Best Engine Builders??

[Relaxalot]

Long time lurker, first time poster. I need some help in finding a new engine for my Carrera 257 deck boat. I want something that is turnkey, dependable and will run in the mid 80's. I currently run a 454 mag with a B-1 24p to 64 mph. Can anyone suggest an engine builder in the So Cal or Havasu areas? I need steering upgrades also. Can I stay with my stock B-1? I have spoken with a few people and they have suggested 540 block N/A motors. I have been warned to stay away from superchargers because of dependability issues? In other words, where can I buy a turnkey, kickass 600 plus horse motor?? And, (this is the hard part, how much will it cost??)
Thanks!

[Havasu Hangin']

I good place to start would be Gordon at Paul Phaff in Huntington Beach.
(714)894-7573
Teague makes a 620HP 509-based n/a engine...but it's expensive (like most of his stuff).
I would think steering upgrades are a must...as for the Bravo, depending on how you drive, I would upgrade (before the grenade).

[gnarley]

Originally posted by Relaxalot
I have been warned to stay away from superchargers because of dependability issues? In other words, where can I buy a turnkey, kickass 600 plus horse motor?? And, (this is the hard part, how much will it cost??)
Thanks!
It all depends on how much you want to spend ;) Blower motors can be just as reliable as N/A motors if built and tuned right. The blower just adds 1 more level of complexity to you mix and cost.
How much cash you got???

[Relaxalot]

I think I can get what I want without going with the blower. I have heard that a whipple or a procharger could boost my current 454 mag to the high 70's or maybe 80. I have been told to expect the motor to last only two seasons. I was thinking instead of selling my stock motor and buying a new 540. I will check into Phaff. Thanks for the tip. Anyone else have an engine suggestion?? How much can I expect to spend on a well built 540 that runs on pump gas that will last?
Thanks,
Dan

[Cs19]

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[Cs19]

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[bigkatboat]

$17550.00, 540, pump (92) gas, dyno tested (before install), 710 HP, 680 torque, all under 5500 RPMs. Exhaust system extra, external steering REQUIRED. No core charges, all new. Warranty available with REV. limiter install. 45 to 60 days to build. :p

[LVjetboy]

Make sure you know the power level (and performance) you want before deciding. Rated and actual two different things and do make a difference. I think most builders and advertisers talk rated or corrected. If you're thinking actual you may be dissapointed. Cost? Well, often you get what you pay for. Blowers can get big numbers at a lower cost but there's compromises. At the power level you're talking, I think n/a is the way to go if you can do it. At much higher power levels, blower or turbo makes sense.
jer

[DogHouse]

Another builder that I and several others on the boards have had good luck with is Larry Peto in Tucson. He is definitely worth a call, 520-623-5373.

[gmocnik]

as long as everyone else is pimping their favorites, i'll cast my vote for gary teague at gt perormance in montclair. i have had their whippled 540 for two seasons with no drama...as with anything good...it ain't cheap...

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by LVjetboy
Make sure you know the power level (and performance) you want before deciding. Rated and actual two different things and do make a difference. I think most builders and advertisers talk rated or corrected. If you're thinking actual you may be dissapointed. Cost? Well, often you get what you pay for. Blowers can get big numbers at a lower cost but there's compromises. At the power level you're talking, I think n/a is the way to go if you can do it. At much higher power levels, blower or turbo makes sense.
jer
very good advise!!!! welcome to the REAL WORLD;)
Omega

[OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET]

Originally posted by cs19
I would highly reccomend DNE motorsports in Costa mesa,Ca. a call to him would definaltly be worth your time. He has lots of experience in building stout pump gas motors, ask around on the boards here, he has a handful of customers and all of them have been more than satisfied.The bottomline is your going to spend some cash on this thing, you definatly need to make some calls and feel the guys out and see who you are the most comfortable with.
As far as a price, it depends on what you have to start with and what yours goals are, you mentioned you only want 600 horse, thats no prob maybe even with all cast iron parts, or a decent aluminum head. If your set on pump gas compresion, you can easily see 800 horse with the right combination and run the piss out of it all day, if you can afford something like that.
What do you have to start with? Or are you planning on getting all new stuff? I would steer clear of those "catalog" motors personally, I think they can be overpriced, besides that when you have one built you can reach your goals and not compromise with anything.
still pimpin' I see:rolleyes: just make sure you laminate your dyno sheet and carry it with you!!!!
Omega

[Blown 472]

Then there is this guy in oklahoma that builds some really kick ass motors. I think he is on the boards and he had a build up that you can see.

[Whipped Caliber]

Originally posted by Havasu Hangin'
I good place to start would be Gordon at Paul Phaff in Huntington Beach.
(714)894-7573
Teague makes a 620HP 509-based n/a engine...but it's expensive (like most of his stuff).
I would think steering upgrades are a must...as for the Bravo, depending on how you drive, I would upgrade (before the grenade).
I 2nd that Gordon build my 565ci they stand behind what they build!!:)

[jackpunx]

Originally posted by gmocnik
as long as everyone else is pimping their favorites, i'll cast my vote for gary teague at gt perormance in montclair. i have had their whippled 540 for two seasons with no drama...as with anything good...it ain't cheap...
I second that.. I got 45hrs on mine.. the onlything I do is change the oil:D

[bigkatboat]

More or less power depends on; your cash flow, and second on how the motor is being used. Look for torque figures (a low flat curve is best), and "see it dyno run" before install. Good luck!

[Cs19]

Originally posted by OMEGA_BUBBLE_JET
still pimpin' I see:rolleyes: just make sure you laminate your dyno sheet and carry it with you!!!!
Omega
What are trying to say here ? That makes no sence.

[CrazyHippy]

One of our own Board members does some BITCHEN motors.
Get ahold of Infomaniac here on the boards. I think he is in Oklahoma, but his work is awesome from what i've seen, and he seems like a real stand up guy
BJH

[Bow Tie Omega]

DNE seems to be the place to go for the biggest bang for the buck. HBJet used them, my brother (brendella jet) is in the process of doing a build up with them right now, he is very pleased with their prices. Look at October's Hot Boat Issue and they did an article on HBJet's build up, 700+ hp on pump gas, using an iron GM block and heads (rec port).

[bigkatboat]

Please tell us at WHAT RPMs those figures are being made. This man has a Bravo I, I don't think he wants to run the motor much over 5500 RPMs (unless he has a B- MAX). I can build you a 'pump gas' 461", oval port, 2 bolt, JET BOAT motor that will make over 520 hp. BUT! It won't have the low end torque, for an outdrive. It also makes the POWER in a narrow band, perfect for a jet drive, dead dog in an O/I boat. Please, let's try to give accurate info. here. As in any normally aspirated motor, the "tricks" are in the heads and cam timing, so ask about HOW and WHERE the power is made. (example) You can make 700 hp many ways; a 700 cu in, at 5000 rpms, a 500 cu in, at 6000 rpms, a 350 cu in, at 8500 rpms, or a 250 cu in, at 10500 rpms. What works for you? Look at the torque! That is what moves the load (under 5250 rpms)! Thanks for reading.

[Bow Tie Omega]

Read the article, like my post says, October issue of Hot Boat, they document the complete build up of this motor. This motor is making 665 foot pounds of torque at 4500 rpm. At 5200 rpm it is making 666 ft/lbs of torque and 660 hp. At 6300 rpm, this motor will put out 610 ft/lbs of torque and 732 hp .This guy asked to make his boat hit the mid 80's from currently doing 64, that is not going to happen using a 520 hp 5000 rpm 2 bolt. Of course there will have to be some changes to make this motor work better in a I/O. In my opinion, he is going to have to shell out some money to do some work on the outdrive anyways. I think that everyone will agree that more rpm under a load equates to more speed. Your not going to get that from a 520 hp 5000 rpm 2 bolt main. To get speed you need increased rpm. To get increased rpm you need HP and torque and an outdrive to handle that load. What I was recommending was that the man give DNE a call and see what they can do for him. ANd I know this motor would be ALOT LESS then $17,000.

[Relaxalot]

Thanks for all the advice. I have talked to a few builders and they seem to lean towards maintaining my current efi system, adding a whipple, reprogram the ecu, new aluminum heads, new exhaust system and new valve train. Options are outdrive upgrade, cam upgrade, steering upgrade. I am told that my current 454 with these upgrades will put out close to 700 hp. I am unsure of torque curves. These upgrades should put me in the high 70's for sure, mid 80's maybe. It is sounding expensive but fun. My engine has 138 hours on it. I am told that with these upgrades it should be a dependable pump gas lake cruiser. I guess the other option is to sell my 454 and buy a new bigger block. Is there any advantage to keeping the 454 for insurance reasons?? Thanks again ..... Dan

[gnarley]

When you get INS they ask about advertised speed or top speed. If you have an accident, which speed played a part due to your modifications and the INS Co was able to tell this I doubt if they would pay the claim, as you were not truthful with them.

[Fired Up]

How much more HP can you expect from just upgrading your heads? I've got the stock large oval port BBC heads on my flat. To increase the valves from the stock 2.06/1.72 size valves to 2.19/1.88 I've read makes them work much better. Or would going to a good set of aftermarket aluminum heads with longer ports and bigger valves be better? I'm turning about 6000rpm's now, 10.5:1 compression. Looking for affordable HP.

[Blown 472]

Originally posted by Bow Tie Omega
Read the article, like my post says, October issue of Hot Boat, they document the complete build up of this motor. This motor is making 665 foot pounds of torque at 4500 rpm. At 5200 rpm it is making 666 ft/lbs of torque and 660 hp. At 6300 rpm, this motor will put out 610 ft/lbs of torque and 732 hp .This guy asked to make his boat hit the mid 80's from currently doing 64, that is not going to happen using a 520 hp 5000 rpm 2 bolt. Of course there will have to be some changes to make this motor work better in a I/O. In my opinion, he is going to have to shell out some money to do some work on the outdrive anyways. I think that everyone will agree that more rpm under a load equates to more speed. Your not going to get that from a 520 hp 5000 rpm 2 bolt main. To get speed you need increased rpm. To get increased rpm you need HP and torque and an outdrive to handle that load. What I was recommending was that the man give DNE a call and see what they can do for him. ANd I know this motor would be ALOT LESS then $17,000.
Not quite sure a tunnel rammed motor is the way to go with a stern drive.:rolleyes:

[jackpunx]

Originally posted by Fired Up
How much more HP can you expect from just upgrading your heads? I've got the stock large oval port BBC heads on my flat. To increase the valves from the stock 2.06/1.72 size valves to 2.19/1.88 I've read makes them work much better. Or would going to a good set of aftermarket aluminum heads with longer ports and bigger valves be better? I'm turning about 6000rpm's now, 10.5:1 compression. Looking for affordable HP.
About 50hp
and your going to take some weight off as well

[Robbie Racer]

I would also recommend talking to both DNE in Costa Mesa and Larry Peto in Tucson. They both have built kick ass reliable motors for me in the past. Both can build a first class single carbed N/A 540" or 580" motor that can be extremely reliable and put out more power than your drive can handle. Good luck, R/R

[Bow Tie Omega]

Actually, my brother was told by DNE that the DNE 496 would perform nearly as well with a Holley HP 950 and Torker Intake.

[PHOTOGLOU]

I 2nd that Gordon build my 565ci they stand behind what they build!!:)
Gordon jennings is the best. built my 1200 hp 600 ci motors 109 hrs and only rebuilt the heads at 100 hrs changed the oil at run it hard

[SHAKEN Not Stirred]

Here's another Gordon Jennings motor.......
Pfaff.....Pfaff.....Pfaff.....
Hey.....Wasup Photoglou ????
CJG

[Eric455]

anyhow i know of a good builder if you need help thats all PM for more info
good luck

[SHAKEN Not Stirred]

Eric!......Step away from the crack pipe!!!
The Pfaff 600 EFI with a beefed-up drive from Max Machine Worx and hydraulic steering like Havasu Hangin said.....Done!
I don't think I have ever heard someone say that Pfaff builds a shit motor.
So why do you think $5K is expensive for assembly & dyno ???
What would you pay for all that work ??
When I'm paying $30K+ for a motor, I don't want low bid !!!
I want someone who will be in business next year.....
Hey....I bet you could finally sell that boat if you put a Pfaff motor in it!!!!!
OK....Go ahead and take another hit.....I'm done !!!!!
Hey Jay....Hope Steve got those stickers on your boat tonight.....
He was really caught up with Bobbits boat.....
CJG

[Eric455]

Eric!......Step away from the crack pipe!!!
The Pfaff 600 EFI with a beefed-up drive from Max Machine Worx and hydraulic steering like Havasu Hangin said.....Done!
I don't think I have ever heard someone say that Pfaff builds a shit motor.
So why do you think $5K is expensive for assembly & dyno ???
What would you pay for all that work ??
When I'm paying $30K+ for a motor, I don't want low bid !!!
I want someone who will be in business next year.....
Hey....I bet you could finally sell that boat if you put a Pfaff motor in it!!!!!
OK....Go ahead and take another hit.....I'm done !!!!!
Hey Jay....Hope Steve got those stickers on your boat tonight.....
He was really caught up with Bobbits boat.....
CJG
i condragulate you on ur 30k+ motor good luck and hope you enjoy it. i got nothing els to say.
and selling my boat had no biusness in this conversations.
eric

[don johnson]

Gary Teague in Montclair. He has been building my motors for 10 years. Currently i have twin blown 1050 HP motors that I have not touched in 2 years, short of normal maintenance, oil changes.
I support what many have said on the board, a blown motor, if built right, is every bit as reliable as a N/A. In your boat a blown motor could be just the ticket as the low and mid range torque a blown motor developes, as opposed to a N/A, would make that 257 really fun to drive. A blown deal would also allow you to run a little more propeller than a N/A which would increase your cruise speed dramatically.
Lastly, a blown deal is just a tune up away from 100 more HP, just change a pulley and make a few pounds more boost. Where as adding HP to an N/A deal can be very expensive. That is a really big consideration since you are prepared to start from scratch.... Once you hot rod your boat you may grow bored of its performance after a season or two and be serching for a little more. A blown deal really has its benefits then.
Good luck!

[Craig]

Another builder that I and several others on the boards have had good luck with is Larry Peto in Tucson. He is definitely worth a call, 520-623-5373.
Larry has a 580 for about 16 grand, carb to pan.

[BrendellaJet]

$17550.00, 540, pump (92) gas, dyno tested (before install), 710 HP, 680 torque, all under 5500 RPMs. Exhaust system extra, external steering REQUIRED. No core charges, all new. Warranty available with REV. limiter install. 45 to 60 days to build. :p
That seems kinda pricey. Im getting more power, more torque for a lot less, although I am supplying a few parts. Even adding the parts to my price, Ill come in a couple g's cheaper.

[MAXIMUS]

Relaxalot I would put a call into Paul Grichar of Grichar racing engines. He is located in Baldwin Park & works out of his house. He works alone & does all the machine work himself! Probably one of the best in the buisness!!! Also don't have to pay those high prices for some of the cool names... As far as dyno #s wouldn't worry too much & just tell him what you want to achieve. I promise he will deliver that & more! 626-962-5877 He answers the phone from 8am -9pm. Will be on vacation for a couple of weeks starting saturday! Like I said he is one of the best!

[cdog]

Seems like alot of you boat only guys have alot more money than sence. 30k for a 15k blower engine is insane. Stop and look around at the hot rod scene. There are only two differences between a marine engine and a automotive engine. Cam and clearences (only if your running open cooling). I would recomend that if you live in CA or AZ you run efi. When you have to start you engine at a crowed dock and run it up to 1500 rpm to warm it up with a carb your sure to get a noise ticket or thrown out. The same parts that say Marine or Corvette cost twice as much as their like parts.

[superdave013]

Some GREAT engine builders have been brought up here.
Might as well toss my guy in.
George @ Clay Smith Cams 714 523-0530
support your local speed shops!

[flat broke]

I am going to have to give my nod to Dave at DNE as well. Bang for the buck wise I'm way stoked about my numbers for the $$ paid. For that matter, I know people who have paid a lot more for less HP!!! Better than that, he worked WITH me to make a couple of decisions on parts selection. At no point in time did I feel like I was being told I HAD to do something. Then again knowing that spending a little bit more in certain areas going into the build will assure better reliability may have been the difference there.
My total build including all the goodies that I bought outside of Dave's scope my total was right below 16k and I can tell you I got more than 720hp!! I'm not going into the numbers on the board because the same old DNE haters will do their thing and thats not what this thread is about. Suffice it to say that my combination runs pump gas, IS a tunnel ram motor, and made 700 or more ft lbs of torque from 5100 to 5700, so it would do nicely on a outdrive that doesn't like to live much above 5500rpm. All this from a little 498 because its what I had to start with. And this isn't a drag motor thats only meant to run for a couple seconds at a time. I've already had a couple extended WOT runs and everything is working perfect (knock on wood :) ) One of the coolest things about my mill, is that there isn't another one out there just like it. Similar combinations maybe, but its not a cookbook motor that you will see on every 25' cat sold by xyz manufacturer. Not that there is anything wrong with cookbook type packages.
The only thing my cost didn't include was the fabricated tunnel ram top we made for the motor, the air breather setup, and the Lightning exhaust.
The bottom line is that you have some very good choices available. Some of them build the same motor time and time again, and it works time and time again. Others build custom motors based on your application/budget/existing parts base.
As an asside, BTO, I didn't realize that Brendella Jet was your bro. I'll be real interested to see his finsihed motor hit the dyno. More cubes than all of us 496/498 guys, so it should pump some real nice numbers.
Chris

[ARS Marine inc.east]

Seems like alot of you boat only guys have alot more money than sence. 30k for a 15k blower engine is insane. Stop and look around at the hot rod scene. There are only two differences between a marine engine and a automotive engine. Cam and clearences (only if your running open cooling). I would recomend that if you live in CA or AZ you run efi. When you have to start you engine at a crowed dock and run it up to 1500 rpm to warm it up with a carb your sure to get a noise ticket or thrown out. The same parts that say Marine or Corvette cost twice as much as their like parts.
I'm Not much for bad rappin:
BUT How do you figure that $30K Is insane? :rolleyes:
I have worked out in Florida , and back home in Chicago .
For some BIG H.P. Engines Shops, $30k wouldnt even get you a 1000H.P. Tunnel Ram Motor, That will LIVE IN A BOAT, Plenty of Car guys have Tried it And have Failed "They know who they are!" Their is a little More to it than just Change a Cam And open up the Bearing Clearances,
If that is what you think the 30 is gouing towards YES that Is INSANE.
But there is a Whole nother World in a marine Motor That makes BIG "REAL" H.P. And lives in a Boat for over 200 hours Of Hammer down Drivin.
Didnt Mean to Upset Anyone with this but There is a Ton of hours Involved in making A Marine motor last for over 200 hours making 1500 HP On 92oct Fuel
And it get me Pantys in a curl When your average guy says You Paid To Much For That Motor You should have just changed the CAM and Bearings :cool: And You would have saved $25k

[BrendellaJet]

I
As an asside, BTO, I didn't realize that Brendella Jet was your bro. I'll be real interested to see his finsihed motor hit the dyno. More cubes than all of us 496/498 guys, so it should pump some real nice numbers.
Chris
Yep, hes my Bro. Joe, Dave did not say the Torker would work. He likes the Victor jr for my motor-I elected not to use the tunnel ram, but Im thinking that with all the cubes I might go with it just to get the most power available, my wallet will probably tell me to keep the single hp950 since thats what Ive got.
Anyone considering a new boat motor should check DNE out. Just talking to him will probably convince you. Hes a killer guy and knows his sh&t, and doesn't mind answering your ?s.

[flat broke]

Yep, hes my Bro. Joe, Dave did not say the Torker would work. He likes the Victor jr for my motor-I elected not to use the tunnel ram, but Im thinking that with all the cubes I might go with it just to get the most power available, my wallet will probably tell me to keep the single hp950 since thats what Ive got.
Anyone considering a new boat motor should check DNE out. Just talking to him will probably convince you. Hes a killer guy and knows his sh&t, and doesn't mind answering your ?s.
On the T ram issue, I was where you are 4 months ago, and I can't be happier I went duals.... except doing that t-ram top on our own (though I think its slicker than the double spacer dealio) I had a Demon 850 and was going to go single carb (Cyclone's ol single carb motor is to blame for the initial plunge to make some "real" HP :) ) But after talking to Dave as the efficiency level increased in my parts selection, the single carb seemed to be leaving more and more on the table. To do a kick ass big carb single plane deal was going to cost more than going to duals on a TR2. Sooo following in my previous footsteps in the build, I figgured why get cheap when the big money has already been spent.
If its of any help, after agonizing over the intake issue with Dave, I learned that more would be gained from a better intake than a bigger carb if I had to choose between one or the other. In the end it didn't matter because I went to duals, but thats what I got out of the conversations while I was kicking around the single vs dual debate. BTW, the cnc'd Victor that he'd probably prefer costs almost as much as a 2nd 950 to go on top of your bad boy. ;) Keep us posted on your dyno date
And since we're both brothers of "I've been hosed by a convicted felon gelcoater who's name we wont mention" club members we have one more thing in common ;)
Chris

[BrendellaJet]

(Cyclone's ol single carb motor is to blame for the initial plunge to make some "real" HP :) )
Keep us posted on your dyno date
And since we're both brothers of "I've been hosed by a convicted felon gelcoater who's name we wont mention" club members we have one more thing in common ;)
Chris
LOL, whats even funnier is that the Victor Jr and HP 950 that I have I bought from Cyclone! Ill see about the duals. I can always change later if I want more power. 800 on a single carb in such a tiny boat should suffice though.(I hope)
Im shooting for hitting the dyno in February, March at the latest.
Yes, the gel on BTO's boat has some serious flaws. Too bad, looked so good when it was perfect. Now its a 10 footer, Joe can fix it though. For the money he and hacker spent it really sucks to see things go to sh%t. Hopefully doing my gel myself turns out better...

[tahitijet]

You might want to try contacting Barry (Obnoxious racing engines). He is just down the road from you. He blttl my motor and far excedded my expectations. He surfs the boards regularly try emailing him at AGT001@aol.com

[Cs19]

BUT how much did Bill Hannah pay for that big blower motor in his CP?
Rio
Does it really matter? The topic is BEST or FAVORITE engine builder, not cheapest motor.

[probablecause]

My hat goes off to Lew Larson in South Gate. Races Drag boats and is an engine builder also. Has his own shop. Great bang for you buck if you are not in a hurry. Just my two cents. :D

[cdog]

I'm Not much for bad rappin:
BUT How do you figure that $30K Is insane? :rolleyes:
I have worked out in Florida , and back home in Chicago .
For some BIG H.P. Engines Shops, $30k wouldnt even get you a 1000H.P. Tunnel Ram Motor, That will LIVE IN A BOAT, Plenty of Car guys have Tried it And have Failed "They know who they are!" Their is a little More to it than just Change a Cam And open up the Bearing Clearances,
If that is what you think the 30 is gouing towards YES that Is INSANE.
But there is a Whole nother World in a marine Motor That makes BIG "REAL" H.P. And lives in a Boat for over 200 hours Of Hammer down Drivin.
Didnt Mean to Upset Anyone with this but There is a Ton of hours Involved in making A Marine motor last for over 200 hours making 1500 HP On 92oct Fuel
And it get me Pantys in a curl When your average guy says You Paid To Much For That Motor You should have just changed the CAM and Bearings :cool: And You would have saved $25k
No Offence to you man but i've been building engines for over 15 years or so.
Alot of you marine only guys toot your own horn and act like your super special marine parts are different than everyone elses. When it comes down to it they are all made in the same place. A 540 stroker kit will run you about 4k and a dart block will run about $3,200 machined. Throw in aftermarket iron heads complete with inkonell exhaust valves and good springs about $1,500. At this point you have a stout 700 hp + engine.
When you have a 100 mph v-drive like I had we can talk but untill then I'm not going to argue about the if's an ands of engine building.
By the way you are comparing apples to oranges when you throw in a 1500 hp engine into the same mix as a 750 hp pleasure boat blower engine. Secondly if you don't know how to build a engine of that caliber then you should'nt own one because they never are completely turn key.
If you want to spend 20k on an engine and 10k on a name go ahead. I'm sure they are great engines. I'm just saying that to those who know how there is a better way.
And to complete my rant. I just built and dyno'd a 540 with efi set up to run a procharger with 8.5 compression and it dyno'd at 585 hp and 648 ftlb's of tq. Turn key for 12k. With the blower at 8-10 lb's of boost we will see 900hp +. If I had one of these marine shops build this engine it would have cost twice as much. The only exception to this that I know is Fonse performance in New Jersey. Al Sr. is a honest guy who will make some money off of you without poking you in the ass.

[Cs19]

Check your pms there tough guy.

[powerplay230]

"__________________
How about a six pack of shut the **** up! "
Why are we comparing V-drives to I/O's.... not the same dealio either way. ??
:boxingguy :idea: :( :chi:

[ARS Marine inc.east]

http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5396&stc=1 cdog:
No Offence Taken :smile:
You are 100% correct about the cost of ,you or I Building a motor. For about 15k I built a 540 with ALL Good Parts Carrilo,jesel,Ferea,JE,Dart,Sonny Not a kit
But when there are People that dont have a clue about the basic's
Maintence,Valve lash,Check timing .
You have to make sure the stuff is not going to come apart, Because thesae people dont have a clue they get in the boat and HAMMER Down. The big dollars is not all just for the motor its also the jacketd headers, motor plates,Velvet drive to handle the H.P.
And your comment about Your 100mph you HAD
I still own my 112 MPH Eliminator jet That only Runs On Pump GAS.
That I built 7 yrs ago.
The Cheyenne Is my New Project
I'll Do the same tune on it as the Eliminator
Schould get 110MPH At the very least
Not to shabby for a lake Boat :cool:http://www.***boat.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5398&stc=1

[cigar]

Gt Engineering Montclair

[78Southwind]

:cool: :D

[Fiat48]

How much more HP can you expect from just upgrading your heads? I've got the stock large oval port BBC heads on my flat. To increase the valves from the stock 2.06/1.72 size valves to 2.19/1.88 I've read makes them work much better. Or would going to a good set of aftermarket aluminum heads with longer ports and bigger valves be better? I'm turning about 6000rpm's now, 10.5:1 compression. Looking for affordable HP.
Sell those heads to a jet boater who sees no rpm, buy a set of heads. :hammerhea
Affordable HP. Now that is a tough one.
I think that 78Eliminator has a set of 990 heads ready to go that he wants to part with.

[Kindsvater Flat]

When these guys talk..... listen close.
http://www.schoutenranch.com/mike/knowledge.JPG

[Havasu Cig]

I good place to start would be Gordon at Paul Phaff in Huntington Beach.
(714)894-7573
Teague makes a 620HP 509-based n/a engine...but it's expensive (like most of his stuff).
I would think steering upgrades are a must...as for the Bravo, depending on how you drive, I would upgrade (before the grenade).
A friend had some Pfaff 600's in his 36 Daytona. They look like 500 efi's. He did not have the boat long but he liked the motors alot.
He has teague 1000's in the boat he has now and so far they have been good motors.
You can't go wrong with either Teague or Pfaff.

[Dave C]

sssshhhhhh.....keeep it down... your giving away all the "good secrets"...... ;) ;)
When it comes down to it they are all made in the same place. A 540 stroker kit will run you about 4k and a dart block will run about $3,200 machined. Throw in aftermarket iron heads complete with inkonell exhaust valves and good springs about $1,500. At this point you have a stout 700 hp + engine.
.
BTW don't forget that the accessories for I/O's can double the price of the motor. Dang, intakes, pumps & exhaust for I/O's can top $5,000 by themselves. :sqeyes:

[ARS Marine inc.east]

Just seen this on the Blower page
AND maybe CDOG wants to reconsider 30K-50K
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/181pic30145.jpg

[PHOTOGLOU]

Eric!......Step away from the crack pipe!!!
The Pfaff 600 EFI with a beefed-up drive from Max Machine Worx and hydraulic steering like Havasu Hangin said.....Done!
I don't think I have ever heard someone say that Pfaff builds a shit motor.
So why do you think $5K is expensive for assembly & dyno ???
What would you pay for all that work ??
When I'm paying $30K+ for a motor, I don't want low bid !!!
I want someone who will be in business next year.....
Hey....I bet you could finally sell that boat if you put a Pfaff motor in it!!!!!
OK....Go ahead and take another hit.....I'm done !!!!!
Hey Jay....Hope Steve got those stickers on your boat tonight.....
He was really caught up with Bobbits boat.....
CJG
Stickers went on great

[Blown 472]

Doesn't dne use the "happy" westech dyno?????

[TexasJet]

Isn't " affordible horsepower " an oxymoron? :idea:

[GM Killer]

Try Jim Guthrie. He is reasonable pricebuild whatever you want. PM me if you need the number