Eliminator 27 fundeck, what's it worth?

[MOPAR2YA]

1999 with 502 MPI, 130hours.
Just curious with everybody's thoughts. Thanks in advance :)

[bigq]

MOPAR2YA:
1999 with 502 MPI, 130hours.
Just curious with everybody's thoughts. Thanks in advance :) 60k, just a guess.I think there is a Conquest 1999 in the Boat Trader right now to for about that price.

[THOR]

MOPAR2YA:
1999 with 502 MPI, 130hours.
Just curious with everybody's thoughts. Thanks in advance :) Ah yes, I think I know the one your are looking at. If I am right that thing is about 25K below what it should be. Am I right?

[MOPAR2YA]

THOR:
MOPAR2YA:
1999 with 502 MPI, 130hours.
Just curious with everybody's thoughts. Thanks in advance :) Ah yes, I think I know the one your are looking at. If I am right that thing is about 25K below what it should be. Am I right? Yea, probably the same boat. I bid on it today.

[Froggystyle]

Difference is that Eliminator doesn't build their version using a chopper gun. They lay each one up properly.
I would be wary of any "high performance" boat generated from a chopper gun build process.

[MOPAR2YA]

THOR:
MOPAR2YA:
1999 with 502 MPI, 130hours.
Just curious with everybody's thoughts. Thanks in advance :) Ah yes, I think I know the one your are looking at. If I am right that thing is about 25K below what it should be. Am I right? Check your pm's :)

[MOPAR2YA]

Froggystyle:
Difference is that Eliminator doesn't build their version using a chopper gun. They lay each one up properly.
I would be wary of any "high performance" boat generated from a chopper gun build process. Conquest still uses a chopper gun for layup :confused: That's scary. I thought that process went by the waste side long ago. However that doesn't surprise me.

[bigq]

Froggystyle:
Difference is that Eliminator doesn't build their version using a chopper gun. They lay each one up properly.
I would be wary of any "high performance" boat generated from a chopper gun build process. Who uses a chopper gun?

[DogHouse]

I'm sure a quick call to Keith will answer any questions regarding the construction used by Conquest. I'd be extremely surprised if they were using chopper guns.

[Reaper1]

Call me stupid but what's a chopper gun? :confused:

[HavasuDreamin']

Reaper1:
Call me stupid but what's a chopper gun? :confused: Exactly, can someone explain how boats are layed up with a chopper gun. I think I understand the hand laid process, but what is the story with a chopper gun?

[uvindex]

I still have bad memories of a job I had way back in college where we manufactured fiberglass covers for tow truck booms using, you guessed it, chopper guns. A chopper gun is a contraption that uses compressed air (kind of like a paint sprayer) to shoot resin into the mold of whatever you're trying to build. Simultaneously, strands of fiberglass are shredded (chopped) and mixed with the spray of resin (this all happens at the gun, which is a fairly sophisticated, and probably expensive, device.) So, you get a hodgepodge of resin and fiberglass strands in the mold. You can see chopper-laid fiberglass lots of places -- porta potties come to mind -- next time you're taking a leak in one :) , look at the wall and you'll see lots of little fiberglass strands going in all different directions. In hand-laid fiberglass (in contrast with chopped,) fiberglass cloth is laid by hand with the resin, and therefore you'll see threads at 90 degree angles to each other (just like the threads in the sheets on your bed.)
I have no opinion or info on which boat mfr's disccussed here use which methods -- just describing my first-hand experience with chopper guns in a past life (shudder... :)
Happy boating,
CS

[Reaper1]

Thanks from a fellow South Orange Countian.... wink

[uvindex]

My pleasure, Reaper1.
Happy boating,
A fellow South Orange Countian AND a fellow Lake Forestian! :)

[HavasuDreamin']

Thanks for the info. RBILHC. :cool:

[Cole]

great discription of the chopper gun!! with that little lesson i dont think eliminator or conquest uses the chopper gun...or at least i sure havn't seen it...although maybe for the top deck alone on the partycats??Cole
[ March 04, 2003, 07:55 AM: Message edited by: Cole ]

[uvindex]

Glad I could help guys. :) I found a picture of a chopper gun on some site that makes them. In the photo, you can see the fiberglass strands entering the chopper at the top left and you can see the "chopped" glass and resin leaving the gun at the right-hand side of the pic. The rubber and stainless lines going into the chopper are for resin and compressed air.
Happy Boating,
CS
http://www.***boat.net/image_center/data/506/240chopper.jpg

[Keith E. Sayre]

Conquest doesn't use or even own a choppergun.
Anyone visiting our facility will instantly see
that we don't have a choppergun on premises or
have we used one in the past. You see, it's not
an easy thing to hide since that stuff flies everywhere. Those that do have one--have to
dedicate a closed-off room to control the waste.
I'm not certain where "froggystyle" got his info
but I'd invite anyone to come on by anytime for a
factory tour to see how Conquest does it.
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats
928-680-1400

[Sandbar Mike]

Keith E. Sayre:
Conquest doesn't use or even own a choppergun.
Anyone visiting our facility will instantly see
that we don't have a choppergun on premises or
have we used one in the past. You see, it's not
an easy thing to hide since that stuff flies everywhere. Those that do have one--have to
dedicate a closed-off room to control the waste.
I'm not certain where "froggystyle" got his info
but I'd invite anyone to come on by anytime for a
factory tour to see how Conquest does it.
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats
928-680-1400 Keith I can't help but laughing my ass off.
I know I'm just as bad as spreading what I here, Who will come up with what next. smile_sp

[DogHouse]

Sandbar Mike:
Who will come up with what next. smile_sp I heard that Eliminator is going to start splashing DCBs. :D
It was a JOKE!!! wink

[Sandbar Mike]

DogHouse:
Sandbar Mike:
Who will come up with what next. smile_sp I heard that Eliminator is going to start splashing DCBs. :D
It was a JOKE!!! wink :D
Brian how are you bro, when's your first or next run to Havasu?

[THOR]

DogHouse:
Sandbar Mike:
Who will come up with what next. smile_sp I heard that Eliminator is going to start splashing DCBs. :D
It was a JOKE!!! wink Why would the #1 name in boating (Eliminator) splash someone?
:D

[rivercrazy]

LMAO Thor!

[Keith E. Sayre]

Brian--you're right. It is strange how rumors in
this business get started. Obviously your comment
was nothing more than a good joking point, but
alot of folks say things that can damage or alter
a reputation or a business without realizing it.
Remember when you were a kid in school and the
teacher whispered a sentence into your ear and then you whispered it to the next one and the
next one and when it got around the room it wasn't
anything close to what came out of the teachers
mouth? Same thing here sometimes. I trust that
most errors of information are spread without any
real intent. Someone says something in the channel on Saturday when he's 11 beers down and
it becomes gospel on Sunday. Oh well, that's
part of the game I guess! I always appreciate
your comments and those of you who emailed me--
thanks!
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats
Ironically, the whole subject of choppergunning
or (random-strand processing) as some call it
is still widespread in the midwest boats and the
east coast boats and is very effective in building
specific pieces of boats like dashboards and panels where strength isn't an issue but here in the west it's pretty rare.

[DogHouse]

THOR:
Why would the #1 name in boating (Eliminator) splash someone?
:D Yes I do believe that was the point!
:D

[THOR]

DogHouse:
THOR:
Why would the #1 name in boating (Eliminator) splash someone?
:D Yes I do believe that was the point!
:D I know that is the point Doghouse. YOu were saying that Eliminator is the #1 name in boating and I agree. That is why I own one. :D

[DogHouse]

Well that ought to be enough to get the anti-checkers crowd on their feet!
:D

[XTRM22]

Keith E. Sayre:
Brian--you're right. It is strange how rumors in
this business get started. Obviously your comment
was nothing more than a good joking point, but
alot of folks say things that can damage or alter
a reputation or a business without realizing it.
Remember when you were a kid in school and the
teacher whispered a sentence into your ear and then you whispered it to the next one and the
next one and when it got around the room it wasn't
anything close to what came out of the teachers
mouth? Same thing here sometimes. I trust that
most errors of information are spread without any
real intent. Someone says something in the channel on Saturday when he's 11 beers down and
it becomes gospel on Sunday. Oh well, that's
part of the game I guess! I always appreciate
your comments and those of you who emailed me--
thanks!
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats
Ironically, the whole subject of choppergunning
or (random-strand processing) as some call it
is still widespread in the midwest boats and the
east coast boats and is very effective in building
specific pieces of boats like dashboards and panels where strength isn't an issue but here in the west it's pretty rare. Ya know I once whispered something into a teacher"s ear, she then whispered it into her husband"s ear and he chased me for for like two miles, must have been one of those misunderstandings! :D
I am not even gonna grace the whole Eliminator number 1 name in boating thing.....oh hell yes I will I agree with them being the number 1 name in boating, it's just unfortunate that they're what? like #3 in gelcoat and #6 in rigging! eek! :D wink
Chuck
ps if anyone is offended....I'm not surprised
pss it's a freakin joke for Pete's sake!!! :p
[ March 05, 2003, 02:31 PM: Message edited by: XTRM22 ]

[DogHouse]

Sandbar Mike:
Brian how are you bro, when's your first or next run to Havasu? I'm good, you know, spending money on the boat always puts a smile on my face! eek!
I have some parts on order so it'll be a while before the motor is back together and ready to go. Realistically, I probably won't be back on the water until late April. cry
When's your new ride supposed to be finished?

[Keith E. Sayre]

Brian:
I hope your engine problems go away, that's a trick boat. I love the way you did the front end.
Very unique, you should post a photo so others
could share the idea. Good luck.
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats

[DogHouse]

Thanks Keith, the plans are in motion to solve them in fine style, and maybe pick up a pony or two along the way... Have a couple of tweaks that I'm going to try out that should increase "efficiency" without resorting to a blower.
There have been a few threads in the past where I've posted pics or this link (http://members.cox.net/bcurnutt4/) for anyone who was interested in seeing the interior layout. It has turned out to be really useful for the boating and camping that we do.
-brian

[THOR]

DogHouse:
Well that ought to be enough to get the anti-checkers crowd on their feet!
:D Hell no I am not offended. I love this shit. That is what this board is all about. Talk a little trash, have a good time, then meet up on the water and have a cold one. Keep up the entertaining posts please. :D

[Sandbar Mike]

DogHouse:
Sandbar Mike:
Brian how are you bro, when's your first or next run to Havasu? I'm good, you know, spending money on the boat always puts a smile on my face! eek!
I have some parts on order so it'll be a while before the motor is back together and ready to go. Realistically, I probably won't be back on the water until late April. cry
When's your new ride supposed to be finished? Brian, They say 1s week in April, I say as long as I get it by Easter. :confused:
Bummer your's wont be back together till then.
Keep me updated so we can meet up out there.

[Charley]

DogHouse:
Sandbar Mike:
Who will come up with what next. smile_sp I heard that Eliminator is going to start splashing DCBs. :D
It was a JOKE!!! wink Oh ya?? I heard that Talon was gonna start splashing Magics!
:D

[playdeep]

Speaking of splashing...
Let's see who can answer this question...Blosdale's ex-AO was the ummm,inspiration... :D
For how many Havasu based builders cats?
[ March 08, 2003, 05:33 AM: Message edited by: playdeep ]

[Keith E. Sayre]

Here's the story. The guy that deserves all of the credit is the guy from Talon. He gets no
credit and it was his idea innovation that we
all benefit from today. Heck, I don't even know
his name.
Now I would never knowingly accuse anyone of
splashing a boat bottom nor would I admit doing it or copy anothers ideas etc. It's simply
unheard of. But somehow alot of boats all have
exactly the same or very similar bottoms and in some cases tops too!
Here's the pecking order as I see it. American
Offshore 26 somehow had a very very very ver very similar bottom as the Talon. Then dean Messmer
(Boat Brokers) and Bruce Nescher (Sleek and
Conquest bought an American Offshore and gave the
design engineers in Havasu some inspiration and
there is the Conquest bottom for the 28' Deckboat! Then Conquest sells a mold to Bob Leach at Eliminator for their 27 fundeck model.
Then Magic gets a mold from Conquest for their
new 28' deckboat. Then Conquest and Magic both
use their molds to build 28' cats using the
deckboat molds. Then Howard boats all of a sudden
has a boat with a very simiar bottom as these others. Then Firehawk in Dallas Texas all of a
sudden has a mold looking very familiar to these!
I'm sure there are others too but I'm not recalling who they are right now. The guy from
Talon is the brains behind a very safe and fun
and fast bottom that's been copied or imitated
at every level! Thanks--whatever your name is!
Keith Sayre
Conquest Boats
Lake Havasu City
928-680-1400

[havasulew]

Hey Keith,
You did a fine job of being vague.

[XTRM22]

Imitation (splashing) is after all the sincerest form of flattery!! :D
Chuck

[Donnie]

ps if anyone is offended....I'm not surprised
pss it's a freakin joke for Pete's sake!!! :p [/QB][/QUOTE]
I'm offended ya crack head...quit smokin those zip ties eek!

[DogHouse]

Keith that sounds about right, except that (I think) Firehawk came along before a couple of the others. The Commander bottom looks mighty familiar as well. I'm just glad that most changed the decks enough to give each version a personality of its own!
-brian

[Charley]

Charley:
DogHouse:
Sandbar Mike:
Who will come up with what next. smile_sp I heard that Eliminator is going to start splashing DCBs. :D
It was a JOKE!!! wink Oh ya?? I heard that Talon was gonna start splashing Magics!
:D I think my joke back @DH was trying to give the credit where it is due wink

[DogHouse]

So is the Talon a big 25, or is the AO a small 26, or are the two really different sizes? Maybe I'll go outside and put a tape on the Magic "28" and see what it really measures tip to transom!

[DogHouse]

Just measured the Magic, from the tip of the sponson in front, follwing the curvature of the bottom, to the rear of the boat. 24'6" to the end of the running surface, 25'6" to the back of the notched transom, 27'11" to the end of the swimstep. There may be a little error in those numbers but they're close. I guess one man's 25 is another man's 28!