Reply With QuoteThe rods with the "football" shaped rod bolt heads are the one's you want to use (truck rods).
The passenger car rods have square shaped rod bolt head and are not as strong as the truck rod.
Ive got two sets here, gotta decide which set to use. one set is D6VE-AA the others are D0OE-A. the D6s need resized, they are the ones that came out of my boat. the D0s are usable as is, according to the machine shop. so which ones are better or is there a difference?
The rods with the "football" shaped rod bolt heads are the one's you want to use (truck rods).
The passenger car rods have square shaped rod bolt head and are not as strong as the truck rod.
Ive got two sets here, gotta decide which set to use. one set is D6VE-AA the others are D0OE-A. the D6s need resized, they are the ones that came out of my boat. the D0s are usable as is, according to the machine shop. so which ones are better or is there a difference?
Dave,
Paul Lakesonly has posted some pics of the Ford CJ or Truck rod and the 514 rod. Depending on how much power and RPM you are going to make will determan what rod you need. But the stock 460/429 rod is plenty strong for most cases. But what you may concider is the wieght of the pistons which will greatly make a big difference in any rod strength.
Jim
Ive got two sets here, gotta decide which set to use. one set is D6VE-AA the others are D0OE-A. the D6s need resized, they are the ones that came out of my boat. the D0s are usable as is, according to the machine shop. so which ones are better or is there a difference?
Dave,
The D6VE-AA rods are the truck rods and are the exact same configuration as the Cobra Jet style rod.
The D0OE rods may be the CJ style rod or possibly the passenger car style rod. The difference is that the SCJ/truck rods can accomodate a rod bolt with a football shaped head only, whereas the passenger car style rod has a broached shoulder at the big end which allows for a rod bolt with a square bolt head.
http://www.reincarnation-automotive....s-football.jpg
So it really doesn't matter what the number is on the rod...only the configuration of the rod matters. The D6VE-AA rod will always be the CJ/Truck rod, but the D0OE rod may be either CJ or passenger.
Generally speaking, both these types of rods have the same strength as far as we are concerned. Yes, the CJ rod has more material and is technically stonger at the big end, but the Ford rods almost always break mid-beam, so the football-style rod is not helping weak area of the rod. Therefore, they are essentially the same strength, since the weak area in the rod is the same in both styles of rods.
Important question: Are you choosing rods for the TRW L2443 dome top's I sold to you?
LO
yes, these are for the pistons you sold me. also, i went and checked both sets of rods and they both have the square bolts. i can tell minor differences in the castings but they are otherwise the same configuration.i think i will just go with the D0OEs because they are in fine shape, the others are pretty eggshaped, i dont know if i would trust them after being resized.
Dave,
The TRW L2443NF30 was more or less TRW's reply to the D3VE cylinder head when it first came out...a nice, forged dome-top piston to make good compression with the 96cc combustion chamber. This gives the D3VE headed .030-over 460 about 10.65:1 compression ratio.
People ended up using the L2443NF30 with the early-style heads too, where they would make for a 13.2:1 c/r with the same shortblock and therefore suitable for a high horsepower build.
By today's standards, it is considered to be a rather heavy aftermarket piston. That being said, some people are weary of using them on stock rods, but I don't believe you'll have any problems at all, and I'll explain why.
As I noted in the above post, the stock rods most often separate mid-beam. It seems the failure occurs on the upstroke of the exhaust cycle when the exhaust valve is open and therefore there is no cylinder pressure to work against the piston. As the crank reaches TDC and starts downward again, the massive piston wants to keep going up. This scenario is further exasperated when one lifts throttle and closes the carburetor throttle plates, thereby dramatically reducing cylinder pressure on the compression stroke as well. And so the heavier the piston, the more one should be cautious of how high he revs the engine.
The reason this does not apply to you is because I don' believe you will be revving your jet boat motor over 5500 rpm. Even though others may try to instill fear in your situation, rest assured that you won't have any issues. I had a 460 boat motor that had stock rods and identical pistons in it and it ran for ten years, 4800/5200 rpm (thru transom/OT headers). Also, the very pistons I sold you had just 1000 miles on them in a Fox body Mustang that turned 7500 rpm (CJ rods with smoothed beams).
The key to keeping your stock rods from letting go at sustained rpm's as in a jet boat is good rod inspection and prep, proper bearing clearances, plenty of oil, proper tune and logical rpm's for the components used. Unless you intend to bomb around the lake at 5500-up in your boat (6500 rpm shift point in a car), don't worry about it.
Finally, I acknowledge there are plenty of success stories of others running the rods in more extreme conditions, but this is also the area where the horror stories begin to pop up too, so I just assume recommend no more than I already have rpm-wise.
Finally, if you aren't trying to squeeze every last HP from your engine, you may consider whacking the top .100"-.200" off the peak of the dome. This will help flame front travel and allow you to run slightly less ignition advance, and maybe even pump gas as a result (depending on many other factors). I have never personally done this, but it is not uncommon practice. Also, it lightens the pistons somewhat.
So pick the better set of rods and prep well...you'll be fine.
LO
Dave,
The D6VE-AA rods are the truck rods and are the exact same configuration as the Cobra Jet style rod.
The D0OE rods may be the CJ style rod or possibly the passenger car style rod. The difference is that the SCJ/truck rods can accomodate a rod bolt with a football shaped head only, whereas the passenger car style rod has a broached shoulder at the big end which allows for a rod bolt with a square bolt head.
http://www.reincarnation-automotive....s-football.jpg
So it really doesn't matter what the number is on the rod...only the configuration of the rod matters. The D6VE-AA rod will always be the CJ/Truck rod, but the D0OE rod may be either CJ or passenger.
Generally speaking, both these types of rods have the same strength as far as we are concerned. Yes, the CJ rod has more material and is technically stonger at the big end, but the Ford rods almost always break mid-beam, so the football-style rod is not helping weak area of the rod. Therefore, they are essentially the same strength, since the weak area in the rod is the same in both styles of rods.
Important question: Are you choosing rods for the TRW L2443 dome top's I sold to you?
LO
Paul,
I think it would be a good idea to post the pics that you have of the three rods. The pass rod, the CJ/Truck rod and the 514 rod. Just the make this tread complete.
Thanks
Jim
I run the same set up that paul just described, .030 460, D3 heads (exhaust ported only) and 2443NF TRW pistons on truck rods. however I purchsed new in the box factory rods from Ford since I didn't trust my old 100.000 + mile originals that were reconditioned. Had my shop balance the new rods, pistons and crank.
This motor was built in the spring of 1996 and still runs strong today. pulls a consistant 5400 rpms on a "B" berkley impeller.
Paul,
I think it would be a good idea to post the pics that you have of the three rods. The pass rod, the CJ/Truck rod and the 514 rod. Just the make this tread complete.
Thanks
Jim
Jim is referring to the original rod that came in the 1st & 2nd generation 514 crate motors, before Ford went to the H-beam rod in the 3rd and 4th generation 514 crate motors. Bear in mind that all the passsenger car rods have a 1.050" pin bore and the 514 rod has a .990 pin, so these rods will not work for the above builds as delivered.
(lifted from another post: ) The new 514 crate motors from Ford use an H-beam connecting rod; the earlier 514's used an I-beam rod. These I-beam rods are Ford part number M-6200-A514. At first glance, one may mistake them for the D0OE or D6VE CJ-style rod but there are subtle differences. (The FRPP catalog says they are the same as the truck/marine rods, but I just took one of those marine motors apart and it had D6VE rods in it.)
http://a9.cpimg.com/image/3D/5C/3950...-01AD0200-.jpg
The CJ rod is on the left and the A-514 rod is on the right. The weight of these rods (in grams) are written on the respective I-beams. Both rods are 6.605" center-to-center. Notice how much more material is around the big end & cap of the A-514 rod. Also, notice how much more material is around the small end of the A-514 rod, and how the I-beams meet at the small end compared to the CJ rod. The A-514 rod is bushed for .990" floating pin.
I mic'd these rods mid-beam and found them to be no different (.010") from the pass car rods, so I feel we are left with the same strength scenario in the end...
LO
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