My main question is what would be the best intake runner cc for a 540.I will probobly be turning in the 6000 rpm range.I am looking at the brodix heads,may change my mind before winter though.They are showing the BB2 which has 312cc runners would only work good to a 509 ci.The BB2X (340 cc runner)has the bigger intake valve and is good up to 555 ci.The BB2Xtra has to have a minimum of 540 ci.(365 cc runner).I know with the bigger runner you lose velocity and i am only going to be turning 6000 rpm's.I am going to put a tunnel ram with 750's on it also.Any info would be greatly appreciated.
Mike
P.S.:If you want to slam Brodix be my guest,i want opinions.
The bb2 would work realy good but if you ever want to step up anymore you will need the bb2x.What are you running for valvetrain is it hydsolid or a roller set up?what manifold are you going to run?Ifit were me i would go for the 2x and grow from there.
I would put an approx 315 ish CNC port head on a N/A 540. Run a 340 on a blown deal. I do not spring for the CNC ports on the blown stuff.
I'd be looking at either the Canfield or the AFR's. around 320 cc. Profilers are nice, but you have to use their man.
as cast Canfield 310's
VALVE LIFT .100 .200 .300 .400 .500 .600 .700 .800
Intake Port 72 138 204 266 318 347 353 355
Exhaust Port 74 123 176 205 237 260 273 284
These are typical flow numbers at 28 inches of water measured on a SF 600 bench by an independent shop.
djd,
Right now i am running a hyd roller cam in a 454 and i really like it.I have used the same motor for 5 years,just freshen it each winter.The intake is a 2 x 4 edelbrock with 2 750's that i will put on it.
Thank you for your opinion.
Info:
My take is you are saying keep the port size down because i am only going to be turning 6000 rpm's.What if i wanted to go with the 340 cc without the blower,would that hurt the torque and horsepower in that rpm range?
Oh ya,your trident engine build was very impressive,it was nice to have pictures along with info.your attention to detail is 2nd to none.
Steelcomp:
I like the flow numbers of the canfields.The 310 cc is comperable to the 312 cc brodix on the intake side but the lower lift numbers on the brodix are better.At 600 lift the canfields are a little bit better.How would the 2 compare with torque and horsepower numbers.My first though would be that the brodix head would be better on low end but after thinking about it not sure what the difference would be.No matter what rpm you were at,when the valve was at a lower opening the brodix would flow better.Sound like i am rambling on,hope you understand what i am talking about.
200. 300. 400. 500. 600.
brodix
intake 215 265 311 334 344
canfield 138 204 266 318 347
On the exhaust side their is a big difference.When you here people talking they are mostly talking about intake flow,i know exhaust is important also,just not sure how much?
brodix
exhaust 122 148 187 216 229
canfield 123 176 205 237 260
Looks like with petal to the metal canfield flows better,given the numbers.
One question i have is,say you had access to a dyno and bolted these 2 different heads on a 540 what would expect the differeces to be on a torque and horsepower curve.
Steelcomp,your opinion is greatly appreciated.thank you.
Just want some opinions i am trying to learn.
Mike
check this out.
heads thread (http://www.***boat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=54166)
djd,
Right now i am running a hyd roller cam in a 454 and i really like it.I have used the same motor for 5 years,just freshen it each winter.The intake is a 2 x 4 edelbrock with 2 750's that i will put on it.
Thank you for your opinion.
Info:
My take is you are saying keep the port size down because i am only going to be turning 6000 rpm's.What if i wanted to go with the 340 cc without the blower,would that hurt the torque and horsepower in that rpm range?
Oh ya,your trident engine build was very impressive,it was nice to have pictures along with info.your attention to detail is 2nd to none.
Steelcomp:
I like the flow numbers of the canfields.The 310 cc is comperable to the 312 cc brodix on the intake side but the lower lift numbers on the brodix are better.At 600 lift the canfields are a little bit better.How would the 2 compare with torque and horsepower numbers.My first though would be that the brodix head would be better on low end but after thinking about it not sure what the difference would be.No matter what rpm you were at,when the valve was at a lower opening the brodix would flow better.Sound like i am rambling on,hope you understand what i am talking about.
200. 300. 400. 500. 600.
brodix
intake 215 265 311 334 344
canfield 138 204 266 318 347
On the exhaust side their is a big difference.When you here people talking they are mostly talking about intake flow,i know exhaust is important also,just not sure how much?
brodix
exhaust 122 148 187 216 229
canfield 123 176 205 237 260
Looks like with petal to the metal canfield flows better,given the numbers.
One question i have is,say you had access to a dyno and bolted these 2 different heads on a 540 what would expect the differeces to be on a torque and horsepower curve.
Steelcomp,your opinion is greatly appreciated.thank you.
Just want some opinions i am trying to learn.
Mike
Mike...everything you said is true, but remember, the Canfields are getting those numbers with a smaller port. And I know for a fact that with very little chamber work the mid numbers wake right up. Smaller port with same or better #'s = more velocity. Always go with the smaller port if the numbers are close. Canfields are also way less expensive. Basic complete assembled, flat tappet, 3/8 guide, $1399. I have less than $1800 in mine with 11/32 severe duty valves, Ti ret's, roller springs, etc. Complete. Not saying they're a "better head" per say, but definately a better buy. Performance would be fairly neglegable unless you're trying to build an all out race motor, and looking for every last hp (in which case you'd be using the AFR's or a symetrical port anyway). Cam design is critical, and can address differences flow numbers. What I like is the in/ex ratio that the Canfields hold. I like their castings, and workmanship. Their "as cast" ported design is clean w/o a lot of core shift. (Mostly evident in the guide bosses inside the port)...at least on the set I got. These heads can support 800 na hp without any problem.
BTW...excessive low lift #'s have a tendancy to over draw the intake charge (on overlap) sending raw fuel out the exhaust.
Had to edit...see that the Brodies are within a few intake CC's. Still, the Can's are better on top, where it's going to matter on a small head. If you were really looking for optimunm, I'd do a mild super mod port job on them, open them up to about 320-325, and have a real nice pkg for your na 540. I thnk @ 6000, the smaller heads will still feed the 540 very nicely, and you'll have throttle resoponse like an injected motor. (very good port velocity=excellent carb signal). I also think the bigger ex no's favor a jet app where the motor basically goes right to a specific rpm...dosen't really have to "pull" through a power band. Jets like a lot of duration, (280+ @ .050) and that likes good ex flow!
What kind of compression are tyou thinking of?
Dave c:
Thanks for the thread,it's hard to get away from bigger is better,i guess i will be going with "it's not how big it is but how well you use it".
Steelcomp:
Thanks for the detailed response.Sounds like the canfields would work good for me.I'll be on a tight budget and the cost savings is substancial.I like the idea of good throttle response and carb signal.
You mentioned cam design.I have a couple of questions for ya.Duration 280+ @ .050 lift,would that mean i would have to run a pretty high lift cam to get to that duration?Could you give me some ballpark #'s for a cam that would work good for those heads, using a 540 @ 6000 rpm?
I would like to run around 10:1 or 10:5 to1 on pump gas if possible.Thanks again.
Mike
Dave c:
Thanks for the thread,it's hard to get away from bigger is better,i guess i will be going with "it's not how big it is but how well you use it".
Steelcomp:
Thanks for the detailed response.Sounds like the canfields would work good for me.I'll be on a tight budget and the cost savings is substancial.I like the idea of good throttle response and carb signal.
You mentioned cam design.I have a couple of questions for ya.Duration 280+ @ .050 lift,would that mean i would have to run a pretty high lift cam to get to that duration?Could you give me some ballpark #'s for a cam that would work good for those heads, using a 540 @ 6000 rpm?
I would like to run around 10:1 or 10:5 to1 on pump gas if possible.Thanks again.
Mike
TR w/ 750's. Hmmm. Do you expect to do any porting? What's the bore/stroke/rod length or are you still figuring that out?
My first guess would be a Lunati solid roller...probably a little milder with the lower comp. What are you looking for? Just all out hp, do you want some reliability, hyd roller or solid? (do you mind adjusting valves from time to time and replacing valve springs?) Mild or wild? What's it going in? (hull) Your TX?
I would put an approx 315 ish CNC port head on a N/A 540. Run a 340 on a blown deal. I do not spring for the CNC ports on the blown stuff.
Ditto
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