What's The Trick w/ Starters ??

[Jetty 468]

Lately having trouble w/ my starter Turn the key and click , take a wire straight from the battery to the starter and it turn's over ? This happened at the end of last yr.so I changed the thing and damn if it's not doing it again ,any ideal's ?????
Thank's Jetty

[Rexone]

I'm going to assume this is a GM starter. The problem normally is excessive voltage drop to the "stock solenoid" on the starter because of the long wiring typical in most boats to the dash and back (ign switch wire). A trick we've used for years is to install a Ford type slave solenoid in the wire to the GM stock starter solenoid (back near the starter). The key switch then is working only the "slave" solenoid and the GM starter solenoid receives full voltage. As I recall it takes about 10+ volts to pull a GM solenoid and some boats just wont supply that much with the long run from the dash. Heat makes the problem worse so many time you'll have a situation where it will start when cold but then won't after it's warmed up. This is an age old problem with many cars as well. Used to encounter the same thing years ago with old VW bugs. There's other problems that can be what you're describing but this is the most common one.
If you need the wiring diagram for this install I can fax it or scan it for you. Just give a hollar.

[Jetty 468]

Rexone:
I'm going to assume this is a GM starter. The problem normally is excessive voltage drop to the "stock solenoid" on the starter because of the long wiring typical in most boats to the dash and back (ign switch wire). A trick we've used for years is to install a Ford type slave solenoid in the wire to the GM stock starter solenoid (back near the starter). The key switch then is working only the "slave" solenoid and the GM starter solenoid receives full voltage. As I recall it takes about 10+ volts to pull a GM solenoid and some boats just wont supply that much with the long run from the dash. Heat makes the problem worse so many time you'll have a situation where it will start when cold but then won't after it's warmed up. This is an age old problem with many cars as well. Used to encounter the same thing years ago with old VW bugs. There's other problems that can be what you're describing but this is the most common one.
If you need the wiring diagram for this install I can fax it or scan it for you. Just give a hollar. Thank's bud 50334 here ,it's not a stock gm starter but I can't think of the name right now .
I think it's getting too wet . I was thinking about you lately, I started a chapter here in West Tx. W/ EBA and could sure use your help

[Oldsquirt]

I'm with Rexone on this one. Most likely excessive voltage drop in the starter trigger circuit.
To measure the actual drop, connect the Negative lead of a voltmeter to the trigger terminal on solenoid and the Positive to battery positive term. Measure voltage while cranking. The goal is to have a very low number, ideally only a couple tenths of a volt.
If the drop is within spec and the battery is strong, the problem may lie in the starter.
If it is too high, clean all the connections in the circuit. If you have a junction block at the engine, clean ALL the terminals(should be part of yearly maintenance). Recheck the voltage drop. If still too high, it may well be due to high resistance in the old wiring.
I made a pre-emptive modification on my current project. It's a relay kit made by Painless Wiring.


The relay is small enough to mount underneath the junction block. The kit cost about $30 and includes relay, prewired relay block and necessary terminals. The relay itself is a standard Hella unit designed for lighting systems and should be available in any auto parts store if replacement were necessary.

[GlastronGuy]

I ran a Ford solenoid for two years and it seemed to help. My biggest problem was the starter was getting wet. After 2 or 3 seasons (I can't remember) I had to replace it. I have to pull the motor to do it but the starter is guaranteed for life so at least it didn't cost me anything.

[Jetty 468]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by OLDSQUIRT:
I'm with Rexone on this one. Most likely excessive voltage drop in the starter trigger circuit.
To measure the actual drop, connect the Negative lead of a voltmeter to the trigger terminal on solenoid and the Positive to battery positive term. Measure voltage while cranking. The goal is to have a very low number, ideally only a couple tenths of a volt.
If the drop is within spec and the battery is strong, the problem may lie in the starter.
If it is too high, clean all the connections in the circuit. If you have a junction block at the engine, clean ALL the terminals(should be part of yearly maintenance). Recheck the voltage drop. If still too high, it may well be due to high resistance in the old wiring.
I made a pre-emptive modification on my current project. It's a relay kit made by Painless Wiring


The relay is small enough to mount underneath the junction block. The kit cost about $30 and includes relay, prewired relay block and necessary terminals. The relay itself is a standard Hella unit designed for lighting systems and should be available in any auto parts store if replacement were necessary. [/QUOTE
I will check voltage at trigger the wiring is only a yr. old now . I did check volt's at starter and it's a full 12 volt's . Since I can jump it by a wire straight from the battery maybe I need me one of them there relay's , how does it make more juice to solenoid?

[Oldsquirt]

It doesn't "make more juice". What it does is eliminate the voltage drop that you get from the 20+ foot run from battery to ignition switch and back to starter. It essentially does what you did with the jumper wire. Measure your voltage drop first and see what you get.

[Jetty 468]

Sorry Rex ,after reading your post again you said stock solenoid not stock starter . I think you and old squirt are on with this problem ,send me what you got if you get a chance .
wink
Thank's Jetty

[Jetty 468]

OLDSQUIRT:
It doesn't "make more juice". What it does is eliminate the voltage drop that you get from the 20+ foot run from battery to ignition switch and back to starter. It essentially does what you did with the jumper wire. Measure your voltage drop first and see what you get. Understand now ,will get on it thank's again

[Jetty 468]

Oldsquirt the hot shot seem's to have fixed the problem thank's a ton

Jetty