Anyone running a hydraulic roller cam in a jet?

[ttmott]

Wet77,
A couple of things that may help you:
I have stepped down from a 310 grind Comp P/N 11-745-9 (.772/.772) mechanical to a 300 grind Comp P/N 11-694-8 (.652/.652) mechanical for several critical reasons. Primarily the spring rates were so high that I was spending more time and money keeping up with the wear than having fun with the boat. The lower duration, in my case, kept the engine peak torque at a more usable rpm (around 4500 to 6000). The bigger lifts (greater than the mid .600's) require dilligent maintence and adjustment about every time you run the boat. This is a simple fact due to the stresses in the valve train imposed by the heavy springs and radical geometry. If you opt for a hyd roller I believe you will have the best of both worlds; reasonable valve train geometry, excellent engine throttle response, and no valve lash adjustment.
Now for a couple of tricks. If you opt for a large (in the .700 range) cam you can install a rev kit and reduce the valve spring pressures greatly. If you don't know a rev kit is a separate spring kit that goes under the head to the lifters. I run this even with the smaller cam as it guarentees the lifters will stay planted on the cam even in the event of a failure in a rocker or push rod; very critical for saving the costly cam components and maintaining oil pressure. In all cases, very critical that all of the components are a matched set; roller cams are a different breed and are very sensative to spring behavior. Spend some time talking to the folks at Crane, Comp, Iski or Clay Smith to make sure you have the right combination.
Hope this helps....

[wet77]

solid roller is the way to go. adjusting the valves isnt that hard after you do it a few times, and if you do it right the first time, you should be able to make it all season w/o any adjustment. ive run solids all season, and i boat about 150 hrs a year (used to at least). dont be afraid of them. if you boat a lot, pull the valve covers after about 25 hrs n check em. i just checked mine after the last race. over 900 hp, ran it up to 8300 rpms on several launches, and it runs 7600 down the track. after the race, they havent moved. seven passes. you did the right thing by talking with duane, i think he will get you hooked up w/ the right cam. now go out n hold it to the floor till ur eyes melt. nelson#109
Thanks for the support the valve lash tunning I thought would be every tank of fuel :jawdrop:
Good to know its not that bad.
Some quick specs on the motor
540 dart with Billet mains
dart heads inconol valves
JE pistons
Eagle H beam rods
Scat 4340 crank
Victor jr intake/850 carb
HEI ignition
Mech roller cam lift?? still in the talks
electric fuel pump
Motor is going on dyno I will let everyone know what the results are.
Just got back Agressor bronze B cut with inducer from HTP
IN a berk JG, shoe, ride plate new style place diverter, Manual trim
Boat is a 1985 eliminator (only 10 hours on the hull!!!) looks like the one in my avatar
Hope to be in the water asap
Lots of help from the board is making that possible

[SmokinLowriderSS]

Once you get to the water, "THE TUNING" begins then. THAT may take quite a few tanks of gas. I am speaking of tuning the drive/boat/engine combination as a set for best speeds, acceleration, ride angle, RPM's, man-o-man a lot of variables. Keep coming back here, lots of experience here.

[LVjetboy]

"Thanks for all the reply's from what I have heard if you go over 6000 rpm with a roller hydraulic cam it could cause some major problems in the valve train"
http://members.cox.net/lvjetboy/HydraulicMax.jpg
Crane hydraulic roller and cam in a 540 at 6200...similar to your original post. No major problems so far. Adjusting lash no big deal, yet time consuming and a hassle especially before or after a lake trip. Maybe worth 50 hp? At the power you're gonna run, is your time worth an extra 50 hp? Not saying all hydraulics go to advertised rpm. Just pointing out the compromize...
Race or lake?
I don't need or want that extra 3-4 mph solids, more lift and periodic lash adjustments may give me.
Besides all that, with an Aggressor B cut you're gonna need at least 100 hp over my 540 to turn 6200 rpm. You got that? If not, then no worry about exceeding 6k with the Aggressor B.
jer

[LVjetboy]

"Thanks for the support the valve lash tunning I thought would be every tank of fuel. Good to know its not that bad."
Not that bad at all. What the heck. Your 540 with an Aggressor B probably needs solids no doubt. Let us know what you turn, or not. (I get a bit sarcastic sometimes...sorry)
jer

[wet77]

"Thanks for the support the valve lash tunning I thought would be every tank of fuel. Good to know its not that bad."
Not that bad at all. What the heck. Your 540 with an Aggressor B probably needs solids no doubt. Let us know what you turn, or not. (I get a bit sarcastic sometimes...sorry)
jer
Going with a Isky cam from HTP
When this mess is finally over and I actually get to hit the water I will post my #'s.
Aslo the motor is going on a dyno so we will see what the #'s are :crossx:

[bp]

My 454 is NEVER gonna see 7-large unles I am airborne and asleep at the same time. Lotsa guys are running more lift than I am at .565 but I have to keep a lake-boat running good to pull skiiers/tubes as well as have good breathing muscle on top. The 454 is designed for 6,200 to 6,600 RPM for extended time like track racing, I have to assume the 540 being so much larger with heavier parts and a longer stroke is going to red-line that much lower. possibly below 6,000RPM.
why would you assume that a 540 has heavier parts? you know what happens when you assume?
nelson's right on. solid roller is the only way to go. after 3+ years, i still check mine after every race or two, but very seldom have to make any adjustments. my good friend that runs frequently on the river and at the track, with a similar setup is the same - checks frequently, few adjustments. the valve train remains tight, and the
on the old prostock deal with .950 lift, we checked lash after each pass and often had adjustments to make, had to shim springs after 20 or so passes, new springs after 30 or so. of course we were running that at 8600rpm through a reduction gear. with good springs, and lifts in the .700 range, rpm in the mid 6k range, the components can live quite well for a very long time.
speaking of the weight of parts, how much does a run of the mill NHRA 500" pro stock engine's crankshaft weigh? those engines only make in excess of 1300hp, and they don't throw ALL the parts away after every run (especially the cranks).

[wet77]

Anything I should look at as far as helping the rocker nuts stay put??
This is all new to me so I need advice
I was told something about locking nuts with set screws??

[wet77]

Oh yeah I will find out soon about the lift on the cam but I think it was around .650 - .680??

[bp]

Anything I should look at as far as helping the rocker nuts stay put??
This is all new to me so I need advice
I was told something about locking nuts with set screws??
rocker nuts??? wet, what you're looking into here is an entirely different ballgame. jesels, crane golds, etc., use screws to adjust lash that are locked with nuts. but the main thing is selecting a good system for your application that will keep the valve train tight. for example, if you installed a relatively hi lift roller cam around .700, and only replaced your stock rockers with crane golds, the stock studs are gonna bend around so much that your valve train won't stay tight, so that system would need a stud girdle. stud girdles make valve adjustment a little trickier, but they work. with a roller system, it is critical that the valve train geometry is installed correctly (pushrod length, rollers over the valves, etc.), and that the components remain tight during operation.
just for the heck of it, go to www.jegs.com, or summitracing and look at all the different types of valve train components available.