Wiped a Cam out....

[MikeF]

HD, It is unfortunate that this happened! That guy should fess up and take the loss if he is to continue with his reputation (though it looks like he does "not" know what he's doing). I hope that you can find some recourse in the situation! I know that his establishment won't be used again if he does not help you out. Good luck!, Mike

[bajaruner]

HD, Let us know the name of this joint so no one else gets screwed like this. One other thing you may consider saying to this asshole is ("Better buisness bureau") or ("bureau of automotive repair") and ("whats your buisness license #) he may just change his tune especially if he's in the wrong! Last time my machinist made a error he couldn't make the repairs fast enough. all parts and maching where done free of charge, (bearings, gaskets, boring, shop supplies, everything!) he's really good but he knew he made a mistake.

[Unchained]

I had to learn the same hard lesson. Next time spend the extra money and get a roller cam. No break in and easy to change to another cam w/same lifters. Put a bronze gear on the dist. also.
In my opinion flat tappet cams are old technology and should not be marketed any more. Come to think of it, pushrod engines are old technology.

[lghtnin33]

sorry to hear your delima hammerdown, don,t take this the wrong way but you should have known better man! if you have the tools to check the aftermath you should have checked it before hand. i mean if i get a set of heads back from the shop and there is a spring difference, like the one you had, one double spring valve on the head, that in itself would throw up a flag that something is wrong! we all live and learn and your machinist or mechanic should buy you a new cam along with a block clean up. like boater bill and unchained said just go roller. oh and unchained like your statement about the push rod engine, the Otto cycle engine IS out of date http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif

[DEEZ NUTTS]

Switched intakes and got a good look at good cam. checked rockers and all is good.
How long should I baby my new motor?
Sorry to hear Hammerdown.

[GasTurbine]

Originally posted by Boater Bill:
One of many good reasons to pony up the money up front and run a roller cam.
Or pony up more, and run a camless engine. http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif

[HammerDown]

Originally posted by lghtnin33:
sorry to hear your delima hammerdown, don,t take this the wrong way but you should have known better man! if you have the tools to check the aftermath you should have checked it before hand. i mean if i get a set of heads back from the shop and there is a spring difference, like the one you had, one double spring valve on the head, that in itself would throw up a flag that something is wrong! we all live and learn and your machinist or mechanic should buy you a new cam along with a block clean up. like boater bill and unchained said just go roller. oh and unchained like your statement about the push rod engine, the Otto cycle engine IS out of date http://free.***boat.net/ubb/smile.gif
No I don't have the spring tester...borrowed one, then when I saw what I saw...I took a couple springs in hand and went to his shop!
Now when I saw the added spring at first I did ask if there would be a issue...he said no way all's good. Now between all the added work I've been doing to my Daytona (doing a pump setback and all) I guess I let it pass. But still its a shame to have to check work thats been done, but yes ya really should! I recall the thought of removing the inner spring anyhow prior to bolting the heads on...but with everything else going on with the boat...it sliped my mind. Still he NEVER should have mix matched springs...If the cam did'nt burn up then, I'm sure it would not have had a normal life.

[lakesmodified]

"My original spring# is 911-16 a single spring w/dampner. Aprox. installed ht. at 1.900 should be 115 lbs....with the extra spring he added it went to almost 140lbs.!!!
The Open pressure of the original spring was almost 285 at 1.500...with the added spring it tested to be 370 lbs.!!!"
Hammer, I'm by no means coming to the aid of your machine shop, but you need to take a look at your cam's spec card. According to the spec card for my Crane cam, I need double springs (which I purchased the part # Crane recommended) These springs have approx the same rates you quoted for the springs you removed from your heads. The spec card should have the spring rates at the installed height, as well as "open" and at spring bind. Your cam going flat doesn't necessarily mean the springs are incorrect (if that was the fact, then ALL the lobes would have gone flat!) Before you go replacing those springs, check out the manufacturers spec card. Ivan

[HammerDown]

Lakes...I don't know the requirements of your Cam...it may have higher lift, you may be turning more rpm's. Faster ramp speeds or whatever the case may be.
Either 911 or 924 spring's can be used for my cam#.
Now I went thru some papers from almost 6 years ago and found where I wrote down the tech rep. said the 911 (single) would be fine due to the lower rpm's the motor is turning.
The 911 springs without the added spring would have been where the spec card quoted.(and that's how I ran the original Cam for 6+ years) no problems.
The added spring took the pressures higher than the 924 double spring spec. is.
So if I were to send the burned up cam and lifters back to Comp...they want to know what springs a psi. I was using? I say well SIR my shop add'ed a inner spring to the 911, and the seat psi and over the nose psi went above the need #'s. So he tells me sorry bud, your problem is with the shop that did the work...he should have known better than adding a second spring to a 911 set up...have a nice day.
Now I go to the shop and he says all's good with the spring work I've done...SOOOO I ask him, what If I burn up another new Cam?
After removing the cam and lifters from the motor there are more lifters that show pre-mature wear! He knows he did wrong, I've proven that! And from what I see after tearing down the motor...he has to make good for new bearings, another hone on the block, new rings, new gaskets, and also another cam and lifters ,this is how I just built the motor....also he has to remove the added springs.
There is a chance I may use the 924 springs this time, only due to the chance of useing a smaller Impellar and turning more rpm's. If so, than I'll be sure to remove the inner spring form the 924's for cam break-in!
Just for giggles...lets here about your Crane Cam. the lift and required spring specs. Thanks Hammer.

[lakesmodified]

Hammer, here's the part #354561, Grind #CCH-304-2-NC It's a Hydraulic Commander For 429-460 Ford. .556" intake. .579" exhaust duration @.050" 234 intake, 244 exhaust. RPM range 3000-6500. They specify the use of Crane dual springs Part# 99893. The specs on those springs are as follows: Seat Pressure at installed height of 1.875" = 120 lbs
open pressure @ 1.310" = 340 lbs
open pressure @ 1.175" = 391 lbs
I just called and spoke with Crane Cams Tech line. According to the guy I spoke with, he said it would be HIGHLY beneficial to break the cam in with only the outer springs installed. I'm not glad that you had your trouble Hammer, but I am glad I got involved.. I was going to just break it in with both springs. I guess I'll have to remove the inner springs... Take care, hope everything goes well. Ivan