Impeller Detailing

[Taylorman]

Is there anything to be gained in holeshot by having an impeller detailed in a low hp boat. Im curious if i could improve my out the hole speed by having my impeller detailed. Is a 375-400 hp olds Taylor SJ, JE pump and bone stock AMT A impeller.

[Jet Hydro]

yes if you have the money to spend ;) but there are other things that might help as well ;)

[HBjet]

Yes
Less cavitation = quicker holeshot
I do not believe there is anything else I would do before getting the impeller detailed since that is where the cavitation usually starts.

[FuelInMyVeins82]

Yes
Less cavitation = quicker holeshot
I do not believe there is anything else I would do before getting the impeller detailed since that is where the cavitation usually starts.
:devil: :devil: :devil: :D

[Taylorman]

Whats involved in detailing and whats the typical cost.

[BrendellaJet]

Whats involved in detailing and whats the typical cost.
A general massaging of the blades, removing any nicks & dings and sharpening of the blades. Easily messed up by an amateur. I was quoted 6 hours for my jacuzzi stainless @ MPD(I think the rate for that work was $50/hour though I could be wrong).

[Sleeper CP]

Your current AMT A impeller, what RPM'S do your turn it? Depending on your current intake grate it could have an affect on your holeshot. Some grates block more water than others. One thing you might want to consider is an inducer impeller that is placed on the shaft in front of the main impeller. It will help your holeshot probably more that anything else you can do.
Sleeper CP

[BUSBY]

Send it to Jack @ MPD ... well worth the money ... as Randy (HBjet) said, it'll make a better holeshot ... you'll be happy you spent the money & Jack will do it right.
Brian

[Jet Hydro]

some times it take a little more then a impeller detailed ;)

[Pops@Aggressor]

yes if you have the money to spend ;) but there are other things that might help as well ;)Say HI to Ya!

[Jet Hydro]

well Hello Pops :)

[mdunn01]

I am not an expert but I do pay attention to Jet boat people and those who know the sport well. A different intake grate is going too do nothing for your hole shot, sorry. It wont help you much at all unless at high speeds. A impeller is not going to make a difference that much either. What will make a difference for a hole shot is a diverter, plain and simple. To be able to life your boat off plane faster and push it out quicker a diverter will make a huge difference.

[Jet Hydro]

wow maybe I should get me one of them diverter things for my 1200 hp drag boat??? :idea: guess I`v been doing it wrong for all these years :rolleyes:

[mdunn01]

wow maybe I should get me one of them diverter things for my 1200 hp drag boat??? :idea: guess I`v been doing it wrong for all these years :rolleyes:
Hes talking about a bone stock motor here not a full blow race engine. if thats the case you mean to tell me a Intake grate is going to make a difference or a different impeller? I dont think so? Not for getting a better hole shot.

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

I did a detailed impeller(per Duane) and I noticed a difference in the pump loading

[Jet Hydro]

I`v done it on stock or low hp boats and seen a difference but I would also do other things to the pump to make better uses of the mods.

[HotDogz]

Seems like an impeller detail would only be half the equation as my impression is that impellers are not very good at sucking water as they are at pushing water. Seems like an inducer would be the other half the equation to feed water to the impeller so the impeller can make use of it. Then I can see the impeller detail coming into play (blade sharpening, removing excess mass, etc) after which a diverter would make sense to better direct the flow of water leaving the pump.
Just my ignorant opinion.:)

[Jet Hydro]

There are many things that come in to play when trying to figure out a pump set-up. I learned with working with some of the best to some of "not so good, full of BS" people. Every boat is different and will take a different set-up. I`d start out with moving the impeller in and out then play with ride plate angles and length moving on to loader and nozzle angles and sizes. Some times just a nozzle size can make all the differance in the world. I never make a call till I drive the boat so I can see just what is happening so I know the right changes to make. Then make only (1) One change at a time and wright down the out come of the change. An inducer is just a bandage for a pump that someone cant figure out. To do pump set-up`s you better have a big box of tricks in the back of the truck and plan on a long day if you want the best set-up you can get. A data recorder is also nice to have but it can be done with-out it, if you have the time. There is no "one anwsure" it`s a matter of trying this then trying that. Taylorman I dont know how bad your pump is slipping on the hole shot so it`s really hard to say what the fix would be with out knowing it first hand.

[BigBlockOldsJet]

wow maybe I should get me one of them diverter things for my 1200 hp drag boat??? :idea: guess I`v been doing it wrong for all these years :rolleyes:
You forgot to mention that your "1200 HP" drag boat runs the 1/4 mile in 11 seconds ..... that's nothing to be proud of.

[Taylorman]

Taylorman I dont know how bad your pump is slipping on the hole shot so it`s really hard to say what the fix would be with out knowing it first hand.
I have no idea if it is slipping but im sure theres room for improvement, this was just a question our of curiosity. I have a new AMT A impeller/ultimate wear ring and an inducer.

[BUSBY]

You forgot to mention that your "1200 HP" drag boat runs the 1/4 mile in 11 seconds ..... that's nothing to be proud of.
ouch

[BUSBY]

I have to agree with Jet Hydro here ... there are numerous things that can assist a boat in getting a better/quicker set up ...
but the question was "is having your impeller detailed going to help your holeshot?"
they answer is yes ... it will help, but is that the only thing you can do? obviously not.
As I said before ... have Jack/Duane/Shoemaker/Bruce/Gene Snow/whoever do it that KNOWS what they are doing and you will see a difference.
That is the answer to your question ... now if we want to jack the thread and talk about pump set ups and what works and doesn't ... that would be up to Taylorman IMO ...
my .02 for what it's worth (which is probably nothing)

[IMPATIENT 1]

I have no idea if it is slipping but im sure theres room for improvement, this was just a question our of curiosity. I have a new AMT A impeller/ultimate wear ring and an inducer.
kevin, the guy i wanted to email you about quachita just pulled his inducer off cause it was making it cavitate. he's runnin a taylor sj with a bbc, he's on these boards now, his handle is hotbo, give him a pm about his set-up;) he gained 3-4mph just by removing the inducer alone!

[hotbo]

yes i pulled it out tryin to find the many problems i have at top end cavitation which i have narrowed it down.iwas runnign right around 69-70 on my gps.pump cavitating like a mofo like being on a circus ride.so i pulled out the inducer lost no hole shot performance at all and it took it longer to cavitate.went to 73.7 gps best pass but hanging right around 72 73.i know ive got more the boat is still pulling hard then wamo it cavitates.i need more loader so im adding material to mine and im sure this will help.:D
ive had the e-shoe kit on my boat that a certain company sells slowed me wtf down and tried to kill me 3 times,boat got into a bucking fit and was not fun.others have tried them and had good sucsess with them not i.i have detailed my impeller and noticed not a damn thing other than hours of crappy work.my pump does not slip a rpm my boat turns 5450 on a b cut agressor and thats it from the holeshot down the lake.so i say detailing is another one of those wise tales it worked for 2-3 people so its perfect for all.if your pump does not slip dont worry.stage your boat start taking off let the pump load some then nail it watch the tach and feel the boat.you will gain nothing on top end by detailing dookie:D

[Taylorman]

My problem is there are not many jet boats that i hang with and i have only riden in two or three jet boats besides mine so i don't know what a good holeshot feels like. Im just trying to optimise what i have, not spend a fortune on others to do it for me. Maybe you can come for a ride in my boat next week Travis. Im just a hair slower than you. Im running 70-72 at 4800-4900 rpms.

[Jet Hydro]

You forgot to mention that your "1200 HP" drag boat runs the 1/4 mile in 11 seconds ..... that's nothing to be proud of.
guess you should be at more races ;)

[hotbo]

love to taylorman.the problem is alot of guys on here are talking drag boats we have lake boats!!!!!!!not all the same crap works good for our power output.that is a good speed.im hoping when i can get my pump to load right i will pick up a few and probably lose some rpm cuase right now i only have 8-10 psi pump pressure.so we will see.good luck see ya next week:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

love to taylorman.the problem is alot of guys on here are talking drag boats we have lake boats!!!!!!!not all the same crap works good for our power output.that is a good speed.im hoping when i can get my pump to load right i will pick up a few and probably lose some rpm cuase right now i only have 8-10 psi pump pressure.so we will see.good luck see ya next week:D
you mean intake pressure, retard:D

[hotbo]

you mean intake pressure, retard:D
blow it out your hinny hole retard.dont start over here with me:D yes intake pressure:idea:

[Taylorman]

So how to you change intake pressure if its to low or to high? I have a shoe kit for an e pump which is not adjustable.

[IMPATIENT 1]

So how to you change intake pressure if its to low or to high? I have a shoe kit for an e pump which is not adjustable.
kevin, the shoe kit is a raw material kit more or less. i had to take mine off twice and have my uncle mill some off till it felt like it had enough bite and gave enough lift without the harsh shut down side effects the e shoe kit is known for.i never had a intake pressure gauge on mine, but if i remember correctly it was setting @almost a full 1/4 above the keel line. travis is a sharp fella, he can give you more info on the actual intake psi readings.
has anyone else took pressure readings on epumps?????curious minds wanna know:D

[Jet Hydro]

make it adjustable and play with loaders....
BTW... I own and work on lake boats too ;) My lake boat is an SJ ...hummmm ;)

[IMPATIENT 1]

blow it out your hinny hole retard.dont start over here with me:D yes intake pressure:idea:
lol:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

make it adjustable and play with loaders....
BTW... I own and work on lake boats too ;) My lake boat is an SJ ...hummmm ;)
j.h., let's see some pics of it!!! i can't imagine you with a sj, s.o.b. have a big motor too?

[Devilman]

j.h., let's see some pics of it!!! i can't imagine you with a sj, s.o.b. have a big motor too?
I have seen pics of it here & read all the testing he was doing with it. Pretty cool, believe he took the insert pump out of it & went with a regular style Berkeley? Had it running pretty damn good too, if I remember right. :devil:
Here's one of the threads about it, not the one I was thinking of though.
SJ (http://www.***boat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=122460)

[Jet Hydro]

j.h., let's see some pics of it!!! i can't imagine you with a sj, s.o.b. have a big motor too?
Nothing real big just a 468 with 2 little 600`s on top.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497P1030603.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/208P1010503.JPG

[BigBlockOldsJet]

wow maybe I should get me one of them diverter things for my 1200 hp drag boat??? :idea: guess I`v been doing it wrong for all these years :rolleyes:
You forgot to mention that your "1200 HP" drag boat runs the 1/4 mile in 11 seconds ..... that's nothing to be proud of.
guess you should be at more races ;)
My bad, 10.90's

[Jet Hydro]

yea lets just say 10.90`s :D

[Rondane]

Im just trying to optimise what i have, not spend a fortune on others to do it for me.
THATS some funny shit right there taylorman. Maybe you should have tried one thing at a time rather than get carried away buying all that supertek stuff you really didnt need all at one time AND spending a fortune to do it. :D Just a thought.
rondane

[Taylorman]

THATS some funny shit right there taylorman. Maybe you should have tried one thing at a time rather than get carried away buying all that supertek stuff you really didnt need all at one time AND spending a fortune to do it. :D Just a thought.
rondane
Another successful waste of oxygen by you. How do you know what i bought and during what timeframe. I never bought a bunch of supertek stuff all at once.

[IMPATIENT 1]

Nothing real big just a 468 with 2 little 600`s on top.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497P1030603.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/208P1010503.JPG
swweeeett! i love sj's, wish i had kept mine:( i really dig the heavy flake green. got any bow shots of the scallops?

[hotbo]

well there are alot of ways to check pressures and alot of people tell you the best way nad you really need 2-3 pressure taps.but just for a reference point i drilled and tapped mine 1.5 behind wear ring land parellel with the shaft.this is a good starting point will give you very generall reference at waht you have going on inside there.im sure someone will argue my point:D but thats the way i do it to start with.then i will add more taps to play with the loader.i had a shoe kit i payed a zillion for another screwing i got from a unnamed source:jawdrop: .took it pff went faster remember you have a e- pump.another thing why in the hell would you put a back cut shoe on a e-pump taylor:idea: those things are designed for tunnel boats that have the weight in th ass.:D anyway if your boat likes it leave it alone,but maybe if you checked with it and without it you could see the difference.mayhbe helped or hurt.
always do 1 thing at a time.cannot stress this enough:sqeyes:
now as far as loaders we are talking e-pumps not insert pumps dont waste alot of money on different loader been there done that.if your pump is loading good.dont bother.just my 2 cents worth only cuase ive been there.spent that go fast money at b.s. companies and learned the hard way.remember guys we are talking about a taylor sj heavy 18ft boat not a cp tunnel or tx-19.altogether differernt worlds:D

[Rondane]

Another successful waste of oxygen by you. How do you know what i bought and during what timeframe. I never bought a bunch of supertek stuff all at once.
it doesnt matter the time frame, you bought a whole bunch of stuff you didnt need because it sounded good. Havent you learned yet? As hotbo said, If you tried on thing at a time, maybe you would have saved some money in the process and maybe even gone faster. My oxygen has alot of truth to it son. All that go fast stuff you have and your still in the dark. SHEESH!! Learn from this hotbo guy instead of a guy who just wants to take your money. As he says, spent your go fast money at BS companies only to run faster out of your money instead of faster with your boat. :D my .02
rondane

[djdtpr]

[/LIST] why in the hell would you put a back cut shoe on a e-pump taylor:idea: those things are designed for tunnel boats that have the weight in th ass
Not all tunnels need a back cut shoe i know of alot that are running tappered or flat shoes.Not argueing but to say tunnels only need backcut is wrong most gullwings like backcut also. I think it has alot to do with the bottom and engine placement or where the ballance is.
[/QUOTE]always do 1 thing at a time.cannot stress this enough[/QUOTE]
I totally agree there to many people seem to make to many changes and not know what made the difference rite wrong or indiference.

[hotbo]

Not all tunnels need a back cut shoe i know of alot that are running tappered or flat shoes.Not argueing but to say tunnels only need backcut is wrong most gullwings like backcut also. I think it has alot to do with the bottom and engine placement or where the ballance is.
always do 1 thing at a time.cannot stress this enough[/QUOTE]
I totally agree there to many people seem to make to many changes and not know what made the difference rite wrong or indiference.[/QUOTE]
well since were getting technical here.no not all tunnels gullwings or any boat likes has or wants any kinda certain shoe.my point was why in the hell would you put a back cut shoe on a taylor sj.:mad:.your exactly right aout the backcut shoe on other boats just trying to make a refernce point about tunnels.remeber hes asking for help on impeller detailing on a lake boat not a 100mph river racer or drag boat.:D dont waste the effort you will gain nothing on speed holeshot or anything for that matter other than beign able to walk around saying i have detailed impeller.when your trying to get a boat tuned in for tenths of seconds snd so forth yeah its worth it.but from what ican understand this is a lake boat and you take your family.save your money:hammer2:

[cyclone]

THATS some funny shit right there taylorman. Maybe you should have tried one thing at a time rather than get carried away buying all that supertek stuff you really didnt need all at one time AND spending a fortune to do it. :D Just a thought.
rondane
what are you? his step-dad? you sure spend entirely way too much time bitching about how much he and everyone else spends on their boat. Damn man, you are either pissed off that you don't have a boat or you're even more pissed off because you are paying for yours with food stamps. Who cares what order he modified his, who he paid for the service or how much he spent? if it makes him happy then shut your pie hole.

[cyclone]

Not all tunnels need a back cut shoe i know of alot that are running tappered or flat shoes.Not argueing but to say tunnels only need backcut is wrong most gullwings like backcut also. I think it has alot to do with the bottom and engine placement or where the ballance is.
always do 1 thing at a time.cannot stress this enough[/QUOTE]
I totally agree there to many people seem to make to many changes and not know what made the difference rite wrong or indiference.[/QUOTE]
danny is right. you cant make a blanket statement to say a back cut shoe is only for tunnel boats. the one thing i've learned is that nothing is certain when it comes to jet boats. when the hull is made of 'glass, every boat is different and just when you think you've figured something out with regards to hardware set up the boat is gonna smack you upside the head and tell you differently.
beyond that...i know a lot of v bottoms that benefit from back cut hardware.

[hotbo]

im not worthy to answer

[BigBlockOldsJet]

well im glad you put your worthless 2 cents in finally.:idea: im just rying to save him money and help which alot of you guys tend to forget to do when someone askes a question:mad: i have a taylor do you hell now so why dont you shut your piehole and treat people with alittle respect mr.know it all.:eek: and another damn thing if you know some damn much about boats why dont you answer the real question here big boy
impeller detailing is it worth the money to spend on his application not your or mine his boat.:confused: and as far as food stamps im not a loser are you.:devil:
Maybe you ought to re-read Cyclone's post, pay close attention to who he quoted. Either you can't read or you forgot to logout as Rondane before you posted.

[hotbo]

im from arkansas im not worthy.come on guys you can piss me off more than that.

[steelcomp]

i dont have to reread anything it was aimed at me at some point of the conversation:confused: regardless he ought to have damned respect for people.you know what you guys have got off the subject just like i have even earlier in the thread
he want our 2cents on impeller detailing not for abunch of us to argue about shoes loader and setups.so im sorry taylorman.:cool:
Cyclone's post wasn't directed at you at any point. Rondane has been on here for a long time, sticking his nose in, making stupid and sarcastic comments about things he knows nothing about, and people get real tired of it. You, with your 26 posts, don't know what's gong on here, so just stick to your pathetically amaturish advice, and you'll do just fine. Cyclone is probably one of the most respectful, and knowledgable guys on this site, and you need to learn who you're dissing, and who you're defending. Rondane is nothoing more than a waste of oxygen ad human tissue. You're not far behind.
As far as the thread, anything you can do to improve the effeciency of an impeller is going to make it work better, ie: better holeshot due to less cavitation. If it's not cavitating, it's still going to move more water, faster, which is still going to be an improvement. Will it be measurable and/or worth the $$? That in itself is going to be different with each and every boat, and you'll never know untill you try. Maybe you can borrow one and see, but typically, it's worht the $$.

[Pops@Aggressor]

[QUOTE=steelcomp;2635551]QUOTE] If something is in the way of water it will climb over, go around untill it can remove it. The problem is in doing so it diverts the rest of the flow pattern also. If you can see it or feel it take it out

[hotbo]

Cyclone's post wasn't directed at you at any point. Rondane has been on here for a long time, sticking his nose in, making stupid and sarcastic comments about things he knows nothing about, and people get real tired of it. You, with your 26 posts, don't know what's gong on here, so just stick to your pathetically amaturish advice, and you'll do just fine. Cyclone is probably one of the most respectful, and knowledgable guys on this site, and you need to learn who you're dissing, and who you're defending. Rondane is nothoing more than a waste of oxygen ad human tissue. You're not far behind.
As far as the thread, anything you can do to improve the effeciency of an impeller is going to make it work better, ie: better holeshot due to less cavitation. If it's not cavitating, it's still going to move more water, faster, which is still going to be an improvement. Will it be measurable and/or worth the $$? That in itself is going to be different with each and every boat, and you'll never know untill you try. Maybe you can borrow one and see, but typically, it's worht the $$.
me with my 26 posts:D so your f-----g speacial huh!!b/c you have 5000 plus post does this make you a proffesional.what im not competent enough to answer a qustion or argue a damned point.:idea: b/c i only have a 26 post.:eek: well lick my fat ass i must be stupid cause im from arkansas and not from cali:D
amature advice you got alot of nerve you dont even know me.yeah im sure with all the money it cost to detail an impeller that some so called jet shops youll tell a big diference:D lol!!!!.
i felt like cyclone was aiming it to me so if not i do apologize to you only cyclone my sincerest apology.:)
rodane dont know him but atleast he hasnt tried totell me how stupid i am like you have so from what i can see your the waste of air and space.:devil: well ifeel like that went rather well see if i can go piss another californian off on a different thread.cause you know us hicks we dont know much about jets do we.:)

[steelcomp]

LOL...I never said you were stupid...you did...twice. :notam:
'Course, you do write like a third grader.:)

[BigBlockOldsJet]

Rondane has finally stumbled and inadvertently posted a picture of his boat, look at hotbo/Rondane's avatar.

[Sleeper CP]

I have no idea if it is slipping but im sure theres room for improvement, this was just a question our of curiosity. I have a new AMT A impeller/ultimate wear ring and an inducer.
Hey Taylorman,
Curious statement. When you hit it(stick your foot through the floor) does it cavitate,slip or does it leave? With an A impeller and inducer and a low HP engine I would be suprised if it slips at all. It should just leave.
If it cavitates , then you should get your impeller's detailed. And regardless of what someone else posted, try a couple of different intake grates. I'm not talking about super high rpm top loaders ,but open ski grates or a mild performance grate. If you are running some sort of stock rock grate it could be having an affect. But answer my first question, Is it slipping, how much does it "flash" when you stomp on it?
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

LOL...I never said you were stupid...you did...twice. :notam:
'Course, you do write like a third grader.:)
Ouch;)

[Sleeper CP]

A different intake grate is going too do nothing for your hole shot, sorry. It wont help you much at all unless at high speeds. A impeller is not going to make a difference that much either. What will make a difference for a hole shot is a diverter, plain and simple. To be able to life your boat off plane faster and push it out quicker a diverter will make a huge difference.
Excuse me!! I'm no expert but, I don't have 8 intake grates,8 (MPD) shoes, and 12 shims and haven't learned anything from them. And OH, now my fourth Impeller and bowl combo that I pick up from Jack at MPD on Monday or Tuesday.
(Correction made after post: What does he mean by "Holeshot"? Getting on plane or once on plane leaving hard? I'm assumming he not drag racing this boat, so I'm guessing he means getting on plane) Someone correct me if I'm wrong, it wouldn't be the first time.
Even with a stock engine the bite that the impeller takes is huge. His boat maybe able to cavitate a B/C cut impeller, maybe even a A/B, but I would be suprised if it can slip a straight A. If it can he has some other issue's, like how it is getting water. And that is where the loader grates come into play. I asked him , because I don't see it in any of his post's " Is it slipping, or Cavaitating and how much does it flash when you stomp on it?"
I have open loaders and blockers, with angle iron and flat stock. 2 back cut shoes, and 6 flat shoes or various openings. Two inches of blocker makes a big difference on the hole shot of the boat. When skiing the 7 inch blocker takes alot more foot control to keep it from "spinning out" when pulling a skier up it will slip like crazy. The 5 inch blocker you can basically hit it and go. As a matter of fact with the 5 inch blocker in, the boat will pull two 180 lb. guys up in a snap. So yes, at least on my boat in my experience intake grates make a difference on the hole shot.
FYI: I'm not running alittle river racer, it's a heavy CP open bow gullwing ,it weighs 990 lbs with the pump and interior in, and 1,980 with gas ready to go. It is not the fastest boat at the river, but it is the fastest family stationwagon(8 passenger open bow ski boat) I've ever seen. It was running 100+ 14 yrs ago(1993). And it's a ski boat, it just happens to be able to haul the mail too. So to be able to pull skier's up, travel 14 miles up river to Picacho and back with 26 gallons of gas on board and go fast we made alot of compromises and did alot of running different combinations. Question for you : What does he mean by HoleShot? Getting on plane from a dead stop, or once on plane moving from there? As you said, a diverter could help him alot especially when just trying to get on plane. My own definition is "Holeshot" means after on plane. Plaining(sp) time is getting on plane, which does he mean?

[77charger]

When i had a jet i had jack at MPD do the impeller first made an improvementt and i think it cost about 150 back then.lowered the rpm and came out of hole better.Killed that impeller on a rockbar so went back and bought another but had the bowl vanes thinned down also.Bottom line was best 300 i ever spent on a jet this was no where near a race pump but what i consider basic must dos for a jet boat.after that i was bale to plane at a way lower rpm and if i had a steady foot on the gas mpg was very good.I ended up losing about 500 rpm but still had the same speed thru out the whole range.(well gained 2 mph)
but now since gone to props and v drives :D Just wish jack did props too.

[Sleeper CP]

So how to you change intake pressure if its to low or to high? I have a shoe kit for an e pump which is not adjustable.
Typically intake pressure is a top end MPH thing. It's the reason MPD has both my stainless Legand and AT impellers and both bowls. The intake pressure used to run at 28 psi at 92-93 mph with the a AT A3 impeller(9.25 dia) at 5,200 rpm's it would run at 38-40 psi at 103 mph /Nos at 6,400 rpm's. After doing that for a couple of seasons we finally pulled the ears back on end of the impeller blades(vaines). I guess they weren't designed to pull an A3 at 6,400 rpm (1,100 hp). So we switch to the 9.25 A2, damn boat never ran the same again. It would still run 102-103 on the bottle but off the bottle it would only run 88 mph at 5,600 and the intake pressure was now 22 psi.
We tried 4 different size reducers in the nozzel no big changes. Worked with that for 2 seasons and then switched to a Legend Bowl and Impeller, stainless A2. Now the damn thing turned 5,800 ran 88 mph with 18 psi of intakes pressure off the Nos and 102-103 on at 6,800 rpms.Needless to say now I'm really pissed off :mad: Then we quite going to the river 5 years ago. Decided if we are going back this year we'll get the pump right. Sent it to Jack at MPD 6 weeks ago. Wasn't in a rush to get it back so I told him to take his time. He called yesterday said" I can pick it up on Monday. " Engine should be on the dyno at end of the week. New engine combo should smoke old combo that made 855 at 6,600 with single carb on cast intake. New pump , new engine; the chase for the perfect set up starts all over again. Looking to be able to do mid to upper 90's off the bottle at 6,000. We'll see.
The pressure can be changed by , intake grates, shoes and nozzle reducers. Fooled with all three that's one of the reason's why we have so many pieces. And on our boat nothing made big impacts. We ran the shoe's from 1/8th inch up to 1/4" inch below the keel. It always ran best and saftest at 1/16 up. With a back cut or standard shoe. But no big changes so that's why MPD has both of my pumps.
As others have said" Make one change at a time", but sometimes you have to start over like my brother and I have. But I don't think your on the same journey we are on.
Sleeper CP

[FOURQ]

wow..... ALL THE SHIT SLINGING IN HERE IS FUNNY.. The only .05 cents I am going to throw in here Hotbo is that it doesn't matter if its the same boat out of the same mold 9 out of 10 times the hardware setup is going to be different. you may have great knowledge with your boat but that doesn't mean it will work on someone else's boat EVEN IF IT IS A SJ....
as far a detailed impellew working yes but DO NOT TRY IT YOURSELF HAVE A PRO DO IT.

[BigBlockOldsJet]

You, with your 26 posts, don't know what's gong on here
SC, at this time hotbo only has 24, hopefully we won't see 25

[pw_Tony]

Let's go ahead and scare away a guy with a useful opinion/experience:mad:

[steelcomp]

SC, at this time hotbo only has 24, hopefully we won't see 25That's funny...I was wondering if anyone would catch that. :D

[hotbo]

WHAT ELSE CAN YOU BOYS THROW OUT THERE CAUSE IM HERE WITH MY FAT ASS READY TO ROCK AND ROLL.WISH I WAS CLOSER WE COULD REALLY DO SOME TRASH TALKING hell id buy the beer and you guys could tell me how me and rodane are nothing:D LOVE YOU GUYS FALKER OUT HOTBO/RODANE LOL!!!!!LOL!!! YOU CAN DO BETTER GUYS:devil:

[BigBlockOldsJet]

you fags are going to have to do better than this to run me off.;) everyone told me you guys were a bunch of assholes over here and hell they were right.:D well im a asshole to so I think ill stick around and post my 3rd grade writing ability and my amature knowledge.:boxingguy hell i eat this shit up what else do you know it alls have left for me and rodane:D i like that hotbo/rodane well hell atleast im sumbody know.obtw this is maybe my 25 post you shit heads upset know:hammer2:
the reason iwas trying to help him with his sj is i listened and typed to this b.s on other sites listend to the know it alls of the lake sandbars or in arky we have big freaking rock bars anyway people will lie about there speeds ect, what they have and really screw with your head about your boat.he has a e pump not the same shit works for us like you guys shit does.
but since then you ****ers have decided to pick on me so im having fun know.if you dont like my post i dont care if the world was perfect you would be all the time to.
WHAT ELSE CAN YOU BOYS THROW OUT THERE CAUSE IM HERE WITH MY FAT ASS READY TO ROCK AND ROLL.WISH I WAS CLOSER WE COULD REALLY DO SOME TRASH TALKING hell id buy the beer and you guys could tell me how me and rodane are nothing:D LOVE YOU GUYS FALKER OUT HOTBO/RODANE LOL!!!!!LOL!!! YOU CAN DO BETTER GUYS:devil:
English translation:
Mommy, they're picking on me

[cyclone]

hotbo- my post wasn't for you, it was for Rondane.
the bottom line here is that there is a ton of not so good advice dished out on this forum. There is also some very good advice if you listen hard enough.
if guys like Rondane would stop pushing his personal agenda on others long enough to actually contribute some INFORMATION, this place would be a lot better off and the guys that are really testing parts consistently and learning about what makes a jet pump work might post a bit more often.
I spend a shit load of money at the race track to test parts on my boat and learn how it reacts just to make it run better. Does that make myself or the other racers on this forum doing the same thing any better than anyone else? No. but when they take the time to donate their hard-earned information to others, it would behoove people to drop their personal bs and just listen instead of bashing someone for asking a question or spending money on their boat.

[hotbo]

English translation:
Mommy, they're picking on me
is this your attempt to make me like you more its working:D
apparently i have stirred up a hornest nest this is fun.;)
yes ive told my mommy and shes mad:idea:
i thought your intelligance was on my 3rd grade level welcome to my world bro lol!!!! see ya on the other side:D

[hotbo]

cyclone i agree im trying to tell him things ive been doing on my sj.no not all are the same but i do have a sj with e-pump and he does to.ive been testing combos for months now thats all .then wamo i took something wrong and the troops are on me like stink on shit:D

[BigBlockOldsJet]

is this your attempt to make me like you more its working:D
apparently i have stirred up a hornest nest this is fun.;)
yes ive told my mommy and shes mad:idea:
i thought your intelligance was on my 3rd grade level welcome to my world bro lol!!!! see ya on the other side:D
hotbo, it's all good.
As Cyclone stated, there are many contributors on this board that share great information, but on the other hand there are a selected few that personally attack individuals for spending money on their project.

[hotbo]

well thanks for being nice:D yeah i dont know the hole story on all this crap with a select few.:devil:
i have been screwed time and time again by certain people with my boat so i know how it feels to waste money.:jawdrop:
if his pump is not cavitating i personally feel he will see very little difference with the money he will spend on detaling his impeller.these are things people wont or they are to damned stupid to tell you.if you have a good holeshot and are not cavitating use this money on other upgrades is all im trying to say.so finally i hope you guys will accept my 3rd grade knowldege and let me try to help and i will have many questions of my own also.:D later travis

[cyclone]

if the leading edges of Taylormans impeller are dull then yes his boat will benefit from having the impeller detailed. does he need a full blown race job done on both the front and back side of the impeller? nope.
but even if his pump is not cavitating, the boat will get out of the hole quicker if those leading edges of the impeller are nice and sharp no matter how little horsepower he's got. The better "bite" on the water the front of the impeller has, the better the holeshot. This is the first mod i'd make to any jet pump if you care about how it runs. Fix the impeller, make sure the clearances are good and tight between it and wear ring too. And remember, once the wear ring is installed into the suction housing, the odds of it being perfectly round are almost zero. So setting the clearnaces up too tight (less than .025 for a river boat) is a waste of time.

[Sleeper CP]

TaylorMan,
Still wondering what you mean by "holeshot" ? Pulling skiers up from a dead stop, or acceleration after you have rolled over on plane? And do you "blow out" the pump when you hit it?
Sleeper CP

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

everyone told me you guys were a bunch of assholes over here and hell they were right
Hey bro, not everyone is an asshole over here. Alot of the guys that are giving input have rides that run 100mph or over. They have done alot of work to get where they are at. Some may come across better than others and some come across as jerks but they are great peeps. I have done alot of business and learned alot from these guys. Trust me, you have to get to know how they are. They are a bunch of different books and need to be read differently;)
WHAT ELSE CAN YOU BOYS THROW OUT THERE CAUSE IM HERE WITH MY FAT ASS READY TO ROCK AND ROLL.WISH I WAS CLOSER WE COULD REALLY DO SOME TRASH TALKING hell id buy the beer and you guys could tell me how me and rodane are nothing:D LOVE YOU GUYS FALKER OUT HOTBO/RODANE LOL!!!!!LOL!!! YOU CAN DO BETTER GUYS:devil:
This wouldnt be the best way to earn a good rep on here. Alot of people read this stuff. You never know what these guys have to offer. Im not picking on you by any means. Im just trying to get you to understand whats going on in here. Its your decision to take my advice or not. Whatever you choose to do have a great time;)
Spitter

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

it doesnt matter the time frame, you bought a whole bunch of stuff you didnt need because it sounded good. Havent you learned yet? As hotbo said, If you tried on thing at a time, maybe you would have saved some money in the process and maybe even gone faster. My oxygen has alot of truth to it son. All that go fast stuff you have and your still in the dark. SHEESH!! Learn from this hotbo guy instead of a guy who just wants to take your money. As he says, spent your go fast money at BS companies only to run faster out of your money instead of faster with your boat. :D my .02
rondane
You do have a point to a certian extent. But tell me this, have you ever spent $$ on something and never seen anything out of it?? Lets take a msd ignition for instance. I have been running them for years. If I swap back to an old school HEI, would I see a drop in performance in a lake boat:idea: Why did I run a MSD ignition setup? because EVERBODY runs on at the races. That will tell you something:idea:
A shoe doesnt always help a holeshot but in most cases it does! I just did a shoe on 460's boat and the holeshot was better and it handled like a dream. The boat rides drier and doesnt porpoise like it did.

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

well there are alot of ways to check pressures and alot of people tell you the best way nad you really need 2-3 pressure taps
Very ture
.i had a shoe kit i payed a zillion for another screwing i got from a unnamed source:jawdrop: .took it pff went faster remember you have a e- pump.another thing why in the hell would you put a back cut shoe on a e-pump taylor:idea:
Did you try different shoes,shoe depths,mouth openings,etc? Maybe you had the wrong setup.If your going to talk about getting screwed then lay it on the table. Dont have us guessing. If thats the case then dont ever mention it.....
now as far as loaders we are talking e-pumps not insert pumps dont waste alot of money on different loader been there done that.if your pump is loading good.dont bother.just my 2 cents worth only cuase ive been there.spent that go fast money at b.s. companies and learned the hard way.remember guys we are talking about a taylor sj heavy 18ft boat not a cp tunnel or tx-19.altogether differernt worlds
If you actually do a search you will find that someone on here has a taylor that hauls azz!!! E pumps take more $$ than a b,c,g pump. Hell even the diverter for them is more $$$. But dont think that they wont move water. Maybe he needs more hp:idea: Has anyone ever mentioned that???
another thing why in the hell would you put a back cut shoe on a e-pump taylor:idea: those things are designed for tunnel boats that have the weight in th ass.
Thats NOT true by any means! I ran a 2* backcut in my kachina and it was a night and day difference. Backcuts are designed to create tail lift PERIOD. Tapered hardware are designed to carry the bow. I would try both because shoes are cheap. I thinkl $100 in shoes arent a waste of $$. Hell my bar tab is 5 times that much on a saturday night;)

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

Not all tunnels need a back cut shoe i know of alot that are running tappered or flat shoes..
Yup! Dan Nelsons world record tunnel ran a flat shoe;)
Not argueing but to say tunnels only need backcut is wrong most gullwings like backcut also. I think it has alot to do with the bottom and engine placement or where the ballance is.
Also it depends where and how you boat. Where we boat a backcut shoe will get you hurt at my lake. I have to run a tapered shoe because the water is so bad out here. If I was in parker or big river then I would be all over a backcut;)
I totally agree there to many people seem to make to many changes and not know what made the difference rite wrong or indiference.
I agree 100% here. I have made alot of changes before and never knew what worked or not. Was I mad? hell naw, i was having fun installing new hardware:D Now I will be running pressure guages to verify how my changes work;)

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

what are you? his step-dad? you sure spend entirely way too much time bitching about how much he and everyone else spends on their boat. Damn man, you are either pissed off that you don't have a boat or you're even more pissed off because you are paying for yours with food stamps. Who cares what order he modified his, who he paid for the service or how much he spent? if it makes him happy then shut your pie hole.
Damn, look at Mike getn' all frisky like them videos you sent me :D :D

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

\
beyond that...i know a lot of v bottoms that benefit from back cut hardware.
Yes sir! Mine sure did;)

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

BLA BLA BLA...... all this from a guy that buys used shoes on ebay.....
Yup and gave you tha boot to tha chest :D
How ya been sucka? Havent seen ya lately.

[bp]

TaylorMan,
Still wondering what you mean by "holeshot" ? Pulling skiers up from a dead stop, or acceleration after you have rolled over on plane? And do you "blow out" the pump when you hit it?
Sleeper CP
don't know what his definition is, but from my perspective, it's how the boat reacts when you plant your foot from a dead stop.
Yup! Dan Nelsons world record tunnel ran a flat shoe
yes, but do you know why? did you ever see that boat run? not trying to bust your chops. that boat was heavy and set up very conservatively, overcoming the conservative setup with massive power.

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

Still stirrin...
when is that new lump of yours actually going to be on the water......
I see that:D
Im getting very close. My pocket was hurting for a few months:cry: now im getting back into the swing of thngs:) Next month for sure;)

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

yes, but do you know why? did you ever see that boat run? not trying to bust your chops. that boat was heavy and set up very conservatively, overcoming the conservative setup with massive power.
he told me but I dont remember. Me and Dan talked about shoes for about an hour last month. He said so much I dont remember much because he said so much.
Hows the boat running? You ran good at firebird. You were making more passes than most lakeboats do at the lake :D

[bp]

yea lets just say 10.90`s :D
so steve, you racing this thing anywhere this year? M.E.? marble falls? sitc? world finals???

[Jet Hydro]

so steve, you racing this thing anywhere this year? M.E.? marble falls? sitc? world finals???Long story so I`ll make it quick
My oldest kid got real sick last year right after Brick Town, you may have read about her in DBR last month
so I stepped back for a while to pay some bills. I should show up somewhere but I dont know just where yet. The new motor is done but I just have to think of her first. I`m not sure what class I`m gonna run as I`m still trying to get the one big pass in yet,
then I`ll go back to racing.

[Jet Hydro]

Hey Taylorman
:idea: Bring your boat to my shop and we can fix the problem ;)

[bp]

Long story so I`ll make it quick
My oldest kid got real sick last year right after Brick Town, you may have read about her in DBR last month
so I stepped back for a while to pay some bills. I should show up somewhere but I dont know just where yet. The new motor is done but I just have to think of her first. I`m not sure what class I`m gonna run as I`m still trying to get the one big pass in yet,
then I`ll go back to racing.
now that you reminded me, yes i do remember reading about her. hope she is doing better. i'd go re-read the article, but all my old dbr's are at home in lhc...
look forward to seein ya out there sometime. from what i recall, it sounded like she would like that too...

[Taylorman]

TaylorMan,
Still wondering what you mean by "holeshot" ? Pulling skiers up from a dead stop, or acceleration after you have rolled over on plane? And do you "blow out" the pump when you hit it?
Sleeper CP
I started this post just out of curiosity, i never said my pump was cavitating or was not. Fact is i dont know.
I had a few hours to myself today so i went on a looooooooooooooooooong boat ride down the river today and wrote down all my observations.
I cant say if my pump is cavitating or not but heres what i can say.
I have a 375ish hp 455. Turns 4750 rpms and runs 70. Brand new AMT A imp with inducer. Today i did many holeshot starts from a dead stop and from a slow rolling start. When i mash the gas, rpms go up to about 4900 then in a second or two settle back down to 4750.
Thats the best data i can come up with to determine if im cavitating or not.

[Jet Hydro]

If your already running 70 save your money and time for playing in the family boat, you are doing fine.
Can it go faster? :idea: Yes, but you seem to be happy so save the money for gas ;)

[Jet Hydro]

now that you reminded me, yes i do remember reading about her. hope she is doing better. i'd go re-read the article, but all my old dbr's are at home in lhc...
look forward to seein ya out there sometime. from what i recall, it sounded like she would like that too... Yes she`s looking forward to our next race. I havent even had the drag car out so she`s kinda up in my butt these days ....lol

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

I started this post just out of curiosity, i never said my pump was cavitating or was not. Fact is i dont know.
I had a few hours to myself today so i went on a looooooooooooooooooong boat ride down the river today and wrote down all my observations.
I cant say if my pump is cavitating or not but heres what i can say.
I have a 375ish hp 455. Turns 4750 rpms and runs 70. Brand new AMT A imp with inducer. Today i did many holeshot starts from a dead stop and from a slow rolling start. When i mash the gas, rpms go up to about 4900 then in a second or two settle back down to 4750.
Thats the best data i can come up with to determine if im cavitating or not.
70with a 455 in a taylor and low hp? I personally think your doing an excellent job;) I would drive the schit out of it this summer and save the coin for more hp next year;) Hp=speed;)

[hotbo]

If your already running 70 save your money and time for playing in the family boat, you are doing fine.
Can it go faster? :idea: Yes, but you seem to be happy so save the money for gas ;)
:D thats what ive been trying to tell everyone.
as far as my boat all my buisness was with a company out of kansas.dont get me started.hell yes i was getting picked on only becuase i was voiceing my opinoin on what to do.
well lets let this dog lye why dont we ibeen straightened out and we all now how i feel about it so forget it:D
i dont have enough fingers to type what ive been doing with my boat.ill tell ya this though im running 73-74 with a 500 horse motor and my pump on top is cavitating horrible im getting me a loader made for it and my nozzle machined for a bushing insert. scotts marine out of hot springs ar,has been helping me.for those of you that dont know him his dad is jack seastrum a very well know and knowlegable jet man was there to report on the very first tri-hull youngblood to be ran on the arkansas river.his son is scott seastrum races in the circuit and so forth has a jet shop for 30 years and nows exactly what hes doing hes the one got me back on track and away from the b.s. you read and are told.i do know a thing or 2 ABOUT JETS MY OLE MAN HAS HAD THEM SINCE THE 70S.PLUS SOME V-DRIVES IM YOUNG ONLY 29 BUT AM WILLING IN EVERY WAY TO HELP WITH WHAT I DO NO AND WHAT I DONT KNOW.:D .you guys do know what your talking about.never ever once will i argue that with you at any time.;) im telling my experince with my sj and trying to help another feller thats all.like i said i hope i can help and i hope you will help me when i have a question.my dad has original jbn youngblood 79 tx-19 we just got finished with.the motor is a roller stroker that i built dynoed at 719hp.and we are having a very tough time getting it to hook outta the hole so i might need some advice later on this issue.but for now taylorman has a question so i answered the way i feel he has a amt impeller which is pretty good outta the box.save your money.hope you guys will grow to like me alittle better i mean no harm just play and when attacked i attack back later travis.:D

[bp]

I started this post just out of curiosity, i never said my pump was cavitating or was not. Fact is i dont know.
I had a few hours to myself today so i went on a looooooooooooooooooong boat ride down the river today and wrote down all my observations.
I cant say if my pump is cavitating or not but heres what i can say.
I have a 375ish hp 455. Turns 4750 rpms and runs 70. Brand new AMT A imp with inducer. Today i did many holeshot starts from a dead stop and from a slow rolling start. When i mash the gas, rpms go up to about 4900 then in a second or two settle back down to 4750.
Thats the best data i can come up with to determine if im cavitating or not.
from that, i'd say you are not cavitating. if it were me, and i wanted more out of it, i'd have the impellers and bowl blueprinted, and the A impeller cut to an AB. or, just drive it the way it is...
he told me but I dont remember. Me and Dan talked about shoes for about an hour last month. He said so much I dont remember much because he said so much.
Hows the boat running? You ran good at firebird. You were making more passes than most lakeboats do at the lake .
thanks for askin', yes we went around in circles down there for awhile.. boat's running just fine, just gotta get the driver to drive better - these first loser (runnerups) deals are getting old... 17 passes down there, probably another 26 since then. trying to get staged for the next one in oregon.
when talking about setup, there are a couple things to keep in mind. loose is good, but boats -generally- contine to get looser and looser (rise further and further out of the water) as speed increases. the ideal is to get a boat on top of the water at as low a speed as possible, and then have it remain hooked up with good conservative attitude at top speed. we can be much more aggressive for lift with a boat that tops out at 80, then we can with a boat that's going to run 130-140-150. if the intended top speed is up in those regions, "quick on top" isn't something a lot of time is initially spent improving; the greater concern is correct attitude, lift, and connection at top speed, and the ability to shutdown in a relatively safe manner. once you are there, then you can work on very small changes to quicken the boat, but every change is made with conscious deliberation about top end effect.
for every change that's made, there is a consequence; i.e., a positive and negative effect. these need to be well thought out; what are we looking to gain? where will this change have an adverse impact, and what will it be? the key is in knowing what the negative could be with any change, and minimizing it.
some guys talk about "one change at a time", which is, basically, a great concept. however, some changes by their nature will have an undesireable negative consequence unless other adjustments are made, either at the same time, or in further testing. an example, without mentioning any names; a guy installs a non-blueprinted inducer, makes one pass that loses a little et, and pulls it out. that's not even a test; it's simply proving that, with the setup which was already in the boat, the inducer had a negative impact. how do we know what the correct opening, depth, or angle of a shoe might be? another example; we move an engine forward 2", and the boat slows down. initial reaction is to put it back, but what have we proven? with the same setup, of course the boat will slow down with the c/g changed like that.
these are just things to think about. as somebody else mentioned, all these boats are different, requiring subtle differences in setup. but concluding a change is "no good" by itself, with no attempt to make other adjustments, will result in no progress...

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

from that, i'd say you are not cavitating. if it were me, and i wanted more out of it, i'd have the impellers and bowl blueprinted, and the A impeller cut to an AB. or, just drive it the way it is...
thanks for askin', yes we went around in circles down there for awhile.. boat's running just fine, just gotta get the driver to drive better - these first loser (runnerups) deals are getting old... 17 passes down there, probably another 26 since then. trying to get staged for the next one in oregon.
when talking about setup, there are a couple things to keep in mind. loose is good, but boats -generally- contine to get looser and looser (rise further and further out of the water) as speed increases. the ideal is to get a boat on top of the water at as low a speed as possible, and then have it remain hooked up with good conservative attitude at top speed. we can be much more aggressive for lift with a boat that tops out at 80, then we can with a boat that's going to run 130-140-150. if the intended top speed is up in those regions, "quick on top" isn't something a lot of time is initially spent improving; the greater concern is correct attitude, lift, and connection at top speed, and the ability to shutdown in a relatively safe manner. once you are there, then you can work on very small changes to quicken the boat, but every change is made with conscious deliberation about top end effect.
for every change that's made, there is a consequence; i.e., a positive and negative effect. these need to be well thought out; what are we looking to gain? where will this change have an adverse impact, and what will it be? the key is in knowing what the negative could be with any change, and minimizing it.
some guys talk about "one change at a time", which is, basically, a great concept. however, some changes by their nature will have an undesireable negative consequence unless other adjustments are made, either at the same time, or in further testing. an example, without mentioning any names; a guy installs a non-blueprinted inducer, makes one pass that loses a little et, and pulls it out. that's not even a test; it's simply proving that, with the setup which was already in the boat, the inducer had a negative impact. how do we know what the correct opening, depth, or angle of a shoe might be? another example; we move an engine forward 2", and the boat slows down. initial reaction is to put it back, but what have we proven? with the same setup, of course the boat will slow down with the c/g changed like that.
these are just things to think about. as somebody else mentioned, all these boats are different, requiring subtle differences in setup. but concluding a change is "no good" by itself, with no attempt to make other adjustments, will result in no progress...
Good post Bob;)

[Sleeper CP]

III have a 375ish hp 455. Turns 4750 rpms and runs 70. Brand new AMT A imp with inducer. Today i did many holeshot starts from a dead stop and from a slow rolling start. When i mash the gas, rpms go up to about 4900 then in a second or two settle back down to 4750.
Thats the best data i can come up with to determine if im cavitating or not.
TaylorMan,
I don't know what the other guys will call it,but where I'm from we call that "flash" not cavitation I think my 11 year old knows the dif.
Anyway, since you don't have a hi performance boat, don't worry about it you are doing fine. Save your money.
Sleeper CP

[hotbo]

well on the e-pump we have no shoe to shim move around so forth.all you have avalibale is the shoe kit that someone sells in kansas.it hangs down below kell well atleast mine did almost a 3/8 of a inch.i have always thought and been taught never ever have anything below kell.now i no some boats have shoes loaders ect.hanging below keel that work just fine.my boat hated it.i do not intend on bashing any one company on this site.therefore i refrain form naming names.:D
you can get a e-pump to load quite effectivley with out the shoe.the back cut shoe that you bolt on the e-pump is suppose to help lift the ass of the boat up while blocking and loading the pump.now all the e-pumps are set in boats different from what ive been around with my little experince and what ive been told by shoemaker,hi-tech,big a performance and pro boats in georgia.yes i do talk to everyone on the phone about issues and so forth.my idea is ask everyone and find your way threw the b.s. lines and try to make sense of something.i know of a few sjs that have run well into the 80s with the e-pumps less the so called great add on shoe kit.:) yes i agree with the one thing at a time will have a positive and negative sometimes but it is nice to now what the negative is when there is a positive,without guessing and pulling your hair out all the time.atleast it s for me.:idea:

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

well on the e-pump we have no shoe to shim move around so forth.all you have avalibale is the shoe kit that someone sells in kansas.it hangs down below kell well atleast mine did almost a 3/8 of a inch.i have always thought and been taught never ever have anything below kell.now i no some boats have shoes loaders ect.hanging below keel that work just fine.my boat hated it.i do not intend on bashing any one company on this site.therefore i refrain form naming names.:D
you can get a e-pump to load quite effectivley with out the shoe.the back cut shoe that you bolt on the e-pump is suppose to help lift the ass of the boat up while blocking and loading the pump.now all the e-pumps are set in boats different from what ive been around with my little experince and what ive been told by shoemaker,hi-tech,big a performance and pro boats in georgia.yes i do talk to everyone on the phone about issues and so forth.my idea is ask everyone and find your way threw the b.s. lines and try to make sense of something.i know of a few sjs that have run well into the 80s with the e-pumps less the so called great add on shoe kit.:) yes i agree with the one thing at a time will have a positive and negative sometimes but it is nice to now what the negative is when there is a positive,without guessing and pulling your hair out all the time.atleast it s for me.:idea:
Now your on the right track;) You will get better responses for sure after everyone reads this;)
Spitter

[bp]

well on the e-pump we have no shoe to shim move around so forth.all you have avalibale is the shoe kit that someone sells in kansas.it hangs down below kell well atleast mine did almost a 3/8 of a inch.i have always thought and been taught never ever have anything below kell.now i no some boats have shoes loaders ect.hanging below keel that work just fine.my boat hated it.i do not intend on bashing any one company on this site.therefore i refrain form naming names.:D
you can get a e-pump to load quite effectivley with out the shoe.the back cut shoe that you bolt on the e-pump is suppose to help lift the ass of the boat up while blocking and loading the pump.now all the e-pumps are set in boats different from what ive been around with my little experince and what ive been told by shoemaker,hi-tech,big a performance and pro boats in georgia.yes i do talk to everyone on the phone about issues and so forth.my idea is ask everyone and find your way threw the b.s. lines and try to make sense of something.i know of a few sjs that have run well into the 80s with the e-pumps less the so called great add on shoe kit.:) yes i agree with the one thing at a time will have a positive and negative sometimes but it is nice to now what the negative is when there is a positive,without guessing and pulling your hair out all the time.atleast it s for me.:idea:
difficult to find the question out of all this. if you're installing a shoe with the "biting edge" 3/8" below keel centerline, the positive effect is that you'll load the pump much harder. the negative effect is, that far below keel centerline, you'll increase suction pressure to the point the boat is slower than it was, and it may not react well when the engine dies at top speed. if you can maintain positive suction pressure without adding depth, why add depth? the answer to that question is; to increase lift. but if you offset the potential benefit of increased lift by loading the pump too hard. it's not that the eshoe wont' work; but it doesn't increase performance the way you had it installed. this stuff isn't easy; easy is turning a key, driving a boat, and never thinking about it...
if you talk to 5 different pros, from wherever, you'll get 5 different answers, based on how your question was posed and how what they heard (if the same sentence is repeated over and over to different people, they'll all hear something different). but each one would basically "do" the same things in person; watch the boat run, gather data, make changes the information tells them is warranted. and, some are better at it than others, some are better with certain boat types than others, which is just the way it is. there is no magic elixer.
TaylorMan,
I don't know what the other guys will call it,but where I'm from we call that "flash" not cavitation I think my 11 year old knows the dif.
Anyway, since you don't have a hi performance boat, don't worry about it you are doing fine. Save your money.
Sleeper CP
propellers flash, pumps cavitate. if your 11 year old has a BSME, emphasizing fluid flow and thermodynamics, then perhaps the difference is apparent. on the other hand, why not just keep the condescending 11 year old comments to yourself...

[hotbo]

all i know is i paid 300 dollars for the damn gift to e-pumps and wamo my boat tried to kill me several times:eek: i got a major porpoise like really bad so bad when i would try to drive threw it and let off finally after no resolvement it would nose dive so bad the bow would go under water and slam my ass into the dash so hard it bruised my ribs and broke my dash supports.so i called around oh well you need to do this and do that so i did and wmao same shit.called back buy this buy that.:D yeah i did.lotta money later i found out that i was crazy took it off with the advice of my ole man and scotts marine.i gained 3 miles hour and i can let go at top speed and let off rides like a dream and sets good. i straightend my bottom this winter we have abody shop my ole man been in the buisness for 40 years ive been there ever since i can remember i love body work.any way just telling you i can make a bottom straight.after all this and money i was told it was my fualt the shoe wont work bring it to there shop and for 500 a day theyll fix my screw up.can yu figure why im so pissed:idea: i have a straight snoot i would like to stick up someones ass and preferably not mine cause i had to dig it out after i bought it:D you know maybe i could have shaved it down but to the advice of someone i trust more than words will allow i can fix my pump feeding problem without killing my self.i was also told if i had more horsepower i could use the shoe kit.so basically i need to spend 10000 dollars to make my shoe kit work right. i dont think so.im trying to dial in what i have like taylorman with what little power i have and so far im doing alright i think,:) nothing is like having more horsepower no matter what,but in my 3rd grade skull get the best with what you have and you never know it just might be alright till you get your ass smoked then all hell breaks lose again.later travis

[IMPATIENT 1]

lol, i just checked this thread. :D :D
trav, you still stirring up shiat bro:D just keep in mind, truth is hard to hear sometimes.

[hotbo]

hell ya thats me bro how did the boat do.:confused:
i think they are starting to fall in love after all the bickering:D lol!!

[IMPATIENT 1]

didn't go out. i chilled with the kids most of the day, tinkered on the tx some.ballgames mon & tues, so maybe i'll get her wet wed after work. sounds mean, the blower surge idle gives me wood:D :devil:

[Sleeper CP]

propellers flash, pumps cavitate. if your 11 year old has a BSME, emphasizing fluid flow and thermodynamics, then perhaps the difference is apparent. on the other hand, why not just keep the condescending 11 year old comments to yourself...
A little touchy are we? Point being BP, you have to expect some "slip" particulary(sp) from a dead stop. If the pump "flashes" only 150 rpm's and can catch itself without "back peddling" he doesn't have a cavitation problem, and if it catches itself in a second that's just normal isn't it?
I'm just getting back to my boat after four seasons off, but I didn't realize that someone invented a traction control no-slip launch system for jet pumps. Can you tell me where I can get one?:rolleyes: I would love to slam my foot into 855 hp from a dead stop and have the boat leap 20 feet out of the water:D :D :D That would be realy cool.
Maybe it's just me, but I differentiate(sp) from typical "slip/flash" to full blown cavitation where you have to back-peddle to get it to hook-up. Or maybe you can tell me is "back-peddle" the correct word?
Sleeper CP

[IMPATIENT 1]

I would love to slam my foot into 855 hp from a dead stop and have the boat leap 20 feet out of the water That would be realy cool.
they call those kinda boats, vdrives;) :D

[Sleeper CP]

I would love to slam my foot into 855 hp from a dead stop and have the boat leap 20 feet out of the water That would be realy cool.
they call those kinda boats, vdrives;) :D
Yes, I guess they do. ;) ;) Thanks for reminding me.
Sleeper CP

[IMPATIENT 1]

Yes, I guess they do. ;) ;) Thanks for reminding me.
Sleeper CP
seriously though , i get what your sayin. as soon as someones invents a impellor that'll hook up like a vdrive, that person will make millions!!!!!!!!!!
i've got a similar hull as yours, just fired up the fresh blown 475 last nite and i'm wondering how well yours hooks up? i set the pump up tight with a bcut(dom pump) and have 800+hp pushing the condor tx-19(lightened hull, weighs @380-400lbs now)

[Sleeper CP]

seriously though , i get what your sayin. as soon as someones invents a impellor that'll hook up like a vdrive, that person will make millions!!!!!!!!!!
i'm wondering how well yours hooks up?condor tx-19(lightened hull, weighs @380-400lbs now)
Well, I'm going to assume you mean from a roll-over river race start: It leaves f''ing hard. Since the hull weighs 780 lbs. bare my brother and I never expected it to leave as hard as light race boats. That is one reason we have always used A2 or larger impellers. Jack at MPD just re-worked my A2 Legend I think he settled on a A+ cut. But, some years back I took my father for a ride in it for the first time. He is an "old" drag race guy and had a couple of 12 sec. street cars. I turned on the Nos 'rolled over on plane and asked him if he was holding on he said " yeah why?" I mashed the throttle ; waited 1/2 second and hit the button, he almost flipped over the back of the front seat!
And he isn't the only person that I've done that to... the answer to your question is : From a rolling start it leaves like a bullet. No slip, no cavitaion, just bite and go ( Oh I might get corrected on that:rolleyes: Where's BP anyway? ). I hope the new pump exceeds what we used to do.
Sleeper CP

[IMPATIENT 1]

780lbs? is yours a gullwing or tunnel? my man. listed hull weight is 450lbs. i removed the floor,ski box and everything else i could, so i think its weighs @50-70lbs lighter. i wish i knew how ervin capps figured hull wieght for the condors. i assume its what comes outta the mold with floor/ski box unrigged? not sure:confused: when i had the boat hulled down 3months ago, i could pick the boat up off the trailer in the back, could pick up the frt too. i'm a skinny 170lb 6ft1 fella:D

[bp]

A little touchy are we? Point being BP, you have to expect some "slip" particulary(sp) from a dead stop. If the pump "flashes" only 150 rpm's and can catch itself without "back peddling" he doesn't have a cavitation problem, and if it catches itself in a second that's just normal isn't it?
I'm just getting back to my boat after four seasons off, but I didn't realize that someone invented a traction control no-slip launch system for jet pumps. Can you tell me where I can get one?:rolleyes: I would love to slam my foot into 855 hp from a dead stop and have the boat leap 20 feet out of the water:D :D :D That would be realy cool.
Maybe it's just me, but I differentiate(sp) from typical "slip/flash" to full blown cavitation where you have to back-peddle to get it to hook-up. Or maybe you can tell me is "back-peddle" the correct word?
Sleeper CP
not touchy at all. the sarcasm isn't necessary. and yes, i can slam the throttle from a dead stop to top rpm without any cavitation at all, bowl pressure just rises, and i know several others that can do the same. and yes, we are fairly close in hp, but tossing numbers around is gay. next time you see jack, ask him if your boat is heavier than mine. and, if you're feelin confident, maybe you'd like to drag it to oregon, marble falls, ming, or perhaps the world finals and see what you can do with it...

[steelcomp]

Well, I'm going to assume you mean from a roll-over river race start: It leaves f''ing hard. Since the hull weighs 780 lbs. bare my brother and I never expected it to leave as hard as light race boats. That is one reason we have always used A2 or larger impellers. Jack at MPD just re-worked my A2 Legend I think he settled on a A+ cut. But, some years back I took my father for a ride in it for the first time. He is an "old" drag race guy and had a couple of 12 sec. street cars. I turned on the Nos 'rolled over on plane and asked him if he was holding on he said " yeah why?" I mashed the throttle ; waited 1/2 second and hit the button, he almost flipped over the back of the front seat!
And he isn't the only person that I've done that to... the answer to your question is : From a rolling start it leaves like a bullet. No slip, no cavitaion, just bite and go ( Oh I might get corrected on that:rolleyes: Where's BP anyway? ). I hope the new pump exceeds what we used to do.
Sleeper CPI think just about any jet will do that. As soon as there is enough forward motion to feed the impeller, away they go. What's it do from a dead stop? That's a hole shot, not a rolling start. Guys with really "fast" river boats get a real taste of humble pie when they come to the drags, and lose near a full second off the line, while someone who's done their homework goes by-by. Hole shot. You lose.
Only place I've ever heard the term "flash" used was with a torque converter in an auto trans. It really dosen't apply to impellers.
Sleeper...easy on bp...he's forgotten more about this stuff than most of us will know.

[Sleeper CP]

780lbs? is yours a gullwing or tunnel? my man. listed hull weight is 450lbs. i removed the floor,ski box and everything else i could, so i think its weighs @50-70lbs lighter. i wish i knew how ervin capps figured hull wieght for the condors. i assume its what comes outta the mold with floor/ski box unrigged? not sure:confused: when i had the boat hulled down 3months ago, i could pick the boat up off the trailer in the back, could pick up the frt too. i'm a skinny 170lb 6ft1 fella:D
Gullwing, It's an 8 passenger open bow ski boat. With the pump and interior in; it weighs 980 lbs. As I've posted before it's not the fastest boat but it is the fastest stationwagon I've ever seen. For what it is, it hauls a$$. But we cruise up river for 13-15 miles at 50 mph at 3,900 rpm's water ski with it for hours and after we burn off some gas go race some of our friends with their little two seaters. I posted this before too: We have run 13 miles from Picacho to Fishers Landing in 14 minutes flat that's 56 mph average. And it wasn't exactlly calm water either. Oil temp never went over 225 and pressure stayed at 60 lbs. It's an all around fun boat.
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

next time you see jack, ask him if your boat is heavier than mine. ...
Can do, I'll be picking up my pumps from Jack this week. Do you have a timer on that thing? An old friend of mine named Ron Segni has told me for 15 years to send my pumps up to MPD. I have 8 of his shoes and a least 12 shims for them from him, but this is the first time he has done my pump. Segni asked why I took so long. Ron is a So-Cal jet boat racer, I think he won his class 9 out of 12 years ( something stupid like that) before he retired a few years ago. I think his boat ran 116 ( but that might be w/Nos).
Sleeper CP

[djdtpr]

well since were getting technical here.no not all tunnels gullwings or any boat likes has or wants any kinda certain shoe.my point was why in the hell would you put a back cut shoe on a taylor sj.:mad:.your exactly right aout the backcut shoe on other boats just trying to make a refernce point about tunnels.remeber hes asking for help on impeller detailing on a lake boat not a 100mph river racer or drag boat.:D dont waste the effort you will gain nothing on speed holeshot or anything for that matter other than beign able to walk around saying i have detailed impeller.when your trying to get a boat tuned in for tenths of seconds snd so forth yeah its worth it.but from what ican understand this is a lake boat and you take your family.save your money:hammer2:
Well this is a tech forum so why not get technical although i didnt know we were. He was asking about detailing an impeller and if ya think you get nothing from it than you are showing your ignorance. By saying that you guys are talking about lake boats not drag boats so it doesnt matter for your situation where do you think that all the data on pumps,shoes,loaders and bottom work come from?Most all the imfo out there comes from R&D at the track.

[Sleeper CP]

.
Only place I've ever heard the term "flash" used was with a torque converter in an auto trans. It really dosen't apply to impellers.
Sleeper...easy on bp...he's forgotten more about this stuff than most of us will know.
Steel -"flash or slip" we always used the term seperate from full blown cavitation, where you have to back-peddle. MPD set up the new pump with an inducer. With all the talk about them on the boards I'm interested to see what the inducer will do. The only reason I got the inducer is because the most succesful jet/drag boat guy I know, Ron Segni, has a Gullwing and he is along time friend and know's exactally what we do with our boat told me to have Jack put on the inducer, also my friend Neil from San Diego Performance Marine told me it will help the hole shot also.
I have always got the little drag boat guy's to give alittle at the start because of the heavy boat I'm in. We usally roll over plane out and hit it. My chances increase a bunch when that happens. The AAA impeller or AA will take full throttle and Nos with no slip and that A3 moves a shit load of water at 6,600-6,800. Alot of the guy's running A/B's or B's would still have to watch the thottle alittle. My river friends have told me that alot of the guy's have really stepped up since we haven't been around much for 5 years. So maybe they are all getting their stuff done by MPD now . We'll be seeing what happens here real soon.
So do you call it "slip" or cavitation when it takes just a second to catch and it's only 150 rpm's above the max the engine pulls anyway? Maybe we are splitting hair's but I'd like to use the correct lingo.
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

. and, if you're feelin confident, maybe you'd like to drag it to oregon, marble falls, ming, or perhaps the world finals and see what you can do with it...
Or you can bring yours down here, load up yourself and 7 or 8 of your friends in it (like I can) with two ice chests, 4 chairs and 3 ski's and a 5 gallon gas can and I'll meet you 14 miles up river at Picacho. We can do alittle racing and when or if ,I lose ,(I have no problem losing ,cause if your boat can out run my 103 mph stationwagon ,your boat hauls ass ) I'll turn on the stereo, load up 5 of the guys I bought up river and go skiing up river for another 6 miles. Then when they get tired come back get the other 2 or three, take them skiing then when we are done drop the 5 gallons in and head home.:D :D ;) :jawdrop: :jawdrop: Going fast is only half the fun...what you make go fast is the other half.BTW: I haven't driven the thing at speed for 4 years, it's likely to scare the hell out of me anyway.LOL. And with the new pump and engine I might just leave the NOS off the thing; for a few trips anyway.
BP, it's not a drag boat, it's an openbow family ski boat with a few extra ponies.:) . And I'm being nice cause Steel told me to be and I respect his opinion.:)

[hotbo]

Well this is a tech forum so why not get technical although i didnt know we were. He was asking about detailing an impeller and if ya think you get nothing from it than you are showing your ignorance. By saying that you guys are talking about lake boats not drag boats so it doesnt matter for your situation where do you think that all the data on pumps,shoes,loaders and bottom work come from?Most all the imfo out there comes from R&D at the track.
you make me laugh:D you are exactly right.god bless you and i hope you are happy with your qoute.theres that ignorance shit again:idea: :idea: but thats okay ive come to realize its alright to be ignorant atleast im sumthing when alot are nothing.:D

[Jet Hydro]

I have a 900lb bare hull, yep the Hydro is a ski boat not built as a race light lay-up. I can stand on it from a dead stop and jump the boat out of the water ;)
I could do that when I only had 700hp from a dead stop. If you look you can see the holding rope.
This was with an Aggressor "C" impeller too!
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/42130009.bmp
Originally Posted by djdplacecraft
By saying that you guys are talking about lake boats not drag boats so it doesnt matter for your situation where do you think that all the data on pumps,shoes,loaders and bottom work come from?Most all the imfo out there comes from R&D at the track.
And there you have it right there!

[Jet Hydro]

all i know is i paid 300 dollars for the damn gift to e-pumps and wamo my boat tried to kill me several times:eek: i got a major porpoise like really bad so bad when i would try to drive threw it and let off finally after no resolvement it would nose dive so bad the bow would go under water and slam my ass into the dash so hard it bruised my ribs and broke my dash supports.so i called around oh well you need to do this and do that so i did and wmao same shit.called back buy this buy that.:D yeah i did.lotta money later i found out that i was crazy took it off with the advice of my ole man and scotts marine.i gained 3 miles hour and i can let go at top speed and let off rides like a dream and sets good. i straightend my bottom this winter we have abody shop my ole man been in the buisness for 40 years ive been there ever since i can remember i love body work.any way just telling you i can make a bottom straight.after all this and money i was told it was my fualt the shoe wont work bring it to there shop and for 500 a day theyll fix my screw up.can yu figure why im so pissed:idea: i have a straight snoot i would like to stick up someones ass and preferably not mine cause i had to dig it out after i bought it:D you know maybe i could have shaved it down but to the advice of someone i trust more than words will allow i can fix my pump feeding problem without killing my self.i was also told if i had more horsepower i could use the shoe kit.so basically i need to spend 10000 dollars to make my shoe kit work right. i dont think so.im trying to dial in what i have like taylorman with what little power i have and so far im doing alright i think,:) nothing is like having more horsepower no matter what,but in my 3rd grade skull get the best with what you have and you never know it just might be alright till you get your ass smoked then all hell breaks lose again.later travis
I would not put a shoe on an SJ with an insert pump as it will kick the shit out of you like yours did.
You didnt need a straight snoot on an SJ you needed a droop snoot ;)
I`m was gonna try a straight snoot on my SJ but I removed the insert pump and I have more toys (parts) to play with to make the set-up work. The main problem I see with trying one is the SJ is a V Bottom boat and it needs the nose up so I still dont think a straight snoot is the way to go on an SJ. Thats just my $0.02 and I know nothing ....

[IMPATIENT 1]

I would not put a shoe on an SJ with an insert pump as it will kick the shit out of you like yours did.
You didnt need a straight snoot on an SJ you needed a droop snoot ;)
I`m was gonna try a straight snoot on my SJ but I removed the insert pump and I have more toys (parts) to play with to make the set-up work. The main problem I see with trying one is the SJ is a V Bottom boat and it needs the nose up so I still dont think a straight snoot is the way to go on an SJ. Thats just my $0.02 and I know nothing ....
they both need more hp or a bbf:D lol, hotbo tried a snoot, it hurt his performance. when he ran the droop, it'd try and carry the transom to much much and almost all his hp went into carry the boat instead of pushing it.i've got an old race video somewhere, i'll find it and a recent pic of hotbo racing without inducer or droop, huge difference!!!

[Jet Hydro]

I have found out over the years, if you change one part you might have to change another 3 parts to make it work. When we go out testing we take a big box of stuff (Parts box) so we can make the changes we need to find out what parts work best for each boat we are working on. I spent about 40 hours testing that Baja we did that pump change on that had the SBC. Bolt this on and run it then bolt that on then change ride plate angles and so on. If you change one thing it may take a few try`s to get it working and a hole bag of parts ;)
Now about that BBF, :idea: Why would you want em to slow down.....ROTFLMAO ;) :D

[bp]

Can do, I'll be picking up my pumps from Jack this week. Do you have a timer on that thing? An old friend of mine named Ron Segni has told me for 15 years to send my pumps up to MPD. I have 8 of his shoes and a least 12 shims for them from him, but this is the first time he has done my pump. Segni asked why I took so long. Ron is a So-Cal jet boat racer, I think he won his class 9 out of 12 years ( something stupid like that) before he retired a few years ago. I think his boat ran 116 ( but that might be w/Nos).
Sleeper CP
i know ron well, we have been through goods and bads together. haven't seen him for a few years though, as i'm not so-cal. ron put max effort into his deal for many years, and was great at it, both in ski jet and the brackets. if he's advising you to do something, it's good advice.
my boat isn't a light layup specific drag boat. it's an old lake layup, that weighed 860 in jack's shop with only the pump in it, that i ran on the lake/river for several years before i started racing it, after crewing on another boat for 3 years, in the company of some pretty knowledgeable people. i'm not sure what you mean by a "timer"; there are a lot of "things" in my boat. if you can be more specific, i'll try to answer the question.
it's all good that you have a good time with your boat, carrying all these people around. but you have made some very improbable statements in this thread. there are people posting, relatively new to boats/jet boats, that don't need condescending sarcasm in response to their questions. not too many people have been where i've been, done what i've done. doesn't mean they're ignorant or stupid, so there's no reason to respond to simple questions as if they were.

[IMPATIENT 1]

Now about that BBF, Why would you want em to slow down.....ROTFLMAO
lol:D i like em, but i am runnin a bbc this yr.;)

[bp]

all i know is i paid 300 dollars for the damn gift to e-pumps and wamo my boat tried to kill me several times:eek: i got a major porpoise like really bad so bad when i would try to drive threw it and let off finally after no resolvement it would nose dive so bad the bow would go under water and slam my ass into the dash so hard it bruised my ribs and broke my dash supports.so i called around oh well you need to do this and do that so i did and wmao same shit.called back buy this buy that.:D yeah i did.lotta money later i found out that i was crazy took it off with the advice of my ole man and scotts marine.i gained 3 miles hour and i can let go at top speed and let off rides like a dream and sets good. i straightend my bottom this winter we have abody shop my ole man been in the buisness for 40 years ive been there ever since i can remember i love body work.any way just telling you i can make a bottom straight.after all this and money i was told it was my fualt the shoe wont work bring it to there shop and for 500 a day theyll fix my screw up.can yu figure why im so pissed:idea: i have a straight snoot i would like to stick up someones ass and preferably not mine cause i had to dig it out after i bought it:D you know maybe i could have shaved it down but to the advice of someone i trust more than words will allow i can fix my pump feeding problem without killing my self.i was also told if i had more horsepower i could use the shoe kit. so basically i need to spend 10000 dollars to make my shoe kit work right. i dont think so.im trying to dial in what i have like taylorman with what little power i have and so far im doing alright i think,:) nothing is like having more horsepower no matter what,but in my 3rd grade skull get the best with what you have and you never know it just might be alright till you get your ass smoked then all hell breaks lose again.later travis
sorry, but you got me roflmao with this one... i empathize, but that is some funny stuff right there...
recovering a little, i've seen others do similar things and get tossed right out of the boat, breaking a few things on the way (including themselves). short one; we had a guy that raced in my class for a few years. for some reason, they decided to reset the intake. so, at the next race, the boat's barely getting down the track (same setup as before). on his second attempt, the poor thing finally gave up, hooked an abrubt right at about 70, tossing him out and doing a job on his knee. come to find out, when they reset the intake, they didn't place it at the same angle and depth relative to the keel. the same setup resulted in significant overcharge. but, the intake was solid.
i've seen others just as bad...
hang in there..

[djdtpr]

you make me laugh:D you are exactly right.god bless you and i hope you are happy with your qoute.theres that ignorance shit again:idea: :idea: but thats okay ive come to realize its alright to be ignorant atleast im sumthing when alot are nothing.:D
Thank you im glad i make you laugh. I apreciate the God bless too. Good luck with the Sj im sure you will get her figured out!:)

[Sleeper CP]

i know ron well, we have been through goods and bads together. haven't seen him for a few years though, as i'm not so-cal. ron put max effort into his deal for many years, and was great at it, both in ski jet and the brackets. if he's advising you to do something, it's good advice.
. but you have made some very improbable statements in this thread. there are people posting, relatively new to boats/jet boats, that don't need condescending sarcasm in response to their questions. not too many people have been where i've been, done what i've done. doesn't mean they're ignorant or stupid, so there's no reason to respond to simple questions as if they were.
BP, Ron is doing well, got the invite to his 50th Bday this summer. He is stoked I got the pump to MPD.
I said timer, maybe should have said " RPM delay switch?"
" You have made some improbable statements in this thread":confused: Ron knows the boat well and will tell you: I'm alot of things but full of shit aint one of them. I've known Segni for about 18 years he'll tell you I'm the real deal, I don't need to exagerate what the boat does. Ron is the only person I have ever given the keys to my boat at the river and said " Don't brake it, and make sure you check the fuel pressure before you hit the NOS". I think I remember Ron saying. "It won't beat my boat, but holly shit that things fast and for a heavy boat it leaves!"
BP, thanks for reminding me of something; you're correct about the condescention, if he doesn't know he doesn't know. I've had the opportunity of being able to ask acouple of the smartest people in motorsports anything I want and both of them would just answer my lame questions without telling me how stupid it was. One of them was the late great Don Vesco and the other is a man I'm proud to call a friend, Bruce Crower( if you haven't seen it yet google "Crower six cycle engine" I happened to drop by the ranch to say 'Hi" to him about 3 days after he fininshed the first bench test on it. I was there for two hours as we talked about it and some of his other projects). So I'll watch the smart ass comments, thanks. However, I'll tell you this, rather it is improbable or lame : The original question in this thread was posted by a guy who has 3,200+ posts and has been here since 2001 and he doesn't know if his impeller is cavitating or not? I just found that alittle odd!
Just wondering what you think is improbable about my comments on my boat?
Regards,
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

I have a 900lb bare hull, yep the Hydro is a ski boat not built as a race light lay-up. I can stand on it from a dead stop and jump the boat out of the water ;)
I could do that when I only had 700hp from a dead stop. If you look you can see the holding rope.
This was with an Aggressor "C" impeller too!
!
I always thought it was counterproductive to put a jet in a Hydro?:confused:
(correction) Scratch that comment from above, just saw your posted pic on the other thread. WOW!! what E.T. and What M.P.H.? Guess I just learned something new, but how much work did you have to do to the bottom of that thing?
I thought they were called 3 point boats for a reason?
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

Now about that BBF, Why would you want em to slow down.....ROTFLMAO
lol:D i like em, but i am runnin a bbc this yr.;)
You're going to the Dark Side?;)
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

it's all good that you have a good time with your boat, carrying all these people around. but you have made some very improbable statements in this thread. .
Just checking for that list of improbable's. BTW I talked to MPD today, Jack told me to tell you "Hi" He wants me to drag my boat up there Thursday afternoon to pick up my stuff and set the pump in. He wants to look at all of my hardware options for the new baseline. My pump was finished today.
Sleeper CP

[Jet Hydro]

I always thought it was counterproductive to put a jet in a Hydro?:confused:
(correction) Scratch that comment from above, just saw your posted pic on the other thread. WOW!! what E.T. and What M.P.H.? Guess I just learned something new, but how much work did you have to do to the bottom of that thing?
I thought they were called 3 point boats for a reason?
Sleeper CP
A lot of work and money but it`s pretty quick so I`m happy ;)
:idea: Does this give you any Idea how much work was done ;)
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/208P1020062-med.JPG

[Sleeper CP]

A lot of work and money but it`s pretty quick so I`m happy ;)
:idea: Does this give you any Idea how much work was done ;)
[/img]
So how far under the original keel does the intake sit?
How fast and what ET? Or just one of them?
Sleeper CP

[Jet Hydro]

lake testing we ran it up to just a little over 100. Our lake is not really a good testing ground as we have 4ft rollers all the time.
On the 1/4 we lost the motor at the 660 going 98 so we really don't know yet. :idea: If the motor holds together the next time we race it I would say mid 9`s or so :jawdrop:
The original keel or (intake pod) was completely removed and the bottom of the boat was completely redesigned.

[hotbo]

lake testing we ran it up to just a little over 100. Our lake is not really a good testing ground as we have 4ft rollers all the time.
On the 1/4 we lost the motor at the 660 going 98 so we really don't know yet. :idea: If the motor holds together the next time we race it I would say mid 9`s or so :jawdrop:
The original keel or (intake pod) was completely removed and the bottom of the boat was completely redesigned.
that had to be some major shit right there.i wish you the best on your next outing:D

[Sleeper CP]

From your other pic it looks like it only rides on the intake pad, do the front sponsen ride in the water much at all?
If it was doing 98 at the 660 that baby is quick. My friend Ron Segni's very quick 500 lb CP Gullwing ran 105 in the 1/4 with a 440 bbc. At one race he had a problem at the start so he let off and came off plane, by the time he got squared away he was at half track. He ran it out the back end of the track and ran 99 mph in the 1/8th. He was really surprised that his boat only picked up 6 mph in the last 1/8th. Sounds like yours is as strong as Ron's old boat.
Sleeper CP

[Jet Hydro]

if the water is glass I set-up with then off the water but if there is some ripple to the water I run em on top.
Now if the water is bad I set-up like this
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/4213IMG_2935-med.jpg
If you look at the pic at the bottom you will see that there was a little ripple so I ran em on top

[Sleeper CP]

Now that is a cool pic. I got to get to work this morn,but one more question how does that thing settle when you get off the gas?
Sleeper CP

[Jet Hydro]

:idea: like a feather falling from the ski. When I lost the motor at 100+`s I thought I would have to swim but it went nice and straight :)
Very safe boat!

[LGCDEVIL]

A lot of work and money but it`s pretty quick so I`m happy ;)
:idea: Does this give you any Idea how much work was done ;)
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/208P1020062-med.JPG
Only two empties??? Must not have been that big of a deal:D

[Jet Hydro]

went to wellers/coke ;) the two empties were my brothers :)

[bp]

Just checking for that list of improbable's. BTW I talked to MPD today, Jack told me to tell you "Hi" He wants me to drag my boat up there Thursday afternoon to pick up my stuff and set the pump in. He wants to look at all of my hardware options for the new baseline. My pump was finished today.
Sleeper CP
i need to call him about something, but i keep forgetting to. not that i don't have anything else happening right now... movers are loading all my stuff in a truck:eek:
i have something in my boat that is similar to what you're calling a timer, or delay box. there are two uses for this box. one is to dampen, or minimize cavitation over the first 100' or so. i don't use it for that purpose. when i've run 9.50s in the past, and on a few other occassions, i just have a high rpm limit, and hit it. bowl pressure climbs right to the top, with no divots.
The AAA impeller or AA will take full throttle and Nos with no slip and that A3 moves a shit load of water at 6,600-6,800. Alot of the guy's running A/B's or B's would still have to watch the thottle alittle.
yes, an A3 at 6600-6800 does move a helluva lot of water. however, it would take a whole lot more than 850-900 hp to turn one, OR an A2, that high. i spin a B 6000, and a C slightly over 6200. the only thing i watch the throttle do is bend over the throttle stop. you could ask jack about that too... had him build me a gorilla proof foot mount a few years back...
I always thought it was counterproductive to put a jet in a Hydro?
no need to take it back, it's absolutely true. i know that because i read it on ***boat. steve has heard lots worse, which is one reason he keeps trying... :D

[Jet Hydro]

I`m glad someone understands ;) :D
Speaking of tyring, the new motor got fired today :D Cant wait to get out on the water!
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497P1030841.JPG

[Sleeper CP]

:idea:Very safe boat!
Yeah, you just keep telling yourself that!;) I'll stand back and watch, thank you very much.:D
My brother and I thought along time ago: Anyone can make a 18' Daytona Pickle run 100, lets do that with a bigger boat, one that can hold 8-9 people and we can ski with. That's why we got the Open Bow CP.
"Dare to be different"
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

yes, an A3 at 6600-6800 does move a helluva lot of water. however, it would take a whole lot more than 850-900 hp to turn one, OR an A2, that high.
... :D
Sorry for the bad intel, the Legend is an standard 9.125" A2 SS and it does spin to 6,800. (that would be 855 @ 6,600 + 250 Nos = 1,100 HP ) That's why it's at MPD with my AT parts ( 9.25" AA) that turned 6,600. I'm having serious effecency problems. It would turn the Legend 5,800-5,900 off the bottle. But the MPH was in the tank at 88 because the intake pressure was only about 18 psi.And we tried every thing I could think of to get it up to the upper 20's or 30 psi and nothing worked. Hopefully Jack's magic can get that damn thing to work correctly.
I hope your move goes well.
P.S. FYI Engine spec's( 565 BBF single Carb, 10.8:1 comp, trq 710@5800,HP 802@6000,855@6600,850@6800 plus 250 HP Nos system) she has all the power we need just can't get the pump to work effiecently)
Sleeper CP

[Jet Hydro]

Yeah, you just keep telling yourself that!;) I'll stand back and watch, thank you very much.:D
"Dare to be different"
Sleeper CP
I`v been playing with it for over 5 years now so I think I should know. ;)
Grow some and come take a ride ;)
I can show you "Dare to be different" :eek: .....rotflmfao
Cant, never could!

[Sleeper CP]

I
I can show you "Dare to be different" :eek: .....rotflmfao
Cant, never could!
What the ???? what does that mean, I'm new to this and some of the short cuts I still don't get. Help me on rotflmfao. ?:confused: :confused:
Thanks,
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

It's not the pump.....
Don't start with me or I'll ....:mad: :mad: :mad:
It used to turn an A3 5200 off the bottle and run 92-93. Switched to the Legend A2 with the Legend bowl. Should have been able to run closer to 100 or over at the 5800 level , but fell to 88. MPD used the AT bowl and the Legend impeller for the best combo of my parts I already had.

[djdtpr]

My brother and I thought along time ago: Anyone can make a 18' Daytona Pickle run 100, lets do that with a bigger boat, one that can hold 8-9 people and we can ski with. That's why we got the Open Bow CP.
Sleeper CP
Ive never seen a 18 daytona tunnel i thought they were all 19. Would be cool to see one. I wonder why they dont race more of the 18's.

[Devilman]

What the ???? what does that mean, I'm new to this and some of the short cuts I still don't get. Help me on rotflmfao. ?:confused: :confused:
Thanks,
Sleeper CP
Rolling
On
The
Floor
Laughing
My
F*cking
Ass
Off
:D :D :D

[Sleeper CP]

Ive never seen a 18 daytona tunnel i thought they were all 19. Would be cool to see one. I wonder why they dont race more of the 18's.
Sorry bout that. It's my boat that they make in a 18' & 19' although my 19' measures 18-4" I think. I'll check today.:) P.S. Wrong 18'-11" that must have been my first boat.
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

Rolling
On
The
Floor
Laughing
My
F*cking
Ass
Off
:D :D :D
Thanks for the heads up.
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

I`v been playing with it for over 5 years now so I think I should know. ;)
Grow some and come take a ride ;)
I can show you "Dare to be different" :eek: .....rotflmfao
Cant, never could!
And just exactly where does a passenger ride in that ski boat of yours?:confused: :D I'll be fine watching.
Sleeper CP

[Jet Hydro]

And just exactly where does a passenger ride in that ski boat of yours?:confused: :D I'll be fine watching.
Sleeper CP
Right next to the DRIVER ;) in the other seat....lol
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/4213P1030361.JPG

[bp]

I`m glad someone understands ;) :D
Speaking of tyring, the new motor got fired today :D Cant wait to get out on the water!
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497P1030841.JPG
'course i understand - heard the same thing about southwind tunnel's, all the way up to the point i started winning 7 championships, and bunches of events with dne power/mpd pump...:D
you know though, 1200 hp would put me in the 8's:D

[Jet Hydro]

1200 is a little more then I think I really need but I want some extra hp if needed to get that 9. After I get the 9 I might start racing again .... I`v been telling everyone I`m gonna run RR1 again....rotflmao

[Sleeper CP]

[QUOTE=Jet Hydro;2642671]Right next to the DRIVER ;) in the other seat....lol
[QUOTE]
Thanks, but I'll watch;)
Sleeper CP