gullwing owners runnin over 90+, shoe depth???

[IMPATIENT 1]

what are you guys runnin for shoe depth on your gullwings? runnin a taper or backcut?
i went and ran my condor tx-19 hard sat. and at 93gps it cavitates and just slips. i thought the shoe was level with the keel, but i checked it today and its 1/8 above keel:eek: i musta been tipsy when i checked it:D anyways, do i need to drop it down to 1/8 below keel or just make a shim to get it level???i've got enough plate to build the shims, but i'd like to know where to start.
at @91mph its runnin almost 6700 then it climbs fast to almost 6900rpms , cavitates, bangs out on the limiter.i know this thing will do 100+ if i can keep it hooked up. my loader seems to be working great, its @1/8 below keel. appreciate any info, tom.

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

How is it at shutdown????????? Does it dig the nose? Does it turn right or left? Thats one of the main things that you need to find out when testing with those kinds of speeds. You will get 50% of the peeps that run a backcut and the other 50% run tapered hardware. 1/8 above keel is rule of thumb to start. You should drill and tap your suction for a guage. That will get you a better idea where you need to be;) Im glad to hear that you finally got her out there;) You did a hell of a job on that boat.....

[Squirtin Thunder]

Move the shoe down slowly, you don't want to go too far. Your RPMs may drop and speed will pick up. Watch it on shut down. Light breaks are good, hard breaks with a twist is bad.

[IMPATIENT 1]

How is it at shutdown????????? Does it dig the nose? Does it turn right or left? Thats one of the main things that you need to find out when testing with those kinds of speeds. You will get 50% of the peeps that run a backcut and the other 50% run tapered hardware. 1/8 above keel is rule of thumb to start. You should drill and tap your suction for a guage. That will get you a better idea where you need to be;) Im glad to hear that you finally got her out there;) You did a hell of a job on that boat.....
i appreciate that mike!:) i wish it was as pimp clean as yours;) but i'll get it to that point someday(i hope).
i did drill and tap both places on the intake when i went thru the pump. stuck plugs in it to work on that this winter time. i wanna make a transom plate so i can get the bowl off easy:mad: and was gonna run the lines to some gauges then. the shut down is almost dead straight which lead me to think i didn't have enough shoe to begin with. i thought i had checked it over the winter but i think i checked the loader depth instead and confused the 2. i'll try getting it level with keel and find a nice open cove, see how it reacts to it.some guys here local are tellin me to drop it to 1/8 below but without a jetaway, i think it'll pitch me at some point there.

[Squirtin Thunder]

It is safer to go a little at a time. And a bit more testing so more fun.

[IMPATIENT 1]

It is safer to go a little at a time. And a bit more testing so more fun.
i will jim, gonna drop it to level, play with it this weekend and see what it does. i know its kinda stupid not to adjust shoe by the intake pressure but i don't need every mph i can get this yr., just keep it from cavitating for now will do for me with a decent shutdown.gonna pull the shoe and build a shim tues nite, maybe go out sat. and play alittle.

[camoman]

Go slow if you start adding shims like 030 slow:idea: You will know when you went past the comfort zone when you get out of her:confused:

[Squirtin Thunder]

I have some testing to do this week as well as my daughter. I am putting the Dom on and see what I can get out of it. I am working on my new shoe and rideplate also. I well be dropping it an 1/8, right now the breaks are OK but hoping for a bit more, ie drive in deeper into the corners.

[sleekcrafter]

Your loader is stealing water from the shoe, being an 1/4 inch lower than the shoe.

[IMPATIENT 1]

Your loader is stealing water from the shoe, being an 1/4 inch lower than the shoe.
ya know, that makes alot of sense!!and it is lower than the shoe.i'll try shimming down alittle 1st then before i go to much more, trim the loader.
what's the rule of thumb as far as loader to shoe depths? just boat to boat or has a pattern formed?

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

.015-.030 per drop. Then fire her up and run her. Shut her down at 30mph/40/50/60/etc. Thats what I did with my Kachina when I shoed it. I ran a 2* backcut and it pulled the nose down upon shutdown but it wasnt violent by any means so I kept it there :) Let us know your results when you test. Please be smart and start slowly. I have seen several boats get stupid with hardware chenge:eek:

[Cs19]

Fab up a .030 and a .060 shim for the shoe and rideplate cradle, add .030 at a time to both the shoe and cradle.. If it likes the .030 then pull it out and install the .060, if it likes the .060 stack both shims in there and try it again. If it was faster and still driveable go home and make a .125 shim. Remember that if you drop the shoe x amount you need to shim the plate/cradle x amount to keep the plate at the same angle.

[IMPATIENT 1]

Fab up a .030 and a .060 shim for the shoe and rideplate cradle, add .030 at a time to both the shoe and cradle.. If it likes the .030 then pull it out and install the .060, if it likes the .060 stack both shims in there and try it again. If it was faster and still driveable go home and make a .125 shim. Remember that if you drop the shoe x amount you need to shim the plate/cradle x amount to keep the plate at the same angle.
whataya guys think the difference should be between loader depth and show depth?is there a rule-o-thumb?
i appreciate the good info fellas, i think its gonna break 100 this weekend:D

[smokinjoe]

my shoe is 1/8" below keel and the loader is also below keel a little more than 1/8" and it runs great. no cavitation and rpms are what they should be. but i still cant get it to hole shot without it blowing the pump out. AA impeller spining 6300 and doing 105.7 with three people and a cooler in the boat. shutdown is smooth and straight

[IMPATIENT 1]

my shoe is 1/8" below keel and the loader is also below keel a little more than 1/8" and it runs great. no cavitation and rpms are what they should be. but i still cant get it to hole shot without it blowing the pump out. AA impeller spining 6300 and doing 105.7 with three people and a cooler in the boat. shutdown is smooth and straight
gullwing hull?

[Sleeper CP]

Wow I think I want to run Smokinjoe when I get the boat on the water.
MY CP gullwing seams to run best the the shoe 1/16th up from the keel. Both backcut and tapered. It runs a couple mph faster with the backcut. At 1/16th up it shuts down real smooth at 90+. I have pushed it to 1/8th below, it didn't go any faster and just messed up the skiing wake.
Sleeper CP
565" Ford Lover

[IMPATIENT 1]

Wow I think I want to run Smokinjoe when I get the boat on the water.
MY CP gullwing seams to run best the the shoe 1/16th up from the keel. Both backcut and tapered. It runs a couple mph faster with the backcut. At 1/16th up it shuts down real smooth at 90+. I have pushed it to 1/8th below, it didn't go any faster and just messed up the skiing wake.
Sleeper CP
565" Ford Lover
did it get hairy on shutdowns below keel an 1/8th?

[Sleeper CP]

did it get hairy on shutdowns below keel an 1/8th?
No it didn't, just that you could really feel the drag, that's all.
Sleeper CP

[bigriverdog]

I'm running a 2 degree backcut shoe at 1/8 above keel. This combo works very well. Good hole shot and it doesn't slam the hull down on re-entry.

[smokinjoe]

shut down is smooth not even any turning or feeling like you slammed on the brakes.

[smokinjoe]

and yes its a gullwing with a set back pump

[IMPATIENT 1]

i built my shim last nite and bolted it all up, the leading edge of the shoe(tapered) is at 1/16 below keel and it tapers to about level with the keel as it transitions to the ride plate mount area. i hacked on my loader alittle and i gotta got my bud to tig it all back up tonite ,get it back on. the loader was alittle to long so i'm gonna try 1 my uncle has this weekend 1st and see if the "off the shelf" ssloader will do the job, if it does i'll get a new 1 instead of pccoating my old 1. i think 100+ is gonna happen saturday:D can't wait :)

[hotbo]

i built my shim last nite and bolted it all up, the leading edge of the shoe(tapered) is at 1/16 below keel and it tapers to about level with the keel as it transitions to the ride plate mount area. i hacked on my loader alittle and i gotta got my bud to tig it all back up tonite ,get it back on. the loader was alittle to long so i'm gonna try 1 my uncle has this weekend 1st and see if the "off the shelf" ssloader will do the job, if it does i'll get a new 1 instead of pccoating my old 1. i think 100+ is gonna happen saturday:D can't wait :)
:D dreaming my young son:jawdrop:

[IMPATIENT 1]

:D dreaming my young son:jawdrop:
i'm older than you peckerwood:D and i'll text ya a picture of my "dream" saturday when i put my gps over 100;) :D

[IMPATIENT 1]

i'm trying a different loader sat too, billy has a nice blocked loader i'd like to try we pulled offa his tx-19. if it works, i was gonna call scott and see what kinda deal he could get me on a new ss loader.

[hotbo]

i'm trying a different loader sat too, billy has a nice blocked loader i'd like to try we pulled offa his tx-19. if it works, i was gonna call scott and see what kinda deal he could get me on a new ss loader.
why a blocked loader thats gonna block more water and make rpms go up more peckerwood:idea: let him kae ya a c-fang atleast they look weird:D
http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w130/hotbo/HPIM0310.jpg

[hotbo]

http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w130/hotbo/HPIM0309.jpg
mind everyone this is for a e-pump but look similar to a regular pump just smaller in design
http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w130/hotbo/HPIM0311.jpg
tom get ya one youll love it if you can get your loader to work.:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

why a blocked loader thats gonna block more water and make rpms go up more peckerwood:idea: let him kae ya a c-fang atleast they look weird:D
http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w130/hotbo/HPIM0310.jpg
its just blocked in the frt, not even gonna effect anything. its the same loader that hitech, cp, everybody sells "off the shelf" but this 1 has a small blocker at the intake mount area, they still sell them but they nolonger have the blocker on them. i just wanted to try a newer designed loader, that's all man.
i think the c-fang is awesome, but it'd overload my pump with the amount of shoe i fed it;) if you talk to scott, ask if he has any used ss loaders layin around, let me know please.

[IMPATIENT 1]

something like this trav is what i'm lookin for:
http://www.cpperformance.com/detail.aspx?ID=3282
the mid level ss loader, i want to creat lift with the shoe and ride plate , not the loader which i think the xs loader would do.

[hotbo]

he has nothing all the used ones he has are blocked centers:eek: said he could order one or make one:idea: call mpd jack mclure tom and see what hes got for ya.

[IMPATIENT 1]

he has nothing all the used ones he has are blocked centers:eek: said he could order one or make one:idea: call mpd jack mclure tom and see what hes got for ya.
well crap:D i'll run billy's till he needs it back then, he told me i could cut out the blocker but i really don't think its affecting anything, its so close to the mounting pad and has already been trimmed for a tx-19.i'm gonna run by and get it at lunch, pickup a cell battery:mad: (jus tried callin ya, it rang twice and went dead:mad: ) and go get some longer bolts for the shoe/rideplate. i hope i'm not feeding it too much shoe, cause i'm blendin it in tonite:rolleyes: i've had at least a dozen peeps say run it level, another dozen told be to drop it to an 1/8th, so i comprimised and went 1/16th below :D
the shop made loader is too straight, it really has no "bend" to it like modern loaders do. its also wider and too long compared to newer designed loaders.it works but i think the curve loader design will work better.

[Jet Hydro]

If you want to spend a weekend of testing come up here, I have a few loaders to try and maybe a few other things ;)

[IMPATIENT 1]

If you want to spend a weekend of testing come up here, I have a few loaders to try and maybe a few other things ;)
i will take you up on that someday steve. do you think i'll be accused of riding kansas coattails though if i did:D :D :D lol

[Jet Hydro]

ROTFLMAO .....I still think that's just about the funniest thing I have even been told. I`v heard a lot of crap but that one was the funniest :)

[hotbo]

well tom custom made loaders are the shit,you can make them whatever you want more curve less curve,more length ect,you get the picture:idea: i would be scared of production stuff not all boats are the same.:D anyway hope his works for ya.the blocked center ones ive been told hurt your take off something fierce if blocked to much later trav.:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

well tom custom made loaders are the shit,you can make them whatever you want more curve less curve,more length ect,you get the picture:idea: i would be scared of production stuff not all boats are the same.:D anyway hope his works for ya.the blocked center ones ive been told hurt your take off something fierce if blocked to much later trav.:D
i cut the blocker outta the "borrowed:D " loader last nite;) the intake is turnin out nice, i hope its close cause i blended the shoe into the intake already:rolleyes: may go out fri after work and see what the hardware change done.

[IMPATIENT 1]

ROTFLMAO .....I still think that's just about the funniest thing I have even been told. I`v heard a lot of crap but that one was the funniest :)
i thought you'd appreciate that:D :D :D are you taking the hydro to ttr? you'd have a couple of quik boats there to run for fun if ya did. i think a few tx-19's showed up.

[Mr. Crusader 83]

Who here could help me. Hands on set up a shoe and ride plate on a boat that doesnt have one?

[IMPATIENT 1]

Who here could help me. Hands on set up a shoe and ride plate on a boat that doesnt have one?
whatya need to know man? most bolt on kits are straight forward, but there's always some fab and mod work needed to make them work right.

[Mr. Crusader 83]

Well, im looking at a 19 1/2ft crusader with a 468 and a berk. But my buddy said i need to put a ride plate and shoe on it if i want to make it faster. I have not a clue on how to do this properly. So i was wondering if someone near me wouldnt mind helping me set it up. I will provide the pizza and beer.:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

Well, im looking at a 19 1/2ft crusader with a 468 and a berk. But my buddy said i need to put a ride plate and shoe on it if i want to make it faster. I have not a clue on how to do this properly. So i was wondering if someone near me wouldnt mind helping me set it up. I will provide the pizza and beer.:D
what pump? i'd help ya with it but i'm @1500 miles away:D

[Mr. Crusader 83]

what pump? i'd help ya with it but i'm @1500 miles away:D
not sure. split bowl berk

[IMPATIENT 1]

not sure. split bowl berk
12je or 12jg?is it an insert berk pump or does it have a transom adpater?

[Mr. Crusader 83]

12je or 12jg?is it an insert berk pump or does it have a transom adpater?
Here is a pic
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c395/crusader83/IMG_0581.jpg?t=1186677289

[IMPATIENT 1]

looks like a 12jg, nice pump to start with. there's a few places that sell bolt on shoe kits for those, that's the way i'd go if your not trying to get every mph outta the boat. otherwise the intake would have to be pulled from the boat and machined for a adjustable shoe kit. call tom at jetboatperformance.com and see what he's selling the bolt on shoe and ride plate kits for, he'll set you up. roost did a nice job of taking pics when he did his, i'll look it up for ya and link ya too it in a second. his was a 12je install but it'll give ya an idea of what needs to be done.

[IMPATIENT 1]

here ya go, alittle bit different pump but the same basic install will be done on yours too. roostwear did a nice job!
http://***boat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57167&highlight=shoe+ride+plate+kit

[Mr. Crusader 83]

So I can use this kit instead of pulling the engine and intake, and having it machined?

[IMPATIENT 1]

So I can use this kit instead of pulling the engine and intake, and having it machined?
yep, they make a "bolt on" kit:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

check yo pm's crusader!

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

Well, im looking at a 19 1/2ft crusader with a 468 and a berk. But my buddy said i need to put a ride plate and shoe on it if i want to make it faster. I have not a clue on how to do this properly. So i was wondering if someone near me wouldnt mind helping me set it up. I will provide the pizza and beer.:D
Havasu to phoenix is only a 3 hour drive;) :idea::idea:

[Mr. Crusader 83]

Havasu to phoenix is only a 3 hour drive;) :idea::idea:
Thanks Bro. I will hit you up when I get all the parts.