Stem cell research

[FOXMAN]

Now that a UW Madison scientist has found a way to use skin cells instead of embryo cells, what will be then next road block put up by the government to slow down research?? One wonders where they would be at if not for our elected officials.

[bigq]

Don't know why they would have a problem with skin cells?
How are they slowing down research anyway, the private sector continues the research the gov just won't fund it.:confused:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Don't know why they would have a problem with skin cells?
How are they slowing down research anyway, the private sector continues the research the gov just won't fund it.:confused:
Considering how much money our Govt wastes, throwing a few bones behind stem cell research seems like the least the Feds could do. IMO, this is something that should be at the top of our game.

[Blown 472]

Considering how much money our Govt wastes, throwing a few bones behind stem cell research seems like the least the Feds could do. IMO, this is something that should be at the top of our game.
Cant make those good god fearin christians mad now. How many billions wasted to kill people that could have been used to save lives. Sad.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Cant make those good god fearin christians mad now. How many billions wasted to kill people that could have been used to save lives. Sad.
That's what I'm talkin' about. It is sad.

[Old Texan]

Here we go with another Political ball tossed into the air to be batted around aimlessly well attached to conspiracy theory and another attempt to keep the little man down.
"Stem Cell Research", the cure all for everything from Aids to the common cold, stifled once again by those in the White House keeping immortality to themselves. :rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Here we go with another Political ball tossed into the air to be batted around aimlessly well attached to conspiracy theory and another attempt to keep the little man down.
"Stem Cell Research", the cure all for everything from Aids to the common cold, stifled once again by those in the White House keeping immortality to themselves. :rolleyes:
Great response Tex :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
In your eyes "Stem Cell Research" falls in the same category with Global warming. Denial must be a warm, fuzzy and safe place to hide.

[Old Texan]

Great response Tex :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
In your eyes "Stem Cell Research" falls in the same category with Global warming. Denial must be a warm, fuzzy and safe place to hide.
There you go making assumptions again.
The whole controversy lies in the source of the stem cells. The Liberals again spin the whole issue into a "Bush Bash". Stem cell research is alive and well, it just isn't the Holy Grail of cure alls the Bush detractors make it out to be. The issue is more cannon fodder for you Bushie haters.
Tell us where stem cell research is being decimated so badly by lack of funding????? I'm sure you can come up with some Michael J. Fox and John Edwards quotes to enlighten us with.

[centerhill condor]

You have stem cells that can be manipulated for the advancement of science without the religious outrage.
I thought we already killed this chicken back in 10/06....not really news now is it?
CC

[ULTRA26 # 1]

There you go making assumptions again.
The whole controversy lies in the source of the stem cells. The Liberals again spin the whole issue into a "Bush Bash". Stem cell research is alive and well, it just isn't the Holy Grail of cure alls the Bush detractors make it out to be. The issue is more cannon fodder for you Bushie haters.
Tell us where stem cell research is being decimated so badly by lack of funding????? I'm sure you can come up with some Michael J. Fox and John Edwards quotes to enlighten us with.
Talk about spinning.
Considering how much money our Govt wastes, throwing a few bones behind stem cell research seems like the least the Feds could do. IMO, this is something that should be at the top of our game.
The above pretty much states how I feel about the issue.
We all know where the controversy lies Tex and that support or lack thereof is based on pro-life or pro-choice, Christian Right or not. Just to clarify, I am anti-abortion but pro-choice.
I am saying that this science needs more Federal funding. Sarcastic use of MJ Fox, is par. :rolleyes:

[Schiada76]

Here we go with another Political ball tossed into the air to be batted around aimlessly well attached to conspiracy theory and another attempt to keep the little man down.
"Stem Cell Research", the cure all for everything from Aids to the common cold, stifled once again by those in the White House keeping immortality to themselves. :rolleyes:
First the libs would need to know the difference between adult stem cell research and fetal stem cells. That'll never happen.:rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

First the libs would need to know the difference between adult stem cell research and fetal stem cells. That'll never happen.:rolleyes:
I'm surprised to hear you chime in on this. Are you a pro-life atheist?

[Old Texan]

Abortion is another big waste of air time. It should be a State issue, not a federal issue and it is continually being used as an issue of electing a President. I personally could care less about how a Presidential candidate views abortion. The office of President of the USA is beyond the issue of abortion rights, too many major issues need attention. If as you have stated before, feel Abortion Rights are a major campaign issue, we are in complete disagreement.
Ultra if you want to follow around in the footsteps of Fox and Edwards feel free, but you are missing the whole point. This research is far better off being done in the private sector and doesn't need government bureaucracy to inhibit work. You claim to want less government in our lives but continue to push for government funding and intervention in every facet of our society.
And what is sarcastic about bringing MJ Fox into the conversation, he "is" one of the spokesmen for the subject, touting the need to for more work. I just haven't seen the evidence that Stem Cells are the great cure all he claims and disagree that the problem is lack of "Federal Funding". If the private sector turns up any real progress, I'm sure funding will be there. You're naive if you think otherwise.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Abortion is another big waste of air time. It should be a State issue, not a federal issue and it is continually being used as an issue of electing a President. I personally could care less about how a Presidential candidate views abortion. The office of President of the USA is beyond the issue of abortion rights, too many major issues need attention. If as you have stated before, feel Abortion Rights are a major campaign issue, we are in complete disagreement.
Ultra if you want to follow around in the footsteps of Fox and Edwards feel free, but you are missing the whole point. This research is far better off being done in the private sector and doesn't need government bureaucracy to inhibit work. You claim to want less government in our lives but continue to push for government funding and intervention in every facet of our society.
And what is sarcastic about bringing MJ Fox into the conversation, he "is" one of the spokesmen for the subject, touting the need to for more work. I just haven't seen the evidence that Stem Cells are the great cure all he claims and disagree that the problem is lack of "Federal Funding". If the private sector turns up any real progress, I'm sure funding will be there. You're naive if you think otherwise.
This research is far better off being done in the private sector and doesn't need government bureaucracy to inhibit work. You claim to want less government in our lives but continue to push for government funding and intervention in every facet of our society
More Federal funding is my point. Just as I believe that there should be more Federal funding in finding cures for cancer, as well. Noone said anything about intervention.
You're naive if you think otherwise The great and powerful Tex has spoken. :)

[eliminatedsprinter]

This research is far better off being done in the private sector and doesn't need government bureaucracy to inhibit work. You claim to want less government in our lives but continue to push for government funding and intervention in every facet of our society
More Federal funding is my point. Just as I believe that there should be more Federal funding in finding cures for cancer, as well. Noone said anything about intervention.
You're naive if you think otherwise The great and powerful Tex has spoken. :)
More control of the purstrings = more absolute control. The gov never gives funding without bureaucratic interference.:idea:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

More control of the purstrings = more absolute control. The gov never gives funding without bureaucratic interference.:idea:
Are there not Federal grants where the Govt doesn't get overly involved? Seems there are.

[Old Texan]

Are there not Federal grants where the Govt doesn't get overly involved? Seems there are.
Naive or just argumentative? The private sector has plenty of funding for result oriented research. Government grants too many times just keep the program in motion regrdless of results.
Question for ya.... If you have a serious disease which doesn't have a cure and you are mega rich, who are you going to give your money to for the development of a cure, the best research scientists money can buy or turn your bucks over to a government grant facility on some name campus or foundation using grad assistants and tenured professors?

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Naive or just argumentative? The private sector has plenty of funding for result oriented research. Government grants too many times just keep the program in motion regrdless of results.
Question for ya.... If you have a serious disease which doesn't have a cure and you are mega rich, who are you going to give your money to for the development of a cure, the best research scientists money can buy or turn your bucks over to a government grant facility on some name campus or foundation using grad assistants and tenured professors?
Again, do as I say and not as I do. You're getting good at this. Not naive or argumentative. I have a valid point whether you accept it or not.
Sorry I don't believe in privatized everything Tex. You just keep supporting billions being spent on war, and I will continue to ask that some of our taxes get directed at a few more positive causes. And you call me naive?
You folks in TX march to a different drummer, than the rest of the nation. We are all aware of this.
You need to get over believing that you have the only valid opinion.

[Schiada76]

I'm surprised to hear you chime in on this. Are you a pro-life atheist?
I think abortion should be MANDATORY if you can't show the financial wherewithal to raise a child.:devil:
What is it with you libs and your fascination with killing babies anyway?

[Schiada76]

Notice, ulib makes no attempt at debating adult vs fetal stemcells.:rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

I think abortion should be MANDATORY if you can't show the financial wherewithal to raise a child.:devil:
What is it with you libs and your fascination with killing babies anyway?
Killing babies, you're a riot.
Notice, ulib makes no attempt at debating adult vs fetal stemcells.:rolleyes:
fetal stemcells?
This is a new twist. fetal
What do you want to debate?

[Old Texan]

Again, do as I say and not as I do. You're getting good at this. Not naive or argumentative. I have a valid point whether you accept it or not.
Sorry I don't believe in privatized everything Tex. You just keep supporting billions being spent on war, and I will continue to ask that some of our taxes get directed at a few more positive causes. And you call me naive?
You folks in TX march to a different drummer, than the rest of the nation. We are all aware of this.
You need to get over believing that you have the only valid opinion.
Lots of opinions out there, some good, some bad. I just don't agree with yours.
Sorry you have a hard on for TX, it's just hell living in a Republican controlled conservative environment. And as to the different drummer, different than whom? Liberal CA or the rest of the country?
By the way you didn't answer my question on finding the cure to the diease. Don't care to share?
Also where did I state I support spending billions of Bucks on the War? My whole view of the war is to get it over with as quickly as possible and do it the right way, not an ongoing political chaos like we have now.

[Old Texan]

I think abortion should be MANDATORY if you can't show the financial wherewithal to raise a child.:devil:
What is it with you libs and your fascination with killing babies anyway?
We got Joe Horn and his shotgun to solve that problem. Kill em' in the womb or kill 'em while committing a crime later on.......:devil:
What is it with you libs and your fascination with killing babies anyway?
It's one of those "commune" things from the '60s........:eek:

[058]

Federal Funding....The answer to ALL our social ills.:rolleyes: Another Hillary Kool-Aid drinker.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Lots of opinions out there, some good, some bad. I just don't agree with yours.
Sorry you have a hard on for TX, it's just hell living in a Republican controlled conservative environment. And as to the different drummer, different than whom? Liberal CA or the rest of the country?
By the way you didn't answer my question on finding the cure to the diease. Don't care to share?
Also where did I state I support spending billions of Bucks on the War? My whole view of the war is to get it over with as quickly as possible and do it the right way, not an ongoing political chaos like we have now.
Fact is Tex, a good many of the folks in or from TX aren't nearly as conservative as you are. I never met a Texan that I didn't like.
Different drummer with regard to law enforcement. I was clear when I said rest of the country, wasn't I? I didn't ask you to agree with me, as you usually don't.
Federal Funding....The answer to ALL our social ills.:rolleyes: Another Hillary Kool-Aid drinker.
Hardly

[Old Texan]

Fact is Tex, a good many of the folks in or from TX aren't nearly as conservative as you are. I never met a Texan that I didn't like.
Different drummer with regard to law enforcement. I was clear when I said rest of the country, wasn't I? I didn't ask you to agree with me, as you usually don't.
I'm not nearly as conservative as you think I am. Hell our Liberals are more conservative than you give them credit for, unless you get up around Austin where we keep our tree huggers pretty well confined and have sport with 'em.:devil: :D
Still no answer?
In case you overlooked it:
Question for ya.... If you have a serious disease which doesn't have a cure and you are mega rich, who are you going to give your money to for the development of a cure, the best research scientists money can buy or turn your bucks over to a government grant facility on some name campus or foundation using grad assistants and tenured professors?

[eliminatedsprinter]

Are there not Federal grants where the Govt doesn't get overly involved? Seems there are.
There are many research grants, but the amount of red tape seems to grow on a daily basis.

[Schiada76]

Killing babies, you're a riot.
fetal stemcells?
This is a new twist. fetal
What do you want to debate?
New twist? WTF is wrong with you? That's what the ENTIRE debate IS about.
Federal funding for cloning humans just for fetal stem cells is THE cutting issue.
Pick up a newspaper once in awhile.
Jesus Christ, you really have no idea that this was what the whole Micheal J Fox staged commercial was about do you??
At least have the balls to call abortion what it is, it's killing babies whether you're an atheist or not.

[eliminatedsprinter]

I personally have no problem with any major type of stem cell research. However, a great many Americians do have problems with some types of stem cell usage. Therefore, I feel the government should butt out and let the private sector do it...

[Old Texan]

I personally have no problem with any major type of stem cell research. However, a great many Americians do have problems with some types of stem cell usage. Therefore, I feel the government should butt out and let the private sector do it...
Agreed by the representative from the "Great State of Texas" where men are men and Libs are target practice....:devil:
On a serious note ES, I believe your right opinion is right on.

[Old Texan]

New twist? WTF is wrong with you? That's what the ENTIRE debate IS about.
Federal funding for cloning humans just for fetal stem cells is THE cutting issue.
Pick up a newspaper once in awhile.
Jesus Christ, you really have no idea that this was what the whole Micheal J Fox staged commercial was about do you??
At least have the balls to call abortion what it is, it's killing babies whether you're an atheist or not.
Makes you believe he rode that lil' short bus to the other school where the kids were a little bit slow.:D
I got the same confusion when he claimed Fox was irrelevant to the topic. Heel Fox could be the chairman of the topic....:rolleyes:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

New twist? WTF is wrong with you? That's what the ENTIRE debate IS about.
Federal funding for cloning humans just for fetal stem cells is THE cutting issue.
Pick up a newspaper once in awhile.
Jesus Christ, you really have no idea that this was what the whole Micheal J Fox staged commercial was about do you??
At least have the balls to call abortion what it is, it's killing babies whether you're an atheist or not.
It is normally referred to as Embryonic Stem Cell research , but you you like to bend the facts into something they're not.
fetus
Main Entry: fe·tus
Pronunciation: \ˈfē-təs\
Function: noun
an unborn or unhatched vertebrate especially after attaining the basic structural plan of its kind; specifically : a developing human from usually two months after conception to birth
embryo
Main Entry: em·bryo
Pronunciation: \ˈem-brē-ˌō\
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural em·bry·os
1 aarchaic : a vertebrate at any stage of development prior to birth or hatching b: an animal in the early stages of growth and differentiation that are characterized by cleavage, the laying down of fundamental tissues, and the formation of primitive organs and organ systems; especially : the developing human individual from the time of implantation to the end of the eighth week after conception
2: the young sporophyte of a seed plant usually comprising a rudimentary plant with plumule, radicle, and cotyledons
3 a: something as yet undeveloped b: a beginning or undeveloped state of something <productions seen in embryo during their out-of-town tryout period — Henry Hewes>
There is a difference between an enbryo and a fetus, by defintion. Duh!!
You still whining about MJ Fox not taking his meds. WWWWWWWAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH
It ain't killing babies and I'm not an atheist. That's you remember.
Stagged WWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH

[Schiada76]

It is normally referred to as Embryonic Stem Cell research , but you you like to bend the facts into something they're not.
fetus
Main Entry: fe·tus
Pronunciation: \ˈfē-təs\
Function: noun
an unborn or unhatched vertebrate especially after attaining the basic structural plan of its kind; specifically : a developing human from usually two months after conception to birth
embryo
Main Entry: em·bryo
Pronunciation: \ˈem-brē-ˌō\
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural em·bry·os
1 aarchaic : a vertebrate at any stage of development prior to birth or hatching b: an animal in the early stages of growth and differentiation that are characterized by cleavage, the laying down of fundamental tissues, and the formation of primitive organs and organ systems; especially : the developing human individual from the time of implantation to the end of the eighth week after conception
2: the young sporophyte of a seed plant usually comprising a rudimentary plant with plumule, radicle, and cotyledons
3 a: something as yet undeveloped b: a beginning or undeveloped state of something <productions seen in embryo during their out-of-town tryout period — Henry Hewes>
There is a difference between an enbryo and a fetus, by defintion. Duh!!
You still whining about MJ Fox not taking his meds. WWWWWWWAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH
It ain't killing babies and I'm not an atheist. That's you remember.
Stagged WWWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH
Are you retarded?
Fetal Stem Cells in Modern-day Science
By Caitlin Chapman
An ActionBioscience.org original article
articlehighlights
The use of fetal stem cells for medical research is a hotly debated issue because some equate it to abortion. However, fetal stem cells:
Just the first thing that came up on google not relavant other than the obvious.
No one here whines but you and the MJF reference is relevent, cloning humans for fetal stem cell research was the reason behind the staged commercial.
Why don't you have the balls to call it abortion what it is, killing babies?
Serious question.

[Schiada76]

Makes you believe he rode that lil' short bus to the other school where the kids were a little bit slow.:D
I got the same confusion when he claimed Fox was irrelevant to the topic. Heel Fox could be the chairman of the topic....:rolleyes:
I wasn't going to respond to his vapid posts anymore but I still can't believe how stupid he really is. I keep thinking he's just got to be misinformed.:rolleyes: :D

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Are you retarded?
Fetal Stem Cells in Modern-day Science
By Caitlin Chapman
An ActionBioscience.org original article
articlehighlights
The use of fetal stem cells for medical research is a hotly debated issue because some equate it to abortion. However, fetal stem cells:
Just the first thing that came up on google not relavant other than the obvious.
No one here whines but you and the MJF reference is relevent, cloning humans for fetal stem cell research was the reason behind the staged commercial.
Why don't you have the balls to call it abortion what it is, killing babies?
Serious question.
Why don't you have the balls to call it abortion what it is, killing babies?
Serious question
Simple. Because I don't believe that it is.
You you've gotten worse than Blown used to be.
Call things what you want. Stagged commercials, killing babies. The level of ignorance that you display is very annoying, but then you know that and love it. Must be nice to be smart as you.
See ya

[Schiada76]

Why don't you have the balls to call it abortion what it is, killing babies?
Serious question
Simple. Because I don't believe that it is.
You you've gotten worse than Blown used to be.
Call things what you want. Stagged commercials, killing babies. The level of ignorance that you display is very annoying, but then you know that and love it. Must be nice to be smart as you.
See ya
Ignorance of what?
Fetal stem cells?
Cloning humans?
Federal government funding of human cloning?
The commericial was staged Ultra, made the guy that funded it a billionaire.
You knew that though didn't you?

[Old Texan]

Ultra- Ya forget my question???????

[ULTRA26 # 1]

Ultra- Ya forget my question???????
If I was mega rich, as the question asks, I'd be giving money to both. The best scientists money can buy aren't always the best scientists.
http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/07/19/stemcells.veto/index.html
Bush veto'd it so it must be bad

[Schiada76]

DAMN THAT GW!!!!!
With one stroke of the pen he's prevented mankind from finding the cure for every disease on the planet!!!:mad: :confused: :rolleyes: :D :D

[centerhill condor]

ya'll amaze me...somebody posts a thread about finding a way around the fed funding ban on embryonic stem cell research and continue to fight about it.
I say whoopeee!
The right wing christians, to which I belong, didn't agree with embryonic research, cloning, invitro, etc...'cause mankind doesn't know anything other than he has a new toy.
So here we are, 30 years into the future and we have these incredible moral delimas...when a couple divorces who gets the fertilized eggs? So, now we have a sea of fertilized eggs that nobody wants and can't be "destroyed"...what now...it would have been nice to answer this and other questions before we lit the fuse.
This is different from abortion and really clarifies the issue...they aren't "a woman's body"...they are in fact humans in limbo. Somebody's kids, grandkids, etc.
Stem cells...wow. literally God's tools for life. Remarkably akin to atoms...God's building blocks.
Type what you want about politics...but man has always tried and succeeded in destroying himself with every tool he grasps.
As usual, our problems aren't technical rather political.
CC

[Old Texan]

If I was mega rich, as the question asks, I'd be giving money to both. The best scientists money can buy aren't always the best scientists.
Bush veto'd it so it must be bad
"The best scientists money can buy aren't always the best scientists."
So let's get this straight. You are rich beyond all others, sick and dying from a thus far incurable disease, you have the ability to scour the world and hire the best scientists and medical researchers available, BUT you can't admit that you would do everything with your wealth to insure you have the best to find YOUR cure?????????????:confused:
Why aren't the highest paid the best? You have the money and the power to get the best by giving them whatever they want and need to perform the research to find YOUR cure. Why aren't you hiring the best recruiters to get you the best scientists???????:confused:
Giving money to institutions that may or may not produce the best results when you have the opportunity with YOUR wealth to fund the best???????:confused:
Now I've heard it all, you would allow yourself to perhaps die rather than agree with me that given all the resources in the world, it would be best to help yourself by establishing the most effective and efficient medical research team and facility in the world to save your own asse. Rely on the government to fund the research that holds YOUR life it it's hands, OH puhlease.......And then somehow blame it on Bush.........:rolleyes:
Ultra I think you've been out in the sun too long there Bud.....:devil:

[ULTRA26 # 1]

"The best scientists money can buy aren't always the best scientists."
So let's get this straight. You are rich beyond all others, sick and dying from a thus far incurable disease, you have the ability to scour the world and hire the best scientists and medical researchers available, BUT you can't admit that you would do everything with your wealth to insure you have the best to find YOUR cure?????????????:confused:
Why aren't the highest paid the best? You have the money and the power to get the best by giving them whatever they want and need to perform the research to find YOUR cure. Why aren't you hiring the best recruiters to get you the best scientists???????:confused:
Giving money to institutions that may or may not produce the best results when you have the opportunity with YOUR wealth to fund the best???????:confused:
Now I've heard it all, you would allow yourself to perhaps die rather than agree with me that given all the resources in the world, it would be best to help yourself by establishing the most effective and efficient medical research team and facility in the world to save your own asse. Rely on the government to fund the research that holds YOUR life it it's hands, OH puhlease.......And then somehow blame it on Bush.........:rolleyes:
Ultra I think you've been out in the sun too long there Bud.....:devil:
What was my answer Tex?

[Old Texan]

What was my answer Tex?
That you'd give money to both. You made no clear choice.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

That you'd give money to both. You made no clear choice.
Question for ya.... If you have a serious disease which doesn't have a cure and you are mega rich, who are you going to give your money to for the development of a cure, the best research scientists money can buy or turn your bucks over to a government grant facility on some name campus or foundation using grad assistants and tenured professors?
Your question didn't ask for a clear choice Many of the best cancer doctors and facilities are involved with University medical centers. The best research developments are not necessarily coming from the high dollar private facilities. Bottom line it that if I contract a decease that has no cure, chances are it's over, and all the money in the world isn't going to change that.
Sorry my answer isn't to your liking.

[Old Texan]

Your question didn't ask for a clear choice Many of the best cancer doctors and facilities are involved with University medical centers. The best research developments are not necessarily coming from the high dollar private facilities. Bottom line it that if I contract a decease that has no cure, chances are it's over, and all the money in the world isn't going to change that.
Sorry my answer isn't to your liking.
The whole point goes back to your idea that government funding is necessary for research. My position is the private sector has plenty of money and can do the job without government intervention. As ES pointed out, keeping the government bureaucracy away is in itself a better position.
You started this whole conversation by saying stem cell research needed to be advanced and the government should step in with funding. CC stated his point from a moral view and that alone indicates we need to keep government out of it. If stem cell research is as important as many including yourself think it is, why not allow the private sector to fund it and have the versatility to move operations offshore if govenment and moralistic concerns stifle the research.

[ULTRA26 # 1]

The whole point goes back to your idea that government funding is necessary for research. My position is the private sector has plenty of money and can do the job without government intervention. As ES pointed out, keeping the government bureaucracy away is in itself a better position.
You started this whole conversation by saying stem cell research needed to be advanced and the government should step in with funding. CC stated his point from a moral view and that alone indicates we need to keep government out of it. If stem cell research is as important as many including yourself think it is, why not allow the private sector to fund it and have the versatility to move operations offshore if govenment and moralistic concerns stifle the research.
I think that the private sector should be funding and I don't want to see it moved offshore. However, I think Federal funding is also needed. As you know there have been recent developments that for the most part, should quiet moralistic concerns. Again, clearly we don't agree that some Federal funding could benefit the program. Not the end of the world. :)