Vac. or mech. secondarys..I do have a tunnel ram...
Again I'm looking for much better fuel economy, willing to sacrifice a little performance..thanks..

[TahitiTiger]

are you running a MSD?

[tittyman]

No msd..

[lilrick]

are you running a MSD?
he says MAG.

[lilrick]

Have a BBC with 12:1 comp., radical cam, dual 660'S, tunnel, Vertex Mag. Just rebuilt these 660'S...still haven't got them completely dialed in...
Ran the boat yesterday, not on it hard at all..went through 8-10 gallons of fuel while just adjusting the carbs..running round a little bit..that's a crap load of fuel for the amount of time I ran the boat..plus it's 110 race fuel..my boat only has 2 10 gallon tanks
The question is..1. If I change these 660'S to get better fuel hours should I go with Holley or Edelbroch? I would be willing to sacrifice a little power for much better fuel economy...what size should they be?
Question 2..Vac. or mech. secondarys..I do have a tunnel ram...
Again I'm looking for much better fuel economy, willing to sacrifice a little performance..thanks..
how about a single carb and losing the ram?

[Nucking futs]

Or switch them out for the 650's I have for sale. They are good on fuel with my T ram motor.

[tittyman]

I really do want to keep the tunnel..I understand your point though..

[BrendellaJet]

The 660 has a reputation for being a drag race carb. You might be able to modify them so they are more friendly. Someone more knowledgeable may be able to tell you. I would think that some progressive linkage could be helpful.

[QuickJet]

Use the 660's. I had them on my jet and they ran GREAT!! Ran them on my V-drive as well with the same results. The only thing an Edelbrock carb is good for is keeping your trailer from rolling after you've unhooked it from your truck. They make great tire chaulks since they do very little in the department of horsepower. If you are looking to get some fuel mileage, ditch the jet and get a V-drive or a wacker.

[tittyman]

Thanks Quickjet..just need better fuel economy..has far as getting rid of the jet..I would consider it but this is a pretty cool Sanger Picklefork..

[QuickJet]

Thanks Quickjet..just need better fuel economy..has far as getting rid of the jet..I would consider it but this is a pretty cool Sanger Picklefork..
I was just kidding about getting rid of it. That's a beautifull boat. I think you will find your fuel economy in the tune (jetting, timming, etc.) or possibly the cam.
How big is the cam?

[tittyman]

I wish I had to cam specs but I don't..all I can tell you it is very extreme..I think I do want to make a carb change..just not sure of the size..600 or 650..Holley or Edelbroch..vac. or mechanical..just looking for a lot better economy..I know I can get 600 Edelbroch's at Jegs for $199 each, but there vac. sec. I don't know if that will work or even if the carbs are too small...

[Taylorman]

I ran edelbrock carbs for a long time with very good luck. The run great but like others said, Holleys make more hp. They definately get better gas mileage than Holleys. Go with 2 Edelbrock 600's or 750's depending on what size your engine is. Edelbrocks are mechanical secondaries. Some think they are vaccum because they have a little door above the secondaries that open when air starts to flow. If fuel mileage is what your after, edelbrocks will give you that.

[tittyman]

How much HP do you give up with Edelbroch's vs Holley..are 2 600'S big enough..

[sanger rat]

Or switch them out for the 650's I have for sale. They are good on fuel with my T ram motor. I'd would go with a set of 600 DP or 650 DP like futs has for sale. I got good mileage with a set of 600 DP. FourQ is running them on his new motor.

[ap67et10]

your engine is radical...the cool thing with just about any type of beefed up engine is that the more air and fuel you can dump the more power it makes. (one of the reasons you can always find articals where some wild 383 sbc makes the most peak power with dual dominators and a ram or something rediculous like that) and you could do that too...go bigger and bigger and probably gain more and more. however you specifically said you want to sacrifice that for fuel economy. typically someone that wants to secrifice for fuel economy also wants the reliability to come with it. Go with the edelbrock i have never once had a problem with any carter/edelbrock type carb. every holley i have ever see needed to be tuned (they always run better in the end once tuned right), but 2 weeks later you will be doing it again...and again...and again. even the brand new ones need to be tuned. and now not only do you have to tune it all the time but you have to do it to 2 of them. seriously you might loose some performance (you may not even notice if you haven't even gotten the holleys to run right in the first place) but once they are delivered and you put them on. set the idle and have fun...and watch how much money you save in gas. you want edelbrocks.

[pw_Tony]

your engine is radical...the cool thing with just about any type of beefed up engine is that the more air and fuel you can dump the more power it makes. (one of the reasons you can always find articals where some wild 383 sbc makes the most peak power with dual dominators and a ram or something rediculous like that) and you could do that too...go bigger and bigger and probably gain more and more. however you specifically said you want to sacrifice that for fuel economy. typically someone that wants to secrifice for fuel economy also wants the reliability to come with it. Go with the edelbrock i have never once had a problem with any carter/edelbrock type carb. every holley i have ever see needed to be tuned (they always run better in the end once tuned right), but 2 weeks later you will be doing it again...and again...and again. even the brand new ones need to be tuned. and now not only do you have to tune it all the time but you have to do it to 2 of them. seriously you might loose some performance (you may not even notice if you haven't even gotten the holleys to run right in the first place) but once they are delivered and you put them on. set the idle and have fun...and watch how much money you save in gas. you want edelbrocks.
I could be wrong here but you won't necessarily get more horsepower from just running bigger carbs like two dominators on a 383. Your heads have to flow enough, and combustion space must be able to take all that fuel and air. So as far as the bigger carbs you go, makes more horsepower? I don't think that's right. You need what carbs are right for your motor, bigger carbs don't mean more horsepower, and smaller carbs don't mean more fuel economy. I don't know what you need but these guys on the forums will help you and know to figure specs. So bigger and bigger doesn't do anything other than run non-efficient. And as fas as holley's always have to be tuned? I have ran Holley's on everything I've owned, and once they are dialed in for your motor the first time, that's all I ever had to touch them again. So I'm really confused by what ap67et10 says but I know it doesn't make too much sense, or I could be the idiot... we'll find out :D

[widowmaker]

If it is fuel economy for a tunnel ram, try a pair of 450's they run and idle great, may not have the top end of 660's but they are very user friendly. I've run them for years and had great results. Plus they are a tunnel ram carb and they are mechanical.

[ap67et10]

you are exactly right, your heads and cylinder size and everything you mentioned and more about your engine come into play when you are looking at the capabilities of your setup, but typically if you are trying to get the absolute peak ouput from an engine putting a huge carb (or 2) will only help because the engine with only take in what it can (its an air pump) so what you are essentially doing by adding (for example, thats all it was meant to be) 2 dominators is ensureing the induction system is not a limiting factor to max ouput capabilities of that engine. (i'm not saying thats the best thing to do overall, and definately not for this situation) i am saying that often by adding the opportunity for more air flow you almost alway gain in the total/peak for that engines capabilities. i have a very good friend with his mild 440 cast heads and fairly mild components had a 1050 dominator that was all flowed and setup and expensive on his drag car and ran consistant 10.90's. he happened to come across a tunnel ram and had an extra 750 edelbrock so he took the other 750 off his old work truck to try it out (just messin around) and the first run out with basically no tuning ran almost 3 tenths faster. he just allowed his engine to have 450 more cfm and it wanted it. from the sound of it tittymans setup is far more radical than this but no mater what edelbrock is the way to go for you. id try some 750 edelbrocks. from the sound of it you could probably borrow someones tire chock edelbrock....make sure you give them a block of wood so their boat doesn't roll away though. :)

[tittyman]

Widowmaker..at the present time are you running dual 450'S on your boat or were you running them in the past on another boat? If your running 450'S now what is your motor set-up..or what was the motor set-up when you were running them..seems just a lilttle on the small side..but that's the dual carb set-up that holley actually said to use..

[Hallett19]

I'm running a Holley 4bbl vac secondary and it does well on fuel, as good as you can with a jet boat I guess.

[pw_Tony]

See that's totally different. Your friend with a 440 went from one intake to another, not just a carb change. Ps, I know in my Dart I ran an 11.10 witha 340 and a 800, after putting just a 2 inch spacer on it, it ran 10.95, just from moving the carb higher gave it more top-end, no thanks to over carbeartion. Infact when Carlsbad was shut down and I raced down the street at Barona I ran faster going from a 800 dp, to a 750 dp. So the bigger carb, doesn't mean more power. I've also heard the 450's do real good, and they're cheap too!

[tittyman]

If I go with dual 450'S, mechanical 9776, will I see a huge drop in power or just maybe a couple hundred rpm on the top, or what should I expect. I know the thing will idle great and the fuel will be much better..or in most of you guy's opinions is that just too small...I know some guys are running dual 450'S...thanks for the advise...it's greatly appreciated..

[cave]

Is there any truth to better gas milage in a jet boat?
Maybe drop your compression and run super rather than 110. Or maybe run Av gas. What I gather from your post is you like what you got but hate the price you got to pay to play. I have your solution but its not an easy one. Keep your pedal of the floor :D Just another Internet opinion. You seam to have a great set up. Why mess it up with a carb change? I would run the av gas or change the pistons for a pump gas friendly motor. Good luck either way.

[ap67et10]

I've never said that putting a hugh carb on or 2 of them with improve your performance as a whole...i simply said that TYPICALLY it will keep increasing the absolute PEAK power output until your engine has nothing else it can take in with a perticular setup. i never said it would have a higher average or better overall perfromance i said peak power. your car is in that category your overall performance was better with a smaller carb. I don't even completely know why this is such an issue i'm not telling him to put huge dominators on, but it sounds like if his big block is as radical as he says, he could probably get away with cause the thing would probably eat up as much fuel as you want to give it, but you want fuel economy with the look of a tunnel ram. One other thing to think about is long term. i have never NEEDED to rebuild an edelbrock. they never leak (unless the float gets stuck it happened one time to me), but i have a set of 600 holleys i got on a boat that came with a tunnel ram and they ran good the first season but they started to run crappy the next season (probably from sitting) then they started leaking and it just sucks when all you want to do it have fun. i took the ram off but if i were to keep it i'd get some edelbrock, unless i was looking for the absolute most i could get. then holleys are great. And dont get me wrong i love holleys they are the best carb if you like tinkering and are going for the most you can get. if you want reliability and ease of setup with some good fuel economy save the time and money and do the edelbrock.

[pw_Tony]

Use the 660's. I had them on my jet and they ran GREAT!! Ran them on my V-drive as well with the same results. The only thing an Edelbrock carb is good for is keeping your trailer from rolling after you've unhooked it from your truck. They make great tire chaulks since they do very little in the department of horsepower. If you are looking to get some fuel mileage, ditch the jet and get a V-drive or a wacker.
Word:devil: :devil:

[hang tight]

Have a BBC with 12:1 comp., radical cam, dual 660'S, tunnel, Vertex Mag. Just rebuilt these 660'S...still haven't got them completely dialed in...
Ran the boat yesterday, not on it hard at all..went through 8-10 gallons of fuel while just adjusting the carbs..running round a little bit..that's a crap load of fuel for the amount of time I ran the boat..plus it's 110 race fuel..my boat only has 2 10 gallon tanks
The question is..1. If I change these 660'S to get better fuel hours should I go with Holley or Edelbroch? I would be willing to sacrifice a little power for much better fuel economy...what size should they be?
Question 2..Vac. or mech. secondarys..I do have a tunnel ram...
Again I'm looking for much better fuel economy, willing to sacrifice a little performance..thanks..
Jet boat love carburetion, You can go bigger for more power. Jet boat have never been known for gas mileage. Vac secondary don't work very well with tunnel ram, so go with mech.
Vertex is good just watch your RPM's not so good at super high RPM's
But remember you did build a performance motor. can't really get the best of both worlds. Set it up to run and have fun.

[Klinger]

Edelbrock Is A Night And Day Difference For Me. I Can Run For A Day And A Half Compared To A Couple Hours Off A Dp Holley. Go With The Edelbrock. Be Happy:d

[tittyman]

Are you running a tunnel with dual carbs?? What size are the Edelbrochs? What size motor, cam and compression....thanks..

[ap67et10]

Is there any truth to better gas milage in a jet boat?
Maybe drop your compression and run super rather than 110. Or maybe run Av gas. What I gather from your post is you like what you got but hate the price you got to pay to play. I have your solution but its not an easy one. Keep your pedal of the floor :D Just another Internet opinion. You seam to have a great set up. Why mess it up with a carb change? I would run the av gas or change the pistons for a pump gas friendly motor. Good luck either way.
Even though AV gas is cheaper, fight the urge to use it in a car or boat or anything that operates with a carb in hot temps. remember AV gas is designed for Aviation...they operate at high altituded (obviously). the thing they do with AV gas is pump it full of anti-icing agents so the stuff wont freeze at 30.000 ft...thats not good for us...espectially with carburation

[pw_Tony]

Even though AV gas is cheaper, fight the urge to use it in a car or boat or anything that operates with a carb in hot temps. remember AV gas is designed for Aviation...they operate at high altituded (obviously). the thing they do with AV gas is pump it full of anti-icing agents so the stuff wont freeze at 30.000 ft...thats not good for us...espectially with carburation
I'll let Riodog explain why you're an idiot. Avgas runs much hotter than normal Race leaded fuel. Avgas is meant for Jets at over 20,000 feet where the air is cool."
Splain why lil Cessna 152, 172, 182, and on and on that are flying at "0" agl ->12,500agl are using avgas. When you're done with that one why don't you explain to us all what the difference between avgas and jet fuel is. Wonder when the last time anyone here put avgas in their jet? (it can be done along with diesel, kerosine and scotch).

[ap67et10]

I'll let Riodog explain why you're an idiot. Avgas runs much hotter than normal Race leaded fuel. Avgas is meant for Jets at over 20,000 feet where the air is cool."
aparently you have a difficult time reading...i said it has ANTI-ICING agents. that means they don't want it to freeze...meaning it runs hot. and that is not exactly the best thing for carb boats or cars in hot temps. HOT plus HOT = Bad.
have people done it without any known problems???..yep im sure they have...doesn't mean its a good idea.
apparently you really don't like me or something cause you immediatly want to try and oppose everything i am saying...which is fine in fact I like be proven wrong cause then I learn new things. i try not to be hard headed, but you don't actually read what i say and then i have to restate in ways you understand...maybe i'm just not clear or something.

[pw_Tony]

Haha. That's not what I typed, it was someone else that responded to a message after I said how hot avgas runs. I've seen the affects of avgas and oxgenated fuels have done to cylinder heads after running that type of fuel for a long time, mostly aluminum heads though. Don't take it to the melon just givin ya a little shiat:devil: that's what this board is here for right?

[ap67et10]

whether you typed it or not you are agreeing with me yet you are saying i'm wrong??? I really don't care if you want to try and give me a hard time or whatever, but don't try to do it with info that i never stated...thats just annoying.
and i thought this board was for a bunch of people with the same intrest to come and share info for helping other people out...maybe not

[pw_Tony]

whether you typed it or not you are agreeing with me yet you are saying i'm wrong??? I really don't care if you want to try and give me a hard time or whatever, but don't try to do it with info that i never stated...thats just annoying.
and i thought this board was for a bunch of people with the same intrest to come and share info for helping other people out...maybe not
Wah wah:devil: :devil: