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View Full Version : Dont run from the cops in Blue Ash Ohio..



WetWillie
10-03-2007, 08:35 PM
Watch it until the end.... http://www.officer.com/videonetwork/index.jsp?showid=378811

DILLIGAF
10-03-2007, 08:41 PM
intense

DUNDUN
10-03-2007, 08:42 PM
damn!

charlyox
10-03-2007, 08:49 PM
You can bet he won't do that again.

DSW
10-03-2007, 08:50 PM
Awesome! now if they would just do that everywhere!

Wet Dream
10-03-2007, 08:56 PM
Holy shit!!! Nice finish.

socalmoney
10-03-2007, 09:18 PM
That will undoubtedly be used in training as to "what not to do when terminating a pursuit". I guess there are still cowboys in Ohio.

Nord
10-03-2007, 09:25 PM
Extinguished..................

DUNDUN
10-03-2007, 09:33 PM
That will undoubtedly be used in training as to "what not to do when terminating a pursuit". I guess there are still cowboys in Ohio.
the guy was being a danger to p.o's..... wreckin cars n shit!
arent cops trained to shoot when being shot at, or in this case.. driven at?

WetWillie
10-03-2007, 09:33 PM
The U.S is going to hell in a handbasket and I think we need to go back in time..;) If you run from the cops, shoot at the cops I dont care how they do it. They just did it with style...
In all seriousness none of us were there. I assume his first choice was not to be riding on that hood. But you can sure as shi# bet that if that was me on that hood and that guy was trying to take off again I would pump him full of lead to...:eek:
That will undoubtedly be used in training as to "what not to do when terminating a pursuit". I guess there are still cowboys in Ohio.

25Elmn8r
10-03-2007, 11:35 PM
Gotta say, thats pretty intense, and Well Done!

Outnumbered
10-03-2007, 11:46 PM
Dash Cam Captures Violent Ohio Chase
Updated: August 31st, 2007 11:02 AM PDT
Blue Ash Police Department
A driver was killed and two officers were injured in the Aug. 28 chase and shooting.
Story by newsnet5.com
Watch Video
BLUE ASH, Ohio --
A driver was killed and two officers were injured Tuesday after a police chase and shooting.
Daryl Black, a passenger, said all he wanted was a ride to the store. What he got instead was the wildest ride of his life.
Already, he's having nightmares, newsnet5.com partner WLWT-TV in Cincinnati reported.
"I thought I was a goner," Black said.
Black, 28, was riding with Charles Bennett, 37, when Blue Ash police tried to pull him over for erratic driving near Sycamore High School. Instead, Bennett made a run for it.
Wednesday night, Black watched the dashcam video from the Blue Ash cruisers that chased Bennett early Tuesday morning.
"What I am thinking here is, 'Get me out of this car … you're going to kill us," he said.
Black said he didn't know that the car was stolen. He said that he tried to grab the wheel, but couldn't.
Black said Bennett never said a word during the entire chase.
Eventually, after being hit by police cruisers at least twice, Bennett's car stopped and an officer jumped on the hood of the car, firing through the windshield.
"I thought I was a dead man, you know? I thought he was going to shoot me when he was up on that thing. I kept on saying 'No, no, no, don't shoot!" Black said.
Bennett died at Bethesda North Hospital, but Black was unharmed and police quickly determined he was an innocent bystander.
"Going through a chase and then watching an officer shoot several shots in a window, when you think the next bullet is for you, it's unreal," Black said.
The three officers who fired shots during the pursuit are on administrative leave.

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 01:23 AM
It didn't appear to me that they were being shot at in the video but I wasn't sure and didn't bring that up. The article confirms this. The first line says two officers were hurt and the suspect is dead. All because he didn't want to pull over. Two officers hurt is unacceptable. You have to ask yourself, did the suspect hurt them or did they place themselves or create a situation that caused them to get hurt. Jumping onto a moving cars hood in my mind is the last thing I would want to do. You are just about forcing yourself to shoot this guy because you don't want him to take off. You are on the hood after all. Many departments are reviewing their policy about shooting at moving vehicles. Is it ok for an Officer/Deputy to place himself in front of a car that is trying to leave and them say to him/her self, this guy is going to kill me, I better start shooting to save my life. Might have been a better idea not to stand in front of a moving car in such an explosive situation. If an Officer/Deputy is stuck in his or her position and the car decides to run them over, they should do whatever is necessary to stop the treat. If a Officer/Deputy steps in front of the car, I don't think they have a right to shoot. Just my .02

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 01:26 AM
In all seriousness none of us were there. I assume his first choice was not to be riding on that hood. But you can sure as shi# bet that if that was me on that hood and that guy was trying to take off again I would pump him full of lead to...:eek:
You shouldn't be on the hood in the first place. This is the training note I was pointing out.

vdrivenman
10-04-2007, 03:19 AM
a good job well done !! concerned me that it took him so long to get back up units in the chase.

RitcheyRch
10-04-2007, 04:09 AM
Awesome and one less scum bag on the planet

dale459us
10-04-2007, 05:00 AM
removing scum is a good thing...we need to be more pro-active such as the video. I wish these cops lived closer to my home

Throttle
10-04-2007, 06:11 AM
it looked like an officer may have been under the car prior to the shooting of the driver -

Wet Dream
10-04-2007, 06:35 AM
I completely agree with and support the actions of the officers. The driver was not going to give up at any point, and had tobe stopped. The officer was safer on the hood than in front of the car. You can't get run over by an object you're on.

boatsnblondes
10-04-2007, 07:07 AM
At any point, if you point your car at a cop, try to ram him/her, as this guy did, several times....that cause...assualt with a deadly weapon I think?? LE correct me if I am wrong...that was enough for him to get taken out...had he just given up, the arrest still would have been a rough one...cops don't like it when you try to ram them....never have, never will...

H20 Toie
10-04-2007, 07:33 AM
It didn't appear to me that they were being shot at in the video but I wasn't sure and didn't bring that up. The article confirms this. The first line says two officers were hurt and the suspect is dead. All because he didn't want to pull over. Two officers hurt is unacceptable. You have to ask yourself, did the suspect hurt them or did they place themselves or create a situation that caused them to get hurt. Jumping onto a moving cars hood in my mind is the last thing I would want to do. You are just about forcing yourself to shoot this guy because you don't want him to take off. You are on the hood after all. Many departments are reviewing their policy about shooting at moving vehicles. Is it ok for an Officer/Deputy to place himself in front of a car that is trying to leave and them say to him/her self, this guy is going to kill me, I better start shooting to save my life. Might have been a better idea not to stand in front of a moving car in such an explosive situation. If an Officer/Deputy is stuck in his or her position and the car decides to run them over, they should do whatever is necessary to stop the treat. If a Officer/Deputy steps in front of the car, I don't think they have a right to shoot. Just my .02
How about just stopping your car and not having a chase at all? He was in control of the situation and got what he deserved.
The way he was driving it is lucky he didnt kill anyone else.

LAFD
10-04-2007, 07:53 AM
i couldnt imagine being in a situation like this. having a stupid as driving doing over a hunder on surface streets not stopping for anything. granted being on the hood probly isnt the best idea but he felt it was at the time. who knows the true situation and how it completly went down. doesnt hurt my feelings that another low life is off the street. he wont steal another car or put anyone in danger again.hats off to those guys they did what they had to do and hopfully they dont get a bad rap for doing so.

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 07:57 AM
How about just stopping your car and not having a chase at all? He was in control of the situation and got what he deserved.
So your saying he deserved death?
I am not condemning these Officers for their choices. I would condemn their department for lack of training. Cops don't make choices in these situations, they go into auto pilot and revert to how they were trained. I think there are many opportunities in the video for improved training methods so more people don't get hurt or killed. Seems like everyone is caught up in the action of this video and are not truly seeing the flaws.

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 08:12 AM
Some of this appears to not be clear on the video.
Officers Hurt; Suspect Shot, Killed After Blue Ash Police Pursuit
Last Update: 8/28 1:57 pm
Story by 9News Reporter Bill Price:
Photographed by Chic Poppe and Dave Marlo:
A suspect is dead and two Blue Ash police officers were injured after a high speed police chase ended in a police-involved shooting early Tuesday morning.
The suspect has been identified as Charles Wayne Bennett, 37, of Blue Ash.
Officers said they were forced to fire upon Bennett, who was unarmed, because he reportedly tried to run them down -- not once, but twice.
The incident started just before 12:30 a.m., on Cornell Road near Sycamore High School, when the black Chevrolet Bennett was driving was spotted driving suspiciously, police said.
When officers tried to pull the car over, they said Bennett turned his car around and drove back toward their cruiser, almost hitting it.
Officers tried to get him to stop, but instead Bennett led them on a chase of several miles through Blue Ash, at speeds of up to 100 miles per hour.
As Bennett's car approached Reed Hartman Highway at Glendale Milford, he was seen driving left of the center line and without his headlights on.
The car then slammed into a Blue Ash cruiser at Reed Hartman and Cooper Road.
As two officers approached the stopped car, they said Bennett accelerated towards one of them.
Both officers fired into the car in response. At that point, Bennett reportedly took off again.
Just 200 feet away along Reed Hartman Highway, Bennett hit another Blue Ash police car.
A third officer was struck by the car as it lunged forward.
He was slammed onto the car's roof and then fired additional shots into the car to get it to stop.
The chase finally ended near the intersection of Reed Hartman Highway and Cooper Road in Blue Ash, after the driver crashed into a Blue Ash cruiser.
Blue Ash Police Captain James Schaffer explained what happened next, "Further down the road at Reed Hartman, the suspect crashed into a second police car. Then the car lunged at several officers as they tried to approach, and more shots were fired."
Bennett was shot by police and was taken to Bethesda North Hospital in Montgomery where he died.
There are numerous bullet holes in the suspect's car, which police said was reported stolen out of Clermont County.
Two Blue Ash Police officers suffered minor injuries. One was taken to the hospital and released, while the other refused treatment.
Police said the suspect had, what they refer to as, "an extensive criminal record."
Bennett's passenger was injured by flying glass and was taken to the hospital, where he was treated and released. He is not being charged.
The three officers who shot at the stolen car have been placed on paid administrative leave while the pursuit and shooting investigation continues.
Bennett is well known among Blue Ash Police for charges of drug trafficking.

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 08:12 AM
Blue Ash Police Release Cruiser Footage Of Deadly Chase
Last Update: 8/29 6:09 pm
Reported by: Shannon Kettler
Photographed by: Chic Poppe, Eric Clajus
Web produced by: Laura Hornsby
We're getting an up close look at the high-speed chase in Blue Ash that ended with officers shooting and killing the suspect.
Wednesday afternoon, police released video from the cruiser capturing those tense moments.
Blue Ash police say they were trying to pull over the driver of a stolen black Chevy because of his erratic driving.
"I just had a vehicle try and ram me. Headed westbound on Cornell Road," said Officer Scott Noel.
As Officer Scott Noel radios dispatch, he is now in pursuit for the driver who police later identified as Charles Wayne Bennett.
Speeds reach 80 to 100 miles-per-hour.
The suspect's car collides with a Blue Ash cruiser at Reed Hartman and Cooper Road.
As two officers approach on foot, police say the driver accelerates towards one of them.
Both officers fired at the suspect, but the black Chevy continues on 200 feet, where it again collides with another cruiser.
A third Blue Ash officer approaches the vehicle on foot.
Police say the officer was struck as the Chevy moved foward.
The officer fired shots from on top of the hood of the car ending the chase.
The Blue Ash officers involved in the use of force are Sergeant Paul Hartinger, Sergeant Edward Charron, Officer Steve Keller and Officer Scott Noel.
They are on paid leave, which is standard procedure as the investigation continues.

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 08:14 AM
More info
Shooting haunts passenger
BY QUAN TRUONG AND CLIFF RADEL | QTRUONG@ENQUIRER.COM AND CRADEL@ENQUIRER.COM
BLUE ASH – As police here launched two investigations into a high-speed chase in which officers shot and killed a driver who fled from them in a stolen car, the car’s passenger was dealing with his own demons.
Daryl Black, 28, said Wednesday he has already had nightmares of bullets flying around him.
He looked at the cuts on his palms and could still see his neighbor, Charles Wayne Bennett, riddled with bullets with blood staining his shirt.
He remembered the determined look on Bennett’s face as he pressed his foot on the gas pedal and ran from police at speeds up to 130 miles per hour.
Black was in the passenger seat of the stolen car that led police on a pursuit through Blue Ash early Tuesday.
Several times during the chase, Black said, he tried to grab the wheel and crash the car but was unsuccessful.
The car hit two cruisers before finally slowing to a stop. When the final, fatal gunfire began with an officer on the hood firing into the car, “I hit the floor,” Black said.
Huddled underneath the dash in the passenger seat, he heard bullets shatter the windows.
Wednesday afternoon, Black sat at a picnic bench near his home in Sycamore Township and recalled the nightmare that “should’ve never happened.”
Black said the shooting was not justified.
“Obviously they had him stopped, they didn’t need to keep firing,” he said. “For a car, it’s not worth a life.”
Police said Bennett nearly ran into cruisers twice, once while making a U-turn, accelerated toward officers at one point, twice actually bumped cruisers, and rolled into the officer who ended up firing from the hood. Three officers fired shots, but not all at the same time.
As he spoke, Black rarely smiled. He appeared calm but looked tired. Occasionally, he held up his hands, gripping the imaginary wheel of the Monte Carlo as he described the chase.
“It keeps going through my head,” he said.
It all began just after midnight, when Bennett picked him up – with another man in the car – from the apartment building on Kenwood Road where Black said the two were neighbors.
“He was supposed to take me to Walgreens,” Black said. “I didn’t know the car was stolen.”
After dropping off the third man in the car, Bennett was driving on Cornell Road when he decided to do a U-turn, Black said. A Blue Ash officer pulled up and tried to stop the car.
“He said, ‘(Expletive) this,’ and takes off,” Black said. “He floors it and I grab the wheel but stopped because I decided it was too dangerous. I said, ‘You’re gonna kill us (expletive)! Stop this (expletive) car!’”
Bennett replied with the only phrase he uttered during the entire chase: “Shut up (expletive.)”
“It was eerie,” Black said. “He was very quiet throughout the whole thing. I was the one screaming at him.”
Black said he’s never been that close to gunfire. Hamilton County court records show he’s had previous drug and assault charges convictions, but Black said he never imagined himself in this situation.
“Somebody died right next to me – somebody I know,” he said. “We were casual friends. Never would I have thought he’d be involved in this – he was a soft-spoken man. No one understands why he did it.”
Bennett, 37, who Black said was his neighbor in Sycamore Township, had numerous charges on his record. His most recent conviction was for panhandling and possession of marijuana in July.
Blue Ash officers are conducting a criminal investigation to present to the Hamilton County Prosecutor and an internal investigation. Both are under the direction of Capt. James Schaffer.
“The investigations will be conducted one right after the other,” Schaffer said.
The criminal probe, he said, deals with “felonious assault on police officers in which deadly force was used.” The internal investigation will see “if any internal policies were violated.”
So far, it appears Blue Ash police followed proper procedure during the pursuit and shooting, Schaffer said.
“When someone is using a vehicle as a weapon, if officers are threatened with bodily harm or death, they are justified under our policy,” Schaffer noted, “in using that level of force.”
Following the incident, four officers were placed on paid administrative leave. Three were put on leave for discharging their sidearms. One went on leave for using his car as a weapon. Being placed on administrative leave is department policy in such cases.
The officers on leave are:
- Sgt. Edward Charron – policeman since 1988. Blue Ash Police Department member since 1995. Promoted to sergeant in 2002. While a member of the Cincinnati Police Department in 1991, he shot and killed a Golf Manor teen after the 18-year-old tried to grab the officer’s gun during a scuffle following a traffic stop.
- Sgt. Paul Hartinger – policeman since 1984. Blue Ash Police Department member since 1989. Promoted to sergeant in 1998. Sued for excessive use of force after a 1993 traffic stop.
-Officer Steve Keller – policeman since 1993. Blue Ash officer since 2002. Involved in July incident where a handcuffed suspect escaped from a cruiser’s back seat.
- Officer Scott Noel – policeman since 1990. Blue Ash officer since 2002. Used his cruiser as a weapon against the stolen car driven by Charles Wayne Bennett. Noel performed a “pit maneuver” where a trained officer bumps a suspect’s car to send it into a spin and off the road.

Spotondl
10-04-2007, 08:19 AM
So your saying he deserved death?
I am not condemning these Officers for their choices. I would condemn their department for lack of training. Cops don't make choices in these situations, they go into auto pilot and revert to how they were trained. I think there are many opportunities in the video for improved training methods so more people don't get hurt or killed. Seems like everyone is caught up in the action of this video and are not truly seeing the flaws.
"The three officers who fired shots during the pursuit are on administrative leave."
Looks like others in the department agree with you...

vdrivenman
10-04-2007, 08:20 AM
well socalmoney what academy did you attend and who holds you license.how many pursuits have you been invloved in and how many class hours do you have in use of deadly force!!!!
ARMCHAIR quaterbacking ! it is easy to make a decision safely sititng at your computer.
were thiings done textbook,probably not,but things NEVER go the way you train for them!

Spotondl
10-04-2007, 08:32 AM
OMG, that second news story is sooooo much BS... Pit maneuver? LMFAO... that was a RAM... I never saw anyplace in that video where the driver/runner tried to ram the cops... I heard the officer "claim" a ram attempt on the radio, didn't look like it to me... the guy was making a U turn while running...
Don't get me wrong, I am glad that the asswipe got his in the end, I just have trouble justifying the means to that end... Makes me wonder how many other BS "claims" are made as means to an end that favors the cops...
And yes, I have trust issues with most LE...

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 08:36 AM
well socalmoney what academy did you attend and who holds you license.how many pursuits have you been invloved in and how many class hours do you have in use of deadly force!!!!
ARMCHAIR quaterbacking ! it is easy to make a decision safely sititng at your computer.
were thiings done textbook,probably not,but things NEVER go the way you train for them!
I have no doubt there are still "Cowboys" in Texas.

ULTRA26 # 1
10-04-2007, 08:37 AM
well socalmoney what academy did you attend and who holds you license.how many pursuits have you been invloved in and how many class hours do you have in use of deadly force!!!!
ARMCHAIR quaterbacking ! it is easy to make a decision safely sititng at your computer.
were thiings done textbook,probably not,but things NEVER go the way you train for them!
Is that how you deal with stolen car chases in TX? Don't have to be a trained LE officer to know that you don't chase a stolen vehicle at speeds over 100 mph.
I watched and listened to the entire video and believe that the officer on the hood will be charged with excessive force as will the Officer who crashed the stolen cars door.
And before you post another intelligent response let me help you. I don't know shit!
EDIT: I see you decided to reword your comment "socalmoney you dont know shit"

73kona455
10-04-2007, 08:46 AM
I dont think the officers were wrong...:) If you cant do the time, dont do the crime.....Trying to drive off with a policeman on the hood brings you a strong chance of dying, as does leading to police on a high speed chase in a stolen vehicle....

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 08:52 AM
I dont think the officers were wrong...:) If you cant do the time, dont do the crime.....Trying to drive off with a policeman on the hood brings you a strong chance of dying, as does leading to police on a high speed chase in a stolen vehicle....
If the article is correct and that Officer was struck by the suspect vehicle and he ended up on top of the hood, he is justified (in my mind) to end the threat. If the Officer jumped on the hood to engage the suspect, I have problems with that. If the Officer was struck by the vehicle, why did the Officer put himself in front of the vehicle. This is very unsafe and by most accounts would force the Officer to shoot. This is the very crux of my argument. Officers should not be stepping in front of moving cars. It is bad for the Officer and the suspect.

vdrivenman
10-04-2007, 09:14 AM
yes there are a lot of cowboys in Texas and they all have guns and drive p//u trucks.
yes i did reword /edit my post because i don't know what he knows and felt that was to strong language!
based on what i saw they did what was necessary. could things have been done better? probably so, but i wasn't there.all i have is the video.
would i cowboy up on the hood of a vehicle,probably not.
but the real fault lies with the person who decided to steal a vehcile and run from the police.
Now a bunch of peoples lifes are affected!
Life's about choices !

ULTRA26 # 1
10-04-2007, 09:16 AM
Officer's first comment. "I just had a vehicle try and ram me"
Complete bullsh*t
Officer: "I'm going to take this guy out if a get a chance"
Officer: "Southbound at 100 MPH don't anybody pull out"
Stolen vehicle making u-turn officer crashes into the door of stolen vehicle.
Officer starts firing. Target unknown
Stolen Vehicle attempts to flee and gets rammed and spun by PD vehicle
Officer jumps onto hood of stopped stolen vehicle. Stolen vehicle pulls forward and Officer unloads his weapon into the driver.
Unreasonable force :confused: :confused:

OutCole'd
10-04-2007, 09:22 AM
Bottom line, at the end of the day, who is responsible for the guys death?
If the guys did not steal a car, would he be alive?
If he did not lead the police on a 100+ MPH chase, would he be alive?
If he would have stopped, and done what he was told, would he be alive?
One less pile of shit in the world today, I'm OK with that.

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 09:33 AM
yes i did reword /edit my post because i don't know what he knows and felt that was to strong language!
I grew up watching CHiPs, Adam 12, Swat, TJ Hooker, Simon and Simon, Magnum PI, Riptide, The Fall Guy, Hardcastle and McCormick, The A Team, Hunter, Sledge Hammer, Hill Street Blues, Spenser: For Hire, Miami Vice, Knight Rider, 21 Jump Street, Barney Miller, Charlie's Angels, Starsky and Hutch, MacGyver and Crazy Like a Fox. Did I leave any out.
I am fully qualified to comment on police matters.

HM
10-04-2007, 09:47 AM
I grew up watching 21 Jump Street.
Fag.

WetWillie
10-04-2007, 09:50 AM
I went to the academy and was a deputy for 7 years. There is NO way to cover any and all possibilities in any academy. However he ended up on that hood only he knows. I am sure that was not where he wanted to be.
The story was sent to me and mentioned the suspect was involved in a shooting. I assumed it was during this event. I feel they attempted to ram him twice to stop him. Both times he sped or attempted to speed away. In my opinion he got what he deserved.
If he would have killed someone and gotten life through our system would that be fair?
You shouldn't be on the hood in the first place. This is the training note I was pointing out.

cjordan
10-04-2007, 09:53 AM
This is old chit.....!!:D ;) happened about 10 miles away...

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 09:56 AM
Fag.
Yea, I thought about leaving that one out but I left it in since a gained a lot of valuable police knowledge from it.
What's up with the new screen name?

HM
10-04-2007, 10:04 AM
Yea, I thought about leaving that one out but I left it in since a gained a lot of valuable police knowledge from it.
What's up with the new screen name?
I was inspired by you by weaving my last name into my screen name. :D
Just thought I'd let people refer to me the way most people refer to me. :D
(also, had surgery that removed the moley that was next to the holey). ewe. :jawdrop: :D

CP Dad
10-04-2007, 10:32 AM
Guys, the issue is a dynamic situation that changes by the second. Who knows why the cop jumped on the hood and wether or not that was the correct act, and nobody can really say. I honestly will never believe that an officer would purposely place himself in front of a vehicle so that he can shoot the suspect when the suspect drives away. If any of you ever would have the opportunity to be in a situation like that (and I know some have), I can honestly say that it is scary as shit. Whatever the reason for being on the hood was, he was there. The suspect then made the choice to put his car in drive and drive away, that's what signed this clown's death warrant. I have a real problem with the public saying cops can't defend themselves in a threatening, possibly deadly, situation, becasue they "caused" the confrontation. Isn't that what is expected of cops, confront the situation? This guy had every option of giving up and being taken into custody and he chose differently.... Plain and simple.
Would the public rather let the suspect continue the pursuit at 100 mph through the city, risking every other person on the roadway??????? How about if your kids were standing on the next corner waiting to cross the road??? Would your oppinion change then???????????? I'm sure the cop sitting on the hood figured, This is over, he can't possibly get away now. So would the people second guessing this cop's actions assume it would be reasonable of him to take a ride on this guys hood at 90-100 mph because, after all, "he caused the situation......"????? Thankfully, the courts and the justice system have more common sense than the general public and things like this "usually" end up ok. People just need to remember, police actions are justified or not justified by the totality of the circumstance at the exact time of the incident, and what was going thru the officer's mind at the time of the incidnet. Not what a bunch of second guessers would assume after watching a video several times and having time to reflect back on the incidnet. All of the history and events that led up to the critical incident are not part of the equation. In a civil court, totally different.
All I can say folks, is if anybody has a problem with this incident, ask yourself honestly........... If your kids were crossing the road at the next intersection, would your oppinion be different.................. CP Dad

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 10:37 AM
I was inspired by you by weaving my last name into my screen name. :D
Now the secret is out. I was trying to make people believe I had money, not that I am money. haha

CP Dad
10-04-2007, 11:21 AM
My last post being said, I don't blame the public for having the frustrations and the issues they do. In my oppinion, police departments do a horrible job of educating the public on the practices and policies that are in use. Someone said earlier, "I don't have to be a police officer to know that you don't chase a stolen veh at 100 mph." That is totally incorrect and anybody that watches the news will see pusuits everyday that go well beyond 100 mph for even a stolen car. But you never see a rep for the department that gets up after the event and explain to the public the reasons why things are done, which leaves it up to people's imagination. That's the worst case senario for LE's image with the public.
Society has to draw a line somewhere, and god help us all if the answer is just don't chase anybody. What would that do for the crime rate????? I can't believe that we have not relied on stiffer sentences for people who run. That's where it needs to change. Why is a car thief that runs in a pusuit down a public highway at 130 mph getting sentenced to 3 months probation???????? That's begging for trouble. Every day somewhere in this country you hear about pusuits that have gone bad and innocent people are hurt or killed. Why aren't we hammering the criminals that do it???? Instead, we focus on how impropper the LE that was chasing the subject acted and focus on restricted pursuit policies. That message is never brought out to the public by the LE agencies or the media.

River Lynchmob
10-04-2007, 11:23 AM
I think the cops were justified in their actions. I also believe that more cases should be handled in the same manner. These jack asses not only endanger thier own lives (which I could care less about) the lives of the officers and most importantly the general public. When a person endangers the lives of the general public he has given up his rights as far as I am concerned.
That officer saved the state of Ohio probably millions in trial, DA, public defender fees, appeals and breing locked up. As far as I am concerned they acted appropriately.

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 11:30 AM
That officer saved the state of Ohio probably millions in trial, DA, public defender fees, appeals and breing locked up. As far as I am concerned they acted appropriately.
Lets not forget that these Officers will most likely be sued civilly and it could cost them millions. The suspect was black so history tells us race will come into effect as well. It is a no win situation for these guys.

vee-driven
10-04-2007, 11:31 AM
Let me guess......police persuit ends with 15 shots fired at point blank range and noone was injured. lol

Sleeper CP
10-04-2007, 12:56 PM
So your saying he deserved death?
I am not condemning these Officers for their choices. I would condemn their department for lack of training. Cops don't make choices in these situations, they go into auto pilot and revert to how they were trained. I think there are many opportunities in the video for improved training methods so more people don't get hurt or killed. Seems like everyone is caught up in the action of this video and are not truly seeing the flaws.
That looks to be the case, early on the cop could have rammed him at one of his U turns. That POS could have killed someone later in the chase.
I'm fine with them shooting and killing the POS. Bottom line cop red lights you; pull over. It would be interesting to know his record, why was he running. But once he puts the cops in danger or bystanders ..Blast him. He won't do that again and if it happened more often the word would get out.
Just my .02
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

ULTRA26 # 1
10-04-2007, 01:11 PM
but the real fault lies with the person who decided to steal a vehcile and run from the police.
Noone could possibly disagree with this comment. However, death seems a bit sever for what occurred here. Grand theft auto and resisting arrest. The officer clearly jumped onto the hood from the driver side of the vehicle, gun in hand. When the vehicle moved, he unloaded his gun into the driver.
At no point in the video did the Chevy ram a LE vehicle. To the contrary, the Officer in pursuit of the Chevy aimed straight for the driver's and hit the car with significant force. The Chevy was rammed in the right quarter panel by another LE vehicle. The LE account of this issue given to the press does not follow the video.

Spotondl
10-04-2007, 01:26 PM
I bet the innocent passenger, Black, has a hey day in court with the way this was handled... $$$$ for life.... Bet he buys a DCB...:D :D :D

delemorte
10-04-2007, 01:27 PM
I see it like this. When a police officer tells you to do something and you dont, you take your life into your own hands.
The second this guy decided to run from the cops he made the choice that his life was not worth going to jail over. so its his own fault.
1. Should not have stolen a car.
2 Should not have tried to run
3. and when stopped should not have tried to escape in a 2 ton weapon forcing an officer to kill him...
he made a bad string of choices and paid the ultimate price. i wont loose any sleep on this one.

River Lynchmob
10-04-2007, 01:35 PM
Lets not forget that these Officers will most likely be sued civilly and it could cost them millions. The suspect was black so history tells us race will come into effect as well. It is a no win situation for these guys.
I would really hope that you are wrong, but as you said history has shown us that you are most likely correct. I'm suprised the Reverands Al and Jessy haven't chimed in yet.

MudPumper
10-04-2007, 09:02 PM
Is that how you deal with stolen car chases in TX? Don't have to be a trained LE officer to know that you don't chase a stolen vehicle at speeds over 100 mph.
Ummmm.......and why not???? Every department has Pursuit policies that dictate where, what, when, and why we can chase. It is up to the primary Officer to decide when to terminate a pursuit unless he is commanded to terminate by a supervisor and all pursuits are overseen by the supervisor. 100, 105, 110 isn't really that fast on an open road or freeway with little to no traffic. I've been in a chase where my speed hit 130 on the freeway and I felt it was unsafe and backed off to 115 which did not feel unsafe for the road and traffic conditions. Weather, road, traffic conditions, time of day and the severety of the crime will dictate if the pursuit continues. In this case traffic and pedestrians were almost non existent so why shouldn't it continue.
Officer's first comment. "I just had a vehicle try and ram me"
Complete bullsh*t
Officer: "I'm going to take this guy out if a get a chance"
Officer: "Southbound at 100 MPH don't anybody pull out"
Stolen vehicle making u-turn officer crashes into the door of stolen vehicle.
Officer starts firing. Target unknown
Stolen Vehicle attempts to flee and gets rammed and spun by PD vehicle
Officer jumps onto hood of stopped stolen vehicle. Stolen vehicle pulls forward and Officer unloads his weapon into the driver.
Unreasonable force :confused: :confused:
Obviously the Officer felt the driver tried to ram him. Officers actions are judged by the Reasonable Officer Doctrin which states an Officers actions will be judged by what another Officer with similar training and experience would have done in a similar situation where circumstances were tense, uncertain and rapidly evolving. You don't have this training or experience and therefore are not qualified to judge. Especially from just watching a video where not all the facts are known. You don't think so from the video but you werent behind the wheel of that cruiser were you??
We are allowed to ram vehicles to terminate a pursuit. If you are not trained in the PIT manouver, we call it a Legal Intervention. The supreme court has decided in certain cases that ramming a fleeing vehicle off the road is not Excessive Force.
The bottom line is this.....You were not there and therefore should not pass judgement on the actions of others unless you know all the facts. Hell, the Supreme Court of the U.S. does not pass judgement without first knowing all the facts.
I'll get off my soap box now.:idea:

CP Dad
10-04-2007, 09:13 PM
Did I read it wrong, or was the guy's name Black? At any rate, I'm sure that would be brought in to it as well. After all, it's pitch black outside with reflections from overhead lights all over the place, they knew the occupants were a minority, right? Gotta love lawyers................... Don't know how they can sleep at night. Oh yeah I do, on a $10K mattress.....

socalmoney
10-04-2007, 09:41 PM
I'm fine with them shooting and killing the POS. Bottom line cop red lights you; pull over. It would be interesting to know his record, why was he running. But once he puts the cops in danger or bystanders ..Blast him. He won't do that again and if it happened more often the word would get out.
This is a ridiculous statement. You are basically eliminating our judicial system by saying that. Do you really want Cops to have that kind of power? Cops are put into harms way everyday. Every time they make a car stop, clear a building, make contact with the homeless or respond to a domestic. Imagine how many morons would be shot at if we lived by this statement. I am amazed at the intellect being displayed in some of these comments. Seems like most take the attitude that if your a "POS" then shoot him. Amazing.

Sleeper CP
10-04-2007, 10:07 PM
This is a ridiculous statement. You are basically eliminating our judicial system by saying that. Do you really want Cops to have that kind of power? Cops are put into harms way everyday. Every time they make a car stop, clear a building, make contact with the homeless or respond to a domestic. Imagine how many morons would be shot at if we lived by this statement. I am amazed at the intellect being displayed in some of these comments. Seems like most take the attitude that if your a "POS" then shoot him. Amazing.
This is a ridiculous statement? No it's not . Once some POS starts running from a cop in a 3,000 lbs. car at 100 mph he or they might as well be running around with a loaded machine gun. If you want them to kill someone you know..well God bless you. I'd rather the cops take them out before they hurt or kill someone in my family. About 4 cops with .50 cal semi-autos at a road block should about do it clear to fire at 75 yards out.
Cops are put in harms way everyday... Yes they are, and for some POS to add to that danger in a high speed chase....phuck em. Cops have enough to worry about and for some idiot to put their lives in danger and John Q citizen by endangering them in a high speed chase ... it's their choice and their fault if they get killed by the cops.
Imagine how many morons would be shot if we lived by this statement.. I would guess after a couple hundred got shot maybe the others would get the word...:idea: And just think how much the crime rates would drop where they did this..:idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

41USCLB
10-04-2007, 10:14 PM
I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post.

41USCLB
10-04-2007, 10:22 PM
I think this quote from A Few Good Men applies here. LE is a dirty job, just like defending a nation. Most people don't have the stomach to know what it takes, so are probably better off not knowing. These cops took a dangerous guy off the streets, so if you're not willing to get your hands dirty, don't criticize those who are. Just say thank you. This was a justified shooting.

socalmoney
10-05-2007, 06:26 AM
Lets get something straight here. I have never passed judgment on whether this shooting was justified or not. I have merely made statements about the safety of the Officers involved. I have responded to other comments that I found to be somewhat outrages but as far as the topic at hand, my intent was to point out that it isn't smart to engage suspects in front of a moving car when they are trying to flee. It is crazy the tangents people go on and the conclusions people draw when reading forum posts. I guess that's why we all keep coming back. I like the open debate so long as there is some intelligent thought put behind the posts. There is often not much of that when it comes to posts about Cops. Nobody here should question my support for Law Enforcement. If you need reasons why, lets meet for a doughnut and coffee.
$

Sleeper CP
10-05-2007, 06:45 AM
Hey $,
So you're okay with post #57?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

socalmoney
10-05-2007, 06:50 AM
Hey $,
So you're okay with post #57?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
Not really. Makes for a good movie though.
Car manufactures need to come up with a way to allow cops to disable the vehicle. But with a statement like that, you have the public all up in arms about big brother being able to control your free will. I doubt the public would be ok with Cops at road blocks with 50 cals.

lawbreaker2
10-05-2007, 06:50 AM
removing scum is a good thing...we need to be more pro-active such as the video. I wish these cops lived closer to my home
Be carefull what you wish for.:idea:
The cop in ohio don't mess around even if you are 5mph over.:mad: But yes, I don't have anything bad to say about them, BUT stop following me around at night.:rolleyes:

BoatPI
10-05-2007, 06:52 AM
The driver will run from the police and endanger the lives of the public again.

Sleeper CP
10-05-2007, 07:04 AM
Not really. Makes for a good movie though.
Car manufactures need to come up with a way to allow cops to disable the vehicle. But with a statement like that, you have the public all up in arms about big brother being able to control your free will. I doubt the public would be ok with Cops at road blocks with 50 cals.
My bet is it would only have to happen a few dozen times and this crap would stop. It probably would only have to happen 10-20 times before they figured out that they where not going to get handled with kid gloves anymore.
And believe me the public will be more comfortable with a few well trained SWAT snipers w/ .50 Cal's than some POS in his stolen car on their streets at 100 mph. Just a thought:idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

02HoWaRd26
10-05-2007, 07:32 AM
W.O.W. is all I can say that looked excessive but again like said by others we were not there but again WOW