panther energizer kit

[pokerboat]

I have a 20Â’ Taylor Stiletto tunnel with a panther jet and was thinking about putting in a panther jet drive energizer kit from American turbine. Has anyone heard of this conversion or seen one or should I rebuild my panther. Or am I better of cutting out the panther and changing to a Dominator pump or American turbine. If I do change the pump which is the best choice Dominator, American turbine, Legend.
Thanks mike
http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_DSC00077.jpghttp://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_DSC00076.jpg

[gqchris]

I have a Panther also Mike, and was real skeptical when first buying the boat with it in it. After several river trips, I have to say I am very impressed with it. I pulled it apart last trip, it was super easy, has a stainless impeller, and ride plate. Easy to service. Holeshot is great. I like the fiberglass molded in pod. No more silicone touch ups. I do miss being able to throw a roost, but I can't see spending 2600 bucks on the Energizer kit just to have a droop and/or diverter. If I was running big HP, I would do the cutout and going to a Dominator. But as far as turn key goes, Im sticking with the Panther until it needs a replacing. I have spoke with a ton of people and researched the heck out of Panther Pumps. Hope this helps:)
Chris

[RIVERTIME247]

I have a 20Â’ Taylor Stiletto tunnel with a panther jet and was thinking about putting in a panther jet drive energizer kit from American turbine. Has anyone heard of this conversion or seen one or should I rebuild my panther. Or am I better of cutting out the panther and changing to a Dominator pump or American turbine. If I do change the pump which is the best choice Dominator, American turbine, Legend.
Thanks mike
http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_DSC00077.jpghttp://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_DSC00076.jpg
CHECK OUT TOM AT JETBOATPERFORMANCE.COM HE'S HELPED WORK ON IT WITH A/T.

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

talk to tom at jetboatperformance.com
Him and Josh designed that setup. Tom knows panthers pretty damn well

[hotbo]

if you cut it out i like berkley better than dominator:idea:
never had a panther so call tom at jet boat performance and hell tell ya what to do.
remeber just b/c some say they are junk doesnt mean they are junk.some peeps just think these things cause they dont want to make it work or there peers told them they suck.panthers are not know for perfromance stock but the enegizer kit is a great addition to the panther.hope this helps.later trav.:idea:

[jrork]

The stock Panther worked really good for us for a number of years but I wanted to try something different so I yak'd with Tom at Jet Boat Performance and pulled the trigger and picked up a new Energizer setup. I can't wait to try it out.
If you're looking for something low maint. and in the uppper 60's to low 70's for speed, ain't nothing wrong with the Panther. If you're throwing a ton of HP at it or want to tinker with it to try to get what you can out of it, the stock Panther isn't probably the best setup. I view the Energizer as possibly something in between. Good parts, possibility of tinkering with shims, impellers, inducers, and most of all ease of installation...
Good luck regardless with the direction you wanna go and just have fun..........John

[pokerboat]

John have you gotten your energizer kit on your boat, what kind of boat and engine are you putting it on.

[IMPATIENT 1]

if you cut it out i like berkley better than dominator:idea:
never had a panther so call tom at jet boat performance and hell tell ya what to do.
remeber just b/c some say they are junk doesnt mean they are junk.some peeps just think these things cause they dont want to make it work or there peers told them they suck.panthers are not know for perfromance stock but the enegizer kit is a great addition to the panther.hope this helps.later trav.:idea:
berk better than dominator,lol, whats you smoking this mornin trav:D next you'll be sayin jacuzzi is the shhhiat:D :D

[jrork]

John have you gotten your energizer kit on your boat, what kind of boat and engine are you putting it on.
Just picked the pump up from Tom last week so I havent installed it yet. I'm going completely thru the boat so it'll be a little bit. It's an 18' Brendella. Motor is a modest blown BBC.

[malcolm]

You've been home long enough John, get on with it! :D

[hotbo]

berk better than dominator,lol, whats you smoking this mornin trav:D next you'll be sayin jacuzzi is the shhhiat:D :D
well and then there is tom.i dont get to have a opinion.:idea:
scott has showed me some things about beks,dominators.changed my mind alittle.:D but then again what might he or for that matter his dad jack sea know hes only been doing this since before we were both born:idea: and there is a certain jacuzzi that is bad ass.have you had anyone set you down and show you differences in things and talk to you about pumps,ect.sometimes theres things you can learn from people that dont have big egos to uphold.later trav.:D

[BrendellaJet]

and there is a certain jacuzzi that is bad ass.
Jacuzzi's can be made to run. Anyone want to come for a ride let me know. You'll be beggin me to lift:D
Id be interested to see how the panther kit works. My bros boat has one and I've been bugging him to cut it out so we can drop in a berk. For 2500 though if his boat will do 70 or so with the energizer it may be well enough figuring that a berk in a 21 ft boat with 550 horse wont do any better...

[pokerboat]

John will you be getting the boat in the water this season. I wonÂ’t be starting my project until this winter I would like to see how the panther kit works for you. I sure hope it works great, then ill jump on the band wagon. That would save me a lot work not having to change out my jet. Let me now when youÂ’re testing it.
Thank Mike

[IMPATIENT 1]

well and then there is tom.i dont get to have a opinion.:idea:
scott has showed me some things about beks,dominators.changed my mind alittle.:D but then again what might he or for that matter his dad jack sea know hes only been doing this since before we were both born:idea: and there is a certain jacuzzi that is bad ass.have you had anyone set you down and show you differences in things and talk to you about pumps,ect.sometimes theres things you can learn from people that dont have big egos to uphold.later trav.:D
look at what they run on race day;) most aren't berks or jacuzzi's:D and scott got beat alot on the 4th by dominator pushed boats:D :D i've seen the vids and pics, plus my uncle was there as well;) chop was putting it on him

[jrork]

John will you be getting the boat in the water this season. I wonÂ’t be starting my project until this winter I would like to see how the panther kit works for you. I sure hope it works great, then ill jump on the band wagon. That would save me a lot work not having to change out my jet. Let me now when youÂ’re testing it.
Thank Mike
Mike,
It'll likely be late season at best.

[bp]

look at what they run on race day;) most aren't berks or jacuzzi's:D
the most i see are berk's, or some combination of amt/legend/berk. the quickest/fastest blown jet is amt, but the quickest/fastest unblown jet (by a long way) is berk. i can't say i've ever seen a jacuzzi at the track, but then i'm not really looking for 'em either.

[hotbo]

look at what they run on race day;) most aren't berks or jacuzzi's:D and scott got beat alot on the 4th by dominator pushed boats:D :D i've seen the vids and pics, plus my uncle was there as well;) chop was putting it on him
what in the hell does this have to do with panther or jacuzzi. scott never said he was the fastest in fact he doesnt lie alot either.so your sayin he lost alot becuase he doesnt know what hes doing:idea: wo what a fool.
chops boat is very fast tom one of the fastest txs in our area. he has 400 shot of nos on top of a 550+bbc he should be fast.scotts tx is a 468 with 8-71 onlt runnin 8psi boost he said it only makes around 700hp.:jawdrop: so go figure know it all.this has nothing to do with him or his dads ability to make boats fast go to the real drag boat races and watch him and his team he spends alot of his personal money on it so he can race not his lake boats and he does have 3 to keep up.
im not going to argue with you or any one else for that matter about the seasrtum guys.you apparently dont know there history or the work
him and his dad work for jacuzzi for years there are 2 different jacuzzi pumps and 1 shit and the other is a horsepower eater jack sea told me i cant remeber the 2 modles but the good one:idea: anythin under 500hp and your wasting your time with the jacuzzi now granite that is the good one:D you should really talk to thim and listen they are good gys like alot of the old timers from this sport are and there knowledge i will not dispute.b/c back when jack was racing they didnt have all this buy and bolt on shit they have now it was making your own one off shit back then
now back to the real subject i know nothing of panther or the energizer kit and apparently no one else does either:idea: so my friend call someone who does,tom at jetboat perfromance.later trav.
well i stand corrected scotts boat has a 540 dart block motor with 8-71 he said making 830+ hp he has the dyno sheets to prove it and the power range is in his wot range.he said it didnit hurt his feelings he lost some hell we all lose some.

[hotbo]

the most i see are berk's, or some combination of amt/legend/berk. the quickest/fastest blown jet is amt, but the quickest/fastest unblown jet (by a long way) is berk. i can't say i've ever seen a jacuzzi at the track, but then i'm not really looking for 'em either.
bp your right sometimes impatient one just tries to make me and look bad and act like he knows everything:idea:

[IMPATIENT 1]

bp your right sometimes impatient one just tries to make me and look bad and act like he knows everything:idea:
lmao:D yep, that's me, mr.noitall. guess that's why i've posted a few thousand questions on this site:rolleyes: let's see you try to go 20-30 posts without mentioning a seastrum, bet ya can't:D

[hotbo]

lmao:D yep, that's me, mr.noitall. guess that's why i've posted a few thousand questions on this site:rolleyes: let's see you try to go 20-30 posts without mentioning a seastrum, bet ya can't:D
and again what does this have to do with the real question:idea:
dont be jealous :D what in the hell does having thousands of post have to do with what ya know or dont know.:confused: ive learned alot from reading listening and posting on here and other sites.sometimes we just refer to the peeps that treat and have some sense in the posts i make thats all sorry if your offended that i have someone else to talk to lol!!!later bro and get yo ass ready for labor day its gonna be fun.:D

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

Play nice ladies :D

[gqchris]

Panthers always cause this uproar! Rarrrrrrrr!!!!:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

and again what does this have to do with the real question:idea:
dont be jealous :D what in the hell does having thousands of post have to do with what ya know or dont know.:confused: ive learned alot from reading listening and posting on here and other sites.sometimes we just refer to the peeps that treat and have some sense in the posts i make thats all sorry if your offended that i have someone else to talk to lol!!!later bro and get yo ass ready for labor day its gonna be fun.:D
i'm trying bro, gonna work on it hard today and maybe fire it up.
396, trav(hotbo) is 1 of my homies and we give each other shiat:D its how we roll:D :D

[hotbo]

i'm trying bro, gonna work on it hard today and maybe fire it up.
396, trav(hotbo) is 1 of my homies and we give each other shiat:D its how we roll:D :D
YEAH WE ARE JUST POKIN FUN AT EACH OTHER:D YEAH THIS PANTHER THREAD HAS GOTTEN OFF HAND AND I BLAME IMPATIENT1:boxingguy :D

[pokerboat]

I didnÂ’t wonÂ’t to cause any trouble I just wanted to know what to do with my panther I think I am going to wait and see how jrork conversion works for him.

[Cas]

completely 2 different animals. John is putting a blown big block, if I'm not mistaken, in his v bottom boat. You're looking to put an LS1 in a tunnel hull.
If you're still going with the small block, keep the Panther as the engine has the chance to better get into it's rpm range.
That all aside, this past weekend there was a Tahiti with a Panther that sawed off a couple of Berks. That Tahiti runs about 74 at 5400 rpms, not fast by many people's standards but faster than a lot of jets out there. They can be made to run pretty good.
Here's a thread with some additional reading-http://www.socaljetboats.com/index.php/topic,882.0.html
Also, talk to Ron at A/T, he posted up some excellent info awhile back that would benefit you and your decsion.

[hotbo]

completely 2 different animals. John is putting a blown big block, if I'm not mistaken, in his v bottom boat. You're looking to put an LS1 in a tunnel hull.
If you're still going with the small block, keep the Panther as the engine has the chance to better get into it's rpm range.
That all aside, this past weekend there was a Tahiti with a Panther that sawed off a couple of Berks. That Tahiti runs about 74 at 5400 rpms, not fast by many people's standards but faster than a lot of jets out there. They can be made to run pretty good.
Here's a thread with some additional reading-http://www.socaljetboats.com/index.php/topic,882.0.html
Also, talk to Ron at A/T, he posted up some excellent info awhile back that would benefit you and your decsion.
very true its not generally the top mph that will make you win its how quick you get from point a to b is the one thta will everytime.i have proved this here lately.my boat runs all around 74 and turns 5400 also ive sawed of some much faster mph boats this year and they cant figure it out its the quickest that wins.:idea: and what i mean by all aorund is im having loading issues and one pass might be 72 the other might me 74.7 juist not consitent in the big end.

[jusjetting]

jrork what year is your boat? I have 1979 Brendella w BBC and a Panther performer . Haven't seen many Brendellas. Would interested in some pics.Off the beating path a little sorry. Thanks

[Cas]

very true its not generally the top mph that will make you win its how quick you get from point a to b is the one thta will everytime.i have proved this here lately.my boat runs all around 74 and turns 5400 also ive sawed of some much faster mph boats this year and they cant figure it out its the quickest that wins.:idea: and what i mean by all aorund is im having loading issues and one pass might be 72 the other might me 74.7 juist not consitent in the big end.
try smoothing all the transitions at the rock grate and pump to insert joints under the boat. Fill in any and all gaps that you may find.
You're right about the hole shot, Doug had them all out of the hole and they couldn't catch up. The hole shot was the same with my ole Tahiti with a Panther although I would get beat on the top end. That's what I got for a basically stock engine, log exhaust with a top end of 66@4900.

[hotbo]

[QUOTE=Cas;2701048]try smoothing all the transitions at the rock grate and pump to insert joints under the boat. Fill in any and all gaps that you may find.
You're right about the hole shot, Doug had them all out of the hole and
.i bought loaders till im bought out :mad: took it to jac seastrums sons shop and he measured everything and is custom making me one,all the off the shelfs were shit for my setup.right know i only have 10psi on the intake pressure:eek: but it kicks ass for a short distance about 1/8 mile then im outta water.:mad: but ill fix it.thanks for the advice i should have ,moulded all the shit inside the intake when i had it upside down dehookin it last winter guess ill turn it back over this winter and redo that part.
oh yeah mine is a e-pump berk,not panther

[Cas]

oh yeah mine is a e-pump berk,not panther
that's ok, similar but different :D
you've got a lot more options with e pump and that's what my opinion is on poker's deal. If you're gonna change, make the complete change to the mixed flow to have the ability to utilize all the options available to better tune the set-up.

[camoman]

That all aside, this past weekend there was a Tahiti with a Panther that sawed off a couple of Berks. That Tahiti runs about 74 at 5400 rpms, not fast by many people's standards but faster than a lot of jets out there. They can be made to run pretty good.
That would be DougS he has one of the fastest panther boats i will ever see:confused: especially to see him saw off sqirtin thunder back to back:jawdrop:

[pro53]

I dont Know about the Energizer kit for the Panther, But It sure hepled me out with my Jacuzzi YJ. Money well spent.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i76/pro53/100_1577.jpg

[OKIE-JET]

I dont Know about the Energizer kit for the Panther, But It sure hepled me out with my Jacuzzi YJ. Money well spent.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i76/pro53/100_1577.jpg
Looks good, can ya give some detail as to how it helped. I have the YJ in an old Appolo and for a stock deal, its got a killer hole-shot, been thinkin of the energizer or putting in a Berk JC that I already have.

[pro53]

Very easy to install, got it from Tom at JETBOATPERFORMANCE.I think my old YJ was out of tolerance and sloppy.I havent GPS it.Took it out 1 time with the new pump, then the next had a new motor.Between the Droop, Rideplate the boat really felt alot faster and it felt like it was not riding so wet.I was pleased with the swap.No with the new 521 damn thing runs GOOD:D It a very heavy Lake Boat.Here is a pick of how the boat is riding in the water.I have the old Hyraulic trim for the YJ in the SPAM section.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i76/pro53/normal_h3_073-1.jpg

[pokerboat]

Pro53 nice boat, did you do the conversion yourself or did tom do it for you. And if you donÂ’t mind me asking how much did it all cost the energizer kit, droop and ride plate. And what kind of Impeller are you running.
Thank Mike

[jetboatperformance]

Poker We built the Jet pump ,George (pro53 ) did the beautiful install and I might add modified the Place diverter ride plate/droop setup (which may have been a "first" on a YJ conversion!!) GOOD JOB ! George Boat looks Great! Tom

[pro53]

Pro53 nice boat, did you do the conversion yourself or did tom do it for you. And if you donÂ’t mind me asking how much did it all cost the energizer kit, droop and ride plate. And what kind of Impeller are you running.
Thank Mike
Yea Tom built the pump, he will send you one put together, pull your old one out slide the new in.:) Its simple, and buy you doing it yourself you can save all them labor charges;) The energizer kit, droop,ride plate, 2 cables, steering ext., swivel, place divertor kit I think it was around $3000.00 thats all new stuff.Its pricey and Tom gave me the best price on the kit, I did some shopping around.I like my boat, but I could not stand not to have no ROOSTER TAIL.The old pump wouldnt handle the new stroker motor anyway.

[jrork]

jrork what year is your boat? I have 1979 Brendella w BBC and a Panther performer . Haven't seen many Brendellas. Would interested in some pics.Off the beating path a little sorry. Thanks
It's a 1978. I'll PM you this evening.....John

[Cas]

That would be DougS he has one of the fastest panther boats i will ever see:confused: especially to see him saw off sqirtin thunder back to back:jawdrop:
yep, that's the boat! From what I understand, he took out a boat this past weekend that was converted from a Panther to a Berk. I don't think the owner of the converted boat was too pleased after spending all the time and energy for the replacement. On the other hand, he will be adding more power in the near future which I'm sure will get his boat going real good.

[pokerboat]

ThatÂ’s a good price compared to what I got quoted up here in Vancouver Canada. I was quoted more then that just for the kit. I might have to take a trip to California. to see tom.

[gqchris]

completely 2 different animals. John is putting a blown big block, if I'm not mistaken, in his v bottom boat. You're looking to put an LS1 in a tunnel hull.
If you're still going with the small block, keep the Panther as the engine has the chance to better get into it's rpm range.
That all aside, this past weekend there was a Tahiti with a Panther that sawed off a couple of Berks. That Tahiti runs about 74 at 5400 rpms, not fast by many people's standards but faster than a lot of jets out there. They can be made to run pretty good.
Here's a thread with some additional reading-http://www.socaljetboats.com/index.php/topic,882.0.html
Also, talk to Ron at A/T, he posted up some excellent info awhile back that would benefit you and your decsion.
Excellent reading over there Steve. I just wanted to say thanks again for the call the other day and letting me pick your brain about my pump. I forgot though where I was suppoed to put the devcon when I get it from Panther. Was it in the bowl wear ring area? :) Have a good weekend!
Chris

[Cas]

Excellent reading over there Steve. I just wanted to say thanks again for the call the other day and letting me pick your brain about my pump. I forgot though where I was suppoed to put the devcon when I get it from Panther. Was it in the bowl wear ring area? :) Have a good weekend!
Chris
Chris,
You get to be the guinea pig on this one but I'm thinking filling in the gap where the wear ring meets the housing. I've heard of a couple of pumps with the wear ring installed getting unusually high rpms so there has to be a reason for it. There have been a couple where the sealant between the pump and insert was allowing air into the pump but it doesn't sound like it's the case with yours.
Good talking to you!
oops, wrong Chris :D On yours, it's the area where a wear ring would normally be. Being the suction housing is aluminum and the impeller is SS, the housing will get some pitting. To fix that, goop the Devcon on the housing to fill in the pitting and make it about the same width as the impeller vanes. Make the Devcon kind of thick so the impeller will go on very tight.....you may have to do some sanding. When you fire the boat in the water the impeller will cut it's own clearance.

[Squirtin Thunder]

That would be DougS he has one of the fastest panther boats i will ever see:confused: especially to see him saw off sqirtin thunder back to back:jawdrop:
That boat of DougS sure did run. Damn that was over two years ago at easter right ?
I was running back then about 72 - 73mph on GPS

[H20MOFO]

This Is My 1st Post. Just Couldn't Take It Anymore.hope This Is Going On The Panther Thread. I Put The Energizer On My Tahiti 18'bbc Prox 600 Hp Could Barely Hit 55 Before Kit Now Boat Does 68.7 On Gps Think She Will Go To 70 Plus With A Little Tuning. I Was Impressed,no Loading Issues. Boat Does Seam Alittle Looser Pretty Sure Running Less Wet Now.

[pokerboat]

H2OMOFO did you put the energizer kit on a panther jet or Berkley could you post a pitcher

[H20MOFO]

I PUT IT ON A PANTHER I THINK RON @A/T SAID I WAS THE 2ND(AFTER HIS TEST BOATS) COULD POST A PICTURE IF YOU CAN TELL ME HOW (I HAVEN'T A CLUE ) MY EMAIL IS KREG@SHAGRUGLA.COM ALSO IM RUNNIN AT ALTITUDE I'M A UTARD (FROM UTAH) COULD POST ENGINE SPECS 600 HP MAY BE A LITTLE HIGH. FROM 60-68 THE MPH'S CAME SLOWER. WITH THE PANTHER I WAS SPINNING 5800R'S
WITH THE ENERGIZER KIT I'M DOWN TO 5300-5400 I THINK I SHOULD HAVE WENT WITH AN A IMPELLER INSTEAD OF A B. ON MY MADEN JOURNEY WITH THE KIT MY BACK SEAT BLEW OUT (1 OF EM) NEVER FOUND IT EITHER. RON FOUND THAT FUNNY. PORPOISED (DONT THIK I SPELLED THAT RIGHT) ONCE WITH JUST ME IN IT YIKES.

[Cas]

This Is My 1st Post. Just Couldn't Take It Anymore.hope This Is Going On The Panther Thread. I Put The Energizer On My Tahiti 18'bbc Prox 600 Hp Could Barely Hit 55 Before Kit Now Boat Does 68.7 On Gps Think She Will Go To 70 Plus With A Little Tuning. I Was Impressed,no Loading Issues. Boat Does Seam Alittle Looser Pretty Sure Running Less Wet Now.
apparently Doug's Tahiti with a mild 460 and a Panther will clean your clock also. My old Tahiti 19' mini cruiser did 66 or so with a pretty stock 454 and my old 21' Tahiti did a best of 59 with the same engine that was in the 19. Neither one of those tached over 4900. That same 19' boat has now hit 71 with a 454 that's been built up a little.
A little time and energy along with a little thought can go along way without having to spend a ton of money.

[H20MOFO]

To My New Buddy. Let's Put It This Way Before The Energizer Kit I Couldn't Break 60 Now I've Almost Hit 70.i've Not Tuned The Boat Yet. If You Have A Day Cruiser That Will Run 70 On Pump Gas In Utah I'll Buy It Right Now. Back On The Subject I Think The Energizer Kit Was A Good Investment. Hope To Add A Place Diverter This Winter. BY THE WAT I REALLY AM IN THE MARKET FOR A DAY CRUISER. MY WIFE SAYS "YOUR BOAT TOO SMALL,TOO LOUD,TOO FAST.

[jrork]

apparently Doug's Tahiti with a mild 460 and a Panther will clean your clock also. My old Tahiti 19' mini cruiser did 66 or so with a pretty stock 454 and my old 21' Tahiti did a best of 59 with the same engine that was in the 19. Neither one of those tached over 4900. That same 19' boat has now hit 71 with a 454 that's been built up a little.
A little time and energy along with a little thought can go along way without having to spend a ton of money.
Steve, You and I have been pretty damn tight for quite sometime (thinking back to the old LBBA boards and I've been a big fan (even wear your tshirts proudly). For some reason you have got a hard-on for this kit and though we have talked by phone and email, you continue to take shots at it. Nobody is asking for you to buy it.
H2OMOFO has not made any shots at anything but merely presented what he has found to be true in HIS boat. Your first response is "apparently Doug's Tahiti with a bla bla bla will clean your clock".
Come on, give it up. H20 wasnt asking for your opinion and you made an ass out of yourself with the response.
Should we discuss how you told me that Panther has contacted you about some "new" performance parts they are making and would like you to be the vendor and open up as a service shop? Could this be the reason for your love of bashing this kit? Hell if I know, regardless, I wish you the the very best in the endevor but as far as bagging on the Energizer kit, give it a rest. You're sounding like a broken record here.
I will say that I have enjoyed talking to you over the years and picking your brain on your experiance with the Panther. They didn't make significant improvements to my boat but that's not to say it wont to others.
For the record, I pretty damn sure the Energizer is not gonna be the answer to everyone (nor has anyone that I know of made that statement). With the ability to be able to fiddle with the tune up, getting a "real" diverter, and real parts (let's compare shaft size (does that sound gay?)), I am tickled pink to give this a try. If I can not cut the crap out of my boat but merely bolt this one in it's place, sounds pretty good to me. Tom and Ron have been standup from the get go about things. I cant ask for anything more than that.
Best of luck but let's just give it a rest.
PS, you can also delete my account on your board similar to the posts where you were calling everyone out for real numbers (which Ron at AT provided you and you in turn quickly dumped the entire tech category only to return it filtered by you)
Jeezus, I don't go off like this....sorry to everyone for the rant but enough is enough........John

[H20MOFO]

If You Do The Energizer Kit You Do Need To Cut 2 Holes In Your Boat. The F-wd And Rev. Cable And Steering Are Re-routed. Ron Is Very Helpful.

[Cas]

H20,
Check out the boat jimthetoolman has for sale. It's a 21' Apache tunnel with a small block that runs 65, it's down in the spam section or on the Sacramento area Craigslist. I know it's a long way to go but it's a helluva boat for a good price.
John,
Show me where I bagged on the kit, I gave poker places to go for more info, even suggested he talk to Ron. SAre you not going with a blown big block? Is it wrong to suggest poker compare apples to apples?
If you're referring to this-
If you're gonna change, make the complete change to the mixed flow to have the ability to utilize all the options available to better tune the set-up.
that's my opinion which hasn't changed ever.
As far as H20, I also did not say anything that wasn't true, hell, Doug's boat kicks butt on a LOT of other boats. Now on to the other things-
1. I am not now or never was affiliated with Panther. Yes, I was asked to become an authorized dealer/repair shop, so what, I don't feel any different now than I did 5 years ago.
2. The whole Panther section on the LBBA board has been removed from public view as have just about everything regarding them. It was there for people to find info about Panthers not a place to spam. Ron's info had nothing to do with the removal and you yourself was happy it was gone.
3. I asked for some info (numbers) back in March, none of the questions were answered not a "we don't know yet", "we're not done with testing", nothing. It wasn't until June that Ron found the time to answer a lot of those questions honestly. Those answers were very much appreciated by quite a few people, some of which are now thinking about purchasing the unit.
4. To me, anyone that is more informed on any product to make a decision based on any/all info available the best way, isn't it?
5. As far as looking like an ass, it isn't the first time and it surely won't be the last.

[H20MOFO]

:) Sorry If I Caused Some Friction; By The Way What Should A Tahiti Run @ 5300 R's With A- B Impeller. Say With A Berk? 18'

[jrork]

H20,
As far as looking like an ass, it isn't the first time and it surely won't be the last.
Agreed

[Cas]

:) Sorry If I Caused Some Friction; By The Way What Should A Tahiti Run @ 5300 R's With A- B Impeller. Say With A Berk? 18'
lots of variables involved to say for sure but as you saw, Dougs boat runs 74@5400 (equivilant to a B), another friend of mine's runs 71@5000 with an A/B, my first Tahiti w/berk ran about 62@4700 (A impeller). My Bahner is around 75 or so @ 5000 with an A/B.
which model Tahiti?
any hook in the bottom?
I'm assuming it's the new pump?

[H20MOFO]

I'D LOVE TOO POST A PICTURE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT MODEL I'D CALL IT AN 18' BUBBLE DECK. IF SOMEONE CAN HELP WITH THE PIC THANG MY E MAIL IS KREG@SHAGRUGLA.COM COULD PROVID PH# B-CAUSE NOT MUCH OF AN E-MAIL G-RU

[Cas]

send me the pics s.cas2006@sbcglobal.net and I'll post them

[jetboatperformance]

H20MOFO welcome to the world of ***boat boards Thanks for you story and more importantly thanks for your support and patience during the development of the Panther conversion project !! We @ JBP deeply appreciate the patience & faith that folks like you Jrork & Jan and Randy (therapy)displayed during the tooling R&D etc and I know Ron and Dustin @AT feel this way as well ! Tom
Remember "The Pioneers Always Take The Arrows"
PS. I sent you an Email to help you post pics if you need help
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/josh/Beating_A_Dead_Horse_by_livius.gif

[pokerboat]

Jrork howÂ’s your project coming along are you putting the pump together yourself or did tom do it for you.

[jrork]

I had Tom and the gang put it together for me. In talking with Josh though it sounds like its certainly doable at home as well.

[Cas]

H20,
I'm guessing this is your boat?
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/P1010081.jpg
if so, it appears to be an 18' Tahiti Super Tiger, same hull as DougS' boat although it's hard to see the deck-
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b218/PUMPkin455/Verona%20Joes%2007/VeronaJoes7-15-07134.jpg
here's an 18' Tahiti Bubble, is yours the same?
http://i7.ebayimg.com/05/i/000/ac/70/e969_1.JPG
one thing for sure, it throws a helleva roost!
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/P1010077.jpg
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/P1010062.jpg

[Cas]

here's a better pic of a bubble deck-
http://www.79tahiti.freecyberzone.com/images/upload.jpg

[H20MOFO]

Yep That Looks Like My Girl. Will Try To E-mail Cas Pics Tonite When I Get Home.

[H20MOFO]

Hey Cas By The Way How Much Is That Apache Tunnel Goin For? And What Impeller Do Ya All Think Would Be The Best Fit For Me. 427 Bbc
Brodix Bb2plus Heads 11.6 To 1 Crower Cam #01206 Intake 290 Dur .524 Lift. Exaust Side 302 Dur..536 Lift Comp Cam Roller Rockers. Single 4 High Rise. Bassett Headers 110 Octane Fuel.
Also H.p. Guess?? How Do I Check For Rocker. Just Lay A Straight Edge On The Bottom Of My Boat?

[Cas]

Hey Cas By The Way How Much Is That Apache Tunnel Goin For? And What Impeller Do Ya All Think Would Be The Best Fit For Me. 427 Bbc
Brodix Bb2plus Heads 11.6 To 1 Crower Cam #01206 Intake 290 Dur .524 Lift. Exaust Side 302 Dur..536 Lift Comp Cam Roller Rockers. Single 4 High Rise. Bassett Headers 110 Octane Fuel.
Also H.p. Guess?? How Do I Check For Rocker. Just Lay A Straight Edge On The Bottom Of My Boat?
I just saw that it has a Panther :sqeyes:
here's the ad- he's asking $4,000.00
Clean jet boat one owner small block chevy pather pump gel coat in get shape and seats perfect cond. motor's got roughly 30 hrs on it. runs 65mph on gps empty and loaded 55 mph on gps need to sell by the second make me an offer come take a look my loss need to pay bills. chad 209-304-5078 call please not on the computer much.
taking a guess at hp, that's tough......540 to 575 maybe? impeller choice will really depend on where the engine is making it's power. I'll try to get your engine on Desktop Dyno just to get an idea where the HP and TQ curves are.
As far as checking for hook or rocker, use a 4' straight edge on the bottom of the boat measuring from the transom forward. If it's like a lot of Tahiti's, it may have about 3/16" hook.

[lilsquirt]

Mike,
It'll likely be late season at best.
Its ALREADY late in the season John :D Get to it already. :)

[Cas]

H20,
According to DTD, the peak power is around 6500 to 7000 rpms (642 hp). Being that I don't have a lot of the numbers for your cam and heads, it's probably off. If the peak power is up that high, the engine would most likely like something more in the B range for an impeller.

[H20MOFO]

Thanks For The Info. It Seems Like My Gps Takes A While To Catch Up. Seems Like I'm Doin Quicker Than 69 .(its A Hand Held) Would A Boat Mounted Unit Be More Accurate. Last Time At The Lake #'s Went Up After I Got Out Of It.

[Cas]

I found the same to be true with my gps lately. It seems to be taking longer to acquire the satellite hook up and it's taking longer to update, squirt is having the same issue with his. I'm not sure what's changed in the past couple of months but something has.
How long are you staying in it?

[H20MOFO]

I Haven't Been In The Water As Much As I Like.summer Has Been Blown Due To Relocating My Buisness Thanks U.d.o.t. The Only Time I've Left My Foot In Was That Maiden Voyage. (when I Was Alone) When The Wife Is With Me She Screams When The Fours Open. When I Did 68.7 It Was Still Climbing But Slowly. When My Seat Blew Out It Caused A Fuel Leak Had To Cut It Short.

[Cas]

based on our conversation, it sounds like you have a lot more you've yet to hit. I'm really looking forward to hearing/reading what it's going to do. As mentioned, I'd try a longer ride plate so the water isn't coming up and hitting the nozzle. With that turbulent water hitting the nozzle, it could very well be the reason why you're getting a squirrely feeling?
The longer ride plate will also help get more of the boat out of the water, give you a little more tuning and a better ride in the rough stuff.
Hmmmm, just looked at the pic of your install again. It doesn't appear there are fins on your existing ride plate which could be another reason for the squirrely feeling at speed? There's nothing down there to help the boat track.

[pokerboat]

H2O Do you think you could post pics. Of the install if there are more
Thank Mike

[H20MOFO]

I'm Not Positive But It Sure Seems Like The New Bowl Sticks Further Out The Rear Of The Boat (than The Panther) A Place Diverter Would Make The Even Longer Right? Wondering If A Jet Mounted Rudder Would Help? I'm Going To Go Home Tonite And See What I Can Do About Some Type Of Extention For That Ride Plate. Also Will Check For Rocker. WILL TRY TO GET PICS TO STEVE TONITE. HE SAID HE WOULD POST THEM 4 ME. THANKS STEVE

[H20MOFO]

Hey Steve I Sent Those Pics (i Hope )wanted To Send MoRe Like 1 Of My Power Plant. If Anyone Wants A Different View Of Anything Let Me Know. If Its Ok I'd Like To Send More You Can Post On The "send Pics Of The Jet Boat Thread" Somebody Should Tell My Sorry But How To Post A Pics. By The Way Steve What Do You Do For A Living?

[Cas]

keep on sending away! I just need to resize them a bit before posting but they'll be here shortly.
and yes, the conversion does stick out further, 10"- 12"? don't know for sure since I haven't seen one up close yet. And yes, adding a diverter would extend it even more. That was one of my concerns....too much weight hanging off the back for the insert to carry. I think Tom addressed that though.
General Contractor and played some golf professionally (not with the guys on tv). I won a tourney at South Mountain a few years ago.

[H20MOFO]

How Far Should I Try To Extend That Ride Plate (that Is What Its Called Right) And Why I'm Askin Dumb Questions Why Do Some Boats Have Transom Plates.

[H20MOFO]

I Just Read Your Last Post Again(STEVE) I'm Also Concerned About Weight But My Concern Is When I'm Towing To The Lake. Not While Im In The Lake. Am I Worried About The Wrong Concern? If I Add A Diverter Would You (or Anyone) Recomend A Manual Or Hyd. I Was On Here A Few Months Ago And Most Everyone Prefered A Manual. A/t Sugusted Hyd.?

[Cas]

here's your pics-
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l204/Cas2006/Random%20Pics/IMG_0275_2_.jpg
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l204/Cas2006/Random%20Pics/IMG_0278_1_.jpg
good looking boat and yep, you have the bubble deck. Based on what I've done, that hull can be made to go pretty darn good!
Towing was where my concern was also. With the trailer bouncing around, that added down force might be an issue but adding a couple of supports would help out a lot. That's where Tom has addressed it, he has some supports available.
With the ride plate, I'd try one long enought to extend about an inch past the 8 bolts holding the nozzle on. I'd set it at about 2º up in relation to the bottom of the boat to start with.
Here's a pic of the cradle that holds the ride plate to the bowl-
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l204/Cas2006/84%20Bahner/DSC01009.jpg
You can probably gt the cradle right from A/T. The above stuff are thngs I would try and by no means are based on any experience with the conversion.
I have the hydraulic system and like it, it's all personal preferrence though.

[H20MOFO]

Again Steve Thanks For The Info. I Hope To Go Out This Weekend May Have New #'s

[H20MOFO]

Who Is Tom I'll Take Some (supports) .

[Cas]

my bad, I thought you bought the kit through Tom at Jet Boat Performance.

[H20MOFO]

Wow I Hope I Did'nt Get Ron In Trouble . Just For ThE Record I've Been Calling A/t For Over A Year. Way B-4 The Kit Was Ever Advertised

[jetboatperformance]

H2 My son and business partner Josh developed built and designed the "proto type " (later produced by A/T ) that your current jet conversion is based on. If you would like to call or give me a number to call you at i'll explain the "bracing" and "walk" you thru the procedure .I'd also enjoy chatting with you re the "project" and like to hear feed back on the performance,handling etc thanks Tom
Jet Boat Performance 805 466 4719 10 to 6 ... m thru fri
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Panther%20Prototype/MVC-045.jpg

[Cas]

Wow I Hope I Did'nt Get Ron In Trouble . Just For ThE Record I've Been Calling A/t For Over A Year. Way B-4 The Kit Was Ever Advertised
I doubt anyone will get in trouble. From what Ron said at one time, Josh, Tom's son, pretty much developed the conversion kit and AT is producing it. The one thing about the supports, I think I would get a longer pair that would extend to the nozzle bolts maybe make a bracket for the to mount to.

[Cas]

finally found the pic showing the supports. If you look closely, you can see the supports going from the transom to the Panther ride plate bolts.
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/randy%20thompson/100_1062.jpg
If it were mine, I'd go from the transom to the bolts holding the nozzle on. Extending the supports to that location will give a lot more support to help carry the extra weight.

[pokerboat]

CAS what do you mean by putting a cradle on

[Cas]

poker,
Here's a better picture of a ride plate cradle-
http://www.hi-techperformance.com/images/Cradle_9975cr.jpg
the top bolts into the bowl and the bottom bolts to the ride plate. There are usually some shims between the ride plate and the bottom of the cradle so adjustments can be made to attain the optimum angle.

[jetboatperformance]

H20mofo, although not a panther conversion/modification this is a general "concept" from my sons boat Tom
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/josh/DSC01283.jpg

[pokerboat]

Thanks for the pics showing the cradle and the supports which is better

[jetboatperformance]

Poker we don't often use the cast "cradle" believing them to be cumbersome. We also believe they provide greater interference and are harder to adjust (requiring shims). Cradles also neccesistate drilling and tapping the bowl. The set up you see is a little more expensive to initially build but worth the effort. IMO Tom
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/steves%20eliminator/DSC03854.jpg

[H20MOFO]

Thanks Tom I'll Be Callin Today (i'm All Over It) I Was Going To Add Some Glass Work This Winter But That Looks Like A Much Better Plan. If I Extend My Ride Plate Would I Want The Piece To Be Flat Or Extend The One I Have Angleing Upward From Where The Orig. One Stops? And Steve Your Pretty Good Put A Straight Edge On Her Last Night Looks Like I'm An Un-happy Hooker. Does That Serve No Purpose But To Slow Me Down? Seem Like It Might Help Feed The Jet.

[Cas]

3/16" hook huh? That one is going to be up to you if you want to tackle the chore of removing it. The thoughts on hook is the faster you try to go, the more the bow is forced down thus creating more wetted surface which in turn will prevent the boat from reaching higher speeds.
Check the hook again with a 3' straight edge, if it's now 1/8" or less, I wouldn't worry about it too much on a lake boat.
The way I see it is if you can get to your goal with it the way it is, why bother? Then again, goals change :D
The ride plate should look like the one on Josh's boat that Tom posted. It appears that the end of his ride plate is about even with the nozzle mount. It also shows the rails on top to prevent the ride plate from bowing up in the middle.
would you mind taking a picture of your install from the same angle as this picture?
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/P1010062.jpg
The reason I'd like to see it is back in the day, there wasn't much concern on how the inserts were installed by some of the boat builders. I've seen a couple where the pump was installed a good 5º off. The one in the pic above looks to me like it has too much up angle but it could also be the angle the picture was taken.

[H20MOFO]

Yeh I'll Give It A Shot My 19 Year Old Sent The Last Ones 4 Me And He's Gone. So It May Take A Day Or 2 If I Cant Get It. When You Mentioned 2* Up. Is That Based On In Relationship To The Bottom Of The Boat. I Want A Diverter Now. Going To Call Tom To See If He Can Also Help With That Too.
In The Mean Time Was Thinking About Using A Racheting Strap To Provide Some Support While Towing Mabey Laso Jet And Hook It To My Ski Pylon. I Used A 6' Edge To Check My Hook And 3/16 Is Pretty Darn Close To What I Have.

[pokerboat]

Very informative thanks again for the pics. Tom do you need the support straps from the jet to the transom and is this just because of the way the panther is mounted in the boat and dose this panther kit stick out further then if I was to change the pump out to A/T or dom.
Thank Mike

[H20MOFO]

I Guess I Need To Pay A Little Closer Attention(steve) You Already Told Me 2 Up In Relationship To The Bottom. Oops On That Jet Angle Deal Can You Really See That In A Picture Or Is There Some Way I Can Check At Home?

[American Turbine Man]

[QUOTE=Cas;2707885]I just saw that it has a Panther :sqeyes:
here's the ad- he's asking $4,000.00
65 MPH 21 foot boat small block Panther, if that boat will run 65 mph on MY GPS I'll give him $8000.00
CAS you should know better.
ATM
Here is the Press Release and test results for the Panther Kit, maybe this won't be "cleaned out"
Panther Energizer Kit
I had been toying with the idea of a Panther jet energizer kit for about two years, since the Jacuzzi YJ and WJ kits have been so successful. When Josh from Jet Boat Performance phoned me up and told me that he had assembled some basically stock parts and had mocked up a kit for the Panther. Josh said he had used parts from our YJ kit, a WJ kit and other American Turbine parts, I said that I was going to do the same thing but just had not had the time. He said he would test it and report the results. The results were good so I commenced to purposely design the kit using solid works 3D software. After designing the kit we machined two kits from billet material. We assembled the two prototypes and then located two boats one was a twenty-three foot Sleekcraft, the other was an eighteen-foot Tahiti so we had the full spectrum of the usable application. Both were stock 325 hp 454Â’s the Sleek needed motor work, as evidenced by only turning the AA impeller 3800, the distributor cap was literally wired down with bailing wire. To be fair I have to tell you that neither of the Panther jets was fresh. So here are the following results.
Sleekcraft Twenty-Three
PANTHER JET
RPM SPEED
3925 30.00 mph
4800 39.73 mph
W/ PANTHER JET ENERGIZER KIT installed “AA” impeller
RPM SPEED
3275 30.00 mph
3800 44.10 mph (this engine is really down on power)
Tahiti Eighteen
PANTHER JET
RPM SPEED
3413 30mph
4900 52.35mph
W/ PANTHER JET ENERGIZER KIT installed “A” impeller
RPM SPEED
3013 30mph
4350 59.75
4350 61.75 Turbine Trim installed
After the installation of the kits you can “mat” the throttle on both of these boats without slipping the jet. I think the Energizer kit will show even greater performance difference with “hopped up” engines. Also after installing the kit you can now take advantage of all the performance hardware droop snoots etc. The installation takes about eight hours and the skill level is seven on a scale of ten.
Tim it is important to me that mention Josh from Jet Boat Performance as the first one to do this, we just refined it and put it into production.
Thanks, Ron

[H20MOFO]

Hey Ron If Your Still Out There What Are Your Feelings About Possibly Gaing Some Mph By Extending My Ride Plate(or Anyone Else) Was Telling Cas My Boat(for Lack Of Better Way To Describe It) Seems Looser At Speed Maybe I'm Running Less Wet Now. Or Maybe It's Because Im 10mph Faster. Cas Thought Turbulence At The Jet Nozzle May Be Part Of What's Goin On. Is The Steering Ratio Quicker Now. Seems Pretty Sensitive (don't Get Me Wrong Best $3000.00 I've Spent On Her)

[Cas]

Kreg,
Tom does have good prices on the diverters, manual or hydraulic.
power,
When the first pictures of the conversion kits were posted, my first thoughts/concerns were about the added length and weight. It's not so much the amount weight as it is the location of the weight being transfered outside the boat more. The question in my mind is whether or not the Panther insert would be able to handle that weight given the way the pump is mounted. The concern as mentioned above, is when the boat is being towed and hitting bumps in the road.
There are a few ways to beef it up, one of which is adding some sort of support ie: struts, straps, or somethng else to help carry that load when towing. I guess it's more a peace of mind thing for me based on my construction background dealing with loads, spams, stress points, etc.
Ron,
I just posted what was in the ad. I make no claim to actual performance ;)
Then again, I've seen 3 different Tahiti/Panther/small block packages that did 65+. From what I understand, that 21' tunnel has a 440 hp small block so you just never know. :)
I think the owner is here on the boards?
BTW, thanks again for posting up that info on the conversion. The last sentence before the results about "just to be fair" says a lot about your honesty/integrity!

[H20MOFO]

Pokerboat If You Decide To Go With The Panther Conv. I'd Recomend The Belhousing That Has The Window. Because I Found It Way Eaiser To Un Bolt The Driveline From The Crank, Than Try To Lift The Jet Poke It Through The Back Of The Boat. And Line Up The Splines On The Driveshaft. Just Takked To Tom And Ordered A Diverter.

[H20MOFO]

Pokerboat: If You Decide To Go With The Panther Conv. I'd Recomend The Belhousing That Has The Window. Because I Found It Way Eaiser To Un Bolt The Driveline From The Crank, Than Try To Lift The Jet Poke It Through The Back Of The Boat. And Line Up The Splines On The Driveshaft. By The Way, Just Talked To Tom And Ordered A Diverter. Will Keep Ya All Posted On That.(am I The Only Utard?)

[pokerboat]

Thank for the info itÂ’s nice to talk to someone who is running this conversion. When you change your ride plate you will have to let me know how your boat is handling and if it helped your top speed. And post some more pics. I am from Vancouver Canada

[H20MOFO]

You Got It Pokerboat. What R U In Now? Or Is That Why Your Fixing This 1 Up?

[pokerboat]

I got a 16’ Jetster with a 351w and a Berkley 12je jet pump; it’s a nice little boat. It runs 48 mph on the gps. My 3 kid have made me outgrow it. It’s for sale plus two other boats couldn’t bring my Taylor home until I deplete the fleet. I got my Taylor parked at a friends house. http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_IMG_1758.jpghttp://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_IMG_1797.jpg

[camoman]

That boat of DougS sure did run. Damn that was over two years ago at easter right ?
I was running back then about 72 - 73mph on GPS
Yes that was a couple of years ago and he totally sawed me back then too. Since then i've done some serious changes from the diverter to the crank pulley and ended up with a 40mph gain:jawdrop:

[jetboatperformance]

John ,just can't resist Thanks... Tom
before
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/camomans/Panther-001.jpg
after
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/camomans/MVC-057S.jpg

[H20MOFO]

Camo. Do You Have Athe Same Kit As I? What Impeller Do You Run? I Have A-b And It Sure Seems Like I Could Pull An A. If I Cant Get This Suka To 80 (er Dam Close) I Guess It'll Be Blower Time. Whats Your Power Plant And Your Top End? Was The Diverter Worth About 3-5 On Your Boat?

[Cas]

he did the full replacement from Panther to Dominator

[pokerboat]

Mofo go to jet boat performance and click on projects then look at Panther Jet drive to set-back Dominator conversion that is camoÂ’s boat.

[Cas]

camo's boat is a perfect example of what my opinion is based on. With the complete swap out, he has all of the tuning tools available to him to get the most out of his boat. Granted, he may have higher speed goals for his boat than many people so he chose the route with less limitations.
Yes, the conversion kit makes for an easier install and yes more performance options will be available to use. To me and my thought process, if a change is in order, why not go all the way?

[H20MOFO]

Camo Or Tom What Was The Bottom Line $ For A Complete Swap?
(not That I'm Consedering Now) Just Curious. Cas Has Me Confused B-4 His Point (i Thought) Was That $ Would Be Better Spent On Tuning Ect.now Its Complete Conversion? What The? Still Would Like To Hear What Camo's Boat Does. Maybe Tom Or Somebody Could Tell Us Why A Complete Conversion May Be Better. If I Understood Ron Correctly His Only Concern For The Kit Was Loading Issues.(which I've Yet To Experiance Any)

[Cas]

Kreg,
I'm all about trying to get the best out of what a person has the most economical way, in the long run. I very much find the conversion kit interesting and I'm definitely waiting to hear about it more, find out what may or may not work on it ie: longer ride plate, droops, wedges, etc. Since you already have the conversion, I'd really like to see you get the most out of it. If my background with the Panther can be of help, I'm all for giving suggestions.
I'm not bashing you or anyone else that does the kit, this is my own opinion
To be real honest, I'd just get another hull with what I wanted/needed and rebuild from there. I'm not one to sink a whole bunch of money into something that I'd get no return on. Again, that's my personal opinion.

[H20MOFO]

Yeh Hindsite Is 20/20 Had A Know A Little More About The Panther I'd Probably Kept Looking. I Paid 6900 For The Boat Blew The Motor B-4 The 1st Payment. Spent 6k On That, 3k On The Kit. And The Boat Is Still Worth 6900(or Somewhere In There) Was Always In Eliminators Of My Dads,brothers,sisters, Ect. In Fact We Bought So Many Of Them In The 70's They Made Us A Dealer In Utah(pleasure Craft Ltd.) Then Later It Was Otto At Otto's Auto And Marine Now I'm Not Sure Who It Is. Ironically,the Guy I Bought This Boat From Was A Good Friend Of Otto (when He Was Alive) When I Told Him I Grew Up In Boats With Berks He Proceeded To Tell Me How He' Kick Otto's But On The Lake All Day Long With His Panther. Live And Learn I Guess.

[Cas]

Also, a lot of my opinion is based on the prices of boats around where I live. You can pick up a heckuva a boat for $4K or less.
For example-
1978 Tahiti Jet Boat. Ford 460. Berkeley jet drive. Runs awesome. Edelbrock intake manifold and chrome covers. Mallory distributor. Holley carb. Dual 10 gal. fuel tanks. Updated fuel and tach gauges. Newer upholstery. New throttle and steering cables. Tandem trailer included, which was re-welded, painted, rewired, and fitted with all new lights in 2005. Brand new tires have less than 250 miles on them. Everything works, one crank start every time. $4,000.00
http://images.craigslist.org/01010201020501031120070802096c7a3031fd986e68004681 .jpg
$4900 for this 1975 Eliminator (been for sale at this price for awhile)-
http://images.craigslist.org/0102010103110104032007080159d77d4f541bdae2360055b7 .jpg
this one is $2,000.00
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb137/francisodon/boat.jpg
and here's Tahiti Bubble Deck BBC/Panther that I've been thinking about buying for $2500.00
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l204/Cas2006/Tahiti_Panther.jpg
I guess prices of boats are higher in different areas.

[H20MOFO]

That Eliminator Looked Pretty Good. Don't Think I Could Bring My Self To Have A Ferd. I Know There R Plenty Of Ya With 1 That Could Clean My Clock. Just So Many More Options For A Chev. My Boat As I Bought It Was Over Priced. Guy Claimed To Have 10k In The Motor Alone And When We Test Drove It And I Saw The Tach Fly Way Past 5k I Thought Wow This Thing Is Flyin. (THE ELIMINATORS WE HAD NEVER SEER R'S MUCH PAST AMOUT 4400) Well Guess The Motor Was.
I Wouldn't Sell It Now For 6900.00. There Is A 21' Eliminator (1979) On Ksl.com Here In Slc. The Guy Is Askin 3995.00 I Bet He'd Take 3500.00 Or Less (it A Ferd) BY THE WAY ANYONE HOW FAST WOULD YA EXPECT AN 18 ELIM. BUBBLE DECK TO GOIN AT THAT RPM? AA IMPELLER I ASSUME.

[camoman]

Yeah, keep looking around for what you're looking for, its out there;) This boat was one i wanted to keep and it had a Panther in it. After using this boat for a couple of years I was disgusted with the performance of the panther. The output I got out of the Panther was 57mph max. It was time to make a change! So, I opted for a complete pump change that I owe credit to Tom and Josh at Jet Boat Performance in Atascadero. This was one of the best upgrades that I've ever done to make this boat perform at its optimum level. I can't say enough about those two about taking on this project head first without even thinking about it.
With doing a complete pump change it gave me options of all performance upgrades that you can do to a jet pump. That's why i went that route. My ultimate goal was to breach the 80mph mark and with the pump and engine combo I put in there, i surpassed my goal and am now in the mid 90's:) So as of now this project is at it's peak. Possibly later down the road if I pick up a more proven hull then i can move forward with completing my project. Then the wife gets the hand me down of the old hull! Hopefully Santa brings me a Gullwing down the road;)

[H20MOFO]

Wow 90's I'm Impressed. And No Blower? How Can I Talk To (type To) One OF YOU GUYS Directly On Here Is That What A P.m. Is? I Can Tell I'm Gettin Off Subject. I Was Going To Tell Cas To Hurry And Buy One Of Those Boats He Posted So I Can Beat Him. Lol. Still Curious On Price I Know Asking Is Tacky Don't Answer If You Dont Want To I Figured Poker Would Also Be Curious.

[pokerboat]

Yes I would be interested if you don't mind camo

[camoman]

Ttt

[H20MOFO]

SORRY POKER NO NEW #'S FROM ME YET. RAINED ALL WEEKEND HERE. HEY CAMO WHAT KIND OF MPH ARE YOU AT 5300 R'S.(I HOPE TO SEE 75 ISH WITH TRIM AND A LITTLE MORE FOOT TIME) AND TO HIT 90 PLUS HOW MANY R'S FOR THAT? I'M GOING TO ATTEMPT TO POST A PICTURE OF MY MUSIC MAKER.C:\Documents and Settings\kreg\My Documents\My Pictures\Picture
HMMM I GUESS I DON'T GET IT.(DUMB UTARD)

[jetboatperformance]

Here ya go John ...Tom (ya i know its camoman,cant edit the title)
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/camomans/CamoMansspeedo.jpg

[camoman]

Yo H20 i am spinning a A/B cut stainless about 59ish for my top end fully loaded pump;) The heads are my limiting factor but thats ok this hull is probably way over it's limit:confused: If i had something a little more proven say a Gullwing then a set of A-460 Heads would be on this engine to let this beeeoouuucccchhhh breath;) Keep us updated on your goal and try different things some work some don"t but setup is the key to get a boat to run to it's optimum;)

[Cas]

Wow 90's I'm Impressed. And No Blower? How Can I Talk To (type To) One OF YOU GUYS Directly On Here Is That What A P.m. Is? I Can Tell I'm Gettin Off Subject. I Was Going To Tell Cas To Hurry And Buy One Of Those Boats He Posted So I Can Beat Him. Lol. Still Curious On Price I Know Asking Is Tacky Don't Answer If You Dont Want To I Figured Poker Would Also Be Curious.
I'm still debating on whether or not I want another boat hanging around here :D When I was doing more pump rebuilds, I would install them in a boat for a test run before sending them out as I wanted to make sure they would do what I wanted them to. That Tahiti Bubble Deck would be a perfect candidate for that :)
As far as pricing on a complete replacement from a Panther to a AT/Berk/Dom/Legend/Aggresser style pump, here's a semi educated guess.
If you go with a brand new pump and have someone do the cut-out, glass work and install- somewhere between $4500 and $5500
If you're able to do the glass work yourself, knock off $500 to $1000 or so
If you can get yourself a used pump, get it rebuilt and do the glasswork/install yourself, it could be done for as little as about $1500.00 to $2,000. That would be about $400.00 to $600.00 for the pump/intake, $1000.00 for the rebuild and $100.00 for cloth/mat/resin and a couple hun for incidentals.

[pokerboat]

Thanks again cas, I would buy a different hull but I like the deck on this boat and I do all my own glass work thatÂ’s why IÂ’m swaying back and forth between replacing, rebuilding, or upgrading since I am in now hurry I was hoping to see what kind of numbers H2O and JRORK get

[jetboatperformance]

Poker should have some other "numbers" for you this week ,just got off the phone with a dealer in Minn .he's finishing a Mirage 20' BBF ,just swaped out a rebuilt Panther (with trim and bronze sleeve) for the "kit" and is finishing up now more to follow Tom

[Cas]

Thanks again cas, I would buy a different hull but I like the deck on this boat and I do all my own glass work thatÂ’s why IÂ’m swaying back and forth between replacing, rebuilding, or upgrading since I am in now hurry I was hoping to see what kind of numbers H2O and JRORK get
btw, if you're still thinking about putting that LS1 in the boat, I'd suggest you give Ron at American Turbine a call before thinking about any pump changes. I'm sure he will give you some really good info.

[pokerboat]

That would be great tom thanks
Cas IÂ’m not sure if I am going with the LS1 for sure I was just thinking of trying it because it just sitting in my shop (aluminum paper weight)
Thanks Mike

[jrork]

First let me say I know nothing about anything. There, now with the disclaimer out of the way, I’d like to discuss MY grade school understanding of the loading issues.
In my very uneducated view, the Panther insert has a configuration very similar to what to what many refer to as the “NASA Duct�. This style of inlet has been used extensively in airplane, hydroplane and automotive performance applications. While I realize there are significant differences between air and water, for purposes of moving a medium, it appears to this layman that it’s pretty darn efficient otherwise these guys wouldn’t be using them.
One of the biggest challenges (again my opinion or what I’ve been told by others) for Panther drives is the tendency to overload the pump by furnishing more water than the small stock impeller can handle which some have discussed might be a significant contributor to the cavitations/hi rpm issues that seem to creep up with these pumps. That there were some prototype Panther intakes developed years ago (somebody must have a picture) that allowed the driver to reduce the intake size to limit the overloading tends (in my feeble mind) to reinforce this theory.
Also, there has been quite a bit of discussion on other boards about the possible success of narrowing the intake dimensions thereby hopefully limiting the overcharging issue (at the possible expense of lower speed charging) also makes me think we’re headed in the right direction.
In addition, the whitewater boys have gone to great lengths to install protrusions into the intake (spoons) which to this dummy, look very similar to what is formed into the intake of a stock Panther insert again makes me want to tinker with this setup.
Also, it appears to this dumbass that the placement of the insert spaces the stock Panther intake back just about as far as a person would want. Many “conventional pump� owners are going down this path in their quest for maximum speed at significant expense and/or labor to set their pumps back.
Okay, with all the babbling out of the way I’ll say with the Energizer, I hope to have the ability to (a) be able to try a number of different size impellers to use this perceived loading issue to it’s advantage, (b) be able to use inducers, wedges, snoots, droops, different size insert nozzles, different ride plate dimensions and of course a real diverter to fine tune the ride. If for some reason the insert would need additional water, I find it hard to imagine that with all the talent that is fiddling with performance jet boats, that someone couldn’t develop a shoe to try.
Support and bracing the pump/insert is all just a matter of doing it. Neither of these should be anymore difficult that what is necessary for any significant setback pump should require regardless of the intake. I’ve seen pictures and read accounts where this is needed with conventional intake setbacks as well.
Now with all that said, could I do all this with a different setup? Sure, if my boat didn’t already have a Panther. Can I go to the effort to change it over to a “conventional� intake? Sure but at some semi significant expense/labor. What this setup (in my feeble mind) provides is the ability to unbolt the stock Panther and slide the new Energized Panther in place. Sure there are some minor modifications (new hole for the steering cable and possible reinforcement devices discussed earlier in the thread) but none compare to the amount of work that a intake replacement would be.
Is there more resale value in a boat that has a conventional intake? Maybe, to the enthusiast. Not likely to the bulk of the folks out there that just want a boat that can throw a big roostertail and make a bunch of noise (I’m in this bunch).
Besides, who cares. I’m not planning on selling my boat anytime soon and enjoy tinkering with it.
Will the Energizer be something that will likely set the world on fire? Hell if I know. Does the Energizer give us Panther owners some new options? You Bet! That alone is enough for me to give this a try and see what I can wring out of it.
Stay tuned and let’s keep this discussion going. Ultimately, it will provide a better product.
John

[jetboatperformance]

Heres some interesting "info' to go with... the actual abstract can be found by typing in the patent ## 444,9944 Talks about actually "closing down" the Panther (maritec) intake at higher speeds I seem to recall Tom http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4449944.html
Good post John
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Misc/DSC05912.jpg

[H20MOFO]

Hey Tom R-u Getting Close To Those Ride Plate #'s? I'm Ready To Be The Lab Rat. ITS OFF SUBJECT BUT DO YOU SELL THAT TINTABLE EPOXY LIKE WHAT WAS IN THE LAST HOT BOAT ISSUE?

[jrork]

Hey Tom R-u Getting Close To Those Ride Plate #'s? I'm Ready To Be The Lab Rat.
I feel like I've been cheated on.... Mofo shows up and I'm kicked to the curb. ;)

[H20MOFO]

Dude I Thought We Were On The Same Team?

[pokerboat]

Jrork how is your project coming along how about posting some pic of your progress.

[jrork]

Dude I Thought We Were On The Same Team?
We are, but if an opportunity to take a shot at Tommy presents itself, we owe it to ourselves to take it. :D

[jrork]

:Jrork how is your project coming along how about posting some pic of your progress.
Poke, I could but it'd be pretty damn uninspiring. Take one decent looking boat, tear it apart, grind the piss out of the fiberglass to cap it, lose a bunch of the surplus holes and glass it all back together.
So what I guess I'm saying is it'd be a hull and a pile of parts (some of them really shiny:D ) .
If still interested, I will but I won't hijack this thread amd just start a new one.............John

[jetboatperformance]

H20 ,Josh is "working away" on some very cool Ride plate innovation/improvements that we belive will serve the E pumps and the Panther.
Re the "epoxy" sorry haven't had a chance to read about it yet,i'll do my homework
Re "kick to the curb"... NEVER ,John your my "homie"!! lets get that Hot Rod in the water! Tom

[jrork]

Josh is "working away" on some very cool Ride plate innovation/improvements that we belive will serve the E pumps and the Panther.
Tom
Very cool. Can't wait to see what he dreams up this time.
As I mentioned, gotta get one project finished (hopefully tonight) and then it's full steam ahead on the tugboat.

[Josh@JBP]

Wow, it always seems to amaze me how i no more that think of an idea and the next day I'm reading about it on one or more forums. But what can i say, its positive motivation from my #1 supporter.
My tinkering is more or less self serving this time, the CVX20 ran near perfect off the trailer, so that means I need to mess with something. Also gives me a reason to use the mill and make a mess.
and John, You should be workin ("hull and a pile of parts") instead of waitin around for my dreams, I'll be the first to tell ya sometimes they hurt my head

[H20MOFO]

Hi Josh. I Want To Order Some Turn Buckles From You Guys And Water Jet Out Some (mickey Mouse Ears) So I Can Brace My Pump Like Thi Pics You Guys Posted. Should I Hold Off On That Until You Figure The Ride Plate Thing Out. Not Sure If It Will Be A Whole Nother Ride Plate Or A Mod To The Existing one. (i'm Bored And Want To Start On It.)

[jrork]

Wow, it always seems to amaze me how i no more that think of an idea and the next day I'm reading about it on one or more forums. But what can i say, its positive motivation from my #1 supporter.
My tinkering is more or less self serving this time, the CVX20 ran near perfect off the trailer, so that means I need to mess with something. Also gives me a reason to use the mill and make a mess.
and John, You should be workin ("hull and a pile of parts") instead of waitin around for my dreams, I'll be the first to tell ya sometimes they hurt my head
Looky there! Josh is online.:)
As far as working on my tub, I know, it'll be sparkling soon. Promise
Glad to hear your new boat worked out for you guys.

[Josh@JBP]

All power to you start playing arround with it. On the ears I usually make the center to center of the turn buckle pad mounts around 10.5" min (on a standard 8" wide ride plate the turn buckle center shafts would come too close to the bowl otherwise), and I would also suggest designing it to mount on the outside of the flange rather than in between. As far as the overall design of the ride plate, its in the works we'll keep ya informed. -Josh

[Josh@JBP]

I've always been here John, lurking in the shadows. The new boat was great and my daughter loved it to (first time in a boat). And Because I grew up with my Grandpa's near identical boat (except color), I've carfully taken note of all the little improvements I wanted to do, had I ended up with it. Staight from the launch ramp it felt like the same boat, like i was wearing blue tinted glasses or something. Good Times.

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

I've always been here John, lurking in the shadows. The new boat was great and my daughter loved it to (first time in a boat). And Because I grew up with my Grandpa's near identical boat (except color), I've carfully taken note of all the little improvements I wanted to do, had I ended up with it. Staight from the launch ramp it felt like the same boat, like i was wearing blue tinted glasses or something. Good Times.
Sup Josh? Hows business been? Tell your pops that I will be calling him in a few to square up with him:) Ive been moving so I havent had much time to do much.....

[Josh@JBP]

Sup Josh? Hows business been? Tell your pops that I will be calling him in a few to square up with him:) Ive been moving so I havent had much time to do much.....
Buisness is good, I'd ask how you were doing but I know how much moving sucks, just did that two months ago. You never realize how much crap you have till you have to move it all.
I'll let him know, wish I knew what that felt like I havent been square ($ wise) with him since I was 12:D

[jrork]

ITS OFF SUBJECT BUT DO YOU SELL THAT TINTABLE EPOXY LIKE WHAT WAS IN THE LAST HOT BOAT ISSUE?
Hey Mofo, I saw what you were talking about regarding the tintable epoxy. It's a misprint by saying "Wetsystem". I think what actually used is Westsystems Epoxy. It's definately tintable.
I've used the stuff and it's goooood! Spendy but really nice. Good luck.......John
http://www.westsystem.com/

[Cas]

That would be great tom thanks
Cas IÂ’m not sure if I am going with the LS1 for sure I was just thinking of trying it because it just sitting in my shop (aluminum paper weight)
Thanks Mike
I hope you do try it! I think you have the best chance of anyone to do all kinds of testing should you get the conversion. You could go from small block to big block with the stock unit and the conversion. I think that would be way cool except for the time involved switching back and forth with all the parts.
John,
Pretty cool you brought all that up as many of those topics were discussed by Ron and I. He's a great guy that I would suggest anyone needing more info needs to talk to providing he's got the time.

[Cas]

Tom,
Panther had a manually adjustable intake many years ago. The plans to build it yourself are still available but Panther no longer makes the unit due to liability issues. Back in the 70's someone closed off the intake nearly all the way which caused the boat to flip. All the info about it used to be posted on the original Panther board I had a couple of years ago.

[pokerboat]

Hey H2OMOFO did you get your boat out for more testing

[jrork]

Hey H2OMOFO did you get your boat out for more testing
Hope so. At least somebody is getting their boat wet cuz I sure am not.

[jetboatperformance]

As promised heres the most recent customer/dealer (Minnesota) install ! Numbers and results to follow The "kit" replaced a "fresh" ,bronze sleeved,internal divertered' factory rebuilt Panther drive. Tom ps Johnny Check your brown truck tommorow !!!
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Spicer%20Sports/MVC-041S.jpg
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Spicer%20Sports/MVC-039S.jpg

[pokerboat]

Hey tom great looking install what engine is in it and I noticed it doesnÂ’t have any supports on that install will that be a problem is that a must for this kit.

[jetboatperformance]

Poker the Motor here is a 460 ford reputed to be around 400 hp Regarding 'supports" nothing is included or supplied with the kit Tom

[jrork]

Thanks Tommy, can't wait for the truck to swing by. :D
Can you post up the pieces you and Josh use for the reinforcing struts so us neanderthals can make sure we order the right parts?

[jetboatperformance]

No problem 'cept I only have pics of Randy's and various set back Berks "Minnesota" is working on his as we speak Tom
PS got some numbers and feed back on the newest install ,will post up later

[jrork]

Should have seen me last night when I got home. Sitting in the middle of the living room floor surrounded by empty boxes and wrapping/packing paper all over the floor.
Santa brought me a brand new (REAL) Place Diverter, Cables and the most glorious of all things, a polished diverter control. :) :) :)
Thanks a bunch Tommy.

[jetboatperformance]

Every day is like Xmas every morning when the Brown truck comes ,only problem is I usually have to package the "cool shiny stuff" back up to send to you guys ... Tom

[jrork]

Every day is like Xmas every morning when the Brown truck comes ,only problem is I usually have to package the "cool shiny stuff" back up to send to you guys ... Tom
Bullchit, when I was there Rhonda was doing all the hard work and you were busy yelling at the broadband company (which was quite funny by the way :D )

[jetboatperformance]

ATT and SBC the companies I love to hate, 8 lines which all are intermittent ,most recently they fixed my fax line and simultaneously f#%ed up my DSL 8:00 pm ,Had cold beer ,relaxing chair NO HOT BOAT forums:mad: Tom
now ya went and got me goin

[jrork]

now ya went and got me goin
Then my work here is done.....:D

[H20MOFO]

Thanks For The Tip On The Tintable Epoxy Jrork. I'm All Over It, I Hate Carpet In A Small Boat.(it's Eaiser To Wash Out The Spilled Beer And Crunched Doritos Whit No Rug) . Sorry It Took Me A While To Get Back On Here I Was In Calif. All Week Me And The Battle Ax Took The Kids To Disneyland). Poker I Did Make It Out Not Yesterday But Last Saterday. Made It Out Of The Harbor,turned On The Gps, And The Battery Went Dead 30 Sec. Later. (not That It Matered Much It Was Too Choppy To Stay In It Very Long. About The 3rd Time I Poped The Jet Out Of The Water I Gave Up.) And Josh I Was Going To Call You (and Still Will) But Thought Poker And Jrork Would Be Curious About What You Had To Say About That Pump Brace/ride Plate Extention Issue.

[American Turbine Man]

H20MOFO what is the elevation where you run your boat?
ATM

[Cas]

Ron,
It was really good talking to you a couple of weeks ago, it was very enlightening! I've been trying to line up some suction housings for you but the ones I'm finding seem to be connected to a hull :D

[H20MOFO]

Hi Atm. I Believe Slc Is 4700 Ft. Thats Where I Boat Mostly. Some Times We Hit Flaming George I Think Its Closer To 6000. I Have A Friend With A 22' Nordic He Claims It Will Do 62 Here And 70 At Havasu.

[American Turbine Man]

Hi Atm. I Believe Slc Is 4700 Ft. Thats Where I Boat Mostly. Some Times We Hit Flaming George I Think Its Closer To 6000. I Have A Friend With A 22' Nordic He Claims It Will Do 62 Here And 70 At Havasu.
68 mph is pretty impresive at 4700 ft.
ATM

[jetboatperformance]

H20 josh is well into the "ride plate' project as of today mill work is done more to follow Tom

[H20MOFO]

Keep Me Posted Tom. Also Do You Sell The Mickey Mouse Ears Also.i Don't Have Access To A Band Saw.(i Could Have Some Water Jeted).
What I Didn't Posts Is The Last Time I Went Out About 30-40 Min Int My Day I Smoked Both Exaust Hoses,all At Once(thru Transom Bassetts) It Was Eaiser To Pull The Headers To Change. Anyway I Was Scarry Lean(two Tubes White). If Fed-x Gets Here In Time With My Pkg. I May Have New #'s Today Or Sunday)

[pokerboat]

JRORK did you get your boat back together and do you have any numbers

[H20MOFO]

Poker I'll Be Suprised If I Don't Have Something Better By Friday Night. My Advence On My Distributer Was Way Off,(over 40*+ Mech Only) Takin A 1/2 Day Of Friday To Try To Blow Her Up. (HOPE NOT)
TOM ANY KIND OF ETA ON THE NEW RIDE PLATE? I'LL TAKE ONE AND A DIVERTER. AND A BATTERY BOX .

[jetboatperformance]

H20 The ride plates a comin (E's and panthers ) AND were going to get fired up ona loader for the conversion as well (not to distant future) !! Meanwhile for your entertainment heres a VID of a boat we did a "remove Panther install Dominator" on year before last (watch after the tree) nice ride!! ps turn up the volume pss Thanks Big John you made my day yesterday !!!! Tom
http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x145/camoman202/th_JohnFourbay8-26-07.jpg (http://s185.photobucket.com/albums/x145/camoman202/?action=view&current=JohnFourbay8-26-07.flv)
http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x145/camoman202/th_JohnsBoat.jpg (http://s185.photobucket.com/albums/x145/camoman202/?action=view&current=JohnsBoat.flv)
http://jetboatperformance.com/index.php?p=Pantherdominator

[jrork]

That boat runs hard Tommy. No wonder he's so pleased with the outcome. Talk to you later.......me

[Longstr]

DAMN Tom I am impressed... That thing ROCKS... Carries that nose high... :devil:... love it man.. :D

[jetboatperformance]

Ryan John did a good job on the boat ,runs very hard and looks good too!! Tom
Ryan NICE avatar !btw is that boat Coast Guard rated for that many passengers? Tom

[Longstr]

Ryan John did a good job on the boat ,runs very hard and looks good too!! Tom
Ryan NICE avatar !btw is that boat Coast Guard rated for that many passengers? Tom
Tom at that point I didnt care if it sunk!!!!:D

[H20MOFO]

Well Poker I Have New #'s . All Worse. Now That I'm Set At 35* I Couldn't Even Get The Tack To 5k. I Have A Buddy That Swears A Timing Light Is Useless With A Large Cam With Alot Of Overlap. I Wish I'd Have Taken The Light To The Lake. Bumped It Up To 40* Total (WHEN I GOT HOME)And It Sound Alot Better. CAMO Did You Post On That What Is Your Speed At 4k Thread? I Checked Today At 3k Iwas 27mph At 4k I Was 46mph. And Near As I Could Tell 4900 R's Was Getin About 61-or 62. I Did Have 4 In The Boat And 2 Full Tanks.

[camoman]

H2O my mph @ 4000 rpm was about 58mph on an A/B cut impeller 90+ @ 5900:D

[H20MOFO]

I'm Goin To Look At That 4k Thread Again. Seems Like Most Were Faster Than I At 4k. Today I Was At About The Same Speed As B-4 The Kit. But I Was Turnin 1k More To Get There.
(BEFORE THE KIT). As Much As I Hate To Say It I'm Wishin Ida Done The Whole 9 Yards. Whats Your Prox H.p. Camo. I Know I'm Gettin Personal There.

[Cas]

I'm Goin To Look At That 4k Thread Again. Seems Like Most Were Faster Than I At 4k. Today I Was At About The Same Speed As B-4 The Kit. But I Was Turnin 1k More To Get There.
(BEFORE THE KIT). As Much As I Hate To Say It I'm Wishin Ida Done The Whole 9 Yards. Whats Your Prox H.p. Camo. I Know I'm Gettin Personal There.
sorry to hear you're feeling that way. The intake is one of the limiting factors with the Panther as far as top end. I have a couple of things I've done in the past that has worked with Panthers so if I can be of any help, just holler.

[jrork]

Ah nutz, sorry to hear you're struggling but dont give up that easy. Post up the issues and lets see if the gang here can help you step back from the ledge.:D
Looking at your previous posts makes me think you probably have some tuneup/setup issues contributing to this as your speeds seem to be dropping from your previous posts. I've posted them all on this one reply so we as a group we all can try to figg'r this one out for you.
Hang it there......John
This Is My 1st Post. Just Couldn't Take It Anymore.hope This Is Going On The Panther Thread. I Put The Energizer On My Tahiti 18'bbc Prox 600 Hp Could Barely Hit 55 Before Kit Now Boat Does 68.7 On Gps Think She Will Go To 70 Plus With A Little Tuning. I Was Impressed,no Loading Issues. Boat Does Seam Alittle Looser Pretty Sure Running Less Wet Now.
I ALSO IM RUNNIN AT ALTITUDE I'M A UTARD (FROM UTAH) COULD POST ENGINE SPECS 600 HP MAY BE A LITTLE HIGH. FROM 60-68 THE MPH'S CAME SLOWER. WITH THE PANTHER I WAS SPINNING 5800R'S
WITH THE ENERGIZER KIT I'M DOWN TO 5300-5400 I THINK I SHOULD HAVE WENT WITH AN A IMPELLER INSTEAD OF A B.
Well Poker I Have New #'s . All Worse. Now That I'm Set At 35* I Couldn't Even Get The Tack To 5k. I Checked Today At 3k I was 27mph. At 4k I Was 46mph. And Near As I Could Tell 4900 R's Was Getin About 61-or 62. I Did Have 4 In The Boat And 2 Full Tanks.
I'm Goin To Look At That 4k Thread Again. Seems Like Most Were Faster Than I At 4k. Today I Was At About The Same Speed As B-4 The Kit. But I Was Turnin 1k More To Get There.
(BEFORE THE KIT). As Much As I Hate To Say It I'm Wishin Ida Done The Whole 9 Yards. Whats Your Prox H.p. Camo. I Know I'm Gettin Personal There.

[H20MOFO]

The Only Thing I Changed Was Timing. Yesterday Was The First Time I Couldn't Hit 5k. Before I Left Wakeless Zone She Wasn't Happy. Even My 13 Year Could Tell It Didn't Sound Right. It's A Little Discouraging (spelling?) To See Most Everyone Killin 70 Mph At 5k, And I'm Barley 60. Maybe The Plate,diverter,droop Snoot Deal Will Help. A Little Hook Can't Be Robbing Much Mph, Or Could It. I'd Guess 1 Or 2 But I Don't Know. Can A Loader Give More Mph At The Same Rpm? As Far As Modifing The Panther Inlet Cas. Maybe You Could Posts Some Examples.

[jrork]

We've all been there, trust me. Since you seem to be losing performance as time goes, let's start with easy stuff and get your motor sqaured away. I've never heard of not being able to use a timing light with a big cam but with that said, I don't know sh*t. There's some big dogs on here that can help.
What have you got your initial set at? I assume from reading your earlier posts that your timing all in is at 35 degrees?
Stick with it and work out all the bugs first before you buy anymore parts for the pump.

[H20MOFO]

THANKS FOR THE SUPPORT JRORK. I STILL THINK MY TIMING MARK IS FUBAR.
CHECKED WITH THE OL PULL #1 PLUG AND SCREWDRIVER METHOD AN IT WAS CLOSE. I'M GOIN TO THE LAKE(I HOPE TOMMOROW) WITH THE TIMING UP TO 42, STARTS WITH THE 1ST BUMP SOUNDS WAY BETTER THAN AT 35*. BEFORE I WAS SET AT 60+ (TOTAL). I'M 4-SURE NO EXPERT. AS FAR AS INITIAL. I'M AT 30* INITIAL AND 42 (AFTER BUMPIN IT UP)TOTAL (ACORDING TO THE LIGHT) I KNOW EVERYONE IS GOING TO SAY THATS TOO MUCH INITIAL (AND TOTAL)BUT ITS HAPPY THERE. OH; AND IF I DON'T POST ANYMORE IT WILL BE BECAUSE I DIED WHILE SITTING ON THE BACK OF MY BOAT TRYING TO POWER TIME HER AT W.O.T. :o

[jrork]

No sweat as far as the support but holy crap, that's a ton of timing. I don't know what your setup is but I was running 12 initial and 32 total on my previous motor (BBC, bunch of cam and some goodies inside with a edelbrock RPM and 780 carb) and it ran killer at that. It was a full MSD setup.
What have you got for a motor? Lets get that thing dialed in first before you spend anymore coin.
Oh and by the way, please wear a life jacket IF I DON'T POST ANYMORE IT WILL BE BECAUSE I DIED WHILE SITTING ON THE BACK OF MY BOAT TRYING TO POWER TIME HER AT W.O.T. :o :jawdrop:

[H20MOFO]

Yeh I Know. I'll Keep Ya Posted. R-u Gettin Close Jrork?

[pokerboat]

H2OMOFO Good luck tomorrow I hope it works out well for you. If it doesn’t I’ll have to take the panther out and putting it ‘down’ lol

[Cas]

Stick with it and work out all the bugs first before you buy anymore parts for the pump.
real good advice right there!

[H20MOFO]

Thanks For The Bassett T Valve Info Cas. What R Those Bungs In The Back For The Way They Are Rigged Now Doesn't Look Like They'd Do Anything. As Far As My Motor Spec's Bbc 427, Crower 01206 Hyd Flat Cam,(and It Might Be Goin Flat Too, Second Time This Year I've Had To Adj. My Valves) Edelbrock Single 4 High Rise 800cfm Dp, Brodix Bb2plus Aluminum Heads(rec Port Cc'd To 116) 11.6to1 Gave Up Tryin To Tune For Mixing Gas With 110 So Now I Fust Run 110.
As Far As 42* Being Too Much. My 83 Burb With 454 Set At 38-39 Total. Less Atmosphere Less Cyl Pressure(least I Think). And From My Limited Knowlege Of Cams, A Cam With A Lot Of Overlap(think I Have 32* Specs R At Work) And Cam With Lobe Centerline Of Say 107* Will Also Tend To Bleed Of Cyl Pressure.(think Mine Is 108*). I'm Always Open For Help. Thanks Not Sure If I'm Goin To The Lake Today, At Least Not Till I Get The Whole Bassett T Valve With Tt Worked Out .milkshaking My Motor Would Really Add Insult To Injury.OH AND AS FAR AS WAITING TO GET THE PLATE AND DIVERTER. NO WAY. CAMO SAID IT BEST SHE GOES OR SHE BLOWS.

[Cas]

Kreg,
Are you getting any help with your set-up/issues?

[H20MOFO]

Yeh. Tom Sugested Using A Bore Scope To Find Tdc. I've Said A Few Times I Didn't Think My Timing Mark Was Accurate. I Ran It All Last Season Over 60*(on The Light) With No Pinging Issues I Doubt 40-42 Will Hurt. Having A Hard Time Tryin To Figure Out Why I Shouldn't Just Power Time It. Still Havent Replumbed By Dump Lines In To My Through Tt's. Hope My Last Post Didn't Make Me Sound Like A Smart Ass. (my Cam Knowledge Bla Bla Bla) Tom Is Going To E-mail Me How To Set A Pres. Gauge Up On My Intake.(TO CHECK INLET PRES.)

[jetboatperformance]

Kreg heres the pics I promised Tom
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Panther%20Prototype/DSC07006.jpg
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Panther%20Prototype/DSC07003.jpg

[H20MOFO]

Tom Is That The Fitting Right Above The Hose? Can You Sell Me That Fitting,gauge And Hose?

[jetboatperformance]

H20 ,yes you are correct on the pressure tap position truthfully most of the "fittings",water line etc are hardware store stuff Tom

[FOURQ]

Why tap it in that location and not the top and bottom?
Isn't the idea of getting pressure readings to be able to equal out that pressure top and bottom?
If the pressure is too high or low, what can be done to change it since Panthers don't have choices for loaders or shoes ?
I am not an expert on panthers but on my pump (aberkanator) I have multiple taps to set it up accordingly with loaders and shoes. I know the pumps are apples to oranges but I am just curious.

[H20MOFO]

Hi 4-q. I Was Just Goin To Log On And Say ShoulD I Mount The Gauge Permanent Or Temp. Sure Wish I Was Smart Enougph To Pm, I Have A Few Things To Ask Some Peeps.(AND TELL THANKS)

[jetboatperformance]

Why tap it in that location and not the top and bottom?
Isn't the idea of getting pressure readings to be able to equal out that pressure top and bottom?
If the pressure is too high or low, what can be done to change it since Panthers don't have choices for loaders or shoes ?
I am not an expert on panthers but on my pump (aberkanator) I have multiple taps to set it up accordingly with loaders and shoes. I know the pumps are apples to oranges but I am just curious.
Good call Shawn more taps the more/better info ( the pic's from the first proto),this conversions is still in its infancy (there is/are hardware changes in the works too Thanks Tom
Kreg I'd mount the guage/guages permanently ,small guage pods etc.

[Cas]

Kreg,
Before you go drilling one hole at that location, read this thread-
http://www.***boat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107709&highlight=timinator
All that info is in regards to a mixed flow pump.

[H20MOFO]

Thanks All. PICS R GOOD.

[FOURQ]

Good call Shawn more taps the more/better info ( the pic's from the first proto),this conversions is still in its infancy (there is/are hardware changes in the works too Thanks Tom
Tom
what hardware can be changed now based on the readings you get? what hardware is in the design stages? .. I didn't think there was anything you could do the tune the intake on those things. I don't have time to read everything but what has been done to over come the wall that they hit with the intake design. the new AT bowl and impeller are a great add on but I guess my biggest question is why spend all this money on a pump that will never really compare to a Berk , Dom, AT, Legend and so on. you can pick one up cheap on Ebay and other places all the timefot cheap and you and I know its not expensive to rebuild one. why not spent all that money to cut out the panther and glass in a new/rebuilt Berk for less or the same money when you and I both know the performance will be way better.. I am not knocking the guys doing this upgrade if thats what the coustomer wants to do its their money.. maybe its just the way I see it I can do glass/gel work I do know how to set an intake so for me its easy maybe thats why I don't understand all this .. sorry for the rambling but I just had a few questions ;) and not trying to stir the shit as some do
Shawn

[jetboatperformance]

Shawn,
All valid and legitimate questions. The kit as now produced by AT is simple and user friendly to install, and very complete with driveline and steering changes included. It offers an alternative to rebuilding or replacing the Panther jet as it stands. In many cases even a damaged Panther suction which would normally need to be sleeved, or epoxy, etc. can be reused. The conversion may not be right for everyone and every situation, but it is there, it works, and so far results have been positive.
Unlike you and others out there, as you & I know not everyone has the skills and capability (or is confortable with doing neccesary major structural hull work, such as for example Camoman's boat.
I cannot disaggree for some, depending on the circumstances, it might be better and more advantageous for some to cut, glass, set and install a Berkeley/Dominator/AT, etc. or return the pump to Panther or authorized dealer for repairs or replacement.
Regarding changes and additions, we are currently working on a different style ride plate, as well as some underwater pieces and we are actively looking for a decent Panther equipped hull to do more testing (we sold our original proto boat, less jet).
Thanks again,
Tom

[jrork]

Shawn,
All valid and legitimate questions. The kit as now produced by AT is simple and user friendly to install, and very complete with driveline and steering changes included.
Unlike you and others out there, not everyone has the skills and capability (or is comfortable with doing neccesary major structural hull work, such as for example Camoman's boat.
I cannot disaggree for some, depending on the circumstances, it might be better and more advantageous for some to cut, glass, set and install a Berkeley/Dominator/AT, etc. or return the pump to Panther or authorized dealer for repairs or replacement.
Thanks again,
Tom
Good discussion guys. Thanks.
For what it's worth these reasons Tom has posted above, are exactly the reason I elected to go this route along with the fact that that I would really like to see something like this work if for no other reason that to provide the Panther crowd an alternative.

[Cas]

Good discussion guys. Thanks.
For what it's worth these reasons Tom has posted above, are exactly the reason I elected to go this route along with the fact that that I would really like to see something like this work if for no other reason that to provide the Panther crowd an alternative.
now that's some funny shit! I was asking the similar questions and got accused of attacking Tom.
Example-
Tom,
The subject of intake/pump pressure has been talked about many times over years on many different boards. It's been stated that the best place for a gauge is at the 10 o'clock or 2 o'clock position but the best set-up is for 2 gauges to be installed......1 at 10 or 2 and the other at 5 or 7 o'clocks repectively. The reason being is the pressure from the 2 areas will equal out in the center and not really give a true reading.
The top of the pump/impeller is the area most subject to cavitation thus the reason for top loaders. It's also the reason to install the gauge at that location so the differences in pressure can be obtained. When adding a shoe, it's going to add water to the bottom of the impeller thus the reason for a 2nd gauge to determine that pressure.
and the answer- (real nice way to start out)
Hard to be a “laid back boater” if you were constantly looking at multiple water pressure gauges or a Data recorder going down the lake trying to compute numbers. Sure you will get quite a bit more information drilling and tapping your suction in multiple locations and taking averages, but for the average lake boat and boater its likely of no great value.
Drilling tapping and installing the pressure port in the "name badge" on the side of the suction in the area (shown earlier on Kathenup's Eliminator) gives, in our opinion, a very solid location to drill and tap due to the added casting thickness and also gives a fairly good "mean" average on “suction” side pressure readings. This also provides a means of judging shoe and intake opening size & loader effectiveness or lack thereof (assuming these things are even applicable or relevant).
On the other hand it definitely makes sense to try to make intake "hardware" adjustments with some knowledge and information, than to say for example, simply head out to the lake with an arm load of loaders and a tool box and spend the day "on and off the trailer" and in and out of the water trying same in varying inconsistant water, wind, fuel load and etc. conditions. We maintain that most everything respective to these boats varies from boat to boat, not to mention horse power, load, altitude, etc. etc.
In short, everything is an experiment to some degree. Most of this will never be an issue in a 65 mph weekend warrior lake boat.
My early experience in this came as a result of three blown hand hole clean outs on my TX 16 at 80 plus MPH. For help I went to all the "gurus", most promonently among them perhaps was Roy Miersch (aero / engineer, builder, designer and patent holder of famous 5 degree Jet drive intakes, pop offs etc.).
Hope this helps and doesn't confuse.
Tom
BTW 15 to 30 psi is "mean" average. Tim Place told me the other week that "Going Places" would record intake pressures as high as 150 psi at the 1/8 mile. Time to "chill" now Best regards to everyone Tom
and then the questions that never got answered-
What I'm not understanding is how the mean means anything? Being it's just an average reading between the top and bottom, it's not going to be of much help to determine if more or less shoe is needed. It's also not going to tell a person if they have chosen the proper loader. It's not going to tell them if they needed any of that stuff at all.
Should a person get a mean reading of say 30psi, we wouldn't know if the pressure at the top is the same at the bottom or even if it's close. It seems that making any change based on an average number alone would be difficult to determine. Beyond that, if there's a reading of say 60 psi and a person takes out some shoe that drops the psi to 30 yet drops mph, is that the proper adjustment?
The idea with utilizing a gauge, in my mind, is to give a person more information to better choose what is needed on their set-up. I don't see how not bringing a few different loaders to do a test and tune can be avoided nor can I see how a shoe can be adjusted in the same way.
Am I missing something here?
there is no doubt there are benefits but there's also a lot of limitations that people should know up front. The difference is the above discussion was about a Berk. wtfe

[jrork]

H20,
As far as looking like an ass, it isn't the first time and it surely won't be the last.
Agreed
Since we're digging up old posts on this thread, here's one that still fits Stevie....:D

[Cas]

Since we're digging up old posts on this thread, here's one that still fits Stevie....:D
could be but you still never showed me where in this thread that I was bashing

[FOURQ]

easy there boys I wasnt trying to start a CAT fight just asking a few questions.. lol :jawdrop: :D

[pokerboat]

jrork have you got your boat done if so do you have any numbers

[jrork]

Nah Pokie. Not yet. This is a major refit with fiberglass/pump install/blowermotor/interior job. Shooting for spring of next year.
How bout you? How are you comiing on yours?....John

[jrork]

easy there boys I wasnt trying to start a CAT fight just asking a few questions.. lol :jawdrop: :D
No worries FourQ. Cas and I have been around the block enough that aint neither one of us gonna get our feelings hurt.

[pokerboat]

What kind of glass work ya doin

[Cas]

Nah Pokie. Not yet. This is a major refit with fiberglass/pump install/blowermotor/interior job. Shooting for spring of next year.
if you'd quit taking road trips you'd have that thing done in short order! :D

[jrork]

if you'd quit taking road trips you'd have that thing done in short order! :D
:idea: You know, you might have a solid point there.......:D

[jrork]

What kind of glass work ya doin
Pokie,
ItÂ’s one of those projects that has just grown. Started with the new pump, then a new blower motor. Then setting back and looking at the paint that someone had applied before I bought it and how crappy it was going to look with the new pump and motor I decided to stripped it all off (3 different colors of paint jobs. No wonder it looked like sh!t).
Next thing you know, IÂ’m filling the old thru-transom exhaust holes, decked the top to lose the lights, filled some surplus holes in the dash. Then to make matters worse, once I pulled the rub rail off and saw how good the boat looked I made the decision to go with a capped boat.
Many of the folks on this board and others gave me some great advice on how to make that happen. It’s clearly not for the week of heart. I ground into the seam and layed it back 2 to 3” all the way around and then used multiple layers of fabric and epoxy to join them permanently. Tons of work and scary as hell to do but now that it’s done, I wouldn’t change a thing.
Right now IÂ’m in the primer stage with multiple layers of 2K primer and am blocking it out to make it look as good as possible. WeÂ’ll see but so far it looks really good.
John

[pokerboat]

Jrork good on you sounds awesome, monster project like to see some pics.
H2omofo whatÂ’s up got no new # and Tom any more # or is this conversion gone by the way side.

[H20MOFO]

Maybe This Weekend. I Don't Think I'm Going To Break 70 With My Setup At This Altitude.

[jetboatperformance]

Still working on it guys pieces are cut out etc,just been slammed the last couple weeks Tom:D
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Panther%20Prototype/ResizeofDSC07103.jpg

[jrork]

Jrork good on you sounds awesome, monster project like to see some pics.
Here's my thread for what it's worth
http://www.***boat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164154
Saw the pics Tommy. Looks really good. I'll give you a buzz in a bit
H2O, given your altitude, I would think that somewhere near 70 is a pretty good number unless you throw some cubic dollars at it.

[H20MOFO]

Cubic Dollars Thats Funny Shit. How Bout Blown Cubic $.

[jrork]

If that's the case, you need to add some $$$. Dont ask me how I know :eek:

[H20MOFO]

Hey Jrork How Bout A Loan??????????

[jrork]

Hey Jrork How Bout A Loan??????????
I'm interested. What percentage rate are you offering? :D

[pokerboat]

H2omfo did you get out, did you get any better numbers. I hope you got some good news I jest sold my ride now it full steam ahead on the tunnel hull. Tom how about you do you have any new numbers from any new conversions.

[H20MOFO]

I'm Hoping For This Sunday But Like I Mentioned. I Dont See My Current Set Up Breakin 70. If I Had To Take A Stab I'd Say My Prox 575 Hp Motor At This Altitude Is Somewhere Near 500 Hp. I'm Not Sure If 500 Hp=70mph Is Good Or Bad But It Is What It Is.(i Think I'm Jumpin Ship And Going 21' Daytona If All Goes Well)

[jetboatperformance]

Poker,
I sent another kit to Texas yesterday. Customer has a 18' V bottom boat, BBC 454 with small blower. He estimates HP at 450. Boat currently runs 60 at 6K. Current pump has bronze sleeve and trim, was freshened this season. This guy is enthusiastic and I'm sure we will have comparison numbers soon.
Tom

[H20MOFO]

60 At 6k Sounds Amost Identical To The #'s Prior To My Energizer. I Predict He Bolts On 10mph. What Impeller Is He Going With? I Was Also Kind Of Suprised To Hear Jrork's #'s On His Stock Panther. Something Like 67 At 5.8k If I Remember Right. But I Also Have No Idea Of Jrorks Weight,diverter Or Not, Ect.

[jrork]

60 At 6k Sounds Amost Identical To The #'s Prior To My Energizer. I Predict He Bolts On 10mph. What Impeller Is He Going With? I Was Also Kind Of Suprised To Hear Jrork's #'s On His Stock Panther. Something Like 67 At 5.8k If I Remember Right. But I Also Have No Idea Of Jrorks Weight,diverter Or Not, Ect.
Gotta make sure we are talking apples to apples here. I've got a 18' Brendella that's similar to a Southwind. Not a tunnel. Boat is reasonably light and had what I would call a fairly mild BBC. No matter how much I messed with the pump, I dinged my 5900 rev limiter at 67-+mph.
No diverter, fiddled with the ride plate till I was blue in the face, epoxy'd the housing to tighten up the clearance, replaced the water seal. All of these things did help but still not what I was hoping for.
With all that said, the Panther was a great pump for everyday boating and had a killer holeshot.

[jetboatperformance]

Kreg ,i don't think John (jrork) will mind ,his current (New) jet has an "A" impeller standard nozzle adaptor and Manual diverter .The Kit sent yesterday has no trim,standard steering and a "AA" to start with he's a machinist and will adjust accordingly Tom
Randy/Nevada/conversion
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/randy%20thompson/02.jpg
BTW the "Kids" are headed out to Ramona tommorow am pm me your home/cell please Tom

[jrork]

Nah, Tommy. I dont mind. Just wish you'd get your butt up here and help me put this boat together instead of hanging out with those roundy round jet guys...;)

[pokerboat]

did you get out h2omofo

[H20MOFO]

This Weekend It Snowed Here. I Think My Seasons Done. My 02. I'm Thinkin The Energizer Is Much Better Than The Stock Panther And The Whole Cut Out Deal Sounds Better Than That (money Allowing)btw I've Never Heard I've Never Heard Of Your Hull Is It Rare? Looks Like It Will Be Bitchin Either Way.

[pokerboat]

Hey H2OMFO the hull is a California Taylor Stiletto I have seen a few but not very many. So after putting in the energizer kit do you think you would have bin better off cutting it out for a different jet.

[H20MOFO]

wow dude that's a tuff one.if you would have asked me that 1 month ago i might have said yes(cut a new 1). poker what is your end goal? how fast do you want to go? what r u planin on throwin at it? all i can tell you is i bolted on 8-10 mph with the kit. i'm lookin forward to everybody else's #'s. tom keep us posted (and jrork)

[pokerboat]

I was going to put a ls1 in thatÂ’s sitting in my garage (400+hp) ,I will give it a try if I donÂ’t get the results I am looking for IÂ’ll switch to a big block my goal is 70 nothing under that will make me happy. I would still appreciate Tom to keep posting any new # or improvements to the energizer kit.
Thanks Mike

[jetboatperformance]

Poker here a letter form a retail sale (shop installation) from the midwest ,admittedly these are not hard numbers just a customers perception and observation... Tom
Tom
That would be great if you use the pics. At this time, I dont have too many accurate numbers. Like I said earlier, the boat has been in the water only a few times with everything completely finished. The oringinal owner is only a few miles away, and I have spoke with him about the boat. What I can tell you is that it had a stock Ford 460 with a Holley 650 and stock panther jet. He took good care of the boat and said it worked great, then moved from California to MN and sold the boat in early 90's. Second owner drove a few times, then gutted the boat interior and bored out motor. He took the panther jet and had it balanced and added jet-o-vator, also added stainless marine exhaust manifolds with corsa performance mufflers. He never drove the boat after additions. Sat for almost 15 years before I bought it.
Only time the panther jet was ran was when Jared(the mechanic) tested motor. Motor ran at over 5000 rpms and boat would not plane out or barely move. Now, with your berkley conversion, boat jumps out of the water and runs in the high 3's to low 4's. I would guess 50-55 mph. Hoping for 60's some day. There are a few bugs to work out and the boat just got winterized. I am eager to test everything next spring. Hopefully then I'll have better data and get a gps reading. Once again thanks for everything, and I'll keep in touch
Bill
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Spicer%20Sports/MVC-036S.jpg

[jrork]

Wow Tom, That is a big sumbitchin boat (and looks very nice to boot). I realize that the number posted are estimate but wow, that's good speed figuring what it is. Can't wait to give it a try myself

[jetboatperformance]

Ya its a bigun huh ,I guess fitty is respectable ,he give us more as time progresses Tom.... John ck your PMs

[pokerboat]

Nice boat, wow good # for that size boat. Thanks tom for the updates. John howÂ’s your project coming along. H2O are you ice fishing yet.

[jrork]

Nice boat, wow good # for that size boat. Thanks tom for the updates. John how’s your project coming along. H2O are you ice fishing yet.
Got the boat flipped rightside up, washed, masked. Also sealed it up with some DP48LF with some DT860 reducer. Next step is to start smoothing the top
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h157/jrork/IMG_0274.jpg

[jetboatperformance]

Got the boat flipped rightside up, washed, masked. Also sealed it up with some DP48LF with some DT860 reducer. Next step is to start smoothing the top
http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h157/jrork/IMG_0274.jpg
Now thats what I'm talkin about ! Gitter done Johny:D

[pokerboat]

Looking good jrork getting closes to starting mine just 1 small thing to do empty my garage last weekend took 3 full loads to the dump and it looks like I did nothing lol.

[malcolm]

Alright John! Make use of this good weather!!! Who paid who off and made the nice days fall on the weekend??? :D

[jrork]

Moved to the project post..

[GAWnCA]

John!! you've got SUN!!!, I'm going to mark my calendar!!! Oh, and by the way. The BOAT looks GREAT, too!! :D Greg

[jrork]

Yahoo! Look at the top picture all way to the right and you can see how flat the water is. Man, I wish I was out there.....

[GAWnCA]

Yahoo! Look at the top picture all way to the right and you can see how flat the water is. Man, I wish I was out there.....
This would be a good day to be out there. Oh well, there's next year and you'll be looking GOOD!! I may have a shop by the end of the month and then I can get busy... Be ready for questions! :) Maybe next summer the wife and I can take a run up there!

[jrork]

Maybe next summer the wife and I can take a run up there!
Do it! Try to make the big bash at Mardon over the Laborday weekend. Already sounds like a few boats are coming up from down south. You could caravan together. They had 57 boats this year. Let's hope we can get even more for next year.

[jetboatperformance]

Message from customer Steve : It's all together, and I took it out for a spin in the lake yesterday. It works great. The AA impeller was a good choice. It launches like a bullet out of the hole, and my cruise speed is under 3000 rpm, which is much better than before. I didn't run it too fast because I wanted to give the thrust bearing and tail bushing a chance to break in. Steve
JBP note: This customer encountered a few "installation" problems which ,because he is a machinist by trade was able to overcome .His suggestions are greatly appreciated and are passed on to A/T for mods and production changes Tom
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Steve%20P/DSCF0020.jpg
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Steve%20P/DSCF0021.jpg
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Steve%20P/DSCF0018.jpg
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r319/jetboatperformance/Steve%20P/DSCF0024.jpg

[firemanjim]

I have a 20Â’ Taylor Stiletto tunnel with a panther jet and was thinking about putting in a panther jet drive energizer kit from American turbine. Has anyone heard of this conversion or seen one or should I rebuild my panther. Or am I better of cutting out the panther and changing to a Dominator pump or American turbine. If I do change the pump which is the best choice Dominator, American turbine, Legend.
Thanks mike
http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_DSC00077.jpghttp://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/pokerboat/th_DSC00076.jpg
Looks alittle like my boat.....
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r215/firemanjim_photos/7.jpg

[pokerboat]

Nice boat firemanjim what kind of jet and engine, top speed that is a Taylor right.

[1978 Rogers]

I got my HB mag on Friday. I noticed a nice plug in Jet Tech on the Energizer Kit. That was a good recommendation.
Chris

[firemanjim]

Nice boat firemanjim what kind of jet and engine, top speed that is a Taylor right.
Thanks. The motor is a 454 with a tunnel ram and dual 600's. Got some tricked out heads roller valve train and full race cam. Not sure on the specifics though, duanehydro built the motor up. Haven't gps it yet the speedo doesn't really read right over 65 starts hopping. Yeah is a Cali Taylor. Previos owner really researched the boat back to the original owner and he said it was a one of a kind hull combo with the high transom. I've seen a couple with the lower transome like yours but none like mine. I really like the tunnels in the hulls. Jim

[jrork]

I got my HB mag on Friday. I noticed a nice plug in Jet Tech on the Energizer Kit. That was a good recommendation.
Chris
I saw that too. Very cool!!!

[Pump Master Nv]

This pass weekend I was able to get 71mph @ 5700rpm's(on the GPS) with a built panther. We talked awhile ago and its now time to start working on trying to get 15 or more out of it.the season is over and I'm ready to start working on it. So what I'm looking for is should I consider the energizer kit or think of changing out the hole pump?

[H20MOFO]

I'm sorry define "built panther" how much hp? Anyone else with a (stock)panther that can say that rpm=mph?