Income Tax?

[pw_Tony]

Is there really a law that says you have to pay an income tax?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4440305635073917429&q=american+freedom+of+fascism&total=590&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=2

[SmokinLowriderSS]

I don't actually suggest you try it.
Mr Schiff tried it, among others (http://www.quatloos.com/taxscams/cm-taxpr.htm)
I believe (without a ton of deep digging) that you ARE required to file a signed return. I think there IS law on that one.
That makes you an agreed signatory to the information contained, and the debt disclosed by that informantion.
Failure to pay that agreed upon debt is a punishable offence.

[Sleeper CP]

I'll come visit you in the "Big House".
You can fly under the radar for some time if you: don't have alot of asset's
don't have alot of reportable income(1099's or a 1040's). Not necessarily in that order of importance.
I wouldn't recommend it.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[Moneypitt]

About 25 years ago a friend of mine got drug into this idea. Refuse to pay/file taxes because there is no law requiring it...........Oppps, when the IRS came down on him, the group disappeared like magic and he was left holding his own bag.........Took him several years to get it right, and the penalties alone were more than the original taxes would have been if paid when due.......MP

[YeLLowBoaT]

It should also be noted that Al Capone was never charged with Racketteering... they got him for tax evastion.

[HM]

Every once in a while, these guys get out of jail...make their claims, and go back to jail and take a few new people with them.
Yes, it has been established that not only must you pay taxes, but you must file a tax return. Now, if you legitimately owe no taxes and you haven't filed...there are no penalties for late filing when you owe nothing or the IRS owes you.
The only part of their argument that holds some water is that filing a tax return violates your right with the 5th amendment(The right to choose not to incriminate yourself - the goberment must prove you did something wrong). While some people will argue if you "don't break the law you have nothing to worry about" angle, realize that this country was founded by people wanted by the law! These people(tax dodgers) have a fundamental problem with taxes, and I understand where they are coming from based on how income tax was established as a temporary law to fund a war...and never went away. But, most people realize that we have to pay taxes, not just because the law says we do, but because we can't run a country without taxes. Most of us just have a problem with the stewards of our taxes and where that money goes. I know I'd be a lot happier if I got to choose on my tax return where my tax dollars went.

[Sleeper CP]

) . Most of us just have a problem with the stewards of our taxes and where that money goes. I know I'd be a lot happier if I got to choose on my tax return where my tax dollars went.
Yeah, What he said:)
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Every once in a while, these guys get out of jail...make their claims, and go back to jail and take a few new people with them.
Yes, it has been established that not only must you pay taxes, but you must file a tax return. Now, if you legitimately owe no taxes and you haven't filed...there are no penalties for late filing when you owe nothing or the IRS owes you.
The only part of their argument that holds some water is that filing a tax return violates your right with the 5th amendment(The right to choose not to incriminate yourself - the goberment must prove you did something wrong). While some people will argue if you "don't break the law you have nothing to worry about" angle, realize that this country was founded by people wanted by the law! These people(tax dodgers) have a fundamental problem with taxes, and I understand where they are coming from based on how income tax was established as a temporary law to fund a war...and never went away. But, most people realize that we have to pay taxes, not just because the law says we do, but because we can't run a country without taxes. Most of us just have a problem with the stewards of our taxes and where that money goes. I know I'd be a lot happier if I got to choose on my tax return where my tax dollars went.
Good post Mr. Moly

[pw_Tony]

Oh no you better believe I'm paying my taxes!
Just after watching that video got me thinking that's all. Too many videos now adays have BS in them and you can't tell what to believe. But if there really is no law to pay income tax, and I was rich as a mutha focka, then I would fight against it.
Just an idea :idea:
Very interesting video NTL

[Focker]

Is there really a law that says you have to pay an income tax?
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4440305635073917429&q=american+freedom+of+fascism&total=590&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=2
TOO FOCKEN FUNNY

[SmokinLowriderSS]

They are pretty "interesting", IMO from an "entertaining" standing.
Supposedly Irwin Schiff is “America’s leading untax expert”.
Convicted of attempted tax evasion, 26 U.S.C. § 7201 (1982), and willful failure to file a corporate tax return, 26 U.S.C § 7203 (1982).
He appealed, claiming several errors in the trial court's jury instructions. He argues that the court's instructions erroneously imposed an objective test rather than a subjective test on his good faith defense, effectively amended the indictment to permit a conviction based on uncharged conduct and permitted Schiff to be convicted by a non-unanimous jury.
Appeal lost.
Then, Schiff tried for a reduced or corrected sentence on the grounds that his fee speech and free association rights were being violated, and that by filing a tax returns he was being compelled to testify against him self.
Again, lost.
Then, a year later, he filed suit, REQUESTING A TAX REFUND for 1975.
Yep, lost that one too, and the govt won legal fees sanction for filing a frivilous suit.
Not having had enough fun defeating Uncle Sam, he filed a writ of habeas corpus pursuant to 28 U.S.C. § 2241 to try to get out of jail.
It was found to be without merit. Another loss.
Still game tho, Schiff files a Writ of Mandamus. C/A No. 89-202-E.
"Denied".
He even tried, filing suit to the govt, claiming that "Federal Reserve Notes" were not "dollars", among other constitutional claims.
I guess he liked paying his AND Uncle Sam's attorneys.
Suit denied, with sanction for legal expenses, AGAIN. :idea:
The rest seemed not to have Schiff's staying power.
Tully
Snyder
Bibbs
Scoville
Greene
Treglowne
And so many others.

[sam pioske]

I have a number of friends that have resigned from the Corp. Ca. and the U S .They are driving cars with no Ca tags no Ca. drivers license with a letter from the state that they are O.K. to do so. They do not pay income taxes, sometimes go to court but they know the ropes none of them has ever lost anything. One gal makes couple hundred k$ a year. Some of you know that they use capitols in your name when you belong to the corp. look at your permit to drive ! tax forms etc. Your PRIPER name starts with a capitol and the rest of the letters are lower case. -------------

[Moneypitt]

I have a number of friends that have resigned from the Corp. Ca. and the U S .They are driving cars with no Ca tags no Ca. drivers license with a letter from the state that they are O.K. to do so. They do not pay income taxes, sometimes go to court but they know the ropes none of them has ever lost anything. One gal makes couple hundred k$ a year. Some of you know that they use capitols in your name when you belong to the corp. look at your permit to drive ! tax forms etc. Your PRIPER name starts with a capitol and the rest of the letters are lower case. -------------
Please explain this corp.?.......MP

[Boatcop]

Please explain this corp.?.......MP
Don't bother. It's a scam and illegal.
Just like the goofballs that claim that an American Flag with a fringe is a flag of admiralty, and any court that flys such a flag has no legal authority, except in admiralty cases.
Read all about the various scams people have tried here:
http://www.quatloos.com/taxscams/cm-taxpr.htm
Most of those scams came from the old "Patriot" Movements. Most of those loons are either in prison, dead, or in a secluded cabin in Montana writing a manifesto.

[SmokinLowriderSS]

I have a number of friends that have resigned from the Corp. Ca. and the U S .They are driving cars with no Ca tags no Ca. drivers license with a letter from the state that they are O.K. to do so. They do not pay income taxes, sometimes go to court but they know the ropes none of them has ever lost anything. One gal makes couple hundred k$ a year. Some of you know that they use capitols in your name when you belong to the corp. look at your permit to drive ! tax forms etc. Your PRIPER name starts with a capitol and the rest of the letters are lower case. -------------
Pardon me for mentioning, but NON-US Citizens, must have lisence plates on their vehicles to drive them legally on US roadways.
A Driver's Lisence IS REQUIRED to drive a vehicle on US roadways, Period, don't really care where from.
United States v. Ross, No. 93-1010 (7th Cir. 1995)
Argued that the district court lacked jurisdiction because Indiana is not part of the United States, and because there were no regulations issued to implement the criminal statute under which he was convicted.
United States v. Gardell, No. 93-1916 (1st Cir. 1994)
Argued that he has no obligation to pay taxes because he has "the Status of Freeman and . . . has no Contractual, Quasi-Contractual or implied agreements with the Federal Government."
United States v. McDonald, No. 88-5239 (9th Cir. 1990)
Argued that as a "white, natural born, state citizen," the income tax does not apply to him, that he is not a "person" or a "resident," and that the district court lacked jurisdiction.
McLaughlin v. United States, 832 F.2d 986 (7th Cir. 1987)
Argued that the federal income tax is a contract, and that he didn't owe any tax because he rescinded the contract.
United States v. Drefke, 707 F.2d 978 (8th Cir. 1983)
Argued that he was a "nontaxpayer" because he did not enter a contract for government services, that the district court had no jurisdiction, and that the tax code violated his Fifth and Thirteenth Amendment rights.
And several of the "yellow flag fringe" idiots. They went to jail too.
Have faith sam, your "friends" will find their way there too sooner or later.
Oh, and sam, it's prOper name, not prIper name.
Do fill us in on how this "resigning from the US" BS works, so that we can see the full depth and breadth of the stupidity involved, and locate the folks who are already in prison for this one. I, for 2, and curious, professional curiosity.

[SB]

Good post Holy.
Let me add that technically you are required to report income, so you could have the IRS calculate what is due, and if you don't pay it, they can try to collect it, and if you send in your quarterly amounts or have your taxes deducted, you might get away with not signing a return.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Pardon me for mentioning, but NON-US Citizens, must have lisence plates on their vehicles to drive them legally on US roadways.
A Driver's Lisence IS REQUIRED to drive a vehicle on US roadways, Period, don't really care where from.
And several of the "yellow flag fringe" idiots. They went to jail too.
Have faith sam, your "friends" will find their way there too sooner or later.
Oh, and sam, it's prOper name, not prIper name.
Do fill us in on how this "resigning from the US" BS works, so that we can see the full depth and breadth of the stupidity involved, and locate the folks who are already in prison for this one. I, for 2, and curious, professional curiosity.
Smokin, it's license not lisence :D :D
Please stop the petty sh*t would ya please.

[eliminatedsprinter]

Please stop the petty sh*t would ya please.
Petty pooper....:rolleyes: ;)

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Petty pooper....:rolleyes: ;)
That was funny I have to admit. :D :D

[delemorte]

it may be a "Volentary" tax law but you are required to report all earnings inside the united states. Even non citizens who make a profit in this country have to report any earnings.

[centerhill condor]

to quote Waylon Jennings, "I just write a check and rub my neck and hope they'll go on their way".
Just do it. I may have an interesting story about this soon.
CC