The Prison Camp Myth Marshall Law coming to a town near you

[MWJSOne]

Who can confirm that in fact that KRB inc is building prison camps ???
also there are prison rail cars planted over the US they look like car carriers
the link
http://www.issuesandalibis.org/campsd.html
who can locate these rail cars and are they the real deal or a myth???
Yes I have seen the rail cars in Gary Indiana
By Dave Lindorff
07/27/07 "ICH" -- -- The looming collapse of the US military in Iraq, of which a number of generals and former generals, including former Chief of Staff Colin Powell, have warned, is happening none too soon, as it my be the best hope for preventing military rule here at home.
From the looks of things, the Bush/Cheney regime has been working assiduously to pave the way for a declaration of military rule, such that at this point it really lacks only the pretext to trigger a suspension of Constitutional government. They have done this with the active support of Democrats in Congress, though most of the heavy lifting was done by the last, Republican-led Congress.
The first step, or course, was the first Authorization for Use of Military Force, passed in September 2001, which the president has subsequently used to claim-improperly, but so what? -that the whole world, including the US, is a battlefield in a so-called "War" on Terror, and that he has extra-Constitutional unitary executive powers to ignore laws passed by Congress. As constitutional scholar and former Reagan-era associate deputy attorney general Bruce Fein observes, that one claim, that the US is itself a battlefield, is enough to allow this or some future president to declare martial law, "since you can always declare martial law on a battlefield. All he'd need would be a pretext, like another terrorist attack inside the U.S."
The 2001 AUMF was followed by the PATRIOT Act, passed in October 2001, which undermined much of the Bill of Rights. Around the same time, the president began a campaign of massive spying on Americans by the National Security Agency, conducted without any warrants or other judicial review. It was and remains a program that is clearly aimed at American dissidents and at the administration's political opponents, since the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court would never have raised no objections to spying on potential terrorists. (And it, and other government spying programs, have resulted in the government's having a list now of some 325,000 "suspected terrorists"!)
The other thing we saw early on was the establishment of an underground government-within-a-government, though the activation, following 9-11, of the so-called "Continuity of Government" protocol, which saw heads of federal agencies moved secretly to an underground bunker where, working under the direction of Vice President Dick Cheney, the "government" functioned out of sight of Congress and the public for critical months.
It was also during the first year following 9-11 that the Bush/Cheney regime began its programs of arrest and detention without charge-mostly of resident aliens, but also of American citizens-and of kidnapping and torture in a chain of gulag prisons overseas and at the Navy base at Guantanamo Bay.
The following year, Attorney General John Ashcroft began his program to develop a mass network of tens of millions of citizen spies-Operation TIPS. That program, which had considerable support from key Democrats (notably Sen. Joe Lieberman), was curtailed by Congress when key conservatives got wind of the scale of the thing, but the concept survives without a name, and is reportedly being expanded today.
Meanwhile, last October Bush and Cheney, with the help of a compliant Congress, put in place some key elements needed for a military putsch. There was the overturning of the venerable Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, which barred the use of active duty military inside the United States for police-type functions, and the revision of the Insurrection Act, so as to empower the president to take control of National Guard units in the 50 states even over the objections of the governors of those states.
Put this together with the wholly secret construction now under way--courtesy of a $385-million grant by the US Army Corps of Engineers to Halliburton subsidiary KBR Inc--of detention camps reportedly capable of confining as many as 400,000 people, and a recent report that the Pentagon has a document, dated June 1, 2007, classified Top Secret, which declares there to be a developing "insurgency" within the U.S, and which lays out a whole martial law counterinsurgency campaign against legal dissent, and you have all the ingredients for a military takeover of the United States.
As we go about our daily lives--our shopping, our escapist movie watching, and even our protesting and political organizing-we need to be aware that there is a real risk that it could all blow up, and that we could find ourselves facing armed, uniformed troops at our doors.
Bruce Fein isn't an alarmist. He says he doesn't see martial law coming tomorrow. But he is also realistic. "Really, by declaring the US to be a battlefield, Bush already made it possible for himself to declare martial law, because you can always declare martial law on a battlefield," he says. "All he would need would be a pretext, like another terrorist attack on the U.S."
Indeed, the revised Insurrection Act (10. USC 331-335) approved by Congress and signed into law by Bush last October, specifically says that the president can federalize the National Guard to "suppress public disorder" in the event of "national disorder, epidemic, other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident." That determination, the act states, is solely the president's to make. Congress is not involved.
Fein says, "This is all sitting around like a loaded gun waiting to go off. I think the risk of martial law is trivial right now, but the minute there is a terrorist attack, then it is real. And it stays with us after Bush and Cheney are gone, because terrorism stays with us forever." (It may be significant that Hillary Clinton, the leading Democratic candidate for president, has called for the revocation of the 2002 Authorization for Use of Military Force against Iraq, but not of the earlier 2001 AUMF which Bush claims makes him commander in chief of a borderless, endless war on terror.)
Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-VT), chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, has added an amendment to the upcoming Defense bill, restoring the Insurrection Act to its former version-a move that has the endorsement of all 50 governors--but Fein argues that would not solve the problem, since Bush still claims that the U.S. is a battlefield. Besides, a Leahy aide concedes that Bush could sign the next Defense Appropriations bill and then use a signing statement to invalidate the Insurrection Act rider.
Fein argues that the only real defense against the looming disaster of a martial law declaration would be for Congress to vote for a resolution determining that there is no "War" on terror. "But they are such cowards they will never do that," he says.
That leaves us with the military.
If ordered to turn their guns and bayonets on their fellow Americans, would our "heroes" in uniform follow their consciences, and their oaths to "uphold and defend" the Constitution of the United States? Or would they follow the orders of their Commander in Chief?
It has to be a plus that National Guard and Reserve units are on their third and sometimes fourth deployments to Iraq, and are fuming at the abuse. It has to be a plus that active duty troops are refusing to re-enlist in droves-especially mid-level officers.
If we are headed for martial law, better that it be with a broken military. Maybe if it's broken badly enough, the administration will be afraid to test the idea.
Dave Lindorff is the author of Killing Time: an Investigation into the Death Row Case of Mumia Abu-Jamal. His n book of CounterPunch columns titled "This Can't be Happening!" is published by Common Courage Press. Lindorff's newest book is "The Case for Impeachment",
co-authored by Barbara Olshansky.

[Steve 1]

"The looming collapse of the US military in Iraq"
I read enough!

[Pheelin Phroggy]

looky, another Michael Moore, "I am a dumb ass... low life... scum of the earth.. two bit... paranoid piece of sheeeeeit" movie, waiting to happen.
U.S. Army Retired

[MWJSOne]

How do you know ?? the only way to find out is this just a myth ???why did the Blackwater group open another training site( Halliburton trainned police force)
all that was asked before you start calling names.Is there proof to support the Myth
Just like the Navys 7 Palms question
Would you fire on a group of US citizens??
looky, another Michael Moore, "I am a dumb ass... low life... scum of the earth.. two bit... paranoid piece of sheeeeeit" movie, waiting to happen.
U.S. Army Retired

[SmokinLowriderSS]

It's whacked and nuts. Period.

[Blown 472]

How do you know ?? the only way to find out is this just a myth ???why did the Blackwater group open another training site( Halliburton trainned police force)
all that was asked before you start calling names.Is there proof to support the Myth
Just like the Navys 7 Palms question
Would you fire on a group of US citizens??
I guess we will find out when there is a "disaster" that keeps bush in office prior to the 2008 elections.

[never_fast_enuf]

You left wingers are complete tin foil hat wearing farking nut bags. THIS is exactly why I give you so much $hit. Guess what....the cow did NOT jump over the moon and that same moon is NOT made of cheese.
Freaking get half a brain you nit-wits...it would be a start.

[Blown 472]

You left wingers are complete tin foil hat wearing farking nut bags. THIS is exactly why I give you so much $hit. Guess what....the cow did NOT jump over the moon and that same moon is NOT made of cheese.
Freaking get half a brain you nit-wits...it would be a start.
How do you like your crow, cold or warm?

[eliminatedsprinter]

Who can confirm that in fact that KRB inc is building prison camps ???
also there are prison rail cars planted over the US they look like car carriers
the link
http://www.issuesandalibis.org/campsd.html
who can locate these rail cars and are they the real deal or a myth???
Yes I have seen the rail cars in Gary Indiana
By Dave Lindorff
07/27/07 "ICH" -- -- The looming collapse of the US military in Iraq, of which a number of generals and former generals, including former Chief of Staff Colin Powell, have warned, is happening none too soon, as it my be the best hope for preventing military rule here at home.
From the looks of things, the Bush/Cheney regime has been working assiduously to pave the way for a declaration of military rule, such that at this point it really lacks only the pretext to trigger a suspension of Constitutional government. They have done this with the active support of Democrats in Congress, though most of the heavy lifting was done by the last, Republican-led Congress.
The first step, or course, was the first Authorization for Use of Military Force, passed in September 2001, which the president has subsequently used to claim-improperly, but so what? -that the whole world, including the US, is a battlefield in a so-called "War" on Terror, and that he has extra-Constitutional unitary executive powers to ignore laws passed by Congress. As constitutional scholar and former Reagan-era associate deputy attorney general Bruce Fein observes, that one claim, that the US is itself a battlefield, is enough to allow this or some future president to declare martial law, "since you can always declare martial law on a battlefield. All he'd need would be a pretext, like another terrorist attack inside the U.S."
The 2001 AUMF was followed by the PATRIOT Act, passed in October 2001, which undermined much of the Bill of Rights. Around the same time, the president began a campaign of massive spying on Americans by the National Security Agency, conducted without any warrants or other judicial review. It was and remains a program that is clearly aimed at American dissidents and at the administration's political opponents, since the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court would never have raised no objections to spying on potential terrorists. (And it, and other government spying programs, have resulted in the government's having a list now of some 325,000 "suspected terrorists"!)
The other thing we saw early on was the establishment of an underground government-within-a-government, though the activation, following 9-11, of the so-called "Continuity of Government" protocol, which saw heads of federal agencies moved secretly to an underground bunker where, working under the direction of Vice President Dick Cheney, the "government" functioned out of sight of Congress and the public for critical months.
It was also during the first year following 9-11 that the Bush/Cheney regime began its programs of arrest and detention without charge-mostly of resident aliens, but also of American citizens-and of kidnapping and torture in a chain of gulag prisons overseas and at the Navy base at Guantanamo Bay.
The following year, Attorney General John Ashcroft began his program to develop a mass network of tens of millions of citizen spies-Operation TIPS. That program, which had considerable support from key Democrats (notably Sen. Joe Lieberman), was curtailed by Congress when key conservatives got wind of the scale of the thing, but the concept survives without a name, and is reportedly being expanded today.
Meanwhile, last October Bush and Cheney, with the help of a compliant Congress, put in place some key elements needed for a military putsch. There was the overturning of the venerable Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, which barred the use of active duty military inside the United States for police-type functions, and the revision of the Insurrection Act, so as to empower the president to take control of National Guard units in the 50 states even over the objections of the governors of those states.
Put this together with the wholly secret construction now under way--courtesy of a $385-million grant by the US Army Corps of Engineers to Halliburton subsidiary KBR Inc--of detention camps reportedly capable of confining as many as 400,000 people, and a recent report that the Pentagon has a document, dated June 1, 2007, classified Top Secret, which declares there to be a developing "insurgency" within the U.S, and which lays out a whole martial law counterinsurgency campaign against legal dissent, and you have all the ingredients for a military takeover of the United States.
As we go about our daily lives--our shopping, our escapist movie watching, and even our protesting and political organizing-we need to be aware that there is a real risk that it could all blow up, and that we could find ourselves facing armed, uniformed troops at our doors.
Bruce Fein isn't an alarmist. He says he doesn't see martial law coming tomorrow. But he is also realistic. "Really, by declaring the US to be a battlefield, Bush already made it possible for himself to declare martial law, because you can always declare martial law on a battlefield," he says. "All he would need would be a pretext, like another terrorist attack on the U.S."
Indeed, the revised Insurrection Act (10. USC 331-335) approved by Congress and signed into law by Bush last October, specifically says that the president can federalize the National Guard to "suppress public disorder" in the event of "national disorder, epidemic, other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident." That determination, the act states, is solely the president's to make. Congress is not involved.
Fein says, "This is all sitting around like a loaded gun waiting to go off. I think the risk of martial law is trivial right now, but the minute there is a terrorist attack, then it is real. And it stays with us after Bush and Cheney are gone, because terrorism stays with us forever." (It may be significant that Hillary Clinton, the leading Democratic candidate for president, has called for the revocation of the 2002 Authorization for Use of Military Force against Iraq, but not of the earlier 2001 AUMF which Bush claims makes him commander in chief of a borderless, endless war on terror.)
Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-VT), chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, has added an amendment to the upcoming Defense bill, restoring the Insurrection Act to its former version-a move that has the endorsement of all 50 governors--but Fein argues that would not solve the problem, since Bush still claims that the U.S. is a battlefield. Besides, a Leahy aide concedes that Bush could sign the next Defense Appropriations bill and then use a signing statement to invalidate the Insurrection Act rider.
Fein argues that the only real defense against the looming disaster of a martial law declaration would be for Congress to vote for a resolution determining that there is no "War" on terror. "But they are such cowards they will never do that," he says.
That leaves us with the military.
If ordered to turn their guns and bayonets on their fellow Americans, would our "heroes" in uniform follow their consciences, and their oaths to "uphold and defend" the Constitution of the United States? Or would they follow the orders of their Commander in Chief?
It has to be a plus that National Guard and Reserve units are on their third and sometimes fourth deployments to Iraq, and are fuming at the abuse. It has to be a plus that active duty troops are refusing to re-enlist in droves-especially mid-level officers.
If we are headed for martial law, better that it be with a broken military. Maybe if it's broken badly enough, the administration will be afraid to test the idea.
Dave Lindorff is the author of Killing Time: an Investigation into the Death Row Case of Mumia Abu-Jamal. His n book of CounterPunch columns titled "This Can't be Happening!" is published by Common Courage Press. Lindorff's newest book is "The Case for Impeachment",
co-authored by Barbara Olshansky.
And when they got back home hanging from the car door hande was .......... a HOOK!!!!:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[MWJSOne]

The real question here right or left after the last round in DC with Congress willing to pass a Immigration that thier word this is the best we can do.
I don`t take any salt in the fact that I wouldn`t put it past them.
Tin Foil or not the Nazis worked the same way and over a million people lost thier lives.
Some of the speaches lines are taken right from the Nazi speaches from Hitler
One must stay on watch and make those they place thier trust in accountable.
And history fact Bushs Grand father was a Nazi supporter

[eliminatedsprinter]

The Nazis and most other major political movements including our own Dems and Repubs got there political tactics from the historical studies of Nicolo Machiavelli. That is why both parties can always find Nazi-like similarities in each others tactics. Hell, stylistically, Al Gores book "Earth in the Balance" is a rip off of Hitler's "Mien Kampf" but that does not make him as evil as Hitler was (even if he is almost a big of a liar).
I'm not any more of a fan of these tactics than Machiavelli was, but I understand that their use has been a fact of life for a very long time now.
This administration has done some things that concern me in re to their honesty and there are things about the "Patriot Act" and the "Dept of Homeland Security" that I definatly don't like. However, the notion that this administration is somehow conspiring to suspend the constitution is flat out paranoid. Even in the unlikely case that the above accusations are true, they are still tame in comparison to what President Woodrow Wilson's administration did to civil rights just before and during our involvement in WWI, yet somehow our democracy survived.

[never_fast_enuf]

How do you like your crow, cold or warm?
Never eaten any so I will pass thank you. Is that the meal of choice in the insane asylum from which you post? Must be a government run facility...

[Schiada76]

And when they got back home hanging from the car door hande was .......... a HOOK!!!!:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
OHMYGOD! OHMYGOD! OHMYGOD!:D :D :D

[never_fast_enuf]

And when they got back home hanging from the car door hande was .......... a HOOK!!!!:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
LMAO!!
Whooooo's got myyyyyyy goldennnnn armmmmm.

[Schiada76]

Anyone know if the liberal nitwits have blamed the bridge collapse on the POTUS yet?:rolleyes: :D

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Anyone know if the liberal nitwits have blamed the bridge collapse on the POTUS yet?:rolleyes: :D
As many as 50 vehicles in the river and 30 still missing. 80 injured and 4 confirmed dead. Not a matter for political funnies.

[Schiada76]

As many as 50 vehicles in the river and 30 still missing. 80 injured and 4 confirmed dead. Not a matter for political funnies.
Then why was Katrina?
I wasn't trying to be funny, it's a serious question.
Have the tinfoil hat liberal nitwits blamed President Bush for this disaster yet?
Seriously

[Schiada76]

How do you know ?? the only way to find out is this just a myth ???why did the Blackwater group open another training site( Halliburton trainned police force)
all that was asked before you start calling names.Is there proof to support the Myth
Just like the Navys 7 Palms question
Would you fire on a group of US citizens??
If you believe your first post you are no longer on the brink of insanity.:rolleyes:

[Schiada76]

And so it starts, the democrats have started railing about how this proves that President Bush has not spent enough on "infrastructure".:rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Then why was Katrina?
I wasn't trying to be funny, it's a serious question.
Have the tinfoil hat liberal nitwits blamed President Bush for this disaster yet?
Seriously
Noone blamed Bush for the natural disaster, which was Katrina. He had no control of the weather.
There is a time for everyone, including you, to put politics aside. The bridge collapse. is one them.

[Schiada76]

Noone blamed Bush for the natural disaster, which was Katrina. He had no control of the weather.
There is a time for everyone, including you, to put politics aside. The bridge collapse. is one them.
I'm not the one claiming that this proves President Bush hasn't spent enough on the nation's infrastucture. The liberal scum in this country have started to however and I'm sure it will get worse.
My you have a short memory, President Bush is still being blamed for the Katrina disaster.:rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

I'm not the one claiming that this proves President Bush hasn't spent enough on the nation's infrastucture. The liberal scum in this country have started to however and I'm sure it will get worse.
My you have a short memory, President Bush is still being blamed for the Katrina disaster.:rolleyes:
Please have some respect for this tragedy and it's victims, regardless of how you view me or my political views
Please!

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Anyone know if the liberal nitwits have blamed the bridge collapse on the POTUS yet?:rolleyes: :D
Yes, Bush had secret operatives blow the pilings.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

As many as 50 vehicles in the river and 30 still missing. 80 injured and 4 confirmed dead. Not a matter for political funnies.
And New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina was?
Do I need to "refresh" your memory of the various accusations of blown levees, hurricane creation, etc?????????

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Noone blamed Bush for the natural disaster, which was Katrina. He had no control of the weather.
There is a time for everyone, including you, to put politics aside. The bridge collapse. is one them.
I guess I DO need to "refresh" your memory.
9-1-2005:
Robert F. Kennedy Jr., the Cindy Sheehan of the environmental movement, who blamed Hurricane Katrina on President Bush and Mississippi Governor Haley Barbour for not buying into the global warming hype, and not signing up for the thoroughly discredited Kyoto Treaty.
12 Sep 2005:
The reason Sen. Landrieu gave for Mayor Nagin not transporting his people to safety was that President Bush doesn't support mass transit.
Sen. Landrieu's exact response was: "I am not going to level criticism at local and state officials. Mayor Nagin and most mayors in this country have a hard time getting their people to work on a sunny day, less alone getting them out of the city in front of a hurricane, and it's because this administration and administrations before them do not understand the difficulties that mayors face. In other words, this administration does not believe in mass transit."
2005-09-12:
New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin today blamed President George Bush for the lower-than-expected number of bodies discovered in the receding flood waters, and said it's part of a White House campaign 'to prevent black people from getting what they deserve. ''Follow the money,' said Mr. Nagin. 'Low body-count means less federal aid and less redistribution of wealth from the rich to the poor black folks of my city. You don't have to be a cable guy to figure out that this benefits George Bush and his rich cronies.' "
21 August 2006:
Spike Lee’s “Katrina Film” When the Levees Broke: A Requiem in Four Acts. Blames Bush.
THE LEVEE'S WERE BLOWN UP:
Dyan French, also known as “Mama D,” is a New Orleans Citizen and Community Leader. She testified before the House Select Committee on Hurricane Katrina on Tuesday. “I was on my front porch. I have witnesses that they bombed the walls of the levee, boom, boom!” Mama D said, holding her head. “Mister, I'll never forget
JOE EDWARDS, JR., 9TH WARD RESIDENT: I heard something go BOOM!
DAVID MUIR, ABC NEWS: Was it solely the water that broke the levee, or was it the force of this barge that now sits where homes once did? Joe Edwards says neither. People are so bitter, so disenfranchised in this neighborhood, they actually think the city did it, blowing up the levee to save richer neighborhoods like the French Quarter.
MUIR: . . . they broke the levee on purpose?
EDWARDS: They blew it!
14 Sep 2005:
Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan is telling his followers that the levees in New Orleans may have been deliberately "blown up" to kill the city's black population.
"I heard from a very reliable source who saw a 25 foot deep crater under the levee breach," Farrakhan explained. "It may have been blown up to destroy the black part of town and keep the white part dry."
The source was later admitted by Louie to be RAY NAGIN.
How's the memory doing now?

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Please have some respect for this tragedy and it's victims, regardless of how you view me or my political views
Please!
Bush was blamed for the truck fire on the Oakland Bay bridge.
The Blame Bush For The Bridge Brigade started YESTERDAY ultra.
Kos
Fredomeden
Captainsquartersblog
And sooooo many more.

[Blown 472]

Bush was blamed for the truck fire on the Oakland Bay bridge.
The Blame Bush For The Bridge Brigade started YESTERDAY ultra.
Kos
Fredomeden
Captainsquartersblog
And sooooo many more.
Bush is the anti christ, 666 mother****er.

[Steve 1]

The Bent one protesting!
http://www.UploadYourImages.com/img/9636539222.jpg (http://www.UploadYourImages.com)

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Bush was blamed for the truck fire on the Oakland Bay bridge.
The Blame Bush For The Bridge Brigade started YESTERDAY ultra.
Kos
Fredomeden
Captainsquartersblog
And sooooo many more.
Smokin,
While some extreme leftist BS websites might suggest that the Bridge collapes was the fault of the Prez, noone in their right mind could possibly believe such garbage. I guess it's similar to the the extreme Right wing goons who blame Liberals for the state of Iraq. It's all extremist bullsh*t
I just read that the number missing is down from 30 to 8 which was better news. Still 4 confirmed.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

I never said it was anyone with credibility who blames the President for stupid garbage conspiratorial lunacy.
You simply said it didn't happen, and you are WRONG. Perhaps you should "investigate" more.
I didn't even bring up the freakshow of blame over the events of 11Sep 2001, from she same idiots who accuse him of "stealing" an election.

[never_fast_enuf]

Smokin,
While some extreme leftist BS websites might suggest that the Bridge collapes was the fault of the Prez, noone in their right mind could possibly believe such garbage. I guess it's similar to the the extreme Right wing goons who blame Liberals for the state of Iraq. It's all extremist bullsh*t
I just read that the number missing is down from 30 to 8 which was better news. Still 4 confirmed.
Like it or not, the extreme left is now the mainstream of the democrat party.
Fact is, these asswipes have taken every tragedy as an opportunity to somehow blame Bush for everything that has ever gone bad.
You need to do a serious self examination of the party you identify with. They are complete tools...their record speaks for itself.

[never_fast_enuf]

BTW Ultra...the democrats are coming out of the wood work to use the bridge tragedy as a reason to Bash Bush...even before those bodies have been rcovered from the water.
You SHOULD be pizzed off...at your own ilk. They have no shame and are willing to pizz on the dead of anyone to advance their cause.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Bush was blamed for the truck fire on the Oakland Bay bridge.
The Blame Bush For The Bridge Brigade started YESTERDAY ultra.
Kos
Fredomeden
Captainsquartersblog
And sooooo many more.
Please post a link or two where Bush is being blaimed
BTW Ultra...the democrats are coming out of the wood work to use the bridge tragedy as a reason to Bash Bush...even before those bodies have been rcovered from the water.
You SHOULD be pizzed off...at your own ilk. They have no shame and are willing to pizz on the dead of anyone to advance their cause.
I'm not finding this, post links
I have read articles that state the that we need more invested in his Country's infrastructure, which we do. I don't understand this to mean "Bush is to blame" .
Like it or not, the extreme left is now the mainstream of the democrat party.
Fact is, these asswipes have taken every tragedy as an opportunity to somehow blame Bush for everything that has ever gone bad.
You need to do a serious self examination of the party you identify with. They are complete tools...their record speaks for itself.
FYI, there are ideals of both parties that I support and some from both sides that I don't.

[never_fast_enuf]

Your not finding links Ultra? If that is the case, you didn't look.
Go to the Daily Kos and look at the drivel they are posting.
Ed Shultz has already blamed it on Bush.
Patty Murray blamed Bush when she said yesterday that the Bush Administration has not supported Democrat efforts to increase spending on critical infrastructure.
There is crumbling infrastructure all over the country, said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev. Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash., who heads the Senate panel that controls transportation spending, said the Bush administration has threatened vetoes when Democrats try to increase such spending.
Good lord Ultra...open your eyes and look what the democrat trash is doing...you should be outraged....I know I am
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0807/5228.html
You have to be blind to not see how the democrats are once again using the deaths of these people for their own political gain. It's what they do best.

[never_fast_enuf]

Your not finding links Ultra? If that is the case, you didn't look.
Go to the Daily Kos and look at the drivel they are posting.
Ed Shultz has already blamed it on Bush.
Patty Murray blamed Bush when she said yesterday that the Bush Administration has not supported Democrat efforts to increase spending on critical infrastructure.
There is crumbling infrastructure all over the country, said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev. Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash., who heads the Senate panel that controls transportation spending, said the Bush administration has threatened vetoes when Democrats try to increase such spending.
Good lord Ultra...open your eyes and look what the democrat trash is doing...you should be outraged....I know I am
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0807/5228.html
You have to be blind to not see how the democrats are once again using the deaths of these people for their own political gain. It's what they do best.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Your not finding links Ultra? If that is the case, you didn't look.
Go to the Daily Kos and look at the drivel they are posting.
Ed Shultz has already blamed it on Bush.
Patty Murray blamed Bush when she said yesterday that the Bush Administration has not supported Democrat efforts to increase spending on critical infrastructure.
There is crumbling infrastructure all over the country, said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev. Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash., who heads the Senate panel that controls transportation spending, said the Bush administration has threatened vetoes when Democrats try to increase such spending.
Good lord Ultra...open your eyes and look what the democrat trash is doing...you should be outraged....I know I am
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0807/5228.html
You have to be blind to not see how the democrats are once again using the deaths of these people for their own political gain. It's what they do best.
Due to your hatred of Democrats your taking what is stated in few blogs as the gospel. There are some A'hole Dems out there as there are some a'hole Reps. Judging either party by this method, is like judging a book by it's cover.
It appears that you are basing your comments on polititical inuendo and not statements or facts If I based my opinion of Republicans on blogs from the likes of Steve 1 or Shiada76, I would believe that the entire party was as worthless as their comments,which I might add are pretty f'n worthless. (I know an oxymoron)
You have to be blind to not see how the democrats are once again using the deaths of these people for their own political gain
I view this comment as a political spin, similar to what your comment alleges.
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.

[Steve 1]

Also note Minnesota is a RAT infested state!!
http://www.cagw.org/site/Search?query=Minnesota&inc=100

[Schiada76]

Liberals, ya gotta love their entertainment value.
The democrat scum in this country hate the POTUS so much that they blame him personally for everything that goes wrong on the PLANET and my comments regarding the FACTS are worthless.:rolleyes:
Can you even read? NFE posted quotes from democrat politicians and your only defense is there are a hole Republicans out there too. Why don't you quote just one that blamed Clinton for a hurricane, tornado, bridge collapse or earthquake?
Here's a thought for you Ultra, after the Northridge earthquake how many Republicans blamed President Clinton?:rolleyes:

[Schiada76]

Ultra in the interest of "leaving politics out of this tragedy" why don't you phone and FAX Harry Reids office and tell THEM!:idea: :rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Ultra in the interest of "leaving politics out of this tragedy" why don't you phone and FAX Harry Reids office and tell THEM!:idea: :rolleyes:
You have 0 class and apparantly never will.
My comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.

[Steve 1]

http://www.UploadYourImages.com/img/673016gallows1.jpg (http://www.UploadYourImages.com)

[Schiada76]

You have 0 class and apparantly never will.
My comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.
What part of "I'm not a Senator" do you not understand?
Don't you have the balls to take it up with the scumbags that are promoting this tragedy for their own political gain? :rolleyes:
A sign of respect would be the filthy liberals shutting their mouths and letting the families mourn.
We wouldn't be discussing this then would we?

[ULTRA26 # 1]

What part of "I'm not a Senator" do you not understand?
Don't you have the balls to take it up with the scumbags that are promoting this tragedy for their own political gain? :rolleyes:
A sign of respect would be the filthy liberals shutting their mouths and letting the families mourn.
We wouldn't be discussing this then would we?
You would be discussing anything that you could spin into those filthy liberals shutting their mouths
I'm done with this thread. Bash liberals all you want. Bush didn't cause the bridge to collapse, I know it and anyone in their right mind knows it and there are plenty of Dems and Reps with right minds who also have feelings for those lost or injured. You're just not one of them
A sign of respect would be you shutting your mouth as well, but apparently that's not possible
Good by

[never_fast_enuf]

You have 0 class and apparantly never will.
My comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.
You have nothing to say about the democrats pi$$ing on these people before they are even removed from the water but you get pi$$ed off when people here point out how the bastard democrats are pi$$ing on these people before they have even been pulled out of the water.
That is some twisted logig.

[Schiada76]

It's liberal logic.
I find appalling that an "adult" can actually think in that manner.:rolleyes:

[Steve 1]

Minnesota ?? Here is some reading on where exactly the money goes! BTW not for bridges.
http://www.cagw.org/site/DocServer/2006_Minnesota_Piglet_Book.pdf?docID=1701
In it you will find gems like:
The state bailout of the Minneapolis Teacher’s Retirement Fund, which puts state taxpayers on
the hook for $972 million in unfunded liabilities;
A new $776 million Twins Stadium to be paid for with a Hennepin County sales tax increase
(approved by state legislators with no voter referendum)
$97.5 million for the Northstar Commuter Rail line;
$34 million in subsidies to ethanol producers that have seen a 300 percent increase in profits in
the last year;
$30 million for bear exhibits at the Minnesota and Como Zoos;
$12 million to renovate the Shubert Theater in downtown Minneapolis;
$1 million for a replica Vikings ship in Moorhead;
$500,000 for a skating rink in Roseville;
$310,000 for a Shakespeare festival in Winona; and
$129,000 for state art grants for North Dakota museums and theaters.

[Old Texan]

Please post a link or two where Bush is being blaimed
I'm not finding this, post links
I have read articles that state the that we need more invested in his Country's infrastructure, which we do. I don't understand this to mean "Bush is to blame" .
.
http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=270946786982156
Katrinafying Minnesota's Disaster
By INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Thursday, August 02, 2007 4:20 PM PT
Government: Bodies hadn't even been pulled out of the river in the Minneapolis bridge collapse before President Bush was being blamed. But sticking it to Bush is infantile. Civic priorities are what need re-examination

[Schiada76]

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=270946786982156
DAMN YOU! Damn you selfish unfeeling Republicans to hell!
How in God's errrr I mean Gaias'a name can you be so heratless as to protest the liberal scum bags hypocricy!
People died here we all know that makes it the Presidents fault!:D :D

[ULTRA26 # 1]

You have nothing to say about the democrats pi$$ing on these people before they are even removed from the water but you get pi$$ed off when people here point out how the bastard democrats are pi$$ing on these people before they have even been pulled out of the water.
That is some twisted logig.
Sorry for not leaving this issue alone as I stated I was going.
My comment was not directed at the rest of the blogging public, it was directed to the PRF, (the Political Rhetoric Forum), period.
My comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.

[Old Texan]

DAMN YOU! Damn you selfish unfeeling Republicans to hell!
How in God's errrr I mean Gaias'a name can you be so heratless as to protest the liberal scum bags hypocricy!
People died here we all know that makes it the Presidents fault!:D :D
I guess I need to get all sanctimonious now about my selfish ways.......:devil:

[Schiada76]

Sorry for not leaving this issue alone as I stated I was going.
My comment was not directed at the rest of the blogging public, it was directed to the PRF, (the Political Rhetoric Forum), period.
My comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.
As noted this is the Political Rhetoric Forum.
If you really cared about any "respect" for the dead in the least amount you would be railing against the flithy liberal scumbgas trying to MILK THEIR DEATHS for political gain. Instead as all liberals are prone to do you want to attack the messenger.
hypocrite

[ULTRA26 # 1]

As noted this is the Political Rhetoric Forum.
If you really cared about any "respect" for the dead in the least amount you would be railing against the flithy liberal scumbgas trying to MILK THEIR DEATHS for political gain. Instead as all liberals are prone to do you want to attack the messenger.
hypocrite
"flithy liberal scumbgas" Scumbgas you say.
I'm merely asked that those in the PRF show some respsct for the victums. I have little to no contact with the flithy liberal scumbags you refer to. I was able to reach you and everyone else in the PRF who read my suggestion. There are way to many self centered, selfish pricks, in the PRF who don't know when to STFU.
Again my comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.
PLEASE

[Freak]

BACK ON SUBJECT....
Who can confirm that in fact that KRB inc is building prison camps ???
also there are prison rail cars planted over the US they look like car carriers
the link
http://www.issuesandalibis.org/campsd.html
who can locate these rail cars and are they the real deal or a myth???
Yes I have seen the rail cars in Gary Indiana
By Dave Lindorff
07/27/07 "ICH" -- -- The looming collapse of the US military in Iraq, of which a number of generals and former generals, including former Chief of Staff Colin Powell, have warned, is happening none too soon, as it my be the best hope for preventing military rule here at home.
From the looks of things, the Bush/Cheney regime has been working assiduously to pave the way for a declaration of military rule, such that at this point it really lacks only the pretext to trigger a suspension of Constitutional government. They have done this with the active support of Democrats in Congress, though most of the heavy lifting was done by the last, Republican-led Congress.
The first step, or course, was the first Authorization for Use of Military Force, passed in September 2001, which the president has subsequently used to claim-improperly, but so what? -that the whole world, including the US, is a battlefield in a so-called "War" on Terror, and that he has extra-Constitutional unitary executive powers to ignore laws passed by Congress. As constitutional scholar and former Reagan-era associate deputy attorney general Bruce Fein observes, that one claim, that the US is itself a battlefield, is enough to allow this or some future president to declare martial law, "since you can always declare martial law on a battlefield. All he'd need would be a pretext, like another terrorist attack inside the U.S."
The 2001 AUMF was followed by the PATRIOT Act, passed in October 2001, which undermined much of the Bill of Rights. Around the same time, the president began a campaign of massive spying on Americans by the National Security Agency, conducted without any warrants or other judicial review. It was and remains a program that is clearly aimed at American dissidents and at the administration's political opponents, since the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court would never have raised no objections to spying on potential terrorists. (And it, and other government spying programs, have resulted in the government's having a list now of some 325,000 "suspected terrorists"!)
The other thing we saw early on was the establishment of an underground government-within-a-government, though the activation, following 9-11, of the so-called "Continuity of Government" protocol, which saw heads of federal agencies moved secretly to an underground bunker where, working under the direction of Vice President Dick Cheney, the "government" functioned out of sight of Congress and the public for critical months.
It was also during the first year following 9-11 that the Bush/Cheney regime began its programs of arrest and detention without charge-mostly of resident aliens, but also of American citizens-and of kidnapping and torture in a chain of gulag prisons overseas and at the Navy base at Guantanamo Bay.
The following year, Attorney General John Ashcroft began his program to develop a mass network of tens of millions of citizen spies-Operation TIPS. That program, which had considerable support from key Democrats (notably Sen. Joe Lieberman), was curtailed by Congress when key conservatives got wind of the scale of the thing, but the concept survives without a name, and is reportedly being expanded today.
Meanwhile, last October Bush and Cheney, with the help of a compliant Congress, put in place some key elements needed for a military putsch. There was the overturning of the venerable Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, which barred the use of active duty military inside the United States for police-type functions, and the revision of the Insurrection Act, so as to empower the president to take control of National Guard units in the 50 states even over the objections of the governors of those states.
Put this together with the wholly secret construction now under way--courtesy of a $385-million grant by the US Army Corps of Engineers to Halliburton subsidiary KBR Inc--of detention camps reportedly capable of confining as many as 400,000 people, and a recent report that the Pentagon has a document, dated June 1, 2007, classified Top Secret, which declares there to be a developing "insurgency" within the U.S, and which lays out a whole martial law counterinsurgency campaign against legal dissent, and you have all the ingredients for a military takeover of the United States.
As we go about our daily lives--our shopping, our escapist movie watching, and even our protesting and political organizing-we need to be aware that there is a real risk that it could all blow up, and that we could find ourselves facing armed, uniformed troops at our doors.
Bruce Fein isn't an alarmist. He says he doesn't see martial law coming tomorrow. But he is also realistic. "Really, by declaring the US to be a battlefield, Bush already made it possible for himself to declare martial law, because you can always declare martial law on a battlefield," he says. "All he would need would be a pretext, like another terrorist attack on the U.S."
Indeed, the revised Insurrection Act (10. USC 331-335) approved by Congress and signed into law by Bush last October, specifically says that the president can federalize the National Guard to "suppress public disorder" in the event of "national disorder, epidemic, other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident." That determination, the act states, is solely the president's to make. Congress is not involved.
Fein says, "This is all sitting around like a loaded gun waiting to go off. I think the risk of martial law is trivial right now, but the minute there is a terrorist attack, then it is real. And it stays with us after Bush and Cheney are gone, because terrorism stays with us forever." (It may be significant that Hillary Clinton, the leading Democratic candidate for president, has called for the revocation of the 2002 Authorization for Use of Military Force against Iraq, but not of the earlier 2001 AUMF which Bush claims makes him commander in chief of a borderless, endless war on terror.)
Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-VT), chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, has added an amendment to the upcoming Defense bill, restoring the Insurrection Act to its former version-a move that has the endorsement of all 50 governors--but Fein argues that would not solve the problem, since Bush still claims that the U.S. is a battlefield. Besides, a Leahy aide concedes that Bush could sign the next Defense Appropriations bill and then use a signing statement to invalidate the Insurrection Act rider.
Fein argues that the only real defense against the looming disaster of a martial law declaration would be for Congress to vote for a resolution determining that there is no "War" on terror. "But they are such cowards they will never do that," he says.
That leaves us with the military.
If ordered to turn their guns and bayonets on their fellow Americans, would our "heroes" in uniform follow their consciences, and their oaths to "uphold and defend" the Constitution of the United States? Or would they follow the orders of their Commander in Chief?
It has to be a plus that National Guard and Reserve units are on their third and sometimes fourth deployments to Iraq, and are fuming at the abuse. It has to be a plus that active duty troops are refusing to re-enlist in droves-especially mid-level officers.
If we are headed for martial law, better that it be with a broken military. Maybe if it's broken badly enough, the administration will be afraid to test the idea.
Dave Lindorff is the author of Killing Time: an Investigation into the Death Row Case of Mumia Abu-Jamal. His n book of CounterPunch columns titled "This Can't be Happening!" is published by Common Courage Press. Lindorff's newest book is "The Case for Impeachment",
co-authored by Barbara Olshansky.
I don't know..but just to stir the pot...:) .I did a quick search for KBR + Camps and got.
Steve will love this cause he get's paid to post propaganda for the RNC. :D
KBR awarded Homeland Security contract worth up to $385M
I you look at the contract (public info) it seems to be right around 16 facilities in each state.
http://www.halliburton.com/default/main/halliburton/eng/news/source_files/news.jsp?newsurl=/default/main/halliburton/eng/news/source_files/press_release/2006/kbrnws_012406.html
By Katherine Hunt
Last Update: 12:19 PM ET Jan 24, 2006
SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- KBR, the engineering and construction subsidiary of Halliburton Co. (HAL : Halliburton Company
News , chart , profile , more
Last: 34.51-0.95-2.68%
3:55pm 08/03/2007
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HAL34.51, -0.95, -2.7%) , said Tuesday it has been awarded a contingency contract from the Department of Homeland Security to supports its Immigration and Customs Enforcement facilities in the event of an emergency. The maximum total value of the contract is $385 million and consists of a 1-year base period with four 1-year options. KBR held the previous ICE contract from 2000 through 2005. The contract, which is effective immediately, provides for establishing temporary detention and processing capabilities to expand existing ICE Detention and Removal Operations Program facilities in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs, KBR said. The contract may also provide migrant detention support to other government organizations in the event of an immigration emergency, as well as the development of a plan to react to a national emergency, such as a natural disaster, the company said.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Freak,
Some interesting info.

[Old Texan]

"flithy liberal scumbgas" Scumbgas you say.
I'm merely asked that those in the PRF show some respsct for the victums. I have little to no contact with the flithy liberal scumbags you refer to. I was able to reach you and everyone else in the PRF who read my suggestion. There are way to many self centered, selfish pricks, in the PRF who don't know when to STFU.
Again my comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.
PLEASE
Chill out John. You are going over the line with your names this time.
No one on this forum is disrespecting the dead, so please try and control your temper. You get baited way too easy.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Chill out John. You are going over the line with your names this time.
No one on this forum is disrespecting the dead, so please try and control your temper. You get baited way too easy.
Once again we disagree TEX. A simple leave the politics out of this Bridge Tragidy turned into "flithy liberal scumbags". Your buddies can be selfish as hell and I'm surprised that you wouldn't acknowledge this.
You talk like these guys get me all angry and sh*t. I laugh at the majority if what Steve and Shiada post.
It's refreshing when someone from the Right quotes and names of the liberal they have an issue with. The majorty of the time, it's flithy liberal scumbags, or in this case flithy liberal scumbgas.
However, I agree that it doesn't belong in this thread.

[Schiada76]

Once again we disagree TEX. A simple leave the politics out of this Bridge Tragidy turned into "flithy liberal scumbags". Your buddies can be selfish as hell and I'm surprised that you wouldn't acknowledge this.
You talk like these guys get me all angry and sh*t. I laugh at the majority if what Steve and Shiada post.
It's refreshing when someone from the Right quotes and names of the liberal they have an issue with. The majorty of the time, it's flithy liberal scumbags, or in this case flithy liberal scumbgas.
However, I agree that it doesn't belong in this thread.
Boy you sure got me there! I committed a typo. I'll go hang myself now.:rolleyes: :D
My initial question wasn't directed at you, I asked an honest question because I knew what was coming from the left wing liberal scumbags in this country and they truly are scumbags. You of course, siding with the scumbags, take great umbrage at my question. Not the actions of the scumbags, just the question. At least you're open with your true feelings, even if you don't fully understand them yourself.
Oops almost forgot as did Ultra.
Name: Harry Reid
Quoted by NFE
A true dyed in the wool anti American liberal scumbag who will do and say anything to keep and/or increase his power.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Boy you sure got me there! I committed a typo. I'll go hang myself now.:rolleyes: :D
My initial question wasn't directed at you, I asked an honest question because I knew what was coming from the left wing liberal scumbags in this country and they truly are scumbags. You of course, siding with the scumbags, take great umbrage at my question. Not the actions of the scumbags, just the question. At least you're open with your true feelings, even if you don't fully understand them yourself.
Oops almost forgot as did Ultra.
Name: Harry Reid
Quoted by NFE
A true dyed in the wool anti American liberal scumbag who will do and say anything to keep and/or increase his power.
Please read from page one in this thread
I'm done with this thread. Bash liberals all you want. Bush didn't cause the bridge to collapse, I know it and anyone in their right mind knows it and there are plenty of Dems and Reps with right minds who also have feelings for those lost or injured. You're just not one of them
A sign of respect would be you shutting your mouth as well, but apparently that's not possible
Good by
I know that Bush didn't have anything to do with this disaster. However, I must agree that there some insane Democrats, trying to spin this tragady for their political benifit. These people are complete pieces of sh*t.
I should have stayed away like I originally intended.

[Schiada76]

Please read from page one in this thread
I know that Bush didn't have anything to do with this disaster.
However, I must agree that there are some insane Democrats, trying to spin this tragady for there political benifit. These people are complete pieces of sh*t.
I should have stayed away like I originally intended.
Maybe, since the fact is you and I are in 100% agreement on this yet you still want to argue. I don't get it. :confused:

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Ed Shultz has already blamed it on Bush.
Patty Murray blamed Bush when she said yesterday that the Bush Administration has not supported Democrat efforts to increase spending on critical infrastructure.
There is crumbling infrastructure all over the country, said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev. Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash., who heads the Senate panel that controls transportation spending, said the Bush administration has threatened vetoes when Democrats try to increase such spending.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0807/5228.html
So, 2 U.S. SENATORS are simply "The Crazed Blogging Public" eh ultra?
That "Ed Shultz" name seens toi have a familiar ring to it.
Oh yea, played football with the Winnepeg Blue Bombers, for a year.
Edward Andrew Schultz (born January 27, 1954) is the host of The Ed Schultz Show, a nationally syndicated U.S. talk radio show promising "straight talk from the heartland" from a "gun-totin', red meat-eatin' lefty."
Your "investigative" skills need work, since I GAVE you the Daily Koss, Fredomeden.com, amd Captainsquartersblog.com.
That's like a CD I made for a guy at work, about the "wonders" of Michael Moore.
He stuck it in his computer, and it auto-played a sound file, about 2 minuites worth, and, he said, that was all there was on it. It was the only SOUND FILE on the disk.
He flat REFUSED to "explore" the CD, LOOK at the 500 megabytes of speech cut comparisons, factual corrections, the complete DISECTION of "Roger & Me, Bowling For Columbine, AND "Farenheight 911".
The cuts of video-taped speeches where SUIT COLORS CHANGED, where CLOCKS GAINED 15 MINUITES IN A COUPLE OF SECCONDS, where PEOPLE SHIFTED INSTANTLY A FEW INCHES BEHIND A PODIUM BETWEEN CONSECUTIVE WORDS (removing a body shift that encompassed 6 or 7 words between his "cuts").
I wasted 4 or 5 hours one evening compiling it, for someone who DID NOT WANT TO LEARN THE TRUTH.
Reminds me of someone else, except that he built airplanes for a living. :idea:
I gave you half of it, and you still refused to look. :confused:
At least you FINALLY located the quotes from the 90's, from just about EVERYONE, as to Saddam's WMD's BEFORE "Bush supposedly lied".

[SmokinLowriderSS]

However, I must agree that there are some insane Democrats, trying to spin this tragady for there political benifit. These people are complete pieces of sh*t..
We agree.
I should have stayed away like I originally intended.
You can't help it, like staring at a train wreck or car accident, even when you KNOW you will see something disturbing to the eye.
:D

[MWJSOne]

The real deal a Police force for Halliburton from the folks at Blackwater you then have a Waffin SS force of Jack Booted Thugs
you could be confined in limbo or even be wiped off the face of the earth.
16 locations in each state
add the North American Union into the mix good bye rights.
Add to the mix
the revised Insurrection Act (10. USC 331-335) approved by Congress and signed into law by Bush last October, specifically says that the president can federalize the National Guard to "suppress public disorder" in the event of "national disorder, epidemic, other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident." That determination, the act states, is solely the president's to make. Congress is not involved.
I don't know..but just to stir the pot... .I did a quick search for KBR + Camps and got.
Steve will love this cause he get's paid to post propaganda for the RNC.
KBR awarded Homeland Security contract worth up to $385M
I you look at the contract (public info) it seems to be right around 16 facilities in each state.
http://www.halliburton.com/default/m...ws_012406.html
By Katherine Hunt
Last Update: 12:19 PM ET Jan 24, 2006
SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- KBR, the engineering and construction subsidiary of Halliburton Co. (HAL : Halliburton Company
News , chart , profile , more
Last: 34.51-0.95-2.68%
3:55pm 08/03/2007
Delayed quote dataAdd to portfolio
Analyst
Create alertInsider
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Sponsored by:
HAL34.51, -0.95, -2.7%) , said Tuesday it has been awarded a contingency contract from the Department of Homeland Security to supports its Immigration and Customs Enforcement facilities in the event of an emergency. The maximum total value of the contract is $385 million and consists of a 1-year base period with four 1-year options. KBR held the previous ICE contract from 2000 through 2005. The contract, which is effective immediately, provides for establishing temporary detention and processing capabilities to expand existing ICE Detention and Removal Operations Program facilities in the event of an emergency influx of immigrants into the U.S., or to support the rapid development of new programs, KBR said. The contract may also provide migrant detention support to other government organizations in the event of an immigration emergency, as well as the development of a plan to react to a national emergency, such as a natural disaster, the company said.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Since Halliburton is "making a huge ammount of money", care to explain to me just wht Halliburton was trying to SELL KBR a few years ago?
Care to explain to me why THEY COULDN'T FIND A BUYER?

[Steve 1]

Since Halliburton is "making a huge ammount of money", care to explain to me just wht Halliburton was trying to SELL KBR a few years ago?
Care to explain to me why THEY COULDN'T FIND A BUYER?
Oop's there it goes the Lefties worst enemy "FACTS"

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Here is a fact for your Steve. You are an embarrassment to political conservatives and everyone in the PRF's knows it.
How about "investigating" my KBR questions Mr "investigator"?
Or do you just buy into the "KBR makes Halliburton a ton of money" line like you bought into Global Warming and a couple of conspiracy theories I know of? Your "Un-sourced, un-supported, opinion".

[ULTRA26 # 1]

How about "investigating" my KBR questions Mr "investigator"?
Or do you just buy into the "KBR makes Halliburton a ton of money" line like you bought into Global Warming and a couple of conspiracy theories I know of? Your "Un-sourced, un-supported, opinion".
Not sure what you're getting at but here some info from a brief search
In May 2003, Halliburton revealed in SEC filings that its KBR subsidiary had paid a Nigerian official $2.4 million in bribes in order to receive favorable tax treatment.
On April 15, 2006, Halliburton filed a registration statement with the Securities and Exchange Commission to sell up to 20 percent of its KBR stock on the NYSE under the ticker symbol "KBR", as part of an eventual plan for KBR to be a separate company from Halliburton.
Today KBR employs over 30,000 people in Iraq. Halliburton's work in Iraq is diverse and complicated. In addition to troop support, Halliburton also provides air traffic control support; produces 74 million gallons of water a month for consumption, hygiene and laundry; deploys as many as 700 trucks a day to deliver essentials to American forces; and provides firefighter and crash-rescue services, as well as working to restore Iraqi oil infrastructure.
KBR has contracts in Iraq worth up to $18 billion, including a single no-bid contract known as "Restore Iraqi Oil" (RIO) which has an estimated worth of $7 billion
An audit of KBR by The Pentagon’s Defense Contract Audit Agency (DCAA) found $108 million in "questioned costs" and, as of mid-March 2005, said they still had "major" unresolved issues with Halliburton.
Do you hve some inside blog info on this issue?

[Steve 1]

Here is a fact for your Steve. You are an embarrassment to political conservatives and everyone in the PRF's knows it.
Well we all know how Communists like to lie and talk bullshit insurance boy!!

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Oop's there it goes the Lefties worst enemy "FACTS"
Here is a fact for your Steve. You are an embarrassment to political conservatives and everyone in the PRF's knows it.
Well we all know how Communists like to lie and talk bullshit insurance boy!!
Shell Shocked whiney little Fag

[Steve 1]

Here is a fact for your Steve. You are an embarrassment to political conservatives and everyone in the PRF's knows it.
Shell Shocked whiney little Fag
Figured you liked Men ULTRA FAG! The Bent One said you had holes on both sides of your underwear.
http://www.UploadYourImages.com/img/171547laughinghardka6.gif (http://www.UploadYourImages.com)

[Old Texan]

Shell Shocked whiney little Fag
John you've got to stop hanging around Blown. You're stealing all his good material. :devil:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Steve, you're so original. Keep um commin. Opps. I forgot you save that for your army buddies.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

John you've got to stop hanging around Blown. You're stealing all his good material. :devil:
Just a few more.

[Steve 1]

Steve, you're so original. Keep um commin. Opps. I forgot you save that for your army buddies.
I thought I told you to do the EXACT opposite of what that tiny Brain says, so guess what ULTRA wrong again!!!!!!!!
http://www.UploadYourImages.com/img/868713factaid.jpg (http://www.UploadYourImages.com)

[ULTRA26 # 1]

I thought I told you to do the EXACT opposite of what that tiny Brain says, so guess what ULTRA wrong again!!!!!!!!
http://www.UploadYourImages.com/img/868713factaid.jpg (http://www.UploadYourImages.com)
Why would you post a picture of yo mama with a red line through her mustache. And I know that picture, below, of your pappy coughin up your chowder, brings you to attention.
Have at it, lamo. I'm done

[Steve 1]

Why would you post a picture of yo mama with a red line through her mustache. And I know that picture, below, of your pappy coughin up your chowder, brings you to attention.
Have at it, lamo. I'm done
Here I found the problem asswipe!
http://www.UploadYourImages.com/img/010803brain_socialist_.gif (http://www.UploadYourImages.com)

[Pheelin Phroggy]

While I do not personally follow much of the bullsheit in politics, what I have learned from this forum:
1. We are nazi wannabees
2. Liberals are assholes
3. Democrats are assholes
4. Republicans are assholes
5. Everyone else are assholes
6. POTUS caused katrina, the tornado's, flooding, bridge collapse, and possibly my friends divorce (wondering if we could pay him to get wave his hand and fill our lakes out here).
7. Blackwater is about to stage a coup and take over the U.S, backed by our own military.
8. Resistance is futile!
While I am sure I missed of few items... I will take all this news like normal... fookit, im going to the lake!
U.S Army Retired

[GAWnCA]

Anyone know if the liberal nitwits have blamed the bridge collapse on the POTUS yet?:rolleyes: :D
In a round about way, YES!! He's spending all this money in Iraq when he should be spending it here at home, on welfare, food stamps, and other give-away programs. Just ask Nancy Pelosie or Harry Reid. Now talk about nut jobs. They could find hundreds of pet projects to spend that money on. Now they are talking "we need new taxes" to fix our roads, where the hell is all that gas tax going.
I'm not really happy with Bush and some of his ideas as to how America and Americans should be protected, our borders and ports sealed, but can you imagine what America would be had Tree-Hugging Gore had been elected? How about that traitor, Kerry?

[never_fast_enuf]

Sorry for not leaving this issue alone as I stated I was going.
My comment was not directed at the rest of the blogging public, it was directed to the PRF, (the Political Rhetoric Forum), period.
My comment"
The death toll at risen to five with more confirmed expected later today. Let us here in the PRF leave the politics out of this tragedy as a sign of respsct for the victums and their families.
Yet another fine example of the extreme hypocrisy you on the left so proudly display.
Well done!!!

[Old Texan]

Here I found the problem asswipe!
http://www.UploadYourImages.com/img/010803brain_socialist_.gif (http://www.UploadYourImages.com)
That's hilarius....:D :D

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Yet another fine example of the extreme hypocrisy you on the left so proudly display.
Well done!!!
Please explain where my comment was hypocritical. I asked those in the PRF not no make this tragedy political. Contained in my 1st post about this issue I stated that Bush had nothing to do with this and that anyone in their right mind would know this.
I fail to see the hypocrisy here, so please spell it out for me. If not I will write it off as just another Dem this, liberal that, empty comment.
Your turn never_fast_enuf

[Schiada76]

Ok, Maybe not your hypocrisy, lets call it "theirs".

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Do you hve some inside blog info on this issue?
Well, you found the usual "half-truth" news site.
What I have is public reality.
KBR is UNPROFITABLE.
KBR is permitted, by the letter of the contracts it holds (Contracts issued not by George W Bush), to make a profit on the contracts. It is permitted a 3% profit.
Now, I will guarantee your employer will not tolerate a 3% profit level from any entity it opperates. That is basically ZERO, just barely breaking even.
My parent employer wants 20% from LearJet, and does not get it.
My DEPARTMENT exceeds that, but specifics are not releasable.
KBR is a bad performer for Halliburton's bottom line, and was for sale.
It was for sale for 4 years.
No-one wanted it, and so Halliburton is still stuck with it, and all it's expenses, and all it's liabilitites, and NONE of the "huge government contract profits" the left want to CLAIM they get from it.
EXTRA CREDIT to tell me who issued Halliburton the contracts they hold.
Bush EXTENDED the contracts, he DID NOT ISSUE the contracts (another fact ignored by the lefty noisemakers).

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Well, you found the usual "half-truth" news site.
What I have is public reality.
KBR is UNPROFITABLE.
KBR is permitted, by the letter of the contracts it holds (Contracts issued not by George W Bush), to make a profit on the contracts. It is permitted a 3% profit.
Now, I will guarantee your employer will not tolerate a 3% profit level from any entity it opperates. That is basically ZERO, just barely breaking even.
My parent employer wants 20% from LearJet, and does not get it.
My DEPARTMENT exceeds that, but specifics are not releasable.
KBR is a bad performer for Halliburton's bottom line, and was for sale.
It was for sale for 4 years.
No-one wanted it, and so Halliburton is still stuck with it, and all it's expenses, and all it's liabilitites, and NONE of the "huge government contract profits" the left want to CLAIM they get from it.
EXTRA CREDIT to tell me who issued Halliburton the contracts they hold.
Bush EXTENDED the contracts, he DID NOT ISSUE the contracts (another fact ignored by the lefty noisemakers).
Now how is it that you are privy too these contact specifics? Who at KBR/Halliburton would enter such a poor agreement? Makes little sense
KBR has contracts in Iraq worth up to $18 billion, including a single no-bid contract known as "Restore Iraqi Oil" (RIO) which has an estimated worth of $7 billion Hard to believe that KBR would be involved in a no bid contract, limiting profit to 3%.
If KBR has been advanced large sums and has no intention fulfilling it's obligation, then it makes some sense.
BTW, it wasn't me who claimed big profits from KBR. Halliburton can probably use the write-off.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

The government contracts are not secret, classified, covert, or any other euphemism you like.
You're just too lazy to "investigate".

[ULTRA26 # 1]

The government contracts are not secret, classified, covert, or any other euphemism you like.
You're just too lazy to "investigate".
I simply don't have the enormous thirst for trivia or as much time to research the same as you. Rest assured, it's not about lazy.
Since KBR contracts are public, please post a link to the 3% profit margin limit language in the KBR contract you commented on.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

I simply don't have the enormous thirst for trivia or as much time to research the same as you. Rest assured, it's not about lazy.
Since KBR contracts are public, please post a link to the 3% profit margin limit language in the KBR contract you commented on.
I've done enough of your homework for you. Do it yourself.
By the way, WHO ISSUED those no-bid contracts to KBR??????

[ULTRA26 # 1]

I've dome enough of yout homework for you. Do it yopurself.
By the way, WHO ISSUED those no-bid contracts to KBR??????
Smokin,
I'm not your student nor are you my teacher.
Who cares that the Pentagon issued the no bid contracts. You want to tell us about this and the 3% profit margin limit language in the KBR contract, that's fine. If not, that's fine too.

[Old Texan]

I guess it's fine then.......:devil: Proceed.......

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Nice try ultra.
The Pentagon did not "give" those contracts to KBR.
The falacy that your liberal co-horts try to spread that Pres. Bush gave KBR those contracts is also a bald-faced lie.
President Clinton issued those contracts to KBR/Halliburton. All the current administration did was to extend them after 9/11/01.
Care to tell me what companies in the world can fill Halliburton's shoes?

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Nice try ultra.
The Pentagon did not "give" those contracts to KBR.
The falacy that your liberal co-horts try to spread that Pres. Bush gave KBR those contracts is also a bald-faced lie.
President Clinton issued those contracts to KBR/Halliburton. All the current administration did was to extend them after 9/11/01.
Care to tell me what companies in the world can fill Halliburton's shoes?
FBI Investigates Halliburton's No-Bid Contracts
By John Solomon
Associated Press
October 28, 2004
The FBI has begun investigating whether the Pentagon improperly awarded no-bid contracts to Halliburton Co., seeking an interview with a top Army contracting officer and collecting documents from several government offices. The line of inquiry expands an earlier FBI investigation into whether Halliburton overcharged taxpayers for fuel in Iraq, and it elevates to a criminal matter the election-year question of whether the Bush administration showed favoritism to Vice President Dick Cheney's former company.
FBI agents this week sought permission to interview Bunnatine Greenhouse, the Army Corps of Engineers' chief contracting officer who went public last weekend with allegations that her agency unfairly awarded KBR, a Halliburton subsidiary, no-bid contracts worth billions of dollars for work in Iraq, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press. Asked about the documents, Greenhouse's lawyers said Thursday their client will cooperate but that she wants whistleblower protection from Pentagon retaliation. "I think it (the FBI interview request) underscores the seriousness of the misconduct, and it also demonstrates how courageous Ms. Greenhouse was for stepping forward," said Stephen Kohn, one of her attorneys. "The initiation of an FBI investigation into criminal misconduct will help restore public confidence," Kohn said. "The Army must aggressively protect Ms. Greenhouse from the retaliation she will encounter as a result of blowing the whistle on this misconduct."
I'm not going to answer more of your silly questions so you can say
"your wrong" with 0 suppot

[Old Texan]

FBI Investigates Halliburton's No-Bid Contracts
By John Solomon
Associated Press
October 28, 2004
The FBI has begun investigating whether the Pentagon improperly awarded no-bid contracts to Halliburton Co., seeking an interview with a top Army contracting officer and collecting documents from several government offices. The line of inquiry expands an earlier FBI investigation into whether Halliburton overcharged taxpayers for fuel in Iraq, and it elevates to a criminal matter the election-year question of whether the Bush administration showed favoritism to Vice President Dick Cheney's former company.
FBI agents this week sought permission to interview Bunnatine Greenhouse, the Army Corps of Engineers' chief contracting officer who went public last weekend with allegations that her agency unfairly awarded KBR, a Halliburton subsidiary, no-bid contracts worth billions of dollars for work in Iraq, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press. Asked about the documents, Greenhouse's lawyers said Thursday their client will cooperate but that she wants whistleblower protection from Pentagon retaliation. "I think it (the FBI interview request) underscores the seriousness of the misconduct, and it also demonstrates how courageous Ms. Greenhouse was for stepping forward," said Stephen Kohn, one of her attorneys. "The initiation of an FBI investigation into criminal misconduct will help restore public confidence," Kohn said. "The Army must aggressively protect Ms. Greenhouse from the retaliation she will encounter as a result of blowing the whistle on this misconduct."
I'm not going to answer more of your silly questions so you can say
"your wrong" with 0 suppot
I believe if you would consult the dictionary you hold so dear, "investigation" doesn't mean "guilt". When the evidence is in and only then can you state emphatically that wrongdoing took place.
Side note, what the hell kind of name is Bunnatine?????:)

[ULTRA26 # 1]

I believe if you would consult the dictionary you hold so dear, "investigation" doesn't mean "guilt". When the evidence is in and only then can you state emphatically that wrongdoing took place.
Side note, what the hell kind of name is Bunnatine?????:)
Calm down Tex, nobody said anything about anyone doing anything wrong
This was only posted in regard to the Pentagon awarding no bid contracts in response to Smokin saying they didn't. Wrongfully?? The article doesn't say.

[Old Texan]

Calm down Tex, nobody said anything about anyone doing anything wrong
This was only posted in regard to the Pentagon awarding no bid contracts in response to Smokin saying they didn't. Wrongfully?? The article doesn't say.
I'm perfectly calm. Just pointing out that your "dead on proof" of guilt is still being investigated.
Contrary to what you seem to think, no bid contracts are often the right and prudent thing to do and both parties have taken this upon themselves. KBR and other specialty contractors often are the only real qualified gropups to do certain jobs. If every contract were put up for bid we could have a lot of bad situations costing the country both money and lives. But that is a whole different story for discussion. The low bid is not always and actually a high percentage of the time, not the right choice.
I'm curious if this mysteriously named Bunnadine hasn't got you all aroused or somethin'.......:eek:

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Calm down Tex, nobody said anything about anyone doing anything wrong
We've all here seen "Accusation = Guilt" in ultra's little world.
A US President WAS ACCUSED of "stealing" an election, and is guilty, especially since no proof exists.
A Vice President IS ACCUSED of releasing the name of a "secret agent" to the press, and is guilty, despite the admission of a former State Dept. employee that HE released her name, and despite the fact that she WAS LEGALLY NOT COVERT, and so no crime exists.
Mankind IS ACCUSED of heating up the entire planet, and is guilty, despite the fraudulent "evidence" used by the accusers, the volumes of evidence to the contrary that global temperature change is a normal part of the earth's existence, and we Americans are told we can "stop it" if WE reduce "carbon emmissions, despite the fact that WE AMERICANS only emit 0.0027% or worldwide carbon dioxide emmissions.
He'd make a FINE prosecuting attorney, I think an appropriate opening exists in North Carolina. :idea:
A fine college there too, private school.
I think they play Lacrosse among other sports. :idea:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

I'm perfectly calm. Just pointing out that your "dead on proof" of guilt is still being investigated.
Contrary to what you seem to think, no bid contracts are often the right and prudent thing to do and both parties have taken this upon themselves. KBR and other specialty contractors often are the only real qualified gropups to do certain jobs. If every contract were put up for bid we could have a lot of bad situations costing the country both money and lives. But that is a whole different story for discussion. The low bid is not always and actually a high percentage of the time, not the right choice.
I'm curious if this mysteriously named Bunnadine hasn't got you all aroused or somethin'.......:eek:
Guilt with regard to what? I didn't state that the Pentagon was guilty of anything. The point of paste was only to prove that the Pentagon awarded no bid contracts to KBR. No more no less. The investigation was related to potential wrong dong.
We've all here seen "Accusation = Guilt" in ultra's little world.
A US President WAS ACCUSED of "stealing" an election, and is guilty, especially since no proof exists.
A Vice President IS ACCUSED of releasing the name of a "secret agent" to the press, and is guilty, despite the admission of a former State Dept. employee that HE released her name, and despite the fact that she WAS LEGALLY NOT COVERT, and so no crime exists.
Mankind IS ACCUSED of heating up the entire planet, and is guilty, despite the fraudulent "evidence" used by the accusers, the volumes of evidence to the contrary that global temperature change is a normal part of the earth's existence, and we Americans are told we can "stop it" if WE reduce "carbon emmissions, despite the fact that WE AMERICANS only emit 0.0027% or worldwide carbon dioxide emmissions.
He'd make a FINE prosecuting attorney, I think an appropriate opening exists in North Carolina.
A fine college there too, private school.
I think they play Lacrosse among other sports.
1. You are correct.
2. Never accused the VP of leaking anything. I stated that I believe that time will tell that the VP was crook.
3. You are somewhat correct. There is significant eveidence that mankind is having an affect on the climate.
With all of the smoke you get blown up you a** it's no wonder you are such a bag of wind. At least you impress yourself.

[never_fast_enuf]

I simply don't have the enormous thirst for trivia or as much time to research the same as you. Rest assured, it's not about lazy.
Since KBR contracts are public, please post a link to the 3% profit margin limit language in the KBR contract you commented on.
Translated your statement say you have no desire to understand the truth. It gets in your way of "feeling" ignorant hatred to a company that you think is evil.
Clearly, you are clueless as to how these contracts work and how/why they come about. If you understood them, you would have moved on long ago. This is just one more example of the ignorance displayed by the Bush haters.

[never_fast_enuf]

2. Never accused the VP of leaking anything. I stated that I believe that time will tell that the VP was crook.
3. You are somewhat correct. There is significant eveidence that mankind is having an affect on the climate.
Just how is the VP a crook? More ignorance from a lazy left wing kook.
There is significant GUESSING that man is somehow causing the earth to warm wich is refuted by simple common sense and facts.
Too bad that there are plenty of people like you who are all too eager to put their "feelings" ahead of facts and common sense.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Translated your statement say you have no desire to understand the truth. It gets in your way of "feeling" ignorant hatred to a company that you think is evil.
Clearly, you are clueless as to how these contracts work and how/why they come about. If you understood them, you would have moved on long ago. This is just one more example of the ignorance displayed by the Bush haters.
Now try and follow the comments. Can you do that? Apparantly not.
Just more of the Dem this and lib that empty B.S. you folks are so good at. Be proud, at least you are good at something.
A simple question for you and please answer based on the facts as you know them.
Did the Pentagon at any time properly award no bid contracts to KBR?

[Schiada76]

Just curious, why do you think Cheney is a crook?
I haven't heard of any charges against him.:confused:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Just curious, why do you think Cheney is a crook?
I haven't heard of any charges against him.:confused:
There haven't been any charges. No facts, Nothing. Just nutbag emotion.
Kinda like the Right's blind loyaly to W and his crew

[Schiada76]

There haven't been any charges. No facts, Nothing. Just nutbag emotion.
Kinda like the Right's blind loyaly to W and his crew
This is by far the saddest post on this site.:confused: :rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

This is by far the saddest post on this site.:confused: :rolleyes:
Coming from you, this is a compliment

[Schiada76]

Coming from you, this is a compliment
Typical liberal leftwing nut job.
"I don't like your views so you must be a criminal and a liar".:D
What happened to you little Ultra, lighting strike on your tin foil hat?:idea: :eek: :rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Typical liberal leftwing nut job.
"I don't like your views so you must be a criminal and a liar".:D
What happened to you little Ultra, lighting strike on your tin foil hat?:idea: :eek: :rolleyes:
Not at all. I just follow the "If it ain't' Right and it and White then shoot it" philosophy.
You clowns sure talk about tin foil alot. Was there a sale, on it, over there at WWWWWAAAAAAAALLLLLLL-MMMMAAAARRRRTTTTTT

[Schiada76]

Not at all. I just follow the "If it ain't' Right and it and White then shoot it" philosophy.
HUH?
You clowns sure talk about tin foil alot. Was there a sale, on it, over there at WWWWWAAAAAAAALLLLLLL-MMMMAAAARRRRTTTTTT
HMMM, is that supposed to be a whine or do you hate Wal Mart too?:D

[ULTRA26 # 1]

HMMM, is that supposed to be a whine or do you hate Wal Mart too?:D
Yep, I hate Wal-Mart too

[Schiada76]

Yep, I hate Wal-Mart too
Is it just too white trash for your upper crust liberal tastes or are they an evil business keeping the poor folk down?

[Old Texan]

Yep, I hate Wal-Mart too
You never have explained this great disdain for WalMart. You like to use at as material for personnal attacks I've noticed (above is an example), but really could you elaborate a little on what it is about WalMart you don't like?
I'm curious and would like to hear your views, no sarcasm or anything intended (for now anyways :D ), seriously what's the deal.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

You never have explained this great disdain for WalMart. You like to use at as material for personnal attacks I've noticed (above is an example), but really could you elaborate a little on what it is about WalMart you don't like?
I'm curious and would like to hear your views, no sarcasm or anything intended (for now anyways :D ), seriously what's the deal.
Tex,
My dislike for Wal-Mart runs very deep and I don't type well enough to tell the entire story.
Wall-Mart has a history of being less than fair to it's employees. In about 60 % of the cases their people are only allowed non full time work weeks to avoid standard employee benifits. Wal-Mart per hour wage is the lowest in the nation for a large company. In fact Wal-Mart pays so little that a large percentage of there employess are eliglble for and receive aid from the Govt.
Here are a few pastes related to what I am referring to
In 2001, sales associates, the most common job in Wal-Mart, earned on average $8.23 an hour for annual wages of $13,861. The 2001 poverty line for a family of three was $14,630.
A 2003 wage analysis reported that cashiers, the second most common job, earn approximately $7.92 per hour and work 29 hours a week. This brings in annual wages of only $11,948.
The average two-person family (one parent and one child) needed $27,948 to meet basic needs in 2005, well above what Wal-Mart reports that its average full-time associate earns. Wal-Mart claimed that its average associate earned $9.68 an hour in 2005. That would make the average associate's annual wages $17,114
Wal-Mart reported in January 2006 that its health insurance only covers 43% of their employees. Wal-Mart has approximately 1.39 million US employees
Full-time hourly employees must wait 180 days (approximately 6 months) before being able to enroll in Wal-Mart's health insurance plan. Managers have no waiting period.
All of Wal-Mart's Health Plans Are Too Costly for Its Workers to Use
Since the average full-time Wal-Mart employee earned $17,114 in 2005, he or she would have to spend between 7 and 25 percent of his or her income just to cover the premiums and medical deductibles, if electing for single coverage
Wal-Mart Admits Public Health Care is a "Better Value"
President and CEO Lee Scott said in 2005, "In some of our states, the public program may actually be a better value - with relatively high income limits to qualify, and low premiums
All of the above, and so much more, has been common knowledge for years.
Tex, I do everything possible never to set foot in Wal-Mart.

[Old Texan]

Tex,
My dislike for Wal-Mart runs very deep and I don't type well enough to tell the entire story.
Wall-Mart has a history of being less than fair to it's employees. In about 60 % of the cases their people are only allowed non full time work weeks to avoid standard employee benifits. Wal-Mart per hour wage is the lowest in the nation for a large company. In fact Wal-Mart pays so little that a large percentage of there employess are eliglble for and receive aid from the Govt.
Here are a few pastes related to what I am referring to
In 2001, sales associates, the most common job in Wal-Mart, earned on average $8.23 an hour for annual wages of $13,861. The 2001 poverty line for a family of three was $14,630.
A 2003 wage analysis reported that cashiers, the second most common job, earn approximately $7.92 per hour and work 29 hours a week. This brings in annual wages of only $11,948.
The average two-person family (one parent and one child) needed $27,948 to meet basic needs in 2005, well above what Wal-Mart reports that its average full-time associate earns. Wal-Mart claimed that its average associate earned $9.68 an hour in 2005. That would make the average associate's annual wages $17,114
Wal-Mart reported in January 2006 that its health insurance only covers 43% of their employees. Wal-Mart has approximately 1.39 million US employees
Full-time hourly employees must wait 180 days (approximately 6 months) before being able to enroll in Wal-Mart's health insurance plan. Managers have no waiting period.
All of Wal-Mart's Health Plans Are Too Costly for Its Workers to Use
Since the average full-time Wal-Mart employee earned $17,114 in 2005, he or she would have to spend between 7 and 25 percent of his or her income just to cover the premiums and medical deductibles, if electing for single coverage
Wal-Mart Admits Public Health Care is a "Better Value"
President and CEO Lee Scott said in 2005, "In some of our states, the public program may actually be a better value - with relatively high income limits to qualify, and low premiums
All of the above, and so much more, has been common knowledge for years.
Tex, I do everything possible never to set foot in Wal-Mart.
First off John, I really appreciate where your coming from on WalMart and I actually agree too pretty much all you post about it and say about it. Now then here's my take which is entirely a view of what it might be, could be, or actually is about the WalMart mystique or whatever we label it to be.
A little history. Back in the 60's and 70's the great American auto machine had their support industries, we call them Tier 1 & 2 Suppliers today, located in small towns throughout the midwest and I suppose other regions. These suppliers basically did the same thing as today's Miquiladoras(sp) which are located on the Mex/US border. They were essentially parts assembly plants and manufacturers of components for the auto industry. They employed mostly female and minority workers that worked for wages approx. 50% of what was being paid on the "lines" in the auto factories. They had minimal benefits and managed to work around what benefits were offered in the big "shops".
What was it they provided? Jobs for wives, single women, divorcees, and others with little or no marketable skills. Actually everyone was very pleased because the wages, although a fraction of the factory wages, paid far more than the local economies which at the time were dominated by "Mom and Pop" owned small businesses and agriculture. It was pretty much a good thing for most everyone. Higher than average local small town wages, reasonably priced labor for the product, and mainly a secondary tier of jobs for unskilled labor to get a start.
What happened? Labor Unions pushed and pushed and made these jobs unaffordable to the Big 3 and off they went to Mexico and beyond.
Today Walmart offers essntially the same thing. It's basically in my opinion a lot like the intent of the minmum wage, a job to help out or to supply secondary income. It also allows public access to reasonably priced products that if sold by union driven and benefit laden wages would make a lot of things unaffordable to a large segment of society.
Just obsevations John, no investiating required. I'm not by any means a Walmart fan, I just view it as something of more benefit than not. It serves a purpose.
My point is that WalMart is today's economic repalcement for "Second Tier" jobs. It is what it is, a starting point and somewhere that many folks use to survive. Will you get rich, not likely. But it serves a purpose and it definitely allows a major portion of the nation to afford items that probalby would beyond their financial reach.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

First off John, I really appreciate where your coming from on WalMart and I actually agree too pretty much all you post about it and say about it. Now then here's my take which is entirely a view of what it might be, could be, or actually is about the WalMart mystique or whatever we label it to be.
A little history. Back in the 60's and 70's the great American auto machine had their support industries, we call them Tier 1 & 2 Suppliers today, located in small towns throughout the midwest and I suppose other regions. These suppliers basically did the same thing as today's Miquiladoras(sp) which are located on the Mex/US border. They were essentially parts assembly plants and manufacturers of components for the auto industry. They employed mostly female and minority workers that worked for wages approx. 50% of what was being paid on the "lines" in the auto factories. They had minimal benefits and managed to work around what benefits were offered in the big "shops".
What was it they provided? Jobs for wives, single women, divorcees, and others with little or no marketable skills. Actually everyone was very pleased because the wages, although a fraction of the factory wages, paid far more than the local economies which at the time were dominated by "Mom and Pop" owned small businesses and agriculture. It was pretty much a good thing for most everyone. Higher than average local small town wages, reasonably priced labor for the product, and mainly a secondary tier of jobs for unskilled labor to get a start.
What happened? Labor Unions pushed and pushed and made these jobs unaffordable to the Big 3 and off they went to Mexico and beyond.
Today Walmart offers essntially the same thing. It's basically in my opinion a lot like the intent of the minmum wage, a job to help out or to supply secondary income. It also allows public access to reasonably priced products that if sold by union driven and benefit laden wages would make a lot of things unaffordable to a large segment of society.
Just obsevations John, no investiating required. I'm not by any means a Walmart fan, I just view it as something of more benefit than not. It serves a purpose.
My point is that WalMart is today's economic repalcement for "Second Tier" jobs. It is what it is, a starting point and somewhere that many folks use to survive. Will you get rich, not likely. But it serves a purpose and it definitely allows a major portion of the nation to afford items that probalby would beyond their financial reach.
Tex,
Your points were very easy to understand.

[never_fast_enuf]

Ultra, are you a member of a union?

[never_fast_enuf]

http://www.walmartfoundation.org/Files/wmf_2005contributions.pdf
Ultra?

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Ultra, are you a member of a union?
X Member.
http://www.walmartfoundation.org/Files/wmf_2005contributions.pdf
Ultra?
And your point?

[never_fast_enuf]

X Member.
Why an ex?

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Why an ex?
The American Federation of Musicians, local 369, just about destroyed live music in Las Vegas. I joined in 1968 and remained a member until about 1980. Unacceptably high pay scales, benefits rules and regulations, closed the door on what was a place where a Musician could make a living without being on the road. I quit playing music for a living in 1985, in order to be a better father.

[never_fast_enuf]

Well that sounds like a damn good reason to me . Kudo's to you for the choice you made.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Well that sounds like a damn good reason to me . Kudo's to you for the choice you made.
Best choice I've ever made. My Son is a great guy. He's now 26 and married to a lady who is equally great.