need driveline help

[wright27]

I purchased a 78 Challenger. I have a dominator pump that Jack at MPD just finished for me. Well the guy I bought it from said it was set up for a bbc. Well I put the motor in on the mounts that were in the boat when I bought it and my H-BAR is 7 and 1/2 inches and I only have 4 inches between the end of the shaft and the flywheel. Also the rear of the motor sits way to high, the angle of the driveline just is not right.
Should I drop the back of the motor and also move the motor forward?
Also I never took the intake out of the boat and it is not set straight. It is 3/16 off and the driveline sits at an angle if I were to move the motor forward and down.
Please help
little out of focus but you still can see it is crooked
http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=11217&stc=1
http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=11218&stc=1
Please help what do I need to do.

[Cs19]

whats it going to take to lower the engine? you also need to check that the driveline has end play. you dont want the driveline to bottom out on the bearing clip inside the jet pump.
It doesnt have to be dead nuts straight, but it needs to be reasonably straight.
nice looking dominator, looks good!!

[Rexone]

Crankshaft and pump shaft should be parallel and offset vertically by 1º to 2º.

[ONAROLL]

Im a little confused but here goes................
1. Could it be the other guy had a set up for a flexplate and you have a flywheel in this one, (adding length)?
2. Did you use the same drive coupler as the othe guy had?
3. Did you bolt on a crank hub behind your flexplate or flywheel (adding
length)?
4. Are you sure your mounts are bolted in correctly?
5. Is the crooked intake in relation to your engine or relation to the bottom of your boat?
6. It is not unusual to have to shim mounts to get a precise angle, any shims laying around?
7. If you have to, get your drive coupler out and look at your mounts very close, forget the coupler for a little while and see if you and get the engine in proper position using the mounts that came with the boat. then figure out the proper distance from your flexplate/or flywheel to your pump shaft. if you have all the original hardware and the last guy ran the same engine you probably just have something a little off, stare at it, drink a beer and stare at it some more..........Vic

[wright27]

Last night I was typing fast because I was so phucking frustrated. I can shim, drill out mount feet and make it work. I know it is not rocket science, but I don't want anything breaking on the water. HOw technical and how precise do I need to be. I might be blowing this whole thing way out of proportion. My angle of the driveline is off 3/16 and the height is off by about 1/2 an inch. Is 1/2 inch to much. I can compensate the 3/16 by drilling and shimming. Is it ok to drill out and oblong the feet mounts, or will the motor shift under power.

[GUGS102]

Have you measured the centerline of the crank at the front and back relative to the stringers? I was just thinking of the wiggle room I have in my set up and wondering if yours has the same. Maybe enough to take care of the side offset without elongating the mounting holes? Just a thought...
Gugs

[wright27]

Have you measured the centerline of the crank at the front and back relative to the stringers? I was just thinking of the wiggle room I have in my set up and wondering if yours has the same. Maybe enough to take care of the side offset without elongating the mounting holes? Just a thought...
Gugs
The mounts are tight to the stringers. The only way is to oblong the feet holes so I can shim, but i am concerned with motor movement under power.

[ONAROLL]

Wright,
its a 4 point mount you should be able to pull the feet tight enough to be secure in oblong holes, if its some ungodly blown deal you may want to rethink that, did the last guy have this problem, if you are finding its crooked after being bolted tight to the rails, loosen all the mounts up and retighten them while watching the position of the engine and pump shaft, utilize your "wiggle room" while securing it again......Vic

[wright27]

Wright,
its a 4 point mount you should be able to pull the feet tight enough to be secure in oblong holes, if its some ungodly blown deal you may want to rethink that, did the last guy have this problem, if you are finding its crooked after being bolted tight to the rails, loosen all the mounts up and retighten them while watching the position of the engine and pump shaft, utilize your "wiggle room" while securing it again......Vic
If I oblong the holes on the side I need to move over to and shim the others the motor should not be able to move. My next question is motor angle. Can I angle the front higher to lessen the height dirrerence of the H-bar. This should work being as the pump sits at an angle.

[ONAROLL]

Wright,
A little up angle in the front is fine, alot of guys run the driveline dead nuts straight, I agree with a 1 to 3 degree angle on the joints, nail it!!!!.......Vic

[wright27]

Wright,
A little up angle in the front is fine, alot of guys run the driveline dead nuts straight, I agree with a 1 to 3 degree angle on the joints, nail it!!!!.......Vic
Thanks it shall be done tonight.

[cole'd one]

How many beers did you have when you were setting that pump??? :cool:

[BigBlockBaja]

How many beers did you have when you were setting that pump??? :cool:
1 less that you....
:crossx: :crossx: :crossx:

[Squirtcha?]

How's this for alignment? Believe it or not, this is what mine looked like when I bought it. It had been like that for god knows how long, and although embarassing to say, I continued to run it that way for like 3 or 4 years. I figured what the hell, it's lasted this long........
When the motor was pulled out and torn down, the crank had suffered some damage and needed a thrust repair. It was saved though and is still in there running now.
I wouldn't advocate leaving one like this, but it shows to go ya.......those u-joints can work at some pretty extreme angles and still live. If you're off a little I don't think it's gonna hurt ya too much. Even after redoing all my stuff and going to a rail type mount, it's still not perfectly straight. (way way way better than the picture though).
http://www.jetheaven.us/photopost/data/500/19ujointalignment_sized.jpg

[inwo]

Seems like someone should make up a straight shaft. No u-joints. To pass around, for alignments. Would save a lot of measuring. I'm dealing with a buddy's now.

[Devilman]

How's this for alignment? Believe it or not, this is what mine looked like when I bought it. It had been like that for god knows how long, and although embarassing to say, I continued to run it that way for like 3 or 4 years. I figured what the hell, it's lasted this long........
When the motor was pulled out and torn down, the crank had suffered some damage and needed a thrust repair. It was saved though and is still in there running now.
I wouldn't advocate leaving one like this, but it shows to go ya.......those u-joints can work at some pretty extreme angles and still live. If you're off a little I don't think it's gonna hurt ya too much. Even after redoing all my stuff and going to a rail type mount, it's still not perfectly straight. (way way way better than the picture though).
http://www.jetheaven.us/photopost/data/500/19ujointalignment_sized.jpg
Damn, looks sorta like mine. My driveline is straight as far as side to side, but runs on a downward angle to the pump....
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/2812driveline.jpg

[cruser]

I think I am confused about this. Look at any rearwheel drive vehicle with a 2 u-jointed driveshaft. The driveline angles are much bigger than those shown here. I was taught that as long as the input and output are paralell (not necessarily in alignment) and the angle does not cause a bind in the u-joints, you are good to go. In both the "bad" examples shown the input and output look to be paralell but offset. Perhaps that is why the work(ed)?
On mine, the motor and pump are mounted at the same angle inline with each other horizontally, not vertically. My motor and pump were set at Tom Papp's shop.

[Sleek-Jet]

I think this is exactly what you want. Like Rex said, the crank and pump shaft should be in line horizontally, and a few degrees off in the vertical. The way it was explained to me is that if there is not some angle difference, the U joints will ride on the same needles all the time (the shafts won't turn in the cups) and this will lead to U joint failure.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/2812driveline.jpg

[wright27]

Well I redrilled the mounts and realigned everything, because of the intake being out the 3/16 I am not perfect but compared to the other pics in here I am more than good. Thanks for all the help.

[wright27]

How many beers did you have when you were setting that pump??? :cool:
I drank a few before, but alot later with your mama.

[Devilman]

I think this is exactly what you want. Like Rex said, the crank and pump shaft should be in line horizontally, and a few degrees off in the vertical. The way it was explained to me is that if there is not some angle difference, the U joints will ride on the same needles all the time (the shafts won't turn in the cups) and this will lead to U joint failure.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/2812driveline.jpg
That is what I have always heard from back when I was lifting trucks. I don't recall why I took that pic, think I was looking for a driveline cover or something. That is how its been since I got the boat & it has been perfectly fine. Regardless, I couldn't lower my motor anyway, as the pan is pretty close to the floor as it is.... :cool:

[Rexone]

This link may help you guys. It is in the list in Gear Heads > tech links also.
http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/driveline/
3º is recommended max angle. I prefer 2.