h.t.m boats

[tbanzer]

As you have stated, I do not like the HTM's. I have very valid reasons and yes some of them have to deal with construction methods. I DO NOT like the way they build their boats!
HTMs have gotten a bad reputation due to their safety record. I know of 3 accidents HTM's were involved in. I am sure there is more, I just cant recall it off the top of my head. These accidents are a MAJOR contributor to cat hull insurance being raised and/or canceled. One of the accidents was on the Parker Strip with a person cruising. Boat only had a 496 in it. All reports that I have heard, said the driver was doing between 40-50mph. Driver's wife and daughter were under the bow and the boat barrel rolled. Like you said, HTM is a small builder. If you take a look at the number of incidents compared to the number of boats built, your number would be VERY high in comparison to other builders.
I do not think that the boat should be used for recreational use. With the bottom it has and a high CG, it definitely makes it tricky and touchy, in comparison to other boats. Your margin of error is pretty small! Maybe they are all right for an experienced CAT driver, but definitely not for the 1st time buyer or a novice.
Knowing what I know and seeing what I have seen, leads me to believe that these boats are unsafe for general use. You will NEVER find me in one of them. If you walk up and hit the sides of an HTM versus a DCB, Howard, Hallett, etc. you will notice a difference. There are reasons why they are typically MUCH cheaper than an equivalently equipped boat from other manufacturers.
So you were in close conference with the insurance companies when they looked at insurance premiums? I witnessed a 38ft Cigarette topgun barrel roll on a calm day doing between 40 and 50, this must be an unsafe boat not for general use? I suppose you are an engineer and you did center of gravity calculations vs all other manufactures? Not an expert but never seen any structural problems or damage related to the layup of the sides of an HTM.

[BADBLOWN572]

Wow, I thought there was a considerable difference in performance from what I have heard and read. In there promo video it shows one 24 SS running a 9.41 in the quarter. Since there is no real center pod do you think this helps in the speed and hurts the overall handling?
You can make anything run fast with enough power.
I was out at the power boat trials when Steve was there trying for 130+ out of his boat. They broke approximately 5 drives on that boat in that test. They would break one, tow it back in, change it, then send them back out. All that they were looking for was that number.
I know that there are guys who do drag race them, but I have never gotten close enough to take a look at them. I would assume that they are REAL light weight hulls. I also believe that they are running VERY built drives. A standard drive failure at high speed can be deadly.
You can't run a single engine true cat. Single engines require the use of a center pod. The difference is that the HTM "V's" from the tunnels down to the center where most cats have a true center sponson. That V has a lot more surface area and minimizes the area where the air can escape. That causes more compression which in turn gets the boat further out of the water. You would probably have to see the difference side by side to really know what I am talking about. Hard to describe in words.

[BADBLOWN572]

So you were in close conference with the insurance companies when they looked at insurance premiums? I witnessed a 38ft Cigarette topgun barrel roll on a calm day doing between 40 and 50, this must be an unsafe boat not for general use? I suppose you are an engineer and you did center of gravity calculations vs all other manufactures? Not an expert but never seen any structural problems or damage related to the layup of the sides of an HTM.
1) If you take a look at Cat insurance, you will notice that the insurance premiums went up shortly after the HTM roll over at Castaic. If you take a look at the track reccord of the HTM, you can see that it is less than stellar.
2) To roll a Cig on a calm day between 40-50 you really need to do something wrong. Any one with minimal experience can drive a deep v. Cats are not the same.
3) Take a look at the boats and you tell me. The freeboard is much higher than a standard cat in its size range. Simple logic says that the CG is much higher.
4) I have laminated SEVERAL (approx 25) boats. I have also been in the industry for over 10 years. I have probably seen in excess of 400 boats laid up. I think I know what I am talking about here. What I saw definitely did not give me the warm and fuzzies.
I have said my peace. I am out of this subject.

[playdeep]

...There was an HTM here in New Mexico,that had some issues with an unseen roller,and ended up sinking.
The HTM was at one time Steve's personal boat,it was the one featured in the HTM adds for a long time.I believe it was the one that first ran 127 or something along those lines...
Anyway the owner(who has a LOT of seat time in HTM's) was leaving a cove running maybe40-50,he didn't see an oncoming roller and ended up jumping the wake.
When the boat landed it hit on the right(rear) sponson,it cracked the side and managed to take out part of the transom...
I saw the boat shortly after it hit,with owner sitting on the nose and the rest of the boat underwater.
A few days later,I ventured over to his shop and saw the remnants sitting on the trailer.The right rear looked as if it had been through a paper shreader.
As others on this thread have stated,you could push in the sides of the hull fairly easily.
I guarantee it was not driver error,as the owner does not drink and has a ton of seat time in HTM's,he's one of the safest boater's I have ever met..
...As Danny(BB572) alluded to those things were built with one objective...to cut a big number.
Not bagging on HTM"s they are what they are,I just think that the lay up's were pretty inconsistant...It's obvious that at times weight was saved in order to produce a faster boat.

[playdeep]

d.p.

[htmchris]

The boat is top quality have one and love it mines got big power runs fast havent been beat has lots of room kids can go under bow in big rain storms at powell and run 100 all day long like others say some of the other people are cult followers people who hate have problems with them selfs ,2000 sr24 565 blown 14/71 big cheif but Iam going too d-tune down too a 555 with a pro charger friend of mine had this setup very reliable and the right prop w-gears all day 90s perfect for the familiy, and for the haters on lia shame on you she just needs the right help at the boat show she showed that there is going to be a hole lot of changes hope for the good well con grats on a boat youll love .......

[htmchris]

I do agree with blown 572 that the boat is very thin on lay up and being that is a cat single drive its a drivers boat Ive had to learn about how she handles at high speeds and at low speeds she can get away from the most expert driver you have a fine line too learn and some times it mite be to late , twins would be a hole lot better but for the price not to bad and let me tell a story power slides at 60 will fill up your shorts, my advise drive to a point and all ways be ready ,

[htmchris]

The boat is top quality have one and love it mines got big power runs fast havent been beat has lots of room kids can go under bow in big rain storms at powell and run 100 all day long like others say some of the other people are cult followers people who hate have problems with them selfs ,2000 sr24 565 blown 14/71 big cheif but Iam going too d-tune down too a 555 with a pro charger friend of mine had this setup very reliable and the right prop w-gears all day 90s perfect for the familiy, and for the haters on lia shame on you she just needs the right help at the boat show she showed that there is going to be a hole lot of changes hope for the good well con grats on a boat youll love .......

[Deano]

I do agree with blown 572 that the boat is very thin on lay up and being that is a cat single drive its a drivers boat Ive had to learn about how she handles at high speeds and at low speeds she can get away from the most expert driver you have a fine line too learn and some times it mite be to late , twins would be a hole lot better but for the price not to bad and let me tell a story power slides at 60 will fill up your shorts, my advise drive to a point and all ways be ready ,
:idea: WOW! Case closed!

[Goodtime$]

The guys at HTM; Dorian, Lia, Fred etc are great people. You may not like how the boat turns or how it is built, but the people there are great. They will help you out in a bind, no matter what boat you have. anyway, we have all been passed by a HTM cat so we know they haul ass, if you dont like how they turn, a 28 V is coming out....see you on the water