Appreciation?

[Jbb]

No Good Deed Goes Unpunished
What a very sad and bizarre end we have to the Jesica Santillan story. Jesica's second heart and lung transplant seemed to be working, but the damage from the first transplant was already done, and it wasn't survivable. Jesica died on Saturday afternoon with irreversible brain damage.
Now .. the rest of the story. Jesica, as you no doubt know by now, came to this country illegally. On both of the days that both of her transplant surgeries took place about sixteen people who were in this country legally died because they didn't get their life-saving transplant in time. That's 32 law-abiding citizens and residents of the United States who passed away while an illegal alien was receiving two hearts and lungs. (Four lungs? I don't know if they transplant one or two at a time.) Here's your kicker. When Jesica passed away there was a chance that the heart and lung she received a few days earlier might have been transplanted into yet another recipient. She also had two kidneys, corneas and other organs that could have been transplanted. The doctors asked her family if they would donate her organs.
Amazingly, they said, "No".
Can you believe this? This family pays a human-smuggler $5,000 to get into this country. They play on the sympathies of Americans to collect donations sufficient to cover the cost of the first operation. The hospital picks up the cost of the second operation - a cost that will be passed on to the taxpayers and to other patients. They give this girl two hearts and a couple of lungs that could have been transplanted into law-abiding citizens or residents. Then, when the time comes to show some appreciation or some compassion for others who might need a donor organ .. they say, "No".

[JetBoatRich]

I am truely sad for the young girl and the family for loosing their daughter. :mad:
But yesterday when I read that story I was pissed for the same reason you mentioned. Go back Home frown

[Raskal]

yah i am sorry the girl died but what the f k they could not give up her organs that just pisses me off . burningm burningm burningm

[Kilrtoy]

That is why we need the MILITARY on the the border with a shoot first ask questions second policy. That is a bunch of bullshit.

[Mandelon]

They'll probably be suing the hospital for a few hundred thousand bucks too!!!
My office manager was in the hospital for 23 days earlier this year. Intestinal problem. Hospital bill....(not surgeons)....$158,000
[ February 24, 2003, 07:55 PM: Message edited by: Mandelon ]

[Jordy]

It's a sad deal, but I agree that's bullshit. Just wait for the next step when some asshole liar, dammit, I always do that, I mean lawyer shows up and files a malpractice case against everyone involved and gets millions of dollars for himself of course, and the family... burningm

[JetBoatRich]

Thats the other thing, they will sue and never have to work again and all hospitol bills will be gone frown

[LUVNLIFE]

I agree 100% with you boys.

[Jbb]

Shut Up, Quit Whining, Read This!
The Bill of No Rights
"We, the sensible people of the United States, in an attempt to help everyone get along, restore some semblance of justice, avoid any more riots, keep our nation safe, promote positive behavior, and secure the blessings of debt free liberty to ourselves and our great-great-great-grandchildren, hereby try one more time to ordain and establish some common sense guidelines for the terminally whiny, guilt ridden, delusional, and other liberal, bed-wetters. We hold these truths to be self-evident: that a whole lot of people are confused by the Bill of Rights and are so dim that they require a Bill of No Rights.
ARTICLE I: You do not have the right to a new car, big screen TV or any other form of wealth. More power to you if you can legally acquire them, but no one is guaranteeing anything.
ARTICLE II: You do not have the right to never be offended. This country is based on freedom, and that means freedom for everyone -- not just you! You may leave the room, turn the channel, express a different opinion, etc., but the world is full of idiots, and probably always will be.
ARTICLE III: You do not have the right to be free from harm. If you stick a screwdriver in your eye, learn to be more careful, do not expect the tool manufacturer to make you and all your relatives independently wealthy.
ARTICLE IV: You do not have the right to free food and housing. Americans are the most charitable people to be found, and will gladly help anyone in need, but we are quickly growing weary of subsidizing generation after generation of professional couch potatoes who achieve nothing more than the creation of another generation of professional couch potatoes.
ARTICLE V: You do not have the right to free health care. That would be nice, but from the looks of public housing, we're just not interested in public health care.
ARTICLE VI: You do not have the right to physically harm other people. If you kidnap, rape, intentionally maim, or kill someone, don't be surprised if the rest of us want to see you fry in the electric chair.
ARTICLE VII: You do not have the right to the possessions of others. If you rob, cheat or coerce away the goods or services of other citizens, don't be surprised if the rest of us get together and lock you away in a place where you still won't have the right to a big screen color TV or a life of leisure.
ARTICLE VIII: You don't have the right to a job. All of us sure want you to have a job, and will gladly help you along in hard times, but we expect you to take advantage of the opportunities of education and vocational training laid before you to make yourself useful.
ARTICLE IX: You do not have the right to happiness. Being an American means that you have the right to PURSUE happiness -- which by the way, is a lot easier if you are unencumbered by an overabundance of idiotic laws created by those of you who were confused by the Bill of Rights,"
ARTICLE X: This is an English speaking country. We don't care where you are from, English is our language. Learn it or go back, for good, to the hole you came from.
If you agree, share this with a friend. No, you don't have to, and nothing tragic will befall you if you don't. I just think it is about time common sense is allowed to flourish - call it the age of reason revisited.

[bear down]

JETBOAT BRIAN
Can you believe this? This family pays a human-smuggler $5,000 to get into this country. They play on the sympathies of Americans to collect donations sufficient to cover the cost of the first operation. The hospital picks up the cost of the second operation - a cost that will be passed on to the taxpayers and to other patients. They give this girl two hearts and a couple of lungs that could have been transplanted into law-abiding citizens or residents. Then, when the time comes to show some appreciation or some compassion for others who might need a donor organ .. they say, "No". [/QB]Is the value of human life different if that person is from another country whether s/he is in that country legally or not? Is the immigration of illegal aliens into this country a problem especially from Mexico? Yes it is, but should we resort to violence as in "Shoot first, ask later" Policy, definitly not. Though many immigrants from Mexico are illegals and undocumented(the same I think) many work and are employed by Americans. We are benefiting from their hard labor and willingness to take jobs that none of us willing to take on. Who in this group eats fruits and vegetables, wears clothing from national dept. store, get their vehicles repaired, have landscapers, janitors etc...? I think we all do. These illegal immigrants are still contributing to the national economy by working and paying taxes (very few companies pay under the table) but receive little assitance from the U.S. Gov't. I think the point I am trying to make is not whether this illegal immigrant had a right to take a heart/ lung away for a U.S. Citizen in the same instance is a criminal less worthy than a person who is not a criminal regardless of offense. I think not, we are not God and we can not pick and choose who lives and dies but we can help as many survive as we can. I guess the punishment for being an illegal immigrant was served, instead of prayers for her survival maybe thoughts of doubt to her worthiness were pondered instead. Death was her sentence. God help us if any of us were to travel abroad and need some type of life saving surgery and that country has the type of mentality that some of us in the U.S. have. In regards to the family not willing to give her organs, if true really does "SUCK"
Guillermo Andrade

[Nubbs]

JETBOAT BRIAN:
Shut Up, Quit Whining, Read This!
The Bill of No Rights
Ain't that the truth. I just wish everybody would see it that way. Too many people think they deserve everything for nothing nowadays.

[Mandelon]

Memo, you make a good point. I don't think anyone could look that little girl in the eye and deny her the medical help she needed based on the luck of where she happened to be born.
I think the issue in general is that most Americans are fed up with what they perceive as foreigners taking advantage of a generous system. We take many difficult medical cases on from all around the world. Separating conjoined twins, transplants, etc. Our own medical costs are spiralling every year. Its just a general frustration we have that some immigrants from other countries take advantage of the system
Yes 90% are hardworking folks chasing the American Dream. Those folks deserve respect regardless of their accent or skin color. Its those that take from the system without working that are being deservedly derided here.
[ February 25, 2003, 11:28 AM: Message edited by: Mandelon ]

[wsuwrhr]

I agree with Jetboat Brian and Bear Down. The bill of rights is right on the money. Unfortunatly, I think the person most likely to benefit from an organ transplant,(age, overall health) should be considered first. If we were to open our doors to any immigrant, organs would be even more scarce. As sad as it may seem we have to draw the line somewhere, playing God, I'm not sure we are playing God, there is no abundance of spare organs. Osama is said to have kidney problems you know. Maybe someone should donate a kidney.
I haven't heard either way, but if the story is true that her family wouldn't donate their already DEAD daughter's organs, that just plain makes it worse.
Brian
[ February 24, 2003, 09:40 PM: Message edited by: wsuwrhr ]

[Kilrtoy]

Entering this country illegally is a felony.IT IS A CRIME. If you want to come to this country then do it legally. Every other coutry in the world protects their borders with the military and force, so should we. I can speak and read english and went to school, that is why I have the job I have. The grapes I'm eating right now due tatse pretty damn good and they were on sale too. They need to stay in their own coutries and work hard there, get on a list and come here leagally, bottom line.

[beyondhelpin]

Bear Down
That sounds very noble but if that is the case why don't we just open our transplant banks to anyone no matter where you live. Who are we to put a value on our lives above anyone else whether you live in the US or not. Answer: We have a limited supply of organs.
They were not citizen of the US. If we have the extra great but we don't. I know it sounds cold and heartless, but try asking the families who lost a loved one because she got those organs instead of their loved one, what they think.
There are advantages to being a citizen of our country or at least there should be. You think they pay their taxes just like everybody else. You would be surprised how many of these people are payed under the table. The big companies don't pay under the table but a lot of smaller companies and individuals do.
Many city hospitals along the border are having budget problems because of free care to illegal aliens. Just look a LA. I don't know whether she came to the US just for medical treatment or if she has lived here for a while. Again we cannot afford the provide medical attention for the world. We can barely afford it for ourselfs.
Even a country as rich and giving as we are have limits. Before we throw open our arms to help we need to take care of our own first.
The topper is when the family refused to donate the organs to help another person whose life is in the balance just like their daughter was.
It makes you just not want to help anyone. One other thing, I don't believe a murderer should have just as much chance at a transplant as anyone else. As a matter of fact they should take theirs so that they can at least help someone to live after they took someone else's life.
Just in case anyone is interested I just heard on the news they are going to sue the hospital and the transplant team. I guess they are becoming more American. I'm sure a lawyer did a little ambulance chasing.
Jetboat Brian
That says it all. It is sad that people think they are owed these things. It takes effort on their part.

[ACCEPTENCE]

Kilrtoy:
That is why we need the MILITARY on the the border with a shoot first ask questions second policy. That is a bunch of bullshit. I agree, this whole picture is a big bag of dog shit...
I say two steel fences the lenght of the boarder and one of them with an electric charge, razor wire on top and armed gaurds sprayin lead.
We can stop aid to other countries to pay for it.
Works for me!!!

[bordsmnj]

i cannot stand the bull shit i see on the news every night with fags like paul moyer telling me how i should give one rats ass about a bunch of people i've never met but support none the less.It's a fricking crime to be american working middle class and have an honest goddammed opinion anymore.I just loose it when i watch the news. o.k. i'll shut up. But if you make me president i'll take over mexico tomorrow and straight take arabia's oil from them and bitch slap any country that doesn't like it!OOPs! jawdrop did i say that?? I feel better-i must have.

[Kilrtoy]

BORDSMNJ
you have my vote

[TrojanDan]

Kilrtoy:
I can speak and read english and went to school, that is why I have the job I have. The grapes I'm eating right now due tatse pretty damn good and they were on sale too. They need to stay in their own coutries and work hard there, get on a list and come here leagally, bottom line. Too bad you can't spell correctly in English.
-Dan Mendoza

[El Chingon]

Ditto! (Little Bro)
-Steve Mendoza

[Mandelon]

C'mon now, don't confuse a typo for poor spelling or grammar skills. :p

[Kilrtoy]

It was late and well, you got me. eek!

[twistedpair]

All I know is, that if my daughter was dying of a curable affliction, I would Beg, Borrow, or Steal to get her the help she needed.
But, if for some reason she lost her fight, I would donate her organs so that MAYBE some other child could win theirs.

[bear down]

riodog:
Beardown, YOU ARE FULL OF SHIT ! IF someone broke into your home and took from you without your permission, you'd spout a different line. Most of the 'illegals' don't work for large companies because the companies would not hire them due to the penalties imposed should they get caught, therefore they are NOT contributing more than they take (steal). Let's see now, Crossing the border illegally, Unreported income (tax evasion), Falsification of documents to get their MANY kids into school, Foodstamps, wix vouchers, stolen medical aid, i.e., bankrupting our health system, bankrupting our school system, taxing our criminal justice system to the outer limits. YOU want more ? Well you're going to get more because this state is an UPSIDE DOWN PYRAMID. The people that are supporting this state and contributing to make all of our many blessings possible AREN'T the ones that are BREEDING LIKE RATS! Make no mistake about it, we're being INVADED fron SOUTH OF THE BORDER and it's not with guns but with what's between their legs! This state is already bankrupt-that means for all you bleeding heart liberals- we ain't got no more money! Now what? The breeding bastards will VOTE ( remember- drop a little bastard on U.S. soil and we're stuck with it) to take everything someone else has worked for. We should be taking care of our own people here at home, locking down our borders, shipping assholes like Hanoi Jane, and a few others that come to mind at the moment, out, and acting like the people that founded this country and who were willing to fight and die for what they believed was right!
Rio-rabid-dog aka M.W.Fulton
P.S. want some great reading ? try www.ranchrescue.com (http://www.ranchrescue.com) burningm In fact Rio Dog, a lot of major U.S. companies do employ illegal immigrants, though many of the indentification used to gain employment are false many companies do have illegals as employees. In hindsight, we should penalize many "US Citizens" that have taken advantage of our social system as well. Though many generations of americans have utilized the welfare system, sect. 8 programs, wic and other state, local and federal funded family asst. programs. Do these families that do not work, get their rent paid, families feed and children taught and are not and have not tried to help themselves get out of this situation for years and generations get a break from society just because they are "US Citizens"? That's a tough question. The state and gov't is upside for bigger reasons than just immigration, we are upside down because of our govenors and presidents are not always making the right decisions for the people of the U.S. The State of California is upside down because we are doing uncessary spending for politicans and county employees for travel and expenses, we are upside down in California because we deregulate the Energy companies of the state and we purchased electricity from out side sources when we had it in California, we are also upside down in this state because we are paying out millions of dollars in lawsuits to students that have been molested by teachers, persons who have been abused by policeman, paying out settlements because a bus driver was high while driving and killed a mother. You want more, you'll get more, we are upside down as a state because our congressmans and senators have luxuries that they don't deserve (housing,vehicles with drivers)expenses paid to county supervisor for resort meetings in Palm Springs of Las Vegas. Immigration is not soley the blame of the downfall and let's get that straight. I did conceed that illegal immigration is a problem, we just need to do a better job at the border to prevent that, I never disputed the issues. The issues that I had concerns with is that should a person be denied medical treatmant because of his or her status as a U.S. Citizen? I think not. As for the grape comment by Kilrtoy, those grapes were on sale because they were sold to you by a company that employ's some illegal immigrants and helped pay that employee's salary and medical insurance (so I am sure Juan or Juanita thank you). I do agree with you Riodog on one thing, the thing in between people's legs are a danger to society, when people breed like rat's and rat's get older they become you. Your a prime example on why people should use condoms. That was a good point Rio. And to make things clear on who founded this country are the group of persons who have been royally screwed the most by the U.S. are the Indians (they've been lied too, cheated and robbed). So take your David Duke mentality and get it straight, look at the people around you that you need to survive, they are not all Americans they are not all U.S. Citizens but they are here to help all of us. Everything we do in our every day lives revolve around people from different cultures and we use all of there services.
Guillermo Andrade

[Kilrtoy]

I will give you this BEARDOWN. The overwhelming majority of people on welfare are white and in the mid-west and south.
[ February 25, 2003, 09:58 AM: Message edited by: Kilrtoy ]

[rivercrazy]

Plain and simple, U.S. Citizens should always have first opportunity to receive organ transplants. Afterall, taxes are paid and U.S. Citizens have the right to the benefits that they paid for. Illegal immigrants do not pay for those benefits therefore they should not receive any period.....
HOWEVER, if I had a kid that was sick or needed an organ donation, I do just about anything I possibly could do to recify the problem. So I do understand why the parents did what they did

[twistedpair]

Number one criteria for organ transplants - Can You Pay?
Like everything else, cash talks, they could care less where the money comes from, and those weren't tax dollars being spent, They were charitable donations.
And without starting a race war,(My Hispanic/Apache wife would kill me!) I would like to see proof that most welfare recipients are whites from the Midwest and South. I would think it was mostly urban poor around the large cities.

[Jordy]

Kilrtoy:
I will give you this BEARDOWN. The overwhelming majority of people on welfare are white and in the mid-west and south. Are we just speculating or do we have the numbers to back this up? "Overwhelming majority" are the terms normally used when statistics don't show what the person using them wants to convey, or the numbers just don't exist. Either way, it's dangerous ground.

[bear down]

twistedpair:
Number one criteria for organ transplants - Can You Pay?
Like everything else, cash talks, they could care less where the money comes from, and those weren't tax dollars being spent, They were charitable donations.
And without starting a race war,(My Hispanic/Apache wife would kill me!) I would like to see proof that most welfare recipients are whites from the Midwest and South. I would think it was mostly urban poor around the large cities. I agree with you in a sense, money talks unless that person does have time to wait for a transplant(i.e. you will live 6 months to a year). And on the topic of welfare recipients, go to this website it has pretty good info. Hope that this is proof enough. question on the website what is considered other?
http://www.census.gov/hhes/poverty/poverty01/tables01.html
I think we all need to do our part to help out our country, not to point fingers or argue. There just has to be a better way to help all people in the U.S.

[126driver]

Three words:
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