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View Full Version : Really bad night tonight....



DSW
09-01-2007, 09:23 PM
I got pulled over in Parker tonight during the monsoon. The Arizona highway patrol pulled me over cause my safety chain was dragging and sparking a bit. The officer asked for my license and insurance. I then told him I have a Concealed weapons permit, and I have my carry gun in the vehicle, which is required by law. Next thing I know im outside of the truck, hands on the hood. I'm like ok, i understand, cop has to be safe. He makes my wife get out and stand 30 feet away from the vehicle where she gets eaten alive by red ants. I tell him where the gun is located and he searches to find it. He also searches in other spots also, which does not bother me cause I have nothing to hide. He tells me hands on your head. then searches my person. After that is done he runs the plates on my truck, trailer, AZ numbers on my skis, my glocks serial number... Nothing I'm clean. Now to the sobtriety check... I have not had any alcohol today. I tell him this. (Yes it's true) He pulls out the pen and tests my eyes for well over a min. then tells me my eyes look funny. I tell him go ahead and bretholize me here on the spot! he asks me again how much I've had to drink tonight. Nothing. I again tell him to breatholize me to be sure. He doesnt. He then checks some more, and then tells me to return to my truck. He tells me he will put my glock inside the rear under the passenger seat. He then will put the magazine under the driver seat. He then instructs me to drive far away before I reload the gun. So I drive home. I was not rude during the 25 min ordeal, nor was I evasive or aggressive. I did everything he commanded me to do. All this for some chains...:mad: :mad:
Then I get home.... I walk inside and my 2 dogs are sitting by the sliding glass door waiting to come in. I look out side and see this....
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/8183/s4024555sr5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/1230/s4024558er7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/6347/s4024559am1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/4655/s4024560ac4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/1747/s4024561rc3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
My big baby of a pit bull got scared of the lightning and decited he wanted in..:( Other than some cuts and 1 very chipped tooth (from chewing the aluminum frames of my slider door and my bedroom window) he is fine.... now he is passed out on my side of the bed....:mad:

TheCarDudes
09-01-2007, 09:32 PM
That Sux! Sorry to hear. Not a good night at all. Hopefully tomorrow will be better.

Lavey5150
09-01-2007, 09:37 PM
That sux man, I always have my Sig loaded and ready to go, in the event I get pulled over, drop the clip, to the glovebox, and see what he asks, it's a truck, no trunk..........:confused: Anyhow, better to have one loaded and not need to use it than have one UNLOADED and need it............Hope your dog is OK.........

WishIknew
09-01-2007, 09:37 PM
Sorry to hear tomorrow you will get good karma just believe in it:D :D

WishIknew
09-01-2007, 09:39 PM
That sux man, I always have my Sig loaded and ready to go, in the event I get pulled over, drop the clip, to the glovebox, and see what he asks, it's a truck, no trunk..........:confused: Anyhow, better to have one loaded and not need to use it than have one UNLOADED and need it............
Thats why your 5150!!!!!!!!

victorfb
09-01-2007, 09:45 PM
sounds like CHP did his job TOO THE BOOK. you should be happy.
as for the dog eating his way to safety, id say you may want to consider TAKING HIM ALONG with you. i have two dogs that are not commuters and are basically yard dogs, and if i go anywere i make sure to have someone available to take care of both them and the property. i treat my dogs as one of the family and id doubt you would expect a child to react any differantly. the poor dog wanted to be safe. give him access in these situations. by the bloody pics you posted i hope the poor dog has been well taken care of at this point.

Miss Perfect
09-01-2007, 09:59 PM
sounds like CHP did his job TOO THE BOOK. you should be happy.
as for the dog eating his way to safety, id say you may want to consider TAKING HIM ALONG with you. i have two dogs that are not commuters and are basically yard dogs, and if i go anywere i make sure to have someone available to take care of both them and the property. i treat my dogs as one of the family and id doubt you would expect a child to react any differantly. the poor dog wanted to be safe. give him access in these situations. by the bloody pics you posted i hope the poor dog has been well taken care of at this point.
Awww....give the guy a break. It looks like he lives in Havi. It's not like he went away for days on vacation and left the dogs outside. Vic, don't tell me that everytime you leave for a couple of hours that you have someone there to watch your dogs.
DSW, sorry about your bad day but I am glad it all turned out ok. I hope your puppy isn't too torn up.

DSW
09-01-2007, 10:00 PM
sounds like CHP did his job TOO THE BOOK. you should be happy.
as for the dog eating his way to safety, id say you may want to consider TAKING HIM ALONG with you. i have two dogs that are not commuters and are basically yard dogs, and if i go anywere i make sure to have someone available to take care of both them and the property. i treat my dogs as one of the family and id doubt you would expect a child to react any differantly. the poor dog wanted to be safe. give him access in these situations. by the bloody pics you posted i hope the poor dog has been well taken care of at this point.
He's doing much better. We patched him up good. As for leaving him alone, it was only for 2 hours! And he had our other dog as company. I'd love to take him along with me places. He just can be a handful at times. I shy away from bringing him out in public cause people get afraid when they see a 100+ pound pit around. He would never hurt anybody. But he would eat a small dog in a second. :jawdrop: He's one of the family for sure!
On another note, does anybody know any good window peeps here in Havasu?

MADDOG355
09-02-2007, 04:28 AM
sounds like CHP did his job TOO THE BOOK. you should be happy.
They have a screwed up book there. I have been a permit holder for around 10 years and been pulled over several times and only once has the officer even touched my weapon. In that case he was a rookie and the gun was on my person, He removed it from the holster and placed it on the trunk of the car. He never unloaded it and he was not concerned with the serial number of the gun.
Looks like he just wanted to give you grief for being a gun owner.

Throttle
09-02-2007, 12:30 PM
what an ordeal, have a better day today!

YeLLowBoaT
09-02-2007, 12:42 PM
They have a screwed up book there. I have been a permit holder for around 10 years and been pulled over several times and only once has the officer even touched my weapon. In that case he was a rookie and the gun was on my person, He removed it from the holster and placed it on the trunk of the car. He never unloaded it and he was not concerned with the serial number of the gun.
Looks like he just wanted to give you grief for being a gun owner.
thats not by the book, something else had to be going on for then to give then the once over like that.
The CCW training i've had is leave you hands on the wheel, tell them right away "loaded weapon on my person/in car" "I have my CCW, what do you want me to do?"
When I was pulled over for no plates( of which I did not know they were gone. its not something you check to see if they were stolen.) I did exactly that, i was told to get out, remove the weapon, make it safe , leave it on top of the car and get my permit out( and the rest of the basics) after about 10 mins of him checking my vin and registration. He told me thank you for letting him know right away about the weapon and sent me on my way.
GD I wish Sac county would issue CCWs

ColeTR2
09-02-2007, 01:01 PM
First sorry about your puppy.. Last night I drove from the casino to my house four miles.. and saw three different sets of blue lights. You would have to be insane to even have one beer and drive.. When I drive at night here in parker i know i will get pulled over... more then 50 percent chance. I have been stopped three times in the last year. We have four different law enforcement agency in this little town. Crit PD, Parker PD, La Paz County sheriff, and Arizona highway patrol. I like it.. stop me... keep my town safe. If you have nothing to hide you will be on your way in no time..

repo man
09-02-2007, 01:10 PM
He's doing much better. We patched him up good. As for leaving him alone, it was only for 2 hours! And he had our other dog as company. I'd love to take him along with me places. He just can be a handful at times. I shy away from bringing him out in public cause people get afraid when they see a 100+ pound pit around. He would never hurt anybody. But he would eat a small dog in a second. :jawdrop: He's one of the family for sure!
On another note, does anybody know any good window peeps here in Havasu?
http://emtgel.com/index.php
this stuff works!!!

Jbb
09-02-2007, 01:17 PM
If you have nothing to hide you will be on your way in no time..
:jawdrop:

DSW
09-02-2007, 01:31 PM
I understand the LEO needs to be safe, but does he have to treat me like a criminal in the process? Does he have the right to search my truck without my consent for the weapon, even after I tell him where it is? I still believe he wanted to get me for somthing. I had broken no laws at all. I was driving UNDER the speed limit due to the monsoon, and he followed me for 7 miles before hitting his lights. If my chain was creating sparks, why not stop me earlier? All I know is nothing seemed right about this stop. He had back-up arrive as I was leaving. :confused:

victorfb
09-02-2007, 02:32 PM
sorry for being harsh with my first post. i should have tried to understand the entire situation better, especially about the dog. im glad to hear he is doing well. i understand now it was only a short time and freak type thing. obviously it happens. yes i do leave my daogs unattended for short periods of time but i do allow them to have acces into the house at all times aswell. not everyone can do that, i understand.
as for the way the officer conducted his stop, im still going to have to lean toward the officers judgement here. imagine if he just let everyone go without hassle just because you show him a card that permits a firearm. if that was the case then forged cards would be more common than forged drivers licenses. i believe the officer was just trying to be as cautious as possible. im sure most officers get a bit nervous on big holiday weekends and tend to be overly cautious, but can you blame them. it only takes one time letting your guard down when a criminal can take advantage of the situation and turn it into something deadly. i believe if you feel you need to have a loaded firearm with you at all times, you should also understand the responsability and understand the fear officers have to deal with it. even someone with a legal right to carry a concelled weapon can have that one moment in life when he/she just snaps, and loses all better judgement.

westair
09-02-2007, 02:42 PM
I understand the LEO needs to be safe, but does he have to treat me like a criminal in the process? Does he have the right to search my truck without my consent for the weapon, even after I tell him where it is? I still believe he wanted to get me for somthing. I had broken no laws at all. I was driving UNDER the speed limit due to the monsoon, and he followed me for 7 miles before hitting his lights. If my chain was creating sparks, why not stop me earlier? All I know is nothing seemed right about this stop. He had back-up arrive as I was leaving. :confused:
File a complaint with his department, they really do investigate those and take it
seriously ..... and these go on his record.

scooooter7
09-02-2007, 02:54 PM
Not worth a complaint IMO. He does deserve a "dope slap" though.

Jbb
09-02-2007, 03:00 PM
sorry for being harsh with my first post. i should have tried to understand the entire situation better, especially about the dog. im glad to hear he is doing well. i understand now it was only a short time and freak type thing. obviously it happens. yes i do leave my daogs unattended for short periods of time but i do allow them to have acces into the house at all times aswell. not everyone can do that, i understand.
as for the way the officer conducted his stop, im still going to have to lean toward the officers judgement here. imagine if he just let everyone go without hassle just because you show him a card that permits a firearm. if that was the case then forged cards would be more common than forged drivers licenses. i believe the officer was just trying to be as cautious as possible. im sure most officers get a bit nervous on big holiday weekends and tend to be overly cautious, but can you blame them. it only takes one time letting your guard down when a criminal can take advantage of the situation and turn it into something deadly. i believe if you feel you need to have a loaded firearm with you at all times, you should also understand the responsability and understand the fear officers have to deal with it. even someone with a legal right to carry a concelled weapon can have that one moment in life when he/she just snaps, and loses all better judgement.
You are kidding with this reply ....right?...:D
Sounds like Johnny Law ...left his professional standards at the curb that day....

2Driver
09-02-2007, 03:39 PM
You are kidding with this reply ....right?...:D
Sounds like Johnny Law ...left his professional standards at the curb that day....
Exactly, That cop was a POS from day one based on your story. Where does he get off given you the treatment. Fock if I ever tell a LE that I have a CCW. I dont think you are required to are you?

Boatcop
09-02-2007, 03:51 PM
Exactly, That cop was a POS from day one based on your story. Where does he get off given you the treatment. Fock if I ever tell a LE that I have a CCW. I dont think you are required to are you?
See post 27. You don't have to volunteer the card, but must present it on request.
Your CCW permit comes up when they run you for DL and Wants/Warrants, so they'll find out about it anyway. Best to just tell them, and not give them any surprises.
Although I wasn't there, it sounds like the DPS Officer may have gone a little too far.

MADDOG355
09-02-2007, 04:07 PM
Exactly, That cop was a POS from day one based on your story. Where does he get off given you the treatment. Fock if I ever tell a LE that I have a CCW. I dont think you are required to are you?
That probly varies alot state to state. I have just had mine under the seat or in the console and actually forgot about it during a stop, So far that has just resulted in the officer asking if I had my firearm and me kinda stupidly saying Oh Yea I forgot and telling him where it is.
The incident I posted where the officer removed it from my holster, When he approched the car I had both hands out the window with my permit in one and license in the other. That officer was very grateful for my honestly and even cut me a BIG (15mph) break on my ticket. I was just doing it becouse I was scared to death. A friend of mine had just been drawn on a week or so before that becouse they saw his pistol before he was able to say he had a permit.
From my experince most officers (here atleast) don't have a problem with it but, There was one incident where a officer was giving me a bunch of crap about a knife I had in my pocket Saying it was a concieled weapon :confused: :confused: Yea I have a 45 but I am going to stab someone. :rolleyes: .

Mrs. 20
09-02-2007, 05:07 PM
Oh my! I hope your day goes better tomorrow!:(

Little Wood Boat
09-02-2007, 05:23 PM
BOATCOP....I'm sure you're wrong on....In AZ you're required to present your CCW permit (if you have one) along with Driver's License, Registration and Insurance, if you're stopped by Police.
You may want to check with the ATTY. GEN./ DPS and refine your post.
Persons MUST carry permit when carry is concealed, but have NO DUTY to notify..only MUST present when LE requests to see it (again, only while carrying concealed). LWB

Boatcop
09-02-2007, 06:04 PM
BOATCOP....I'm sure you're wrong on....In AZ you're required to present your CCW permit (if you have one) along with Driver's License, Registration and Insurance, if you're stopped by Police.
You may want to check with the ATTY. GEN./ DPS and refine your post.
Persons MUST carry permit when carry is concealed, but have NO DUTY to notify..only MUST present when LE requests to see it (again, only while carrying concealed). LWB
You seem to be right here. I had just glanced at the back of mine where it read it must be presented along with a photo ID.
But it must be presented on request of Law enforcement.

Baja Big Dog
09-02-2007, 07:13 PM
I believe in the state of California, you do not give up your right to search and siezure when you get a CWP, and when pullled over the cop DOES know you have the CWP when he runs your licence. It is manditory you inform the cop IF you are carrying.
Either way the cavity search is out of line regardless of what state you are in...

ColeTR2
09-02-2007, 07:17 PM
If you have a CCW permit in AZ can you use it across state lines?

YeLLowBoaT
09-02-2007, 07:28 PM
If you have a CCW permit in AZ can you use it across state lines?
its up to the state... CA= NO
I know Utahs is good in about 30 states.
Also in CA you are requried to surrender( temp) your fire armor to the leo when they ask for it... not doing so gets you in deep shit and you will lose your CCW forever. They normally just check serail numbers then hand it back.( unless your in a no firearms zone then your not going to have a good day)

SCR INC
09-02-2007, 07:57 PM
You seem to be right here. I had just glanced at the back of mine where it read it must be presented along with a photo ID.
But it must be presented on request of Law enforcement.
BC... If you a res from AZ can you have a loaded weapon as long as its exposed in your car....

roscoe p coltraine
09-02-2007, 09:45 PM
BC... If you a res from AZ can you have a loaded weapon as long as its exposed in your car....
If you shoot a gun like you drive a boat you sure as hell aint going to hit something even if at point blank range.
If you were shootin shit you wouldnt even get a whif

Racey
09-02-2007, 11:58 PM
Yeah I'd say that's a little bit out of line for him to search your whole truck, 'it doesn't matter if you have nothing to hide' is about as anti-Liberty as it gets. but there ain't much you can do when he has the badge and you pulled over, arguing, however in the right you are, will only lead to more trouble for you, as sad as that is in a country founded on freedom it's the truth. Resistance is Futile.....
Here's a great paper written on the 'Nothing to Hide' mentality from the George Washington University Law School.

mark49
09-03-2007, 12:48 AM
If all the CHP really just stopped you for was a dragging chain they were really out of line.
What kind of boat do you own, a jet??? Is the your boat black and white and named “Cops can suck this”
I’ve been CCW in California for 25 years, doing evictions, in the IE check in with the local POP stations, pulled over on occasions, and not once have I had even a small problem with law enforcement. In addition to this I have pulled my weapon 4 times during my 25 years, the last time with a San Bernardino police officer.
My point is most LEO’s are pro CCW, why, you have passed state and local background checks, proficient shooting skills, etc. We are no threat to LEO’s. I would like to think from a LEO’S standpoint if SHTF one of us could possibility balance the situation.
With all this said I’m very pro police, pro military and firm believer of you/our rights. If what happened is 100% correct I would report it to his supervisor, I would not like to have my wife and or children sitting on a red ant pile made a fool of just because you’re an lawfully owner of weapons and a CCW holder…
Not reporting this matter will just make this slap happy cop feel tougher on his next lawful victim.
In closing some info for all you CCW holders, if anyone has a need to know your current states laws regarding your permit I would be happy to provide the states information.
With that said, I’m not a lawyer or LEO just a Havasu boater that prides himself of legalities of firearms and civilian use of force.
A chain dragging and an LEO empties out you car and semi-detains you.. Something’s not right with this picture???
I thank Alan for chiming in on this subject…
Signed
Mark the Havasu lake lover and gun collector
#1 Neither California or Arizona require you provide your CCW upon a traffic stop... Only you can make that judgement call depending on the Circumstances. Your CCW is not linked to your drivers license, although that may be a good thing if the local states can work with the DMVs. I doubt it.
Some links...
PERMIT HOLDER REQUIREMENTS
• A qualified person must have the permit in possession when carrying a concealed weapon
• The permit must be presented to any law enforcement officer upon request, along with a driver’s license, military ID, state ID card or passport
• A law enforcement officer may temporarily take possession of a firearm during traffic stops or other official contacts with the public
Where can I file a complaint against a police officer who I believe is guilty of misconduct?
Each police department has a Professional Standards Bureau. Listed below are telephone numbers for various departments in Arizona:
Chandler 480.782.4400
Gilbert 480.503.6500
Glendale 623.930.3000
Kingman 928.753.2191
Mesa 480.644.2211
Oro Valley 520.229.4900
Phoenix 602.262.7626
Scottsdale 480.312.5000
Tempe 480.966.6211
Tucson 520.791.4444
Must I Inform Police of My Weapon?
Strictly as a matter of law, no, you are not required to disclose the fact that you are armed to anyone, even police, unless they directly ask you. However, common sense may dictate otherwise, and most gun enthusiasts would recommend you alert the officer to your weapon immediately, to prevent any dangerous misunderstandings.

Baja Big Dog
09-03-2007, 08:58 AM
If all the CHP really just stopped you for was a dragging chain they were really out of line.
What kind of boat do you own, a jet??? Is the your boat black and white and named “Cops can suck this”
I’ve been CCW in California for 25 years, doing evictions, in the IE check in with the local POP stations, pulled over on occasions, and not once have I had even a small problem with law enforcement. In addition to this I have pulled my weapon 4 times during my 25 years, the last time with a San Bernardino police officer.
My point is most LEO’s are pro CCW, why, you have passed state and local background checks, proficient shooting skills, etc. We are no threat to LEO’s. I would like to think from a LEO’S standpoint if SHTF one of us could possibility balance the situation.
With all this said I’m very pro police, pro military and firm believer of you/our rights. If what happened is 100% correct I would report it to his supervisor, I would not like to have my wife and or children sitting on a red ant pile made a fool of just because you’re an lawfully owner of weapons and a CCW holder…
Not reporting this matter will just make this slap happy cop feel tougher on his next lawful victim.
In closing some info for all you CCW holders, if anyone has a need to know your current states laws regarding your permit I would be happy to provide the states information.
With that said, I’m not a lawyer or LEO just a Havasu boater that prides himself of legalities of firearms and civilian use of force.
A chain dragging and an LEO empties out you car and semi-detains you.. Something’s not right with this picture???
I thank Alan for chiming in on this subject…
Signed
Mark the Havasu lake lover and gun collector
#1 Neither California or Arizona require you provide your CCW upon a traffic stop... Only you can make that judgement call depending on the Circumstances. Your CCW is not linked to your drivers license, although that may be a good thing if the local states can work with the DMVs. I doubt it.
Some links...
PERMIT HOLDER REQUIREMENTS
• A qualified person must have the permit in possession when carrying a concealed weapon
• The permit must be presented to any law enforcement officer upon request, along with a driver’s license, military ID, state ID card or passport
• A law enforcement officer may temporarily take possession of a firearm during traffic stops or other official contacts with the public
Where can I file a complaint against a police officer who I believe is guilty of misconduct?
Each police department has a Professional Standards Bureau. Listed below are telephone numbers for various departments in Arizona:
Chandler 480.782.4400
Gilbert 480.503.6500
Glendale 623.930.3000
Kingman 928.753.2191
Mesa 480.644.2211
Oro Valley 520.229.4900
Phoenix 602.262.7626
Scottsdale 480.312.5000
Tempe 480.966.6211
Tucson 520.791.4444
Must I Inform Police of My Weapon?
Strictly as a matter of law, no, you are not required to disclose the fact that you are armed to anyone, even police, unless they directly ask you. However, common sense may dictate otherwise, and most gun enthusiasts would recommend you alert the officer to your weapon immediately, to prevent any dangerous misunderstandings.
Also being a gun owner and lover, I normally have a gun on me, not on my person, but in the car, in the last 35 years I have been pulled over on numerous occasions, and a the advise of many of my LEO buddies, I inform the officer that I have a gun and I tell them exactly where its at, only had one problem with one cop that wrote me for loaded weapon, he was a dick, gun was in the trunk, didn't matter, oh well, broke the law and was guilty, went to he judge, told him my story, he cut the fine in half, and suggested I continue my policy of telling the cop you have a gun!!! But also told me not a good idea to keep it loaded...at that point it is as usefull as a rock!!

full throttle
09-03-2007, 10:05 AM
That was a good post Mark49! I too have had a CCW for a long time, and had a "pain in the ass" experience between Parker & Quartzsite. My little bro & I were comming back from Havasu in my wifes range rover about 6-7 years ago, not speeding or drinking, and got pulled over by a rookie DPS. When approached my window, with both hands on the wheel, I informed him I had a loaded weapon next to my seat, and that I had a CCW...... Well, big mistake. He backed up, drew his weapon, and had us get out. Well, it's 115 out, i'm tired, and pissed. I also did not want to get shot by this trigger happy, rookie. Anyhow, I was as polite as I could stand, and let him do his thing for 20 minutes or so. He ended up giving me my weapon back... firearm, clip, and rounds all seperate. After all the BS, he finally answered my question of "why did I get pulled over". His response was that he could not read the little license plate tab sticker numbers cause the license plate frame was partially covering them. Yea right! You cant read them from 10' away in plain sight. Anyhow I called and complained about the ordeal. Who knows what happened. End result.... I dont say, if they dont ask!!!
What does it take to get a CCW in CA? I want one there too!

River Runin
09-03-2007, 10:42 AM
Sounds like a case of!!--and been there!--A Reserve, power trippin, need to find and make a name for thereself!.....Did I say, Power Trippin Cop!-----lol, or was it one of the OLD, GODS! :D

BRSTQUEST
09-03-2007, 11:36 AM
Before most of you post on this site do you ever give any consideration to what you are going to type. If I had to bet I would say "no." All the tough guys on here with "this cop is trying to make a name for himself", and "he must be a rookie", or my favorite "he can't search my car, I know my rights" you guys are funny.
First, the US Supreme Court has ruled traffic stops are inherantly dangerous and by their ruling allows officers to remove occupants from the vehicle for the safety of the officer and the occupants. If you remember there was a little case out of Riverside, Ca with a person named Latasha Harlines (SP). She was the young lady who was asleep with a gun on her lap. As the officers tried to wake her she reached towards the gun. Fearing for their safety the officers shot and killed her. In the end four lives were ruined, hers and three officers.
Second,when a person tells you they have a gun on a traffic stop, you should handle the situation differently people should get pulled out from the car, searched, and the vehicle should get searched. It may come as a suprise to some but people sometimes don't tell the truth to cops. Searching the car for the weapon is well within the scope of case law as it relates to vehicle searches. Courts have ruled vehicles are very transient and has more liberial view of vehicle searches. CWP allow you to carry specific weapons not any weapon. So if you are permitted for a .25 Berreta you better not carry a .40 Sig or you could go to jail, but this specificity allows officers to search compartments which might be able to conceal unlawful weapons.
Third, for the people who don't like it when officers do their job to the fullest and it impacts their day dont call us when its hot, cold, your home alone, you kicked the wife and dog, you hear a noise, someone stole your rhino, the pipes on your neighbors bike is to loud or any of the other reasons you call because it takes away from my time trying to make a name for myself.

Jbb
09-03-2007, 11:40 AM
Before most of you post on this site do you ever give any consideration to what you are going to type. If I had to bet I would say "no." All the tough guys on here with "this cop is trying to make a name for himself", and "he must be a rookie", or my favorite "he can't search my car, I know my rights" you guys are funny.
First, the US Supreme Court has ruled traffic stops are inherantly dangerous and by their ruling allows officers to remove occupants from the vehicle for the safety of the officer and the occupants. If you remember there was a little case out of Riverside, Ca with a person named Latasha Harlines (SP). She was the young lady who was asleep with a gun on her lap. As the officers tried to wake her she reached towards the gun. Fearing for their safety the officers shot and killed her. In the end four lives were ruined, hers and three officers.
Second,when a person tells you they have a gun on a traffic stop, you should handle the situation differently people should get pulled out from the car, searched, and the vehicle should get searched. It may come as a suprise to some but people sometimes don't tell the truth to cops. Searching the car for the weapon is well within the scope of case law as it relates to vehicle searches. Courts have ruled vehicles are very transient and has more liberial view of vehicle searches. CWP allow you to carry specific weapons not any weapon. So if you are permitted for a .25 Berreta you better not carry a .40 Sig or you could go to jail, but this specificity allows officers to search compartments which might be able to conceal unlawful weapons.
Third, for the people who don't like it when officers do their job to the fullest and it impacts their day dont call us when its hot, cold, your home alone, you kicked the wife and dog, you hear a noise, someone stole your rhino, the pipes on your neighbors bike is to loud or any of the other reasons you call because it takes away from my time trying to make a name for myself.
lol....funny shit right there......I think you should give yourself a medal....:p

DSW
09-03-2007, 12:19 PM
CWP allow you to carry specific weapons not any weapon. So if you are permitted for a .25 Berreta you better not carry a .40 Sig or you could go to jail, but this specificity allows officers to search compartments which might be able to conceal unlawful weapons.
Just to clarify this took place in Arizona. We can conceal ANY legal firearm with a CCW. Usually I carry my glock, but if I feel frisky I carry my S&W 460 snubby, if I want to conceal an AK-47 i can legally. Secondly ALOT of people here have CCW's, unlike California. A leo here has a pretty good chance of pulling over a CCW carrier here EVERY day, and most likely do. Arizona is still an OPEN carry state. If I was walking down the street with it not concealed would he have acted diffrently?

Tom Brown
09-03-2007, 12:26 PM
Before most of you post on this site do you ever give any consideration to what you are going to type. If I had to bet I would say "no."
It varies.
It may come as a suprise to some but people sometimes don't tell the truth to cops.
Are you suggesting civilians are lying and homicidal?
I'll tell you what, Festus. There are cops with attitudes, just as there are cops without.
I've been pulled over once in the last 20 years. It was about 10 years ago. Our highway speed limits here are 100 kph. I generally drive 105. There is a small gully on the way to the lake that has a 90 kph limit. I don't know why. It's in the middle of nowhere but this reduced speed section exists and went through there at 105 kph, the way I always do.
I was taking an electrician buddy to the lake to help us wire the, then new, shop. We were pulled over, the LEO approached the window with his wind pipe blazing and his partner a few steps back, gun drawn. "DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT THE FUKKING SPEED LIMIT IS HERE?" My buddy gave me a "this is not going to go well for you look" as I answered, "yes".
He said, "Well, what is it?" I told him the speed limit was 100 kph where he was standing but that I just passed a short segment with a 90 kph and did so at 105 kph.
He didn't pull me from the vehicle. He looked around the car really well, then ripped my license and registration out of my hand in a huff, and then went back to his car.
My buddy and I didn't say anything. We both knew I was screwed. I hadn't had a ticket in over a decade so it wasn't a big deal.
Ten minutes later, the LEO came back, no partner, no gun, and gave me back my registration along with a warning ticket. He was now calm and rational, asked me to slow down and sent me on my way.
.... so here's the deal. A cop comes at me with his throat and attitude blazing and I have to suck it up. In the grand scheme, it's not a big deal.
Yeah... I know... the cop probably pulled over a long succession of lying assholes who live in the area but pretend to not be aware of the 90 kph zone and maybe the last car caused some problems. I do have some insight into LEO's work, through the eyes of a couple of LEO friends of mine.
If I have a huge argument with my wife, hop in the car, screech away from the house, get pulled over, and then throw some attitude in the face of the cop, you know how it's going to go. They won't stand for that shit. LEOs shouldn't have to put up with that. The thing is, neither should the public have to deal with a bunch of irate attitude.
Hey, I know that most police are good people. You guys don't interact with a random selection of society. You tend to interact with people who are drunk or somehow out of control. I've backed LEO professionalism here in the past because we desperately need law and order.
We don't know what went on at this stop and it would be a good guess that if we could hear from the LEO involved, his story would be quite different. Fair enough.
DSW is a fellow forum member so, as far as I'm concerned, let him bitch. He just wanted to get it off his chest. There's no need to turn this into an us versus them argument. If you would think before posting, I'm sure you would see that.
Doncha see?

NoWorries
09-03-2007, 12:42 PM
I have to agree with you he was looking for something to nail you with. The chains were nothing more then a little probable cause to get you on the side of the road. I understand officer safety and why he took you out of the car and did what he did there. The funny thing is the "eye" test is the most reliable test and most recognized test by NHTSA, so once he was done with that no reason to continue messing with you. I do not like nor agree with over achievers with a badge. Do your job, be safe, keep us safe, don't push the issue just because you can. The reason he didn't give you a PBT (portable breath test) is because the results of them are not admissible in court. The judge can ask the office if he administered one and if so then did the results so and indication of alcohol. The answer can only be yes or no. The funny thing is most officers think once you tell them where the firearm is they can just start diggin in the car, and that as they say on TV leads to fruits of the poisonous tree. Sorry to hear you had to deal with a badge heavy cop nobody likes um and they give the rest of the officers out there a bad name. Take care of your dog and have a better labor day.:D

Jbb
09-03-2007, 12:45 PM
It varies.
Are you suggesting civilians are lying and homicidal?
I'll tell you what, Festus. There are cops with attitudes, just as there are cops without.
I've been pulled over once in the last 20 years. It was about 10 years ago. Our highway speed limits here 100 kph. I generally drive 105. There is a small gully on the way to the lake that has a 90 kph limit. I don't know why. It's in the middle of nowhere but this reduced speed section exists and went through there at 105 kph, the way I always do.
I was taking an electrician buddy to the lake to help us wire the, then new, shop. We were pulled over, the LEO approached the window with his wind pipe blazing and his partner a few steps back, gun drawn. "DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT THE FUKKING SPEED LIMIT IS HERE?" My buddy gave me a "this is not going to go well for you look" as I answered, "yes".
He said, "Well, what is it?" I told him the speed limit was 100 kph where he was standing but that I just passed a short segment with a 90 kph and did so at 105 kph.
He didn't pull me from the vehicle. He looked around the car really well, then ripped my license and registration out of my hand in a huff, and then went back to his car.
My buddy and I didn't say anything. We both knew I was screwed. I hadn't had a ticket in over a decade so it wasn't a big deal.
Ten minutes later, the LEO came back, no partner, no gun, and gave me back my registration along with a warning ticket. He was now calm and rational, asked me to slow down and sent me on my way.
.... so here's the deal. A cop comes at me with his throat and attitude blazing and I have to suck it up. In the grand scheme, it's not a big deal.
Yeah... I know... the cop probably pulled over a long succession of lying assholes who live in the area but pretend to not be aware of the 90 kph zone and maybe the last car caused some problems. I do have some insight into LEO's work, through the eyes of a couple of LEO friends of mine.
If I have a huge argument with my wife, hop in the car, screech away from the house, get pulled over, and then throw some attitude in the face of the cop, you know how it's going to go. They won't stand for that shit. LEOs shouldn't have to put up with that. The thing is, neither should the public have to deal with a bunch of irate attitude.
Hey, I know that most police are good people. You guys don't interact with a random selection of society. You tend to interact with people who are drunk or somehow out of control. I've backed LEO professionalism here in the past because we desperately need law and order.
We don't know what went on at this stop and it would be a good guess that if we could here from the LEO involved, his story would be quite different. Fair enough.
DSW is a fellow forum member so, as far as I'm concerned, let him bitch. He just wanted to get it off his chest. There's no need to turn this into an us versus them argument. If you would think before posting, I'm sure you would see that.
Doncha see?
You are speaking, of course, of officers Cocknuckles and Dickluck...?
:D

River Runin
09-03-2007, 03:35 PM
Before most of you post on this site do you ever give any consideration to what you are going to type. If I had to bet I would say "no." All the tough guys on here with "this cop is trying to make a name for himself", and "he must be a rookie", or my favorite "he can't search my car, I know my rights" you guys are funny.
First, the US Supreme Court has ruled traffic stops are inherantly dangerous and by their ruling allows officers to remove occupants from the vehicle for the safety of the officer and the occupants. If you remember there was a little case out of Riverside, Ca with a person named Latasha Harlines (SP). She was the young lady who was asleep with a gun on her lap. As the officers tried to wake her she reached towards the gun. Fearing for their safety the officers shot and killed her. In the end four lives were ruined, hers and three officers.
Second,when a person tells you they have a gun on a traffic stop, you should handle the situation differently people should get pulled out from the car, searched, and the vehicle should get searched. It may come as a suprise to some but people sometimes don't tell the truth to cops. Searching the car for the weapon is well within the scope of case law as it relates to vehicle searches. Courts have ruled vehicles are very transient and has more liberial view of vehicle searches. CWP allow you to carry specific weapons not any weapon. So if you are permitted for a .25 Berreta you better not carry a .40 Sig or you could go to jail, but this specificity allows officers to search compartments which might be able to conceal unlawful weapons.
Third, for the people who don't like it when officers do their job to the fullest and it impacts their day dont call us when its hot, cold, your home alone, you kicked the wife and dog, you hear a noise, someone stole your rhino, the pipes on your neighbors bike is to loud or any of the other reasons you call because it takes away from my time trying to make a name for myself.
ROFL!! OK, Power Trippin Trooper!! :D :D
So the driver is stopped "Arizona highway patrol pulled me over cause my safety chain was dragging and sparking a bit."
So,You lay your above BS out...Just to Justify a Search?, hopefully find something?, And get that thing to the Auction!!$$$-----Sure didn't sound like a SAFETY CHAIN STOP!!-----Just a Traffic SEARCH....ing for, _________ well Hell, You fill in the Blank!!!!!! :D
And since LE "KNOWS" I have a CCW----The class I took, said you Do Not have to present IT!!...Unless asked...stopped twice, never told, And they Never Asked!

River Rat 005
09-03-2007, 04:38 PM
What I want to know...Did you fix the dragging chain before you left?:D

DSW
09-03-2007, 04:47 PM
What I want to know...Did you fix the dragging chain before you left?:D
Actually no. I drove a bit down the road and pulled over and fixed them, as per instructions of the officer.
I'm not really angry, just suprised. Back when I lived in California every time I got pulled over it was a hassle. I just thought it would be diffrent here. I guess I was wrong. :eek:

RiverRatMike
09-03-2007, 07:10 PM
Actually no. I drove a bit down the road and pulled over and fixed them, as per instructions of the officer.
I'm not really angry, just suprised. Back when I lived in California every time I got pulled over it was a hassle. I just thought it would be diffrent here. I guess I was wrong. :eek:
Man that sucks. I was up on the hill behind our river house taking lightning photos and noticed someone pulled over north bound just at the top of that hill about 2 miles passed the casino.

mark49
09-03-2007, 08:30 PM
Actually no. I drove a bit down the road and pulled over and fixed them, as per instructions of the officer.
I'm not really angry, just suprised. Back when I lived in California every time I got pulled over it was a hassle. I just thought it would be diffrent here. I guess I was wrong. :eek:
Based on your experience with that LEO are cops appear better in Southern Calif then Arizona, at least the Highway patrol.
I’ve been San Bernardino County CCW since the 80s, and i find that most maybe 90% of police in the Inland Empire support CCW holders. Matter of fact a buddy of mine was pulled over going 80 MPH in a 55 and was guilty as hell, after the fog cleared and CCW presented he was let go without a citation, my opinion the CCW was a helpful tool in this case?
SBCSD Sheriff Penrod is very pro civilian rights for protection, you might say that say that San Bernardino County is a right to carry county, and he expresses this to his deputies.
Just for the record this LEO had the right to inspect your weapon, remove it with your hopefully with your cooperation. As for the inspection of your vehicle, unless something is missing from your post, the officer did not appear to have probable cause for any other action, I can’t see in your post where you gave this officer any other reason to proceed as he did as you had not given this officer any reason to semi-detain you as you lawfully complied.
For this officer to search your car, required your passengers to sit on the curb, etc had to be based on something other then your legal weapon and Az CCW permit. His actions would have to fall into another category. Having a CCW in California or Arizona doe’s not give any law enforcement officer to act unlawfully.
Assuming you had both hands on the steering wheel, you complied, you were polite, respectfully you exited the vehicle and the weapon was removed appropriately.
Now this is me speaking, I would have not complied with the search other then my person (Knowing I had never once broken a law other then traffic infractions in my life) I would have politely asked the officer why he felt the need to remove myself and family from my car. Officer am I being arrested or detained??? Can I have your supervisor stop by I would like to ask him if this is standard procedure.
Just one other note: Once run up on the LEO’s computer you’re just a statistic on the screen, when your license showed you were Mr. Honest citizen what the hell went wrong?
Like I said something is missing here, you sure the backseat of your car wasn’t full of empty Budweiser cans, you had a bong on the dashboard? Your breath smelled like old beef Jerky and scotch?
I recommend all who have the need to carry get a CCW in your state, its suppose to help avoid situations like this, rather then inflate them.
For the other person that asked about Calif CCW permit is you must be a resident of San Bernardino County, or one of the other CCW friendly Calif Counties, most other requirements are similar to CCW Arizona’s
My 2 cents
Mark