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Thread: 460Ford, to rebuild or not to rebuild?

  1. #1
    Amm
    Pictures are better than words:
    http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1169/...d63a25091b.jpg
    http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1024/...79a74882dd.jpg
    I am looking for ideas on what to do with the engine in my 23 ft jet boat.
    I've owned the boat for 3 years now and have been very pleased. The only problem is oil leakage. I am fairly confident it leaks oil at the valve cover, the dip tube, and down low.
    The engine is a 1978, according to the model/serial numbers. As a result of the age and the oil leaks, I feel this coming winter would be an excellent time to pull the engine and rebuild it.
    I have enough skill to rebuild it, but not enough experience to make modifications. I have studied information on 460ford.com and in addition to rebuilding the short block, I was thinking the following:
    - New heads
    - New intake
    - Maybe new exhaust
    - Have my berkeley impeller(A4) recut to A2
    Currently I spin the A4 to 4200 rpms.
    As far as usage. I usually get a full speed run to a spot on the lake, then the boat is stopped while my kids jump off the boat and swim, and then we usually do an hour or two of water tubing/skiing.
    So any suggestions on parts or a build for this?

  2. #2
    atxwrangler
    if the block is tired ,replace it with one of these ,then add some ot headers and new heads if the budget allows.you will prolly still have an oil leak somewhere though!l.o.l. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Big-B...QQihZ020QQitem Z300147610116QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

  3. #3
    SmokinLowriderSS
    AFR 429/460 street heads
    cam it under 280* total duration, over .550" lift, so go roller solid IMO (Hyd roller is just WAY too much $$$$).
    Dual plane intake like the Edelbrock Performer RPM Air Gap.
    If the carb you have is a 750, keep it.
    Put ARP bolts in the rods and stud the mains if you feel like it (ARP again).
    Clervite 77 bearings, moly plasma rings, nothign special needed.
    CR it to about 10:1 and run premium.
    It'll be a solid and reliable motor, and may be well in the vicinity of 500HP, almost 2x it's condition as is/was new.
    My 2 cents.

  4. #4
    twowheeledfish
    I would suggest that you bring the 460 back to life as a stocker and spend your money saved on pump mods (new bowl, impeller, wear ring, loader, ride plate, wedges, nozzle inserts, place diverter, etc). You'll get more bang for your buck with a properly set up pump. Then when the pump is to your satisfaction and you think you need more performance (remember these projects are never truly finished), turn your eye to the engine and let the 460 breathe with some top-end mods similar to what you have specified.
    There's no point building tons of horsepower if the pump isn't up to the task. Cheers and good luck with the build!
    -Fish

  5. #5
    Amm
    I would suggest that you bring the 460 back to life as a stocker and spend your money saved on pump mods (new bowl, impeller, wear ring, loader, ride plate, wedges, nozzle inserts, place diverter, etc). You'll get more bang for your buck with a properly set up pump. Then when the pump is to your satisfaction and you think you need more performance (remember these projects are never truly finished), turn your eye to the engine and let the 460 breathe with some top-end mods similar to what you have specified.
    There's no point building tons of horsepower if the pump isn't up to the task. Cheers and good luck with the build!
    -Fish
    Rebuilt(new impeller, wear ring, and bearings and added a place diverter) the pump 4 months ago with the help of those on the ***boat forum. The boat runs great. It's just, the engine leaks oil, and it is old. Although, the engine still runs strong.

  6. #6
    SB
    23 ft jet boat.
    The only problem is oil leakage.
    The engine is a 1978,
    I have enough skill to rebuild it, but not enough experience to make modifications.
    - New heads
    - New intake
    - Maybe new exhaust
    - Have my berkeley impeller(A4) recut to A2
    Currently I spin the A4 to 4200 rpms.
    ?
    I would suggest that you bring the 460 back to life as a stocker and spend your money saved on pump mods (new bowl, impeller, wear ring, loader, ride plate, wedges, nozzle inserts, place diverter, etc).
    There's no point building tons of horsepower if the pump isn't up to the task.
    There's also no point in building tons of hp with that hull and your uses.
    So let me attempt to agree with everybody above:
    A stock 1978 460 made about 220 hp. A stock 68-70 made around 400.
    So get some DOVE C heads, port them, and build an otherwise stock engine, a stock or similar cam, so you don't get killed on gas. You're not going over 4800 rpm so you can skip the intake and exhaust mods.
    Then rebuild the pump, I never heard of an A4, so I'd love to hear details. Stick with a big impeller, at least an A2 or Aggressor A.
    I have a big heavy boat, and my uses are similar to yours. I did the Aggressor A rebuild. Then I bought a stock engine from Advance auto, turning about 4400 rpm. I tow the kids all day, lots of grunt, and it's great on gas.

  7. #7
    Amm
    if the block is tired ,replace it with one of these ,then add some ot headers and new heads if the budget allows.you will prolly still have an oil leak somewhere though!l.o.l. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Big-B...QQihZ020QQitem Z300147610116QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
    When I first saw that I about died, $2500 for a block!
    BUT, then I saw that it is a shortblock. $2500 for a 557 shortblock is a pretty good deal. Would doing a 557 with my current heads(D3VE) and intake work? Would it be like sucking through a straw? Also, I would need help with picking a cam.
    Probably will pass on this option as I am fairly sure my bottom end is in good shape. The engine runs strong. It's just, it leaks oil and its old.

  8. #8
    SB
    Rebuilt(new impeller, wear ring, and bearings and added a place diverter) the pump 4 months ago with the help of those on the ***boat forum. The boat runs great. It's just, the engine leaks oil, and it is old. Although, the engine still runs strong.
    allrighty then, just get some higher compression heads when you rebuild the engine, and you are set.

  9. #9
    Amm
    There's also no point in building tons of hp with that hull and your uses.
    So let me attempt to agree with everybody above:
    A stock 1978 460 made about 220 hp. A stock 68-70 made around 400.
    So get some DOVE C heads, port them, and build an otherwise stock engine, a stock or similar cam, so you don't get killed on gas. You're not going over 4800 rpm so you can skip the intake and exhaust mods.
    http://www.harmanmarine.com/newsite/Library/pp/04.pdf
    I am pretty sure this is the exact engine, although they may have build it up different in 1978. So I am guessing 330 hp.
    Then rebuild the pump, I never heard of an A4, so I'd love to hear details. Stick with a big impeller, at least an A2 or Aggressor A.
    I have a big heavy boat, and my uses are similar to yours. I did the Aggressor A rebuild. Then I bought a stock engine from Advance auto, turning about 4400 rpm. I tow the kids all day, lots of grunt, and it's great on gas.
    I rebuilt the pump 4 months ago, thats how I got an A4. I ordered an A and got an A4. I called up the place I ordered it from, they said I could send it back and they would cut it down to an A. They said they usually start with an A3 and cut them down to whatever size they need. They were not sure how I got it, but they were sure it was an A4. I said I would give it a try and I did. My wife liked that the engine ran at a lower rpm and the boat seemed to perform fine so I kept it.

  10. #10
    XJBones
    I have enough skill to rebuild it, but not enough experience to make modifications. I have studied information on 460ford.com and in addition to rebuilding the short block, I was thinking the following:
    - New heads
    - New intake
    - Maybe new exhaust
    - Have my berkeley impeller(A4) recut to A2
    So any suggestions on parts or a build for this?
    I think a lot of what your build is will be dependant on your desired outcome and how much you want to spend to get there. Think about what you want and be very honest and realistic with yourself.
    May I also give you another piece of advice? Don't plan your build right to the edge of your budget. It will ALWAYS cost more than you expect, sometimes a lot more!
    If you are going to tear into the bottom end of your 460 it might be worth building up our D3 heads instead of going C8-D0 heads since you will most likely be replacing the pistons and can tailor your CR with the new slugs (flat tops). The larger combustion chambers on the D3's will make it easier to keep CR down if you decide to stroke the motor without laying down the cash for dished pistons.
    The BBF's can make big reliable HP and your boat is already set up for one so don't let the bowtie set talk you into a chebby !
    Talk to Paul Kane at High Flow Dynamics (http://www.highflowdynamics.com/). He is very knowledgeable on the BBF stuff and will get you heading in the right direction.
    Good Luck!
    Bones
    http://images25.fotki.com/v948/photo...SCN2647-vi.jpg (http://public.fotki.com/Bones/misc/r.../dscn2647.html)

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