Bassett Plumbing

[FlatRat]

I picked some new Bassett O.T.'s.What is the correct way to plumb these so they don't blue.I'm running BBC with a v-755 neovane. I ran 1/2" S.S. tubing from pump to heads,3/8" out thermostat housing to Tee valve,3/8" out of Tee valve to factory water lines.Are these tubing sizes big enough? There is a gate valve on water out.Is this the best way?I hear of some guys putting .070 restrictors in line. Any thoughts from the pro's.Thanks.

[Snowboat]

Visit this site. http://www.bassettracing.com/newpage7.htm
Personally I have given up on keeping them like the were when they were new, if you run gas. I'll coat mine when the time comes.

[superdave013]

Only 2 kinds of headers. new ones and blue ones.
I always ran 'em dry & hot. Headers hated it but the exhaust valve sure were happier.

[GofastRacer]

superdave013:
Only 2 kinds of headers. new ones and blue ones.
I always ran 'em dry & hot. Headers hated it but the exhaust valve sure were happier. Like these?. :D :D
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/12Image002-med.jpg

[126driver]

Two words:
Jet-Hot.

[GofastRacer]

They will be there this soon!. :cool: :D

[grimreaper]

superdave013:
. Headers hated it but the exhaust valve sure were happier.
How so? ....unless you are running huge amounts of water through them....????? I am somewhat of a newbie at this - sd.....wasssupy?

[76biesmeyer]

Take a picture just after you bolt them $600.00 pipes up!! I will never understand why I spent $$$$$$$$$$ for something that looks cool for 30 min.( MEN & THERE TOYS!!!)PLEASE DON'T TELL THE WIFE pig_flyi

[FlatRat]

Well chit,
they'er not brand spankin' new. I guess I'll save my plumbin' cash,buy some beer and go to lake.After it thaws of course then gas it.Thanks for the info.

[superdave013]

grimreaper:
superdave013:
. Headers hated it but the exhaust valve sure were happier.
How so? ....unless you are running huge amounts of water through them....????? I am somewhat of a newbie at this - sd.....wasssupy? It's called reversion or something like that. Pretty much, big cams suck the water right into the head on the overlap. Cold water and hot exhaust in not a good combo.

[Cole Man II]

Not only will a cam with a large overlap draw water back into the cylinder, but you can get rust. When you turn the motor off, some exhaust valves are left open. Water left in the system will turn to steam on the hot headers. This is not the end of the world, but over time it can cause problems. If you are running a high dollar motor, its just not worth it. I have the water system set up on my boat, just no water flowing through it.
Cole Man.

[grimreaper]

OK.......but what kind of numbers on camshafts can cause this? Water left in the system?.....that is just the fault of the operator....correct? shouldn't the supply be cut-off a couple of minutes before you shut the motor off?
Wouldn't a design change in the headers help? Such as dropping the most lower part of the primary tube down further? Isn't the primary use for the water in the exhaust for safety?
How much does it help for noise?

[Cole Man II]

Mr. Grim,
I am sorry I can not give you more precise answers. When it came to my boat, I felt that I had spent way to much time and money on the motor to fool around with trial and error on water injected headers. The system I was using had a valve connected to my carb linkage via a control arm. As I accelerated past 3000 RPM the valve would begin to allow water into the line feeding the two headers. When I learned about the damage that this could cause to my motor over time, I simply plugged the system. Good luck.
Cole Man

[GofastRacer]

Ditto!, that's why my headers are so pretty!.. wink :D

[Beautiful Noise]

Check with REX MARINE They sale a Manual shut off Valve that you can mount right in front of your seat,that way you control the waterflow to your headers it has a High,Medium&Low+Off setting.This way you can turn them on when or underway and shut them off before you return to a Idle to dry them out.I've run this Valve for year's and my Header's alway look Shiney :D :D
Steve

[LVjetboy]

Oh ya like I'd remember to do that. :D

[fastvdriver]

stop trying to deal with the water no mater how you plum it you will blue the lower parts of the header below the water inlets. if you put enough water to them to keep them crome you will be rebuilding a motor in the near future. I have ran dry headers for the past 4 years with a polished ceramic coating that still looks like new be sure to coat the inside and the outside.

[GofastRacer]

fastvdriver:
stop trying to deal with the water no mater how you plum it you will blue the lower parts of the header below the water inlets. if you put enough water to them to keep them crome you will be rebuilding a motor in the near future. I have ran dry headers for the past 4 years with a polished ceramic coating that still looks like new be sure to coat the inside and the outside. Exactamundo!!.. :)

[CircleJerk]

I seldom feel the need to add anything to the freight train of boat wisdom typically found here,{OPPS THATS A LIE I JUST HIT 501 POSTS}, BUT, I have seen many plumbed with a force feed pickup at the cav plate or thru-hull separate to the engine water intake. This allows the water to enter the pipes only when cruising or blasting! However, a restrictor is a requirement since you can get up to 30 lbs of H2O pressure at speed. The system, when restricted correctly needs NO manual adjusting. I have this plumbed but shut off with a valve to simply appease the Marine Deputies. If the water is plumbed to the pipes, NO ticket for noise is written. So a couple #6 hoses keeps me legal and who cares what color the pipes are! Just put a wet towel over them before you adjust your valves! Burnt smile_sp BabyJeRk
[ March 14, 2003, 10:59 PM: Message edited by: CircleJerk ]

[Beautiful Noise]

Well I must be doing something right My header's alway's look good and my Motor's been together for 8 year's now :D
Steve

[Rexone]

A couple general comments on water injected headers that may help...
The water's purpose is primarily for noise, they are still too hot to touch when underway even with water (the proper amount). Now if you have too much water you might get them cool enough to touch.
The proper amount is just a slight mist (steam). If you have raw water droplets coming out of the end of the pipes you have too much water for engine safety. If you see much of any amount of steam at full throttle you have too much water, just a very small amount should be visible. A fog bank behind the boat is not what you're after here!
The shut off valve works great, I've run them before but you do have to remember to shut it off. The one we make has 3 different size orifices and and off position. You will get a tiny amount of water by the valve in the off position because of valve spool clearance. This is not necessarily a bad thing.
My experience in running one of these setups for several years was to feed the headers off engine water with restrictors in each header line manifold of .080 to .100 per side. This was just enough water to keep the headers from bluing beyond the water fittings and not enough to fill the header up on shutdown and cause engine damage.
Important (and I can't stress this enough)...there are weep holes in the bottom of each primary at the bend. These weep holes get plugged up with crap. They are there for a purpose...to drain any water out that might collect in the tube at shutdown and idle. If you let them become clogged up so they can't drain you "will" have problems with water in the engine. I always just keep something small like a paper clip in the boat and clean them at least every day to make sure they're open.
The bigger the cam the more overlap you generally have. Big overlap causes reversion. Reversion is the sucking backwards of exhaust gas at low engine speeds (idling in particular) when the exhaust valve isn't quite closed. If you have excessive water along with significant reversion you will have water problems. Excessive water being the key words here. In very large cammed applications I'd rig it to shut the water off at low engine speeds. (However, significant idle time without water will blue the headers).
Not an exact science but this is what I've experienced that works for most applications.
One more note...The Bassett Tee valve is simply a pressure operated shut off valve. It eliminates all water to the headers at idle. Therefore if its used you will experience blue primary tubes from idling. Works good, if you like blue. I've seen guys file little tiny notches in the seat of the tee valve where the ball seats to let a tiny amount of water through at idle. Seems to work. Personally I prefer constant water supply with the proper size restrictors in the header lines...accomplishes the same thing.

[A.SNEED]

CAN YOU SHORTEN THAT UP IM KINDA TIRED IN THATS REALLY LONG TO READ.

[Rexone]

A.SNEED:
CAN YOU SHORTEN THAT UP IM KINDA TIRED IN THATS REALLY LONG TO READ. Dammit Sneed I wrote that just for you I heard you had water in your motor once or twice.. :D :D
Here's the shortened version ... Go to bed and reread tomorrow. There will be a quiz. :D
[ March 15, 2003, 10:37 PM: Message edited by: Rexone ]

[Beautiful Noise]

A.SNEED..........Read my Lip's ...."Turn Off The Water To Your Header's" :D :D
Steve

[A.SNEED]

NOPE REXONE YOUR WRONG I HAD THE MOTOR IN THE WATER ONCE OR TWICE : :rolleyes:

[superdave013]

Rexone:
A couple general comments on water injected headers that may help...
The water's purpose is primarily for noise, they are still too hot to touch when underway even with water (the proper amount). Now if you have too much water you might get them cool enough to touch.
The proper amount is just a slight mist (steam). If you have raw water droplets coming out of the end of the pipes you have too much water for engine safety. If you see much of any amount of steam at full throttle you have too much water, just a very small amount should be visible. A fog bank behind the boat is not what you're after here!
The shut off valve works great, I've run them before but you do have to remember to shut it off. The one we make has 3 different size orifices and and off position. You will get a tiny amount of water by the valve in the off position because of valve spool clearance. This is not necessarily a bad thing.
My experience in running one of these setups for several years was to feed the headers off engine water with restrictors in each header line manifold of .080 to .100 per side. This was just enough water to keep the headers from bluing beyond the water fittings and not enough to fill the header up on shutdown and cause engine damage.
Important (and I can't stress this enough)...there are weep holes in the bottom of each primary at the bend. These weep holes get plugged up with crap. They are there for a purpose...to drain any water out that might collect in the tube at shutdown and idle. If you let them become clogged up so they can't drain you "will" have problems with water in the engine. I always just keep something small like a paper clip in the boat and clean them at least every day to make sure they're open.
The bigger the cam the more overlap you generally have. Big overlap causes reversion. Reversion is the sucking backwards of exhaust gas at low engine speeds (idling in particular) when the exhaust valve isn't quite closed. If you have excessive water along with significant reversion you will have water problems. Excessive water being the key words here. In very large cammed applications I'd rig it to shut the water off at low engine speeds. (However, significant idle time without water will blue the headers).
Not an exact science but this is what I've experienced that works for most applications.
One more note...The Bassett Tee valve is simply a pressure operated shut off valve. It eliminates all water to the headers at idle. Therefore if its used you will experience blue primary tubes from idling. Works good, if you like blue. I've seen guys file little tiny notches in the seat of the tee valve where the ball seats to let a tiny amount of water through at idle. Seems to work. Personally I prefer constant water supply with the proper size restrictors in the header lines...accomplishes the same thing. What I get out of this is in a nut shell: With the correct amount of water the pipes are still hot and will blue anyway. If the water is just for noise and we all know it does not quiet it down enough. Why not just run a muffler?

[GofastRacer]

Noise laws are different all over the country and requirements can be different depending on local. Since the river is federal waters, they have no DB requirements. The law says you have to make "An attempt to make it quieter", dosen't say how though, (I'll stick with the mufflers!), so as long as you have something that shows that you're making this attempt, they won't give you a ticket!. I have been told that it would be in my best interest to try and make it a bit quiter though!, but that's only cause I didn't see the cop coming behind me and I decided to stand on it!.. eek! :D

[grimreaper]

Sooooooo - would it just be better to open those weep-holes up a tad so there is less chance of them plugging?

[superdave013]

grimreaper:
Sooooooo - would it just be better to open those weep-holes up a tad so there is less chance of them plugging? Yep

[GofastRacer]

Yeah, and if your just a tad rich, you'll blow black shit all over that area of the boat!.. :rolleyes:

[Rexone]

SD, with the "correct" amount of water the pipes will be hot, but not hot enough to blue. There is a fine line there that can be achieved. I know this because I've done it and made it work.
Of course with a large naturally aspirated big cammed motor this is more difficult with the reversion issue at idle. Mine was a blower motor and worked great with no blue.
With the correct amount of water (translated as not too much) the existing weep hole size is adequate. The important thing is that they remain open.
[ March 16, 2003, 06:44 PM: Message edited by: Rexone ]

[grimreaper]

Rexone:
with the "correct" amount of water the pipes will be hot, but not hot enough to blue.
?????......I always thought that the primary reason for water injection was for cooling so the tubes would not be a danger to the passengers!!??
...but not enough to blue? WTF....I know race cars and street rods with chrome headers that do not suffer from blueing problems at all.
What is wrong with the chroming process that the boat header guys use?