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Woodster
02-24-2006, 04:26 PM
What a bummer..looks like his title hopes are going down the drain. Reed is prob laughing all the way to the bank
PENALTY ISSUED FOR ILLEGAL FUEL AT SAN DIEGO SUPERCROSS
PICKERINGTON, Ohio (February 24, 2006) – AMA Pro Racing has announced that Ricky Carmichael has been penalized 25 points for using illegal fuel at round six of the Amp’d Mobile AMA Supercross Series at Qualcomm Stadium in San Diego, Calif., on February 11.
Fuel samples from eight motorcycles were collected at the San Diego round and the sample from the motorcycle of Ricky Carmichael was found to be in non-compliance. Fuel from the motorcycles of Mike Alessi, Grant Langston, Jeremy McGrath, Nate Ramsey, Chad Reed, Andrew Short and James Stewart was found to be in compliance.
As is required by the AMA Supercross/Motocross rulebook, the samples were sent to a certified testing lab which confirmed the results of the testing.
AMA Pro Racing has required the use of unleaded fuel in the AMA Supercross Series and the AMA Motocross Championship since the 2004 racing season.

Mrs. casean
02-24-2006, 04:28 PM
No way! Why would he do that! He just ruined him self! Now I just have to hope Reed and Bubba mess up in every race :) What a bummer!

Mrs.Racer277
02-24-2006, 04:29 PM
I love it. :) Neener Neener. :p :p :p :p

Mrs.Racer277
02-24-2006, 04:30 PM
No way! Why would he do that! He just ruined him self! Now I just have to hope Reed and Bubba mess up in every race :) What a bummer!
Hey now!!!! :p :rolleyes: :)

Mrs. casean
02-24-2006, 04:30 PM
I love it. :) Neener Neener. :p :p :p :p
(see the hand :D ) :rolleyes: :cry: Would he have even knew this fuel was in his bike or would the mechanic just put it in and then there is a chance he didn't know?

Woodster
02-24-2006, 04:35 PM
(see the hand :D ) :rolleyes: :cry: Would he have even knew this fuel was in his bike or would the mechanic just put it in and then there is a chance he didn't know?
They both prob had no idea it was illegal..The same thing has happened to Stewart and Reed. The fuel they run is already on the edge for being legal. I bet RC is one pissed of guy right now!

Mrs.Racer277
02-24-2006, 04:36 PM
(see the hand :D ) :rolleyes: :cry: Would he have even knew this fuel was in his bike or would the mechanic just put it in and then there is a chance he didn't know?
Does not matter.Neener Neener :p :p :p HEHEHEHE

Racer277
02-24-2006, 04:40 PM
Last year, didn't they track it down to lead in the welds on the gas cans?
This is not something the rider is involved with.
I'm sure he's pissed.
Hope the awesome season keeps up!

Mrs. casean
02-24-2006, 04:40 PM
They both prob had no idea it was illegal..The same thing has happened to Stewart and Reed. The fuel they run is already on the edge for being legal. I bet RC is one pissed of guy right now!
I didn't know the other two are on the edge... well they are probably happy RC got caught :rolleyes: Too bad :(

Mrs. casean
02-24-2006, 04:41 PM
Last year, didn't they track it down to lead in the welds on the gas cans?
This is not something the rider is involved with.
I'm sure he's pissed.
Hope the awesome season keeps up!
me too! I'm bummed. Now Ricky just has to step up even more to make up for those 25 pts lost!

RVRGIRL
02-24-2006, 05:06 PM
GO REED GO!! Hopefully NOW he "might" win the championship. Even though Bubba will probably win.. :cry:

cola
02-24-2006, 05:11 PM
I didn't know Chad Knaus worked for Ricky too. :)
Late, Mike

Woodster
02-24-2006, 09:40 PM
i read that today too !! but believe you me, you and i are more likely to know what goes in the gas tanks before any "rider" . all they need to know if there is enough gas in the tank, they leave it up to the "hired" help to fill it properly. i don't expect to much drama from this !!
Im gonna gonna be pissed off if RC loses the championship by less than 25 pts.. The focked up AMA shouldnt be deciding championships like this.Sounds like they need to do what Nascar does..Supply all of the fuel and sell it to race teams. Then there's nobody to blame but the AMA for stuff like this. I feel bad for RC,but I think he'll be fine when its all said and done.. Next year he'll prob only be doing left turns :crossx: :)

Boa1277
02-24-2006, 10:02 PM
You will see an appeal on this, diddnt Reeds get reduced to only 10pts when it was all said and done. They will trace this back to something like welds. Just when things were really getting interesting they do this. Bummer.
Alls I can say is SABOTAGE :cry:

RiverRatMike
02-24-2006, 10:21 PM
you have to add special fuel to Suzuki's to make them run fast :rollside:

Redrider
02-24-2006, 10:55 PM
American Suzuki has issued a press release in response to the penalty that the AMA Pro Racing has asssessed to Team Makita's Ricky Carmichael after fuel taken from Carmichael's motorcycle after the San Diego round of the Amp'd Mobile Supercross Series was found to be not in compliance with AMA rules. The release is as follows:
BREA, Calif. (Feb. 24, 2006) – Team Makita Suzuki Racing announced today that the team will appeal the penalty imposed by the AMA for the use of illegal fuel at round six of the Amp’d Mobile AMA Supercross Series in San Diego, Calif., on Feb. 11, 2006.
The entire Team Makita Suzuki Racing organization, including Ricky Carmichael and his crew, have followed closely all the rules established for AMA Supercross and Motocross racing. The team has purchased the same fuel throughout the last several seasons; it has been tested and was never found in violation of fuel rules before. The fuel used by the Supercross team at the San Diego round was supplied by a third-party vendor and was not tested by Team Makita Suzuki technicians before the race.
Carmichael and Team Makita Suzuki Racing will compete at round eight in Atlanta with the same determination that earned World and AMA Championships in 2005, and has kept Carmichael near the top of the standings in 2006.
This is crazy. I can say this has never happend to us, but you just never know! :mad: :argue:

Racer277
02-26-2006, 07:59 AM
Im gonna gonna be pissed off if RC loses the championship by less than 25 pts.. The focked up AMA shouldnt be deciding championships like this.Sounds like they need to do what Nascar does..Supply all of the fuel and sell it to race teams. Then there's nobody to blame but the AMA for stuff like this. I feel bad for RC,but I think he'll be fine when its all said and done.. Next year he'll prob only be doing left turns :crossx: :)
The AMA doesn't want a champion to leave without defending his championship?
They want to make sure 'The Next Big Thing' wins for ratings?
More underhanded things have happened.
And with what is happening there now, who can you trust....
Interesting...

beach gomer
02-26-2006, 04:19 PM
If Ricky keeps riding like he did in Atlanta he nobody will be able to catch him.

slink
02-26-2006, 05:03 PM
I read his post race interview on racer X. He said that if the AMA doesn't change the penalty he may just hang it up for SX this season.

mike37
02-26-2006, 05:15 PM
this my be a stupid questing but what advantage would leaded fuel give them

LakeTrash
02-26-2006, 07:57 PM
This is just the AMA showing that they think have all the power - and I might add they do have most of the stupidity.
The trace of lead they found in the fuel would make no difference in the quality of the fuel. It is complete bull crap just as it was when they did the same thing to Chad and Bubba last year.
Woodster is right - if it is such a deal then the AMA should furnish the fuel. Naw - that would be too easy.
What assholes. They finally get the season they and us have waited for and they toss it in the crapper. I wish Suzuki, Kawaski, Honda and Yamaha would all get together and tell the AMA to go to hell. Go to the promoters and make a deal without the political bull.
I would not blame Ricky, as much as I would hate it, if he packed his bags.
LT

boatnam2
02-26-2006, 09:29 PM
i tell ya, i would be pissed!! :220v: :220v:

Redrider
02-26-2006, 09:45 PM
You will see an appeal on this, diddnt Reeds get reduced to only 10pts when it was all said and done. They will trace this back to something like welds. Just when things were really getting interesting they do this. Bummer.
Alls I can say is SABOTAGE :cry:
Sorry, this is not something that you can even appeal. Chad and James both lost 25 points each, no reduction.
Yes, it sucks, but rules are rules. :rollside:

FreshTracks
02-26-2006, 09:47 PM
this my be a stupid questing but what advantage would leaded fuel give them
It doesn't. Leaded fuel helps in a 2-stroke,but not a 4-stroke. They don't need to add anymore power, those factory 450's have more power than they need.
It's total B.S. Ricky has been an honest champ for a long time and doesn't need to cheat. He proved that in Atlanta. AMA, pull your head out from you know where.....

upsman105
02-26-2006, 10:10 PM
The rules are the rules, it has happened to other people, in the past. He had 3 times the legal limit.

LakeTrash
02-27-2006, 05:12 AM
I saw that AMA idiot saying Ricky's fuel had 3 times the limit. The rule will only allow a trace of lead. 3 times a trace is still a trace.
Every real MX fan will add 25 points to whatever Ricky has at the end of the season to determine who the real champ is.
LT

meaniam
02-27-2006, 06:02 AM
..

Tom Brown
02-27-2006, 06:28 AM
nice contribution for your second post...
LakeTrash has been around boating forums a long, long time. This is just the first he's decided to post on ***boat.
Oh yeah... he's a pretty cool guy.... for someone who runs an outboard. :D

LakeTrash
02-27-2006, 07:24 AM
Get up off my ass Tom.
Believe it or not I am completely out of the outboard business. One Turbine powered, one Chevy powered & one diesel powered. One thing is the same though - none are running yet and spring is just about here.
LT

tcook33
02-27-2006, 10:06 AM
i don't expect to much drama from this !!
Care to retract that statement? haha.
Theres been lotso drama this week.

LGCDEVIL
02-27-2006, 01:26 PM
Heard someone say that some of the bigger teams have their own fuel manufacturer who is bound by contract not to supply any other team. Cost=around $700.00/gallon (thats HUNDRED). Insane. Or BS.

Woodster
02-27-2006, 02:00 PM
Heard someone say that some of the bigger teams have their own fuel manufacturer who is bound by contract not to supply any other team. Cost=around $700.00/gallon (thats HUNDRED). Insane. Or BS.
Thats the best one ive heard in a long time..Id say BS :rolleyes: :) Almost everybody uses VP fuel. I think its around 30 bucks a gallon for the stuff they use.

LakeTrash
02-28-2006, 02:43 PM
Like I said - the AMA is full of crap.
The following is from VP Racing Fuels...
Steve Burns, director of research and development for VP Racing Fuels, today issued the following statement regarding the penalization of Ricky Carmichael for the San Diego Supercross race due to a fuel violation:
VP Racing Fuels is a supplier to Team Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki, Suzuki and KTM and has been involved in supplying fuel to professional motocross teams for 25 years. VP develops and manufactures fuels for both motocross and road racing for all these teams. In business since 1975, VP is the Official Racing Fuels of NHRA, the largest racing sanctioning body in the world, as well as a sponsor of more than 30 other racing associations in various capacities. VP produces more blends of racing fuels for unique applications than anyone else in the world. We like to think we have more technology in racing fuels than any other company. This is illustrated by the fact that in racing venues that do not have a spec fuel rule, more championships are won by VP-powered engines than any other fuel company. VP has earned its reputation as a world leader in racing fuels.
It’s with great dismay that we learned of the latest incident regarding a points deduction due to a fuel violation at the Supercross race in San Diego. The matter is still being investigated and the jury is still out regarding the source of lead found in Ricky Carmichael’s fuel. Unfortunately, this marks the third time in the past three years one of AMA’s biggest stars was disqualified due to a situation of the AMA’s own making. The failure here is not the fault of the teams nor the fuel producer. The failure stems from a rule written to serve European interests. These disqualifications have also embarrassed three major corporations, essentially accusing them of cheating -- violating a rule that is poorly written, based on a specification of .005 grams per liter set by the FIM for European competition, while the USA EPA limit is set at .013 grams per liter. These lead levels are so low they could not have affected the performance or octane of the fuel, nor could it have any effect on the outcome of the race. Significantly, VP has never been contacted by the AMA prior to the implementation of any rule pertaining to fuels – which is very surprising given that VP supplies all the factory teams!
The specification that needs immediate attention is the lead level. Based on the European limit, it translates to trace levels -- parts per billion. The low limits set for lead in street fuels is to protect the catalytic converter from becoming coated over long term exposure, thus reducing the function of the converter. It is not a limit set for health reasons. Racing needs a wider tolerance for lead as the fuel is handled more frequently by more parties than pump fuels and in a more hostile environment. While pump gas typically goes from the manufacturer via pipeline or tanker to the gas station, then directly into the customerÂ’s tank, racing fuel is typically shipped to the teams in drums, which are then opened for various purposes, e.g. to draw samples, run tests, transfer to smaller containers, dispensed into the vehicle, drained from the vehicle after the race for reuse, etc. The fact is all dirt contains lead in varying degrees and it is entirely possible that fuel could become contaiminated with trace levels of lead given the windy, dusty and dirty environment encountered at most race tracks. Significantly, none of the levels we are talking about have any affect on the fuel or its performance in the engine. The use of lead in racing fuels is allowed by the EPA Clean Air Act. There are no legal reasons for the elimination of lead from racing fuels.
The other area of concern is the oxygen content of the fuels. As the rule is written, it would render many pump fuels illegal for use in AMA Pro Racing. The current AMA limit is 2.8%, while pump gas can have up to 3.7% in certain parts of the country. According to past conversations with Rob King, former AMA technical director, the current rules originally were written to ensure U.S. pump fuels would be legal for AMA Pro competition. The current rules fail that reasoning on both lead level and oxygen content.
These problems do not need to be confronted again. They require an easy fix -- rewrite the rules, while maintaining their intent. Suggestions were made to the AMA to this effect after the incident with Yamaha in 2004 but it fell on deaf ears. This is the third time the current rules have disqualified a racer that in no way was cheating or possessed an unfair advantage. It has made Yamaha, Kawasaki and now Suzuki look like cheaters, and made VP Racing Fuels appear incompetent. Yet, despite the recent claim by AMA’s Steve Whitelock that the problem “was explained away” in the earlier incidents, an analyzation of the facts in both incidents led to total exoneration of VP by the teams affected and all others involved. We anticipate the same will also be true when all the facts in the current case are analyzed.
This whole situation is damaging to the health of AMA racing. It has cost the factories, the AMA, the racers, VP Racing Fuels and the fans wasted money, wasted time and misplaced emotions. It is time for the AMA to revise its fuel rules to reflect reality.

Boa1277
02-28-2006, 04:46 PM
February 28, 2006
AMA Pro Racing to Investigate Fuel Situation
- press release -
PICKERINGTON, Ohio (February 28, 2006) – AMA Pro Racing announced today that it will launch a special investigation into the fuel situation surrounding the Amp’d Mobile AMA Supercross Series.
On Friday, Feb. 24, Ricky Carmichael was penalized 25 points for using illegal fuel at round six of the series at Qualcomm Stadium in San Diego, Calif., on Feb. 11.
As part of a routine post race technical inspection at the end of the San Diego event, the fuel from CarmichaelÂ’s motorcycle, along with seven others, was tested. The fuel from CarmichaelÂ’s motorcycle was found to be out of compliance with the rules and the Team Makita Suzuki rider was assessed a 25 point penalty. The fuel from the other seven competitorÂ’s motorcycles was determined to be within the rules. The list of riders whose fuel was tested includes Mike Alessi, Grant Langston, Jeremy McGrath, Nate Ramsey, Chad Reed, Andrew Short and James Stewart.
AMA Pro Racing has required the use of unleaded fuel in AMA Supercross and AMA Motocross competition since the 2004 racing season.
In making the announcement that a special investigation will be launched, AMA CEO Patti DiPietro noted that while a fuel penalty is not an appealable offense, there is enough evidence in this case to warrant an investigation.
“Our goal here is to get to the bottom of this ongoing fuel situation,” said DiPietro. “The rule on unleaded fuel is clear cut. If the lead content in fuel exceeds 0.005 g/l (grams per litre) it is illegal for competition. This is an objective, easily defined measurement that has been in place for three racing seasons. What concerns us here is that we keep finding fuel that is outside of the rule limits. We expect our competitors to take every possible step to ensure that their equipment is completely within the limits of the rules, but to penalize a competitor for an offense that is completely beyond his or his team’s control is not our purpose.
“Furthermore, it is not our intention to have a ruling influence the outcome of the series unless completely and absolutely warranted. This investigation will objectively determine all of the facts surrounding this issue.”
DiPietro stated that an outside consultant will be contracted to conduct the investigation. It is expected that teams as well as fuel suppliers, among others, will be interviewed in this process. The finding and recommendations of the consultant will be the foundation for any further action to be taken by AMA Pro Racing officials.
Until the outcome of the investigation is determined, CarmichaelÂ’s penalty stands.

Boa1277
02-28-2006, 04:48 PM
RC will get his points back, maybe not all of them but enough to keep it interesting. I am taking bets any takers, the AMA is not that stupid, they will not ruin the best SX season ever. Just my guess! LOL

Woodster
02-28-2006, 05:15 PM
RC will get his points back, maybe not all of them but enough to keep it interesting. I am taking bets any takers, the AMA is not that stupid, they will not ruin the best SX season ever. Just my guess! LOL
"Until the outcome of the investigation is determined, CarmichaelÂ’s penalty stands."
This quote says it all..RC will get his points back, take the 06SX championship and retire from SX..And do alot of left turns next year :rollside:

hbpdub
02-28-2006, 06:22 PM
Allright lets face it, Ricky is the man and if he does not take the title again this year he will just come back for the nationals and hand everyone their ass as always...

Racer277
03-03-2006, 10:59 AM
Some of you guys called it!
We have a race again...
The following is a release from the AMA:
The American Motorcyclist Association (AMA) and the Federation Internationale de Motocyclisme (FIM) have announced a joint resolution to the points penalty imposed by the AMA on Ricky Carmichael following the February 11 San Diego round of the AMA Supercross Series and the FIM World Supercross GP.
In a post-race tech inspection, the fuel in Carmichael's motorcycle was found to contain more lead than allowed under a standard jointly adopted by both sanctioning bodies beginning with the 2004 racing season.
The AMA has enforced that fuel regulation in its AMA Supercross Series and AMA Motocross Championship for the past two years. However, this is the first time that testing has revealed a fuel violation affecting a competitor entered in both the AMA and FIM series, and while the fuel standard is the same in both rule books, the two sanctioning bodies call for different testing protocols.
The AMA initiated an investigation into the fuel requirement and testing protocols. It then became apparent that this difference in testing protocols would make consistent enforcement of this standard difficult, and the two sanctioning bodies have agreed to cooperate in the investigation, with the goal of creating a unified unleaded fuel standard and testing protocol for the 2007 season.
Meanwhile, the AMA and the FIM jointly agreed that, because of the disparity in testing protocols, a points penalty would be inappropriate in this case. As a result, the AMA has rescinded the 25-point penalty imposed on Carmichael in the AMA Supercross Series standings, and the FIM has said that it will not impose a points penalty in the World Supercross GP standings.
Both sanctioning bodies agreed, however, that a penalty is still appropriate for this fuel violation, and the decision was made to impose a $20,000 fine on the Suzuki team for which Carmichael rides. The AMA and the FIM will equitably donate the fine to the Asterisk Mobile Medical Center, which provides trackside medical support to riders at all AMA Supercross Series/FIM World Supercross GP series and AMA Motocross Championship events and to Riders for Health, a humanitarian organization working in Africa for 15 years reaching nearly 11 million people with regular health care workers riding motorcycles.
"It was clear that the differences in testing protocols raised serious problems for enforcement of this rule,'' said Steve Whitelock, AMA Motocross and Supercross Series manager.
"We think this is a fair and equitable resolution of a difficult situation" said Wolfgang Srb, President of the FIM Motocross Commission.
The AMA has announced that the fuel investigation will be conducted by the Southwest Research Institute's Fuel and Lubricant Lab, an independent consulting organization with nearly 60 years of experience. It is expected that teams as well as fuel suppliers, among others, will be interviewed in this process.

hbpdub
03-03-2006, 11:36 AM
This is very good news for the CHAMP!

JetBoatRich
03-03-2006, 11:43 AM
Glad they gave it some thought :argue:

Tom Slick
03-03-2006, 12:03 PM
Can the AMA be anymore ridiculous? First they take RC's points away and reject Suzuki's appeal, then after a week of BS and I'm sure a bunch of pressure from Suzuki's attorneys they give the points back, but fine them $20,000. Although I'm stoked that RC got his points back :D , what is up with the $20,000 fine? :mad: At least the money is going to a good cause, but if the AMA is going to use the FIM as their alibi to get out of this deal and pretty much say that the rule is bogus why the fine? Now lets see if Reed can actually earn the title the right way. This should get good.

Racer277
03-03-2006, 12:05 PM
Oh, I bet they can get more ridiculous...
:) :) :rollside:

Mr. Pixilated
03-03-2006, 12:19 PM
WTF!!!!! :yuk:

Woodster
03-03-2006, 03:42 PM
Good for RC.. I figured he would get his points back. I know that Yamaha and Kawie are pretty pissed right now though. But at least it will get the AMA to either revise thier system or go to supplying fuel for all of the teams. If RC pulls off this championship he'll retire from SX..

upsman105
03-03-2006, 03:48 PM
Well I guess here like everywhere else in this country the rules only apply to a select few. I can't understand why no one follows the rules anymore. Oh wait maybe it is because we constantly change them to fit the offender. :yuk: Nothing against RC personally, but they have set a presidence in the past and should have to backbone to stick with it.

Dribble
03-03-2006, 04:12 PM
Well I guess here like everywhere else in this country the rules only apply to a select few. I can't understand why no one follows the rules anymore. Oh wait maybe it is because we constantly change them to fit the offender. :yuk: Nothing against RC personally, but they have set a presidence in the past and should have to backbone to stick with it.
The rule is stupid. The penalty was stupid. If I fueled up with super unleaded at Arco before a Supercross (and then won the race) I could have been penalized for too much lead in my fuel. It's not like he was running an overbore kit. They shouldn't have a rule that is impossible to comply with. Especially when you consider that even ten times the allowable lead content can do nothing to enhance performance in a four stroke. Also consider that factory 450's are detuned for supercross because they already have too much power for the tight tracks. The way I see it is that the AMA finally had the balls to do the right thing and also got backing from the FIM. Now whoever wins the series will have earned it.

Woodster
03-03-2006, 04:16 PM
The rule is stupid. The penalty was stupid. If I fueled up with super unleaded at Arco before a Supercross (and then won the race) I could have been penalized for too much lead in my fuel. It's not like he was running an overbore kit. They shouldn't have a rule that is impossible to comply with. Especially when you consider that even ten times the allowable lead content can do nothing to enhance performance in a four stroke. Also consider that factory 450's are detuned for supercross because they already have too much power for the tight tracks. The way I see it is that the AMA finally had the balls to do the right thing and also got backing from the FIM. Now whoever wins the series will have earned it.
Couldnt have said it better myself. :crossx:

Racer277
03-03-2006, 04:18 PM
What sucks is it was decided (either way) by AMA racing.
Once they announced the initial finding and punishment, they were damned either way.
They should have thought of all this prior to the penalty.
Or fixed it last time, as the experts told them to.

upsman105
03-03-2006, 04:37 PM
I am not defending the rule, just the fact that it was in place and they seem to enforce it only on a few people, when it is convenient.. eliminate the rule if it is stupid, but make everybody play by the same rules...by the way I don't think it was intentional, and it also wasn't the last few times they caught people doing it. But those people were punished, and they didn't find a way to un-punish them when people got upset..

LakeTrash
03-03-2006, 07:28 PM
I too am happy that the AMA has gotten thier asses out of the way and are going to let the championship be decided by the racers on the track.
That said - what a spinless way to get out of a mess. Just as all politicians, they do not have the guts to say they screwed up. FIM - different testing - what a bunch of bull.
LT

Tom Slick
03-03-2006, 10:05 PM
I too am happy that the AMA has gotten thier asses out of the way and are going to let the championship be decided by the racers on the track.
That said - what a spinless way to get out of a mess. Just as all politicians, they do not have the guts to say they screwed up. FIM - different testing - what a bunch of bull.
LT
You got it, they are definitely a bunch if fags, but at least RC gets his points back and we can get back to what really matters and that is a battle to see who is really the baddest at the sport today.