Honda Outboards 225 HP

[TCHB]

I am thinking about putting a large four stroke outboard on a tri toon. Have you guys heard any good or bad things about the Honda 225.

[Tyson Ross]

From what I have read they are supposed to be nice engines. I saw the same setup on the river and it moved pretty well with a decent load on it. I have yet to see any large HP Yamaha's or Mercury 4 Strokes on any boats. I do not know if there is a message there or not.
I didn't have much of a choice when buying my pontoon, per the dealer ( came with a Merc). I would have liked a Yamaha as I had one on my lil bass boat and had no problems the 3 years I owned it.
Good luck!

[HavasuDreamin']

Originally posted by W. Tripp
I do not like the geometry of the Honda outboards...rod to stroke is WAY off.
This guy definately knows his stuff. I would look into another 4-stroke option.
HD :cool:

[Forkin' Crazy]

No four strokes for me.
Check out the Evinrude E-tec engines. They are the most advance two strokes on the planet. Better emisions than a 4 stroke and a lot less weight. They are extreamly quiet too.
http://www.evinrude.com/docs/200/1_US.htm

[HavasuDreamin']

Originally posted by Forkin' Crazy
Check out the Evinrude E-tec engines.
Yeah...........but who wants an Evinrude? :D

[TCHB]

It seems like the future will be 4 cycle becuase of tigher standards being set for air and water. I know Mercury is coming out with a new 4 stroke with alot of new tech on it but it will be expensive. I heard it will run @24K for the 270hp.

[Forkin' Crazy]

The E-tec is emission compliant to '06 standards.

[Forkin' Crazy]

Originally posted by HavasuDreamin'
Yeah...........but who wants an Evinrude? :D
Those who don't want to be towed in ....:eek:

[bigkatboat]

2 strokes make horsepower, 4 strokes make TORQUE. Torque moves loads, and horsepower is for faster hulls. I would like to have a 4 stroke on my pontoon, but I'm not going to spend that kind of money on 'this old boat'. DFI and EFI, have helped the two strokes (open up the torque curves) but, the 'heavy' four strokes will be the future. Why didn't anyone try a WEINKEL (sp)(Mazda type) rotor? No (heavy) valve train, and no vibration. Exhaust thru the prop would have cured the 'noise' problem. ...and then TURBO ROTOR!

[CrazyHippy]

I hear those Honda motors really perk up nicely if you put a type-R sticker on them:p
BJH

[Forkin' Crazy]

Originally posted by CrazyHippy
I hear those Honda motors really perk up nicely if you put a type-R sticker on them:p
BJH
A can helps too......:eek!:
LMAO!!!!

[Forkin' Crazy]

Originally posted by bigkatboat
2 strokes make horsepower, 4 strokes make TORQUE. Torque moves loads, and horsepower is for faster hulls. I would like to have a 4 stroke on my pontoon, but I'm not going to spend that kind of money on 'this old boat'. DFI and EFI, have helped the two strokes (open up the torque curves) but, the 'heavy' four strokes will be the future. Why didn't anyone try a WEINKEL (sp)(Mazda type) rotor? No (heavy) valve train, and no vibration. Exhaust thru the prop would have cured the 'noise' problem. ...and then TURBO ROTOR!
I don't think so. Like I said (since you didn't bother to read my post) the E-tec engines actually have lower exhaust emisions then the Yamaha 4 strokes!!! Plus more power, more fuel efficient, lighter weight, and less maintenance (none required for 3 years).
OMC tried the rotory engines long ago. I think the absense torque was one of the main factors, along with it being an environmental nightmare!!! If rotory engines were so good, then why isn't any other production car using them? And Mazda only uses them in the RX cars.
Can you emagine shimming the valves, changine cam belts and all the other stuff...... And what happens when people don't change oil? 4 stoke outboards are a bad idea. Keep them in the cars where they belong.
Since my OMC peak horsepower is around 5700. It has plenty of torque

[Evin Rude]

Originally posted by bigkatboat
2 strokes make horsepower, 4 strokes make TORQUE. Torque moves loads, and horsepower is for faster hulls. I would like to have a 4 stroke on my pontoon, but I'm not going to spend that kind of money on 'this old boat'. DFI and EFI, have helped the two strokes (open up the torque curves) but, the 'heavy' four strokes will be the future.
Sorry there, but you got it backwards. As far as outboards go, the 2 strokes have more mid range torque unless you go with the supercharged Merc. Then they are comparable.
I think sooner or later, consumers who are buying new rigs will start to ask........why a 4 stroke outboard? If you look at cost, a stern drive is WAY lower in initial cost and much more durable.
I have been told a Merc Verado is around $19,000.00 for just the motor at the "good deal"price. After that, I understand you must buy the "rig kit" which consists of the controls and steering system. This is supposedly around $3500.00, again on the "good deal".
A 502 Mercruiser that is higher in HP, lots more torque and probably a longer life span is around $16,000.00 for the total package.
Unless you are re-powering, why screw with a $23,000.00 outboard?
If you are buying new, the choice is easy.
I just dont see the point to the higher horsepower 4 stroke outboards. Buying new, they are just not cost effective.
Oh well...........
ER:)

[CrazyHippy]

Originally posted by Tom Brown
I heard 28K.
That's 38K... for the canatards
24K in the states (cause they like us better):D
BJH

[TCHB]

I guess this debate could go on for years but I think the 4 strokes are here to stay.

[Forkin' Crazy]

Originally posted by TCHB
I guess this debate could go on for years but I think the 4 strokes are here to stay.
Why?:confused:
I guess I (you) just don't understand (like) a two stroke with all the efficient high tech things they are doing with them.
What would you rather have? A 4 stroke that has more than twice the moving parts, gets worse emisions, weighs more, has less power and worse economy than the new direct injection two strokes?
:eek:

[TCHB]

The Honda Corporation is following a well thought out plan and leaving nothing to chance. They will take over the market as they did with cars, motorcycles, mowers, generators, and you know the story.
Honda Outboards face an exciting future in New Zealand as the market here follows the United States and Europe where legislative requirements on pollution and environmental friendliness have brought an end to traditional 2-stroke outboards," he says. "My guess is that in five to 10 years there won't be any 2-strokes being made any more and Honda Marine, with more than 60 different models in 18 different horsepower categories, has the largest and most comprehensive range of 4-stroke outboards available in New Zealand."

[Forkin' Crazy]

Ya, bullshit!!!
I still like briggs and stratton!!!!!
F.U.C.K. HONDA!!!
I eat, live, drive AMERICAN!!!!!!:cool:

[CrazyHippy]

So you're a yamaha man???
BJH:p

[Forkin' Crazy]

Originally posted by CrazyHippy
So you're a yamaha man???
BJH:p
Yamahahahahahahaha!;)

[TCHB]

If Mercury is not carefull the entire market could change with Honda, Yamaha, and Suzuki coming on strong. Just look at the electronics word!

[Evin Rude]

I would walk in tha rain and carry an old DeSoto hub cap before I would spend one dime of my money on a honda/yamaha/izzuzu/misterbitchi/nissan/whattha****ever jap anything.
The people that profit from those jap products are the same ones that started a war that MURDERED hundreds of thousands of American Soldiers and for an old fart like ER, it was not all that long ago.
The USA is a free country and if you want to buy those things, that is certainly your right.
Next time you exercise your right and buy a honda, just think about the American Soldiers who gave their lives protectecting that right.
I buy American at EVERY opportunity when I buy.
ER:confused:

[Tom Brown]

Damn, ER. :(
I haven't consumed alcohol in 17 years, cigarette smoke makes me sick, and I've been to the bar about six times in my life. Last night, I went to one of the sleazier local pubs with some very good friends from Texas. It was 'Jam Night' and my friends were on stage playing most of the night. We stayed out until 1:30.
Between this crazy headache, the puking, the cinder block that's on my chest, and my Glade Plug-ins losing out to RJ Reynolds, I thought this morning was about as harsh as it could be... until I read your post.
Let's talk about the Lord's car maker... GM.
Who owns GM? A significant quantity of people who own stock, like me. You know... non-Americans. GM was sold to anyone who could afford the issue when it IPO'd.
Sure, but what about the jobs? 80% of your divinity wagon is built outside the US by impoverished workers in Korea, China, Mexico, etc.
The Japanese manufacturers do not outsource nearly so many sub assemblies. A Toyota has way, way more American content than the American vehicles we all drive. Well, all of us except me. I drive a Nissan. You know... a company owned by European interests, unlike most of the Japanese auto companies which are largely owned by the American car companies.
Hey... pass those star spangled sun glasses... I don't want people to see the burst blood vessels in my eyes.
:cool: <- We need a frowning emoticon with sun glasses.

[Evin Rude]

That is my feelings and how I came to feel that way.
If other people dont feel that way, thats their own business.
Not saying I'm right or wrong and for sure, I dont apologise for it, just my feelings.
I doubt I'll change either.
ER:)

[Tom Brown]

Originally posted by Evin Rude
That is my feelings and how I came to feel that way.
Much respect, ER. Much respect. :cool:

[Tom Brown]

I'd like to add two points.
I am all about saving North American jobs. I believe in this economy and want to support it. Perhaps that's why I have so much respect for your position.
Secondly,....... HELTER SKELTER! .... you may be a lover but you ain't no dancer...
I thought we were going to have to bring in Marlin Perkins with a tranquilizer gun to get those guys to end that song. It just went on and on and on... I think they played it for about 15 minutes. :D
My head hurts. :( :D :D :D

[TCHB]

Toyota Could Become Top Car Brand in U.S.
DETROIT September 2, 2003; John Porretto writing for the AP reported that to understand the ongoing assault by foreign automakers in the United States, look no further than the traditional car market.
If sales trends don't change dramatically, Toyota will sell more cars in the United States this year than each of the two brands that have dominated for a century: Chevrolet and Ford.
It would mark the first time a foreign automaker has held that mantle and illustrates the growing impact of Toyota Motor Co.p., Honda Motor Co., Nissan Motor Co. and Hyundai Motor Co., all of which continue to expand their domestic lineups and manufacturing capacity.
"What you're seeing from Toyota is an expansion into new segments, both on the production and sales side, and a further entrenchment of their strong sales position in current vehicles like the Camry and Corolla," said Michael Robinet, vice president of global forecasting for CSM Worldwide, which provides market information and forecasts to more than 350 automotive suppliers.
On the passenger car side, Toyota, excluding its Lexus luxury brand, sold 520,991 cars in the United States through July, about 20,000 more than Ford and nearly 47,000 more than Chevy, General Motors Corp.'s top-selling brand.
Ford has been the top car seller in the United States for nearly a decade, although Toyota's Camry was the best-selling model last year.
One of Toyota's new converts is Jim Harper, 69, of Vandalia, Ohio. He was looking to replace a seven-year-old Chrysler with a new one when he test drove a 2003 Camry recently. He liked the performance and knew about the automaker's quality ratings and therefore opted for the Japanese make over another Chrysler product.
"When I get a new car, I like to hang on to it for six or seven years

[sam pioske]

Tyson Ross------- 13 years on a 75 hp Evinrude, never rebulit ran good when i sold it
23 years on a merc v6 200hp "2nd one on the west coast" never rebuilt it neighbor still runs it.
I buy american whenever i can, if they need fixing i can afford it . a couple of years ago a guys starter quit on Lexus, Chilton book says 23 hours plus parts I could'nt afford that. I have 4 GM's and a 2004 duramax . I get 20 mpg on my 1997 gas pick up and it can pull something, even the new rice birners v-8s don't have any tourqe I have a 135 v6 Merc on my pontoon a 225 Merc. v-6 on my Hydrostream a 454 Mag in the Hallet. NO COMPLAINTS.
my .02 no i guess my 10cents worth , sorry

[Tyson Ross]

Sam, I hear yah!
I never claimed to prefer Japanese. I have a Silverado and a Mercury. I only inquired about a Yamaha 4 stroke for the pontoon because I had one before on my bass boat and had no problems as well as they have been around a little longer then Mercury 4 strokes. I hope that a few years from now I am bragging about my 4 stroke Merc's liability!:)

[TCHB]

I wish Chevrolet or Ford would step into the outboard market and keep some balance. I guess they think there is no market or can not compete?

[Steve 1]

The Shame of it is Mercury has been asleep while Yamaha has taken over the earth..

[TCHB]

Yes I agree they were sleeping at the wheel.

[Evin Rude]

Quote by Steve......"The Shame of it is Mercury has been asleep while Yamaha has taken over the earth"
Interesting. I seem to remember the yamahahaha stern drive was introduced a few years back with much fanfare and hoopla.
How is it doing sales wise?
Also,
I race the outboard drags and NOBODY runs a yamahahaha or hoooonda anything cause they are not competitive.
The 2 stroke yahahahahas are slow and throw rods at anything close to 9000 rpms.
The 4 stroke hooooondas and yamahahaha's, well they are just a joke and a bad one at that.
I suppose yamahahaha's and hooooonda's do have a place in racing.
We do need something useless and heavy to anchor the track marking bouys with.
ER:rolleyes:

[Steve 1]

Evin Rude
I love the Mercurys Hell there are two World titles won by My Designed/Built offshore cats with the Black outboard engines..
My Group is Military contractors in Kuwait and I have beat my head against a wall trying to sell the Mercury outboards..Could not budge them off the Yamahas.. the joke was we did/won the Military trails with mercs and then they specked the Yamahas..
Not to mention the preformance edge lost..Our 12 meter patrol boat loaded,armed.fueled ran 10 MPH slower with the Japanese engines.. But still no advail!! Even had to use the Mercury props Lazer II's on them at that..
Best Regards

[Evin Rude]

Hey, this is just internet bickering.....so......all I ment was in the circles I travel, the import clip on's aren't that important.
I am sure in other arenas, they do well. In the hi-perf one, they simply have no players............they are all turds.
I'm an old fart, but I'm not ready for a pontoon boat or anything remotely like it. I still like a kick a stout motor gives me when I whip the throttle.
It'll be the smoke spewrers for me till I'm done with it all.
ER:)

[Tom Brown]

I've got a handfull of Mercs but I think I'll sell them all and replace them with Tohatsus.
... just teasin' ya, ER. :D

[sorry dog]

Tom-
do your feet stink and you don't love Jesus?
Maybe you defer to Kim on what to do in the situation.
Hey ER- GM actually has a pretty strong presense here. Remember the pontiac Transport? They are selling lotsa mini vans under the Shanghai-GM name.
You'll like this though - the patrol chase boat the police have is powered by 4 rude v8's- I'll see if I can get a pic sometime, but they can be touchy about pics...like I'll be revealing some secret tech or something :D

[Steve 1]

S D Be very carefull on the picture thing Have one of them take the Photo..
I could tell you a story..

[Evin Rude]

Originally posted by Tom Brown
I've got a handfull of Mercs but I think I'll sell them all and replace them with Tohatsus.
Ya, them Merkreez are bad news. Sell them at a high price to You Te and get a quality Bombardier Etec.
A good Canadian company destined to dominate the clip-on boat mota market.
I have already seen the light........Thank ya Jesus!
ER:D

[Evin Rude]

Originally posted by sorry dog Remember the pontiac Transport? They are selling lotsa mini vans under the Shanghai-GM name.
Well, Dog..............apparently, those fish head eaters will buy anything then.
I have several rusted out Vegas and a few half burned Pintos along with a 2 ragged K-Cars I would like to get rid of.
What is shipping like????? I know they would sell if I could just get them there.
ER:rolleyes:

[You Te]

Holy poo poo ER, on hot boat.
Hey ER, I need to buy some Merc parts, can you loan me some money.:D
You Te

[Evin Rude]

Originally posted by You Te
...........Hey ER, I need to buy some Merc parts, can you loan me some money............
Sure, I'm loaded with tha dough.
I got a part time job at a meskin bakery and I got dough everywhere.
How much ya want? Its worth its weight in Bombardier parts.
LOL
ER:rolleyes:

[You Te]

ER,
How about a dozen jelly filled? You must be at work, you're posting up a storm.:D :D :D :D :D
You Te

[Evin Rude]

Originally posted by You Te
.........You must be at work, you're posting up a storm...
Storm you say??
It has rained heavily for 5 days straight here in Houston, around 5-6 inches a day sometimes.
It rained a lot for 2 weeks before that.
We have had almost 50 inches of rain so far this year.
Our normal yearly average is 56-60.
Storm is the correct term.
ER is sick of this s-h-i-t.
ER:yuk:

[You Te]

Well ER,
you can do your testing in the front yard.
You Te

[sorry dog]

I have several rusted out Vegas and a few half burned Pintos along with a 2 ragged K-Cars I would like to get rid of.
Why don't you give'em to T Rex. You might even see a couple of those K-car parts under that white cowl at the next DSRA race...

[Wicky]

Originally posted by TCHB
The Honda Corporation is following a well thought out plan and leaving nothing to chance. They will take over the market as they did with cars, motorcycles, mowers, generators, and you know the story.
Honda Outboards face an exciting future in New Zealand as the market here follows the United States and Europe where legislative requirements on pollution and environmental friendliness have brought an end to traditional 2-stroke outboards," he says. "My guess is that in five to 10 years there won't be any 2-strokes being made any more and Honda Marine, with more than 60 different models in 18 different horsepower categories, has the largest and most comprehensive range of 4-stroke outboards available in New Zealand."
I noticed your avatar is a Honda CRF. Well, I have a bone stock CR 250. A couple of months ago I lined up against 2 built 04' CRF 450s, two YZF 450s and one 525 KTM. I took them all in every hillclimb dragrace. I won't mention what the 2 stroke KX 500 did with only 50 more CC's than the 4-stroke 450's spank spank spank. I think this speaks for itself.
Don't vote for a tree hugging president. First they'll tell ya you cant use your 2-stroke. Then they'll tell ya you can't use your 4- stroke because it's going to hurt a little ol' kangaroo rat.
Save the people!! Don't vote for a democrat!!
Mow,
Wicky

[Wicky]

Originally posted by Forkin' Crazy
Ya, bullshit!!!
I still like briggs and stratton!!!!!
F.U.C.K. HONDA!!!
I eat, live, drive AMERICAN!!!!!!:cool:
Me too, except for dirtbikes. There is no other choice.
I make my own sushi though!! Does that help?
Mow,
Wicky

[sorry dog]

I make my own sushi though!! Does that help?
Helps if you make me some too. You gonna be in Havazoo around spring break time next year?
Hey ER - what's this deal Wayne was talking about with Toyota OB? You hear about that?

[Wicky]

Originally posted by sorry dog
Helps if you make me some too. You gonna be in Havazoo around spring break time next year?
BBSP VII 4.20.05 SD!!

[Tom Brown]

Originally posted by Wicky
BBSP VII 4.20.05 SD!!
I'll bring my John Kerry campaign propaganda. :D