Last run of the year...

[Ken F]

Got to take mine out this evening right before dark! Made 3 good hard passes with the Data-Acquisition System on to get some numbers.
It was an absoutly beautiful eveing on Tablerock, 71 degrees with about a 10 mph headwind and 4-6" chop. Made the first run into the wind, second downwind, and a third into the wind. Ol boat was loving the chop & headwind!
It was really packing air good, and runnin faster than it ever has!
After reading the data, it ran 8-10 mph faster than my best pass all year.
That new Hi-Helix impeller is something else!!!
Tomorrow temps are supposed to drop into the 40's during the day, and 20's at night. Damn...time to winterize her.
Ken F

[jet454boat]

wat speed does she run?

[Jet Hydro]

whats a Hi-Helix impeller :idea: You been to Duanes again? ;)

[Ken F]

LOL...yep sure have Steve. Been living down there for the last 3-4 months doing all the expansion/remodeling on the new building in Shell Knob. Duane has sponsored me this past summer in my first season of racing.
You dunno about the new Hi-Helix?
Ken

[Cs19]

Which hi-helix are you using? I hear AMT makes a high helix now.
Did you pick up or loose any rpm when you changed impellers?

[Rondane]

You dunno about the new Hi-Helix?
Ken
Enlighten us mr. PR!! If this isn't spam i dont know what is.
rondane

[Jet Hydro]

Yea, I know about it as I seen it starting out about 3 years a go. I`ve never tried it but have heard some first hand info from a race out west. I haven't been racing the boat this season with my oldest girl getting sick so I haven't seen it on the track myself. Once she gets stable ((if it doesn't sale first)) I`m sure we will return to boat racing and I`ll know more about it. I was just giving you a little jab ;)

[jetboatperformance]

Ken ,just curious re HP ,rpm and "cut" of the HH and how it affected your rpms vs what/whos (impeller) you had prior Thanks Tom
ps inducer too?

[Ken F]

Okay for a little history. Sorry for taking so long to reply, sometimes work just gets in the way of boating! lol
Last spring, my engine dynoed @ 710 hp on 93 octane with 10.5/1 .
Sometime after the first race, the engine started to go away. According to data gathered over the summers racing we are guessing that it is about 550-600 hp now.
The first race, I was able to turn a stock form Agressor B 59-6100 rpm, and the top speed on the clocks was 96.77 with a 11.066 ET.
Since then because of engine issues, I’d been running around 5700 rpm in the mid 80’s.
At this point, we found a problem with the Aggressor impeller, (cracked vein at the outer edge), and decided to TRY the Hi-Helix. I didn''t want to take a chance running the Agressor any longer for fear it would come apart. We ended up having to cut the Hi-Helix down to what would be shown as a "D" cut on the Berkly chart to get the same rpm desired. With the impeller in "raw" form as it came from AT, (only cut to a D), the boat would turn it 6-6100 rpm. Top speed dropped off 8-10 mph, but ET remained about the same.
The hole shot is astounding as evidenced by this video from Smokin in the cove:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0rQoVa6fkY
I was running the 9 second class and ran a 9.08@83.17 The guy I was racing ran 93.17mph at 8.49 ET trying to run me down.
Since Smokin in the cove, Duane has "massaged" the impeller. This has increased the top speed by 8-10 mph, at basically the to 50 more RPM, but ET is unknown until next spring when we get it back on the track again. Hopefully at Popular Bluff.
Tom, I'm not positive on #'s as I was using Duanes Data Aqusition system most of the summer at the races and didn't bother to keep real close track of numbers and relied on the computer to keep track of things for me. He has each race from this summer on computer, so if you want give him a call, he'd be happy to share anything with you, and yes I do have an inducer.

[Ken F]

From RonJanes sig line
They wouldnt as to why KIWI THUNDER got screwed over by getting scammed into buying parts AGAIN for an already BRAND NEW berkeley "factory race" pump that clearly wasnt needed by a "reputable" con artist. Hitek vasalene? I'll exchange it for common sense.
Kiwi Thunder must have really enjoyed intercourse with Duane as HTP is getting ready to ship him a new boat next month! LOL

[jetboatperformance]

"Quote Ken"At this point, we found a problem with the Aggressor impeller, (cracked vein at the outer edge), and decided to TRY the Hi-Helix. I didn''t want to take a chance running the Agressor any longer for fear it would come apart. We ended up having to cut the Hi-Helix down to what would be shown as a "D" cut on the Berkly chart to get the same rpm desired. With the impeller in "raw" form as it came from AT, (only cut to a D), the boat would turn it 6-6100 rpm. Top speed dropped off 8-10 mph, but ET remained about the same.
NICE !! thanks Ken for the 411 ! Ron (A/T) and I talked at great length yesterday re this Impeller and Duanes work on it ,sounds really promising for big HP motors.I would say its quite an advance indeed Good job guys !
BTW Leaves Hard!!

[Cs19]

Thats interesting you had to cut the helix to a D to get the same RPM as the aggsr B.
boat leaves nice.
Chris

[jweeks123]

Last spring, my engine dynoed @ 710 hp on 93 octane with 10.5/1 ...
The first race, I was able to turn a stock form Agressor B 59-6100 rpm...
At this point, we found a problem with the Aggressor impeller, (cracked vein at the outer edge).you cracked a mag bronz impeller with 710hp :confused: what's with that
jw

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

you cracked a mag bronz impeller with 710hp :confused: what's with that
jw
I did it with less hp:idea: I have pics some where. It never came apart but it did indeed crack. Not to mention the weight of the bronze :eek:

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

Hey Ken, Please elaborate on this hi-helix impeller. Whats it made out of,what brand,etc. Im very curious about it.......

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

The hole shot is astounding as evidenced by this video from Smokin in the cove:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0rQoVa6fkY
.
Nice vid Ken. You are making good progress......

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

From RonJanes sig line
They wouldnt as to why KIWI THUNDER got screwed over by getting scammed into buying parts AGAIN for an already BRAND NEW berkeley "factory race" pump that clearly wasnt needed by a "reputable" con artist. Hitek vasalene? I'll exchange it for common sense.
Kiwi Thunder must have really enjoyed intercourse with Duane as HTP is getting ready to ship him a new boat next month! LOL
Hmmmmmmmm:idea::idea: I guess the reach around and the last kiss made it worth it :D
What kinda hull did he get?

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

That is one sexy azz impeller....................
http://hi-techperformance.com/images/HTP%20Hi-Helix%202400.jpg

[Ken F]

Hey Ken, Please elaborate on this hi-helix impeller. Whats it made out of,what brand,etc. Im very curious about it.......
It's an investment casting made of the finest stainless steel available. (I've watched Duane detail two now, and let me tell you it's some hard stuff!!) Ron of ATJ and Duane have worked on it for about three years now. After several prototypes and testing, ATJ produced the castings, (they are really beautiful castings too) and does the basic machine work.
HTP takes these castings and does the final detail work, indexing the blades, putting his entry on the leading edges of the blades, and changing the exit of the impellers, which can not be easily done by machine. Also Ron told Duane; “we as a production shop can not spend that much time on an impeller. We’ll leave that to the individual pump builder.”
HTP has also produced a new bowl that compliments this impeller. I hope it gets to the market soon too! I can't wait to try one..
JWeeks, there was a casting flaw in it.
CS19- Thanks but really the credit has to go to Duane on that count!
Ken

[Rondane]

How about PR kenny with a script right out of the HTP textbook.:idea: Strange how these have been on the "market" now for almost a year with not much said and you just happen to pick up 10mph with a "detail" on your first try.:rolleyes: A/T impellers are as clean out of the box as you can buy. I'm calling BS on a 10mph detail. You are somethin else with these stories.
rondane

[UBFJ #454]

About this new Hi-Helix Impeller: Simply put, Duane designed the impeller and AMT makes it.
Over the past 3 + years Duane has been working on the design and getting the impeller produced ..... During the lengthy design phase he consulted with various people and incorporated their ideas as he felt they were applicable ... The Design is His with input from Ron and others. Due to the cost of producing quality molds he talked with Ron about AMT producing the units as they, AMT, have an existing casting capability and produce quality parts. After whatever discussions, they came to an arrangement then worked together getting the production bugs worked out and the production molds done resulting in what is now available, The Hi-Helix Impeller. The impeller itself is made of a high quality, hard stainless steel alloy that I believe is propriatiary ... all I know about the alloy is that it is extremely hard and being so, is difficult to work ... takes alot of grinding and time to shape.
As to finishing out a production casting to Race Standards, Duane is the one to do it since it's his design. As Ken has said, AMT is a production shop and cannot allocate the time to do every impeller as a Race Impeller ... They have chosen to leave the Race Prep'ing to individuals whose business that is .....
To date we have run 3 different Hi-Helix Impellers in our boat trying to settle on a cut that suites what we're up to: A full 9.5 Inch, what Duane calls an 'A' Cut and what he calls a 'B' Cut. The only direct comparision I can make is that the impeller we had in our old pump was a 'B', perhaps an ever so slight 'B-' SS Legend and when we put the 'B' Cut Hi-Helix in, it took our motor, with the same Tune, down in rpm more than just a few hundred rpm's ... and put a lot more water thru the pump.
Currently, we are working with Duane to determine just what Cut and Finesse of the blades will best fit what we're trying to do at this time. As I have said on another thread, the combination of our putting in the Hi-Helix, changing to the 'Snoot' from the old Berkeley Droop we were running and 'Tweeking' the Tune of our motor has produced very positive results in our 1/4 Mile Passes ... Our E.T.'s are quicker and our mph's are up considerably. I have all the confidence that as we bring the impeller to the motor and the motor to the impeller and, make the proper hardware adjustments we will be even more competitive.

[jweeks123]

Ron (A/T) and I talked at great length yesterday re this Impeller and Duanes work on it ,sounds really promising for big HP motors.why just big HP motors?
jw

[jweeks123]

Thats interesting you had to cut the helix to a D to get the same RPM as the aggsr B.this is puzzling.
berk "a" is like an aggsr "b" which is like a helix "d". does that mean a racer running a berk "c" would run a helix "f". wouldn't that be a very small impeller
jw

[Ken F]

Well put Jack.
JWeeks,
The agressor pumped more water than a berkley simply put. So, an engine turning say 6000 rpm (peak HP) with a berkley "A" would not turn up to the 6K when replaced with an Agressor "A". That is why they told you to drop a size when going with agressor
These things pump so much more water that mine had to be cut clear down to a "D" cut to get back to the hypothetical 6K. There really needs to be a new chart made up for the Hi-Helix impeller. I was not talking about the charts you have seen on the boards showing RPM and cut on the boards.
I was talking about the chart from Berkley which showed a cross sectional view of an impeller and shows how much to cut off of the impeller to make it an A, B, C, or D cut.
Jack Said "Big HP" engines because you really cannot cut an impeller past a "D" cut and maintain efficency.
As I stated in the first post, as best we can assertain I'm probably around 550-600 hp right now and have trouble turning the "D" cut up to my max HP/RPM.
Hope that clears it up some. I know it's confusing.
Ken

[Warp Speed]

Duane and Brian have been a huge help to me with my project, and as a rookie, I have bothered them quite abit on occasion!!!
I am running one of their new Hi-Helix AA impellars in my boat. I am running an inducer, the AA through a detailed Berk bowl w/stuffer, AT snoot and diverter with 3.187 nozzle insert. I spin it 5700-5800 with 915hp. When we chose the AA (for a family boat) Duane said that we could start there, and could trim it down if we needed more RPM. I am sure my boat may go faster turning 6100-6400 (engine really runs good there), but it is a "family" :D boat and it is nice to cruise at 60mph @3900 rpm's. 50mph is right @ 3500 rpm's, so I can cruise on long runs without killing the valve train.
Going to a 9 vane aggressor bowl and a 300 shot fogger this winter. With a little set-up work and some more balls (the boat is faster than I am right now!) I hope to turn it around 6000 when finished.
Duane said when I started this project that the impellar was designed to "Do more with less!" :idea:
Sounds like he was right!! :D
Thanks again HTP boys!!
Warp Speed ;)

[UBFJ #454]

At this time, my opinion on saying that the Hi-Helix Impeller is only for High Hp Motors is wrong. I say this because this is a new design that is in its infancy in terms of its evolution ... there is still a lot to be learned as to how to best finish the production casting for a particular application. It may well turn out in the end that this design is better suited for motors with more Hp, but, to say it now with so much yet to be learned is really premature.

[jetboatperformance]

At this time, my opinion on saying that the Hi-Helix Impeller is only for High Hp Motors is wrong. I say this because this is a new design that is in its infancy in terms of its evolution ... there is still a lot to be learned as to how to best finish the production casting for a particular application. It may well turn out in the end that this design is better suited for motors with more Hp, but, to say it now with so much yet to be learned is really premature.
Well Stated ,good clarification!! Tom

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

How about PR kenny with a script right out of the HTP textbook.:idea: Strange how these have been on the "market" now for almost a year with not much said and you just happen to pick up 10mph with a "detail" on your first try.:rolleyes: A/T impellers are as clean out of the box as you can buy. I'm calling BS on a 10mph detail. You are somethin else with these stories.
rondane
You would call bullshit if your own son came home with an "A" on the reportcard:rolleyes: Go back to sucking Cokk...........

[Sleeper CP]

How about PR kenny with a script right out of the HTP textbook.:idea: Strange how these have been on the "market" now for almost a year with not much said and you just happen to pick up 10mph with a "detail" on your first try.:rolleyes: A/T impellers are as clean out of the box as you can buy. I'm calling BS on a 10mph detail. You are somethin else with these stories.
rondane
I can tell you this; I lost 8 mph from one AT impeller to another 10 years ago.:( And then after having it blueprinted and trimmed the engine was revving 600 more rpm's and was 4 mph slower:mad: :mad: :confused:
So a 10 mph detail/ blueprint might be possible.:idea: :confused:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[BAE_557]

I switched to the newest generation AMT 9.5 Hi-Helix impeller this year, mine was detailed by MPD.
I have only logged a short 300' pass with the new AMT components, with that said, I noticed a significant increase in how quickly the boat hooked up and how hard it pulled.
-William

[Sleeper CP]

I have only logged a short 300' pass with the new AMT components, with that said, I noticed a significant increase in how quickly the boat hooked up and how hard it pulled.
-William
Hows that "lake boat" project of yours anyway?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[BAE_557]

Hows that "lake boat" project of yours anyway?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
I had been planning to run it up today but unfortunately the water level at Modesto Res is far too low.

[Placecraft Dragstar]

I can tell you this; I lost 8 mph from one AT impeller to another 10 years ago.
They are not the same impeller today, they are alot better. One of AMT impellers today tricked out ( if you know what to do to them ) works very well.

[Sleeper CP]

They are not the same impeller today, they are alot better. One of AMT impellers today tricked out ( if you know what to do to them ) works very well.
I think the AT's were only a couple year's old when we got our first 9.25 AAA.
The boat ran 92-93 mph at 5,200 rpms and 102 on the bottle at 6,000. It ran that way for three or four years until it pealed one of the viens back on the impeller.
The new impeller showed up and with nothing else changed the boat ran 85 -86 mph at 5,200 and the pressure on the intake gauge dropped from 28 psi to 18 psi.,after much descusion we trimmed the impeller back and the boat ran 90 mph at 5,800 and 102 at 6,800 it used to run 102 at 6,000. Needless to say we were not happy. We later purchased a Legend impeller and bowl with just about the same results.
My stainless 9.25 AA is sitting in the garage and the boat has the AT bowl and the Legend impeller in it. Neil from SDPM and I have talked about the AT high helix a couple of times if we hear good info on them it might make me call Jack at MPD and we might give one a shot next year.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
1,000+ HP safley used since 1992:D

[bp]

so what kind of family boat is it?
i may be misunderstanding this, but what are you doing to make 915hp at 5800 rpm? that's a pretty stout number for that rpm...
Duane and Brian have been a huge help to me with my project, and as a rookie, I have bothered them quite abit on occasion!!!
I am running one of their new Hi-Helix AA impellars in my boat. I am running an inducer, the AA through a detailed Berk bowl w/stuffer, AT snoot and diverter with 3.187 nozzle insert. I spin it 5700-5800 with 915hp. When we chose the AA (for a family boat) Duane said that we could start there, and could trim it down if we needed more RPM. I am sure my boat may go faster turning 6100-6400 (engine really runs good there), but it is a "family" :D boat and it is nice to cruise at 60mph @3900 rpm's. 50mph is right @ 3500 rpm's, so I can cruise on long runs without killing the valve train.
Going to a 9 vane aggressor bowl and a 300 shot fogger this winter. With a little set-up work and some more balls (the boat is faster than I am right now!) I hope to turn it around 6000 when finished.
Duane said when I started this project that the impellar was designed to "Do more with less!" :idea:
Sounds like he was right!! :D
Thanks again HTP boys!!
Warp Speed ;)

[jweeks123]

The agressor pumped more water than a berkley simply put. So, an engine turning say 6000 rpm (peak HP) with a berkley "A" would not turn up to the 6K when replaced with an Agressor "A". That is why they told you to drop a size when going with agressor
These things pump so much more water that mine had to be cut clear down to a "D" cut to get back to the hypothetical 6K. There really needs to be a new chart made up for the Hi-Helix impeller. I was not talking about the charts you have seen on the boards showing RPM and cut on the boards.
I was talking about the chart from Berkley which showed a cross sectional view of an impeller and shows how much to cut off of the impeller to make it an A, B, C, or D cut.
Hope that clears it up some. I know it's confusing.
Kenthanks for taking the time to explain ken.
jw

[Jet Hydro]

915hp at 5800 rpm? that's a pretty stout number for that rpm...
I was thinking the same thing ;)

[Cs19]

that's a pretty stout number for that rpm...
Definatly stout but its possible.

[jweeks123]

As I have said on another thread, the combination of
1)our putting in the Hi-Helix,
2)changing to the 'Snoot' from the old Berkeley Droop we were running and
3)'Tweeking' the Tune of our motor
has produced very positive results in our 1/4 Mile Passes ... Our E.T.'s are quicker and our mph's are up considerably.what part of the gain would you attribute to each of the thrre changes you made
jw

[Sleeper CP]

915@ 5,800 ?
So that makes four of us.:idea:
But possible yes? What is it?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[Cs19]

915@ 5,800 ?
So that makes four of us.:idea:
But possible yes? What is it?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
probably a big inch ford
:)

[bp]

Definatly stout but its possible.
not even suggesting it isn't. just curious what he's doing to make that number at 5800, in whatever is considered a family boat. i.e., like jm's hallett????? btw, where did you vanish to yesterday??? nappytime?:D

[Sleeper CP]

probably a big inch ford
:)
I was wondering Cu. in. and if that is N/A or supercharged ? But that is stout:jawdrop:
Sleeper CP
Big Ich Ford Lover

[Warp Speed]

so what kind of family boat is it?
i may be misunderstanding this, but what are you doing to make 915hp at 5800 rpm? that's a pretty stout number for that rpm...
The boat is the '79 TX-20 in my avatar.
The engine is a 600ci pump gas Big Duke.
It is 11.3to1 cr
Ross flat top pistons
278/286-110 .800 lift 4-7 swap comp roller installed @107
Early 1800 big duke heads, chambers and valve job by Sonny's, mild porting @ HMS
Jessel 1.7 rockers
Manton push rods
Cola crank
Eagle 6.535 rods
Dart Tunnel ram
(2) 1100 Pro Systems dominators
MSD crank trigger with 6al box.
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid225/p922bab2eb0f496d8e865ced867e01ca7/e77eaf66.jpg
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid225/p6721e23566e5bdd430b4a0e2cd85f7c7/e77cd119.jpg
I bought the engine local off of racing junk. It was fairly fresh inside, had some decent parts for the money, but looked like it had been put together in a gravel driveway!
It took allot of massaging (all summers worth!) but I thought ran pretty good when it finally made it to the dyno....... for the first three pulls anyway.
We went in to check the lash and make a jet change, and found a couple of intake rockers trying to come apart (early style Jessel with the nylon thrust washer). Needless to say we where done running it for the day.
But that third run it made 942hp @ 6200 and 798lb/ft @5200. I didn't think it was too bad considering that was only 28* timing and still had O2 sensors in each primary tube.
The numbers are high because I quoted the corrected numbers. Don't have the raw numbers in front of me, but I was still happy with the results considering what it is, a bunch of old drag race parts.
I'm just glad it's finally running, even if it is just in time for winter! :(
Warp Speed ;)

[Sleeper CP]

Warp Speed,
Just your everyday engine:rolleyes: for your everyday family jet boat:rolleyes: :D :idea:
That thing is a Monster:devil: :) Are you done with the dyno time?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[Cs19]

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid225/p6721e23566e5bdd430b4a0e2cd85f7c7/e77cd119.jpg
Bad ass Warpspeed, your motor came out very nice, I knew it would with your background. Are the updated rockers torrington thrust?
My 568 12 degree Profiler was similar at that rpm. 920 hp @ 5600

[Warp Speed]

Warp Speed,
Just your everyday engine:rolleyes: for your everyday family jet boat:rolleyes: :D :idea:
That thing is a Monster:devil: :) Are you done with the dyno time?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
Thanks CP,
Like most on here, I want to try and have my cake and eat it too.
Needed room for the 3 of us and a cooler and such, but still wanted semi-modern performance with a retro race boat look.
Going to try and get it back on the pump this winter. Putting a 300hp fogger on it and would like to finish tuning the carbs and get a real timing sweep on it. After the rocker ordeal, I wasn't able to run it on the dyno again so I made some adjustments from the baseline data and got it wet!
Warp Speed ;)

[Warp Speed]

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid225/p6721e23566e5bdd430b4a0e2cd85f7c7/e77cd119.jpg
Bad ass Warpspeed, your motor came out very nice, I knew it would with your background. Are the updated rockers torrington thrust?
My 568 12 degree Profiler was similar at that rpm. 920 hp @ 5600
Thanks CS!
Funny story on the rockers.
I had disassembled all of them and checked the shafts and bearings, replaced some clips ect.. Thought that the intake rockers were a little cheesy with the little nylon thrust washers, and could see where a couple of bodies had touched the stands (due to the last "builder" swaping the thrust washer to the other side to gain pushrod clearance!) but all looked to be in good shape.
After the short dyno session, I called Jessel and they told me (as I am sure most of you guy's know) that it was an old design, and they now have torrington thrust wahsers in the sides of the bodies. He said to save me money he would use my shafts and adjusters, and just charge me for the bodies and labor. I overnighted them up there (red label racin'!) and they updated them to the torrington version the next day. When I called them to find out the damage (project over budget allready!!), they said all I needed to pay for was the return shipping. I about fell over!! I thought that was pretty cool, that even though we haven't used their stuff in a couple years, they still made it right when they knew the original design wasn't!!
That profiler stuff is nice!$$!
920 @ 5600 is runnin', big engines rule!!!! :D
Sorry about the thread jack guy's!
Warp Speed ;)

[Cs19]

Ive had great service in the rebuild dept. over there too, any other dealings with Jesel has been a total nightmare.
Keep an eye on those torringtons, Ive had to have mine rebuilt twice.

[bp]

The boat is the '79 TX-20 in my avatar.
The engine is a 600ci pump gas Big Duke.
It is 11.3to1 cr
Ross flat top pistons
278/286-110 .800 lift 4-7 swap comp roller installed @107
Early 1800 big duke heads, chambers and valve job by Sonny's, mild porting @ HMS
Jessel 1.7 rockers
Manton push rods
Cola crank
Eagle 6.535 rods
Dart Tunnel ram
(2) 1100 Pro Systems dominators
MSD crank trigger with 6al box.
I bought the engine local off of racing junk. It was fairly fresh inside, had some decent parts for the money, but looked like it had been put together in a gravel driveway!
It took allot of massaging (all summers worth!) but I thought ran pretty good when it finally made it to the dyno....... for the first three pulls anyway.
We went in to check the lash and make a jet change, and found a couple of intake rockers trying to come apart (early style Jessel with the nylon thrust washer). Needless to say we where done running it for the day.
But that third run it made 942hp @ 6200 and 798lb/ft @5200. I didn't think it was too bad considering that was only 28* timing and still had O2 sensors in each primary tube.
The numbers are high because I quoted the corrected numbers. Don't have the raw numbers in front of me, but I was still happy with the results considering what it is, a bunch of old drag race parts.
I'm just glad it's finally running, even if it is just in time for winter! :(
Warp Speed ;)
thanks for the info. not the "average" family boat engine:) . do you plan to do anything else, such as set the pump back?.

[Sleeper CP]

BP,
Do you know much or anything about the Hi -Helix impeler design?
Sleeper CP

[UBFJ #454]

what part of the gain would you attribute to each of the three changes you made
jw
'Rough Guesstimate':
1) 70% ... Note here thay we also changed bowls from an older Race Prep'd Berkeley to a Hi-Tech Race Prep'd Dominator ... 'Hi-Helix' & Dominator Bowl, a combination 'I'm Sold On',
2) 20% (Helped stabilize both the Launch & Runnung Trim),
3) 10% (Resulting in More 'Giddy Up & GO').

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

Definatly stout but its possible.
Sure is,Just stop by DNE motorsports;) Dave can do it with his eyes closed. But then again, you already know this Chris :)
Spitter

[Warp Speed]

One thing I do know about the Hi-Helix impellar is that it moves a TON of water at idle!!!
I have my engine idle set at 1400-1500 and when you move the bucket to a neutral or reverse position it sprays water every where. I have to have the diverter all the way up to keep from spraying into the boat.
Is this just a product of the hi-helix AA with inducer / high idle or am I doing something else wrong? The diverter is an AT.
http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd120/warpspeed_01/100_2706.jpg
Warp Speed ;)

[Rondane]

One thing I do know about the Hi-Helix impellar is that it moves a TON of water at idle!!!
I think the TON of water is more of the fact you have a AA impeller in a lightweight boat rather than anything else...... :rolleyes: How much speed/ET did you pick up from going from your original AA impeller to this new one?? That is if you originally had a AA and got the "race detail" on the new one.
How did your boat run with a droop?
rondane

[Warp Speed]

I think the TON of water is more of the fact you have a AA impeller in a lightweight boat rather than anything else...... :rolleyes: How much speed/ET did you pick up from going from your original AA impeller to this new one?? That is if you originally had a AA and got the "race detail" on the new one.
How did your boat run with a droop?
rondane
Thought it might just be the hi-helix AA and inducer in a tight pump, coupled with a high idle that was sending so much water. Wanted to make sure it was the nature of the beast and that I wasn't doing something wrong at the diverter end to make it spray everywere.
Little confused on the weight of the boat effecting the flow at idle?
Had a 496 idling at 800rpm's with a loosely set pump/A impellar before so I have nothing to compare it to.
The boat came with the AT snoot on it so I haven't ever ran it with a droop. Since the pic above I have went from 4* to 2.5* on the ride plate and added 3 more degrees of wedge to the snoot and it has picked the boat up a ton in both speed and drivability.
Warp Speed ;)

[Ken F]

WS-
They do pump a lot of water, but I'd think your idle speed has more to do with it. Why is it idleing that high? I've got a pretty big cam, and about 1100rpm is about where mines happy.
As far as spraying the back of your boat, it would be hard to tell. Best thing to do would be to have someone drive, and get back there and see if you can tell where it's coming from. Doesn't sound right though.
Ken

[UBFJ #454]

The 'Hi-Helix' Impeller moves considerably more water than the older type impellers regardless of cut ... This is what it was designed to do. The reason it moves more water, without going into a bunch of technical jargon, is the the curvature (Pitch) of the impeller blades ('Hi-Helix') is much more aggressive than those in the older style impellers ... It's the same as with props: Aggressive props have a more aggressive Pitch (higher angle of attack) and 'Bite Harder' thereby moving more water per unit of time than do flatter pitch ones.

[Duane HTP]

WARP SPEED Here's one way to stop the splash back problem. Note the Plate.
http://www.hi-techperformance.com/images/Ready%204%20St%20Louis%20434.jpg

[Duane HTP]

Found better picture.
http://www.hi-techperformance.com/Ready%204%20St%20Louis%20435.jpg

[jweeks123]

is splash back a common problen with amer turb nozzle?
jw

[396_WAYS_TO_SPIT]

What is "Hi-Helix"? Is it the material or the way its made?

[Sleeper CP]

What is "Hi-Helix"? Is it the material or the way its made?
Did you get a chance to read post 58 :idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[UBFJ #454]

A 'Helix' is a twisted solid shape ..... Technical Defination of a 'Helix':
The prefix Hi added to Helix, making Hi-Helix, simply means a high angle helix. In this case it actually refers to a high angle Helicoid ( [URL=]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicoid (] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helix[/URL)) shape of the impeller blades.

[ol guy]

Great looking impellar. If I may add a suggestion, Water flows best on water. A very light bead blast to take out the polish may add a pinch. Not enough to create a cavitation but enough to let the impellar to hold a SMALL amount of water in a poruse area and to flow better????????????????

[Ken F]

Ol guy,
I agree with your thought process, but would this also apply under pressure?
If this were the case, why do they polish props? Dunno, just thinking out loud here....
I totally agree such as on a boat bottom though.
Maybe someone will chime in here and enllighten us!
Ken

[STRETCH]

is splash back a common problen with amer turb nozzle?
jw
I now have the same question.. I have the very same setup and only idle at 800 rpm, but experience splash back on a regular basis (probably not near as much as high HP engine). Never enough to be concerned about, but does pose the question.

[Jet Hydro]

"Yes" it`s a common problem with the snoot set-up but as Duane posted, there`s the easy fix in those pictures. ;)

[Duane HTP]

Yes" it`s a common problem with the snoot set-up but as Duane posted, there`s the easy fix in those pictures.
It is not a Snoot Problem. The splash problem is created by the type of nozzle.

[Jet Hydro]

yea, the type of nozzle that is used on the snoot thus why I posted the "Set-Up" :) and it`s really the bucket that causes the problem so Ha :D

[Duane HTP]

Let me see if I can clearify this for you a little bit Steve. The type of nozzle that causes the splash problem is the type that is used on the ATJ extension. That is what you have. The Snoot that I build does not use that type of nozzle. They were built so the people with the Berkeley, Dominator, Aggressor, etc nozzles could benifit from the extension of the pump also. They do not have that splash back effect.

[Warp Speed]

Let me see if I can clearify this for you a little bit Steve. The type of nozzle that causes the splash problem is the type that is used on the ATJ extension. That is what you have. The Snoot that I build does not use that type of nozzle. They were built so the people with the Berkeley, Dominator, Aggressor, etc nozzles could benifit from the extension of the pump also. They do not have that splash back effect.
I was wondering about that and is why I mentioned it in the first place. I have a friend with a tunnel dragster that just put a snoot on from a droop and has none of these problems. He has a HTP snoot/Place diverter and I have an AT .
So it is in the nozzle/bucket design of the AT, and is compounded in my case by the combination of high idle / Hi-Helix aa impellar!?!
Thanks Duane.
Wonder if Ken ever thought his "last run" would take so long, or have so many turns in it?!? :idea:
Warp Speed ;)

[Duane HTP]

You got it. But the plate like in the pictures in the above posts solves the problem.

[Ken F]

Wonder if Ken ever thought his "last run" would take so long, or have so many turns in it?!? :idea:
Warp Speed ;)
LOL...It was a long time & lots of turns just getting TO the last run bud!
there's been a lot of good info shared here, all in a positive manner.
Reminds me of the olden days of ***boat!
Ken

[Jet Hydro]

Let me see if I can clearify this for you a little bit Steve. The type of nozzle that causes the splash problem is the type that is used on the ATJ extension. That is what you have. The Snoot that I build does not use that type of nozzle. They were built so the people with the Berkeley, Dominator, Aggressor, etc nozzles could benifit from the extension of the pump also. They do not have that splash back effect.
I`m thinking this is the same one I use, is it not?
http://www.hi-techperformance.com/Ready%204%20St%20Louis%20435.jpg
:idea: I was pointing out that "IF" they are talking about the "SET-UP" you posted the picture of "The same one I run" that the pitcure showed what to do to fix the problem. Sorry I called it a Snoot, it`s the ATJ extension, My Bad ;) I do that some times....rotflmao :)
I remember when I made my first billet extension you thought I was crazy...lol
Then you saw how it worked and we started using the ATJ cast extension off Ricks boat :D
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497P1040399-med.JPG
:idea: You know I never did try my billet extension with the ATJ cast extension....hummmmmmmm :eek: :)
I think I better go back to working on the dragster :D
BTW....Duane I was told to tell you and Barb "HI" from one of your old friends out of "Abby Vill" but I`ll be damned if I can remember his name. His wife worked with my mom at the Gas Co. here in town for years. I was doing a plumbing job for em and we got to talking drag boats after he saw my 1 ton with the stickers on it. I`ll get his name from my mom as she also knows him. He has a bunch of big $$$$ horses, maybe that will help ya remember his name? It`s a small world isnt it .....lmao

[sanger rat]

:idea: You know I never did try my billet extension with the ATJ cast extension....hummmmmmmm :eek: :)
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/8269gbMdzbkg8VYN-SCe6SRFIR7bennPcnXT0300.jpg ;)

[Jet Hydro]

I was just joking ;) it`s been there :D I just dont have it on there right now :D BTW you`ve come a long ways :D
Now you just need to get one of these motors ;)
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497P1040401-med.JPG

[sanger rat]

Still lots of things to try yet. It's getting there.:)

[sanger rat]

Now you just need to get one of these motors ;)
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/15497P1040401-med.JPG
Like this? :D http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/8269100_1497.jpg

[American Turbine Man]

One thing I do know about the Hi-Helix impellar is that it moves a TON of water at idle!!!
I have my engine idle set at 1400-1500 and when you move the bucket to a neutral or reverse position it sprays water every where. I have to have the diverter all the way up to keep from spraying into the boat.
Is this just a product of the hi-helix AA with inducer / high idle or am I doing something else wrong? The diverter is an AT.
http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd120/warpspeed_01/100_2706.jpg
Warp Speed ;)
The design of the reverse bucket causes spray-back at idle speeds above 1000 RPM's. The cure is a deflector, like the photo in Duane's post. We have a new trim that uses an old style bucket.
Call me 800 622 JETS I have a question about your boat/ engine/ High Helix, set up.
ATM
(Ron)

[Jet Hydro]

Yep one of them things ;)
:idea: I`m gonna pull mine and put it in my dragster so I can see what 1200 HP does on land in April. Then It`s goning back in the boat for next season. My oldest Girl took my Camaro away from me so I had to buy a new dragster to play with while she races the camaro. :) This could be a fun season coming up :D

[sanger rat]

Wish you luck with your Dragster. I need to pick your brain sometime this winter.:idea:

[Jet Hydro]

I`ll be in and out of the shop all winter as the plumbing biz has kept me pretty bussy the last 2 years. I think you`ve got my cell number, if not pm me and I`ll give it to ya. :)

[jdf]

hey is duane up and running in the new shop ??? if so may need to bring a toy up there

[UBFJ #454]

He sure is ... 1 (417) 858-8618.

[Duane HTP]

You Bet we're up and running? Bring us your toy.

[jdf]

will do i will call in the am ..tmorrow