Show me your plumbing

[Hemicbx]

I'm going to end up needing a replumbing job on my engine. Right now its kindof nasty with rubber hose everywhere. I want to go to stainless braided hose and I've been thinking on this and debating options over & over until my head hurts. :confused:
I figure the best thing to do is get idea from everyone who's been down this road before. So if you have good pics of your engine & plumbing. . .let's see 'em.
Any other input on brands, hose type, suppliers, etc would be a big help also.
Later
Hemicbx

[waterslinger]

I have used lots of AN fittings and like Earls the best.
Just pick one brand and stay with it some things do not mix well
when you start getting some from here and some from there.

[cal***boat]

Originally posted by Hemicbx
I'm going to end up needing a replumbing job on my engine. Right now its kindof nasty with rubber hose everywhere. I want to go to stainless braided hose and I've been thinking on this and debating options over & over until my head hurts. :confused:
I figure the best thing to do is get idea from everyone who's been down this road before. So if you have good pics of your engine & plumbing. . .let's see 'em.
Any other input on brands, hose type, suppliers, etc would be a big help also.
Later
Hemicbx
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/9big_batch.jpg
Get hold of SuperDave here on the boards, He has all the stuff your will need to plumb your boat at a very good price.

[hack job]

Originally posted by cal***boat
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/9big_batch.jpg
Get hold of SuperDave here on the boards, He has all the stuff your will need to plumb your boat at a very good price.
i second that if he would have had this stuff last year i would have save some serious cash!;)

[superdave013]

Well with out pimping the stuff I have.
There are three types. Compression fittings, cutters and crimp. You need a crimping machine for the crimps so you don't see those on many boats. I think compression fittings are easier to put together then cutters. And I think they are easier to re-use. You will want to re-use one someday. Don't think so? Price a -10 fitting and you'll see what I mean.
I guess they are not FAA approved but they work kick ass.
The ones I have are compression, so are Aeroquip, Russel and many others.
As far as mix and matching. The finishes change from brand to brand. Earls says to only use their hose on their fittings (wonder why). I've used other hoses with out a problem on their ends.
But all in all they all have a JIC 37 degree B nut or else they are not AN fittings.
I like XRP fittings but they are real spendy.
Here's a link to Jeg's site so you can look and most of the brands that are out there. The one's I have are pretty much like the Aeroquip stuff. Jeg's site (http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/CategoryDisplay?cgmenbr=361&cgrfnbr=509)
If you have any intrest in the ones I have shoot me a PM and I'll fill you in.
To know what size AN fitting really are it's easy.
1/2" = 8/16 so a -8AN fitting is 1/2" and a -16 (16/16) is 1"

[Riverdog1]

Even at super discounted prices, it gets SPENDY. I spent over 1K do to everything. Whew! I will say, it all fades so don't buy the most expensive.

[superdave013]

Originally posted by Riverdog1
Even at super discounted prices, it gets SPENDY. I spent over 1K do to everything. Whew! I will say, it all fades so don't buy the most expensive.
I hear ya. I've sent tons myself.
Here's the scoop on what I have now. What do you tink of that pricing?
click click (http://www.v-driveboat.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=396)
I will be getting another batch soon. They will not be close outs and will have our logo etched on them. I'll still have deeply dicounted pricing. I'll have hose and all the NPT stuff then too.
Dang you, you got me to pimp them anyway. lol

[Hemicbx]

Looks like nice stuff SuperDave. I need to just sort out exactly what I want to do. I often get hung up on how I like to route things and what components (fule filter, etc.) I want to put where.
Hemicbx

[Ultra21]

Here's what I decided to do with mine. Shouldn't have to worry about those pesky leaks. Jusy my $.02. . . of course it costs much more than that.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/521/857camp_021.jpg

[sidewound]

ULTRA 21
That's a slick idea man! I've thought along those lines myself. he he he
I hard piped my oil return lines but used hose on my coolin system.
Ya got me thinkin about when I need to replace.
What size tubing did you use?
Single or double flares?
How hard was the stainles to work with?
Vibration cause any problems? Thanks for any info!
Peace Man!:cool:
CESAR

[LakesOnly]

I did some hardline:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/350New_Motor_Overhead-med.jpg
At the time, I figured it wasn't necessary to run AN- fittings along the front of my motor since my back seat hides the front of the engine anyway (nobody's gonna see them). I ended up liking the look of it. Also, copper is not water-corrosive. Mine use compression fittings.
LO

[LakesOnly]

Superdave, who manufactured your stuff?
LO

[Ultra21]

What size tubing did you use?
Single or double flares?
How hard was the stainles to work with?
Vibration cause any problems?
I used 5/8" stainless tubing with stainless AN fittings and a single flare. The stainless wasn't too bad since there weren't too many difficult bends (I'm speaking for my buddy who actually did all the work for me). Haven't had any vibration problems. I also used the brass (or maybe copper) flare sleeves for a better seal. Unfortunatly I have an engine cover so no oportunity to show it off. All the aluminum is polished and clear powder coated.

[cal***boat]

http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/350New_Motor_Overhead-med.jpg
Lakes who makes the headers you have on your engine ?
I like the way they lay down towards the engine and to center of the transom.
I would say it must be a real pain in the ass to adjust the valves with having to take off the headers every time to do it.
How much clearence is between the valve covers and the headers ?

[LakesOnly]

Originally posted by cal***boat
Lakes who makes the headers you have on your engine ?
I like the way they lay down towards the engine and to center of the transom.
I would say it must be a real pain in the ass to adjust the valves with having to take off the headers every time to do it.
How much clearence is between the valve covers and the headers ?
I get that question asked to me a lot....here's a quote lifted from another post:
Many moons ago, there was a jet boat header company in the city of South San Francisco called Sanderson Headers. They made boat headers exclusively.
Sanderson is still around today (in SSF) and they're bigger than ever. Unfortunately, they don't make boat headers anymore. The are in the custom's car and hot rod business and are famous for their custom headers that are on just about evey rod at all the custom car shows that come around.
sangermike used to work at Sanderson when he was like sixteen or so, and he identified them when I showed them to him. They needed work and I took them to Sanderson for some new NPT threads for the water lines to screw into. They guy that welded them had worked there for years and he confirmed that they are Sandersons and that he may have even fabricated them.
The chrome was wasted so I painted them flat black. Frankly, I think it works with the black gel-coat of my hull. I particularly like the way these headers wrap tightly around the valve covers and exit closely together:
Others have pointed out that this makes valve adjustment a pain in the ass. I would agree if I was pulling valve covers after every pass at the races--but I'm not; it's a lake boat and so what if I have to remove eight more bolts to pull the valve covers sometime (have never actually had to...hydraulic lifters).
LO

[burbanite]

Thank God!
I thought this was an invitation for HOSS to take more pictures...

[Special K]

I'm also thinking of getting rid of the black hoses and hose clamps over this winter; Having never worked with AN stuff before, what sizes of Stainless braided lines do you guys suggest using for fuel and water?
Any insider tips about working with this stuff for the new guy?

[Cs19]

Originally posted by Special K
I'm also thinking of getting rid of the black hoses and hose clamps over this winter; Having never worked with AN stuff before, what sizes of Stainless braided lines do you guys suggest using for fuel and water?
Any insider tips about working with this stuff for the new guy?
The first thing to consider what kind of fuel your motor needs. I would check to see what size pick ups your fuel tanks have before you do anything, you can plumb it with all the best S.S. braided line and fittings, but if you dont have large enough pick ups your wasting your time. -8 is the largest you will ever have to go for your fuel system.Thats what i would reccomend.
For the H2O I am running a number 10 line from the jet and then splitting to number 8s to the motor. You may not need something that large, you could probably get away with number 8 line for the whole water system.What kind of motor/carburetion are we talking?
Check with superdave he sells everything you will need to re-plumb your boat at prices you cannot beat.

[squirt]

I went the budget route and with the exception of a few things I'm happy with the way it came out. I saved enough $$$ doing it this way to even come out ahead after buying a banderlog water control valve.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/284gauge2-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/284Photo010.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/284IMG01.png
:wink:

[Hotcrusader76]

If you're looking for the best fitting on the market go with KBs XRP fitting. Yes the will cost you the most but offer a far better resistance to fadeing in the sun. The XRP fitting also installs a hell of lot easier on the braided hose than Aeroquip or any of these other off brands.
Now it's my experience that Superdaves brand "X" fittings are second best. What I mean by this is that I've tested and compared his brand "X" versions to Aeroquip and Russel versions only to find that they offer a better finish in color to, they mike out a little larger on the inside diameter (that's good for flow), and they install a little easier than Aeroquip (which for the novice is critical to sex appeal).
You make the call.
http://www.tpcracing.com/images/testimonials-454BBC_200.jpg

[Rexone]

My .02
First off I have not seen what SD's selling so I cannot comment on it's quality. He obviously has the pricing dialed.
From what I "have" seen though I agree with Ty that XRP is superior quality to other hose ends on the market, namely Aeroquip, Russell, Earls (I have not personally evaluated Goodridge so I will not include them in my comments). My history with SS plumbing in brief: Prior to Rex Marine (speedshop I had) and in the early days of Rex Marine I plumbed boats in addition to parts sales. I've personally installed I estimate in excess of 2000 hose ends. Not bragging just establishing why I feel qualified to write the following. I've used Aeroquip (used to sell them), Earls, and Russell. In the old days (70's-80's) Aeroquip used a cutter style end, similar to the design XRP uses today. They changed design on their commercial product sometime around 1990 to a compression style end (similar in design to Earls and Russell). The reason I was given by Aeroquip was to save cost and compete with these two other brands more competitively. As far as I know the Aeroquip certified aircraft ends are still cutter design to this day (legal to use on aircraft). At least that was the situation when the change occured as I tried to continue buying them but they were just too expensive (aircraft version). Someone will I'm sure correct me if that's old info. That in itself told me that the cutter design is superior from a sealing standpoint. This was also my belief at the time from installing hundreds of them vs the compression type fitting and understanding how the seal is actually accomplished between the hose and hose end. I handled Aeroquip's compression type for a short time and had alot of problems with them from a quality standpoint that I never had with their previous cutter design.
Enter KB (todays XRP) early 1990's or thereabouts. Newbie in the market at that time. Cutter design. Locally made. SUPERIOR thread quality to anything I've seen before or since. They are precision fit every time. During the 2 or so years I installed Aeroquip compression (2nd design) fittings I probably had a scrap rate of 3-4% from galling on assembly. I'll estimate in the last 15 years I haven't had 10 XRP hose ends gall. They are just a better part. I switched to XRP at that time and have never changed. I can buy Russell or Earls and probably Goodridge cheaper but I won't do it because I know XRP is top quality stuff. Price is secondary to me on this kind of stuff where a blown hose can trash a 20k engine in a heartbeat. A little price difference makes no sense to me in these situations.
Also XRP anodize quality is deep and rich and does not fade at the rate of Earls or Russell. I can tell you that too from experience using the others that customers would supply me.
So what's my purpose for this post? Yes I'd obviously like to sell some parts. But not at Superdaves expense. Like I said in the beginning I have not yet seen nor evaluated his product and will not comment on something I know nothing about.
But... for those considering buying Earls or Russell or Aeroquip or XRP (hose ends I do know about) from sources like Summit or Jegs, etc, all I ask is that you check out Rex XRP pricing. We are equal or less than those sources just mentioned for a superior (in my opinion) XRP hose end. So if you choose not to buy SuperDave's stuff for whatever reason just check our XRP out, that's all I'm after here. That and to offer whatever the experience I've had with the various brands to you so you can make more informed decisions on what's good and what's maybe not so good.

[superdave013]

Rexone,
Yes you are right. FAA fittings must be cutters. I find they are harder to re-use and you need to get the hose end cut pretty dang straight too. Not that that's a hard thing to do.
And yes, if you want the very best then the XRP is the way to go and from what I can see the Rex pricing is as good or in most cases a little better then the others.
I don't want this to turn into a pissing match on who's is better or this and that. If you want the best money can buy then get the XRP's. Rex is so great to deal with that it's a no brainer on where to get them.
I'm the first to say that mine are pretty much an Aeroquip knock off. People ask where they are made. Well they are made over seas (like most others) and if I rattled off the name of the place it won't mean anything to you. Unless you know most of the factorys over there.
My prices are cheep for 2 reasons.
I get then right from the factory with no middle man at all.
I'm hungry and I have zero over head as I have to come home every day any way. I can pass the savings on to you guys.
About pressure, I put a -6 hose together with a straight and 90 degree end. Pumped it up to a little under 500 psi. Pretty much I pumped it up to as much as the pump I had would go. It didn't blow the ends off so it should hang in there with the pressures us boat guys are running.
Galling threads. I have not had that happen to me yet. I say yet because it's happend to me many times with Earls. So I'm sure someday it will happen to me with these. If it happens to anyone just let me know and I'll send you another one right away. As a matter O fact, if for any reason someone is unhappy with these fittings I'll give a total refund no questions asked. Just please try to figure that out before you use all of them. If ya don't like them you will know when you put the first one together is what I'm sayin. I have not had any come back yet.
Ok, enough about all of that.
I love the s.s. hard lines too. This is not mine but I liked it so I snapped the pic. How could ya not like it.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/520/924_schiada_rudys1-med.jpg

[Taylorman]

I also used stainless tubing. I like the rigid tubing cause it does not flop around and i think it looks pretty cool also. It more permanent that ss braided line. Here are some pic's.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2377-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2378-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2383-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2385-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2371-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2372-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2374-med.JPG

[Taylorman]

I also used stainless tubing. I like the rigid tubing cause it does not flop around and i think it looks pretty cool also. It more permanent that ss braided line. Here are some pic's.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2377-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2378-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2383-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2385-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2371-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2372-med.JPG
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/161DCP_2374-med.JPG

[Hemicbx]

This is great! Lots of good info and lots of good pics/ideas. That's why these boards are so great.
Hemicbx

[Special K]

Originally posted by cs19
The first thing to consider what kind of fuel your motor needs. I would check to see what size pick ups your fuel tanks have before you do anything, you can plumb it with all the best S.S. braided line and fittings, but if you dont have large enough pick ups your wasting your time. -8 is the largest you will ever have to go for your fuel system.Thats what i would reccomend.
For the H2O I am running a number 10 line from the jet and then splitting to number 8s to the motor. You may not need something that large, you could probably get away with number 8 line for the whole water system.What kind of motor/carburetion are we talking?
Check with superdave he sells everything you will need to re-plumb your boat at prices you cannot beat.
Thanks cs19! That should probably give me a push in the right direction. I'm running a mild-medium 454 w/ a single 850 DP. Nothing too crazy, but this is my first boat. Speaking of fuel pick-ups, we just took out the tanks last weekend to find the pick-ups were ~3/16". Now to figure out how to change them out...
I'm definately going to check out SuperDave's stuff. Looks like a sweet deal...

[Cs19]

Jegs wants 8 or 9 dollars handling for every single item you order, That could get pretty ugly if you were to buy all your fittings from them.

[Cs19]

Originally posted by Special K
Thanks cs19! That should probably give me a push in the right direction. I'm running a mild-medium 454 w/ a single 850 DP. Nothing too crazy, but this is my first boat. Speaking of fuel pick-ups, we just took out the tanks last weekend to find the pick-ups were ~3/16". Now to figure out how to change them out...
I'm definately going to check out SuperDave's stuff. Looks like a sweet deal...
You can easily change your pick-ups to 1/2 pipe or whatever you want. You just need the weld in bungs to convert them, and a welder/fab guy that will weld on gas tanks, which is not risky if you take the right precautions. We have had this done on our aluminum tanks with no problems, and we saved quite a bit of money.Let me know if you need some help with it.
Alot of guys are using - 8 for fuel systems, I would think a number 6 might even cut it for your application, I dont know, ask around and see what the single carb guys are running.
-8 will be perfect for your water I would think.Just make sure you dont put anything thats restricting flow in your plumbing, keep everything the same size and you should be fine.

[ttmott]

Beware of the Earl's Super Stock hose ends. I had a failure on their 3/4" ends on the oil system during a hard run. Luckly smelled the oil when spraying all over the turbos and did not loose the engine. After assembly all of the hoses were tested to 250 PSIG as directed then placed into use. The hose feeding the oil filter let loose. When I called the tech at Earl's their response was that they knew about the problem on oil lines and the fix was to put a hose clamp over the hose. This, I thought was a real cop out and evidence that they are really having problems with the product. No attempt was made to correct or work with me on the issues. I probably have 50 of the hose ends on the boat. I ended up correcting it with a new product from gates rubber; heat shrink hose clamps. I put the heat shrink sleeve over the hose and fitting and all of the problems have gone away. Still, wouldn't buy the Earl's stuff again. See pic of the way the Earl's SS product looks like.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/521/1030toms_boat_plumbing_1.JPG

[LakesOnly]

I can't believe that nobody has had the nerve to show hemicbx their "plumbing.":D
LO

[Hemicbx]

Whoa now, LakesOnly! No need to go there. Engine plumbing only! There are other boards ofr any other sort of plumbing. . .

[Riverdog1]

I get that question asked to me a lot....here's a quote lifted from another post:
Many moons ago, there was a jet boat header company in the city of South San Francisco called Sanderson Headers. They made boat headers exclusively.
Sanderson is still around today (in SSF) and they're bigger than ever. Unfortunately, they don't make boat headers anymore. The are in the custom's car and hot rod business and are famous for their custom headers that are on just about evey rod at all the custom car shows that come around.
sangermike used to work at Sanderson when he was like sixteen or so, and he identified them when I showed them to him. They needed work and I took them to Sanderson for some new NPT threads for the water lines to screw into. They guy that welded them had worked there for years and he confirmed that they are Sandersons and that he may have even fabricated them.
The chrome was wasted so I painted them flat black. Frankly, I think it works with the black gel-coat of my hull. I particularly like the way these headers wrap tightly around the valve covers and exit closely together:
Others have pointed out that this makes valve adjustment a pain in the ass. I would agree if I was pulling valve covers after every pass at the races--but I'm not; it's a lake boat and so what if I have to remove eight more bolts to pull the valve covers sometime (have never actually had to...hydraulic lifters).
LO
I have 2 sets of Sanderson's in my attic. They were great. I have the belled ends and all. I switched them for Bassett Lay-Backs for no other reason that asthetics. I keep the Sanderson's just in case. Bassets come with the water jackets though, Sanderson's were an extra $200 bucks. Bassett gives you a "T" shirt though, LOL. I got a few sets of the Cork Screws though if you need them.

[HOSS]

Thank God!
I thought this was an invitation for HOSS to take more pictures...
Hmmmmm,,,where is that cmera?:idea:

[76Eliminator]

Mine are old and faded. If you want to avoid fading, Russell has them in Endura finish, which resembles nickel plating. I used the Russell Endura finish on my '34 Ford and they look really nice.
Chris
32402
32403

[-XTC-]

Here is a quick pick of the plumbing in my boat. :)
http://www.shorewoodgroup.com/***boat/webImage2.jpg
D.

[PLACECRAFT20]

Here is mine and its for SALE.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/521/boatpics_040.jpg

[patrolman808]

Jegs wants 8 or 9 dollars handling for every single item you order, That could get pretty ugly if you were to buy all your fittings from them.
Jegs and Summit just have the handling charge for the entire order, not individual item. I bought the yellow -10 Push-Loc hose and blue fittings from Jegs and used that for the plumbing on my boat. Looks pretty good too.

[FOURQ]

:D I can't believe that nobody has had the nerve to show hemicbx their "plumbing.":D
LO
Paul I was waiting for that comment and I knew it would come from you ..happy fisting buddie :D :sqeyes:

[watergun4u]

here is a pic of what mine looks like, except the black rubber hose on the rear carb is no longer there, it was stainless, until it got smacked by a waterski, and cressed it, but it has since been replaced!:D

[shaun]

superdave013,
Do you sell fittings that are black?
ex: http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/ear-at800106erl_w.jpg
Sorry i havnt called you yet either, i had some delays..

[Unchained]

I'd like to submit my entry for the plumbers nightmare award.
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/Plumbers_nightmare_.jpg
In this pic you can see aux fuel pump with lines and check valve, fuel rail lines, MAP sensor, wastegate lines, cam driven fuel pump and lines, fuel filter and pressure gauge, water lines, turbo oil pressure lines, turbo oil drain lines, intercooler lines, compressor intake tubes, crank trigger, etc. and the other end of the engine is an electricians nightmare.
You can see how close this all is in relation to the back of the boat at the bottom of the picture and the direct drive alternator is not even mounted in there yet.

[R.A.D.man]

Unchained, is that a household water pressure electrical switch mounted atop the intake unnder the grey plastic cap? If so, what system does it trigger?

[Unchained]

Unchained, is that a household water pressure electrical switch mounted atop the intake under the grey plastic cap? If so, what system does it trigger?
Good eye. For the cooling system I have a 12 volt RV diaphragm electric pump that puts out 5 gpm that will take care of idleing and low speed. While planed out the cav plate force feed pickup will build pressure and activate that well pump switch to shut off the elect pump. It is as yet unproven.
I measured the flow coming out of the block at idle on the garden hose and it took 2 -3 gpm to keep the engine cool.
I didn't want to point that switch out in case someone thought it looked "hillbilly" :D THANKS A LOT :D

[R.A.D.man]

If you had put a pressure tank in there with the switch, then that might have crossed the hilbilly line. For now, that's just good ol shade tree engineering at its finest. :D

[bead]

and ready to drop in boat