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likwidsukr
12-16-2003, 07:05 PM
If I install two subs in front of boat (SEE PICS) in the bow facing back to the driver would it sound bad, as in not good?
And who makes a good 12" marine sub that is not overpriced for rec. boating?
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/3484tahiti5.JPG
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/3484tahiti4-med.JPG

Havasu Hangin'
12-16-2003, 07:16 PM
Lots of people do it...sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
The problem is the possibility for cancellation (if the box is too far up front), as the stowage area can act as another enclosure. It's all about wavelength.
I've seen subs hit hard enough to flex the deck, but little bass comes out.

likwidsukr
12-16-2003, 08:10 PM
Where would the best place be to add subs for the best sound? Rear sear bottom or sides or...?
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/3484tahiti1.JPG

Havasu Hangin'
12-16-2003, 08:30 PM
Originally posted by likwidsukr
Where would the best place be to add subs for the best sound?
My personal preference in under the back seat, but you can put them under the bow. Either place has the potential to get kicked, and you're gonna give up some stowage area, but I like under the back seat for two reasons:
1. Less weight up front
2. Less chance for cancellation firing into the bow area (instead of out of it).
Like I said, lots of guys do them under the bow...sometimes it's not an option. Kinda like beer preference....
...if you like Coors Light, do you not drink if you buddy only has Bud Light?

Infomaniac
12-16-2003, 11:43 PM
Don't make me post pics of Mrs. Infomaniac's Okie stereo system.
Ranks right up there with the beer can grill.

Havasu Hangin'
12-17-2003, 04:41 AM
Originally posted by Infomaniac
Don't make me post pics of Mrs. Infomaniac's Okie stereo system..
Is there such a thing as a "quad rotor sub"?

likwidsukr
12-17-2003, 06:01 AM
LMAO, funny stuff. I just do not want to waste time and money on something that won't sound as good as if I put it somewhere else.

locogringo
12-20-2003, 11:23 AM
I have mine put up front also they surprisingly hit really hard and can be heard outside also. I open the two hatches when I play them really hard.
Here's a pic of it...
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/26DSC01480-med.JPG

riverbound
12-20-2003, 05:56 PM
We do a lot of boats at my shop and whenver I can put subs under the bow we put them there. I have never had a problem putting them under the bow.

Havasu Hangin'
12-20-2003, 06:15 PM
Originally posted by riverbound
We do a lot of boats at my shop and whenver I can put subs under the bow we put them there. I have never had a problem putting them under the bow.
Just curious...what kind of parameters do you use for the cabin (bow) install?
What (if any) characteristics do you take into account for box and/or subwoofer design for a bow install?

likwidsukr
12-20-2003, 06:18 PM
Originally posted by Havasu Hangin'
Just curious...what kind of parameters do you use for the cabin (bow) install?
What (if any) characteristics do you take into account for box and/or subwoofer design for a bow install?
I second that HH. I would like that info as well.

Havasu Hangin'
12-20-2003, 07:29 PM
Originally posted by likwidsukr
I second that HH. I would like that info as well.
Here's my (long ramble) on subs in the bow.
Since the bow area (or cabin in a bigger boat) is an enclosure itself, has a tuning frequency. This frequency is dictated by size, as well as the size of the opening (along with interior, etc.).
The audio competition guys have figured out that frequency tuning is very important if they want to win (AKA- loud). There was a guy hitting 160+dbs with a single 10" last year...I don't think he could have done it without calculating the tuning frequency of his car, then designing the box (and sub) to match.
Placing subs in the bow induces the sub frequencies into this area, before exiting into the seating area. Now...what you've created is a big "band pass" to some degree. Depending on the tuning frequency of the sub box and the bow area, it could create standing wave problems (or none at all).
How many times have you heard bow subs that are "boomy"? They sound loud as hell in the bow are (even flexes the deck), but loses something once you get outside. Probably more often than not.
Smaller jets are less prone to this, as the smaller enclosure with the bigger opening will usually have a higher tuning frequency than the subs.
So I guess what I'm saying is that bow sub installers usually fall into one of two categories:
1. Those that calculate the tuning frequency, and build a custom enclosure to match.
2. A kid with a drill, some particle board, and a saw that put them there "because there's lots of room".
There are very few #1's out there...as most installers are looking to get you out the door (I used to be one)...and calculating the interior surface area (and accoustics) of a boat is not fun.
Sometimes you'll get lucky with #2, but I'd look to #1 for guidance.
I built my pedestal for my subs 'cuz I ain't smart enough to figger how boomy they'd be under the bow....and I didn't want to chance it.
http://www.highperformancecars.com/hhangin/rear_pedestal.jpg
http://www.highperformancecars.com/hhangin/subs.jpg

likwidsukr
12-21-2003, 01:42 PM
HH
Are those speaker covers and what did you go with,speaker wise on your box?
I have to build a seat in back so that looks like the best route!!!!
What size wood is that and is it plywood? Did you do the upholstery, it looks great. Looking for ideas.

Havasu Hangin'
12-21-2003, 02:35 PM
Originally posted by likwidsukr
HH
Are those speaker covers and what did you go with,speaker wise on your box?
I have to build a seat in back so that looks like the best route!!!!
What size wood is that and is it plywood? Did you do the upholstery, it looks great. Looking for ideas.
Those are some cheap wire covers that I painted white. I really liked the Kicker covers, but they were too tight.
http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/products/2001/206/l20601G10.jpeg
Maybe RD could make you some cool billet covers...I was going for the "stealth" look.
I made my pedestal/box out of 3/4" marine ply- strong stuff, and no gaps, so it's accousically as good (if not better) than MDF. I also glassed it...so it'll probably outlive my boat. Each chamber has .75 cu ft.
The upholstery was unbelievably simple. I had already rounded the edges, so I took it to an upolstry place- for $20, he laid some padding down, and stapled the vinyl to the front. Probably took him 5 minutes. I glued some black felt to the back, that can be seen from the engine compartment.
Here's how it looked when I dry-fit the seat on top.
http://www.highperformancecars.com/hhangin/rear_bench_2.jpg
There are other ways to go- Slick made a cool "down-firing" pedestal...you can't even see his subs through the slot. Another friend of mine did his firing through ports. I didn't have much room, so I went with the traditional front-firing (sealed) baffle setup.
The speakers are Infinity Perfects powered by a JBL 1200.1- the same setup as RC (I think he copied me...but don't say anything).
It'll rattle your teeth...not bad for some little 10's...

riverbound
12-21-2003, 05:19 PM
Sorry to not get back to you sooner HH but I have been very busy at the shop (xmas time) When we do a box in the bow we do factor the amount of remaining air space and the size of the opening to the outside. but that is just to see if those perameters will affect the sound. We are not specifically using those to tune the subs to a specific frequency.
There is a little more involved than a drill, particle board and a saw.

Havasu Hangin'
12-21-2003, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by riverbound
There is a little more involved than a drill, particle board and a saw.
So you don't work at Best Buy, eh?
My theory is that if you box is tuned to a frequency higher than the cabin or bow area...then you'll get "boomy" or flat bass.
I just can't imagine trying to calculate (within 10%) some of those boat interior dimensions...it gives me a headache just thinking about it (unless I am getting $75/hour)...

riverbound
12-21-2003, 06:05 PM
No Best buy in my resume. :)

riverbound
12-21-2003, 06:07 PM
I don't get headaches thinking about it (I hire people to do the thinking for me)

likwidsukr
12-21-2003, 07:46 PM
What if I put 1 up in bow and 1 in seat or two in seat none in bow and vise versa?
What are everyone opinion??????

Havasu Hangin'
12-21-2003, 08:02 PM
Originally posted by likwidsukr
What if I put 1 up in bow and 1 in seat or two in seat none in bow and vise versa?
I wouldn't split them up...why build 2 boxes when 1 will do?

likwidsukr
12-22-2003, 12:18 AM
Originally posted by Havasu Hangin'
I wouldn't split them up...why build 2 boxes when 1 will do? Good point!!

rivercrazy
12-22-2003, 09:08 AM
Yup. I splashed HH's design! Sorry I forgot to send the consulting/trademark infringement bill.
The only thing thats different in mine is the size of the box. I went with .65 cubic feet per sub. As a result, HH's is probably a little louder. But the 1200.1 amp doesnt have any problem pushing the four 10's to the limit. And its too loud for me. Headroom is a good thing.....

Hustler
12-22-2003, 09:54 AM
by the looks of that hull you have to have a bench seat in the back right? If thats the case I would use the seat base for your subs, I have two jump seats in the back of my boat so the only other option I had was to put them in the bow, I have 2 Jl audio 12's under there and I love the way they sound.

likwidsukr
12-22-2003, 11:16 AM
It is settled. I am going with the seat option.
Thanks guys for the help.

TrojanDan
12-22-2003, 02:40 PM
We had our subs (10w7's) built in seperate boxes under the rear bench. The original owner had 6x9's there. I kept the 6x9 holes for the sound to pass thru which in turn protected the subs from one of my jackass friends putting their foot thru, and for stealth (except everyone who reads these forums) :D

TrojanDan
12-22-2003, 02:41 PM
...and you think there's a 6x9 in there! :eek:

rivercrazy
12-22-2003, 02:53 PM
Thats a sweet setup TD. Stealthy and very clean. Wish I would have thought of that....
I was also worried about someone kicking my subs too.What I did was to have Shockwave built me my sub box out of 3/4 plywood. They cut the holes for the subs and then put another 3/4 plywood sheet over the subbox to fit around the outside of the subwoofers. Then I put some pretty rigid metal covers over the subs. It gave the subs more room for excursion and reduced the chances of some errant heels. Came out like this:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/505/80Stereo6.jpg
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/505/80Stereo4-med.jpg
So far no one has messed em up yet....

Havasu Hangin'
12-22-2003, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by rivercrazy
...So far no one has messed em up yet.
Give me time...give me time...

TrojanDan
12-22-2003, 04:22 PM
Thanks RC. So are your woofers exposed to punctures the way it's installed or is there a speaker cover over the cone that I just can't see in the picture? I think what you are showing is that the woofer is slightly recessed into the plywood and that is your protection, right?
Your set up isn't too shabby either RC (and HH too)!
:cool:

rivercrazy
12-22-2003, 04:39 PM
All of the subs have their own mesh metal woofer grill. I can't remember if the covers were on in that pic. But you can see the subs through the grill. They are pretty tough and it would take a pretty good impact to get to the sub.

likwidsukr
12-22-2003, 08:51 PM
Keep em coming guys hell yeah!! Some good info there. Anyone else have some setup pics?

likwidsukr
12-22-2003, 08:52 PM
Originally posted by rivercrazy
Thats a sweet setup TD. Stealthy and very clean. Wish I would have thought of that....
I was also worried about someone kicking my subs too.What I did was to have Shockwave built me my sub box out of 3/4 plywood. They cut the holes for the subs and then put another 3/4 plywood sheet over the subbox to fit around the outside of the subwoofers. Then I put some pretty rigid metal covers over the subs. It gave the subs more room for excursion and reduced the chances of some errant heels. Came out like this:
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/505/80Stereo6.jpg
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/505/80Stereo4-med.jpg
So far no one has messed em up yet....
When the subs hit hard do they ever touch the grillz?

rivercrazy
12-23-2003, 08:48 AM
Nope. Thats part of the reason I went with the extra layer of 3/4". Then the grills give another 3/4" or so.

riverbound
12-23-2003, 05:51 PM
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/500/681Picture_128-med.jpg
4 12" Rockford fosgates powered by 2=1501bd
http://www.***boat.com/image_center/data/505/681Picture_208-thumb.jpg
removable 6x9 pods (holds 2 pairs front and back)

likwidsukr
12-26-2003, 07:18 PM
Originally posted by rivercrazy
Nope. Thats part of the reason I went with the extra layer of 3/4". Then the grills give another 3/4" or so.
Good Idea Mind if I use that for my box?