Setback pump/Transom plate question

[BrendellaJet]

New boat has the pump setback pretty far. It was done like this from the factory. As such it leaks a ton of water. Nothing the bilge cant keep up with, but with the amount of silicone applied be previous owners I want to pull the intake, re-set and then re-seal the plates.
Question:
Has anyone ever had the plates welded to the suction housing? If done right would this cause any problems? I dont want to weaken the casting so If I need to have the casting hard annodized again or have some other treatment applied to it then thats not a problem. Once the intake is set and the suction housing bolted in place, I could have the plates welded to the pump and I know that would resolve 99% of the leaks I've got going on right now.
Hear is a pick of what I am dealing with right now:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/P1010140.jpg

[flat broke]

Brian,
The welding option would be interesting, but as you've mentioned, welding the cast piece brings up some issues. I don't think the hard ano in and of itself will correct the issues that arise from welding. It's a surface treatment, and as such, isn't going to do much at the molecular level to undo the changes that welding the aluminum are going to bring about. Maybe SteveM or one of the other metalurgists <sp> can comment on that aspect of things as I'm just speculating. You could also ask Jack for his opinion, as he'd be a good person to have do the welding anyhow.
The other obvious issue with welding the plates to the suction housing would be the fact that the suction housing is then worthless in the aftermarket, but I doubt that's really much of a concern overall.
Honestly, it looks like you can see daylight through the silicone bead that's already on there. Perhaps just making a new set of tight fiting plates is the answer. There are guys that have setup pumps and plates like yours without much of a leakage problem. Ty's boat isn't set back quite as far, but uses a similar transom plate setup, and it doesn't leak. I'd just make new plates, or refit the current ones for a tight fit, then use a 3m 5200 and do a nice clean masking job before you apply the silicone.
If you go the welding route, keep us posted as I'd be curious to see how it goes.

[tahitijet]

just build new plates that seal better and do a good job with the silicone. welding that cast alumn is not fun, easy, or cheap plus how would you handle the area where the suction and intake bolt together and below the intake? would you have another pieace bolted on? or weld the complete pump together? either way doesn't seem like a great idea.

[BrendellaJet]

Hmmm, okay, gonna wait until the motor is out and the pump will come out then too. Likely this wont happen until this winter since the boat funds are tapped and I have two projects to sell to make room for the new boat in the garage. When its home & not in storage then I will tear into it. Then of course I need to buy exhaust for my big motor and Im sure I will find some other stuff to spend money on.....
Ill talk to Jack to get his opinion on the plates. I understand that it is difficult to weld on the casting. One other benefit I would gain by going this route would be that the bottom of the boat and the transom would be tied together. As far back as this pump is set it just seems like a good idea. With the additional pounding a bigger boat will take and the extra leverage the pump has there seems to be a good argument to tie them together.
For the portion of the plates that extend below the suction housing I would seal those with some 3m 5200 or similar product.(the rex Boatlife stuff is really nice to work with and cleans up easy...)
Anyone else feel free to chime in.

[tahitijet]

you might be able to get away with the plates you have if you clean up the sealer and reseal it.. you could use a pump brace to help with the leverage. I added one to mine to for the same reason.

[Jetmugg]

Metallurgically, the plates CAN be welded to the suction housing. Of course, for the plates pictured, the gaps would probably be too big to weld easily. You would most likely have to make new plates with a tighter fit in order to have a clean looking finished product.
Somebody like Jack would be much better equipped to say whether you SHOULD weld the plates to the housing in practical terms. I had similar thoughts during the rebuild of my last 18' Gullwing (welding the plates to the housing). In the end, I just gooped up the gaps with silicone and called it "good to go".
Metallurgically - yes it can be done, practically - I dunno.
SteveM.

[Wicked Performance Boats]

I'd hate to have to remove the pump from the boat after the transom plates were welded on. Just getting the plates off is a bitch without scratching the transom. Make new plates or fit the ones you have better and resilicone, inside and out. Budlight

[sleekcrafter]

Ive done setback that far back before, using a one piece plate. I remove the intake from the boat, and make a filler between the intake flange and the hull mount flange, even to the edge. This then gets welded in and ground flush. this works well in new cut outs, allowing a one piece plate, an existing opening will still require two plates, but sealing is so much easier.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/7363100_0325-med.JPG
here is another one that had been done prior, to the shoe mods. Kind of hard to see in this pic but..it will give you an idea of whats being done.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/17406legend_pump_001.jpg

[BrendellaJet]

Ive done setback that fr back before, using a one piece plate. I remove the intake from the boat, and make a filler between the intake flange and the hul mount flange, even to the edge. This then gets welded in and ground flush. this works well in new cut outs, allowing a one piece plate, an existing opening will still require two plates, but sealing is so much easier.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/7363100_0325-med.JPG
here is another one that had been done prior, to the shoe mods. Kind of hard to see in this pic but..it will give you an idea of whats being done.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/17406legend_pump_001.jpg
Im not sure im following you...

[flat broke]

Brian,
I think what he's sayin is that the whole plate is one piece. Everything is mocked up first, then taken apart, the new plate is welded to the intake. Then the intake is reset, and the suction housing basically slides forward to the transom plate at which point the bolt holes should line up between the suction housing and the intake adapter.
Then again, I could be wrong too :)
Chris

[sleekcrafter]

In the picture the top plate is all that is needed, the filler between the intake and hull is filled by the welded spacer in the intake. The transom plate then covers the transom down to where the fillers are, in picture # 1. It's not welded, just sealed with silicone, and bolted to the hull, it makes for a clean seal.
Here is a better picture of the intake spacer
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/7363100_0210-med.JPG
The intake in epoxied in place.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/7363100_0216-med.JPG
Here the suction is installed, and plate is fit to the hull.
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/7363100_0279-med.JPG

[BrendellaJet]

So what you are saying is that you dont have to cut the plates to fit the intake, they just extend past the tabs you welded in here in this pic?http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/7363100_0210-med.jpg
This way you can run a one piece plate.

[sleekcrafter]

So what you are saying is that you dont have to cut the plates to fit the intake, they just extend past the tabs you welded in here in this pic?http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/7363100_0210-med.jpg
This way you can run a one piece plate.
You got it ;)

[Cs19]

I dont see any reason to weld the plates to the suction, if your worried about the intake moving around then build some pump braces. You should be able to seal up a TA plate set up to where it does not leak.
Do your homework on the pump braces if you want to build some, 75% of the braces out there dont do a damn thing by bad design.

[BrendellaJet]

Brian,
I think what he's sayin is that the whole plate is one piece. Everything is mocked up first, then taken apart, the new plate is welded to the intake. Then the intake is reset, and the suction housing basically slides forward to the transom plate at which point the bolt holes should line up between the suction housing and the intake adapter.
Then again, I could be wrong too :)
Chris
That would be an ideal way of doing it, but I dont know if the pump would fit through the plate that way. Seems like the front half of the suction piece might not make it through...maybe not.

[sleekcrafter]

I dont see any reason to weld the plates to the suction, if your worried about the intake moving around then build some pump braces. You should be able to seal up a TA plate set up to where it does not leak.
Do your homework on the pump braces if you want to build some, 75% of the braces out there dont do a damn thing by bad design.
No welding was done to the suction housing, it's a simple silicone seal. The only welding was done to the intake it's self.