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View Full Version : Euthanasia, Right or Wrong ?



Her454
09-17-2003, 08:45 AM
According to the news this morning, in the next month or so, a band called Hell on Earth will appear in Concert in St Petersburg Florida where they will be "featuring" a live suicide to promote awareness and legalize suicide. Something similar to what Dr. Jack Kevorkian did on 60 minutes....who subsequently went to Prison after that episode. I've watched as family members suffered in pain before they passed, and I dont "think" I could assist in their suicide, much less watch one of someone I dont know. Either this is a struggling band needing to boost ticket sales, or one with a passion that wants to make an extreme point. Just curious how many on the boards would attend, and what your views are?

dimarcobros
09-17-2003, 08:52 AM
I would never pay, or go to watch even if it was free, to watch someone die. However, if a person is in major pain and going to die soon anyway, I think it is their choice and don't see a problem with it. Make your peace and pull the plug. Just my .02
DMB

summerlove
09-17-2003, 08:55 AM
Her454:
According to the news this morning, in the next month or so, a band called Hell on Earth will appear in Concert in St Petersburg Florida where they will be "featuring" a live suicide to promote awareness and legalize suicide. Something similar to what Dr. Jack Kevorkian did on 60 minutes....who subsequently went to Prison after that episode. I've watched as family members suffered in pain before they passed, and I dont "think" I could assist in their suicide, much less watch one of someone I dont know. Either this is a struggling band needing to boost ticket sales, or one with a passion that wants to make an extreme point. Just curious how many on the boards would attend, and what your views are? I wouldn't go if it were down the street. The subject is a very private one that needs to be discussed with family and loved ones, not carried out on stage as a publicity stunt.

Her454
09-17-2003, 09:01 AM
RiverDave:
I might go and watch an execution, but euthenasia?? I think the band could be held legally accountable for perhaps putting someone in a situation where they felt obligated to do something?
RD Apparently there are several legal issues pending with this. In california, I think the law states that a person that willfully claims they are going to harm themself can be held for 72 hours for mental evaluation. Not sure how it is in FL but according to the news they are keeping the actual details, name etc a secret until the "event". Sounds insane to say the least.

RiverReady2
09-17-2003, 09:09 AM
Suicide is a chicken shit way to die. Life is not always grand, you just have to deal with whats in front of you and move on. There will always be people who love and care about you if you let them into your life.
Justin

topless
09-17-2003, 09:09 AM
I read this on another forum.
ST. PETERSBURG - Industrial rock band, Hell On Earth will feature a "live suicide"; at their State Theatre performance in St. Petersburg, FL on Saturday, October 4th. A Euthanasia Society member will carry out the suicide to raise awareness for dying with dignity. The Euthanasia member, who suffers from a terminal illness, is using the event as a platform to help make back-street suicides a thing of the past.
Though his identity is being withheld until the day of the event, he did have this to say, "I thank the lord that Hell On Earth is giving me this opportunity to end my suffering. I just want to say as my last will and testament that this is my god given choice to end my life. I'd prefer to have a physician-assisted suicide but until the laws are changed, those who are in pain like me will either have to continue to suffer or do it themselves."
The event, The Hell On Earth Haunted Tour, is part of a national tour the band is on to support their new album, "All Things Disturbingly Sassy"

Her454
09-17-2003, 09:11 AM
Thanks Topless, I was looking for an article on it.

Essex502
09-17-2003, 09:13 AM
It's the individual's decision as far as I'm concerned whether or not to seek euthanasia as a means to end their life if terminally ill.
Did anyone ever read Soylent Green or see the movie?
As a way to end your life when NOT terminally ill...I think it is wrong. But if a person is dying already and can be spared the pain and agony of cancer or some such disease then I think it sound be legal.
For frustrated, spoiled teens or misfits at all ages - no focking way should it be legal.
Maybe after a Psych eval and sign-off by a panel of Doctors...then okay.

Jungle Boy
09-17-2003, 09:18 AM
Talk about leaving a lasting memory of a band. I would not go, but do support the need for a humane way to go if the cirumstances are severe enough to warrant it. For most people, I think you would hang on to the faintest hope of getting better. It is hard to say, unless you're wearing the shoes. I hope those shoes are never on me.

eaglemtnlaketx
09-17-2003, 10:41 AM
I too wonder what the motivation is for this band. No one seems to mention what the damaging effects and damaging legacy something like that does for the family and children. Anyway, what do I know, I tend to be a hypocrite anyway and am always amazed at how I can find the speck in someone elses eye while missing the "two-by-six" in my own eye.

Blown 472
09-17-2003, 10:56 AM
If I am going to die, hell yeah, why should I be a burden on the peeps around me if I am going to die make it happen and move on.

Havasu_Dreamin
09-17-2003, 11:18 AM
Here is an interesting thing to consider when questioning why or why not it should or should not be legal for someone with a terminal illness to commit suicide, it's called an Advanced Health Directive. Basically what it says is that you, as the person who signs it, are telling the dr. in the event of your incapacitation due to whatever is ailing you to either intervene with artificail life support or not. So, why is it that you can sign an advanced health directive ahead of time in the event of whatever may happen to you but you can't make the decision on the spot.

LaveyJet
09-17-2003, 11:21 AM
As Roseanne Roseanna Danna once said,
"Whats wrong with the Youth in Asia?"
SC

Windy
09-17-2003, 11:25 AM
Her454:
In california, I think the law states that a person that willfully claims they are going to harm themself can be held for 72 hours for mental evaluation. [/b]
If your a threat to yourself or others you can be placed on a 5150 hold. These are the types of patients we sometimes have to use restraints on.
[ September 17, 2003, 12:26 PM: Message edited by: MissHBjet ]

SERIOUS ISSUES
09-17-2003, 11:57 AM
I look at it this way. We treat our pets like people, if you beat kill or otherwise abuse your animals you can go to jail. same thing with a human. if you harm another human you go to jail.
One big dif, if your dog gets seriously injured or is otherwise dying you can put him down. I dont get it. I say its humain one animal to another. my .02

Her454
09-17-2003, 12:14 PM
Havasu_Dreamin:
Here is an interesting thing to consider when questioning why or why not it should or should not be legal for someone with a terminal illness to commit suicide, it's called an Advanced Health Directive. Basically what it says is that you, as the person who signs it, are telling the dr. in the event of your incapacitation due to whatever is ailing you to either intervene with artificail life support or not. So, why is it that you can sign an advanced health directive ahead of time in the event of whatever may happen to you but you can't make the decision on the spot. Isn't that actually referred to as a "Living Will" ? And I am completely in agreement with the "Terminally Ill " and their right to die.
One of the moral issues is that maybe those being left behind just don't want to let go. In doing so, they fail to recognize that "quality of life" is more important than simply "being alive".
[ September 17, 2003, 01:50 PM: Message edited by: Her454 ]

hoolign
09-17-2003, 12:22 PM
I feel that alot of the terminally ill patients
are just kept alive as income for the health system!

Metal_King
09-17-2003, 12:45 PM
Euthanasia should be in private. This band is gloryfying it, using it for promotion, which is completely wrong.
This person is not going to die with dignity; they will have become a freak show...which is sad.
I totally support euthanasia, but not this way...no way.

Essex502
09-17-2003, 12:53 PM
A Living Trust has several sections in it. (Having gone through this with my parents and now my wife's parents). One Section is, as Havasu Dreamin' stated the Advanced Directives stating clearly to your Medical Power of Attorney person(s) and doctors that you don't want life support or other artificial or extrordinary efforts made to sustain your life. Another section is the Will that directs your Successor Trustee(s) how to distribute or disolve your trust. Another is the Power of Attorney for financial and/or Medical Decisions. This is the absolutely best way to handle your end-of-life affairs to make the transition to your heirs.

BUSTI
09-17-2003, 01:30 PM
What this man and the band want to do is so immoral. The importance of a cause what ever it maybe is gets so diminished when protestors resort to undignified and immoral acts! Usually these people that do these things have such intellectual dishonesty. Their severe and radical protest is about them and drawing attention to themselves. It is narcsisim at its worst.
Ask yourself this if during the height of the abortion debate how would you feel if a woman on national TV on a stage during a concert lay on a table. Then she had a doctor abort the baby and there were cameras video taping on to huge vision boards. And we got to see the doctor first slice off the babies head, then the babies arms and legs. Then we saw the doctor vivisecting the babies torso in half to get it out of the womb. All this blood and guts on stage on the TV. Or watched as they just vacuumed the live baby out of the mother. Do you think that the importance of a womans right to choose would be advanced by such a demonstration?
Look, suicide is a very private decision for what ever the reasons. When a society makes decisions to take life because of convienence eg. abortion or assisted suicide all life is reduced in value. When you reduce life to just unwanted tissue and treat it like a tooth that is decayed then you can expect more of this. If this is allowed to happen, all associated with it including the concert promoters and the building owners(they obviously have advanced warning and knowledge of the criminal act) should be arrested and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law! :mad:

Freak
09-17-2003, 02:34 PM
I witnessed an execution by lethal injection 2yrs ago. It was very uneventful and shall we say for the lack of a better word “peaceful”. I am a firm believer that if your quality of live is depleted by illness it is your right to end your life. Overcoming the fear of the unknown and having the inner strength to end the suffering and take that journey seems quite the opposite of chicken shit to me.

Her454
09-17-2003, 03:20 PM
Freak:
I witnessed an execution by lethal injection 2yrs ago. Ok, its my morbid curiosity...........???????????
[ September 17, 2003, 04:21 PM: Message edited by: Her454 ]

CA Stu
09-17-2003, 03:34 PM
secondchance:
As Roseanne Roseanna Danna once said,
"Whats wrong with the Youth in Asia?"
SC And "Let's make Puerto Rico a Steak". God bless her.
Ya know, it's topics like this that make me want to kill myself.
CA Stu <--"Never mind." :D

Freak
09-17-2003, 03:35 PM
What would you like to know?
It was at Greenville correctional facility. We met at the state police building a few miles up the road. They bussed us to the prison.
A bunch of protesters were out front. The inmates on death row yelling stuff as we went by. A lot of waiting in a room with reporters and the other witnesses. He came into the execution room peacefully, laid on the table made a statement and then they did the first injection. Which put him in a comatose state, then the next injection stopped his breathing/heart. He just did a little cough and that was it.
The guy murdered his girlfriend and dumped the body in the Potomac river.
Anyone can sign up and go, at least in the state of VA. The accused have the choice of injection or the electric chair. Almost all choose injection. Believe it or not it's hard to get on the list for the chair, a lot of people want to see that. From what I have heard it isn’t pretty.
Why did I go? Just like you, my morbid curiosity.
[ September 17, 2003, 04:42 PM: Message edited by: Freak ]

Her454
09-17-2003, 03:41 PM
Freak:
Anyone can sign up and go, at least in the state of VA. Believe it or not it's hard to get on the list for the chair, a lot of people want to see that. From what I have heard it isn’t pretty. Why did I go? Just like you, my morbid curiosity. Just curious if it was for work, etc. My morbid curiosity wouldnt get me in the door for something like that, I couldnt handle it. The Movie the Green Mile about put me over the edge when the guy died in the chair....No thanks. eek!

twistedpair
09-17-2003, 03:44 PM
hoolign:
I feel that alot of the terminally ill patients
are just kept alive as income for the health system! AMEN Brother! It has always struck me as odd that when my Dad was dying, doctors kept giving us hope until, coincidentally, his insurance ran out.

Freak
09-17-2003, 03:46 PM
Well kind of. I do work in the prison system. My boss asked if I wanted to go. I was interested in the process. I have been at the bedside of a few family members death's. Death no longer scares me. The suffering does. Unfortunately I also agree death and suffering is a big money game for some businesses.
[ September 17, 2003, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Freak ]

Her454
09-17-2003, 03:59 PM
Freak:
Well kind of. I do work in the prision system. My boss asked if I wanted to go. Dont take this the wrong way and it may sound harsh, but I would imagine that working in the system and witnessing something like that would mentally anesthetize a person after awhile. I think I remember reading somewhere that there are actually people that travel to witness these...kinda like thrill seekers.

DansBlown73Nordic
09-17-2003, 04:01 PM
hoolign:
I feel that alot of the terminally ill patients
are just kept alive as income for the health system! Bingo we have a winner. Its all about$$$$$ Im not talking someone who finds out they have cancer, but a person who has cancer all over. So they remove the lung, then its a brain tumor and next its a kidney.....Before you know it the bills are huge. Then the poor sap croakes and every penny he or she saved there hole life, is spent on hospital bills.
I think if the doctors really wanted to cure stuff like this it would have happened years ago.....Its the MONEY$$$$$$$$
[ September 17, 2003, 05:03 PM: Message edited by: Dans66Stevens ]

JustMVG
09-17-2003, 04:22 PM
CA Stu:
secondchance:
As Roseanne Roseanna Danna once said,
"Whats wrong with the Youth in Asia?"
SC And "Let's make Puerto Rico a Steak". God bless her.
Ya know, it's topics like this that make me want to kill myself.
CA Stu <--"Never mind." :D "What About Soviet Jewelry"
Gilda we miss you!! frown

Freak
09-18-2003, 03:39 AM
Her454:
Freak:
Well kind of. I do work in the prision system. My boss asked if I wanted to go. Dont take this the wrong way and it may sound harsh, but I would imagine that working in the system and witnessing something like that would mentally anesthetize a person after awhile. I think I remember reading somewhere that there are actually people that travel to witness these...kinda like thrill seekers. I'm sure there are a strange group of people that travel to witness executions. It seems like they could find something better to do.
Many professonal fields deal with death on a daily basis. It is a fact of life and I feel that people that are around it daily are more comfortable with it. Currently there is no getting around it.
Working in the system you do become wiser to the cons that people (inmates) try to pull on a daily basis. Just like police deal with daily. You learn quickly that any advantage they can get they will try to take. The world would be a much better place if everyone just told the truth. frown

Seadog
09-18-2003, 05:25 AM
From day one, Doctors and nurses are taught to treat death as an enemy that must be defeated at all costs. The big problem is that doctor training is more about fixing problems than about caring for the overall needs of the patient. It is the same with lawyers. They are taught how to find loopholes and to manipulate facts to get a result. They are not taught about justice, morales and empathy for victim.
Our health care system is slowly changing to become more patient friendly. This is going to take a long time before all medical schools get a good program going and these doctors replace the current crop.
Imagine a boat that you have had for years. It has been a great boat and you have lots of fond memories. It is needing an engine overhaul. Then you notice signs of rot, some of the hardware is rusted, it could use a new paint job. When does the boat get too expensive to fix? It is no wonder that the subject of euthanasia is so hot, because no one can make the same call. Look at the case of the guy whom they had to appoint a court guardian to make the call. His mother, sister and fiancee agreed to pull the plug, but his father and stepmother opposed it.
The main thing is that this is something that should be treated with dignity and sadness, not a public spectical.

comin' unscrewed
09-18-2003, 06:19 AM
My body. My life. My choice, period.

betty boop
09-18-2003, 06:44 AM
i agree with you unscrewed, 100%....

Havasu_Dreamin
09-18-2003, 06:52 AM
Essex502:
A Living Trust has several sections in it. (Having gone through this with my parents and now my wife's parents). One Section is, as Havasu Dreamin' stated the Advanced Directives stating clearly to your Medical Power of Attorney person(s) and doctors that you don't want life support or other artificial or extrordinary efforts made to sustain your life. Another section is the Will that directs your Successor Trustee(s) how to distribute or disolve your trust. Another is the Power of Attorney for financial and/or Medical Decisions. This is the absolutely best way to handle your end-of-life affairs to make the transition to your heirs. I could not agree more! Everyone should set a living trust up! It is well worth the money! Decide how you want your estate and end of life affairs handled ahead of time and in private. Don't involve the court and have everything open to the public! If anyone is interested I can refer you to my attorney.
[ September 18, 2003, 07:55 AM: Message edited by: Havasu_Dreamin ]