Here's some reading material. . .

[cstraub]

This posted on another board. . .
http://www.boatstoreonline.com/procomp.html

[IMPATIENT 1]

This posted on another board. . .
http://www.boatstoreonline.com/procomp.html
that's a good read, i'm gonna have mine flowed, see what they're actually doin, if it as far off as the sbc, they'll go on ebay. they ran really good on my blown 475 but a blower will make any head flow good:idea:

[IMPATIENT 1]

chris, i found a local machine shop with a 2yr old superflow bench, 75 bucks to flow em. i'm having 1 of our porters here at the shop drop them off tommorrow and pick em up next week. let's see what they actually do, i'm curious.

[Sleeper CP]

Wow; Pro-Junk:mad: :eek:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[IMPATIENT 1]

Wow; Pro-Junk:mad: :eek:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
we'll see next wk won't we;) i had a very good race machine shop check the heads when i got them, they said the seats on mine were install very straight, plug holes were right etc. i never knew i had access to a superflow bench in my area or i'd already know the numbers on these. stayed tuned for procomp bbc alum 320cc head flow numbers, THE REAL 1'S :D :D :D

[justfloatn]

good info.
I also found it interesting that the Brodex heads for $2,000.00 only added 15HP at the peak HP of 5100RPM for the Stock GM head and 26HP at 5300 where the stock head falls off. I wish the pull went further into the 6K RPM range to see the difference. But for this set-up I would just run the stock heads and save the $$$$

[IMPATIENT 1]

good info.
I also found it interesting that the Brodex heads for $2,000.00 only added 15HP at the peak HP of 5100RPM for the Stock GM head and 26HP at 5300 where the stock head falls off. I wish the pull went further into the 6K RPM range to see the difference. But for this set-up I would just run the stock heads and save the $$$$
that link is too small block heads, i've got a set of the big block heads, they go to be flowed tommorrow;) the results will get posted here.

[cfm]

Thanks for the link Chris.
Pretty entertaining.
I do not know the company doing the testing, so I will take that with a slight grain of salt.
However, I still stand my ground that Pro-Fraud is just that.
=======================
Also, just to throw this out every once in a while, making good CFM numbers is a lot easier than making good power #'s.
Anyone look at Brodix's cfm #'s and wonder why so many big power makers use Brodix heads ? There CFM numbers look frightening low compared to most other companies. Doesn't make sense on paper huh ?
Way to much emphasis on flow #'s now a days. So much so that I fall victim to it also. Go look at Reher Morrison's site www.rehermorrison.com and read the articles. Flow is #7 or so on their list for making power.

[cfm]

good info.
I also found it interesting that the Brodex heads for $2,000.00 only added 15HP at the peak HP of 5100RPM for the Stock GM head and 26HP at 5300 where the stock head falls off. I wish the pull went further into the 6K RPM range to see the difference. But for this set-up I would just run the stock heads and save the $$$$
No, the $2k was for special valvetrain parts they wanted to use.
The Brodix IK180's start out at around $1050 or so retail.
Modified Vortecs (to handle cam over .460 lift, use guide plates, and etc) will run you near $900.
The Pro-Fraud's are cheaper of course.
Make it cheaper and make big claims ! That's how Pro-Fraud and others do it !
How could you NOT want them ?

[cstraub]

The playing field will be becoming more level. China is having new tax laws coming out at the first of the year. Compound this with the lower dollar and cost of fuel items from China will be going up around 25% over the next 6 months. This will make it easier for us little guys and the big guys to compete with imported product. Just 4 to 5 months ago I had a 30% increase from Torrington on bearings for roller cam buttons. I could have went with the Chines bearing that was less then half the cost of the Torringtons. . . .I didn't. I bought the Torringtons.

[CPBRIAN10THMTN]

Its always entertaining to read new reviews and tests of these heads, nothing we haven't heard before, i think there are 5 different threads on these heads on here. Pro-crap:)

[cfm]

That is one of very few positives of our dollar going into the schitter. It may help against overseas competition.
But, it took our dollar going overseas for this to happen in the first place. Made them weathier.
Let's not forget the real thing here, China's government is all a fraud also. They price fix like there is no tomorrow.
Hopefully this crap will clear out soon. We can get back to real American ingenuity on making better products vs researching how to use Asian cheap knock off type copying to our advantage.
Anybody know why our price of metals and oil is so high ? Yup, same reason, they took our money and now there buying up everything.

[IMPATIENT 1]

so if these bbc procomps i have flow 310 they won't make 750-800hp?

[justfloatn]

so if these bbc procomps i have flow 310 they won't make 750-800hp?
750 to 800 :jawdrop: Not without the help of a blower:D

[Warp Speed]

We must remember that you need a certain amount of flow for a given displacment / RPM. But it is all about QUALITY of air fuel charge not just quantity, especialy in a carbed NA application!!! :idea:
Hence the Brodix #'s vs. how they run! ;)
Warp Speed ;)

[cstraub]

If max CFM is 310
310 x .2575 x 8cylinders= 638HP @ 100% VE

[Liberator TJ1984]

On Superflo SF-1020
Intake @ .600 = 372 Int @ .800 = 394
Ex. =277 =312
I can Fax my Flowchart if someone would like to post it ? :D

[IMPATIENT 1]

On Superflo SF-1020
Intake @ .600 = 372 Int @ .800 = 394
Ex. =277 =312
I can Fax my Flowchart if someone would like to post it ? :D
please fax me that if ya don't mind fax#1-580-326-2478

[IMPATIENT 1]

On Superflo SF-1020
Intake @ .600 = 372 Int @ .800 = 394
Ex. =277 =312
I can Fax my Flowchart if someone would like to post it ? :D
so you had a set flowed already? i sent mine over 2hrs ago to be flowed, i'll pick em up next week, but i wanna play with #'s till then:D

[cfm]

On Superflo SF-1020
Intake @ .600 = 372 Int @ .800 = 394
Ex. =277 =312
I can Fax my Flowchart if someone would like to post it ? :D
My fax # 775-908-2113 goes to my computer in a pdf. I can save it and then post it. Gotta love modern technology.
Are the Pro-Comps or Pro-Toplines ? Big difference.

[IMPATIENT 1]

My fax # 775-908-2113 goes to my computer in a pdf. I can save it and then post it. Gotta love modern technology.
Are the Pro-Comps or Pro-Toplines ? Big difference.
that'd be cool! if they're indeed 320cc procomps, i'm gonna call and tell him not to flow the heads.save that money;) i was gonna have him surface em anyways.
i understand the velocity difference between a brodix or procomp, but if they're flowing 350-360 at .650, wouldn't that be good enough for 750-800hp if the chamber/port design is half decent?

[Liberator TJ1984]

Pro-Toplines > my Bad < fax on the way anyhoo ;)
It's been a few years since they were done !

[cfm]

Tha was quick !!!
See, the name Pro-Comp disleads many.
If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, dazzle them with confusion. LOL.
Here's your 320 aluminum Pro-Topline's on pdf.

[Sleeper CP]

If max CFM is 310
310 x .2575 x 8cylinders= 638HP @ 100% VE
Chris I have found out that if I can acheive 2.1 hp/cfm I'm doing pretty good and not leaving much on the table. But those numbers are with some pretty stought engines with single carbs.
The 935 HP BBlk Ford single carb 565" : A-460 heads flowed 450 cfm's
My 409" smblk Ford made 650 Hp at 6,500 with a 306 cfm AFR 225 head w/2.08 intake.
The 310 cfm number x 2.1= 651 HP. But he would have to build a very stought engine around it with a VE of better than 110%.
Sleeper CP

[IMPATIENT 1]

dam it, i was trying to be cheap and yall wouldn't let me:D

[Sleeper CP]

so if these bbc procomps i have flow 310 they won't make 750-800hp?
Don't take this personally, but not even close.
750 to 800 :jawdrop: Not without the help of a blower:D
:D yeah what he said.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[IMPATIENT 1]

Chris I have found out that if I can acheive 2.1 hp/cfm I'm doing pretty good and not leaving much on the table. But those numbers are with some pretty stought engines with single carbs.
The 935 HP BBlk Ford single carb 565" : A-460 heads flowed 450 cfm's
My 409" smblk Ford made 650 Hp at 6,500 with a 306 cfm AFR 225 head w/2.08 intake.
The 310 cfm number x 2.1= 651 HP. But he would have to build a very stought engine around it with a VE of better than 110%.
Sleeper CP
i'll just let the machine shop do his thing then, if the numbers aren't over 350 intake and 250 exhaust, they'll go to ebay;) sooooo, next wk i'll either be building my long block or sellin my heads and looking for a good used set of brodix:jawdrop:

[IMPATIENT 1]

Don't take this personally, but not even close.
:D yeah what he said.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
wouldn't take it personal bro, you guys are spitting out good info here, i'm trying to learn as much as i can;) teach me the ways of the na 800hp motor:D i wanna know:D :D

[Liberator TJ1984]

Don't know what you consider cheap ? but I picked those up New for $ 1599 :D

[cfm]

I'm still confused ?
Why are we going to flow the heads ?
As I understood it, You are keeping that cam right ?

[cfm]

wouldn't take it personal bro, you guys are spitting out good info here, i'm trying to learn as much as i can;) teach me the ways of the na 800hp motor:D i wanna know:D :D
Click on:
http://www.rehermorrison.com/
And then click on '509' link on left. There is your 800hp 500cid engine.
Here's the cam specs they list. Again, look at the '509' line.
http://www.rehermorrison.com/images/CamSpecs.gif

[IMPATIENT 1]

I'm still confused ?
Why are we going to flow the heads ?
As I understood it, You are keeping that cam right ?
possibly, if i can squeeze 750hp outta this cam/heads, i need to run it and save what $$ i have for a stainless impellor. i put manley valves, comp springs/spring cups/lash caps/retainers/locks and dart guides on the procomps i have. i want to see the flow numbers and show you guys so maybe collectively we can decide what it may put out with these heads and cam and wether a bigger cam would help any(if not, it'd be time to swap heads).

[IMPATIENT 1]

Click on:
http://www.rehermorrison.com/
And then click on '509' link on left. There is your 800hp 500cid engine.
brodix bb2's huh:idea: wonder what's the compression on that 1? also notice it was a 4.5 bore block, i'm still runnin mark iv.
man looking at that cam , looks like i should shoot for 700hp and be happy, spray the shit outta it from there.

[cfm]

They list it at 14:1 .
Don't assume those Brodix's are stock. This is Reher Morrison we are referencing here.
Off topic: Why can't I find smilies to add ? My mom always did say I was a little slow. LOL.

[IMPATIENT 1]

They list it at 14:1 .
Don't assume those Brodix's are stock. This is Reher Morrison we are referencing here.
Off topic: Why can't I find smilies to add ? My mom always did say I was a little slow. LOL.
yeah, i realized that after i posted,lol. no way i can afford their stuff. best i can do is sell what i've got, save for 2-3months and buy a 2k set of heads as cast. i know someone who can get me the protopline's(or are they rhs now??) at a jobber price for around 13-1400 with roller springs.
you should have smiliies in the rh side of the reply box, just click on 1

[cfm]

I'd link to point out at this time I am trying not to be negative, yet realistic.
An 800hp 500cid engine takes some good parts. It also requires very good assembly and especially spec/tolerance control. There is a whole lot more than just bolting stuff together and going. Ex: There are very critical valvetrain dimensions and specs that will never get checked if just bolting on. Professional head porters/assemblers spend a lot of time checking/re-doing things even on the big dollar heads.
It's the way it is.
If not done this way, then it's a roll of the dice on what will happen. Someone may get lucky, but they sure as heck can't preach to the masses that it's perfectly fine to do that.
Use your head and play it safe. I wish you luck, as I do all others.
============
Nope, no smilies. Damn, how can I joke, applaud, what have you. I hate looking serious all the time. Doh.

[IMPATIENT 1]

I'd link to point out at this time I am trying not to be negative, yet realistic.
An 800hp 500cid engine takes some good parts. It also requires very good assembly and especially spec/tolerance control. There is a whole lot more than just bolting stuff together and going. Ex: There are very critical valvetrain dimensions and specs that will never get checked if just bolting on. Professional head porters/assemblers spend a lot of time checking/re-doing things even on the big dollar heads.
It's the way it is.
If not done this way, then it's a roll of the dice on what will happen. Someone may get lucky, but they sure as heck can't preach to the masses that it's perfectly fine to do that.
Use your head and play it safe. I wish you luck, as I do all others.
============
Nope, no smilies. Damn, how can I joke, applaud, what have you. I hate looking serious all the time. Doh.
guys, quit worrying about pissin me off, i'm just trying to learn here ;) i'm not a egotistical fella that thinks he knows everything. i'm a gm master tech, that means i'm good at building oe motors, mild hp motors.by no means do i consider myself a "engine builder" just because i can build a engine. i've got 600-650 hp motors down pretty well, that's not hard and can be done with "bolt ons", but i enjoy learnin how to make big hp na motors.blower motors are pretty easy to get 750-800 hp, been there. SO QUIT THINKING THAT YOUR GONNA OFFEND ME GUYS:D , i'm a grown fella, i can take the truth ;) a wise man learns something everyday, a dumbass thinks he knows it all:rolleyes: :D
here's my dilema guys, i don't have access to a dyno, even if i did, i couldn't bring myself to spend 4-500 bucks for the pulls instead of buyin better parts. so with that said, i've gotta make do with what i've got to work with. only dyno around within 140miles is a drive on dyno, closet dyno room is in dallas tx.. so i've gotta go by flow numbers , then stick that together, see what it does on the water.

[pw_Tony]

If you want to save money..... don't post tech questions on this site :D

[Sleeper CP]

If you want to save money..... don't post tech questions on this site :D
Thanks Tony,
That is funny. You made me spit my beer on the screen....damnit:D ;)
Sleeper CP

[Sleeper CP]

They list it at 14:1 .
Don't assume those Brodix's are stock. This is Reher Morrison we are referencing here.
Off topic: Why can't I find smilies to add ? My mom always did say I was a little slow. LOL.
I wish I knew what your screen looked like. My smiles are on the righthand side of the screen. Maybe if you maximize the screen or make sure your space bar thing at the bottom of the screen is not locked out to the left.:idea:
Sleeper CP ;)
Big Inch Ford Lover

[Sleeper CP]

here's my dilema guys, i don't have access to a dyno, even if i did, i couldn't bring myself to spend 4-500 bucks for the pulls instead of buyin better parts. so with that said, i've gotta make do with what i've got to work with. only dyno around within 140miles is a drive on dyno, closet dyno room is in dallas tx.. so i've gotta go by flow numbers , then stick that together, see what it does on the water.
Oh, that's not your only dilema. I would just about bet you that if we had the same budget and I saved $ 500.00 for the dyno I would be better off than you. Don't look at the $ 500 spent like you are. It is money very well spent and if you want to make 700+ hp you'll need one.
I can't believe that there is not one any closer to you than what you mentioned. That would suck:( Keep looking maybe you find one closer. It is money very well spent.
You are going the correct direction; find the best flowing heads you can afford and start there.:) Oh, it's going to take a good size roller too. I'll see if I can find the spec's on the one that was in my 710 HP 512" Ford. It was a 10.2:1 engine the cam was done at 6,250 it might give you some ideal on how big you need to go.
Edit: The cam in the 512" Ford with A-460 heads that flowed just under 385 cfm's
Roller cam Spec's Dur @ .050 260 int 268 ex. adv. 292-302 lift .634 / .633
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[IMPATIENT 1]

hass taught me a trick tonite:D the dd2000 i have has a iterator on it and runs millions of combos automatically, its still runnin thru cams 1hr later.
sleeper, the cam i have peaks hp at 6500 and tq peaks @6000 every sim i use, and that's were i wanted to run w.o.t. on motor. i'm not gonna step away from a nitrous cam for more hp. i've ran from 652 lift up to 730lift with a "common" duration, center, sep for nitrous and it only picked the hp up another 25hp:confused:
i'm gonna see what the iterator crap does and see what it picked out. hass said his buddy has great luck using it, runs mid 90's on motor in a medium weight tunnel, under 520cubes, @ 12 to 1 comp. be interesting to what it picks out anyways, throw it in the sims and see what it does.
nope , no dyno's, there may be 1 in mesquite tx but that still 100miles away, and it'd cost me a day of work on top of that. i run o2's so i can tune the fuel curve myself by the a/f meter. po man's dyno:D

[pw_Tony]

hass taught me a trick tonite:D the dd2000 i have has a iterator on it and runs millions of combos automatically, its still runnin thru cams 1hr later.
sleeper, the cam i have peaks hp at 6500 and tq peaks @6000 every sim i use, and that's were i wanted to run w.o.t. on motor. i'm not gonna step away from a nitrous cam for more hp. i've ran from 652 lift up to 730lift with a "common" duration, center, sep for nitrous and it only picked the hp up another 25hp:confused:
i'm gonna see what the iterator crap does and see what it picked out. hass said his buddy has great luck using it, runs mid 90's on motor in a medium weight tunnel, under 520cubes, @ 12 to 1 comp. be interesting to what it picks out anyways, throw it in the sims and see what it does.
nope , no dyno's, there may be 1 in mesquite tx but that still 100miles away, and it'd cost me a day of work on top of that. i run o2's so i can tune the fuel curve myself by the a/f meter. po man's dyno:D
Explain this "iterator" :idea:

[IMPATIENT 1]

Explain this "iterator" :idea:
if you've got dd2000 , look up towards the rh top of the page, they'll be alittle i icon , clik on it. its supposed to go the cam sizes till it finds the best cam grind for your particular engine combo. if you've got your head flow, all cam specs etc., it picks out the best grind for your combo within the limits you set in the iterator.

[paradigm shift]

Click on:
http://www.rehermorrison.com/
And then click on '509' link on left. There is your 800hp 500cid engine.
Here's the cam specs they list. Again, look at the '509' line.
http://www.rehermorrison.com/images/CamSpecs.gif
Some great info on the site. More to the game just just flow and port size. Unless you have deep pockets and a dyno proven packages are the way to go I think. Some times too many choices. Some I found real interesting.
Tech Talk Article 2
"Reher's Rule:
RPM Determines Reliability
Tech Talk Article 6
"Head Games"
Tech Talk Article 16
"Flow Bench Fallacies"
Tech Talk Article 57
"The CNC Fallacy"

[cfm]

The iterator is not really good unless maybe doing a basic package.
Cam lobes differ within a manufacturer (many different 'families' of lobes) and of course manufacturer to manufacturer.
Iterator just gives you seat opening/closing numbers, ICL, ECL, and lift values. Too generic for an over acheiving motor !!!
A 800hp 500cid engine will not remotely make the same power and 'act' the same with the same duration at .050" and same neighborhood of lift from a lobe of each family.
I'm willing to bet on a high strung 800hp motor that you could have much as a 50hp-70hp difference between one lobe to another, again, even when having similar specs on paper.
Remember guys, this is not a 500hp 500cid 9:1 motor. Way different story.
======================
Many 'dyno' proven engines are on the money with hp quotes, and many aren't. Sad we have to trust who has an enthusiastic dyno and who doesn't.
==============
Scrolling all the way to right. No smilies. Maybe being blocked by Norton 360 ? Dunno.

[Hass828]

You cant trust dynos or time slips so dont waste your $$. That jet pump in the back of your boat is the most reliable dyno you'll find so build what you want and put it in the boat if it turns the pump tighter-more hp. Then mark off a 1000ft or 1320ft course and get a nordscog gps speedometer ,It will retain the max mph, and thats as good as you can get.

[IMPATIENT 1]

You cant trust dynos or time slips so dont waste your $$. That jet pump in the back of your boat is the most reliable dyno you'll find so build what you want and put it in the boat if it turns the pump tighter-more hp. Then mark off a 1000ft or 1320ft course and get a nordscog gps speedometer ,It will retain the max mph, and thats as good as you can get.
you know how we okies do it:D i ran the protopline flow numbers on my cam last nite, 855hp @6500, 613ftlbs @5000 :D wish i had some protopline's. i read the rehr morrison(sp?) whole tech section last nite and learned alot. very good reads!!!!

[IMPATIENT 1]

hass, you get my emails from last nite?

[Sleeper CP]

you know how we okies do it:D i ran the protopline flow numbers on my cam last nite, 855hp @6500, 613ftlbs @5000 :D wish i had some protopline's. i read the rehr morrison(sp?) whole tech section last nite and learned alot. very good reads!!!!
To much for me to re-read.What will it make with the PRO-Comp heads :confused: That is what you have is it not ? Or do you have the Pro Toplines :confused: :confused: :idea:
I have suggested a few times to guy's on here the rehermorrison site. If I was a Chevy guy and was starting from scratch I would have a very hard time not buying one of their short blocks or complete engines. The prices are great and they have a hell of a reputation and they have done all of the research :idea: Or you can go out and reinvent the wheel:idea: And spend more money doing it. But, if you already have some of the parts I understand the cost of starting over.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

http://***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=44176&d=1196442447To much for me to re-read.What will it make with the PRO-Comp heads :confused: That is what you have is it not ? Or do you have the Pro Toplines :confused: :confused: :idea:
I have suggested a few times to guy's on here the rehermorrison site. If I was a Chevy guy and was starting from scratch I would have a very hard time not buying one of their short blocks or complete engines. The prices are great and they have a hell of a reputation and they have done all of the research :idea: Or you can go out and reinvent the wheel:idea: And spend more money doing it. But, if you already have some of the parts I understand the cost of starting over.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D
i have procomps, they're getting flowed. i ran liberator's protopline flow numbers he put on the 1st page of this thread in the pdf file. those are nice heads! i know flow isn't everything but from what i've read on protopline, they make good power too. didn't protopline sell to rhs, then to comp cams?
yeah, i've already got the balanced 505 kit sitting in my bedroom:D blocks almost done at the machine shop, when it gets back i'm doin a half fill for alittle added strength since i had it punched 100 over. he sonic tested the block and he said "its a thick ass block" . guess i found a decent 1 this time the last block had a lifter come apart(before i got it), punched a dent in the cam gallery, and when i finally got around to makng a full boost race pass, the water pressuer in the block opened up the dent, filled the block with water:mad:
i haev everything to put the 13 to 1 505 motor together with, just wanting to optimize what i have or upgrade heads and cam. i need a stainless impellor bad so its either run the procomps if they flow good or buy protopline's and wait another yr for a ss impellor

[IMPATIENT 1]

The iterator is not really good unless maybe doing a basic package.
Cam lobes differ within a manufacturer (many different 'families' of lobes) and of course manufacturer to manufacturer.
Iterator just gives you seat opening/closing numbers, ICL, ECL, and lift values. Too generic for an over acheiving motor !!!
A 800hp 500cid engine will not remotely make the same power and 'act' the same with the same duration at .050" and same neighborhood of lift from a lobe of each family.
I'm willing to bet on a high strung 800hp motor that you could have much as a 50hp-70hp difference between one lobe to another, again, even when having similar specs on paper.
Remember guys, this is not a 500hp 500cid 9:1 motor. Way different story.
======================
Many 'dyno' proven engines are on the money with hp quotes, and many aren't. Sad we have to trust who has an enthusiastic dyno and who doesn't.
==============
Scrolling all the way to right. No smilies. Maybe being blocked by Norton 360 ? Dunno.
sure, i can understand that. what i was gonna do was let the iterator do its job, take those cam specs and run them on the camquest comp cams sim program.have 2 different sims, build that and hope for the best. i know its not the right way to do it, but its what i can afford and do so its the best bet for me. i used to buy just any camshaft and run it, at least the sim programs give a general idea of what its gonna do:idea:

[Sleeper CP]

Thanks for the clairification, I got lost in there somewhere:confused:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[1968Droptop]

1;2919153]http://***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=44176&d=1196442447
That pix still makes my stomach churn !!! I hope you figure out what's best for you and your check book.

[Sleeper CP]

Droptop,
Your head flow #'s look fine. When I get back to the office this afternoon
I'll send you my thought's on them.:)
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[cfm]

Anybody ever read the article I've posted a few times about Pro-Comps' port job ? Here it is.....there version of a port job......in print with pics.
http://byunspeed.com/Port%20Job.pdf

[1968Droptop]

Droptop,
Your head flow #'s look fine. When I get back to the office this afternoon
I'll send you my thought's on them.:)
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D
Thanks Jon. I rememeber the guy saying there was room for more improvement, but my checkbook didn't agree with him :eek:

[Sleeper CP]

Thanks Jon. I rememeber the guy saying there was room for more improvement, but my checkbook didn't agree with him :eek:
Those intake #'s of 368 at .750 is that out of the box ? Or has
much work been done on them?
Anyway to get over 400 cfm's with them will take some $$$. What were
you thinking you wanted to spend or do?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[IMPATIENT 1]

droptop, that motor had 6hr on it :sqeyes: believe it or not, nothing other than the block got hurt. piston skirts were fine along with everything else(i was spinnin 7k , 10lbs of boost doin 98gps when block let loose). when i pulled the crank out, it had sand in the oil galleries:eek: i recoup'd most of the $$$ i had in that blower motor, bought the 505 kit balanced, bought a new billet dominator , intake, badass nx kit from svtkeith(dude hooked me up!:D ).so the change up should only cost me @1500 if i stay with these heads.i already had a standard deck and tall deck ready to machine.my tall deck is fresh bored to 100 over, but its got a couple sleeves in it, couldn't bring myself to run it. sure wanted to build a 540 with it but i'd be for sure buyin heads/cam/pushrods/lifters/intake spacers/etc..

[1968Droptop]

Those intake #'s of 368 at .750 is that out of the box ? Or has
much work been done on them?
Anyway to get over 400 cfm's with them will take some $$$. What were
you thinking you wanted to spend or do?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D
That was not outta the box. They've had some work done to them, but the cost was like $400 total. I don't plan on doing anything with them right now, they're working pretty good with help from Don Hampton :D. Maybe in the future I'll get 'em worked over real good. Sure can't hurt to have 'em flowing big cfm's !

[thatguy]

I almost bought a set of BBC Pro-Comps last winter during my motor project for my jet. They sounded like the deal of the century. I had run Brodix smallblock heads for years on customers sprintcars, but never could afford them for myself for my 10.90 nova with a long rod 383 stroker. I would template my customers new brodix heads then copy them on 461 chevy castings. Took months, but boy did they work!
I am not a racer so the BBC Darts could not be justified in my engine budget last year. At the last minute I bought the Brodix1 280cc Rect. ports, the ones for marine app. Assembled they were about $1800.00 from summit.
Later I saw the pro-comps that a buddy had bought. WHAT A JOKE!!
Spark plug holes were not even in a line, let alone placed right. You did not need a dial caliper to see the surface was not square and I can only imagine the CC difference. It was clearly visible to the naked eye. The rocker studs looked like an old picket fence when you looked down them.
I know there are heads that will make more power than the Brodix that I bought. BUT they were in fact affordable and I know from past experience they would be clean, solid, made right and last for a long time.
( They sure are pretty when they come out of that box!)
Never flowed or dyno'd the motor, but it runs great and pulls hard. And I know I can use the heads for bigger and badder engines in the future.
Just my thoughts.
Tommy
See it here: http://s152.photobucket.com/albums/s170/thomasljr/Boats/?action=view&current=millerinRiver.flv

[1968Droptop]

droptop, that motor had 6hr on it :sqeyes: believe it or not, nothing other than the block got hurt. piston skirts were fine along with everything else(i was spinnin 7k , 10lbs of boost doin 98gps when block let loose). when i pulled the crank out, it had sand in the oil galleries:eek: i recoup'd most of the $$$ i had in that blower motor, bought the 505 kit balanced, bought a new billet dominator , intake, badass nx kit from svtkeith(dude hooked me up!:D ).so the change up should only cost me @1500 if i stay with these heads.i already had a standard deck and tall deck ready to machine.my tall deck is fresh bored to 100 over, but its got a couple sleeves in it, couldn't bring myself to run it. sure wanted to build a 540 with it but i'd be for sure buyin heads/cam/pushrods/lifters/intake spacers/etc..
Oh I remember well when you lost that engine :mad:. That sucked big time !!! Now your trying to figure out what to do with those heads. Bummed to read what your going through this year, frustrating I'm sure. Are you still going to run a supercharger ?
I hope the engine gods repay you for all you've went through this past year, they owe you one !!!

[IMPATIENT 1]

Oh I remember well when you lost that engine :mad:. That sucked big time !!! Now your trying to figure out what to do with those heads. Bummed to read what your going through this year, frustrating I'm sure. Are you still going to run a supercharger ?
I hope the engine gods repay you for all you've went through this past year, they owe you one !!!
no, i bought a big nitrous express 2 stage kit. yes the chevy gods owe me big time:D that's why i started early this season, i wanna be runnin by the end of feb.. i've gotta coach my twin boys ball team starting in late march, i get just as much adrenaline rush :sqeyes: :sqeyes: :sqeyes: coaching their team during games as i do making hard passes, no joke. got to have the boat tested and tuned in by then!
the heads are being flowed, hell they may flow decent enough to make 750hp, i can be happy with that. i'll spray the shit outta it ;) but this 505 otta push the boat into the 90's hopefully on just motor, that's my goal anyways.nitrous will take it on past 105-110mph i'm sure if not a bit more.i don't thinks its that big a goal cause i haven't really even started tuning the boat, justed played with shoes alittle so far, went thru the pump/repainted and i ran 2mph from triple digits with @700-750hp blown 475.

[1968Droptop]

no, i bought a big nitrous express 2 stage kit. yes the chevy gods owe me big time:D that's why i started early this season, i wanna be runnin by the end of feb.. i've gotta coach my twin boys ball team starting in late march, i get just as much adrenaline rush :sqeyes: :sqeyes: :sqeyes: coaching their team during games as i do making hard passes, no joke. got to have the boat tested and tuned in by then!
the heads are being flowed, hell they may flow decent enough to make 750hp, i can be happy with that. i'll spray the shit outta it ;) but this 505 otta push the boat into the 90's hopefully on just motor, that's my goal anyways.nitrous will take it on past 105-110mph i'm sure if not a bit more.i don't thinks its that big a goal cause i haven't really even started tuning the boat, justed played with shoes alittle so far, went thru the pump/repainted and i ran 2mph from triple digits with @700-750hp blown 475.
Sorry to hear your no longer running the blower :(. I hear you about coaching your kids !!! Got a 6.5yo boy, love doing everything I can do with/for him. It is truely a high seeing the world through his eyes at such a young age.
As for your goals, should be very achievable ! My buddy has a 19' Cheyenne w/a 533 BBF. He's making about 600-625 real world H/P and has the boat running in the mid 90's, one up. He's still got tuning to do, but we're both confident he should tickle the trips just on the motor. BTW he's got a 500 shot he's yet to try :sqeyes: :sqeyes: :sqeyes:

[IMPATIENT 1]

Sorry to hear your no longer running the blower :(. I hear you about coaching your kids !!! Got a 6.5yo boy, love doing everything I can do with/for him. It is truely a high seeing the world through his eyes at such a young age.
As for your goals, should be very achievable ! My buddy has a 19' Cheyenne w/a 533 BBF. He's making about 600-625 real world H/P and has the boat running in the mid 90's, one up. He's still got tuning to do, but we're both confident he should tickle the trips just on the motor. BTW he's got a 500 shot he's yet to try :sqeyes: :sqeyes: :sqeyes:
mine goes to 800hp in 2stages:D

[steelcomp]

I'd link to point out at this time I am trying not to be negative, yet realistic.
An 800hp 500cid engine takes some good parts. It also requires very good assembly and especially spec/tolerance control. There is a whole lot more than just bolting stuff together and going. Ex: There are very critical valvetrain dimensions and specs that will never get checked if just bolting on. Professional head porters/assemblers spend a lot of time checking/re-doing things even on the big dollar heads.
It's the way it is.
If not done this way, then it's a roll of the dice on what will happen. Someone may get lucky, but they sure as heck can't preach to the masses that it's perfectly fine to do that.
Use your head and play it safe. I wish you luck, as I do all others.
============
Nope, no smilies. Damn, how can I joke, applaud, what have you. I hate looking serious all the time. Doh.Wow...just breezed through this thread. Lotta wind blowing here. :D
CFM...how 'bout a little 467 churning out 821hp @ 7000? Basically off the shelf parts, nothing trick or exotic, 12.5:1 CR.
No one here is mentioning the fact that heads in themselves are nothing but a part of the combination. nFlow numbers are really only a very small part of the equation, regardless of how good they are. My 467 had 310 Canfields on it that flowed < 350 on the good intake port. Most guys would say that sucked, and no way you're going to get 800hp out of that engine with those heads. Truth be known, they were more than enough, and if I wanted to turn the motor a little harder, add a little more cam and compression, 850-860 wouldn't have been impossible. Point is, there was a whole more to this engine, as is with any well buuilt performance engine, than a good set of heads...it was the entire combination that was carefully thought through before ever ordering a part. Each part was thought of as a part of a combniation of parts, each contributing to a final desired result. Each part in itself may or may not have been the most expensive or trick part available, but each part did what it was supposed to do, and the result was better than expected as a result. Finally what brought the combination together was the right cam designed by the right guy, Chris Straub. However, even Chris can only provide what he can, given the combination of parts he's given to work with. Heads can be too good, and that's a typical mistake.
Just my 02

[Sleeper CP]

Steel,
It is all about the combo. Firefighter hasn't comeback yet, it will be interesting to hear what kind of combo he is looking for.
I have my idea's :D
Hey, you might know the answer to this, what type of power are the 500" NHRA Pro-Stokers making vs the IHRA + 700" engines do you know or do you have a guess?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[steelcomp]

Steel,
It is all about the combo. Firefighter hasn't comeback yet, it will be interesting to hear what kind of combo he is looking for.
I have my idea's :D
Hey, you might know the answer to this, what type of power are the 500" NHRA Pro-Stokers making vs the IHRA + 700" engines do you know or do you have a guess?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:DI don't know, but my guess would be they're not very far apart. It's harder to make X amount of power per ci the bigger you get. It's amazing to me that they can keep those big engines together given the odd geometry they have to deal with AFA bore/stroke/rod length combinations. We're going to be building an na 565 for the Bonneville car and I've been doing some asking around on how much power guys think we can get. I'm disappointed in what I'm hearing, but the consensus is not much more than 1200. I think that wold be pretty good for an endurance build. (Needs to be at WOT throttle for up to 90 sec.) 500ci pro stocks are in the area of 2.88 hp/ci, so even at 2.2-2.3hp/ci, a 700 in. engine is at 1610. I don't see why we can't get 2.2 from the 565, which puts us at ~1240. I think we can do better, but no one else thinks so. What the heck do I know.:rolleyes: :D

[Sleeper CP]

I don't know, but my guess would be they're not very far apart. It's harder to make X amount of power per ci the bigger you get. It's amazing to me that they can keep those big engines together given the odd geometry they have to deal with AFA bore/stroke/rod length combinations. We're going to be building an na 565 for the Bonneville car and I've been doing some asking around on how much power guys think we can get. I'm disappointed in what I'm hearing, but the consensus is not much more than 1200. I think that wold be pretty good for an endurance build. (Needs to be at WOT throttle for up to 90 sec.) 500ci pro stocks are in the area of 2.88 hp/ci, so even at 2.2-2.3hp/ci, a 700 in. engine is at 1610. I don't see why we can't get 2.2 from the 565, which puts us at ~1240. I think we can do better, but no one else thinks so. What the heck do I know.:rolleyes: :D
Thanks for all the good info. A 565" what? 4.6 x 4.25. What type of heads are you thinking about using a what type of intake system?
At Phoenix two weeks ago the Pro Mod boat that won had a 813" Kaase Ford Hemi in it. I talked to them
but I didn't get a chance to ask: RPM's, bore and stroke and deck height.
Sleeper CP

[steelcomp]

so with all this head talk, what head is gonna make me the most power up to 7500 on the 13 to 1 505? can't spend a ton and a good used set may be a option. there's a guy at work that keeps claiming he's bringing me some brodix heads next wk, and he needs the $$$. i can sell my heads quik locally or ebay em. think the dude may be talking shiat too, but he lives next to a well know race machinist in our area, roland nix. said he bought them when roland retired and shut down. i'm not holding my breath but it'd be cool to stumble on some cheap.
A 13:1 505 at 7500 dosen't need to be a killer head AFA flow numbers. You'll probably be in the 270deg. @ .050 range and without doing the math, my guess is you'll want around 320cfm. You want to think about port velocity, not necessarily flow, and the rule of thumb is, the smaller the port you can run and still get your flow (without maxing out the port), the better off you are. I think the ideal is to get the flow you want at about 75-80% lift. Say you have a 310cc port that flows 350 @ .800, and a 330cc port that flows 370 @ 800. Lets say you need 320cfm for your application. On the 310, you get 330cfm at .600", but the 330cc port gets your 330cfm at .500" lift. The 310 gets your flow at 75% lift, while the bigger port gets the flow at 62%. The port velocity on the bigger port is going to be way lower at the same given flow number, which isn't good. One reason why peak flow numbers aren't so important. You never open a valve to max flow on a head to achieve that flow.
Hope this makes some sense.

[steelcomp]

Thanks for all the good info. A 565" what? 4.6 x 4.25. What type of heads are you thinking about using a what type of intake system?
At Phoenix two weeks ago the Pro Mod boat that won had a 813" Kaase Ford Hemi in it. I talked to them
but I didn't get a chance to ask: RPM's, bore and stroke and deck height.
Sleeper CPThe 565 is a BB Chev, Dart Big M block, 4.600 x 4.250, Raptor heads and a Hogan sheet metal EFI intake with a pair of BIG throttle bodies.
813 ci. is just mind boggling. They have a rod ratio like 1.4:1 or something like that, and that's with a 7"+ rod! (5" stroke) Actually, a 4.625 bore with a 5" stroke is only 672"!!!

[IMPATIENT 1]

only 672:D

[Sleeper CP]

Steel,
It wasn't until I was driving out of the parking lot that I started thinking about it . And figured it must be around a 5.0" bore and a 5.125 stroke.
Something like that I ticked off I didn't ask them.
Sleeper CP

[steelcomp]

Steel,
It wasn't until I was driving out of the parking lot that I started thinking about it . And figured it must be around a 5.0" bore and a 5.125 stroke.
Something like that I ticked off I didn't ask them.
Sleeper CPMust be some special block...biggest passenger "style" block I know of is 5" bore center. I think they can run aluminum blocks, so maybe they have some 5.25" bore center stuff, or wider, but that gets into cranks and heads to match. Crazy, man!!:jawdrop:
Just figured 4.800" X 5.62 str. = 813" (only leaves .200" between bores)

[Sleeper CP]

Must be some special block...biggest passenger "style" block I know of is 5" bore center. I think they can run aluminum blocks, so maybe they have some 5.25" bore center stuff, or wider, but that gets into cranks and heads to match. Crazy, man!!:jawdrop:
Just figured 4.800" X 5.62 str. = 813" (only leaves .200" between bores)
The web site at www.jonkaaseracingengines.com list the 815" Ford at
1,700+ HP. looks like the blocks are 5.00 bore spacing and 12" decks.
I'm guessing that 565 of yours is going to be dry sump? I understand what you're saying on the HP you would guess it could make more, and then you have the altitude to deal with what is it at Bonnivelle?
Bruce Crower is re-building his roadster to go laking next year. I told him and Danny that when they go to Bonniville I want to go.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[BOOGEYMAN]

A friend and racing buddy Todd Hoerner who works with Steve Schmidt and his racing program, runs an 825ci in his Top Sportsman car and it makes "around" 1700...:)
Todd also got a NHRA Pro Stock ride with Schmidt on the engines and Wally Stroupe doing the chassis for the last 4 races just this last season and a full year in 2008 and the 500ci engines make around 1400.....or so......:D
Travis

[IMPATIENT 1]

A 13:1 505 at 7500 dosen't need to be a killer head AFA flow numbers. You'll probably be in the 270deg. @ .050 range and without doing the math, my guess is you'll want around 320cfm. You want to think about port velocity, not necessarily flow, and the rule of thumb is, the smaller the port you can run and still get your flow (without maxing out the port), the better off you are. I think the ideal is to get the flow you want at about 75-80% lift. Say you have a 310cc port that flows 350 @ .800, and a 330cc port that flows 370 @ 800. Lets say you need 320cfm for your application. On the 310, you get 330cfm at .600", but the 330cc port gets your 330cfm at .500" lift. The 310 gets your flow at 75% lift, while the bigger port gets the flow at 62%. The port velocity on the bigger port is going to be way lower at the same given flow number, which isn't good. One reason why peak flow numbers aren't so important. You never open a valve to max flow on a head to achieve that flow.
Hope this makes some sense.
thanx for the info/ i
im gonna press the kid on the brodix heads tommorrow;)

[Cs19]

foxwell, you guys have the cam numbers yet for the raptor motor? iron block?dry sump? how much cfm? where will you dyno?
just curious, similar cylinder head as what i have.

[steelcomp]

foxwell, you guys have the cam numbers yet for the raptor motor? iron block?dry sump? how much cfm? where will you dyno?
just curious, similar cylinder head as what i have.Cam is still up for grabs. I'm trying to get the engine builder tp talk to Straub, but he says he may just get one direct from RM. The block is Dart Big M, Bryant crank, yes on the drysump w/ Jeff Johnson pan, and the CFM is a pair of Holley TB's that are the size of manhole covers. Like 90mm ea. so I'm guessing >2500 cfm. Will dyno at MiTech (Mike LeFevers) down where you are somewhere. I've been told that the Raptor head was designed for the RM package engines, and works real good for that application, but may not be ideal for what we're doing. After looking at them the other day, I'm not real impressed.

[Cs19]

Will the heads be re-worked? Keep us posted on the motor, will be interesting to see what it makes. Have the valve train parts been ordered? If so, which lifters and rockers?

[steelcomp]

Will the heads be re-worked? Keep us posted on the motor, will be interesting to see what it makes. Have the valve train parts been ordered? If so, which lifters and rockers?
My guess is heads will be bolted on as-is, and I don't know about any of the valve train. I'll keep the info coming as it goes. Engine builder is an old time boat racer named Lee Gustavson. He knows all the old guys...ran one of Norm's first gear reductions back in the day. Says he was kickin everyone's a$$ with it, so Norm ended up selling a bunch of them. :D I'm sure Jack knows who he is.

[cfm]

Blowin wind ?
Somewhere in this thread or another Impatient mentioning using the Pro-Comps and a cast gear street solid .650" lift cam to attain his wanted 800hp.
Does that NOT warrant help ?
Also, I diagree with saying 'you can have to good a cylinder head.' To me, this defies everything. Too big - yes. Too good ? Never heard that one before.
Just one person's opinion.

[steelcomp]

Blowin wind ?
Somewhere in this thread or another Impatient mentioning using the Pro-Comps and a cast gear street solid .650" lift cam to attain his wanted 800hp.
Does that NOT warrant help ?
Also, I diagree with saying 'you can have to good a cylinder head.' To me, this defies everything. Too big - yes. Too good ? Never heard that one before.
Just one person's opinion.Blowin wind was referring to a lot of talk about airflow and -pardon the expression- CFM. Just a play on words.
Yes what Impatient posted warranted help. I'm trying to help, not criticize or pick at something for argument's sake. You can define "too good" any way you like. I think you know what I meant.
Have a cup of coffee, relax, and have a good day.

[IMPATIENT 1]

Blowin wind ?
Somewhere in this thread or another Impatient mentioning using the Pro-Comps and a cast gear street solid .650" lift cam to attain his wanted 800hp.
Does that NOT warrant help ?
Also, I diagree with saying 'you can have to good a cylinder head.' To me, this defies everything. Too big - yes. Too good ? Never heard that one before.
Just one person's opinion.
i'm trying to get ahold of some brodix heads this kid here at works claims to be bringing me tommorrow. if i can get them for nothing(sell my heads and recoup) then i'll definately put the cam in required for those heads and my combo. my reasoning for not puttin a high lift, 240-260seat 600lbs spring requiring cam on these heads is i was scared to hurt a stud boss. if they were brodix or another well tested brand, i would have went to alot bigger cam. if the kid has the heads and they're worth getting, i will and have a nice custom grind cut for em. if not, i'm runnin the shit i've got:D upgrade heads and cam next winter. i've got landascaping that needs done, or i won't be gettin none for awhile :eek: :D its a longtime till water is warm again:D

[cfm]

Have a cup of coffee, relax, and have a good day.
I'm 3 hrs ahead and one pot of coffee ahead of you. Then again, I just finished removing 8" of snow, so I'm ready for another pot of Java.
I get no smilie generator on this forum, so I can't truly express emotions behind my typing.
Anyway, why not dive into his situation so we can see your thoughts with what he has.

[Racer477]

Cam is still up for grabs. I'm trying to get the engine builder tp talk to Straub, but he says he may just get one direct from RM.
I've been told that the Raptor head was designed for the RM package engines, and works real good for that application, but may not be ideal for what we're doing. After looking at them the other day, I'm not real impressed.
From having run a 'RM' cam, then a 'Straub' Custom, then back to the 'RM' cam.
I would say that a "custom" cam is not always the best option, if the engine 'assembler' cannot pick the cam maybe you need an engine builder or consult an experienced camshaft person.
BTW. I only assemble my own engines, I am not an engine builder.
People keep talking about 'combination' isn't the 'Raptor' head part of RM's 572 Super Series engine that runs 1120hp @72-7300 rpm, you are running more intake and a dry sump so you should do better. What are you aiming for?:)

[Sleeper CP]

you are running more intake and a dry sump so you should do better. What are you aiming for?:)
Read post 68 & 72 :idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[Racer477]

[QUOTE=Sleeper CP;2924957]Read post 68 & 72 :idea:
Yeah 1240hp what rpm???:)

[Sleeper CP]

[QUOTE=Sleeper CP;2924957]Read post 68 & 72 :idea:
Yeah 1240hp what rpm???:)
Good question.
I'd guess, I would guess 7,800. :idea: Maybe that is to low for that power number though:confused: But I guess with the best of parts they can keep a BBLk together at 8,400+ for 90 seconds. Ah, what the hell do I know:(
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[Racer477]

:confused:
:
Good question.
I'd guess, I would guess 7,800. :D:
Thats why I wrote,
steelcomp
What are "you" aiming for?

[steelcomp]

I'm 3 hrs ahead and one pot of coffee ahead of you. Then again, I just finished removing 8" of snow, so I'm ready for another pot of Java.
I get no smilie generator on this forum, so I can't truly express emotions behind my typing.
Anyway, why not dive into his situation so we can see your thoughts with what he has. A smile is a colon : then cap D, together. :D see.
I'm glad you're shoveling snow and not me. I love the snow, just not living in it. Three years in VA and a couple in MI made that obvious.
I've had my conversations with him via PM, and thought I've put up some useful info above without getting into specifics. I really don't know much about the specifics of the import junk heads except to know that I won't waste much time on them. At least with the brand names here, you know there's been some thought into how the head works, not just a cheap copy of someone else's hard work.

[Sleeper CP]

I'm 3 hrs ahead and one pot of coffee ahead of you. Then again, I just finished removing 8" of snow, so I'm ready for another pot of Java.
I get no smilie generator on this forum, so I can't truly express emotions behind my typing.
Anyway, why not dive into his situation so we can see your thoughts with what he has.
CfM for those of us that have them keep this in mind:
:D = : D
;) = ; )
:( = : (
:) = : )
:rolleyes: = : rolleyes:
Just write them down and type them like that and most of us will know what
you mean. Actullay if you type them with out spaces you'll get the smiley you want in your
message. Read my next post you see.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[steelcomp]

From having run a 'RM' cam, then a 'Straub' Custom, then back to the 'RM' cam.
I would say that a "custom" cam is not always the best option, if the engine 'assembler' cannot pick the cam maybe you need an engine builder or consult an experienced camshaft person.
BTW. I only assemble my own engines, I am not an engine builder.
People keep talking about 'combination' isn't the 'Raptor' head part of RM's 572 Super Series engine that runs 1120hp @72-7300 rpm, you are running more intake and a dry sump so you should do better. What are you aiming for?:)I really don't want to get too far off topic here, but since you're asking, I'll fill you in here. Chris Straub is probably one of the top cam designers in the country. I have the utmost faith in his ability to design the best grind for any application. The cam from RM would be exactly as you say, a cam for their 572 combination that was designed for their application, not necessarily even close for what we're looking for. That brings out another point, and I'm not sure what you're getting at, but the Raptor heads are just what you say, part of RM's combination, and one of the reasons that IMO they're possibly not the best heads for our engine. (again, emphasizing combintion) Unfortunately I'm not building this engine, but the guy that is has been doing it for a long time, and holds more records at Bonneville than anyone else I know. He knows what he's doing, he knows what he wants out of the engine to accomplish his goal, and he'll get it.
Just because we are running more intake and a dry sump dosen't automatically mean we'd do better, especially with the RM cam. We're also running EFI, way different bore/stroke combination, and a set of headers that probably aren't optimum. Ultimately, this isn't an RM engine...we're developing our own "combination" if you will, and that's going to require a different approach than RM's all together.

[Sleeper CP]

CFM,
Three more that you may what to use are:
:idea: = : idea :
:jawdrop: = : jawdrop::jawdrop:
:mad: = : mad:
When you want to use idea if you type colonideacolon with out space's I think the idea image will show on the screen.
If you type : mad: with out the space the :mad: should show up. I'll try it
here :mad: it should show up as a mad face.
While I was typing my directions for you so was Steel. Just write them down so you have them.
Sleeper CP

[steelcomp]

[QUOTE=Sleeper CP;2924957]Read post 68 & 72 :idea:
Yeah 1240hp what rpm???:)1240 is only a figure based on an assumption of what hp/ci seems feesable. Nothing is written in stone at this point, and just my own opinions and thoughts, if this were "my" build. Bottom line is, it's not, and the engine builder is going to do what ever it his he thinks is right. To answer your question, I'd like to see 1200hp@ 6500 rpm. Think that's going to happen? No. In reality, for a BOnneville build, few people ever use all the power they make anyway due to traction issues, so peak power numbers are typically so what. It's what you can put to the salt that matters. If we can make 1150-1200 and keep it below 7500, then I think it'll be a very successful build.

[steelcomp]

[QUOTE=Racer477;2925001]
Good question.
I'd guess, I would guess 7,800. :idea: Maybe that is to low for that power number though:confused: But I guess with the best of parts they can keep a BBLk together at 8,400+ for 90 seconds. Ah, what the hell do I know:(
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D
There shouldn't be aby trouble keeping a BBlk together for that long at that rpm, it just makes the power band very narrow and more difficult to manage on the salt.

[Sleeper CP]

[QUOTE=steelcomp;2925319 It's what you can put to the salt that matters. If we can make 1150-1200 and keep it below 7500, then I think it'll be a very successful build.[/QUOTE]
Told you I didn't know shit. But I did rememer the traction issue after I wrote 7,800. I know that depending on the condition of the salt you may be limited to 7/8th throttle anyway.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[steelcomp]

Told you I didn't know shit. But I did rememer the traction issue after I wrote 7,800. I know that depending on the condition of the salt you may be limited to 7/8th throttle anyway.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover
Yeah, right...I'd like to know some of the shit you "don't" know. :D

[Racer477]

I really don't want to get too far off topic here, but since you're asking, I'll fill you in here. Chris Straub is probably one of the top cam designers in the country. I have the utmost faith in his ability to design the best grind for any application.
Just because we are running more intake and a dry sump dosen't automatically mean we'd do better, especially with the RM cam. We're also running EFI, way different bore/stroke combination, and a set of headers that probably aren't optimum. Ultimately, this isn't an RM engine...we're developing our own "combination" if you will, and that's going to require a different approach than RM's all together.
Yes I have run a 'Straub' cam, cam designer....for me, no, he was a lobe selector, didn't work for me, but, you don't know unless you try. It was 25hp and 1.5 mph down on the RM cam. Still have it.
More intake as in a sheet metal TR style with throttle bodies vs a single 4 barrell.....well....pro stock doesn't run TR's because they make less hp than a single 4:D
So is this motor, a Bonneville motor, optomised for the elevation?
I know 'jack....' about Bonneville except for watching the 'Worlds Fastest Indian'

[steelcomp]

Yes I have run a 'Straub' cam, cam designer....for me, no, he was a lobe selector, didn't work for me, but, you don't know unless you try. It was 25hp and 1.5 mph down on the RM cam. Still have it.
More intake as in a sheet metal TR style with throttle bodies vs a single 4 barrell.....well....pro stock doesn't run TR's because they make less hp than a single 4:D
So is this motor, a Bonneville motor, optomised for the elevation?I know 'jack....' about Bonneville except for watching the 'Worlds Fastest Indian'
Is that important?
Why do pro stocks run TR's?

[Racer477]

Is that important? Isn't Bonneville elevated? As in not sea level air pressure. Or that I know 'jack....' about Bonneville?:)
Why do pro stocks run TR's? Basically, a straighter inlet tract. But this seems to be a rhetorical question.:confused:

[steelcomp]

Basically, a straighter inlet tract. But this seems to be a rhetorical question.:confused:
Is it?

[cfm]

First cam guys I'd talk to are one's that have done some or a bunch of cams successfully (ie: strong runners, record holders, etc) for Bonneville. I'm sure the lobe profile is like no other.
Other than my opinion, I have nothing to offer for such a mountain to climb.
Good luck on this project and plese keep us posted. Pics would be cool too. :)

[Sleeper CP]

First cam guys I'd talk to are one's that have done some or a bunch of cams successfully (ie: strong runners, record holders, etc) for Bonneville. I'm sure the lobe profile is like no other.
Other than my opinion, I have nothing to offer for such a mountain to climb.
Good luck on this project and plese keep us posted. Pics would be cool too. :)
You maybe right on that ;)
:) Hey how did you do that : ) Print those out:D
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[Sleeper CP]

Yeah, right...I'd like to know some of the shit you "don't" know. :D
Thanks for the compliment, but the fact of the matter is, I just hang out with really smart people and pick up what I can.:) And from time to time I can apply it to something I'm doing. :)
Some of my friends have some very long and wide coat tails.;)
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[bp]

At Phoenix two weeks ago the Pro Mod boat that won had a 813" Kaase Ford Hemi in it. I talked to them
but I didn't get a chance to ask: RPM's, bore and stroke and deck height.
Sleeper CP
that same engine has been running in that same pro mod for at least 7 years, with a lot less maintenance required than the blown alky engines that he's routinely run against over that time period. scott's won a lot of races and at least one championship over that span. what seems odd to me is that more pro modders don't go in a similar direction - big inch n/a for that class.
in '05 at chowchilla, the final round of pro mod had scott against danny day's comp hydro (bill rivas's old boat with a capsule on it and deems 470 c.i. engine); with both of those boats wading through a pile of bah's, that was really different.

[Sleeper CP]

that same engine has been running in that same pro mod for at least 7 years, with a lot less maintenance required than the blown alky engines that he's routinely run against over that time period.
I think they check plugs and valve spring pressure between runs and that's it.
Maybe that would make the Blown Alky guy's day to boring. Seems to easy if you ask me :idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[bp]

I think they check plugs and valve spring pressure between runs and that's it.
i think that's a stretch;) i'm sure they do some stuff, like check the computer, make sure there's air in the bottle, etc... it took 'em a little while to get the whole thing dialed, but it is very dialed and has been for a long time. after many years, they finally hurt it - maybe earlier this year, then got it back in time to win the wf..
Maybe that would make the Blown Alky guy's day to boring. Seems to easy if you ask me :idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D
yeah, boring... :rolleyes: i've pitted near shawn reed the last couple years at mf, and those guys are a long way from bored between rounds.

[Racer477]

The 565 is a BB Chev, Dart Big M block, 4.600 x 4.250, Raptor heads and a Hogan sheet metal EFI intake with a pair of BIG throttle bodies.
We're also running , way different bore/stroke combination:confused:
RMRE’s Super Series 572 is the most technically advanced bracket racing engine on the market. It features the Reher-Morrison exclusive Raptor 12° spreadport cylinder heads, Dart Big M block with huge bore 4.625” custom pistons. Callies 4340 4.250" Magnum Crankshaft.
This is Pro Stock Technology for you!
572 Options
Dry Sump Oiling System
Tunnel Ram, Carbs & Linkage
Well steelcomp after asking questions and getting fobbed off with two word single syllable questions, I'll let you go and develop in your words:)
this isn't an RM engine...we're developing our own "combination"
Good luck with the project :)

[Budweiser]

"SMILES" information page (http://www.***boat.com/forums/misc.php?do=showsmilies)
When I scroll down to the bottom of the thread (not post to thread, the bottom of the page you're reading right now) there's a little box on the left that says somethong like "Posting Rules". In my "Posting Rules" box it says "smiles are ON". Does it say the same thing for you guys that aren't getting the smiles list when posting?

[gn7]

there is a HUGE differance between a motor deal set up to accel for 8 sec, and one that runs the salt, road race, circle boat etc. There is a a slightly better that zero chance that an RM engine would be worth a flying chit on the salt.

[Sleeper CP]

there is a HUGE differance between a motor deal set up to accel for 8 sec, and one that runs the salt, road race, circle boat etc. There is a a slightly better that zero chance that an RM engine would be worth a flying chit on the salt.
:D LOL
(I'm pretty sure this means drag race spec engine)
Sleeper CP

[Racer477]

there is a HUGE differance between a motor deal set up to accel for 8 sec, and one that runs the salt, road race, circle boat etc. There is a a slightly better that zero chance that an RM engine would be worth a flying chit on the salt.
Does that include the
"way different bore/stroke combination"

[Racer477]

there is a HUGE differance between a motor deal set up to accel for 8 sec, and one that runs the salt, road race, circle boat etc. There is a a slightly better that zero chance that an RM engine would be worth a flying chit on the salt.
"CONGRATULATIONS!'
ROBERT MOORE
TOP SPEED - 273.100 M.P.H.!!!
"Fastest stock body Corvette in the world"
Reher-Morrison Super Series HRI 572 CID
Injected on 118 ERC fuel
The Bobby Moore took his Reher-Morrison powered stock body Corvette to an unbelievable 273-100 mph and set not one, not two, but five (5) National Speed Records at Bonneville.
His 572 CID engine (based on our Super Series 572 engine) allowed him to set the record in both the AA/GMS and the AA/GT classes at 271.61 and 268.29 mph respectively!
Bobby also set the AA/FMS class record @ 258.546 mph, the A/GMS class record @ 236.142 mph and the A/FMS class record @ 234.162 mph!!!

[steelcomp]

We're also running , way different bore/stroke combination:confused:
RMRE’s Super Series 572 is the most technically advanced bracket racing engine on the market. It features the Reher-Morrison exclusive Raptor 12° spreadport cylinder heads, Dart Big M block with huge bore 4.625” custom pistons. Callies 4340 4.250" Magnum Crankshaft.
This is Pro Stock Technology for you!
572 Options
Dry Sump Oiling System
Tunnel Ram, Carbs & Linkage
Well steelcomp after asking questions and getting fobbed off with two word single syllable questions, I'll let you go and develop in your words:)
this isn't an RM engine...we're developing our own "combination"
Good luck with the project :) Guess I didn't bother to check what the bore/stroke combination is on RM's crate motor. Most 572's I know of are 4.500X 4.500. My bad. Goody for you!!!:rolleyes:
As for answering your questions, if I thought you were doing anything else but trying to stir up some shit, I'd pay more attention to what you're asking, but you're not, so I won't.

[steelcomp]

there is a HUGE differance between a motor deal set up to accel for 8 sec, and one that runs the salt, road race, circle boat etc. There is a a slightly better that zero chance that an RM engine would be worth a flying chit on the salt. But how can ou say that...The Bobby
Moore took his RM based engine and set all those fabulous records with it.:rolleyes: :D

[steelcomp]

How fast is 273-100 mph?"CONGRATULATIONS!'
ROBERT MOORE
TOP SPEED - 273.100 M.P.H.!!!
"Fastest stock body Corvette in the world"
Reher-Morrison Super Series HRI 572 CID
Injected on 118 ERC fuel
The Bobby Moore took his Reher-Morrison powered stock body Corvette to an unbelievable 273-100 mph and set not one, not two, but five (5) National Speed Records at Bonneville.
His 572 CID engine (based on our Super Series 572 engine) allowed him to set the record in both the AA/GMS and the AA/GT classes at 271.61 and 268.29 mph respectively!
Bobby also set the AA/FMS class record @ 258.546 mph, the A/GMS class record @ 236.142 mph and the A/FMS class record @ 234.162 mph!!!

[Racer477]

Guess I didn't bother to check what the bore/stroke combination is on RM's crate motor. Most 572's I know of are 4.500X 4.500. My bad. Goody for you!!!:rolleyes:
As for answering your questions, if I thought you were doing anything else but trying to stir up some shit, I'd pay more attention to what you're asking, but you're not, so I won't.
steelcomp,
so respectfull on speedtalk,
such a know it all here....
sorry to upset you.

[Racer477]

But how can ou say that...The Bobby
Moore took his RM based engine and set all those fabulous records with it.:rolleyes: :D
It would be good if we were all perfect.

[steelcomp]

steelcomp,
so respectfull on speedtalk,
such a know it all here....
sorry to upset you.LOL...I'm not upset. Sounds like you must be, though. 10 posts, and you come in here like you're all that, and you talk about respect? That's rich.
You wouldn't get away with your kind of BS on Speedtalk either, my friend, so maybe you ought to just worry about yourself, eh?
Do you have anything constructive to offer here? I'm all for learning and would be most greatful for anything positive you might have to add to this thread. I have plenty to learn.
BTW...since it seems you have such a problem with me, why don't you just give me a call, and we'll talk. Let's leave the thread to it's purpose, not to air your bad feelings.

[Cs19]

The guy sure came out of nowhere and instantly went after Foxwell. Weird.
Rickyracer477, please introduce yourself.

[Warp Speed]

Sounds like he works for RM and didn't like the "so far I'm not impressed" comment!?! :D
Warp Speed ;)

[cfm]

Here's my 02 - from reading/not listening or seeing.
Racer477 seems to have big respect for Reher-Morrison, which we should all have. The brains behind this organization is pretty much as good as it gets.
"Based" does not mean exactly. Valvetrain, port shapes, exhaust etc,etc are probably different. Do you think they'll drop a 1/4 mile terror in a Bonneville car ? Probably not. Anyone ever listen or read Darrin Morgan's stuff ? If you haven't...you have no idea of what this company does/knows/ and follows thru with. Even if you do, you'll still never grasp what/why/how.
RM is no bullshit company.
BTW: I laugh at the thought that RM would be on this website. No freakin way. Do you think Warren Johnson (not related to RM) would come on here ?
Come on.

[GAWnCA]

How fast is 273-100 mph?
Old Math would tell me that it's 173 mph. :D :D :D

[Warp Speed]

RM is no bullshit company.
BTW: I laugh at the thought that RM would be on this website. No freakin way. Do you think Warren Johnson (not related to RM) would come on here ?
Come on.
No dissrespect was meant at all to the boy's at RM and I appologize if anyone took my little observation as such. We know them very well and usualy see David (sorry) through our shop once every year or so. Not quite as often since Randy passed as they were very close. Very knowledgable folks, and great people too!
I was more refering to the possibilty of one of their employees (or vendors), similar to the situation that was brought up a few years ago on here when 1000hp on pump gas was deamed impossible (and called BS) by someone "in the know". ;)
None of us know everthing, but some seem to think so. :(
Due to the rapidly advancing technology in materials, machining, manufacturing, testing ect.. Things that where impossible 10 years ago are now common place, especialy in the ever evolving world of motorsports.
As soon as your done learning, your usualy done winning!! :idea:
Warp Speed ;)

[gn7]

I guess some of those blown nitro deals at Bonneville are based on Austin Coils stuff:D

[Cs19]

Actually Darren Morgan has posted on ***boat in the past, havent seen WJ yet though.:D
BTW: I laugh at the thought that RM would be on this website. No freakin way. Do you think Warren Johnson (not related to RM) would come on here ?
Come on.

[cfm]

Warpspeed - thanks for mentioning that ! I now understand the position in which it was said.
CS19 - thanks for that info. Proves I'm usually more wrong than right. LOL.
==========================
I apologize for getting a little heated for I read into some things different from how they where typed/conveyed.
I'm a big fan of a few pro shops that I believe are head and shoulders over most other fine establishments and RM is on top of that list. So, I will say something back if I think there is something negative or misunderstood.
==========================
This one dimensional world we call the internet can be a tough one sometimes. Doh.
Okay, back to the scheduled program which was..........Pro-Comp, was it not. :)

[Sleeper CP]

Is this just a pissing contest or what: :eat: :boxingguy
"CONGRATULATIONS!'
ROBERT MOORE
TOP SPEED - 273.100 M.P.H.!!!
QUOTE]
It does read 273.100 not 273-100:rolleyes: Timing lights to the 1/1000th
Here's my 02 - from reading/not listening or seeing.
Racer477 seems to have big respect for Reher-Morrison, which we should all have. The brains behind this organization is pretty much as good as it gets.
"Based" does not mean exactly. Valvetrain, port shapes, exhaust etc,etc are probably different. Do you think they'll drop a 1/4 mile terror in a Bonneville car ? Probably not. Anyone ever listen or read Darrin Morgan's stuff ? If you haven't...you have no idea of what this company does/knows/ and follows thru with. Even if you do, you'll still never grasp what/why/how.
RM is no bullshit company.
.
The reasoning behind my quote below:
[QUOTE=gn7;2926568] There is a a slightly better that zero chance that an RM engine would be worth a flying chit on the salt.
:D LOL
(I'm pretty sure this means drag race spec engine)
Sleeper CP
I'm sure the guys at RM can,have and will build engines that can do what ever is ordered. I don't think anyone would buy RM drag spec engine and drop it in a "salt" car. But if you took one of their engines and changed the cam and oil pan it could probably live in a "salt" car for quite a few years. :idea:
Just my .02
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[Sleeper CP]

[
As soon as your done learning, your usualy done winning!! :idea:
Warp Speed ;)
If that isn't the truth:idea:
Warp, how far do you live from Moorseville ? (sp)
And how about that Jimmie Johnson, did you read my post about the awards
dinner?
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[Warp Speed]

About 30 minutes South of Moorseville depending on traffic.
How 'bout that Jimmie Johnson!!!!! :D
No, I missed your post on the awards dinner. What's it under?
Warp Speed ;)

[Sleeper CP]

About 30 minutes South of Moorseville depending on traffic.
How 'bout that Jimmie Johnson!!!!! :D
No, I missed your post on the awards dinner. What's it under?
Warp Speed ;)
Just Jets "Ford" thread post # 48. I Bumped the thread.
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[bp]

No dissrespect was meant at all to the boy's at RM and I appologize if anyone took my little observation as such. We know them very well and usualy see David (sorry) through our shop once every year or so. Not quite as often since Randy passed as they were very close. Very knowledgable folks, and great people too!
I was more refering to the possibilty of one of their employees (or vendors), similar to the situation that was brought up a few years ago on here when 1000hp on pump gas was deamed impossible (and called BS) by someone "in the know". ;)
None of us know everthing, but some seem to think so. :(
Due to the rapidly advancing technology in materials, machining, manufacturing, testing ect.. Things that where impossible 10 years ago are now common place, especialy in the ever evolving world of motorsports.
As soon as your done learning, your usualy done winning!!! :idea:
Warp Speed ;)
exactly right.
your profile has a "join date" in 2006, but the discussion you're referencing happened a lot longer ago than that;), and probably had a few posts in it myself. i remember it well, since i happened to be in the area and spent the day at the dyno for that particular deal.
seems to me that technology has not only advanced through what you mentioned, but also through benchmarking and incoporating concepts/ideas from other racing formats.

[bp]

Actually Darren Morgan has posted on ***boat in the past, havent seen WJ yet though.:D
yes he did. of course, he's not with rm anymore...

[gn7]

The reasoning behind my quote below:
I'm sure the guys at RM can,have and will build engines that can do what ever is ordered. I don't think anyone would buy RM drag spec engine and drop it in a "salt" car. But if you took one of their engines and changed the cam and oil pan it could probably live in a "salt" car for quite a few years. :idea:
Just my .02
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D
:D exactly

[Racer477]

The guy sure came out of nowhere and instantly went after Foxwell. Weird.
Rickyracer477, please introduce yourself.
No this is not Ricky Bobby.:D
I have previously been a member here, although the last year or so only a 'guest' as I couldn't recall my login/email address I used for this site.
Please read post 87 and 94 I don't believe I went after steelcomp, I beleive I was asking a couple of pertinent enquires, how do you develop an engine for Bonneville?
Is there a dyno available at the same atmospheric conditions? We all know trying to correct (dyno results) for real altitude is a waste of time, so how do you realistically test for those conditions?
That was were I was heading.
My comments about a 'Straub' cam, well, how many people here have done a back to back test?
So as I have done that is it not reasonable to add my opinion?
Steve

[Racer477]

Sounds like he works for RM and didn't like the "so far I'm not impressed" comment!?! :D
Warp Speed ;)
No I do not work for RM.
I run a RM engine.
I have visited there facility and have done there engine course.
I also get most of my parts through them.
I get no discounts or freebies.
I find it hard when people presume they know things and do not check there facts, I beleive we are all guilty of this at times.

[steelcomp]

No this is not Ricky Bobby.:D
I have previously been a member here, although the last year or so only a 'guest' as I couldn't recall my login/email address I used for this site.
Please read post 87 and 94 I don't believe I went after steelcomp, I beleive I was asking a couple of pertinent enquires, how do you develop an engine for Bonneville?
Is there a dyno available at the same atmospheric conditions? We all know trying to correct (dyno results) for real altitude is a waste of time, so how do you realistically test for those conditions?
That was were I was heading.
My comments about a 'Straub' cam, well, how many people here have done a back to back test?
So as I have done that is it not reasonable to add my opinion?
SteveSteve,
There was a definate sarcastic intent behind your posts. The questions -in context- were not "pertinant". You haven't posted anywhere else on this site, just here, and just on this topic, which wasn't even the topic of the thread (and I'm not sure how we even got here). I've been on here long enough, and started enough trouble of my own (Lord knows :rolleyes: ) to know good and well when someone is truely trying to add something pertinant to a thread or subject, or just trying to start something. It's pretty obvious what your intent was, especially after some of your last insulting comments.
Like I said, if you want to talk, just give me a call. I'd be glad to tell you anything I can about our project, or me, or whatever it is that's bothering you.
Finally, if you want to criticize or pick apart the engine program we have, I can give you the engine builders' numbers and you can take it up with them. Like I said before, it's not my deal. I don't know you or what you've done, but there are two very successful and knowledgable engine builders behind this project (with a collective 50+ years at Bonneville, and dozens of records) and I'm not sure there would be much you could add. Not sure there wouldn't be, but most likely not.

[steelcomp]

yes he did. of course, he's not with rm anymore...Nope...head of R&D at Profiler now. Decided NASCAR wasn't for him after RM.
Just as a side note, I've emailed Darin about this project and he was kind enough to give me his cell no. Considering how busy he must be, I thought that was very cool of him.
Darin is as sharp as they get, and his contributions to the advancement of engine development and technology are IMO unparalleled. I'm a huge fan and read as much of his writings as I can. Lot to learn there, most of it over my head, but I try. :cry:
What I do understand, I try and pass on. :D

[steelcomp]

No dissrespect was meant at all to the boy's at RM and I appologize if anyone took my little observation as such. We know them very well and usualy see David (sorry) through our shop once every year or so. Not quite as often since Randy passed as they were very close. Very knowledgable folks, and great people too!
I was more refering to the possibilty of one of their employees (or vendors), similar to the situation that was brought up a few years ago on here when 1000hp on pump gas was deamed impossible (and called BS) by someone "in the know". ;)
None of us know everthing, but some seem to think so. :(
Due to the rapidly advancing technology in materials, machining, manufacturing, testing ect.. Things that where impossible 10 years ago are now common place, especialy in the ever evolving world of motorsports.
As soon as your done learning, your usualy done winning!! :idea:
Warp Speed ;)I can only imagine what an inside look where you are would bring. Talk about advancement!! :idea:

[Racer477]

Steve,
There was a definate sarcastic intent behind your posts.I apologise if it was taken that way The questions -in context- were not "pertinant". post 87, I have used that 'brand' of cam and felt I was qualifed to comment. post 100, I have since explained were I was headed with Bonneville.You haven't posted anywhere else on this site, just here, and just on this topic,I wasn't aware of posting elsewhere before I could post here which wasn't even the topic of the thread (and I'm not sure how we even got here). I've been on here long enough, and started enough trouble of my own (Lord knows :rolleyes: ) to know good and well when someone is truely trying to add something pertinant to a thread or subject, or just trying to start something. It's pretty obvious what your intent was, especially after some of your last insulting comments.
Like I said, if you want to talk, just give me a call. I'd be glad to tell you anything I can about our projectI am really only interested in how 'you' test the engine for Bonneville, or mewe have communicated amicably on forums before, or whatever it is that's bothering you.only recovering from knee surgery:D ,so unless that interests you
Finally, if you want to criticize or pick apart the engine program we have,I stated in post 87 that I am only an engine assembler,not an engine builder I can give you the engine builders' numbers and you can take it up with them. Like I said before, it's not my deal. I don't know you or what you've done, but there are two very successful and knowledgable engine builders behind this project (with a collective 50+ years at Bonneville, and dozens of records) and I'm not sure there would be much you could add. Not sure there wouldn't be, but most likely not.
xx

[Warp Speed]

I can only imagine what an inside look where you are would bring. Talk about advancement!! :idea:
Come on down. Would love to show you around! ;)
I would prefer if you waited untill summer though so we can get the family barge wet while your in town!! :D
Warp Speed ;)

[steelcomp]

Come on down. Would love to show you around! ;)
I would prefer if you waited untill summer though so we can get the family barge wet while your in town!! :D
Warp Speed ;)
That's an offer I'll have to take you up on next summer. That family barge be the one in your avatar?:idea: :D

[Sleeper CP]

That's an offer I'll have to take you up on next summer. That family barge be the one in your avatar?:idea: :D
All 600+ inches of it:D :D
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover

[Sleeper CP]

Racer477, we get it ;you don't like Scott :argue: :boxingguy
Steelcomp " not an engine builder "
xx
I've only been posting here since July and in the first few days of posting I read one of his post's were he said" I'm not an engine builder, just an assemblier" ( I think it was the Mopar guy with the bearing clearance issue WSR .. something) I think most on here know that, I have never got the impression he is or has tried to hide that from anyone. So your xx say's more about you than him, at least to me anyway.:idea: Consider giving it a rest would ya....:idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[Cs19]

So as I have done that is it not reasonable to add my opinion?
Steve
Steve, nobody said you cannot add your opinion, please do.
It certainly seemed like you had a problem with Steelcomp based on the way you came out swinging but apparently we were wrong.
So what was your previous handle here on ***boat Steve?
RM builds wicked motors, if I had the coin Id have one in my Jetboat. Head over Heels Cheyanne (PGJ) has one and its bad ass!

[Cs19]

Come on down. Would love to show you around! ;)
I would prefer if you waited untill summer though so we can get the family barge wet while your in town!! :D
Warp Speed ;)
Can i come?:)

[Racer477]

Steve, nobody said you cannot add your opinion, please do.
So what was your previous handle here on ***boat Steve?
RM builds wicked motors, if I had the coin Id have one in my Jetboat. Head over Heels Cheyanne (PGJ) has one and its bad ass!
I honestly don't rememeber.

[Racer477]

Racer477, we get it ;you don't like Scott :argue: :boxingguy
Steelcomp " not an engine builder "
I've only been posting here since July and in the first few days of posting I read one of his post's were he said" I'm not an engine builder, just an assemblier" ( I think it was the Mopar guy with the bearing clearance issue WSR .. something) I think most on here know that, I have never got the impression he is or has tried to hide that from anyone. So your xx say's more about you than him, at least to me anyway.:idea: Consider giving it a rest would ya....:idea:
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D
People seem a bit touchy here :jawdrop:
I highlighted pieces in that text were what I said. So I(Racer477)am NOT an engine builder only an engine assembler.The two x's were left in by mistake as the 'reply' wouldn't let me preveiw without at least 2 letters.
If that has been the cofusion I hope it has cleared it up:confused:

[Warp Speed]

That's an offer I'll have to take you up on next summer. That family barge be the one in your avatar?:idea: :D
Looking forward to it!!
Ya, that's the ol' girl. Looks like a friggin aircraft carrier compared to most jets! :D
Warp Speed ;)

[Warp Speed]

Can i come?:)
Hell ya, love to show you guy's around!!! :D
Warp Speed ;)

[steelcomp]

Looking forward to it!!
Ya, that's the ol' girl. Looks like a friggin aircraft carrier compared to most jets! :D
Warp Speed ;)LOL..yeah, I remember seeing the Nimitz carrying the nose just like that. :D

[steelcomp]

Thanks for all the good info. A 565" what? 4.6 x 4.25. What type of heads are you thinking about using a what type of intake system?
At Phoenix two weeks ago the Pro Mod boat that won had a 813" Kaase Ford Hemi in it. I talked to them
but I didn't get a chance to ask: RPM's, bore and stroke and deck height.
Sleeper CP
Talking about big engines...just thought I'd share this. I had in my hot little hand today a 5" bore CP piston destined to go onto a new 5.300" bore center block. Word is they're looking at 900ci. Mfgr's were trying to get IHRA to go to 5.5" bore center and be done with it, but they said 5.300 is max. Prototype heads are done, as well.

[Sleeper CP]

Talking about big engines...just thought I'd share this. I had in my hot little hand today a 5" bore CP piston destined to go onto a new 5.300" bore center block. Word is they're looking at 900ci. Mfgr's were trying to get IHRA to go to 5.5" bore center and be done with it, but they said 5.300 is max. Prototype heads are done, as well.
Wow :)
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:D

[steelcomp]

Wow :)
Sleeper CP
Big Inch Ford Lover:DThought that might catch your attention
:D

[cstraub]

Sonny's had their new Hemispherical BBC engine at PRI. You talk about a monster....Note I said "Hemispherical", Chrysler "politely" informed Sonny's that the word HEMI is trademarked so they had to black out all references to the trademark in the booth.

[IMPATIENT 1]

Talking about big engines...just thought I'd share this. I had in my hot little hand today a 5" bore CP piston destined to go onto a new 5.300" bore center block. Word is they're looking at 900ci. Mfgr's were trying to get IHRA to go to 5.5" bore center and be done with it, but they said 5.300 is max. Prototype heads are done, as well.
DAMN:eek:

[steelcomp]

Sonny's had their new Hemispherical BBC engine at PRI. You talk about a monster....Note I said "Hemispherical", Chrysler "politely" informed Sonny's that the word HEMI is trademarked so they had to black out all references to the trademark in the booth.
I saw that on their website. I didn't get a chance to see the head yesterday, but I'm guessing it's a Pro Stock style deal.
Next year, I'm definately going to PRI.

[steelcomp]

What blows my mind is the piston speeds of these engines with the extremely short rod ratio they have to run

[cstraub]

Yes Scott, before they outlawed the Jager rod in IHRA I got to see some of the pistons coming out of some of the Ford engines. Piston speed is one of the major battles in those engines.